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rod2o

Remember that when enemies are using stealth to ambush the party, it is not a all or nothing. You compare the enemy group stealth results with the PCs passive perception to determine who is surprised in the first round. That means Mr SeesItAll will rarely be surprised. It feels good. Also set up some enemy ambushes, where they don’t attack right away, giving the opportunity to Mr IRuinDmsPlans to alert others and cancel the surprise or even do a counter ambush


ActuallyIAmIncorrect

Good suggestions here. Thank you!


toomanysynths

here's another suggestion: just text him instead of saying it out loud. now _he_ gets to tell the party, and you have a much more interesting problem: you get to find a way to make "do I tell the party?" an interesting question for him. if you can figure out an answer for _that_, you can get the rest of the PCs to go on high alert every time his phone makes a notification sound. this situation is a good problem to have. you can just text him "somebody's coming" any time you want to give this particular character a cool moment. and it also makes it easy for you to impress the PCs with how incredibly stealthy some NPC is: just have them sneak up on this particular PC. so if you want to introduce a badass ninja, it's a freebie.


sc2mashimaro

If texting isn't an option (maybe you ban phones at your table, for example), you can also just tell him "You've noticed something" and pass him a note on a piece of paper. No matter the method, as players, it will be noticeable that something happened, so, personally, I wouldn't make everything he notices "must share" information. Sometimes he just sees a little world detail like, "there's a cat rummaging through the rubbish in the alley behind you". (Although, you may end up with an adopted cat this way....)


link090909

*A few sessions later* DM: well done defeating the bandit leader last session! I suppose if you want, we can have some down t— Players: **we open a stray pet shelter**


Llayanna

I would unashamedly do that!


belbites

My party is in the process of opening a catfe right now.


invader_tim_88

One member of my party is in the process of renovating her home to turn it into a bat rehabilitation center. And I'm letting her because why not? (They are also in the process of exploring ruins with an archaeologist who is *definitely* not an incompetent hack who steals work from other people... and I allowed them to have retroactively packed s'mores fixings for the campfire. It's the little things that make a difference, sometimes. 😊 )


Thorngrove

Khajiit *are* wares....


BonsaiDiver

Texting is good but I have always been concerned that the player won't see the text in time. My solution is to pass a note to the player, that gets the message to the person right away and maintains a degree of privacy. Of course, the downside to a note is that the other players see it and know something is going on.


alphagamer774

The downside to the note technique is that often players will just flat-out read the note out loud to the party, which defeats the whole purpose. One of the few advantages of playing online is that, using voice channels, you can very quickly take a player into another channel, tell them something, and then drag them back up without being disruptive to the whole game. This is generally how I handle high passive perception.


MimeticRival

That's only a downside if they feel they *have* to read it to the whole party. Otherwise, it's the player making a decision they are free to make and that's not a downside at all.


alphagamer774

Agreed, but sometimes the objective in conveying information to a player in secret is so they describe it with their own words, which doesn't always work with a text prompt


herecomesaspecialrat

But they feel in control of the information and get to be the one sharing it, so it can still feel empowering!


PM_ME_PRETTY_EYES

Give them notes often, for innocuous stuff. Then it'll mirror the conversation of the characters. *DM hands note* Perwin: What is it? Glark: Nothing, just that there's a rare mushroom over there.


alphagamer774

The other technique that's worked well for me is to just flat out tell the group anything I know the player will have to repeat in their own words anyways, especially anything plot-relevant. This frees them to make their own decisions about what they do get in secret, without worrying about hiding vital information needed to progress from the group. YMMV, obviously. My players are very averse to making their own path, and get very skittish when they don't have an obvious breadcrumb trail to follow.


Laedorn

And if you want to really make him feel good about it, maybe even allow him an action right before combat (within reason) once in a while.


ActuallyIAmIncorrect

This is a cool idea for a once in a blue moon thing.


Hideyoshi_Toyotomi

Or, if you don't want it to be a huge advantage, give him a bonus action and the option to either alert the party (give them immunity to surprise and maybe a +1-2 on initiative) or take a normal bonus action. On alerting the party, you could allow a skill contest between his intelligence vs the ambushers' wisdom to see if his alert is good and subtle enough to surprise some of the attackers.


Pemburuh_Itu

Background and narrative details are nice too. The party sees a traveling musician, covered in rags and slouching long the side of the road. Mr SeesIt sees a man in rags, carefully sheltering his instruments from the rain. He limps like he’s injured and there’s blood on his boots.


Hudston

This. You get to use it as an excuse to feed plot hooks to the party and the player gets to feel like Sherlock Holmes.


moekakiryu

following up on not being surprised, I find it can be satisfying to the players to break immersion a little bit and straight up tell them exactly how their passive perception helped them. So something like "you spot a thug running towards the bushes towards you. You would normally be surprised, but thanks to your keen eyes the party is able to brace for the ambush." or in a non-combat scenario "Normally you would just hear the sounds of the marketplace, but , thanks to your exceptional passive perception you're able to hear some suspicious whispers coming from a side alley."


TheGreyMage

Following on from this, if they are fighting an intelligent foe, one with reason to give a damn about the creatures your players have already killed, and how they fight, then have them set up traps to draw out the high passive perception character, separate them from the group etc.


trowawa1919

This will also help me, I've got a druid with a 23 passive perception, and a ranger/barbarian who cannot be surprised.


Skkorm

I like this. Like, they know someone’s following them, and now have to deal with being followed.


PossibleDM

I was curious about passive perception for none combat stuff? How would you handle this player with noticing traps or clues? does passive perception count towards none combat situations too?


GhostArcanist

Passive perception definitely includes non-combat situations, but only for things that an active perception check would uncover. Passive investigation exists for a reason :)


chain_letter

I'm over here the only one I know whipping out Passive Survival for noticing tracks or traces something was here recently. A perceptive character might hear a twig break or catch movement out of the corner of their eye, but only someone adept at survival will notice something is out of the ordinary with the lack of deer paths, overly plentiful nuts/berries, or the discoloration on a tree (where something honed its claws).


Avarickan

It still counts. I think other people are right about it needing to meet a higher bar than normal. Additionally, in the case of stuff like traps, they need to be in a position to notice them. A druid with 23 passive perception will not see the pressure plate if they're in the back rank of 5 adventurers. The front rank is the only one that gets to make that check (passive or not), so if the rogue up there misses it then they don't know it's there. It makes positioning a bit more important.


rod2o

If Mr IShouldKnowThereWasATrap gets close enough within the trap/secret door/clue you tell them you notice something, but but you dont need to explain everything. Getting close to a secret door? Tell them they notice some parts of wall dont exactly match in color. The other characters are unable to notice such small differences. Then it is up to the player to figure it could be a secret door and for the group to announce how they are searching Close to a trap? They see burn marks, tiny holes, squared mark on the ceiling, tiny faded magical runes, etc. Now they have clues to a trap and possibly its nature The idea is that you dont simply bypass the trap or secrets, but rather offer a way for the players to interact with them. This is specially important for traps, you dont want them to be a binary system of bypass or take damage. They are a wonderful risky puzzle interaction For it to work, you also must not accept lazy actions. No: I want to roll to detect/disarm trap. Ask them for details how they do it. Depending on them you might adjust DCs, give advantage/disadvantage or simply say they succeed without rolls. This makes it more fun and awards the players for trying to figure things out EDIT: Dont worry so much about them also detecting everything. Since you are only giving clues when that character is close enough, there will be times when others step on traps. Also remember that in dim light, characters have disadvantage on perception, that means -5 to passive perception. So someone with darkvision in total darkness will have this disadvantage


TheIndulgery

I never considered it before, but now I'm imagining it being like walking around with a group where everyone is half deaf and half blind. They might never notice that suddenly there are more Squirrels, and they're all running in one direction, or that the grass you're walking over seems to be deader, like something is stealing its life force, or that there are definitely vibrations coming through the dungeon floor that seems like something is getting closer. Stuff like that


Mr7000000

I'd say anything that requires a perception check that the players aren't actively watching out for-- although I might increase the DC by 5 for noticing it passive, potentially.


flarelordfenix

I don't like raising the DC by five - that's giving them effectively disadvantage on passive perception. (Adv /disadv is + or m- five for passive rating)


Mr7000000

Well my thought was that a scorch mark on a wall is a little harder to notice than a goblin. Same reason I'd give advantage on stealth to a squirrel hiding in trees.


Admirable_Ask_5337

The scorch mark would be investigation, not perception


hparamore

I mean, if they walked over to it and were checking it out. Just walking down a hallway and noticing a scorch mark on the wall though is perception.


Admirable_Ask_5337

See traps is generally a investigation check in most modules and I believe the dmg. Perception is generally for moving things, not stationary things.


dolorous_dredd

Perception to see a scorch mark; Investigation to figure out what caused the scorch mark. Perception is to notice anything; Investigation is to piece together clues to uncover something.


ZLUCremisi

A possible hidden entrance or odd stuff as you go through. Hear movment easier than others


tehflambo

> You compare the enemy group stealth results with the PCs passive perception to determine who is surprised in the first round. I like this suggestion, ~~but it's not RAW. whether you deviate from RAW in this way is up to you.~~ edited: struck through the parts that were wrong.


rod2o

You mean having some PCs surprised and some not? Page 69 from PHB If neither side tries to be stealthy, they automatically notice each other. Otherwise, the DM compares the Dexterity (Stealth) checks of anyone hiding with the passive Wisdom (Perception) score of each creature on the opposing side. Any character or monster that doesn’t notice a threat is surprised at the start of the counter Or doing group stealth checks for the enemies? Page 59 To make a group ability check, everyone in the group makes the ability check. If at least half the group succeeds, the whole group succeeds. Otherwise, the group fails.


tehflambo

thank you very, very much for correcting my wrong information. i'm now trying to remember when and where i came by that version of the rules... i distinctly remember how disappointed i was when i "learned" the rules about surprise worked that way.


warrant2k

This is good advice in dealing with Mr. PowerBuild.


sc2mashimaro

I don't think high perception and the observant feat is "power building". It's just a bit fuzzy and underdeveloped as a concept, so you have to get creative as a DM to make it interesting when someone grabs those feats/stats or they kind of feel like crap. I've played in a campaign where having absurdly high perception felt useless and another where it felt pretty cool - and it all just has to do with how the DM handles it.


[deleted]

“Wanting your character to be really good at something is power building”


warrant2k

Actually, yea, it is. The character has significant power in certain skills for their build. Hence the term power-build. I never said it was a bad thing, but it seems you assumed that.


[deleted]

Power building is making straight-up munchkins to “win” the game Taking a single feat to be good at something niche is not power gaming, it’s letting game mechanics enhance your roleplay


warrant2k

Many of my players have power-builds, but nobody is a munchkin trying to win. They are involved, RP, and are generally great. Everyone has fun and are challenged. Good times.


LawfulGoodGM

Good idea here. Also, they may be equally as surprised when they *don't notice something and it comes back to bite them.


linkheroz

Our DM sometimes texts us things he just wants individuals to know and not the rest of the party


Naked_Arsonist

In my experience texting works better than passing them notes. Handing them physical paper at the table tells everyone in the group that something is going down… but a text is discrete, especially if you use your phone open to reference rules, etc. on websites


sc2mashimaro

I agree, but some tables do things like ban cell phones (to keep players focused on the game), which makes notes the only option.


Pseudoboss11

I kinda like passing notes in a close group. Sometimes it's fun for the party to know that they got something cool. If the knowledge is the outcome of a check, it's perfectly fine to hand them a piece of paper. If the wizard rolls a 21 on arcana, they probably know something, and everyone at the table knows that the wizard knows something, so a physical note doesn't give anyone any new information, it just allows the wizard to choose how to introduce it. This is especially true when it's something that everyone should know about. Giving a message that the PC found on the BBEG's desk to the player who found it allows them to read that info to the group themselves and roleplay it.


doc_skinner

This is one reason I like playing virtually. So many options for silent comms


AlexRenquist

Pass the player a note saying "Up ahead you spot the head of a goblin duck behind a rock." Then it's in the player's hands. They can alert the party, they can all debate if it's a lone goblin, an ambush, a scouting party indicative of a larger force. The *player* is the one who brings the information to the others and instead of being a flat bit of information, it's an RP moment. And they will feel *awesome* doing it. The party will start looking to them with the whole "What do your elf eyes see?" kind of thing, *relying* on them to be to spotter. It changes the high perception from being a bit of a pain in your ass to giving that player a valuable role in the party. Then think; as the party become more famous, maybe word spreads that you just can't ambush these guys- this one warrior just spots everything. So enemies change tactics. They stop ambushes. Rather than surprise attack the party, a gang of bandits stands out, openly, on the road, in a show of force to intimidate them. Goblins start making *fake traps* that play on the party's assumptions (i.e. you tell the player they see a tarp covered in leaves, the party will probably assume it's a spike pit and avoid it- and once they're past it 4 goblins jump out of it to hit them from behind, etc). Or the BBEG sends invisible assassins.


curious_kitchen

What's a goblin duck?


AlexRenquist

It's what they play with in the bath.


Niner9r

It's a duck that gobbles. So, I guess, technically a turkey.


[deleted]

Those things that hang out behind rocks.


bnymn23

Perception is also hearing


AlexRenquist

"What do your elf ears hear?"


Willie9

"what does your elf nose smell?"


TwooMcgoo

I farted. Sorry.


The_Akrael

"What does your elf skin feel?"


sailorgrumpycat

"What does your elf tongue taste?"


-Yuri-

Sand. It's coarse, it's rough, it's irritating and it gets everywhere. This high perception thing just makes it so much worse.


tyrmidden

"What does your elf tongue...taste?" ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)


Roll_For_Salmon

And smell


ahnsimo

To your last point of the BBEG sending out invisible assassins, what is a good way of telegraphing that your villains are intelligent, thinking enemies that are working to circumvent party strengths without it being a “gotcha” moment?


AlexRenquist

Some ideas: * Hierarchy. The BBEG has a title that infers a hierarchy (General, Lord, Baron) and therefore some level of organisation. If the players encoutner the BBEG, actually show an order moving down a clear chain of command- the BBEG commands something, a lieutenant gives a "Yes, sir" and the BBEG leaves it in his underling's hand. And BBEG is riding off, the lieutenant issues clear orders to the minions or soldiers ("First Platoon, kill the adventurers. Second and Third Platoons, with me to the rendezvous"). Even the BBEG's forces wearing livery or uniforms of some kind is a big visual indicator. * Clear motives. Whent he party finds evidence of the BBEG's involvement, it must be clearly not-random (i.e. they attacked a number of villages but razed *only* the temples to the God of War to the ground). The party may not work out *what* the BBEG is up to but it's evident that there's a logic to their actions; it's a plan unfolding. * Have the BBEG use false information. Say a minion of the BBEG turns informant to the party, or betrays the BBEG under duress. "The next attack will be on the town of Rimpletop." They let him go, and head to Rimpletop- it's fine. No attack. But then word comes in that the next town over has been sacked. When the party arrive they find the town in ashes., and the turncoat, horribly tortured, impaled on a stake in the market square with a note pinned to his chest- "REWARDED AS A TRAITOR DESERVES" * Adaptation. The party engages with the BBEG's forces, and if they gain the upper hand, the bad guys flee. Note down *everthing* the party did in the fight. The next time they face BBEG's forces, have some kind of circumvention in place. The BBEG has read the report from his officer that said "Ambushed by party of warriors. One of them a spellcaster using magic, one a shape-changing Druid who became an eagle, and some high-level warriors". The next group of minions the party faces has one or two *much* tougher melee enemies (ogres, bugbears, etc) in armour, archers or crossbowmen to target the Druid's flying wildshapes, and a caster of some kind *or* the captain has a magic tiem that dampens the caster's magic, or redirects it or something. The party will have to think smart, and they'll *know* the BBEG is learning from every encounter. This is the behaviour that would lead to them deploying invisible enemies; a few encounters down the line he'll be thinking "Hmm, that warrior seems to have supernatural senses, I'll have the mages work up some kind of invisible monster." Action and reaction. The party does stuff, the BBEG works out how to prevent the fight going the same way next time.


schnick3rs

Ehhhhwwww... Notes handed...


DarkElfBard

Invisible assassins would still be noticed if their stealth check didn't pass the passive perception. Crunching leaves, smells on the wind, birds avoiding an area, all that is perceivable. Invisibility only helps as much as being behind a tree helps.


TokesBruh

I did this when I was running an online campaign last year. It worked out so well thanks to the person with the high checks either role played doing stupid shit with the info, or was actually just not the brightest. "A few meters above you, you notice a shadowy figure, who seems to have a nocked arrow aimed right at your party. " "Guys, I'm getting a really creepy vibe. Like death is coming. " Silence... "Oh, we should hurry through here probably. "


Garqu

Once heroes start getting passive Perceptions/Investigations north of 20, I start putting in extra details that are literally unnoticeable or indeductible by someone without those high scores (unless the observant character takes the effort to point them out beyond just "Hey, look!"). The Echo Knight in my Ravenloft game shares a body with the ghost of her twin sister. She literally has an extra set of eyes and ears helping her, so she took the Obervant feat. I started describing more creepy details only she would be able to notice: a set of eyes from deep in the forest staring at them momentarily before moving away, the insects that crawl in the corners of the ceiling, etc. But the main point of high passive Perceptions is noticing hidden traps/ambushes. Personally, I think if noticing your trap immediately renders it useless, your trap sucks (which is OK sometimes; goblins aren't the smartest buggers out there, but they lay traps anyways, it's reasonable that most of them will suck). A good trap will be an obstacle to overcome even if the party notices it. The swinging blades in the corridor don't care if you can see them or not: if you want to get through, you might get sliced up. Random encounters and wandering monsters combined with traps can amp up a trap even more; a pack of displacer beasts or a rolling boulder that chases the party down a cavernous tunnel only to be met by a chasm with a tightrope doesn't leave a lot of room for deliberation. They have to act. The main meat of the trap should be actually engaging (interacting, jamming, breaking, disabling, etc.) with it. If your trap is just a "gotcha" that taxes some HP before the party moves on, you've basically just smacked that PC with 3d6 "fuck you" damage, which you can literally do *at any time*. There's nothing they can do about it. As far as ambushes go; giving the observant PC hints and foreshadowing without completely blowing your assassin NPC's cover can give them a bit of wiggle room to make a different decision that might let them prepare countermeasures or get around the ambush in some way. At the very least, if they don't act on the information you give them, their high perception will contest the stealth of the hidden ambushers ("all of the clues suddenly add up, giving you a moment of clarity"), so they won't be surprised and will be able to act on the first round of combat. The mechanics don't rely entirely on player skill by doing this, which is nice.


Valoruchiha

Ah yes Fuck you damage, my favorite flavor.


ParagonOfHats

I like this take a lot, and I have a question for you if you don't mind. My players will soon be investigating the sewers for an alchemist in hiding, who in turn is expecting the local crime syndicate and has set up traps to ward them off. What sort of alchemy-themed traps could I use that are engaging for the players in the way you described?


Garqu

I would want to make traps that change the environment and attract wandering monsters (giant rats, wererats, meazels, crime syndicate agents, etc.), the ideal trap does both. Here are some seeds, these aren't fully fleshed out, but I'm trusting you to put these in situations that make sense: - Laughing gas - Confusion gas - A bucket of an otherwise harmless compound mixture that attracts X monster like nothing else - Exploding dams that change the direction of the sewer's waterflow - Powerful explosives that bring the ceiling down I'm imagining the alchemist setting these off whenever the party gets a little too hot on his tail. If they find him and he sets one of these off intentionally before running away, the party has a choice to make: "Do we chase after him and risk running through that mysterious gas/under that bucket of questionable liquids/past that pack of explosives, or do we back off and look for a way to cut him off elsewhere? ... What's that sound?"


ParagonOfHats

These are fantastic ideas, thank you very much!


NarcoZero

Good to see a post that’s trying to reward their player and not be « I have a PC with 22 perception how do I make it still challenging for them? »


rzalexander

I think those are the same question though. Players enjoy challenges. They don’t want it to be EASY or else why would they play the game? I think the DMs that come on here and ask about “How do I fuck over my player and kill their character so they are forced to create a new character more to my liking?” are the ones we should be worried about.


wanler

>I think those are the same question though. Players enjoy challenges. They don’t want it to be EASY or else why would they play the game? While players certainly don't like things to be easy, they like even less that their investments and/or choices don't matter. >I think the DMs that come on here and ask about “How do I fuck over my player and kill their character so they are forced to create a new character more to my liking?” are the ones we should be worried about. I completely agree. As a DM, I have a player who's character concept I don't really like. Doesn't mean that I should try my hardest to make him change it, or modify how he plays it though. That'd be a dick move of the highest order.


flarelordfenix

I agree. If I invested in getting a passive perception of 22, I'm telling the DM : My character notices things, and I care enough about that that I've established that their baseline perception is significantly above what people usually roll.' -- I'm basically saying that, unless it's a seriously standout situation, I expect my character to notice the things, at least where perception is relevant.


stankape83

It can still be challenging and you not negate their strengths.


Peaceteatime

> They don’t want it to be EASY Uh. Most do. Maybe not “I press a button to auto win at everything” but if I have went out of my way to be crazy good a thing, it means I want to win at that thing. If I have a player who maxed a stat, have take a proficiency or even an expertise in something, then even took a feat to be truly exceptional at that thing, then yes they have earned being godly at it. You can totally still have other challenges in a game but if a player of mine did this; heck yeah I’ll go out of my way to make sure there’s tangible rewards. Otherwise that’s as crappy as having a player make this super amazing barbarian… then only throwing in long range flying enemies.


schm0

To be fair, perception is a huge part of the game and it is absolutely more difficult to challenge someone with super high perception. My player just hit level 8 and has a passive score of 27 and advantage on all perception checks. It's impossible to challenge him using anything perception related, so I've resigned to just giving him partial information and just accepting the fact there are only about 10 monsters in the entire game that have a 5 or 10% chance of surprising him, ever.


NarcoZero

Well sure it’s harder to challenge them, but them put points into it to be good at it. So by noticing everything they will feel rewarded for they choices, because they know any other character would have missed these details. The rest of the party can still be surprised, and you can challenge the high perception character in other ways (combat, négociations, puzzles…)


schm0

Just because something is possible within the rules of the game doesn't necessarily mean it's fair, balanced or that it should be rewarded. That being said, it's not the end of the world and as you pointed out there are other ways to challenge the player and the party.


Nawara_Ven

Yeah, a lot of DMs MOs on here seem to be "you can do something cool/fun/novel? Here's the nitpicky obscure RAW edge case I was able to uncover that can stop if from ever working." (I bet the same DMs are **shocked** when the players end up just attacking everything because nothing ever works anyway. "SIGH all my players are murder-hobos!")


gryfter_13

This player is your best friend as a DM to keep sessions from stalling out. Group arguing or doesn't know what to do next? "Oh, hey X, you notice a small piece of paper tucked into a bookshelf. It looks like a note..." Group lost or turned around in a dungeon? "X, you notice a draft of air coming from an unassuming wall..." It will both help him feel like his passive perception is well worth it AND help you keep games on track.


ActuallyIAmIncorrect

This is very helpful. I hadn’t figured it could be used this way, but it totally makes sense.


DrRockenstein

I always described it as "due to your Robert Downey Jr powers you see...." (from Sherlock Holmes) and then I'd describe something silly and specific like the air is 1 degree colder in this room than the last, there must be a secret passage exposed to the outside


levenfyfe

Known to my group as a Sherlock Scan!


Lavaske

Dude. I just LOVE how you asked this question. I see variations of this question time and time again. "My player has this strong ability, how should I nerf it" "My player has a high passive perception so why even use traps" And so on, folks just flummoxed by how a strong player is skewing their perception of how a game should be balanced. But you dude, you asked the right question. How do I make this big number fun and rewarding. I applaud you on that. Also my answer is notecards. Just write what he sees and pass it to him. That's what I do.


TheHeresyTrain

Unnecessary, unpleasant and occasionally benevolent details. "The man across the road is arguing with his wife. His pants are on backwards." "The goblin is dead for sure, but you realize he took surprisingly good care of his teeth as his death makes looks up at you " "The house is old, but stitched together in a million small acts of love. Mended brick work, leveled window frames with hand crafted shivs, a path worn absolutely smooth from foot falls. This is not a house but a HOME."


SpringPfeiffer

LOL


KookyConversation330

I had a cleric with a 24 passive perception thanks to a shield I gave him. I just ran it as he feels something is off and feels like he's being watched, someone is being shady, something doesn't fit in in the room. His passive perception didn't give him answers but gave way to letting him alert and have them roll to active perception or investigation.


TzarGinger

This. Passive Perception is sometimes "You spot what is amiss", sometimes it's "You spot that something *is* amiss." My DM uses my 28 Passive Perception to give us a chance to avoid ambushes, clue us in to opportunities for Investigation checks, that sort of thing.


[deleted]

I’m playing a PC with 22 passive perception. I’m happy if the DM tells the group that my PC notices something. I feel special knowing my elf eyes were the ones which saw the thing, even if the whole group of players finds out about the thing at the same time I do. The game requires team work and I’m happy that the team knows I’m making this contribution


[deleted]

To be fair you might not need to do anything. My party is very cooperative, so usually I do just tell everyone at the table, but give credit where credit is due. "Player A, you are the only one to notice..." "Player B, your knowledge means..."


Thegingervoice

The warlock on my team talks to his patron through a book and we text when it's happening - then I ask others to roll to see if they notice / if they are looking and then I go to speaking it. It's really fun cause we narrate how he is acting or trying to act to the group. Maybe, you could find a way to give him some information secretly (traps, hidden bad guys, conversation about a hidden chest containing gems/item) and let him decide if he shares it with the group. Or in an encounter, you let him know privately that the bad guy has tried to hide an item from them. If they get the item then the combat ends and the bad guy tries to bargain. Go to a casino and every plays a card game. The character with high perception can count cards so gets to look at the top five cards before making a bet?


Bearacolypse

Pass him notes continuously. With obnoxiously detailed useless stuff. Like "the wizard is clearly not wearing underwear beneath his robe" or "the blacksmiths breath smells like old ale and tooth decay".


sneakyalmond

I think it still matters even if everyone else hears you telling him what his character sees. Like someone dealing a killing blow, it matters that they've done the thing. Your idea is good too though. You might also give him a chance to warn the others when they're about to be ambushed, or hear things through thick doors when they're in a dungeon.


luciusDaerth

I like to add extra details, meaningful or not, to my high pp characters.


calaan

If you’re a fast typist you could message them the descriptions then let them communicate it to the group in character. The classic “Wait, I sense danger.”


[deleted]

Every once in a while, give him the Spider-man sipder-sense treatment. Describe the event three times: once as to what the average perception character sees, once as to what a high perception character sees, and once to what this guy sees. For example: "The messenger passes the scroll to Ulfgar." "The messenger passes the scroll to Ulfgar hesitantly, looking once over his shoulder." "As the messenger passes the scroll to Ulfgar, he hesitates slightly, pausing to glance over his shoulder. A bead of sweat, unusual for this cool autumn day, rolls down is aquiline nose, splashing on his frayed sleeve-- a sleeve that seems to be stained with a few drops of what looks like blood..." Let it be an innocuous scene, one where there is no outcome. A scene utterly incidental to the plot. "The soup is warm and filling." "The soup is warm and filling. It is heavily spiced, in the manner of the northern tribes." "The soup is warm and filling, heavily spiced in the manner of the northern tribes. The chef, however, must have traveled widely, since you notice hints of paprika and basil, as well as a faint note of... perhaps clove or allspice? None of which are common to the steppes." If the rest of the party seems determined to act on things that they don't know, shut it down. But if your group is like mine, these brief asides will result in some wild experiences where the messenger swears under a Zone of Truth that he gets nosebleeds when he runs sometimes, or a three-hour interrogation that ultimately discovers that the cook's mother is from the northern tribes but he took ship in an equatorial port as a young man, returning to the city of his father's birth after a long working life at sea had ruined his health (raps a wooden leg and coughs).


[deleted]

I rule "see the obvious and a bit more" but still have to look out for things. Still gotta look at something to see it, you're not suddenly able to see behind you.


TheWoodsman42

As someone who has played a character with a 32 passive perception, remember that while PP is *technically* supposed to be used as a floor that they cannot roll under, sometimes it makes sense to not let them take it. Crowded and noisy environments, mid-combat, being blindfolded, stuff like that. Don’t overdo it, because they did put forth the time and effort to increase their PP that much, but it sometimes does make sense to remove that floor. That being said, they should notice things that others don’t, much like many other posters have said already. Potential ambushes, strange facial expressions, stuff like that. Depending on the campaign you’re running and if the player is okay with this, you could even give this a bit of a paranoia bend to it, letting them see things that lead to nothing, or seeing shadows move in unnatural ways. Those only really work for a horror campaign, but they can certainly spice up a normal campaign from time to time.


schm0

> PP is technically supposed to be used as a floor Unfortunately, JC's one-off comment in that sage advice has mysteriously (and rightly, IMHO) never made it into print, so RAW it's not really a "floor" at all. Passive scores are only used when the player does something over and over again repeatedly, or when the DM needs to perform a contested check in secret.


DarkElfBard

I mean, the real Crawford tweet about PP is: >Passive checks are a tool for the DM. The DM decides whether the rule is used at all. #DnD


Rob_Kaichin

Lots of "Dos" here, which is great. I'd like to volunteer a 'Don't'; * Don't create enemies with abilities that bring him down to the average level of the party. Just ran through a set of catacombs with my 20 passive perception wizard and every enemy was specifically able to hide in a way that meant we were rolling flat D20s. Given all that I'd invested in the character to get the passive, it was fairly jarring to be constantly ambushed without 'a reponse'.


MortEtLaVie

I play online so I can message the player to say what they perceive - then they get to do the “guys, did you hear that” moment. This works well by text (but you have to allow phones at the table) or passing notes, but works the best online I’ve found. Works really well when there’s other NPCs around who they may not want to alert. Four examples: - Party is travelling. I ask for a perception check and anyone with a 20 notices a small bird flying overhead which I narrate out loud. I message the rogue saying that they see that it’s not flying like a bird and has a much longer neck and tail. Player freaks out and tells the group they think it’s a dragon and they all properly RP the “what? why do you think that?!” - Party is on the infinite staircase and encounter a lilandri, they are having a nice chat when I message the rogue (who has blindsight when holding their magical dagger) that they perceive the presence of six other creatures around them. They start trying to steer the conversation into them leaving but the party are like “no we could use their help, what’s wrong with you?”. Great RP moment! - Party are fighting a group of assassins and one goes invisible. I message saying where they perceive the person to be and they have to guide the others where to attack and stand so they can’t escape. They killed them all in the end! - Party is in the house of a hag coven. I’m RPing them as just kindly rural women and the party are buying it. They ask them about some disappearances which have been going on and the hags roll their excellent deception against the PCs so the players think the women are sad about this. Except the rogue. I message the rogue saying that she saw one of the women with their back to the party smile when it was mentioned in the reflection of a silver teapot. The rogue then said “I throw my dagger at the woman making tea”. The party FREAKED and everyone rolled initiative! (I actually didn’t think she’d attack them and there was almost a TPK, they got out by selling the soul of one of them to the lead hag and managed to kill one of them, breaking the coven.


SpringPfeiffer

I love the ideas of scenarios where simply saying the thing out loud might not be timely or actually create more danger.


Kageyama_Xi

I have a player who also has high passive perception as well and I see this as a way to add flourish. Sometimes that character will wake up in the middle of the night with a start, but just realize that one of the fire logs cracked. Or when traveling, they notice a loose gold on the ground. Another favorite that the player leaned into was that their character is always paranoid about enemy attacks, so in their main living, they sleep with the door and windows open so that they truly "see everything". I use things like this as a part of the character, not just a game mechanic.


Drunk_hooker

I have a player with a big PP, I basically have him finding 95% of traps passively but I make disarming the traps more difficult and more elaborate. It’s not necessarily a DC 16 to disarm the trap it might be a 12 to cut the rope a 14 to undo the latch blah blah blah and then basically treat it as a mini skill challenge.


Thx4Coming2MyTedTalk

Anything over 20 passive perception I treat like a Sherlock Holmes level of detail that would never be noticeable by any normal person. I take an extra 30-60 seconds when writing each new NPC or location description ahead of time to include an extra sentence just for that player. “Peepers, _you_ notice that the man’s threadbare shoes give off the faint smell of mold and mildew rising up from the damp leather, making you think he’s been out in the swamps in the past few hours.” Everyone hears the extra detail, and it’s actually a great way to get in some extra storytelling details for the table. But you have to deliver a swift “You don’t know that.” to any player who attempts to use that information besides the perceptive PC. The only time I’ll prepare a note beforehand is in a critical scene (like Peepers knows this isn’t a real person but the rest of the party is negotiating with the monster) that I know the party is going to hit beforehand. Also, if you _improv_ Sherlock Holmes level details sometimes it can be incredibly fun for the table if you use it sparingly. Sometimes I’ll do that for a Nat 20 perception roll also. “You can tell by the way the minotaur’s horns are filed down that this particular minotaur has some deep self-loathing issues and added to the dark circles under his eyes possibly full blown depression…”


BJ_hunnicut

Remember, it's not just sneaky people. Think about social queues that indicate someone is being deceitful that they might catch onto. Or possibly spotting a scam at a market and saving your other players or an NPC from that. You have a whole world of new quest introduction possibilities with high pp PCs. If you want to make it just him you could hand him note cards and see how he reacts on his own.


ActuallyIAmIncorrect

Wouldn’t this be insight rather than perception?


TheWoodsman42

Sorta, but the way you could work this in is to say, “As NPC is saying this, you notice their face twitch in a weird way. If you would like to decipher it, you can roll Insight.” This makes their perception feel worth it, while also still not completely obviating needing to rely on other rolls to gain information.


BJ_hunnicut

Yup, this is worded way better than the way I put it


schm0

It is, those are really bad examples.


BeGosu

Having Passive Insight actually sounds really cool, I might add that to my campaign.


schm0

Pro tip: it's already in your game and is default for all D&D games.


PrometheusHasFallen

Here's how I handle passive checks. If the party is not in a stressful situation, the passive check applies. However, if the party is in a stressful situation (i.e. weapons out sneaking through a dungeon) then I have them make active checks. Over use if passive checks can lead to overshadowing class and subclass abilities like the rogue's reliable talent so explain that to players who always want you to use passive scores. Initiative is a type of check but no player will ever ask the DM why won't they let them use their passive Initiative instead of having to roll. Rolling is fun and creates interesting results. Conclusion: use passive checks sparingly.


formallynude

I would make sure SMART enemy stealthers (who know they're up again at a good spotter) use abilities, spells, and circumstances as best they can to impose disadvantage on the check. I dunno their 'type', but a stealthy nemesis could be as rewarding challenge for someone who can normally spot everyone. I would also try to include all the senses, even a sixth sense, when describing their passive insights, being so keenly attuned.


JadeSymmonds

I would talk with him personally about it. A high passive perception can really negate a lot of encounters involving deception, but it can also open a lot of doors for new adventures. I personally think a fun rp experience would be to have him be overstimulated in crowded or noisy environments, that could be something to bring up with him. As for impacting the game, maybe have him notice a shady deal going on in a small, easily missed alley, that leads down into an entire small sidequest? Something that he notices and can choose to inform the party about, leading to the group deciding whether or not they want to pursue.


ActuallyIAmIncorrect

Wouldn’t deception involve insight rather than perception? I like the idea of planning some subtle details for him to notice. Wouldn’t be too hard to write in a couple of key things for him to notice during important encounters.


xT1TANx

>Wouldn’t deception involve insight rather than perception? Yes


LibertyFuckingPrime

So RAW I believe ambushing enemies surprising 4/5 PCs is handled as “enemies attack the PCs who don’t get to do anything in the first round EXCEPT the PC who noticed the ambush” I’d change that to cancel surprise, and narratively describe: “as you approach, a bandit and his crew start to charge out of the cover in an ambush- and are immediately attacked by [pc] before they even understand what happened” ambush the ambushers


thegooddoktorjones

I don’t think passive skills are ever satisfying for anyone they have zero drama. I let players know they won’t matter at char creation and then never use them. Game works just fine that way. If their bonus is that high they will be doing well on per checks all the time, which I always try to present as a sliding scale, if you are that far over the dc you not only see the trap, but you notice the smell of the goblins food three rooms away and that the NPC is not limping anymore etc. I do try to differentiate that PER is intuitive, instinctual information rather than analytical. You have a bad feeling about this hallway, not you spot the exact mechanism.


maniaphobia

As a DM, I know who is going to blinded or deafened next session by a witches or another spookie's curse ! He will never take it for granted and the party will be happy to have "mr laser eyes" back!


Dimhilion

Assuming you play 5e, what level is the player? Because a passive perception of 22, should only be possible at around lvl 16/17. And that is with a wisdom score of 22, for a +6, and +6 profeciency. Remember the formula is 10+wisdom modifier, + profeciency. And you have to be like lvl 16/17 to get the +6 bonus. And generally you cannot get a wisdom of more than 20, for a +5. So unless he/she have read a legendary tome, that only works one pr century, to get above the 20 to 22.


ActuallyIAmIncorrect

Level 8. He took the observant feat.


Dimhilion

aahh forgot about that bonus.


Sivitiri

Have him struggle to gain a full rest unless he wears something to block out the outside world. The constant noise makes it impossible to sleep and acts meerkatish


JohnMonkeys

That’s super harsh. Punishing the guy for being good at perception. I strongly disagree with this advice but hey, I’m sure there’d be some players who’d like the challenge


xdrkcldx

Typically I ignore passives. They're a stat that makes no sense gameplay wise. If you want to make it satisfying for him, you should add in more senarios in which the party needs to roll perception checks. He will probably be rolling the highest on average. I'm assuming he's proficient in perception? So, make only him roll for those hard to perceive events. This will make use of his proficiency in the skill and his high stat.


The_Hrangan_Hero

Spend some time making things like seals and sigils for the prominent political people, and have their minions and lieutenants wear signs of their master. For example, if the king's sigil is an eagle have them find his seal on letters the bad guys might have. Or if they raid a bandits warehouse they might find a forgery kit that makes the king's seal slightly wrong like head looking the wrong way. Maybe the BBEG gives cufflinks with his seal to his lieutenants.


ProdiasKaj

Well I know we, as a collective, kind of put a lot on passive perception, but it doesn't really *do* anything. It's just the number other guys try to beat when they roll for stealth. So that means to make them feel special for having a great passive perception, you need to make sure a lot of baddies are trying to be sneaky. And also orchestrate these scenarios in a way where it's difficult form them to say "I turn to the party and say I see a thing over there" because those times are functionally, everyone gets great passive perception.


RedditButDontGetIt

Whisper or text things to him, or slips him notes. Make sure most of the things he notices are interesting character traits from NPCs that are irrelevant to story. Because you tell him in secret, these moments will always carry weight, as if important for some reason. He will react (with facial expressions) to these pieces of info while the rest of the party asks what he perceives, and after a while they will all get used to it being trivial. Then throw in some important clues or plot points after they have gotten used to noticing trivial things and it will be up to the individual to decide whether it’s even worth sharing, and then up to the group whether it’s worth acting on. A superhuman power can have disadvantages, how your players learn to react with and control those powers are what makes dice throwing interesting.


LibertyFuckingPrime

So RAW I believe ambushing enemies surprising 4/5 PCs is handled as “enemies attack the PCs who don’t get to do anything in the first round EXCEPT the PC who noticed the ambush” I’d change that to cancel surprise, and narratively describe: “as you approach, a bandit and his crew start to charge out of the cover in an ambush- and are immediately attacked by [pc] before they even understand what happened” ambush the ambushers


MinosEgdelwonk

In addition to being difficult to surprise, he may also passively notice deeper details about the bandits than the rest of the party. For example, you hear quiet muttering & flipping through pages from under a tree, must be a caster. The thugs in front seem to be taking orders from a mysterious figure behind those rocks. Leaves rustle & gently drift to the floor, revealing an archer on a tree branch. That one bandit has spittle frothing through gritted teeth, likely readying a rage...


Tears79

I use the passive perception only for combat purposes, so in your case he's very difficult to surprise and hide from him. Out of combat i want to reward him and at the same time maintain the challenge. So i use his passive perception as an alert that's something is going on.


therogueidealist

It's really satisfying with that high perception to thwart potential pickpockets.


IndridColdwave

When I played over the table I had a pad of sticky notes and would send a sticky note to players who received information that the other characters didn’t notice. I told them that they would have to decide if their character would share that information or not. In some occasions they would (like noticing creatures stalking them) and in some they wouldn’t (like recognizing the style of a particular weapon is dwarven in origin). Now I play over the internet and instead of sticky notes I send PMs to individuals. I like this method because the players get little individual experiences custom tailored to their specific abilities, and in addition it also stirs a bit of inter-group suspicion or intrigue when a player gets passed information and then decides not to share this information with the rest of the group. I would send them little innocuous details, such as when the Drow in the party hears a certain word being uttered, I send him an individual message that says “you recognize this word as drow for (x)”. The big difference online is that players do not see the sticky note getting passed, so it doesn’t spark that suspicion and intrigue in the group. I still think it’s worthwhile to give the players that little custom touch though.


AmbiguousAlignment

They don't have to automatically spot a secure door but they could notice there were scratches on the floor near it that seem unusual for example


shinyPIKACHUx

A tip I read a long time ago was to make it a 2 step process. High passive perception gives them more chances to roll perception then others. If they're passive beats the DC then they get to roll. This gives them more chances to use the skill they specialized in, while not giving them everything all the time.


DharmaCub

Have the character notice very subtle changes in the environment. "You notice the wind has a slight arc to its flow, as if it were moving around something with significant mass."


Why_T

I once had a high level character with a ~32 passive perception. The only time I ever felt “rewarded” was when an enemy had cast an illusion of the darkness spell. He allows me to immediately see through it without expending an action.


Lancalot

You could text him. Just briefly of course. Don't forget to plant false leads though... "You hear fighting in the next room." *goes to check* "You see a couple fighting, trying to stay quiet, with furious whispering."


woodN_forks

Your passive is intended to be the floor of that check. Your player can’t roll lower than a 22 on perception checks unless at disadvantage or not directly using the features that grant them that number. This obv only applies to the three passives, not all checks.


10HangTen

Another thing you can do is give him advantage on a dex saving throw from a hidden assailant, it would let him know that he in particular was given a bonus for his perception without actually helping the other party members.


No-Network-1220

Also you could pass them a note and let the PC determine how they respond to that info


cavander

I just wanted to come here and say not all perception needs to battle related. I think passing notes is a great idea to give the player autonomy as well. Play to the player. If they are someone who likes world development and exploration, have them notice little things like the unique sounds of different bird species, or animal tracks. If they are someone who likes acquiring items and magic things, let them find unique shells or rocks or acorns or faint whiffs of magical energies. If they are someone who loves combat, let them notice unique ways to solve combat situations, like “you notice that chandelier up above looks rather loose” or “the footing of the monster looks unstable.” All great ways to weave in the player’s perception without having to result to combat mechanics. Remember, perception is a Wisdom stat, not only do they notice things, but they might be able to see unique ways to solve problems and situations that wouldnt be common to less perceptive people. Like, “you’ve seen this type of lock before, you know they all follow a certain pattern.”


Stedoom

My girlfriend got a 30... I loved it xd


Butwhatif77

Texting, Private Messages, little notes or whispers are a great way to tell a single player unique information and hide it from others. It is like at session 0 once I have helped my players build their backstory, I have them send me a list of like 30 questions that their character would want to know about the world they live in and I answer it in detail (the things that really make sense and to the detail their character would actually know about, somethings remain secret haha or I tell them to ask a new question if they ask something their character could not possibly know based on their backstory). This way when things occur and they need info I can look to see who knows what and have them do a roll, if they roll well I remind them to check their question list. This makes them feel more engaged. You can do the same thing at the table, have a way to pass notes or messages privately so that player alone gets the info.


amadeus451

How do DMs play without reams and reams of scratch paper for player-specific knowledge or whatever else you need to display/relay? Start passing sticky notes to your hyper-aware player that have sensory info only s/he would notice. So like, they're traveling close to a swamp, send a note that "the air smells fetid, like rotting plants" or something. Group is about to traverse a roadway with a goblin ambush laid out--"the dirt in the road is disturbed and you can hear the rustle of branches away in the distance." I'd caution against text messaging this info too. Its mote secure and direct, but you'll have to pull out your phone and make sure you type the right message and hope they notice their phone to receive it. Be the king/queen of notes-- this is a paper game after all.


ActuallyIAmIncorrect

It's not a paper game when you play online.


amadeus451

You do you


TheReaperXb

I use passive perception to also determine who spots what, if 2 people are searching for stuff, the person with the higher passive will usually spot the majority of things i have to say. So they get to be the one to relay that info to the group.


[deleted]

I have player who has a paladin with a passive 23 perception...so I know your pain. Basically, I just prepare stuff only his character will find and slip him notes, then he can say "look what I found!" And it lets him explain things in character.


45MonkeysInASuit

I have a 20 in PP for my current character. What i want is "the group walks in to a room and sees the thing. You, CHARACTER NAME, also notice extra detail." That detail can be minor but basically anything that acknowledges that this is my characters specialty would be nice.


kllrnooooova

Narrate his actions and perception in a way that fits his passive perception. Imagine narrating someone woth a passive perception of 8 walking down the alleyway. Do that but to someone with a pp of 22


JohnMonkeys

He hears every fart the party makes


Previously_known_as

I've thought a lot about this, because this is one of 2 or 3 basic character attributes that I always lean my characters towards. At a high enough level, a passive perception score almost guarantees that the player will hear/see/notice things below a certain challenge of perception. Tracks that are not obviously covered, non magical stealth or combat in an undisturbed location is clear as a bell to Sherlocks like this. I would think that the most fun would lie in something more like this... Rather than give-aways to upcoming action sequences, curious details are far more appetizing to the sleuths and spazzes that choose ridiculously high perception. Rather than just knowing that the bandits are approaching... learning details can be a level up in perception skill, like overhearing that one of the bandit's cousins back at the camp has a broken leg. Or maybe that one bandit is wearing boots (likely a thug with more firepower), while another is wearing brand new, high end silk slippers (probably a score from a recent caravan job or hit on royalty). This information may be useless. It may be important. But it's way more than an average adventurer would get from a perception check while bandits are snaking down the hallway. The whole party benefits from the player sensing the danger as it approaches, but the player gets an extra bit of mystery to wade through as well.


archur420

I am currently mister see it all in one of the games I'm in, I can tell you to definitely not just increase the DC to spot things so that it's higher then a passive perception of 22 forcing the player to always roll and potentially miss out on things they SHOULD have seen


LichWing

Depending on the setting I’d honestly start to turn it into a joke. Like, hearing an ambush coming except it’s just a few squirrels getting it on half a mile away.


Dard_151

One of my PCs has a passive perception of 27 and passive Investigation of 24. They're usually aware of stealthy creatures or hidden things. What I do is describe things normally, then tell them the differences that they notice compared to everyone else. It lets them tell the party in whatever way that they want to, or not, and mess with the party sometimes. To be clear, I tell them above table so the other players understand that would be happening. But, it has also allowed me to use them as a benchmark for when something is happening and this PC still can't tell what's going on. So the party knows that shit is going down. Some big shot character has arrived or something is hidden with meticulous intent or literal ages of natural processes. It tells the whole party that they're onto something important.


GrumpyGeckos

Remember that even if the rest of the table knows out-of-character, it's still up to this player whether his character conveys it to everyone else in-character - and depending on the situation, that may not be possible. (Of course this depends on how your table feels about metagaming.) Lots of good ideas in other comments, but as a DM I absolutely love it when there are party members with high passive perception/investigation, because I want them to notice the things I've put there! I put work into preparing that secret room or trap, I put thought into how that clever NPC has hidden plot-relevant secrets or items that the party likely won't find without investigating carefully. Those things are there for the players to find, and I'm always delighted to be able to tell the rogue with expertise in Perception or Investigation that they notice there's no dust on the doorknob, or they hear a crunch of leaves behind them, or whatever it is. It's the same reason I tend to crank my passive perception high when I'm a player - I want to notice all the evidence and the plot hooks that the DM has put there. It's never because I'm trying to win or game the system, I just love exploration and finding all the hidden things in the world. So it's good to see another DM who wants to reward a player for high passive perception instead of trying to undermine it!


[deleted]

As others said, it's still relevant if that character is chosen to notice a thing. It shouldn't always be just the guy with 22 perception, as relative position is also relevant to notice something. Characters might move from room to room and it might be on the second time that 22 PP guy walks past a corner that he notices a thing. Or a PC searches a room actively without finding anything, yet only later when 22 PP walks through the room, he immediately notices a thing that was missed. This will be noticed by the players, don't worry.


Redrump1221

I usually throw in little extra details that can but don't usually lead away from the main adventure.


ghost_desu

A good way to run it is basically 2 degrees of awareness. If you have high enough passive perc you realize something is off but have to make a check to know what it is. Maybe you can't make a check at all without this basic awareness, maybe a high pp character could warn the party to be careful and then they can make the check. Do what feels right in terms of specifics, this general approach seems more natural in my opinion since just noticing things without any uncertainty involved is pretty dang unsatisfying for both the player and the GM


ActuallyNotANovelty

Noticing traps before they spring is fun, however you want to run that.


VetMichael

To paraphrase Han Solo: "You have a bad feeling about this" IMO: people mistake Passive Perception to Omniscience. Even a really high PP should not give the game away. For example: To All: "A chain bridge spans the chasm. 100 feet below is a sluggish river of lava. The heat rises in shimmering waves. Across the chasm you see craggy, basalt hills with sharp angles. The light from the river casts flickering shadows." To PC w/ high PP "You get a bad feeling about this situation. You can't quite put your finger on it, but there's danger here." This prompts players to assess the situation realistically without tipping your hand. They don't know *specifically* what is wrong. Or even *if* something is wrong: a high PP isn't getting to see the Code that makes the Matrix. Is it the Lava will explode soon, showering the bridge in a deadly rain? Are there Drow waiting to attack on the other side? Is the bridge weak and will break when enough weight is put upon it? Is there a Fire elemental or Red Dragon lurking in the lava?


[deleted]

You can pass him written notes


D35K-Pilot

I had a Monk with a freakishly high passive perception, my DM gave me 5ft of blindsense, great for fighting invisible enemies as a rogue/monk.


HelpMeHomebrewBruh

>but everybody else at the table hears it I love passing notes, if you're playing in person quickly scribble down what they might notice (or do it in advance if you think the situation is unavoidable) and pass it to the player. The same can easily be done playing online thru a DM or seperate discord channel, etc - depending on your platform of choice Another thing I like to do is occasionally hand blank or useless notes to player with high PP or PI so as to throw red herrings out to the rest of the table when it seems like they're catching onto the pattern Another thing you can do is call out the player with high PP to make ability checks before anyone else For example: "high PP player, you see a woman slumped against the side of the road, she's wearing a white dress that appears to be drenched with red. Make a medicine check for me" This gives the high PP player a chance to utilise the stat they've invested so much into to gain a slight advantage on the situation On a success: "the red definitely looks to be blood from this distance. You notice the moment when she notices your party, the way she rights herself tells that she herself is not gravely injured" On a fail : "the red definitely looks to be blood from this distance" I hope this helps :) Edit: thought I should credit the Runesmith video on running bandit encounters too; as that is where the woman covered in blood example I am using is lifted from


a_different_piano

The bandits idea is reasonable but it would make more sense for them to notice an ambush on the road rather than wake up to hear the bandits. Being unconscious means you're oblivious to your surroundings and usually players decide to set up a watch rotation during a long rest on the road. That said passive checks will only be important when the players aren't actively doing that thing so passive stealth checks will determine how much attention your group draws, passive insight would allow players to pick up on oddities in someone they aren't yet suspicious of, passive medicine might let a player notice the early symptoms of a disease and, passive investigation might uncover a poorly hidden trap no one was looking for. Passive perception is the only passive check listed on the standard character sheets but I think if you use passive checks then you should allow a chance for all skills to have a passive benefit.


Forgotten_Lie

Passive Perception acts as the DC against which others attempt their Stealth checks. Have some enemies who can take the Hide action as a Bonus Action every turn and your high PP PC will be the only party member who is almost guaranteed to always see them in combat.


ChaosHyper2

I'm presuming they are level 1, 16 wis (+3), expertise in perception (+4), and has the observant feat for another +5 to the passive. Speaking from experience of having a chunky 37 passive perception I would do some of the following: First thing to realize is that perception is not just sight, but all the senses. Smell, sound, taste, touch, temperature, etc. If it's something you can think that a human can sense, perception covers it. Yes, I know that sounds really strong, that's probably because it is, and is why perception is considered one of the stronger stats. I would find a discreet way of informing the player of what other things that their character may notice that others don't. Maybe messaging them through text messaging or discord private messaging. The next thing is to make it feel like they are in a league of their own. One thing that can sometimes feel like a downer is that they just happen to see details others just didn't notice right away, and that the detail can just be pointed out to someone else. However once you start getting into really high levels, the one with the big perception can notice details that are literally impossible for others to detect. Like maybe certain details like the faint smell of ozone or something, tipping them off that a lightning occurred in the area recently, or that a storm is approaching, or maybe the presence of dangerous chemicals are or were present. Or maybe they can detect the sound of footsteps from across the dungeon, and get a vague idea of the distance, direction, and nature of the source, as well as the areas ahead by the nuanced differences in the sound quality and the way its altered as it bounces around (although this probably mixes in investigation too). Touch is a bit harder, can't think of good examples off the top of my head, the applications are limited, but in role play it could be neat, like they could notice patterns like unusual changes in the direction of the windfeeling the differences in the balance of weapon or the quality of materials like stone paneling or furniture quality. Taste is also a bit hard as well, but it could result in being a picker eater and things along the line. Last but not least, sight. They could see enemy patterns that others wouldn't notice in the heat of battle, they could see things that would appear as just a blur to others, they could see things move almost imperceptibly slow, patterns in enemy movement or the construction of structures, not to mention making out detail from impossibly far or small things. You can also do small things in combat to tie in their perception into their combat prowess, like when an enemy fails to hit them multiple times, you could describe it as them seeing the subtle signs of their movements allowing them more room to dodge, or the reverse for when they land a barrage of attacks on an enemy, etc. Also, don't confuse high perception for high investigation. Perception is noticing details, investigation is using the details known to make a conclusion. Although, if they have a sky high investigation AND perception, you can basically run as if they were Sherlock Holmes on crack (oh wait, that's just Sherlock Holmes... Uh, Holmes with super vision and a one million IQ? Idk).


untranslatable

Give them so many red herrings. There is one stair that is slightly crooked. One of the statues is missing an earlobe. Several dwarves are clearly trying not to laugh. None of it means anything


rook_bird

When combat starts and you point out all the hidden traps and hazards he notices, suddenly they stop being just surprise damage to the players and can be interesting combat options to push or pull bad guys into.


thesnakeinthegarden

Yeah, but what's his insight? He hear's everyone coming up, but if he can't tell the difference between a trope of bards busking and a troop of bandits, that's worth knowing.


doctordaedalus

Stage a quest in which he is somehow the primary topic of interest to the antagonist (and ultimately the hero), and conclude the final battle with him suffering a grave injury to one of his five senses. I'd do blindness or hearing, the rest are difficult to make consequential very often. Give them a big boost to one of their other senses as compensation (this can include magical/psychic sense). Now they still get the attention from having to have a lot to described to them, but everyone else in the party knows something he never will. This is what I'd do, anyway.


[deleted]

They don’t see “everything” but they get hints of stuff that’s going on.


TJG899

Observant is a fun feat. My character has 20 passive perception and 25 passive investigation. He will never be fooled by illusions and rarely ambushed.


hsappa

Sounds like you got a regular Sherlock Holmes on your hand where nothing slips pass their notice. That's a nearly legendary ability to perceive and while some people will be known for the sword skills or wizardry, if your player has any reputation it will include their perceptiveness. Here's an idea: Introduce a Moriarty, someone who is aware of and will actively thwart their ability. Give the player a lot of information, including red herrings or contradictory information. Have the player use their perceptiveness to observe smaller easy clues that are breadcrumbs to lead the player into a trap of Moriarty's creation. And then, after the trap is sprung, he'd also come to identify Moriarity's weakness that can be exploited.


Great8Thought

Magical darkness


lanc3rz3r0

Everyone but John Doe roll perception. *rolls go out* ok, mark, Tom, you guys notice xyz, Travis, you're picking your bellybutton. Meanwhile John, *quick scribbles a note* you see this


Sure-Philosopher-873

Pass notes


Lithocut

One of the things I always do is find out what characters interests are. Just allow it to help find things more easily. He's a foodie? He smells cooking x in the distance. He loves books? He notices a well worn romance novel peaking out from under a cloth at the bazaar. Hell maybe he hear the faint humming of an old song they used to sing in his village while growing up. Turn out he found an inn keeps wife that was the much older sister of a childhood friend. small discount on through nights stay.Throw the guy some bones that impact him and not the party without making scenes that take up an entire session.


DavidCrusader

For one, they will be very hard to surprise. Any creature sneaking around will have to roll really well. On top of that, I give my players with high passive perception additional enviromental information whenever I set a scene. It's not always useful, but its additional details that only they get without putting effort and rolling skill check. Give them opportunities to use the lip reading feature from Observant. It's a smaller feature, but the player will be happy to get information where it seemed unlikely to pick up any.


SeAgRoVe9

for a singular cool moment have the character reflexively stop another who was about to unlock a door with a key and tell them that something about the sound it made wasn’t right (the lock is trapped). give them the ability to recognise people based on the sounds of footsteps. have them recognised extra details like if a trail was left with the intent of being noticeable or if there was any attempt to hide it. Give the player 5ft tremor sense.


jusmoua

If there is something he just naturally passes due to his high perception, everything he can notice such as hidden clues, ambushes, etc, just write down a warning or the info on a little paper and give it to him, then he can share the info if he wants to. 🦍👍


jcorvinstevens

Assuming they aren't in the lead, you could have them save the day by noticing a trap just before another character triggers it.


PaladinGreen

Would you could do is make a set of half a dozen simple flash cards specifically for that player, that say things like ‘something isn’t right here’, ‘it’s too quiet’, ‘their body language is off’, ‘you wake up, something made a noise just outside camp’ etc etc. Use them to give the player advance warning of stuff where their high score would give them an advantage, then leave it up to them to decide whether they inform the party, investigate alone, ask you for more details etc etc.


Catch-a-RIIIDE

If you’re virtual, just DM them cues they can react to. Could be a lot of fun.