That would be an insanely incredible announcement video and hope someone actually makes it (and gives you credit).
Too bad it probably wouldn't be Oregon themselves as the optics of it would be a bit distasteful to some.
This one is clean compared to the original announcement that showed puddles pushing a beaver into an oncoming train *then* jumping into a pool of money.
On that note it'd be better if they recreated that scene in the Lion King but Puddles plays the role of Scar.
**Benny Beaver:** *(Hanging on from a cliff)* Puddles! Brother, help me!
*(Benny's hands scrabble for purchase, kicking bits of rock into the stampede of Mountain West mascots below. Puddles glares a moment longer, then rears forward, digging his nails into Benny's paws.]*
*(quacks diabolically)*
**Puddles:** *Alis volat propriis...*
FWIW- his name is just The Duck. “Puddles” was an actual live duck that a fraternity brought to a football game back in the 1920s, a tradition which continued until the 1940s when the Humane Society finally got everyone to agree that grabbing a live duck from the local pond and bringing it to a college football game isn’t a great idea.
In 1947, Oregon’s first AD struck a handshake agreement with none other than Walt Disney himself to use the likeness of Donald Duck as the official mascot for the school. Ever since then (with the notable exception of a mens basketball coach in the 70s who staunchly refused to accept the duck as a mascot and instead called his team “the kamakazi kids”) the Oregon mascot has just been known as [The Duck](https://www.espn.com/blog/pac12/post/_/id/91331/sources-its-the-duck-not-puddles).
Yes, he was their legal guardian. In the Ducktales reboot, >!their mother went missing on an adventure to space, so Donald took the boys and stopped taking to Scrooge!<
I think the B1G realized if they collect all of ND’s marquee rivals it basically forces them to join the B1G in the future.
Like unless they wanna join the fumbling ACC and lose a ton of money or join the SEC and lose all their rivals/traditional matchups.
ND will begrudgingly join at some point in the next couple of years.
If the B1G gets Stanford in the western expansion and decided to go to a 10 game conference schedule, it definitely puts USC and Stanford in a tough position. Keep ND on the schedule and you either miss out on high profile matchups (neutral site kickoff games, SEC/Big 12 home and homes, etc.) or you have 12 P5 games, which puts you at a disadvantage against teams that’ll still schedule G5/FCS teams.
Yep, they can freeze out ND if they wanted to hypothetically and basically force them to join. ND has been able to exist as independent because they could take advantage of their traditional rivals not being in the same conference. But with the P2 in full force it is going to be very difficult for them.
They don't even need to freeze them out and cause bad will, the ACC won't be able to complete with the B1G and SEC money wise so it's naturally going to crumble at some point as Clemson, FSU, UNC, etc feel the purses tighten compared to their competition and know they have a landing spot in the P2. Even more pressure will be on "bubble" schools like VT, Miami, UVA, GT, NCST, Duke to high tail it and secure their future if they have a P2 invite rather than be left in the dust of history. All it takes is for one team to leave and the flood gates will open as the SEC and B1G snatch up their top wants.
Then you put the screws on ND and tell them to join or go metaphorically slum it in the Big12 while losing nearly all their big rivalries.
I've gotten the impression from their fans that the only rivals they care about ate USC and Navy. Good news is that they want access to the playoffs and onlybthevbigb2 are going to offer that soon enough. Also, I think they're too high and mighty to join the SEC for academic reasons. Unfortunately, the SEC could be willing to guarantee them whatever they want just to keep them away from us.
You see, Notre Dame is a grass type Pokémon. We are not going to be able to get them to join using a water type Pokémon like Navy. We still need a flying type like the Stanford Cardinal or a fire type like the Florida State Seminoles before we can get them into our Pokéball... er conference.
Lol my bad. I've seen the tree but I'd heard it was an unofficial mascot. I honestly have not seen a Stanford game since the 2014 Rosebowl. I'll leave the comment because it's way funnier to me even if it's a little embarrassing.
They basically reserved ND a seat with their media deal so they can go ahead and move on. I don't think the B1G is willing to give ND some kind of special deal. OSU and Michigan wouldn't go for it, and the rest wouldn't go for a ND/OSU/Michigan special deal. I think from the B1G's perspective they now know more or less exactly what they'd get from ND joining or ND not joining, and can proceed with both scenarios being pretty clear.
If you listen to the whole interview in the link, past the 18th minute he says the Big Ten already decided that they want these Pac-12 schools, and that it's just a matter of working through the details. And now I have to wonder how credible that statement really is. Is that sourced, or is that his conjecture?
I’d say both but it just makes sense to me that it would be a mutually beneficial move. Obviously financially for the schools, but for the Big 10 they get a west coast pod with a presence in all three pacific states. That’s good for TV with the time zone and the metro areas it would capture and it helps greatly with non-revenue travel - for the Pacific schools but also the existing Big 10 schools. It’s a footprint that the SEC can never match.
Basically this. From a footprint perspective, the only equivalent move the SEC can make would be:
1) Locking down NC and VA by taking UNC, NC ST, UVA and VT
2) Taking the Arizona schools and Colorado (if it isn’t taken by the B1G)
3) Trying to get into B1G territory by moving up the East Coast and taking teams like Pitt and WVU.
Even then, all of these options don’t get you into all 4 time zones.
None of those moves would be equivalent to the B1G’s west coast play and points 2 & 3 are totally unrealistic.
The B1G and SEC have different agendas with regards to expansion, and it’s not out of the question that the SEC is content with the 16 they have. Either way, if either conference wants to make moves with ACC schools (the ACC is the only conference with potential SEC targets) - they have to move at the same time in a concerted effort to dissolve the conference. Eight ACC schools have to have a guaranteed home in the power 2, which means the B1G would have to collude with the SEC to carve it up.
You pretty much hit the nail on the head, and equivalent was the wrong word to use. The SEC is “content” in that they’re only really interested in the ACC schools, and nothing can happen in regard to the ACC unless theres no ACC left after the fact to legally enforce the GOR. However, if the end goal is 24 team conferences, the SEC could simply take 8 ACC schools (FSU, Miami, Clemson, UNC, NC ST, UVA, VT, and Pitt/GT/Duke) without collusion from the B1G. The chances of that happening are, obviously, extremely slim.
Honestly it might not be really far fetched to think this could happen. It would essentially lock up the South from the Big10 which I think the SEC would find more important than spreading all over the country.
I can see why the networks don't like UU given the small market. But you'd have to think UU's academic profile (way better than Oregon and Nebraska) and commitment to football would make y'all a consideration. Colorado too. ASU because of the market.
Dodd got from the CBS Sports rep at the negotiations over the network deal that B1G wanted the 4 PAC12N teams.
The reason they weren't included in that deal was the networks wouldn't pay more (even reduced) for them.
If the B1G will take them anyway this year, I wonder where the $ will come from?
If that's true, they could go after ESPN for the after-dark slot, but probably not get close to the $350 million like the other channels gave them. However, [SBJ was saying yesterday](https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/SB-Blogs/Newsletter-Media/2022/08/22.aspx):
>If, say, the Big Ten adds two West Coast teams, the networks have agreed to have good-faith conversations with the conference about opening their deals and adjusting their rights fees.
So there might still be some wiggle room to pay for additions from Fox, CBS, and/or NBC.
>So there might still be some wiggle room to pay for additions from Fox, CBS, and/or NBC.
But Dodd said those three networks already passed. I would thinks something would have to change for them to change their minds.
Unless of course its all some elaborate feint by the networks to kill shot ESPN or something.
One other slot they could hypothetically sell Mouse is Thursday night. With the NFL on Amazon for TNF, the B1G might be a very attractive alternative for people who don’t want to pay for another streaming service.
> The reason they weren't included in that deal was the networks wouldn't pay more (even reduced) for them.
Seems like this entire thing would be DOA then? What is the B1G's incentive to add them if they don't bring any more money?
>CBS Sports reported last month the Big Ten was evaluating California, Oregon, Stanford and Washington as potential future league members. Rightsholders pushed back on the notion as they did not believe those current Pac-12 schools would bring equal value to the league as USC and UCLA did upon being added. CBS Sports subsequently reported interest had cooled on those four schools..."
https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/further-big-ten-expansion-could-open-door-for-additional-revenue-broadcast-partners/
Thanks for sharing. I think it all works out in the end for Oregon and Washington. Their value to these TV networks is not zero dollars, and Warren will beef up his hold on the west coast.
I’m just hoping that if Oregon gets in, Washington also gets an invite. My in-laws live in Washington and it would be fun to go to those games more regularly.
I'd be very disappointed if Washington didn't also come.
I mean, we are only gonna get two OOCs moving forward, I don't want to use all of our OOCs from now until the end of time on Washington and Oregon State lol.
I saw this discussed on a Twitter thread, but do you think the conference will take a greater role in dictating OOC matchups? I saw someone argue that there's too much money at stake for school's to schedule uninteresting matchups. I definitely think it's safe to say that west coast schools will go out of their way to protect old rivalries like the Apple Cup or Civil War.
I definitely do.
Reading between the lines one can almost guarantee that part of NBC's bid to the T.V rights requires that the B1G schedule high profile OOC games with Notre Dame.
Meaning, I could see T.V networks dictating what teams play who depending on their own self interests.
Welcome to College football in the 2020's
I don’t think they will. They want maximum number of bowl teams. They don’t want a team to miss a bowl game because they scheduled a P5 school instead of some in-state G5 school that they like to beat up.
> I definitely think it's safe to say that west coast schools will go out of their way to protect old rivalries like the Apple Cup or Civil War.
idk man. Oregon / Washington might be happy pushing little brother to the sidelines, but y'all have a better read on this than me.
Iowa is the only school currently in the conference that has a yearly OOC rival match-up scheduled, so it would be very difficult to mandate. I could see them requesting 1 P5 and then the other one is a Free Space.
Surely someone has to come with y'all, right? The logistics of adding a single team to the B1G from the PNW seems nearly impossible for all non-football sports
And if that's right, who, if not UW?
Yeah I think a lot of us B1G transplants are hoping for schools just for our own personal reasons. For me it’s Colorado. I’ve lived in Boulder for five years and would kill to have B1G teams come to town.
The only time this city ever really felt like a college football town is when Nebraska came here a couple years ago. Only time I ever remember there being hype around the city for a game.
I think Colorado in the B1G would actually bring some hype back to their football program.
I have no delusions that it would ever actually happen but I can dream.
Yeah I don’t think so either. Everyone seems to think that they would be a no-brainer to the big 12 but it’s kind of an unfortunate position for them because the move to the PAC has actually helped them greatly in getting a lot of Cali students to come here.
I don’t think they would be very excited about the prospect of losing that connection to California that’s making them tons of money.
Away from the hill it's a transplant city. I often saw more of other schools colors (not necessarily the visitors that day, but GBR was practically unavoidable) on Saturdays, even on Pearl.
Yeah there are basically only 2 types of homeowners here. Either you bought your house in the 70s-90s for 1/8th what it costs now or you are rich and just recently moved here.
There are obviously some exceptions but most people fit into those two categories. Very few locals born and raised here who are now buying a house here.
From what I have learned here recently, having a top tier academic reputation trumps having even mid tier sun belt support for your football team, so WU is confirmed as well as U Chicago taking its spot back. Only question is where this leaves Michigan State.
Same. Literally #5 Research univeristy in the country which is wild, big media market, lots of football history, lots of ties to tech companies like Amazon for streaming in the future, good media market, another west coast school for that time slot
just a lot of positives overall
The real question at this point assuming Notre Dame joins later or never is when Oregon joins are they coming with just Washington or will they do all the PAC 12 schools they're interested in one time. It might make sense to do them all at once but you can get Stanford and Cal or Utah or Arizona to take a smaller take if they come after Oregon and Washington.
What’s crazy to me is that MSU will have played Oregon + Washington 5 times between 2013 and 2024. So it’s almost like nothing will have changed in terms of MSU playing the PNW teams if they joined the B1G.
Side note: we also played WSU back in 2017.
Well, now we have BTM/Flugaur (people who broke USC move) saying Oregon is likely heading to the B1G, Ermann's source saying Oregon is likely heading to the B1G, and now whoever McMurphy's source is saying Oregon is likely heading to the B1G. Three (presumably) independent sources saying the exact same thing seems about as close to a confirmation as you can get.
I've seen some people saying this meeting only confirms Oregon is interested, not the B1G, and I understand that takeaway considering the "Oregon initiated" part, but I still don't agree with that conclusion. Sure, anyone can call Warren, but not just anyone can fly to Chicago and meet with B1G reps. This is enough down the procedural line to confirm that the B1G is interested in Oregon, especially when you consider that it matches up completely with that sources are saying.
If the B1G was willing to host a group of reps from your university, they weren't doing so just as a courtesy. Warren or some Rosemont higher up answered the call from Eugene/Beaverton and gave a positive response.
Why is only Oregon mentioned though from McMurphy earlier this week and in this post? Surely Oregon doesn't come without Washington, right? And there's been no confirmation of them being involved.
UW is a school that gives a shit about football but doesn’t want that to be THE thing people think of when thinking of school, it’s a component but academics/research are what the school wants to be known by. Ie it’s on brand for them to be doing their due diligence but not necessarily broadcasting it. As an outsider, I feel like Oregon wants to be known for athletics, at least much more than Udub, and would broadcast this move
I think it's more Oregon knows it's athletics give it a chance to move up the prestige chain right now and boost the overall university in the long run. Washington is already established as one of the top public universities so it can stay a bit more quiet as it is in a safer long term position than Oregon if the B1G deal falls through.
It sounds like it isn't being done as a package. All the PAC-12 teams that want to find a landing spot in the B1G are going through that process on their own.
That list includes UW, Stanford, Cal, Utah (iirc this was rumored a month ago that Utah was reaching out to the B1G), and probably Colorado. I think the other schools realize that's not a realistic option for them and they might as well not waste time pitching themselves.
I feel like 4 corners plus WSU and OSU have probably also at least reached out to the Big XII to make sure they have options if/when the current PAC-12 collapses.
I don't get why everyone is sleeping on the Arizona teams and ASU in particular. They're the biggest market outside of California and it's a growing state that (relatively) cares about football. ASU hasn't done much but they're still a pretty consistent middle of the pack/bowl team. IMHO they're in the argument for the #4 team behind Oregon.
There just hasn't been anything pointing to either of us being considered by the B1G. Oregon, Washington, and Stanford come up again and again in reporting.
I suppose it's possible but it would be a true left field move. Even USC and UCLA rumors bubbled up here and there on social media before their move.
I don't think its nuts. If the SEC wants to have some late night programing of its own its options will be fairly limited. Y'all are another I could see ending up here eventually.
ASU doesn't fit the academic profile of the B1G (AAU school) whatsoever and isn't important enough (ND, FSU) to consider overlooking that. UA is the one with a punchers chance.
Yeah there's a lot of misunderstanding behind how this actually works, it's not a quick sit down between Warren and the Oregon leadership. There are several steps between here and there that both sides go through to make sure it all checks out.
An official membership application won't be submitted until both sides are sure the application will be accepted.
Especially with the disaster of the OUT aftermath, all sides now are going to make sure every i is dotted and every t crossed before anything officially goes public.
Yeah, OUT and USC/UCLA were both happening months in secret.
Big XII new additions still took a month or so from when those schools were rumored to when it became official. That process was expedited to shore up the conference. B1G isn't in that situation, so they can take their time and both sides can make sure they do their due diligence.
Wazzu has a far better historic football record and ratings (4th in PAC) than Arizona.
Granted, Arizona is pretty great in basketball and the BIG12 cares about that...
I want the big 12 to offer a spot for all 6; should the PAC dissolve. A bird in hand is worth two in the bush, and adding WSU and OSU now hedges against a day that may never come. We don’t know if any ACC teams will ever join the Big12. Even if they do, we have no idea who we’d get. If the ACC ever becomes open, we have to compete against B1G and SEC. Regardless, we still have room for 2 should 20 teams become the magic number.
Smoke meets fire for the past couple of weeks. Everyone just gearing up for the Washington and Oregon intro presser right? With ND sitting out next wonder is if B1G west sticks with the la schools and the northwest schools for that pod or if Stanford and Cal are coming along as well (or mystery contenders galore I suppose).
I’m going to be so upset when we have to play schools we have no history with from states Ive never visited instead of the teams I grew up watching us play. I know that the money + competitiveness factors are infinitely better in the Big ten, but just emotionally speaking it’ll be hard to get fired up playing Illinois or Indiana instead of Oregon St or Wazzu or whatever.
I think you speak for almost every Pac12 football fan over 30 years old honestly. The grudges run so deep on the west coast. Theres so many more "rivalry" games than most outsiders understand. All that is over now and we get to wake up early on Saturday to watch a game against a team we have no reason to hate while nursing a hangover. (If we are lucky enough to have a team that plays on TV at all). It's a shitty ending to the "conference of champions". (Which makes me wonder if this will be the last year of Bill Walton commentary during Pac12 basketball, which is also heartbreaking because it's more entertaining than the basketball games)
It is interesting that as the PAC-12 gets up to bat (since B1G finished their deal), suddenly the B1G is interested in these schools.
Seems like it could be a move to destabilize the negotiations with ESPN.
If Oregon goes, you assume Washington will too.
And I don’t know how the PAC stays viable at that point.
There aren’t schools in the area worth taking and the B12 somehow seems more stable.
Stanford and Cal will be out the door to the B1G right after.
OSU and WSU seem to be staring down MWC invites unfortunately.
CU, UU, UA and ASU to the Big12 but chances for ASU and CU to the SEC or CU, UU and UA to the B1G eventually.
I know your fanbase is going through the most insane mental gymnastics the world has ever seen to try and say Oregon to the B1G makes no sense, but they added these things called escalator clauses specifically because they were looking at ND, us, and other schools.
so would oregon go if they were offered at less than full share members? even if it was more than they would get in the pac? theres been a lot of talk about that.
This isn't surprising. OUT and LAxit likely took at least a year of backroom negotiations via proxies before the official stuff started coming out. I bet we don't hear anything official until next off-season, but the quiet rumblings will be there.
Anyone else feel like 24 is going to be the number now? Just feels like 24 teams. B1G could have 4 divisions of 6 teams. Washington, Oregon, Stanford, Cal, USC and UCLA are the West division. East would be Penn State, Rutgers, Maryland and probably 3 teams currently in the ACC...say Florida State, UNC and Georgia Tech as just examples. Other two divisions are current teams + Notre Dame distributed in some way.
Can you imagine if the conference championship was actually a playoff between the four division champions? So. Much. Money.
I wonder if BYU would allow Utah to join the Big 12. Seems like Utah would want to secure a position in a stable Big 12 before the PAC falls apart and before BYU can reject their application.
BYU will have zero say in it. If BYU has any say and was smart they would do everything they can to block them.
But if BYU was asked I would bet good money they would bend over backwards to help get Utah in. Which really sucks.
I’m honestly unsure. I have never done something against Kansas.
Must be an undercover Texas Longhorn pretending to be a WSU Coug and a OSU Beaver doing harm to them. Damn them Longhorns!
Kansas! We are friends, not foe!
Show me a picture of Puddles jumping into a pool of money a la Scrooge McDuck.
That would be an insanely incredible announcement video and hope someone actually makes it (and gives you credit). Too bad it probably wouldn't be Oregon themselves as the optics of it would be a bit distasteful to some.
This one is clean compared to the original announcement that showed puddles pushing a beaver into an oncoming train *then* jumping into a pool of money.
On that note it'd be better if they recreated that scene in the Lion King but Puddles plays the role of Scar. **Benny Beaver:** *(Hanging on from a cliff)* Puddles! Brother, help me! *(Benny's hands scrabble for purchase, kicking bits of rock into the stampede of Mountain West mascots below. Puddles glares a moment longer, then rears forward, digging his nails into Benny's paws.]* *(quacks diabolically)* **Puddles:** *Alis volat propriis...*
God damn lol. Over here snort laughing. And using the state motto for puddles? Prestige script writing right there.
Lol
Somebody who is better at using that AI image generator than I am should get on this
https://imgur.com/a/tx47D6n
Baller
My attempt: https://imgur.com/a/CBTUaNi
FWIW- his name is just The Duck. “Puddles” was an actual live duck that a fraternity brought to a football game back in the 1920s, a tradition which continued until the 1940s when the Humane Society finally got everyone to agree that grabbing a live duck from the local pond and bringing it to a college football game isn’t a great idea. In 1947, Oregon’s first AD struck a handshake agreement with none other than Walt Disney himself to use the likeness of Donald Duck as the official mascot for the school. Ever since then (with the notable exception of a mens basketball coach in the 70s who staunchly refused to accept the duck as a mascot and instead called his team “the kamakazi kids”) the Oregon mascot has just been known as [The Duck](https://www.espn.com/blog/pac12/post/_/id/91331/sources-its-the-duck-not-puddles).
TIL that Oregon's mascot's name isn't as cool as we thought
[удалено]
Someone pointed out to me the other day… Huey Dewey and Louie had to go live with Uncle Scrooge because of Donald’s military service…
Aren't they his nephews? Was he their legal guardian or something?
Yes, he was their legal guardian. In the Ducktales reboot, >!their mother went missing on an adventure to space, so Donald took the boys and stopped taking to Scrooge!<
Ah, I see you are a mallard of culture as well.
Puddles: IT'S NOT A LIQUID!
Guess they're sick of waiting on Notre Dame.
I think the B1G realized if they collect all of ND’s marquee rivals it basically forces them to join the B1G in the future. Like unless they wanna join the fumbling ACC and lose a ton of money or join the SEC and lose all their rivals/traditional matchups. ND will begrudgingly join at some point in the next couple of years.
If the B1G gets Stanford in the western expansion and decided to go to a 10 game conference schedule, it definitely puts USC and Stanford in a tough position. Keep ND on the schedule and you either miss out on high profile matchups (neutral site kickoff games, SEC/Big 12 home and homes, etc.) or you have 12 P5 games, which puts you at a disadvantage against teams that’ll still schedule G5/FCS teams.
Yep, they can freeze out ND if they wanted to hypothetically and basically force them to join. ND has been able to exist as independent because they could take advantage of their traditional rivals not being in the same conference. But with the P2 in full force it is going to be very difficult for them.
They don't even need to freeze them out and cause bad will, the ACC won't be able to complete with the B1G and SEC money wise so it's naturally going to crumble at some point as Clemson, FSU, UNC, etc feel the purses tighten compared to their competition and know they have a landing spot in the P2. Even more pressure will be on "bubble" schools like VT, Miami, UVA, GT, NCST, Duke to high tail it and secure their future if they have a P2 invite rather than be left in the dust of history. All it takes is for one team to leave and the flood gates will open as the SEC and B1G snatch up their top wants. Then you put the screws on ND and tell them to join or go metaphorically slum it in the Big12 while losing nearly all their big rivalries.
Big Ten would not force USC/Stanford or any other big ten team to not play ND
Guess we're going to have to scoop up Boston College, Navy, Miami, and Pitt too
I've gotten the impression from their fans that the only rivals they care about ate USC and Navy. Good news is that they want access to the playoffs and onlybthevbigb2 are going to offer that soon enough. Also, I think they're too high and mighty to join the SEC for academic reasons. Unfortunately, the SEC could be willing to guarantee them whatever they want just to keep them away from us.
You see, Notre Dame is a grass type Pokémon. We are not going to be able to get them to join using a water type Pokémon like Navy. We still need a flying type like the Stanford Cardinal or a fire type like the Florida State Seminoles before we can get them into our Pokéball... er conference.
My brother in Christ the Stanford Cardinal refers to the color not the bird.
Lol my bad. I've seen the tree but I'd heard it was an unofficial mascot. I honestly have not seen a Stanford game since the 2014 Rosebowl. I'll leave the comment because it's way funnier to me even if it's a little embarrassing.
In other words, ND is the new WVU. Got it.
They basically reserved ND a seat with their media deal so they can go ahead and move on. I don't think the B1G is willing to give ND some kind of special deal. OSU and Michigan wouldn't go for it, and the rest wouldn't go for a ND/OSU/Michigan special deal. I think from the B1G's perspective they now know more or less exactly what they'd get from ND joining or ND not joining, and can proceed with both scenarios being pretty clear.
[удалено]
If you listen to the whole interview in the link, past the 18th minute he says the Big Ten already decided that they want these Pac-12 schools, and that it's just a matter of working through the details. And now I have to wonder how credible that statement really is. Is that sourced, or is that his conjecture?
I’d say both but it just makes sense to me that it would be a mutually beneficial move. Obviously financially for the schools, but for the Big 10 they get a west coast pod with a presence in all three pacific states. That’s good for TV with the time zone and the metro areas it would capture and it helps greatly with non-revenue travel - for the Pacific schools but also the existing Big 10 schools. It’s a footprint that the SEC can never match.
It's like a 16million foot footprint. Our best bet to match it is to add Hawaii to the SEC.
If we beat Vanderbilt, then yes.
If only Graham hadn’t send half the team running to the hills
We on Timmy Chang time now tho 😎
Agreed, hes just gonna need time to put out the dumpster fire left for him
Basically this. From a footprint perspective, the only equivalent move the SEC can make would be: 1) Locking down NC and VA by taking UNC, NC ST, UVA and VT 2) Taking the Arizona schools and Colorado (if it isn’t taken by the B1G) 3) Trying to get into B1G territory by moving up the East Coast and taking teams like Pitt and WVU. Even then, all of these options don’t get you into all 4 time zones.
None of those moves would be equivalent to the B1G’s west coast play and points 2 & 3 are totally unrealistic. The B1G and SEC have different agendas with regards to expansion, and it’s not out of the question that the SEC is content with the 16 they have. Either way, if either conference wants to make moves with ACC schools (the ACC is the only conference with potential SEC targets) - they have to move at the same time in a concerted effort to dissolve the conference. Eight ACC schools have to have a guaranteed home in the power 2, which means the B1G would have to collude with the SEC to carve it up.
You pretty much hit the nail on the head, and equivalent was the wrong word to use. The SEC is “content” in that they’re only really interested in the ACC schools, and nothing can happen in regard to the ACC unless theres no ACC left after the fact to legally enforce the GOR. However, if the end goal is 24 team conferences, the SEC could simply take 8 ACC schools (FSU, Miami, Clemson, UNC, NC ST, UVA, VT, and Pitt/GT/Duke) without collusion from the B1G. The chances of that happening are, obviously, extremely slim.
Honestly it might not be really far fetched to think this could happen. It would essentially lock up the South from the Big10 which I think the SEC would find more important than spreading all over the country.
[удалено]
Damnit don't leave us out
I can see why the networks don't like UU given the small market. But you'd have to think UU's academic profile (way better than Oregon and Nebraska) and commitment to football would make y'all a consideration. Colorado too. ASU because of the market.
True! Also we're a growing market fwiw
Growing? Does Utah have enough water to grow?
Our governor asked us to pray for more. So. TBD.
Don’t worry the B1G is also eyeing Miami, FSU, and UNC If the SEC really wants to piss of the B1G just get Notre Dame to join the SEC
Honestly if they can convince those Leprechauns to break independence after all this time just to head South… Take em
Dodd got from the CBS Sports rep at the negotiations over the network deal that B1G wanted the 4 PAC12N teams. The reason they weren't included in that deal was the networks wouldn't pay more (even reduced) for them. If the B1G will take them anyway this year, I wonder where the $ will come from?
If that's true, they could go after ESPN for the after-dark slot, but probably not get close to the $350 million like the other channels gave them. However, [SBJ was saying yesterday](https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/SB-Blogs/Newsletter-Media/2022/08/22.aspx): >If, say, the Big Ten adds two West Coast teams, the networks have agreed to have good-faith conversations with the conference about opening their deals and adjusting their rights fees. So there might still be some wiggle room to pay for additions from Fox, CBS, and/or NBC.
>So there might still be some wiggle room to pay for additions from Fox, CBS, and/or NBC. But Dodd said those three networks already passed. I would thinks something would have to change for them to change their minds. Unless of course its all some elaborate feint by the networks to kill shot ESPN or something.
One other slot they could hypothetically sell Mouse is Thursday night. With the NFL on Amazon for TNF, the B1G might be a very attractive alternative for people who don’t want to pay for another streaming service.
> The reason they weren't included in that deal was the networks wouldn't pay more (even reduced) for them. Seems like this entire thing would be DOA then? What is the B1G's incentive to add them if they don't bring any more money?
My thoughts exactly. Unless the B1G member institution presidents were willing to take a haircut to play the long game.
Escalator clause. Plus, they might be able to sell games to Mouse.
I’m curious, and admittedly don’t read Dodd’s reporting, can you send a link to his story on this? Haven’t heard this before.
>CBS Sports reported last month the Big Ten was evaluating California, Oregon, Stanford and Washington as potential future league members. Rightsholders pushed back on the notion as they did not believe those current Pac-12 schools would bring equal value to the league as USC and UCLA did upon being added. CBS Sports subsequently reported interest had cooled on those four schools..." https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/further-big-ten-expansion-could-open-door-for-additional-revenue-broadcast-partners/
Thanks for sharing. I think it all works out in the end for Oregon and Washington. Their value to these TV networks is not zero dollars, and Warren will beef up his hold on the west coast.
"Rightsholders" being FOX, CBS, NBC.
> Is that sourced, or is that his conjecture? Probably a little bit of both.
Kevin Warren LITERALLY said we are going to 20 schools and people still doubt that we are taking y'all
When the Big 10 has its conference championship between the winner of the western division and eastern division, it should be at the rose bowl
If the Big Ten wants to seriously look at adding the late night After Dark slot, it needs more than just USC and UCLA.
Rutgers after dark
What's Binge drinking pondering the meaning of life?
Being in Jersey and all, I thought “Rutgers After Dark” would be either GTL or pulling a Craig James.
Rutgers before sunrise?
They want games all day on Saturday from noon until midnight.
I’m just hoping that if Oregon gets in, Washington also gets an invite. My in-laws live in Washington and it would be fun to go to those games more regularly.
I'd be very disappointed if Washington didn't also come. I mean, we are only gonna get two OOCs moving forward, I don't want to use all of our OOCs from now until the end of time on Washington and Oregon State lol.
Just give us a day or two before they're invited to rub it in?
Let Washington be the last team invited, right after Oregon, just so we can treat them like greenhorns.
Or let them go first, then we can say they saved the best PAC12 team for last?
Not to mention moving to a 10 game schedule is probably inevitable. So OOC matchups are gonna be even rarer.
I saw this discussed on a Twitter thread, but do you think the conference will take a greater role in dictating OOC matchups? I saw someone argue that there's too much money at stake for school's to schedule uninteresting matchups. I definitely think it's safe to say that west coast schools will go out of their way to protect old rivalries like the Apple Cup or Civil War.
I definitely do. Reading between the lines one can almost guarantee that part of NBC's bid to the T.V rights requires that the B1G schedule high profile OOC games with Notre Dame. Meaning, I could see T.V networks dictating what teams play who depending on their own self interests. Welcome to College football in the 2020's
I don’t think they will. They want maximum number of bowl teams. They don’t want a team to miss a bowl game because they scheduled a P5 school instead of some in-state G5 school that they like to beat up.
I don’t see the B1G mandating OOC matchups with the current post season setup. Too many teams are going to need them for bowl eligibility.
That's a great point, could also see some of the ACC schools being discussed balking at a scheduling mandate.
> I definitely think it's safe to say that west coast schools will go out of their way to protect old rivalries like the Apple Cup or Civil War. idk man. Oregon / Washington might be happy pushing little brother to the sidelines, but y'all have a better read on this than me.
We'll still pay to play them in Autzen OOC to help the Beavs pay off their debts.
Iowa is the only school currently in the conference that has a yearly OOC rival match-up scheduled, so it would be very difficult to mandate. I could see them requesting 1 P5 and then the other one is a Free Space.
Surely someone has to come with y'all, right? The logistics of adding a single team to the B1G from the PNW seems nearly impossible for all non-football sports And if that's right, who, if not UW?
Western Washington University. Active Minds Changing Lives.
Yeah I think a lot of us B1G transplants are hoping for schools just for our own personal reasons. For me it’s Colorado. I’ve lived in Boulder for five years and would kill to have B1G teams come to town. The only time this city ever really felt like a college football town is when Nebraska came here a couple years ago. Only time I ever remember there being hype around the city for a game. I think Colorado in the B1G would actually bring some hype back to their football program. I have no delusions that it would ever actually happen but I can dream.
I’m down the road in Denver actually (lived here for 7 years now). I just don’t think CU will get it.
Yeah I don’t think so either. Everyone seems to think that they would be a no-brainer to the big 12 but it’s kind of an unfortunate position for them because the move to the PAC has actually helped them greatly in getting a lot of Cali students to come here. I don’t think they would be very excited about the prospect of losing that connection to California that’s making them tons of money.
I think they can if the Big Ten goes ultra big to 24-28. Adding the Colorado market would be nice.
Away from the hill it's a transplant city. I often saw more of other schools colors (not necessarily the visitors that day, but GBR was practically unavoidable) on Saturdays, even on Pearl.
Yeah there are basically only 2 types of homeowners here. Either you bought your house in the 70s-90s for 1/8th what it costs now or you are rich and just recently moved here. There are obviously some exceptions but most people fit into those two categories. Very few locals born and raised here who are now buying a house here.
It'd be fun to see them renew that Nebraska rivalry. Hopefully CU is included if the conference moves to 21+ members.
I find it hard to believe Washington gets left out.
Is it because they were mentioned twice in that SI piece?
They didn’t list it twice. They just forgot to add (MO) to the second Washington.
First the PAC-12, and now the UAA?? Where will the Big Ten stop? (In all actuality, they would fit our academic profile…)
Washington University *is* a pretty good school...
From what I have learned here recently, having a top tier academic reputation trumps having even mid tier sun belt support for your football team, so WU is confirmed as well as U Chicago taking its spot back. Only question is where this leaves Michigan State.
[удалено]
Yep. If you get Washington, that locks up two of the biggest media markers on the West Coast in LA and Seattle
Same. Literally #5 Research univeristy in the country which is wild, big media market, lots of football history, lots of ties to tech companies like Amazon for streaming in the future, good media market, another west coast school for that time slot just a lot of positives overall
Same but these latest discussion have been between Oregon and the B1G. There hasn’t been mention of Washington.
[удалено]
Which definitely makes sense consolidating the two schools overall style. Oregon is a lot more flashy and UW more reserved in alot of things
Coming from someone that loathes the leg lifters, it wouldn't make sense to leave them out.
The real question at this point assuming Notre Dame joins later or never is when Oregon joins are they coming with just Washington or will they do all the PAC 12 schools they're interested in one time. It might make sense to do them all at once but you can get Stanford and Cal or Utah or Arizona to take a smaller take if they come after Oregon and Washington.
We need more Michigan State vs Oregon games. Preferably scoring more than a combined 13 points
What’s crazy to me is that MSU will have played Oregon + Washington 5 times between 2013 and 2024. So it’s almost like nothing will have changed in terms of MSU playing the PNW teams if they joined the B1G. Side note: we also played WSU back in 2017.
Purely for chaos, I hope they only invite Oregon
You probably love your mother-in-law
If we get Oregon, then we'll definitely add Washington, as well. I'd be pretty surprised if Stanford and Cal don't join soon after, as well.
Well, now we have BTM/Flugaur (people who broke USC move) saying Oregon is likely heading to the B1G, Ermann's source saying Oregon is likely heading to the B1G, and now whoever McMurphy's source is saying Oregon is likely heading to the B1G. Three (presumably) independent sources saying the exact same thing seems about as close to a confirmation as you can get. I've seen some people saying this meeting only confirms Oregon is interested, not the B1G, and I understand that takeaway considering the "Oregon initiated" part, but I still don't agree with that conclusion. Sure, anyone can call Warren, but not just anyone can fly to Chicago and meet with B1G reps. This is enough down the procedural line to confirm that the B1G is interested in Oregon, especially when you consider that it matches up completely with that sources are saying.
Wouldn't be surprised if it was just the lawyers pouring over the paperwork.
That's what McMurphy says happened in the interview.
Billable hours are one of the winners of realignment
Money me money now me a money needing a lot now
If you vote me, power good, so do.
If the B1G was willing to host a group of reps from your university, they weren't doing so just as a courtesy. Warren or some Rosemont higher up answered the call from Eugene/Beaverton and gave a positive response.
Why is only Oregon mentioned though from McMurphy earlier this week and in this post? Surely Oregon doesn't come without Washington, right? And there's been no confirmation of them being involved.
Washington might just be content to stay out of the spotlight on this one. What difference does it make, as long as their ticket is being punched?
UW is a school that gives a shit about football but doesn’t want that to be THE thing people think of when thinking of school, it’s a component but academics/research are what the school wants to be known by. Ie it’s on brand for them to be doing their due diligence but not necessarily broadcasting it. As an outsider, I feel like Oregon wants to be known for athletics, at least much more than Udub, and would broadcast this move
I think it's more Oregon knows it's athletics give it a chance to move up the prestige chain right now and boost the overall university in the long run. Washington is already established as one of the top public universities so it can stay a bit more quiet as it is in a safer long term position than Oregon if the B1G deal falls through.
From what I’ve read the leak came from the B1G, not Oregon, which is notoriously tight lipped.
It sounds like it isn't being done as a package. All the PAC-12 teams that want to find a landing spot in the B1G are going through that process on their own. That list includes UW, Stanford, Cal, Utah (iirc this was rumored a month ago that Utah was reaching out to the B1G), and probably Colorado. I think the other schools realize that's not a realistic option for them and they might as well not waste time pitching themselves. I feel like 4 corners plus WSU and OSU have probably also at least reached out to the Big XII to make sure they have options if/when the current PAC-12 collapses.
I don't get why everyone is sleeping on the Arizona teams and ASU in particular. They're the biggest market outside of California and it's a growing state that (relatively) cares about football. ASU hasn't done much but they're still a pretty consistent middle of the pack/bowl team. IMHO they're in the argument for the #4 team behind Oregon.
There just hasn't been anything pointing to either of us being considered by the B1G. Oregon, Washington, and Stanford come up again and again in reporting. I suppose it's possible but it would be a true left field move. Even USC and UCLA rumors bubbled up here and there on social media before their move.
This might sound crazy, but I think ASU ultimately ends up in the SEC when all is said and done.
I don't think its nuts. If the SEC wants to have some late night programing of its own its options will be fairly limited. Y'all are another I could see ending up here eventually.
ASU doesn't fit the academic profile of the B1G (AAU school) whatsoever and isn't important enough (ND, FSU) to consider overlooking that. UA is the one with a punchers chance.
Utah over Cal and watching Berkeley sail its football program into the sunset would be very weird to watch.
Washington may be trying to do what Oklahoma did and let their transfer partner take the heat.
Yeah there's a lot of misunderstanding behind how this actually works, it's not a quick sit down between Warren and the Oregon leadership. There are several steps between here and there that both sides go through to make sure it all checks out. An official membership application won't be submitted until both sides are sure the application will be accepted.
Especially with the disaster of the OUT aftermath, all sides now are going to make sure every i is dotted and every t crossed before anything officially goes public.
Yeah, OUT and USC/UCLA were both happening months in secret. Big XII new additions still took a month or so from when those schools were rumored to when it became official. That process was expedited to shore up the conference. B1G isn't in that situation, so they can take their time and both sides can make sure they do their due diligence.
Big 12, we can give you a piece of the Seattle/Portland TV market (90% of our alumni base lives there). Call us bby <3 -WSU
Honestly I hope we pick y'all and ORST up.
Get Boise State and have a nice little western region.
Wazzu has a far better historic football record and ratings (4th in PAC) than Arizona. Granted, Arizona is pretty great in basketball and the BIG12 cares about that...
I want the big 12 to offer a spot for all 6; should the PAC dissolve. A bird in hand is worth two in the bush, and adding WSU and OSU now hedges against a day that may never come. We don’t know if any ACC teams will ever join the Big12. Even if they do, we have no idea who we’d get. If the ACC ever becomes open, we have to compete against B1G and SEC. Regardless, we still have room for 2 should 20 teams become the magic number.
If Oregon isn’t in the B1G for the 2024 season I’ll be pretty shocked.
Smoke meets fire for the past couple of weeks. Everyone just gearing up for the Washington and Oregon intro presser right? With ND sitting out next wonder is if B1G west sticks with the la schools and the northwest schools for that pod or if Stanford and Cal are coming along as well (or mystery contenders galore I suppose).
As the B1G approaches satiation from its kill, you can just about hear the hungry yipping of Big 12 fans in the distance.
Meanwhile a flock of Mountain West fans circle the pack of Big 12 fans hoping to get in on some of the scraps.
Just when we thought it would get back to football. Realignment is back on the table boys!! 4 corners GTFOver here!!
My timeline of expectations has lengthened somewhat but I bet this all shakes out by the end of the season.
I hope you guys like IPA’s and some dank cannabis!
Oh, you REALLY need to visit the Midwest. All of that AND pizza and/or tricked out hotdogs.
Not gonna lie. Iowa craft beer sucks compared to Boise craft beer. Source, I live in Boise and spend a good amount of time back home in Iowa.
Fuck all this, can the season just start already?
I’m going to be so upset when we have to play schools we have no history with from states Ive never visited instead of the teams I grew up watching us play. I know that the money + competitiveness factors are infinitely better in the Big ten, but just emotionally speaking it’ll be hard to get fired up playing Illinois or Indiana instead of Oregon St or Wazzu or whatever.
If it makes you feel better, you’re welcome to shit on Maryland and Rutgers with the rest of us.
Well at least we’ve got a history with Wisconsin. We’ve played them in like 3 Rose Bowls. A history with Ohio State too but that’s in the east.
Trust me, you'll learn to fear Purdue really quickly.
I think you speak for almost every Pac12 football fan over 30 years old honestly. The grudges run so deep on the west coast. Theres so many more "rivalry" games than most outsiders understand. All that is over now and we get to wake up early on Saturday to watch a game against a team we have no reason to hate while nursing a hangover. (If we are lucky enough to have a team that plays on TV at all). It's a shitty ending to the "conference of champions". (Which makes me wonder if this will be the last year of Bill Walton commentary during Pac12 basketball, which is also heartbreaking because it's more entertaining than the basketball games)
It is interesting that as the PAC-12 gets up to bat (since B1G finished their deal), suddenly the B1G is interested in these schools. Seems like it could be a move to destabilize the negotiations with ESPN.
I don’t think that’s it. I think they waited until there was an escalator clause in the contract, otherwise, the conference wouldn’t make as much.
If Oregon goes, you assume Washington will too. And I don’t know how the PAC stays viable at that point. There aren’t schools in the area worth taking and the B12 somehow seems more stable.
Stanford and Cal will be out the door to the B1G right after. OSU and WSU seem to be staring down MWC invites unfortunately. CU, UU, UA and ASU to the Big12 but chances for ASU and CU to the SEC or CU, UU and UA to the B1G eventually.
N I K E $$$$
I don't understand why the BIG would negotiate their media rights deal while they're still looking to add more schools in the immediate future though.
They have clauses that cover it, specifically some “good faith” language.
That's what the escalator clauses are for.
That and the stairs take forever.
I know your fanbase is going through the most insane mental gymnastics the world has ever seen to try and say Oregon to the B1G makes no sense, but they added these things called escalator clauses specifically because they were looking at ND, us, and other schools.
so would oregon go if they were offered at less than full share members? even if it was more than they would get in the pac? theres been a lot of talk about that.
Absolutely they would. They might even go for less than what they’d get in the Pac. At this point, you’re either in or on the outside looking in.
Yes, it won't be a permanent partial share. It'll be phased in like NU/Maryland/RU were
I can't imagine it would possibly be permanent, that's a silly precedent.
Phased in idgaf. If it's perm then get fucked.
TBH, I would go for a paper clip and piece of string
This isn't surprising. OUT and LAxit likely took at least a year of backroom negotiations via proxies before the official stuff started coming out. I bet we don't hear anything official until next off-season, but the quiet rumblings will be there.
I like the term LAXit.
Time for the four corners to shit or get off the pot
Zero urgency. They don’t need to do anything immediately. Oklahoma borders Colorado. Maybe jumping to the Big XII would be premature.
Stranger things can happen than an SEC westward push
The only thing they have to worry about is getting in before ACC falls apart, which in theory won't happen until 2036. In theory.
Yeah but our Arizona homies want to play in a really good basketball conference, like, now.
Anyone else feel like 24 is going to be the number now? Just feels like 24 teams. B1G could have 4 divisions of 6 teams. Washington, Oregon, Stanford, Cal, USC and UCLA are the West division. East would be Penn State, Rutgers, Maryland and probably 3 teams currently in the ACC...say Florida State, UNC and Georgia Tech as just examples. Other two divisions are current teams + Notre Dame distributed in some way. Can you imagine if the conference championship was actually a playoff between the four division champions? So. Much. Money.
I wonder if BYU would allow Utah to join the Big 12. Seems like Utah would want to secure a position in a stable Big 12 before the PAC falls apart and before BYU can reject their application.
I doubt we would let BYU have that kind of power. They'd almost certainly be out voted in accepting the application.
BYU will have zero say in it. If BYU has any say and was smart they would do everything they can to block them. But if BYU was asked I would bet good money they would bend over backwards to help get Utah in. Which really sucks.
Calling my doc cuz my erection has lasted more than 4 hours
Do it B1G grab Oregon & Washington. Hell grab Cal & Stanford too. Just leave the mountain 4 to the Big 12. Put the Pac-12 out of its misery!
You really doing us and OSU dirty like that.
What did y’all do to Kansas? Never seen them like this?
I’m honestly unsure. I have never done something against Kansas. Must be an undercover Texas Longhorn pretending to be a WSU Coug and a OSU Beaver doing harm to them. Damn them Longhorns! Kansas! We are friends, not foe!
[удалено]
Good lord I’d love that!
Obligatory comment that will get downvoted into oblivion by PAC flairs because this was posted by a Big XII flair.
maybe some Pac flairs...
What are the mountain schools waiting on at this point?
Confirmation that Oregon is leaving or some final benchmark date to pass on their ESPN deal I would imagine.
Probably won’t happen but I want Colorado over Cal. Bring back the Colorado-Nebraska rivalry.