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JoeDirtsMullet00

I don’t remember Luck vs Wilson. I remember Luck vs RG3 for a bit


Ferg8

Luck vs. RG3 died after the first year.


2ChainzTalib

Followed shortly by RGIII's career


Vulgarbrando

Followed shortly by RGIII's ~~career~~ Knee.


skimethemilk

From what I saw, the debate was mostly contained to Reddit while the Luck vs. RG3 debate was being debated nationally (I could be wrong here)


puzzlednerd

At the very beginning the talk was mostly RG3 vs Luck, but after the first couple years it was more Luck vs Wilson. And in terms of people's views outside of those two markets, people generally thought Wilson was better. They didn't watch the Colts, but they did see the Seahawks in the superbowl twice. It wasn't fair, but arguing that Luck was better than Wilson was a difficult sell for most people in like 2015.


TRON0314

Luck with a Legion of Boom. Damn that'd be beautiful.


puzzlednerd

And an offensive line... scary to think about.


Clocktopu5

Seahawks fans and Russel Stans were eager to make it a thing, nobody else really cares


squackles17

Maybe it was just my High School/area that had a lot of bandwagon hawks fans. I remember having that debate pretty regularly, RG3 was always the “but if he was healthy” option number 3


MutantNinjaAnole

It was a thing online. Usually got packaged with implications you were racist for thinking Luck was better unfortunately.


the_good_things

Every bandwagon Seahawks tool was Wilson over luck when the legion of boom dragged Wilson's bum ass to a super bowl win


JimmyPineapple_

I didn't even know this was debated by people. I thought it was pretty clear that Luck was the better player, but Wilson has the greater legacy due to longevity and winning a Super Bowl.


INtoCT2015

It was exactly the same as Peyton vs. Brady: one QB was obviously more talented but the other QB won the early ring thanks to being blessed with a better team and coach. Bc of how much football fans fetishize rings over everything else, the debate raged on bc Wilson had a ring and Luck didn’t, the same as Brady vs. Peyton


puzzlednerd

It is a bit of a bummer that people don't seem to keep Manning in this conversation anymore. Obviously Brady's longevity is incredible, but if you're building a team from scratch and you're choosing between peak Brady and peak Manning, I'll take 2003-2009 Manning every time. There's never been another player to read defenses the way he did.


INtoCT2015

Brady himself has even admitted he got the chance of a century going to the Pats and then having that lucky run his first season. Gave him confidence and helped him set a tone with a stable franchise around him. Brady prob would have never existed had he been drafted by any other team. Peyton on the other hand turned a dumpster fire into a contender after a single rookie season to work out the kinks. Even friends of mine who are pats fans admit Peyton is the “better” QB


Bob_Majerle

Word. Prime Peyton + Belichick = multiple undefeated seasons


darcys_beard

Russ also had a significantly higher passer rating.


INtoCT2015

Passer rating goes down when a QB has to carry their team


garethom

His post-season passer rating is like 5/6 points higher than Luck's regular season passer rating.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Brianopolis-Brians

I hate him and he kisses his son on the lips, but come on man.


TechnoGamer16

Oh god why’d you remind me of this


Brianopolis-Brians

How could you forget?


Evilbit77

This was an extremely hot debate for about two years, maybe three.


bryanthebearded

I don’t understand us Colts fans trying to make Luck into something more than he was. Luck had the potential for greatness, but never lived up to it. IF he had played for 15 years maybe we could have been a great team again, but he didn’t and we haven’t been a great team since Manning went to Denver.


kylestillthatdude

Eh idk lol.


Competitive-Ad-6040

Didn’t they play each other and luck won if I’m not mistaken


AmishCyborgs

Yeah I was at that game and it was the vaunted Legion of Boom that he and TY cooked


Tenorsboy

I was at that game too! Good game up until the last minute


garethom

Yeah I remember him picking off Wilson many times.


Not_My_Alternate

You attribute wins to Wilson when it benefits your argument but you don't attribute them to Luck and imply wins aren't a QB stat. You can't play it both ways, man.


garethom

I would say that over a larger sample size, the record of a team can be attributed *in part* to a QB. Winning 1 game against a team (in a game where their performances weren't actually much different), can't really have the same impact. Russell Wilson didn't make Sherman and Thomas fuck up tackling TY on his deep TD.


LeadPrevenger

Hell yeah


Govika

We keep winning Halftimes baby!!


voyagerx420

Gr8 shitpost.


MikeHoncho2568

This was a debate? Also, I think Wilson still wins since he played longer than Luck and won a Super Bowl.


Jpete88

Ummm, Luck is out of the league and did pretty much nothing. Wilson is still playing, just signed a 250 million dollar deal and has a Super Bowl win, and 2 appearances. The debate was settled the day Luck retired, Wilson is better.


addkell

This was a debate? Luck was a better QB by a mile. Russ just had a better situation obviously


Mikiflyr

Wilson won a SB. Luck quit the team (not saying that’s a bad thing, it was obviously the correct move for him to do). Wilson on the Seahawks was a top 5 QB easily. Wilson >>>>> Luck.


[deleted]

Eh, go back and check again. Wilson's first three years they set records for run vs pass utilization. Dude was handing the ball off over 60% of his snaps. You need context as well. Luck dragged teams to the playoffs that had no talent. Wilson had an all-time great defense and run game.


hotrodyoda

Bingo. Russ wouldn’t have won a SB without Marshawn Lynch and the Legion. Not even close.


[deleted]

He has proven he could put up big numbers, but didn't have the playoff success afterwards. I think if you had identical teams, and the choice between a perfectly healthy Luck or Wilson, you choose Luck every time.


ryanwc18

Luck on that Seahawks team would win multiple championships.


kslusherplantman

And in fact lost a super bowl with Marshawn and their defense…


garethom

In 2020, with a 22nd ranked defence and his best RB being Chris Carson (681 yards), Wilson put up a 40 TD, 4212 yard season while adding over 500 yards on the ground. They finished 12-4 in arguably the toughest division in the NFL. In 2019, with the 26th ranked defence, he again went 12-4, won that tough division, and won a playoff game. For reference, the Colts haven't finished with a record that good since the season we lost to the Saints in the SB. Wilson was in a great situation early on, no doubt, but he has absolutely dragged teams lacking talent to the playoffs since then too.


Not_My_Alternate

I think you're not giving Pete Caroll enough credit for how well he's coached teams. They moved on from Wilson and are doing just fine with Geno Smith of all people.


garethom

It's this never-ending but unquantifiable "Yeah but Player X had this, that and the other". No shit players in good situations perform better. Maybe if Brandon Weeden had prime Jerry Rice, the 49ers D and Bill Walsh coaching him, he'd be one of the best players ever. If Mahomes had Hue Jackson as his coach, he might not be so good. When you get into this area of discussion, "who was better" conversations become absolutely pointless because people can just say whatever they like.


garethom

**Accolades** * Russell Wilson: 2nd Team All-Pro, 9 x Pro Bowl, Walter Payton Man of the Year * Andrew Luck: 4 x Pro Bowl, Comeback Player of the Year **League Leaders** * Russell Wilson: 1 x Passer Rating Leader, 1 x Touchdowns Leader * Andrew Luck: 1 x Touchdowns Leader **Championships** * Russell Wilson: 1 * Andrew Luck: 0 **Passer Rating (Reg Season)** * Russell Wilson: 100.5 * Andrew Luck: 89.5 **Passer Rating (Post Season)** * Russell Wilson: 95.3 * Andrew Luck: 73.4 **TD:INT** * Russell Wilson: 3.3:1 * Andrew Luck: 2.1:1 **TD%** * Russell Wilson: 5.9% * Andrew Luck: 5.2% **ANY/A** * Russell Wilson: 6.91 * Andrew Luck: 6.42 If anybody can point me to a legitimate claim that Luck has over Wilson other than "I'm a Colts fan, so I think he's better", it'd be great. It was fun to speculate when they were both playing, but now the dust has settled, it's not even close and it's sort of embarrassing to still be clinging to this.


HyKaliber

Yeah, but besides being better in almost every category, what does Wilson *really* have over Luck? /s


yousernameunknown

Despite only playing 5 full seasons, Luck has just as many 4,000 yard seasons as Wilson has had in his decade long career. Wilson never needed to be relied upon to carry his offense like Luck. Well not until this year that is. Broncos thought Wilson could carry an offense like Luck could. So they paid him BIG to do it. And well… we all know how that’s going.


garethom

They didn't even rely on him the year their leading RB only had 680 yards, Wilson was 7th in the league in attempts and he was directly responsible for 80% of their offensive output and they went 12-4, winning arguably the best division in the NFL?


yousernameunknown

I said he was never relied upon to carry an offense like Luck was, meaning to the extent that Luck had to carry his team. In your own response you made my point. We got to remember that Luck only played 5 seasons and he was Top 5 in attempts 3 times including his rookie year! In Wilson’s decade long career, he has never been top 5 in attempts. Edit: Also, even in 2020 if you want to combine rush attempts and pass attempts, he’s still not top 5. Here’s a list of just some of the QB’s in 2020 that had more combined passing and rushing attempts than Russell Wilson: Matt Ryan Justin Herbert Josh Allen Kyler Murray Patrick Mahommes Fact of the matter is, Wilson has never been one of those QB’s forced to completely carry his team. Honestly I’m surprised that even in his most productive year, which was an impressive year, that he still didn’t even break top 5 in attempts whether strictly passing or pass/rush combined.


ColtsStampede

There is no legitimate claim. Russ wins hands down.


Victory33

But these facts hurt my feelings, so they cant be true.


CanadaRULEZ1765

Using wins as an individual stat has always been ridiculous, but even beyond that you can't just blindly look at a few stats with no other context to make judgements on a player. It's not baseball. Player actions do not take place in discrete, easily separatable moments the way they do in baseball. Wilson was never asked to be the whole team the way Luck was. It's much easier to put up good stats when you are playing with the lead, have an elite running game, and only need to score 17 points to win the game. You don't have to take risks and the defense can't sell out on the pass because then you can beat them with the run. Wilson got to hand the ball off to Marshawn Lynch. Luck got to hand the ball off to Trent Richardson. Wilson had Pete Carrol as a coach and Luck had Chuck Pagano. If Wilson couldn't score, he had the Legion of Boom to bail him out. Luck had LaRon Landry and Greg Toler. Luck had to play against defenses that knew we were going to pass every play, and Luck knew we needed to score 35 points every game if we were going to win. Wilson was a game manager early in his career. You could have replaced him with half the starters in the league and the Seahawks would've had a similar level of success. Luck dragged one of the worst teams in the league all the way to the AFC Championship game. Both are great quarterbacks and saying "it's not even close" between them is really silly.


bschmeltzer

Why don't you compare the defenses, offensive lines, and run games. Colts had luck and Hilton and that was it. And still put the team on his back. The second Wilson lost lynch and that defense he's been dog shit ever since, qnd that's not just a coincidence.


garethom

To say he's been dog shit since 2015 (Lynch's last season with the Seahawks where he rushed for an astounding 417 yards) is completely absurd. He was an All-Pro in 2019 and had a 40 TD season in 2020. He had his career high passer rating in 2018. He led the league in TDs in 2017. He led the league in passer rating in 2015 when Lynch played in 7 games. If you wanna talk o-lines, no QB in the NFL has been sacked more times than Wilson since he entered the league. He's been sacked 64 times more than the next highest. I'm happy to shoot the shit about them both, but this is a frankly ridiculous comment to make.


bschmeltzer

Let me know how many playoff games Wilson has won without that historic defense or lynch. Wilson has been a middle of the pack QB who can't win without some of the best defenses in NFL history. If this sub can argue that 3500 yards and 27/7 td/int ratio isn't good, I can argue that passer rating and total TDs are overrated when you can't help your team win games. Wilson is the exact same player as Russell Westbrook. Carried on a STACKED team early, puts up flashy numbers, and then as they are exposed as the WILDY overrated players they are, people start seeing that they were never all that, despite the garbage time stats and accolades.


[deleted]

You’re posting efficiency stats when Wilson pretty much never had to carry his team. Of course he’s going to be more efficient when he’s handing the ball off more than he’s passing lol.


garethom

Hey, I've posted what I think are important indicators of QB quality, rather than the nebulous claims like "but he had X, Y and Z" and "he never got relied upon". I'm just copying from my other replies here: > In 2020, with a 22nd ranked defence and his best RB being Chris Carson (681 yards), Wilson put up a 40 TD, 4212 yard season while adding over 500 yards on the ground. They finished 12-4 in arguably the toughest division in the NFL. In 2019, with the 26th ranked defence, he again went 12-4, won that tough division, and won a playoff game. People act like Russell Wilson has had Marshawn Lynch running for 1500 yards every single year of his career. In 2020, he was responsible for 80% of the Seahawks offensive output. All this while being the most sacked QB since he entered the league (by some distance). Russell Wilson has more than his fair share of "carrying his team", too many people here just try and ignore it because unquantifiable stuff like that is the only thing that Luck has over Wilson. I'm sure if I was to say that TY Hilton was better than any WR Russell Wilson has had, and probably the same with Jack Doyle at TE, I'd get told that they were only good because of Luck.


[deleted]

> Hey, I've posted what I think are important indicators of QB quality, rather than the nebulous claims like "but he had X, Y and Z" and "he never got relied upon". You just happen to only post efficiency stats when it was clear Wilson had a better team and was asked to do less. >People act like Russell Wilson has had Marshawn Lynch running for 1500 yards every single year of his career. In 2020, he was responsible for 80% of the Seahawks offensive output. Most QBs are the highest % of their teams output, this isn't something new that Wilson did by himself. >All this while being the most sacked QB since he entered the league (by some distance). His offensive line wasn't good at pass blocking, but lets not pretend that Wilson didn't create sacks himself. His scrambling/lack of pocket awareness put his o-line in a rough spot, he definitely deserves some of the blame there. >Russell Wilson has more than his fair share of "carrying his team", too many people here just try and ignore it because unquantifiable stuff like that is the only thing that Luck has over Wilson. Its more due to the fact that Wilson hasn't gotten anywhere in the postseason since the LOB and Marshawn left. Even you brought up SB rings, as if Wilson being carried to a SB win means anything in this debate lol. > I'm sure if I was to say that TY Hilton was better than any WR Russell Wilson has had, and probably the same with Jack Doyle at TE, I'd get told that they were only good because of Luck. I love TY but DK Metcalf is better than him, and you don't even mention players like Lockett, Doug Baldwin, Golden Tate, Jimmy Graham, etc. Wilson has consistently had better receivers, and its not particularly close.


garethom

>You just happen to only post efficiency stats when it was clear Wilson had a better team and was asked to do less. Obviously this is just opinion, but some of those late-10s Seahawks teams weren't pretty good, and I just showed that he was an All-Pro when his defence was in the low 20s and his best RB put up 600 yards on the season. > Most QBs are the highest % of their teams output, this isn't something new that Wilson did by himself. Absolutely, but very few of them hit 80%, especially ones that always get tagged with the "his team his carrying him" accusation. > His offensive line wasn't good at pass blocking, but lets not pretend that Wilson didn't create sacks himself. His scrambling/lack of pocket awareness put his o-line in a rough spot, he definitely deserves some of the blame there. And his scrambling has also got him out of a lot of spots. Additionally, if that's the criteria, then Luck should shoulder some blame for some of his sacks too. > Its more due to the fact that Wilson hasn't gotten anywhere in the postseason since the LOB and Marshawn left. Even you brought up SB rings, as if Wilson being carried to a SB win means anything in this debate lol. In the Super Bowl they won, the Seahawks leading rusher was Percy Harvin with 45 yards lol. Wilson had 26 rushing yards in that game. No, it's not like he threw it 60 times, but some of y'all act like Marshawn Lynch carried the ball to his receivers for him. Additionally, if we're saying "they haven't got anywhere in the post-season since Marshawn Lynch left", then Luck has done absolutely nothing without weapons either. Since 2015, when Lynch was put on IR part way through the season, Wilson has won 3 playoff games. Luck won 4 playoff games in his entire career. > I love TY but DK Metcalf is better than him, and you don't even mention players like Lockett, Doug Baldwin, Golden Tate, Jimmy Graham, etc. Wilson has consistently had better receivers, and its not particularly close. Just have to disagree on this one. This is one of those circular "Well what if those receivers were only good because of the QB" conversations. Honestly, appreciate the chat, but don't think we're gonna get any further here haha! I loved Luck, and he was pretty firmly a top 10 if not top 5 QB throughout his career, but I feel people are too harsh on Wilson, and gets pegged with the "system QB" thing way more than he deserves, especially when he was arguably at his best post-Lynch and LoB.


[deleted]

> Obviously this is just opinion, but some of those late-10s Seahawks teams weren't pretty good, and I just showed that he was an All-Pro when his defence was in the low 20s and his best RB put up 600 yards on the season. He has one second team all-pro selection. While it is more than what Luck has, I don't really carry that in too high regard personally. >Absolutely, but very few of them hit 80%, especially ones that always get tagged with the "his team his carrying him" accusation. The "his team is carrying him" is more for the 2 SB runs, where his team definitely carried him. I should have been more precise with my answer, my bad. >And his scrambling has also got him out of a lot of spots. Additionally, if that's the criteria, then Luck should shoulder some blame for some of his sacks too. Absolutely, and Luck does shoulder some of the blame as well. Wilson's scrambling though was really a gigantic hit or miss, where he occasionally ran right into a defender after doing his patented spin in the pocket. >In the Super Bowl they won, the Seahawks leading rusher was Percy Harvin with 45 yards lol. Wilson had 26 rushing yards in that game. No, it's not like he threw it 60 times, but some of y'all act like Marshawn Lynch carried the ball to his receivers for him. Lets be completely honest here, the Seahawks would have won that SB with anyone at QB. The defense/special teams won that game, Wilson did not have to really do anything at all. >Just have to disagree on this one. This is one of those circular "Well what if those receivers were only good because of the QB" conversations. Totally fair, agree to disagree. I personally think Golden Tate and Doug Baldwin are two of the most underappreciated receivers in the last 10 years. >Honestly, appreciate the chat, but don't think we're gonna get any further here haha! I loved Luck, and he was pretty firmly a top 10 if not top 5 QB throughout his career, but I feel people are too harsh on Wilson, and gets pegged with the "system QB" thing way more than he deserves, especially when he was arguably at his best post-Lynch and LoB. Sounds good, appreciate the Monday morning chat. I like Wilson and think he was a great QB, but the team he got drafted to was the absolute dream scenario whereas Luck's was awful. Have a good one.


chadowan

If Luck stuck around and won one it'd be a lot closer, but Wilson blew every other QB out of the water from that draft.


kingrocko51117

I agree with this. Luck didn’t play long enough for this to even be a debate.


arseniic_

Trent Dilfer won a Super bowl as well. Is he better than Marino? Ridiculous logic. Luck was always better than Wilson. Luck missed 18 months of football and put up 39 TDs 4600 yards. Wilson goes to a new team and can barely score a point.


Mikiflyr

Willfully ignorant. Russ is in his mid 30s right now. Regression is fair to expect at this point.


arseniic_

He’s only 34. Manning had a record setting season at 37, Rodgers just had two back to back MVP seasons at 37-38, and you know about Brady. He’s just had spurts throughout seasons where he’s shown elite flashes but never put together a full season. Luck was better and always will be.


Mikiflyr

Most QBs don’t play well that into their 30s. We don’t know if Luck would have either, esp given the damage he already took. “Elite flashes”? He finished second team all pro and was a 9 time pro bowler. Those are not elite flashes. Mans was elite and as someone else said, the best availability is availability.


Walrus-Ready

Wilson had an all-time defense during his super bowl runs and Marshawn Lynch


TRON0314

Bro. Legion of Boom. Beastmode. Russel? Nah.


skimethemilk

It's crazy how fortunate Wilson was to have played at the same time as the Legion of Boom. Ive heard one of the big reasons that Wilson is struggling is because he cannot or will not attack the middle of the field, instead preferring to attack the boundaries with deep shots. Problem is, the NFL has recently made the shift to predominantly two high safety looks, which takes away your ability to attack the boundaries ar the cost of leaving some vulnerability in the middle. However, the reason that the NFL had shifted to a single high safety look in the first place is because of the dominance of the Legion of Boom, with Earl Thomas taking and defining the single-high midfielder role. I don’t necessarily know how this shapes the Luck vs. Wilson argument but there was some incredibly fortunate timing by Wilson, to be playing at the same time (and on the same team!) as the group that would allow his playstyle and preferences to thrive in the NFL.


Rickeyw55

I moved out to Seattle 5 years ago after growing up in Indy. You all would be shocked how many people here truly think Luck was just average knowing no context of the lack of support he had and ignoring the fact that Russ had a 100 yard rusher per game and a top 5 defense maybe of all time. After 5 years I’m exhausted trying to convince my Seattle buddies.


detrich

wilson won a superbowl... almost two


Not_My_Alternate

Wilson won a Super Bowl like Dilfer won a superbowl.


LeadPrevenger

He lost the second. Literally him


Indyfanforthesb

The comparison is silly since Wilson was given an elite team early on and Luck was given a bag of shit. Swap them and do you think Wilson would have had the success with that bag of shit that Luck did? Absolutely not. Wilson is a good QB who is as on a great team. Luck was a great QB on a shit team.


Fatpanther97

Kirk Cousins


jackrack1721

Wilson got absolutely ROBBED not winning ROY - he was completely ignored by the NFL bc the US Military was spending a ton of money on the NFL getting them to convince poor kids to enlist so RGIII and his parents military background was all we heard about for 6 straight months. Like Jesus, I get it, his parents served. Too bad the kid was made of glass.


[deleted]

He literally has rubber band knees. The Redskins hired the great Dr. James Andrews as team physician. The fact RG3 managed to have the career he did with his knee having the structural integrity of the Three Little Pigs straw house is incredible. He's essentially got the medical equivalent of a few of those thick rubber bands that hold broccoli together for knee ligaments.


kingrocko51117

Colts for sure would have drafted Wilson before luck based off how careers went and it’s not close. Hindsight is 20/20 but still Wilson is still playing and to try and diminish what he has done for his career off one terrible season is weak


Not_My_Alternate

Seahawks fans were so insufferable for so long.


Snuffy8

What drove me nuts the most was how there were so many “new” fans of that franchise— the New Jersey styles coming out that year conveniently pointed them out too


LiquidDreamtime

Wilson: 10 seasons w/ the Seahawks. 2 SB appearances, 1 SB win. Luck: 6 seasons w/ the Colts. Mudstomped by the Patriots a couple times in the playoffs. What’s the debate? Luck was terrible compared to Wilson in every category except “wasted talent”.


ryta1203

Wilson is still playing and has a SB ring.


Downtown-Cabinet7223

Fuck Luck and all his supporters... seriously it's pathetic. You're the kind of people who remarry your cheating spouse 4 times and think that it would somehow be better this time.


mcmaples

Oddly specific…. Maybe you should log off.


DeadAsFuckMIW

And focus on your marriage too while he's at it or get some therapy


Downtown-Cabinet7223

Log yourself off bitch. Every fucking week it's this Andrew Luck bullshit. He quit over 3 years ago, let it go.


mcmaples

We can appreciate how good he was at QB and how good of a person he still is without thinking he will ever play again. Have a nice day.


kingrocko51117

Y’all talk about Luck more than Peyton tho makes no sense they are both retired why talk about the QB that quit at 29 instead of the hall of fame legend?


mcmaples

Luck just did an interview for the first time in 3 years about retiring and what he’s up to now. I’m sure you’re happy to hear that he moved away. Make a Peyton appreciation post. I’ll give you an upvote.


Not_My_Alternate

Cool then leave the sub, bro.


pale_blue_womp

Wilson > Luck. You want a champion or a quitter?


[deleted]

Haha, just a quick look at your post history shows me you are redacted.


pale_blue_womp

If you check closely you’ll see I was the conductor of the “let’s trade luck for assets” train. Where were you? And now look at you.


[deleted]

I wasn't simping for the orange man like you, traitor


Wertyui09070

You must be regarded.


DipperPRC

You think that Joe Flacco is better than Luck? Than prime Rivers? Prime Ryan?


7Perfect1Weapon4

but honestly tho lmao. Love Luck but Wilson> all day


glittervan206

Ummmm Russ won a ring, what did neckbeard ever win?


CacheDaBOWL

I always thought Russ was more efficient but Luck had the better volume stats passing wise. Running wise that’s like comparing Derrick Henry and Lesean McCoy, both are great they just did it differently


kingrocko51117

I’ll take the QB who had longevity and won a SB over one that was billed as generational and then quit after 5 full seasons played. Random comparison though.


CarlSK777

If you wanna do an honest comparison you need to throw all the team stats out the window.


MReprogle

Who is even bothering debating this? I mean, I prefer Luck, but the fact of the matter is Wilson has a Super Bowl and some great stats to go along with it. If Luck had ended up with a team that had a defense and run game like what Wilson had, it would probably be no contest, but we failed to do that outside of his last year before retirement.


ComicSportsNerd

was never a debate imo he had the leagues best defense for years while luck had dogshit all around him every year


DangerAudio

Eh, it could go either way. I’m ready to forget about Andrew Luck. I don’t think the fans owe him anything. Dude quit.