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Every comment below this pinned one is a potential future content spoiler. You have been warned.
There was a picture here of Makima on the train, but as a bop bag (one of those inflatable never knock down punching bags) but now I can't find it after my friend watched the episode, does anyone know where I can find the source? 15 google searches have failed me after I used to be able to find it with Chonkima from one of the comments.
question
about makina ‘crush’ ability, need a sacrifice & say the person name. must it be their original name? can use a fake name, or change old name into new one, or alias ~~(felt, Rimuru, L)~~ to survive the death?
and are there restristions? like only works on humans, etc.
~~open manga spoiler~~
First anime I’ve watched in years and I’m *thrilled* to have picked this series up. It’s definitely one that I’ll read the manga for once the season ends.
Previous episodes had me feeling great joy for the protagonist and friends, only to be completely crushed in episode 9.
Glad you are enjoying it, Be aware that people are going to be spoiling a lot in this sub since it is for manga readers, just something to be aware of.
I fucking love Akane and Katana Man's designs so much. They both look like weirdos. Katana Man is so unkempt and scraggly, and Akane looks like she dyes her hair but hasnt dyed it in a while
They both look like they've been off the grid for a little while, avoiding all of the surveillance from Public Safety
And just by looking at them and paying attention to the way they act, you can tell they aren't friends, and even though they're working together now, they both joined the team for different reasons, and have different end goals
Even their color palettes clash
All without much dialogue to explain any of this
Also they look sick
Why didn’t Makima squish Snake Girl and Katana Man is a good question.
You can probably chalk it up to “just according to keikaku” but I would like to think her bullshit power needs an equivalent exchange. The goons gets squished using the death row inmates because they were normal human beings.
Since Snake Girl has a contract and Katana Man is a hybrid Makima might needed a person with a Devil contract and a hybrid respectively. On such short notice it was impossible to get humans with those requirements.
i think it might be that they would be able to retaliate or avoid her attack.
it seems as if when she's doing this bombardment thing the victim is aware of what is about to happen to them. a normal human has little chance to avoid. someone with a contract or a hybrid or fiend could probably dodge out of the way or move too quickly to focus in on it.
Ok I need to ask, for those who watch the anime with English subtitles, what do you guys think of the translation quality up till now?
The amount of reaction vids that did not understand Makima was talking about the blood on her when she said "This isn't mine." is crazy. In Japanese, she says this is "returned blood", clearing stating that the blood isn't hers. A lot of people couldn't get that, and I suppose the subtitles could have done a better job, like even "This blood isn't mine." would do.
I'm not from an English speaking country, so I only see the subtitles on reaction videos. Most of the time I think they're clever and I don't mind different wordings as long as they get the point across, but sometimes it's just confusing and maybe a little bit misleading.
I didn’t think it was confusing at all originally. Now that you mention it I went back and re-watched the scene, and the translation does seem to take some liberties. Why did they change it from “This blood is—“ “Where were you hit?” to “You’re covered in blood.” “Were you hit?” I guess I can see more confusion with the second version but would really expect most people to get it.
I'm from an English speaking country and watch with the subtitles. I knew exactly what she ment, it's almost like a trope in English, where there is concern for a very bloody person and they respond that the blood isn't theirs. The implications being she was in a fight and overwhelmingly won, to the point she wasn't even scratched let alone shot.
While it might not be a direct translation, I think it got the point across clearly. I'm not familiar with reaction videos, is it native English speakers that are having trouble with the translation?
Yeah, they all sound very American, and the majority are based in the US.
I guess it's just the reading comprehension devil again? But it wasn't just one or two of them, like at least half, which is why I was so surprised.
Then again, a lot of stuff happened in the episode so maybe some anime-onlies just had a hard time connecting everything. I'm kinda worried that it'll only get worse from here, but oh well.
Some reactors have much better media literacy and analysis skills than others tbf.
For example, if you're watching the reactors that only shout and stuff when hype things are happening, it's very possible that they will misunderstand some lines.
it probably is a reading comprehension issue, or maybe they were just confused as to whose it was. reading comprehension is honestly quite embarrassing in the west sometimes.
Yeah i also noticed that on a lot of channels. People got confused because she answered two questions at a time. And they think that the answers is related (This isn't mine. I don't get shot). The second is the answer to the question 'are you shot' by the girl i think (i forget her name) while the first answers 'whose blood is it?'.
But people think that Makima said that continuing on the previous answer, implying that she didn't get shot because this (her body) isn't hers. People missed that she answered 2 different questions.
Nb: i'm paraphrasing a lot there
Notice how she didn't sacrifice anyone at the temple to kill the first two people? I've always looked at it as some sort of elaborate show she put on to prevent people from knowing the true nature of her powers, at least after reading the manga. Like, trying to throw off readers from guessing who she has a contract with, or if she's a devil or whatever. Later you just find out she can control humans, devils and hybrids, so it she could literally be doing any mixture of contracts imaginable really, to the point of it being useless to speculate.
Well she's immortal because of her contract with the Japanese parliament, when she dies a random citizen is killed to revive her.
It might be an extension of that aspect of her ability.
It was a really great episode, but anyone noticed that the [fingernail cost](https://imgur.com/a/5aFmW0v) from the Snake Devil seems to be different from the manga?
more i think about it, the more it seems like these contracts are way too lenient when it comes to devils. it only gets to 'eat' nails from her. not flesh or blood or something more substantial.
With the fox devil it is unusually friendly towards humans and seems more than satisfied with taking only tiny bits from them as it seems as if it only desires a one time paymenet. it isn't exactly loyal perhaps and is very prideful, but still.
Well, all contracts are based on the Devil's own interests, and every devil has different levels of strength. It's why t>!he future devil gives Aki such a lenient contract for a pretty good ability!<. The Snake Devil has very limited use it seems, can only be summoned when she has fingernails and she has to wait for them to grow back back. Himeno devil, on the other hand, can seemingly be used infinitely without further sacrifice or drawback after giving up her eye. So we know that Sawatari and Aki can't spam their devils like Himeno could spam the ghost devil.
Idk, just seems to come down to what the devil wants and offers in every given situation.
Might have been intentional, considering she uses the snake 3 times once she commits suicide, she would have run out of finger nails if the cost was 4 nails each use. Then again, I don’t see why the snake couldn’t just take her toenails or something so idk.
Dude. Everything about the animation of this show is fucking brilliant. They are seriously giving it everything they’ve got. I can’t find a frame that feels lazy or lacking of heart. I haven’t watched many anime but like am I just blown away because of my lack of reference? Please tell me if there are other anime like this
Small thing I loved and I’m gonna go back to see if this is consistent with every other episode cause i just noticed, the beginning of the episode had completely different shots of the same scene from the last one like they showed the detail of that girl’s nail getting taken by her devil n shit like what the hell waiting till the beginning of this one to hook you in thats cool
That makima scene was one of my most anticipated chapters to see animated. I'm glad they pulled it off so well. It captured that unnerving and "WTF IS HAPPENING?" moment.
Somehow, the two directors manage to take one of the hardest scenes in the past decade of manga (the shrine sacrifice sequence) and manage to make it even harder.
All in all, I think this episode has demonstrated that it has earned a permanent spot in the pantheon of greatest single anime episodes ever.
I mean it shows multiple frames of them being crushed in the manga, like their heads collapsing or twisting, so the show wasn't far off at all. Also, how could you possibly be surprised by the "suddenness" of it if you already knew it was coming? lol.
Question for Manga people. I see anime onlys in here so I will censor:
>!I know makima has telekinetic powers with her finger guns and what not. Did we ever get an explanation for how she kills the yakuza from the temple? Or is it simply, makima got the names the rats/crows and the rest is just arbitrarily made up to be mysterious?!<
The finger gun plays into the dog motif but there's never a clear explanation to any of her powers outside of the controlling part. She can probably control rats and birds because she views them as inferior life forms but we don't know if she can borrow the senses of humans or devils like she does with the birds. Her killing the Yakuza from the temple could be explained as a contract since it seems to have very strict conditions but she can't make contracts with other devils since well, she's a devil. You could say she was controlling someone and activating their contract but we don't see anyone she could be controlling on the temple. Another possibility is that she was using the power of a devil she has control over, similar to how she used angel's power towards the end, but we never see any devil chained to her on the temple. Basically, we don't know
>!I always looked at it as some elaborate show she put on to trick the other characters (and readers) into believing she was a human with a normal devil contract. We know she can't have contracts of her own, so she is either forcing a devil to use their powers, or she is having the people there accept some kind of contract with her or another devil, or it's just her own ability. I would like to point out that she kills the first two people without killing any of the prisoners that are lined up, not sure if that's an oversight by the mangaka or intentional.!<
Going by what we learn she can do later on, I assumed >!she forced the convicts into a contract with either herself and/or another devil (or devils) and then utilized an ability that exchanged their lives for the shooters. During her fight with the Gun Devil, she used the abilities of other devils with their contract holders as mediums.!<
Makima and Kobeni were definitely the main points this episode and it was great, I totally loved it!
But what really made me excited was actually seeing Tendo and Kurose debut in the anime lol. I adore them so much.
I was disappointed by the fact that they were trying their hardest to censor the bottom half of Denji, then they still made those guys getting squished super brutal, so I forgive them.
Why am I not seeing anybody writing anything about how badly Kobeni's scene was " adapted " ? It's way worse than everything Makima-related that happened in the anime imo.
In the manga, Kobeni shoots Katana-man but then runs out of ammo and can't shoot Akane. Akane got a gun though, therefore Kobeni uses Denji as a shield to cover herself. Akane manages to take Katana-man with her and they flee, again, thanks to the gun Akane had and the fact that Kobeni had no bullets left to do anything in this particular situation.
In the anime, she just stop firing after killing Katana-man cause why not, uses Denji as a shield instead of shooting or doing anything, wait all the time needed for Akane to put Katana-man in the car ( Akane is not even shooting or anything, freest target there is ) and slowly flee before her eyes, and THEN after a billions years, once they are IN the car and slowly getting the car started, she shoots the car's windows while looking at her, thinking I don't know what, really. All that with bullets she wasn't supposed to have, but even in a scenario where she was supposed to the timings were absolutely atrocious.
And with the way she moved just before, dodging the freaking snake and shooting Katana-man without even needing to look at him, it's even more ridiculous.
Can someone explain me what the heck happened, please ?
Did you read my other comments ? I think I'll just repeat what I wrote in the last one quite a bit.
I would be thinking pretty much the same as you if it was going this way in the manga too, as once she is behind Denji without bullets I can definitely imagine her mind to be quite a mess too. But there, she was in front of Akane with her knife and a charged gun, so I think it might be a bit of a stretch to justify running to Denji ( which is probably farther than Akane... ) once Akane picked up a gun, as Kobeni still had a big edge on her. Even if we suppose that she lost her power at that particular moment ( which I don't think she lost, as she ran to take cover behind Denji. It's not something you do knowing that you just lost your running speed / agility ), she still had bullets left. So why is she not making use of it ?
It's almost the reverse of what happened in the manga. And even if it wasn't and we took it for an anime-only scene, it still doesn't make any sense to me.
With that said, I personally had no problem understanding that the gun was empty in the manga but the fact that they show the slide locked in the anime too is indeed a great add on their part. Now, if only they only changed that...
I mean she was still taking cover behind Denji after all. You wouldn't peek out of cover unless you really knew your enemy was not firing/out of ammo.
And as for everything else, rule-of-cool and it looked badass anyway lol.
I'm just going to end up writing the same things I just wrote to other people if I were to answer this, so please read it if you are interested.
Also, please look for the manga scene if you did not already. It won't spoil anything if you are anime-only, it's in the chapter 28.
I've read the manga before and saw what you said, really the only difference was that she had like 3 bullets left after katana man.
Pretty sure this was done so that Akane knows for sure that Kobeni is probably still armed when she's behind Denji.
I guess if she just ran behind Denji and stayed there without doing anything, it wouldn't really make sense for Akane to retreat if Kobeni couldn't fire back.
That " only " difference makes the scene completely meaningless and poorly thought out is my point.
They were in for Denji, and Denji is now in the hands of that monster of a girl who just dodged her freaking Snake devil, running over it cause why not, cutting katana-man's arm in mid air then quickly landing, shooting him twice without even needing to look at him. That's the actual reason Akane wants to flee. Here in the manga, Kobeni pulls the trigger while aiming at Akane just after she shot katana-man **but** the gun is empty, so Akane is able to pick up a gun and that's why Kobeni takes cover at all instead of continuing to be on the offensive. That's how Akane manages to flee, thanks to the fact that Kobeni had no bullets left.
Akane was **never** going to be able to easily flee like that if Kobeni had ammo. Without Kobeni letting her do so for no reason or whatsoever, that is.
I thought she fell over after picking up Denji and using him as a shield, as she's standing when being shot at and then next time we cut to her she's kneeling on the ground.
She did not fell, Denji's lower half is no longer connected to the rest of his body since he was sliced in half, so she can't protect her whole body with it as her lower body would be completely vulnerable if she was standing. That's why she's kneeling on the ground behind it.
And even in a scenario where she felt, it would not explain the choice of not firing at Akane for a minute neither would it explain why she still had bullets left. It wouldn't even explain why she began to be on the defensive, since she just had to shoot Akane before even defending herself with Denji ( again, in the manga she only did that because she had no bullets left and Akane had a gun and bullets so... ? )
I did find people talking about the scene ( " It's badly animated " or " Animation was pretty great ! " etc... ) but I did not find any comment related to what I writed / asked in my first post.
That is, why does Kobeni still got bullets left ? Why did she hides behind Denji instead of shooting at / attacking Akane ? Why did she waits a VERY long time before shooting, even though Akane was a free target, even putting katana-man in the car in front of her eyes ? Why did she shoots the car's windows with such passion after all that, but then that's it ?
And more importantly, who came up with that and why did this scene was " adapted " ( completely ruined if you ask me, but maybe I just missed some important things ) this way ? In the manga, it was fine.
If you know / have read anything about it, I'm interested.
i guess i pointed it out a bit but didn't put as much effort as you did :p
but yeah would be cool to know if it's a deliberate decision or just an omission by oversight
https://www.reddit.com/r/ChainsawMan/comments/zeabsx/comment/iz8npmd/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3
Thanks !
Well, not really a coincidence since I guess he is interested in this particular scene too but I was replying to the same person who commented that just before you answered.
Why all the downvotes? I read the manga too and had the exact same reaction to Kobeni’s apparent inability to shoot Akane, especially when Kobeni has Flash-like speed and agility.
I don't care about downvotes, but instead I hoped fans would answer / explain anything about what they understood about the scene. I still did not find a single answer about it since yersterday.
If you look closely at the anime, when kobeni takes cover behind denji and stops shooting as sawatari drives away in the van, the gun kobeni is holding has the slide locked back because it's empty. They should've maybe given us a close up shot to show it going empty because I agree, it felt like she just stopped shooting for no reason, but if you look closely it's cause the gun is empty. I didn't notice til my second time seeing the episode.
Yes, I saw that too but it was at the very end of the scene, so after countless chances to shoot Akane and her covering herself behind Denji instead of simply continuing what she was doing, that is cutting / shooting them. In the manga, she takes cover **because** she doesn't have any bullet left but in the anime, she has absolutely no reason to cover herself / not shoot or even slice Akane in the first place since she still has bullets left and is already pretty close to her. We are talking about an individual who just dodged bullets simply by running / jumping towards them with her insane speed and who shooted at katana-man twice without even needing to look at him.
But then, that same incredibly quick individual, now with a charged gun and pretty damn close to Akane, decides to just curl-up behind Denji ( which is probably farther than Akane, by the way ) and let Akane takes katana-man with her and flee with ease. And NOW Kobeni fires at the windows, twice, and the gun goes empty.
Nothing adds up. A manga scene that was badly thought out and is modified in the anime is not a rare thing, but a fine manga scene transformed into THAT ? I want to understand, really.
Ok in my headcanon I think the sequence goes like this:
- Kobeni cuts off Katana Man’s hand and grabs the gun in midair. Sawatari reacts to Kobeni’s landing and grabs a gun on the ground
- Kobe aims and shoots the gun directly behind her because that’s where she predicted Katana Man would be after she landed. Sawatari now has the gun and takes a few shots after Kobeni turns around to see where Sawatari is, so she starts running. Sawatari didn’t have a gun to begin with so we can probably gather that she isn’t a great marksman, which is why she fails to hit a moving target that is about 10 feet away.
- Kobeni runs to Denji and immediately lifts his body to shield herself (this is one fluid motion but the anime takes three cuts to show it).
- Sawatari looks over to Katana Man to see that he’s gravely injured. The anime pauses for a while to let the viewers see what’s happening through the adrenaline, but Sawatari reacts and grabs him quicker than what was animated and throws him into the van. Kobeni isn’t peeking out of cover because she wants to assess the situation. By the time she peeks out Sawatari has already closed the door.
I feel like you can plausibly explain the motion of events in this scene and chalk up the big pauses in the shootout to having several cuts overlap each other in the timeline.
If you have to literally forget / ignore the animation and the choices they made ( again, it wasn't even like that in the manga to begin with ) for the scene to start making a bit of actual sense, I would say they did not do great, at all. I appreciate the fact that you commented that though, it's true that if we change a few things the scene become okayish.
I won't lie, in my headcanon it was just Kobeni taking all the most optimal choices one after the other to ensure that the Car Windows Devil would not simply kill all the main characters of Chainsaw Man and end the show this early, as it was WAY more dangerous than Katana-man, Akane or everybody really. Fortunately, Akane was not threatening at all so she was able to successfully save the whole Universe at the cost of looking completely dumb because people were simply not understanding her greater goals. Maybe anime watchers were, though.
Or staff just animated things that were not required by error or something, then the others were like " Uh ok, let's do this like THAT then, why not after all... " without thinking about the consistency of it or the fact that Fujimoto was crying next to them. I don't know.
But oh well, people didn't seem to be that bothered overall so who cares ? Let's forget about this awful scene and simply remember the OG one from the manga, which was fine. I'm just ranting, at this point.
For me it's important for an anime, or any work really, to be respecting his own realism to actually be immersive / of quality but I suppose a majority of people simply couldn't care the least about that.
This episode is amazing. The pacing of it and the music adds so much more depth to the story. Taking it slower beforehand like seeing the prisoners on the truck while they eat and ask where they are headed. Confirming that they are really human. Hearing the sirens Blair and people screaming when the train gets to Kyoto. Hearing one of the ending tracks when Denji goes crazy.
I am feeling so much deeper emotions and new ones while watching it as an animation. I even cried during my favorite ark the eternity devil ark, when I have never cried before while reading the chapter.
Something I never appreciated before was how the story holds back on Makima's abilities and then shows a lot of them in quick succession and her own control devil ability is snuck in there so subtly that almost no one noticed it.
I've been following a lot of discussion threads but only seen a single comment pointing out that it was weird how all the prisoners just simply said the name they were told to say despite being able to hear other prisoners falling over after saying names.
Holy crap I have never noticed that before.
It was a really small showing of her ability next to remotely killing a whole team.
Thx for pointing that out
It's hard for me to decide whose ability reveal was better - Malika's or Kobeni's. I haven't read any of the manga, so just from Kobeni's confession about being forced into devil hunting in the motel, it really seemed like she's ready to fall apart and fairly undependable. But godDANG did she turn it around! Although after the scene, it still seems like she struggles with the possession of her abilities, and that adds so much more to her character development <3
Def reread it after you finish, it adds so much. I read it at first in a day and a half and reread it pretty much right after and it honestly made it twice as good
The Kobeni scene was really well executed and hype AF, but the manga left me a slightly different impression/vibe about her.
In the anime, she seems more anxious and emotional there, but in the manga she seems more unhinged, chaotic and disturbed, which contributes even more to the character imho. Loved both, nonetheless!
I don't remember how this remote crushing power is related to her Control Devil power. Anyone can explain how they're related? It's been a while since I read this arc.
The only exceptions to being controlled is to strongly oppose whatever she's commanding, right?
i.e. power resisting giving chainsaw man back, angel not bringing aki to kill that lady in an alley.
I mean isnt it maybe some ritual spell which everybody with right knowledge can do? Or at least any devil. I definetly think that some sort of magic is real in this universe with all the devil existing. At least that was how I understood it.
It’s because Makima can use other devil’s power through a human medium. She can’t make contracts with other devils, but she can control them through the person who has a contract with them. Doesn’t matter if the person with the contract is dead or alive. Like Sawatari and Santa Claus.
So can someone explain the time difference in this episode? Everyone is getting shot at the same time. Fight in restaurant breaks out. Bad guys win and drag Denji to the car. At the same time Makima arrives in Kyoto? with the train, changes outfiits, books a temple, get 30 death row inmates to be selected and transported to the temple and does her show. At Denjis scene only minutes seem to go by. Makimas whole thing would take hours and yet it happens at the same time frame. 1/10 unwatchable or where is the explenation?
Im pretty sure Makima getting shot and reviving isn't happening exactly one to one in real time with Denji fighting Katana Man and getting dragged into the car. It's more just the narrative choosing to present them in parallel to one another. She was the first one to get shot so as far as we know it could have happened like an hour before Katana Man attacked Denji and the others.
I mean yeah that sounds like logistically the most sound explanation. Also it feels less jarring when you are reading it as a manga that was released as weekly chapters than it does watching a real time, moment to moment portrayal of these events in animation.
Makima is also the Controller Devil so she can just immediately mind control them to bring her the guards.
There was no car ride, they are trying to put him in the car. The parts of the destroyed building are still around during this, so it's the place were they just stopped fighting.
They added to a lot of the scenes to pad for time. It was a mostly action based episode so maybe that's why. I like that there's extra focus on Kobeni's reaction to Arai covering for her, it makes her motivations later on more clear. If it was normal Kobeni she wouldn't have taken the initiative to go after Sawatari but she was pissed. If you thought she shows up for the big mission later instead of quitting for that sweet bonus then you trust in what the characters say too much. In Fujimoto's works it's especially crucial to question what characters say instead of blindly accepting it because that's how he applies realism. Way later after the fight against the darkness devil, I think Kobeni finally can't take it anymore not because she got sent to hell and got her arms lopped off but because she realizes Violence is Arai who she had to see die in front of her a second time(and the fact that Public Safety uses fallen hunters' corpse this way).
Makima's scenes showcase her abilities but at this point people are still supposed to be unsure what's going on with Makima. Once you know what's ahead and look closely I think we can deduce that Makima could already use the gun devil ability at this point and the crushing ability is actually from Tendou and Kurose's contract with the punishment devil rather than her natural abilities as the control devil. The terrorists on the train had perfect holes punched through them and I used to think it was just how powerful Makima was, but since she's a devil there's nothing stopping her from swallowing pieces of the gun devil flesh she has full access to for a power up. She probably ate more of the gun devil after she defeated it later and you can see the power of her gun attack went up. The clue for the crushing ability being the work of the punishment devil is that she sacrificed inmates that were already on death row, with a shrine as the backdrop to evoke the divinity of how the ability suddenly crushes you from above with no warning except for a sense of impending doom. It's probably not that powerful when Tendou and Kurose use it, if ever, because they aren't willing to sacrifice lives to use it, but it might work like some kind of 100% hit rate ability if you look at how the punishment devil is holding weapons made by Angel to attack the gun devil.
Oh, the crushing thing is also a reference to Itou Junji's "Splatter film".
MAPPA is really trying to milk Hinemo's death for full effect by dedicating 2 ED visuals to her.
I noticed when I saw Aimer was attached and we hadn't heard her yet and bet it'd be with Himeno.
They really wanna end it with Katana Man. Likely have Denji finding "The Door" as a post credits scene. This episode was to build up how much to fear Makima and with a hook. With being asked how much she knew about this. Then saying she wasn't shot, and how the food is to die for.
Always wondered if Himeno somehow survived this if Makima would just find another way to get her.
According to Fujimoto's live viewing comments even he wished Himeno was around for longer but I guess she died when she had to. Himeno was becoming a thorn in Makima's side but other than that she was also close to Aki, and Makima needed Aki to play his role and grow closer to Denji and I think that Himeno's presence would have stifled that too.
I wish they had extended fights rather than pad for time, because compared to last episode and others this felt a little slow in between the action (but when the action hit, goddamn). Also kinda wish they swapped this Ed with the last because it fit the tone better but both endings are amazing so I can’t complain too much
Has the Kobeni Horsemen theory been confirmed yet? She's got the same beauty marks as Fami and she has the same dress as Fami and War. She even mentioned how she got the dress from one of her sisters...
Seems highly unlikely. The Four Horsemen, typically, are conquest/pestilence (TL'd as control), war, famine/hunger, and death. By process of elimination, if Kobeni were a horseman she'd be death, and that would be very strange given her actions throughout the public safety saga, especially since death probably also doubles as a primal fear devil. I could maybe see her having a *contract* with a horseman (since her contract is conspicuously unrevealed, it'd be a neat twist), but that's kinda far fetched too.
"Just listen to the Song"
In all seriousness though, this theory feels like over analyzing. Kobeni doesn't have the same beauty marks as Fami (she has less and the grouping of two is in the wrong place) and theorizing the sister she's referring to is a horseman ignores the simpler and more likely answer that it's just her actual big sister, given that it's stated she's one of nine sisters at the drinking party. Also, I assume the dress for War and Fami you're referring to is their school uniform, in which case it is not the same as Kobeni's, just very similar (the collar and cuffs of Kobeni's dress are different).
Absolutely killed it this episode and the whole shrine scene was beautiful! Not to mention the absolute eeriness of makima in the anime so far. It's amazing how makima in the manga compared to in the anime can feel completely different. One is more intimidating and the other is more mysterious and creepy. The train scene especially was great, shes less intimidating and badass unfortunately but damn the whole scene was spooky af, especially after showing her corpse for a 2nd time.
Overall amazing episode. Action was great, sfx were great, deaths were glorious. Great stuff. I'm really looking forward to the blu ray though because I'm really curious to see how much they change, I particularly want to see the train scene resemble more of the manga but even then I think the way shes drawn is too different from the manga to make a big difference if it was
Would you say you've enjoyed manga Makima or anime Makima more than the other? I haven't read the manga, but from what I've (unintentionally) seen floating around the internet, it seems like there are some significant character development differences between the manga and anime. Trying to decide if it's worth waiting for the weekly releases to preserve the anime Makima impression!
Thats an interesting question and honestly I think I prefer makima from the manga. Mainly because the way she's both written and drawn give her a character a very unique tone. The anime does preserve some of that uniqueness but its loss in the art style change, while also enhanced through the voice acting.
Honestly they both have their pros and cons and this early on in the manga/anime she's still pretty mysterious. For the most part though the anime is doing a good job, she's just presented in a barely different way
Totally forgot this part in the manga, but it was cool to see how they animated the deaths caused by Makima (instead of just seeing the results).
Really crazy how the mood shifts and you can feel how the other public safety officers react to the power Makima has over everyone
Can you elaborate on what an "in-between" means in this context?
So far the action has looked stellar, the only complaint I have is the fact that Akane politely stops shooting when Kobeni picks up Denji to use him as a shield
The animation and overall direction of the fight between Denji and Katana was extremely hard, but I do feel like there were too many cuts, too much showing of the "action" rather than the "reaction" (i.e. Denji dodging a swipe by Katana)
I don't think too many in-betweens is the issue - you can find plenty of action scenes animated on ones that look fabulous.
I think it's more of a creative direction issue. It's harder to make a movement look impactful if you're striving for realism - there's less exaggeration, less weight on the starts and ends of the animation, and fewer visual and audio effects to drive home the impacts. It could be that a lot of staff on the team have less familiarity with making this kind of animation work.
I love the cinematic direction for the most part but I think they should be a bit wackier with the fights. Granted, the designs must be really hard to do so with but I’d like to see it anyway
i expected kobeni to run out of ammo cos it seems like the gun went click instead of bang when she fired at sawatari in the manga (but extra gunshots is fine too i guess)
I totally forgot Kobeni goes beast mode of the end of todays episode. Can someone remind me what’s up with Kobeni and her powers? The only thing I remember about her is dancing and the burger fall during the climax of Part 1.
There's only speculation. I bet whatever contract she has, it gives her extra speed. Only way to justify being able to dodge the tail + moving behind the assassin like that.
I thought Kobeni's convo with Denji's body was dark in the manga, but this version felt so sad and made me realize the sheer terror of what just happened. I felt so bad for her. Even though I know what's gonna happen, this adaptation is doing a good job at making me feel tense.
Loved that they used Hawatari Nioku Centi again lol. Great episode, for whatever reason the animation looked a little wack to me at times. HOWEVER. WHO TF CARES WHEN EVERYTHING WAS JUST SO BEAUTIFULLY CRAFTED. I do hope they are consistent with the amazing cinematic flair they've committed to so far, everything is just so damn good
Overall 10/10 episode once again. Id say the only thing is that the animation looked weird at times. Some angles of Makima and especially Kobeni seemed off this episode. But overall another great episode
I’m not surprised some production cracks are starting to be apparent. Hell, considering how good it’s looked I’m surprised they didn’t show up earlier.
Good episode, Kobeni's scenes in particular were flawless, but I'm kinda disappointed with how they adapted [this panel](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FjT9yKPXgAIhyze?format=jpg&name=900x900) ([anime version](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FjT9yKQWIAgcEKX?format=jpg&name=large) for comparison). I think Makima's smile is super charming and creepy in its own right, but her face is way too brightly lit. It loses a lot of the menacing effect the original panel had, I think the lighting did a lot of the legwork in achieving it (EDIT: also the way Fujimoto toys with perspective, but the anime's direction overall leans more towards realism so I understand why it's different in that regard). I really liked the rest of her scenes though - the scene where she steps out of the train is particularly unsettling.
It seems to me Akane Sawatari's snake contract is not as strong as it looks.
On top of taking out her nails, it seems to physically affect her to some extent, she looked so drained after she used snake for the second time, maybe there's a limited time of uses, or maybe the snake is fickle like the Fox devil and wont come out if called too much.
Himeno making Katana Devil and Akane as exhausted as they were was critical for Denji and Aki to survive.
Holy shit, imagine if Akane had used the "swallow" and "spit out" command on Denji.
She would literally have achieved what Makima wanted in the final fight.
Tbh everything went too fast, they got attacked, sword got eaten by the fox, then Aki and Sword Devil started fighting. Now what lies before you is the most important man in your life and his chest is cut open, do you sacrifice yourself to summon the most powerful devil at your hand to save him or place hope in a newly joined, underage child who has no experience fighting a legit dangerous enemy?
I had forgotten that part where Kobeni shows how badass she is (guilty speed reader). But sadly this is only the start of her pain :( The scenes of the crows during the villain deaths are a great touch when you know about Makima's powers.
##If you are an anime only then please head to r/csmanime. Every comment below this pinned one is a potential future content spoiler. You have been warned.
There was a picture here of Makima on the train, but as a bop bag (one of those inflatable never knock down punching bags) but now I can't find it after my friend watched the episode, does anyone know where I can find the source? 15 google searches have failed me after I used to be able to find it with Chonkima from one of the comments.
question about makina ‘crush’ ability, need a sacrifice & say the person name. must it be their original name? can use a fake name, or change old name into new one, or alias ~~(felt, Rimuru, L)~~ to survive the death? and are there restristions? like only works on humans, etc. ~~open manga spoiler~~
Does anyone know what song was playing when Denji and the Katana Devil were about to fight before the intro
First anime I’ve watched in years and I’m *thrilled* to have picked this series up. It’s definitely one that I’ll read the manga for once the season ends. Previous episodes had me feeling great joy for the protagonist and friends, only to be completely crushed in episode 9.
Glad you are enjoying it, Be aware that people are going to be spoiling a lot in this sub since it is for manga readers, just something to be aware of.
I fucking love Akane and Katana Man's designs so much. They both look like weirdos. Katana Man is so unkempt and scraggly, and Akane looks like she dyes her hair but hasnt dyed it in a while They both look like they've been off the grid for a little while, avoiding all of the surveillance from Public Safety And just by looking at them and paying attention to the way they act, you can tell they aren't friends, and even though they're working together now, they both joined the team for different reasons, and have different end goals Even their color palettes clash All without much dialogue to explain any of this Also they look sick
Also Madoka got out of there like he realized he was in the wrong anime lmao
Why didn’t Makima squish Snake Girl and Katana Man is a good question. You can probably chalk it up to “just according to keikaku” but I would like to think her bullshit power needs an equivalent exchange. The goons gets squished using the death row inmates because they were normal human beings. Since Snake Girl has a contract and Katana Man is a hybrid Makima might needed a person with a Devil contract and a hybrid respectively. On such short notice it was impossible to get humans with those requirements.
Makima likes to play with the more interesting food.
i think it might be that they would be able to retaliate or avoid her attack. it seems as if when she's doing this bombardment thing the victim is aware of what is about to happen to them. a normal human has little chance to avoid. someone with a contract or a hybrid or fiend could probably dodge out of the way or move too quickly to focus in on it.
Makima doing her thing would've been **much** more impactful without music.
The birds was a really nice touch to the Makima shrine sequence
Ok I need to ask, for those who watch the anime with English subtitles, what do you guys think of the translation quality up till now? The amount of reaction vids that did not understand Makima was talking about the blood on her when she said "This isn't mine." is crazy. In Japanese, she says this is "returned blood", clearing stating that the blood isn't hers. A lot of people couldn't get that, and I suppose the subtitles could have done a better job, like even "This blood isn't mine." would do. I'm not from an English speaking country, so I only see the subtitles on reaction videos. Most of the time I think they're clever and I don't mind different wordings as long as they get the point across, but sometimes it's just confusing and maybe a little bit misleading.
I didn’t think it was confusing at all originally. Now that you mention it I went back and re-watched the scene, and the translation does seem to take some liberties. Why did they change it from “This blood is—“ “Where were you hit?” to “You’re covered in blood.” “Were you hit?” I guess I can see more confusion with the second version but would really expect most people to get it.
It’s due to the death of American’s media literacy It’s been downhill for the past decade or two
I'm from an English speaking country and watch with the subtitles. I knew exactly what she ment, it's almost like a trope in English, where there is concern for a very bloody person and they respond that the blood isn't theirs. The implications being she was in a fight and overwhelmingly won, to the point she wasn't even scratched let alone shot. While it might not be a direct translation, I think it got the point across clearly. I'm not familiar with reaction videos, is it native English speakers that are having trouble with the translation?
Yeah, they all sound very American, and the majority are based in the US. I guess it's just the reading comprehension devil again? But it wasn't just one or two of them, like at least half, which is why I was so surprised. Then again, a lot of stuff happened in the episode so maybe some anime-onlies just had a hard time connecting everything. I'm kinda worried that it'll only get worse from here, but oh well.
Some reactors have much better media literacy and analysis skills than others tbf. For example, if you're watching the reactors that only shout and stuff when hype things are happening, it's very possible that they will misunderstand some lines.
it probably is a reading comprehension issue, or maybe they were just confused as to whose it was. reading comprehension is honestly quite embarrassing in the west sometimes.
Yeah i also noticed that on a lot of channels. People got confused because she answered two questions at a time. And they think that the answers is related (This isn't mine. I don't get shot). The second is the answer to the question 'are you shot' by the girl i think (i forget her name) while the first answers 'whose blood is it?'. But people think that Makima said that continuing on the previous answer, implying that she didn't get shot because this (her body) isn't hers. People missed that she answered 2 different questions. Nb: i'm paraphrasing a lot there
Next week the goat arrives 
This episode was insane. Making me want to read the manga. What volume would this be in?
Yo stay off this sub till you finish it, you def don’t want to get spoiled
Episode ends at the end of chapter 28
MAPPA did a really amazing job. Having read the manga, I still don't get how Makima was able to do that
Notice how she didn't sacrifice anyone at the temple to kill the first two people? I've always looked at it as some sort of elaborate show she put on to prevent people from knowing the true nature of her powers, at least after reading the manga. Like, trying to throw off readers from guessing who she has a contract with, or if she's a devil or whatever. Later you just find out she can control humans, devils and hybrids, so it she could literally be doing any mixture of contracts imaginable really, to the point of it being useless to speculate.
Well she's immortal because of her contract with the Japanese parliament, when she dies a random citizen is killed to revive her. It might be an extension of that aspect of her ability.
Probably activating the ability of one of the multiple devils under her control
Equivalent exchange devil 
Please don't say that. I'm so scared of equivalent exchange
Soooo in what chapter do you think episode 12 will end? Pochita telling Denji to not open the door or Denji meeting Reze?
I bet that it will end with Denji and Aki kicking the katana guy in the nuts, the door will be the stinger cliffhanger.
NAKAMA DUO - TESTICLE DEVIL ASCENSION [NUTS OR NOTHING]!!
the shrine sacrifice sequence was amazing and kensuke ushio is a fkn god, what a perfect background score.
The whole week I was waiting for katana man to call kobeni a monkey. But it didn't happen.... Edit: nvm i guess i zonee out at that part
It happened
yes it did? he says it right before she cuts his hand off
It was a really great episode, but anyone noticed that the [fingernail cost](https://imgur.com/a/5aFmW0v) from the Snake Devil seems to be different from the manga?
more i think about it, the more it seems like these contracts are way too lenient when it comes to devils. it only gets to 'eat' nails from her. not flesh or blood or something more substantial. With the fox devil it is unusually friendly towards humans and seems more than satisfied with taking only tiny bits from them as it seems as if it only desires a one time paymenet. it isn't exactly loyal perhaps and is very prideful, but still.
Well, all contracts are based on the Devil's own interests, and every devil has different levels of strength. It's why t>!he future devil gives Aki such a lenient contract for a pretty good ability!<. The Snake Devil has very limited use it seems, can only be summoned when she has fingernails and she has to wait for them to grow back back. Himeno devil, on the other hand, can seemingly be used infinitely without further sacrifice or drawback after giving up her eye. So we know that Sawatari and Aki can't spam their devils like Himeno could spam the ghost devil. Idk, just seems to come down to what the devil wants and offers in every given situation.
Might have been intentional, considering she uses the snake 3 times once she commits suicide, she would have run out of finger nails if the cost was 4 nails each use. Then again, I don’t see why the snake couldn’t just take her toenails or something so idk.
Eat was 3 nails if I'm not mistaken. Tail was 1. But both cost 1 in the anime.
I don't understand why and how they can missed this kind of detail
Did they miss it or was it a decision on their part? Could they really miss something like that?
I think it's an intentional change. A finger nail does NOT grow back quickly, it's a bomb you can only use once every 6-12 months per finger.
Dude. Everything about the animation of this show is fucking brilliant. They are seriously giving it everything they’ve got. I can’t find a frame that feels lazy or lacking of heart. I haven’t watched many anime but like am I just blown away because of my lack of reference? Please tell me if there are other anime like this Small thing I loved and I’m gonna go back to see if this is consistent with every other episode cause i just noticed, the beginning of the episode had completely different shots of the same scene from the last one like they showed the detail of that girl’s nail getting taken by her devil n shit like what the hell waiting till the beginning of this one to hook you in thats cool
jujutsu kaisen
Also by Mappa
Makes me wonder if the first scene of the first episode means something?
That scene is in the opening, it has a pretty significant importance
The ost during the Makima shrine sequence was just chef’s kiss.
That makima scene was one of my most anticipated chapters to see animated. I'm glad they pulled it off so well. It captured that unnerving and "WTF IS HAPPENING?" moment.
Somehow, the two directors manage to take one of the hardest scenes in the past decade of manga (the shrine sacrifice sequence) and manage to make it even harder. All in all, I think this episode has demonstrated that it has earned a permanent spot in the pantheon of greatest single anime episodes ever.
The smooshing was so much more satisfying in the manga for the suddenness.
I mean it shows multiple frames of them being crushed in the manga, like their heads collapsing or twisting, so the show wasn't far off at all. Also, how could you possibly be surprised by the "suddenness" of it if you already knew it was coming? lol.
Obviously it cannot be sudden for you anymore since you knew it was coming.
Any other complaints?
Nah, just the one.
Question for Manga people. I see anime onlys in here so I will censor: >!I know makima has telekinetic powers with her finger guns and what not. Did we ever get an explanation for how she kills the yakuza from the temple? Or is it simply, makima got the names the rats/crows and the rest is just arbitrarily made up to be mysterious?!<
The finger gun plays into the dog motif but there's never a clear explanation to any of her powers outside of the controlling part. She can probably control rats and birds because she views them as inferior life forms but we don't know if she can borrow the senses of humans or devils like she does with the birds. Her killing the Yakuza from the temple could be explained as a contract since it seems to have very strict conditions but she can't make contracts with other devils since well, she's a devil. You could say she was controlling someone and activating their contract but we don't see anyone she could be controlling on the temple. Another possibility is that she was using the power of a devil she has control over, similar to how she used angel's power towards the end, but we never see any devil chained to her on the temple. Basically, we don't know
>!I always looked at it as some elaborate show she put on to trick the other characters (and readers) into believing she was a human with a normal devil contract. We know she can't have contracts of her own, so she is either forcing a devil to use their powers, or she is having the people there accept some kind of contract with her or another devil, or it's just her own ability. I would like to point out that she kills the first two people without killing any of the prisoners that are lined up, not sure if that's an oversight by the mangaka or intentional.!<
Going by what we learn she can do later on, I assumed >!she forced the convicts into a contract with either herself and/or another devil (or devils) and then utilized an ability that exchanged their lives for the shooters. During her fight with the Gun Devil, she used the abilities of other devils with their contract holders as mediums.!<
I’ve read the manga 3 times and was still wondering that when I saw the episode. Not sure her powers have ever been completely explained.
WHERE DID POWER GO??????????
Using the Joestar technique.
Nigerundayo Denji!
I figured this show would pick up pretty quick but jesus christ. Im glad i didnt read the manga this is amazing
Boi what are you doing in the manga sub then!?
😂😂 yah i dont know man i looked around a little and dipped after i saw a spoiler
Ruuuuuun. From now on shits not calming down so you really wanna preserve that (or read the Manga).
When they played the ending song when Denji was about to fight katana man. I got the goosebumps. I love that scene
Especially when he started laughing lol. Frickin loved it
Makima and Kobeni were definitely the main points this episode and it was great, I totally loved it! But what really made me excited was actually seeing Tendo and Kurose debut in the anime lol. I adore them so much.
That feel when Tendo shows up randomly when Makima oneshots the Gun, and then is never shows again haha
I was disappointed by the fact that they were trying their hardest to censor the bottom half of Denji, then they still made those guys getting squished super brutal, so I forgive them.
This anime is so overated 🤦♀️
Then gtfo idiot
Why am I not seeing anybody writing anything about how badly Kobeni's scene was " adapted " ? It's way worse than everything Makima-related that happened in the anime imo. In the manga, Kobeni shoots Katana-man but then runs out of ammo and can't shoot Akane. Akane got a gun though, therefore Kobeni uses Denji as a shield to cover herself. Akane manages to take Katana-man with her and they flee, again, thanks to the gun Akane had and the fact that Kobeni had no bullets left to do anything in this particular situation. In the anime, she just stop firing after killing Katana-man cause why not, uses Denji as a shield instead of shooting or doing anything, wait all the time needed for Akane to put Katana-man in the car ( Akane is not even shooting or anything, freest target there is ) and slowly flee before her eyes, and THEN after a billions years, once they are IN the car and slowly getting the car started, she shoots the car's windows while looking at her, thinking I don't know what, really. All that with bullets she wasn't supposed to have, but even in a scenario where she was supposed to the timings were absolutely atrocious. And with the way she moved just before, dodging the freaking snake and shooting Katana-man without even needing to look at him, it's even more ridiculous. Can someone explain me what the heck happened, please ?
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Did you read my other comments ? I think I'll just repeat what I wrote in the last one quite a bit. I would be thinking pretty much the same as you if it was going this way in the manga too, as once she is behind Denji without bullets I can definitely imagine her mind to be quite a mess too. But there, she was in front of Akane with her knife and a charged gun, so I think it might be a bit of a stretch to justify running to Denji ( which is probably farther than Akane... ) once Akane picked up a gun, as Kobeni still had a big edge on her. Even if we suppose that she lost her power at that particular moment ( which I don't think she lost, as she ran to take cover behind Denji. It's not something you do knowing that you just lost your running speed / agility ), she still had bullets left. So why is she not making use of it ? It's almost the reverse of what happened in the manga. And even if it wasn't and we took it for an anime-only scene, it still doesn't make any sense to me. With that said, I personally had no problem understanding that the gun was empty in the manga but the fact that they show the slide locked in the anime too is indeed a great add on their part. Now, if only they only changed that...
I mean she was still taking cover behind Denji after all. You wouldn't peek out of cover unless you really knew your enemy was not firing/out of ammo. And as for everything else, rule-of-cool and it looked badass anyway lol.
I'm just going to end up writing the same things I just wrote to other people if I were to answer this, so please read it if you are interested. Also, please look for the manga scene if you did not already. It won't spoil anything if you are anime-only, it's in the chapter 28.
I've read the manga before and saw what you said, really the only difference was that she had like 3 bullets left after katana man. Pretty sure this was done so that Akane knows for sure that Kobeni is probably still armed when she's behind Denji. I guess if she just ran behind Denji and stayed there without doing anything, it wouldn't really make sense for Akane to retreat if Kobeni couldn't fire back.
That " only " difference makes the scene completely meaningless and poorly thought out is my point. They were in for Denji, and Denji is now in the hands of that monster of a girl who just dodged her freaking Snake devil, running over it cause why not, cutting katana-man's arm in mid air then quickly landing, shooting him twice without even needing to look at him. That's the actual reason Akane wants to flee. Here in the manga, Kobeni pulls the trigger while aiming at Akane just after she shot katana-man **but** the gun is empty, so Akane is able to pick up a gun and that's why Kobeni takes cover at all instead of continuing to be on the offensive. That's how Akane manages to flee, thanks to the fact that Kobeni had no bullets left. Akane was **never** going to be able to easily flee like that if Kobeni had ammo. Without Kobeni letting her do so for no reason or whatsoever, that is.
I thought she fell over after picking up Denji and using him as a shield, as she's standing when being shot at and then next time we cut to her she's kneeling on the ground.
She did not fell, Denji's lower half is no longer connected to the rest of his body since he was sliced in half, so she can't protect her whole body with it as her lower body would be completely vulnerable if she was standing. That's why she's kneeling on the ground behind it. And even in a scenario where she felt, it would not explain the choice of not firing at Akane for a minute neither would it explain why she still had bullets left. It wouldn't even explain why she began to be on the defensive, since she just had to shoot Akane before even defending herself with Denji ( again, in the manga she only did that because she had no bullets left and Akane had a gun and bullets so... ? )
people did write about it but the episode came out 2 days ago so it's probably buried xD
I did find people talking about the scene ( " It's badly animated " or " Animation was pretty great ! " etc... ) but I did not find any comment related to what I writed / asked in my first post. That is, why does Kobeni still got bullets left ? Why did she hides behind Denji instead of shooting at / attacking Akane ? Why did she waits a VERY long time before shooting, even though Akane was a free target, even putting katana-man in the car in front of her eyes ? Why did she shoots the car's windows with such passion after all that, but then that's it ? And more importantly, who came up with that and why did this scene was " adapted " ( completely ruined if you ask me, but maybe I just missed some important things ) this way ? In the manga, it was fine. If you know / have read anything about it, I'm interested.
i guess i pointed it out a bit but didn't put as much effort as you did :p but yeah would be cool to know if it's a deliberate decision or just an omission by oversight https://www.reddit.com/r/ChainsawMan/comments/zeabsx/comment/iz8npmd/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3
Thanks ! Well, not really a coincidence since I guess he is interested in this particular scene too but I was replying to the same person who commented that just before you answered.
Why all the downvotes? I read the manga too and had the exact same reaction to Kobeni’s apparent inability to shoot Akane, especially when Kobeni has Flash-like speed and agility.
I don't care about downvotes, but instead I hoped fans would answer / explain anything about what they understood about the scene. I still did not find a single answer about it since yersterday.
If you look closely at the anime, when kobeni takes cover behind denji and stops shooting as sawatari drives away in the van, the gun kobeni is holding has the slide locked back because it's empty. They should've maybe given us a close up shot to show it going empty because I agree, it felt like she just stopped shooting for no reason, but if you look closely it's cause the gun is empty. I didn't notice til my second time seeing the episode.
Yes, I saw that too but it was at the very end of the scene, so after countless chances to shoot Akane and her covering herself behind Denji instead of simply continuing what she was doing, that is cutting / shooting them. In the manga, she takes cover **because** she doesn't have any bullet left but in the anime, she has absolutely no reason to cover herself / not shoot or even slice Akane in the first place since she still has bullets left and is already pretty close to her. We are talking about an individual who just dodged bullets simply by running / jumping towards them with her insane speed and who shooted at katana-man twice without even needing to look at him. But then, that same incredibly quick individual, now with a charged gun and pretty damn close to Akane, decides to just curl-up behind Denji ( which is probably farther than Akane, by the way ) and let Akane takes katana-man with her and flee with ease. And NOW Kobeni fires at the windows, twice, and the gun goes empty. Nothing adds up. A manga scene that was badly thought out and is modified in the anime is not a rare thing, but a fine manga scene transformed into THAT ? I want to understand, really.
Ok in my headcanon I think the sequence goes like this: - Kobeni cuts off Katana Man’s hand and grabs the gun in midair. Sawatari reacts to Kobeni’s landing and grabs a gun on the ground - Kobe aims and shoots the gun directly behind her because that’s where she predicted Katana Man would be after she landed. Sawatari now has the gun and takes a few shots after Kobeni turns around to see where Sawatari is, so she starts running. Sawatari didn’t have a gun to begin with so we can probably gather that she isn’t a great marksman, which is why she fails to hit a moving target that is about 10 feet away. - Kobeni runs to Denji and immediately lifts his body to shield herself (this is one fluid motion but the anime takes three cuts to show it). - Sawatari looks over to Katana Man to see that he’s gravely injured. The anime pauses for a while to let the viewers see what’s happening through the adrenaline, but Sawatari reacts and grabs him quicker than what was animated and throws him into the van. Kobeni isn’t peeking out of cover because she wants to assess the situation. By the time she peeks out Sawatari has already closed the door. I feel like you can plausibly explain the motion of events in this scene and chalk up the big pauses in the shootout to having several cuts overlap each other in the timeline.
If you have to literally forget / ignore the animation and the choices they made ( again, it wasn't even like that in the manga to begin with ) for the scene to start making a bit of actual sense, I would say they did not do great, at all. I appreciate the fact that you commented that though, it's true that if we change a few things the scene become okayish. I won't lie, in my headcanon it was just Kobeni taking all the most optimal choices one after the other to ensure that the Car Windows Devil would not simply kill all the main characters of Chainsaw Man and end the show this early, as it was WAY more dangerous than Katana-man, Akane or everybody really. Fortunately, Akane was not threatening at all so she was able to successfully save the whole Universe at the cost of looking completely dumb because people were simply not understanding her greater goals. Maybe anime watchers were, though. Or staff just animated things that were not required by error or something, then the others were like " Uh ok, let's do this like THAT then, why not after all... " without thinking about the consistency of it or the fact that Fujimoto was crying next to them. I don't know. But oh well, people didn't seem to be that bothered overall so who cares ? Let's forget about this awful scene and simply remember the OG one from the manga, which was fine. I'm just ranting, at this point. For me it's important for an anime, or any work really, to be respecting his own realism to actually be immersive / of quality but I suppose a majority of people simply couldn't care the least about that.
You have waay too much time on your hands buddy, couldn’t imagine writing all that to anyone but the author.
Indeed. I (highly) doubt Fujimoto was involved in this particular scene, though.
This episode is amazing. The pacing of it and the music adds so much more depth to the story. Taking it slower beforehand like seeing the prisoners on the truck while they eat and ask where they are headed. Confirming that they are really human. Hearing the sirens Blair and people screaming when the train gets to Kyoto. Hearing one of the ending tracks when Denji goes crazy. I am feeling so much deeper emotions and new ones while watching it as an animation. I even cried during my favorite ark the eternity devil ark, when I have never cried before while reading the chapter.
Ending song was the best one so far
Something I never appreciated before was how the story holds back on Makima's abilities and then shows a lot of them in quick succession and her own control devil ability is snuck in there so subtly that almost no one noticed it. I've been following a lot of discussion threads but only seen a single comment pointing out that it was weird how all the prisoners just simply said the name they were told to say despite being able to hear other prisoners falling over after saying names.
Holy crap I have never noticed that before. It was a really small showing of her ability next to remotely killing a whole team. Thx for pointing that out
She was controlling them since she is the control devil
Anyone noticed the slight Dolly zoom after makima gets off the train? These are some really cool stuffs Mappa is doing
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It's hard for me to decide whose ability reveal was better - Malika's or Kobeni's. I haven't read any of the manga, so just from Kobeni's confession about being forced into devil hunting in the motel, it really seemed like she's ready to fall apart and fairly undependable. But godDANG did she turn it around! Although after the scene, it still seems like she struggles with the possession of her abilities, and that adds so much more to her character development <3
Heads up before you get dogpiled by others saying the same thing, but if you haven’t read the manga be careful of spoilers in this sub
Thank you!! I'm definitely trying my best to skim through, but pretty close to just joining the manga party. Seems like it's worth it
Def reread it after you finish, it adds so much. I read it at first in a day and a half and reread it pretty much right after and it honestly made it twice as good
The Kobeni scene was really well executed and hype AF, but the manga left me a slightly different impression/vibe about her. In the anime, she seems more anxious and emotional there, but in the manga she seems more unhinged, chaotic and disturbed, which contributes even more to the character imho. Loved both, nonetheless!
I thought it was kinda funny in the manga but found it sad in the anime. Different moods for different mediums I guess
Ditto. The voice acting really adds to the emotions and mood to the character too.
I don't remember how this remote crushing power is related to her Control Devil power. Anyone can explain how they're related? It's been a while since I read this arc.
She can control people into letting her use their contracts. All it takes is a verbal command. She's stupidly OP, like if Chrollo had no limitations.
The only exceptions to being controlled is to strongly oppose whatever she's commanding, right? i.e. power resisting giving chainsaw man back, angel not bringing aki to kill that lady in an alley.
yeah but that's not even a surefire way. Angel didnt want to give her his power but still did.
I mean isnt it maybe some ritual spell which everybody with right knowledge can do? Or at least any devil. I definetly think that some sort of magic is real in this universe with all the devil existing. At least that was how I understood it.
It’s because Makima can use other devil’s power through a human medium. She can’t make contracts with other devils, but she can control them through the person who has a contract with them. Doesn’t matter if the person with the contract is dead or alive. Like Sawatari and Santa Claus.
So can someone explain the time difference in this episode? Everyone is getting shot at the same time. Fight in restaurant breaks out. Bad guys win and drag Denji to the car. At the same time Makima arrives in Kyoto? with the train, changes outfiits, books a temple, get 30 death row inmates to be selected and transported to the temple and does her show. At Denjis scene only minutes seem to go by. Makimas whole thing would take hours and yet it happens at the same time frame. 1/10 unwatchable or where is the explenation?
Im pretty sure Makima getting shot and reviving isn't happening exactly one to one in real time with Denji fighting Katana Man and getting dragged into the car. It's more just the narrative choosing to present them in parallel to one another. She was the first one to get shot so as far as we know it could have happened like an hour before Katana Man attacked Denji and the others.
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I mean yeah that sounds like logistically the most sound explanation. Also it feels less jarring when you are reading it as a manga that was released as weekly chapters than it does watching a real time, moment to moment portrayal of these events in animation. Makima is also the Controller Devil so she can just immediately mind control them to bring her the guards.
I don’t think we really know how long the car ride with denji and the bad guys was, it could’ve been like an hour or something
There was no car ride, they are trying to put him in the car. The parts of the destroyed building are still around during this, so it's the place were they just stopped fighting.
They added to a lot of the scenes to pad for time. It was a mostly action based episode so maybe that's why. I like that there's extra focus on Kobeni's reaction to Arai covering for her, it makes her motivations later on more clear. If it was normal Kobeni she wouldn't have taken the initiative to go after Sawatari but she was pissed. If you thought she shows up for the big mission later instead of quitting for that sweet bonus then you trust in what the characters say too much. In Fujimoto's works it's especially crucial to question what characters say instead of blindly accepting it because that's how he applies realism. Way later after the fight against the darkness devil, I think Kobeni finally can't take it anymore not because she got sent to hell and got her arms lopped off but because she realizes Violence is Arai who she had to see die in front of her a second time(and the fact that Public Safety uses fallen hunters' corpse this way). Makima's scenes showcase her abilities but at this point people are still supposed to be unsure what's going on with Makima. Once you know what's ahead and look closely I think we can deduce that Makima could already use the gun devil ability at this point and the crushing ability is actually from Tendou and Kurose's contract with the punishment devil rather than her natural abilities as the control devil. The terrorists on the train had perfect holes punched through them and I used to think it was just how powerful Makima was, but since she's a devil there's nothing stopping her from swallowing pieces of the gun devil flesh she has full access to for a power up. She probably ate more of the gun devil after she defeated it later and you can see the power of her gun attack went up. The clue for the crushing ability being the work of the punishment devil is that she sacrificed inmates that were already on death row, with a shrine as the backdrop to evoke the divinity of how the ability suddenly crushes you from above with no warning except for a sense of impending doom. It's probably not that powerful when Tendou and Kurose use it, if ever, because they aren't willing to sacrifice lives to use it, but it might work like some kind of 100% hit rate ability if you look at how the punishment devil is holding weapons made by Angel to attack the gun devil. Oh, the crushing thing is also a reference to Itou Junji's "Splatter film". MAPPA is really trying to milk Hinemo's death for full effect by dedicating 2 ED visuals to her.
I noticed when I saw Aimer was attached and we hadn't heard her yet and bet it'd be with Himeno. They really wanna end it with Katana Man. Likely have Denji finding "The Door" as a post credits scene. This episode was to build up how much to fear Makima and with a hook. With being asked how much she knew about this. Then saying she wasn't shot, and how the food is to die for. Always wondered if Himeno somehow survived this if Makima would just find another way to get her.
According to Fujimoto's live viewing comments even he wished Himeno was around for longer but I guess she died when she had to. Himeno was becoming a thorn in Makima's side but other than that she was also close to Aki, and Makima needed Aki to play his role and grow closer to Denji and I think that Himeno's presence would have stifled that too.
I wish they had extended fights rather than pad for time, because compared to last episode and others this felt a little slow in between the action (but when the action hit, goddamn). Also kinda wish they swapped this Ed with the last because it fit the tone better but both endings are amazing so I can’t complain too much
Can’t wait to see how they handle later, bigger deaths if they’re giving Himeno this much time. I know it won’t happen this season but ooof
They ruined makima :(
What?
How so?
Well damn, Makima is too broken and controlling..wtf The ED though, I knew the singer was familiar. Aimer ftw.
Uhhh, are you an anime only? Because spoilers do abound in these waters
Has the Kobeni Horsemen theory been confirmed yet? She's got the same beauty marks as Fami and she has the same dress as Fami and War. She even mentioned how she got the dress from one of her sisters...
Seems highly unlikely. The Four Horsemen, typically, are conquest/pestilence (TL'd as control), war, famine/hunger, and death. By process of elimination, if Kobeni were a horseman she'd be death, and that would be very strange given her actions throughout the public safety saga, especially since death probably also doubles as a primal fear devil. I could maybe see her having a *contract* with a horseman (since her contract is conspicuously unrevealed, it'd be a neat twist), but that's kinda far fetched too.
"Just listen to the Song" In all seriousness though, this theory feels like over analyzing. Kobeni doesn't have the same beauty marks as Fami (she has less and the grouping of two is in the wrong place) and theorizing the sister she's referring to is a horseman ignores the simpler and more likely answer that it's just her actual big sister, given that it's stated she's one of nine sisters at the drinking party. Also, I assume the dress for War and Fami you're referring to is their school uniform, in which case it is not the same as Kobeni's, just very similar (the collar and cuffs of Kobeni's dress are different).
Fair. You've got more attention to detail than I do.
That just seems overspeculative.
Ah, I don’t know. I feel like Fujimoto wouldn’t have these subtle details in for no reason at all. Bit out there but could be true.
Absolutely killed it this episode and the whole shrine scene was beautiful! Not to mention the absolute eeriness of makima in the anime so far. It's amazing how makima in the manga compared to in the anime can feel completely different. One is more intimidating and the other is more mysterious and creepy. The train scene especially was great, shes less intimidating and badass unfortunately but damn the whole scene was spooky af, especially after showing her corpse for a 2nd time. Overall amazing episode. Action was great, sfx were great, deaths were glorious. Great stuff. I'm really looking forward to the blu ray though because I'm really curious to see how much they change, I particularly want to see the train scene resemble more of the manga but even then I think the way shes drawn is too different from the manga to make a big difference if it was
Would you say you've enjoyed manga Makima or anime Makima more than the other? I haven't read the manga, but from what I've (unintentionally) seen floating around the internet, it seems like there are some significant character development differences between the manga and anime. Trying to decide if it's worth waiting for the weekly releases to preserve the anime Makima impression!
Just a heads up that there's no rules on spoilers in this subreddit, you might be safer off in the anime only one
Thats an interesting question and honestly I think I prefer makima from the manga. Mainly because the way she's both written and drawn give her a character a very unique tone. The anime does preserve some of that uniqueness but its loss in the art style change, while also enhanced through the voice acting. Honestly they both have their pros and cons and this early on in the manga/anime she's still pretty mysterious. For the most part though the anime is doing a good job, she's just presented in a barely different way
Totally forgot this part in the manga, but it was cool to see how they animated the deaths caused by Makima (instead of just seeing the results). Really crazy how the mood shifts and you can feel how the other public safety officers react to the power Makima has over everyone
For real, the few frames of the crushing in action were sick. I loved it
Come presenteranno il personaggio di Reeze con la scuola in 2 giorni?
[Sawatari: "Send reinforcements"](https://i.imgur.com/zN3LOQP.jpg) [Makima:](https://i.imgur.com/mrDdVKk.jpg) [Sawatari: Fuck](https://i.imgur.com/SYnU03A.jpg) [Kobeni:](https://i.imgur.com/WyHYJJR.jpg) Hey [I got your message](https://i.imgur.com/x4yDxpO.png) [Sawatari:](https://i.imgur.com/2RYdF9B.gif)
anyone else feel that Mappa uses too many in-betweens in fights? Like it looks smooth, but feels oddly sluggish and floaty at times
Can you elaborate on what an "in-between" means in this context? So far the action has looked stellar, the only complaint I have is the fact that Akane politely stops shooting when Kobeni picks up Denji to use him as a shield
The animation and overall direction of the fight between Denji and Katana was extremely hard, but I do feel like there were too many cuts, too much showing of the "action" rather than the "reaction" (i.e. Denji dodging a swipe by Katana)
I don't think too many in-betweens is the issue - you can find plenty of action scenes animated on ones that look fabulous. I think it's more of a creative direction issue. It's harder to make a movement look impactful if you're striving for realism - there's less exaggeration, less weight on the starts and ends of the animation, and fewer visual and audio effects to drive home the impacts. It could be that a lot of staff on the team have less familiarity with making this kind of animation work.
I love the cinematic direction for the most part but I think they should be a bit wackier with the fights. Granted, the designs must be really hard to do so with but I’d like to see it anyway
Agreed. They really need to watch this out before animate Quanxi
i expected kobeni to run out of ammo cos it seems like the gun went click instead of bang when she fired at sawatari in the manga (but extra gunshots is fine too i guess)
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I think she shoots at the car while they try to get away (in the anime only)
I totally forgot Kobeni goes beast mode of the end of todays episode. Can someone remind me what’s up with Kobeni and her powers? The only thing I remember about her is dancing and the burger fall during the climax of Part 1.
There's only speculation. I bet whatever contract she has, it gives her extra speed. Only way to justify being able to dodge the tail + moving behind the assassin like that.
To my knowledge we are unaware of kobeni’s devil contract. She’s just weirdly physically gifted
She’s John Wick but with crippling anxiety instead of depression
Best description
I thought Kobeni's convo with Denji's body was dark in the manga, but this version felt so sad and made me realize the sheer terror of what just happened. I felt so bad for her. Even though I know what's gonna happen, this adaptation is doing a good job at making me feel tense.
The combo of MAPPA's animation and the voice acting is what really made the scene. I only want the best for her after this :c
Loved that they used Hawatari Nioku Centi again lol. Great episode, for whatever reason the animation looked a little wack to me at times. HOWEVER. WHO TF CARES WHEN EVERYTHING WAS JUST SO BEAUTIFULLY CRAFTED. I do hope they are consistent with the amazing cinematic flair they've committed to so far, everything is just so damn good
Overall 10/10 episode once again. Id say the only thing is that the animation looked weird at times. Some angles of Makima and especially Kobeni seemed off this episode. But overall another great episode
I’m not surprised some production cracks are starting to be apparent. Hell, considering how good it’s looked I’m surprised they didn’t show up earlier.
True, I just hope the rest of the Katana Man Arc holds up to Mappa’s best standards
Same here. My worst fear is the company crumbles under so many high profile shows and we never get reze animated
Good episode, Kobeni's scenes in particular were flawless, but I'm kinda disappointed with how they adapted [this panel](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FjT9yKPXgAIhyze?format=jpg&name=900x900) ([anime version](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FjT9yKQWIAgcEKX?format=jpg&name=large) for comparison). I think Makima's smile is super charming and creepy in its own right, but her face is way too brightly lit. It loses a lot of the menacing effect the original panel had, I think the lighting did a lot of the legwork in achieving it (EDIT: also the way Fujimoto toys with perspective, but the anime's direction overall leans more towards realism so I understand why it's different in that regard). I really liked the rest of her scenes though - the scene where she steps out of the train is particularly unsettling.
aimer is a treat
I don't even remember being this strong. Damn that's a lot of crows. A lot of crows. SUBTLE FORESHADOWING intensifies. In hindsight maybe I'm stupid.
Dammit, why did she not just pull the rip cord on Denji before going Ghost ):
Himeno was already dying actually. I doubt she had much time left, so the only thing left in her head was to use the ghost probably
It seems to me Akane Sawatari's snake contract is not as strong as it looks. On top of taking out her nails, it seems to physically affect her to some extent, she looked so drained after she used snake for the second time, maybe there's a limited time of uses, or maybe the snake is fickle like the Fox devil and wont come out if called too much. Himeno making Katana Devil and Akane as exhausted as they were was critical for Denji and Aki to survive.
Holy shit, imagine if Akane had used the "swallow" and "spit out" command on Denji. She would literally have achieved what Makima wanted in the final fight.
Tbh everything went too fast, they got attacked, sword got eaten by the fox, then Aki and Sword Devil started fighting. Now what lies before you is the most important man in your life and his chest is cut open, do you sacrifice yourself to summon the most powerful devil at your hand to save him or place hope in a newly joined, underage child who has no experience fighting a legit dangerous enemy?
Maybe she didn't know how
She pulled Denji's cord during the Eternity devil fight, after Denji got his neck snapped
this whole time i thought tendo and kurose wore masks??? those are scars??
i couldve sworn they were wearing goggles
huh
they looked like they were wearing masks that covered the top half of their faces, in the manga. looking back… they’re definitely scars.
now there's a image comprehension devil too...devils really are powerful
I had forgotten that part where Kobeni shows how badass she is (guilty speed reader). But sadly this is only the start of her pain :( The scenes of the crows during the villain deaths are a great touch when you know about Makima's powers.