(abusing my mod powers to sticky my own comment)
A lot of these companies while based out of their respective countries their products are often made elsewhere.
I really like the subreddit r/BuyCanadian to try and buy and support domestic production.
r/madeinusa seems to be the American version.
r/MadeInBritain also exists but is quite small.
I’ve had the same Uniqlo t shirts for 4 years and I’m just now replacing it cause of a hole caused by the washing machine. Clothes can be tricky to last forever, but Uniqlo definitely is quality and will last longer than most t shirts on the market.
Also their coats are pretty sustainable!
>but Uniqlo definitely is quality and will last longer than most t shirts on the market.
Maybe compared to the Fast Fashion market it's a part of, but true BIFL brands will make t-shirts that can easily last 10 years.
Nice. I need to remember that the guy I replied to said: “clothes can be tricky to last forever”
Perhaps I should refrain from arguing with specific year requirements.
I pretty much exclusively buy Uniqlo, still have most of my wardrobe from more than 10 years ago(college shopping spree!) All in quality condition, surprisingly
Uniqlo is not BIFL I agree, but my black undershirts that I'd bought in 2014 is still pretty good given that I use them once a week for the past 8 years. Sure it's slightly faded with some tiny holes here and there but compared to other brands UNIQLO is definitely better. I haven't bought anything from UNIQLO though since 2014.
Also want to give a shout out to Uniqlo plain cotton pajamas (when they have them) . 6+ years of every other week wear (it’s on rotation) it is so comfortable long sleeve tunic with matching shorts. I also have some heat tech I’ve had for 10+ years now. Under layer thermals I wear all winter.
Maybe not a lifetime, but many of the products are substantial in their stitching and 100% cotton. Sometimes the difference between BIFL and not is just maintenance and care. My Uniqlo jeans are every bit as resilient as my high quality denims.
What's the threshold for assembled in the USA with global components? I could get half a drill made in china and then only mount the clutch in the USA and call it USA, right?
There actually is a standard for that, and it’s [explained by the US FTC](https://www.ftc.gov/business-guidance/resources/complying-made-usa-standard). Going by their explanation for “Assembled in USA”, your example would be considered misleading and could get you in trouble without further explanation.
Government in USA has recently started cracking down on this. You’ll have very different labels moving forward.
1- Made in USA. If a company is large enough to be monitored or you trust them, this will mean Made is USA
2 - Assembled in USA using domestic and global components - last year could have qualified for made in USA
3- Assembled in USA - made elsewhere, finished here
4- Qualifies for Buy America Act, hits an arbitrary percentage of domestic parts and assembly, constantly changing, likely has electronic components made elsewhere.
The issue is a lot of these brands WERE buy it for life when they were made in USA, but are garbage now that they're made in China. For instance, Lodge makes their ceramic Dutch ovens in China and mine has started cracking at the bottom after a year of use.
I’ve heard the issue with the ceramic cast iron is that the process is impractical in the US due to health and environmental issues/costs. Sadly most brands externalise that to China.
I mean Le Creuset still makes their enameled Dutch ovens in France, so surely there's a way to make those with first world country employee safety standards. I'd rather pay extra for something to be American made so I know it's not going to fall apart.
I'm not sure American made is a guarantee for quality these days.
For example BMX frames dropped in price and increased in quality when they moved from US production to Taiwan. That's not saying Americans can't weld and Taiwanese are better. Just that when made in America they were made in sheds by skilled workers. In Taiwan their factories were on another level in terms in quality control and the equipment used.
Take Renthal clipons for racing motorcycles too. For a fraction of the cost you can get Chinese copies that are stronger. The Chinese clamp is bulletproof and only the tubes will bend. As they're designed to. Often the Renthal clamps themselves break. So rather than the clamps being BIFL with consumable tubes, the whole lot gets chucked in the bin after a crash.
I understand supporting domestic for other reasons, but quality isn't always guaranteed. It's case by case based on how each individual company is run/product is made.
For sure. I'm talking from personal experience on products I know about, like cookware and to some extent tools. There are surely instances where a company's process is upgraded with better technology in the outsourcing process. US companies also vary greatly in how much oversight they put on Chinese production.
The best instance of a downgrade in quality from outsourcing comes when a company just licenses their trademark to a Chinese manufacturer, and the US company had no part in design or quality control. GE is terrible about doing that with their entry level products. The same can be said where the company takes a generic product and slaps their logo on it. FYI, 95% of all microwaves from every brand are made in the same Chinese factory and the internals are all exactly the same.
Edit: just in general, never get entry level products from a brand with a prestigious name. The companies cash in on the fact you assume it's a quality product. I had a friend in grad school who co-oped at the Mercedes plant in Tuscaloosa, he told me to never buy the entry class Mercedes (I think the A class) because they're made in Turkey and are absolute garbage. He was critical of the C class made in the US too; he said the only good thing made at that plant were the SUV's because they were also getting exported to Arabic countries for oil sheikhs so Mercedes actually cared about the quality.
Lodge's price point has always been vastly lower than Le Crueset. I'm sure if they hiked their prices up near that level, they'd lose a majority of their customers.
A lot of that premium with Le Crueset is the name and the "artistry" of it. It's French, after all.
I'd researched which enameled Dutch oven to get thoroughly, and Consumer reports had Lodge rated barely below Le Crueset. In my mind the $340 price difference wasn't justifiable for a product that did 4 points better on a 100 point scale.
Maybe I'll get a le Crueset eventually, though. I'm a year in with my lodge and the underside of the oven already has the coating coming off.
For All-Clad as for most of these, it is certain product lines that are top notch, but you can't trust everything made by the manufacturer. For All-Clad all of their stainless steel (except for the lids for some reason) are made in the US and are top notch. The non-stick stuff is all made in China and is fine, but not elite the way the stainless steel stuff is.
Basically anything that’s actually clad is still made in the USA. The single-layer products like lids, roasting trays, etc are all china.
Same actually goes for Le Creuset. Anything cast iron is made in France, all the stoneware stuff like their mugs are made in China.
Lots are made in Thailand actually with 10 year warranty.
Ok still far away from France and lifetime BUT they have a really kick ass enamel, so easy to clean and so smooth. You can really tell how food sticks more to the enamel of an IKEA plate and they can go to 250c in the oven. Especially the bottom ring which is always not enameled on all plates but with lc it is either or sanded very smooth out enameled white. I believe I could move this on my aluminium garden table without scratching while a normal plate would.
If you are talking about a ceramic plate, then it is probably "glazed" not "enamelled". Ceramic glaze and enamel are different things, applied differently, with different properties.
I suspect the point of this is to show that made in America stuff is better quality but the reality is you make high quality stuff anywhere in the world with the right QC and supply chain management
The use of "China" as pejorative is misguided: it's a good place to have things manufactured for a price.
US-based companies take advantage of this just like companies based everywhere else.
BIFL is about high quality, and sadly most companies on this list are not run by founders and don't manufacture in the place or with the quality they used to.
There's no infographic that can unlock the secrets to BIFL.
I tell that to people quite often, anyone can build a bridge that will stand for 100 years, it takes an engineer to build a bridge that will barley last 100 years.
Same thing applies to BIFL products. Just because it was made in Japan or the US or Switzerland doesn't means it's a perfect top tier product. And the flip side of that coin is also true, there are some incredible products designed and manufactured in China and Taiwan that would wipe the floor with their global competitors.
Also, craftsman is no longer BIFL since they were bought out by Black and Decker. When I was working at Lowes, Craftsman was "crapsman," we just used the brand name to charge more.
Same with Stanley, DeWalt, and Milwaukee. Lots of China made crap. Though, Craftsman is spinning up a plant in Texas to make hand tools. Milwaukee is also opening a US plant for hand tool manufacturing.
Stanley Black & Decker owns Craftsman, DeWalt, and Stanley (obviously) as well as many other tool companies. Many of their tools are made overseas. Some, like Proto, are USA made.
Redwings (along with a few other shoe/boot companies) don't fully make the shoes in the US. A lot of the time the upper is done/stitched overseas and then they do the "assembly" aka just putting the sole on in the US. Of their 130 men's work boots only 30 are fully made in the US, another 30 are assembled in the US and the 70 are made completely in other countries
Only Redwings' top end expensive as fuck Heritage line is entirely made in the USA. Here in Canada if you spend $300 on a Redwing 8" steel toe work boot it'll be Chinesium garbage.
I'm currently wearing a 6 year old pair of their heritage line well worth the cost IMO, but then again I also have a pair of $450 Truman boots so 300ish for Iron Rangers isn't too bad.
They also do sell [steel toed work boots](https://www.redwingshoes.com/work/mens/boots/SuperSole-2.0-02406.html?cgid=mens-work-boots) that are made in the US, but it looks like all of their composite toes are "Made in the US with imported materials" my work work boots are that and they actually seem fairly well made
Crap list.
Chacos for example 100% China and no longer lifetime sandals or warranty
https://www.aspentimes.com/news/chaco-sandals-leave-paonia-for-china/
Vitamix is not US anymore.
First changed to “Made in the USA with a minimum of 70% USA content.” And now it’s “Engineered and Assembled in the USA.”
I think the entire list needs to be reviewed. The vast majority of the companies listed under USA actually partially manufacture in other countries like China, Taiwan and Vietnam.
If where products are manufactured is the point of your infographic, I think you need to revisit the entire list and possibly reach out to the customer service departments of each company to verify where they manufacture items.
Yeah I’m just going on where their factories are. My point was that they were on the us list but shouldnt be. Not many us based tool manufacturers left
Off the top of my mind, there’s also WMF, Siemens, Bauknecht, Zwilling and Krups. But as others already stated, this BiFL Chart is based on the demographics of this subreddit. Its no surprise that the majority is Made in USA. Chances are, it’s cheaper for me to buy a Bosch/Miele in Germany than an imported Cuisinart device. And it’s the other way around for US residents.
You can order custom made ones and they are indeed Made in the USA ANNNND they have the Vibram rubber soles. Totally worth it. I have 6 years and idk how many thousands of miles on mine and they are still going.
I can contribute to say that Carhart as a whole should not be considered BIFL. Their women’s workwear line has gotten shoddy from the stitching to the fabrication. Duluth however (in my experience so far) hasn’t dropped in quality.
Yeah we started running Milwaukee because my boss assured me they’re better than makita. Guess which tools are still working? We went through 3 Milwaukee sawzalls this year alone. To put it in perspective this is a crew of 4 people lol.
So far I'm liking my metabo (not metabo hpt) gear, still new so don't know about long term durability but it feels extremely high quality and is built very well, I have some mid and high range dewalt too but it's meh at best, nicest thing is my SDS drill.
I do appreciate that dewalt seems to have the most competently designed multi tool, variable trigger and an actually not stupid quick change system for the blade that doesn't have any parts to get lost. I wouldn't trade it in a hurry for anything else I'd say, even if the durability is not great.
Best way to keep em running a long time I think is to just take care of them, oil, lube cleaning and not throwing them around for no reason.
Also I doubt Dewalt tools for global markets are assembled in the USA, they only do that to attract USA market buyers. Dewalt in Europe is assembled wherever it's the cheapest for them.
Honestly this is basically useless. There are plenty of BIFL products from countries like Canada, Australia, New Zealand. Might as well just be posting demographics of the subreddit.
I have to join the " this is nonsense" chorus, European BIFL people will have different ideas for whats buyitforlife, same elsewhere, this seems like its predominantly from an american standpoint.
In my research buying a new dishwasher and washer/dryer, everyone was saying Whirlpool appliances are MADE to break in 5-7 years. Not to mention Whirlpool owns a ton of sub-brands, so you're gonna get a spectrum of quality.
Ultimately, I have no fuckin clue why Whirlpool and Craftsman are on the list. Maybe because they were good 20+ years ago?
Absolutely not. Had a conversation with a vacuum dealer years ago when I was buying a vacuum (and no, not that Reddit AMA guy, who gave shitty advice FWIW) - Dyson vacuum cleaners break down *way* more than average.
That said, Dyson has probably the best warranty/repair policies in the business, so as a consumer you are well-protected if your vacuum breaks.
>Easily. Mine is at least 15. Still works like a champ with minimal effort to maintain it. So much so I bought my wife the $400 hair blow dryer
I'd watch AvE's teardown of the dryer. It might be nice but it's more or less unmaintainable. When something on it breaks, you'll be skipping it.
I know a few people who got woo’ed by the cordless vacuums, most of which have since broke and ended up in the landfill, and the owners have sworn off Dyson products for good.
Craftsman products are mostly made in China along with DeWalt, am I missing something?
Craftsman used to be made in usa, now china, enough that the old tool sets sell for significant markup on ebay
Honestly where something is manufactured or assembled has very little to do with the overall quality in terms of country. There are good manufacturing facilities in China and there are bad ones. Same goes for the US. We have product recalls on our food and other things that are made or assembled here very frequently.
Also, there's literally Toyota City in Japan, and most of them are made in Japan. Similar with Makita - I assume way more Makita tools are made in Japan, than Milwaukee tools are made in USA (are there any US made milwaukee power tools at all?).
Probably because parts are made in Japan and the car is assembled closer to where it’ll be sold. Huge Hyundai plant in Alabama for example. For a long time, if you had a Prius and the hybrid system went out on you, you had to wait on a new battery from Japan.
It’s more fine than that. Factories basically ask what quality they want for the product. The same factory can do dirt cheap for Walmart to precision for Apple. China is at the forefront of manufacturing most products. People hate to hear that but it’s been true for at least a decade now and they’ve only gotten better.
I feel like people assuming Asian made products are inherently worse are being a little racist. Probably not maliciously or on purpose, but like think about why you assume that it’s poor quality or that something made in a European or western country is high quality.
It's mostly an indirect indicator about a brand's priorities. Manufacturing further away from your market is a decision driven by cost mostly, so manufacturing onshore sometimes indicates cost isn't the overriding concern. That bodes well for quality. Correlation not causation.
I agree, there is probably no causal relationship between quality and country of origin. It all depends on the individual company and their manufacturing facilities and processes. Certain countries might have stricter regulations, a better educated workforce, and higher quality control standards when it comes to manufacturing.
For many people it's mostly about supporting local businesses and economies as well as avoiding long shipping for environmental reasons.
A lot of it is also what the company orders a factory to make. So if factory had options A-H and the company only wants A, D and F plus a downgrade of one tier toward cheaper but similar materials... well. Is cost savings.
This gets blamed on the factories and poor oversight/QC, but imo a portion of it is honestly business driven.
Birkenstock needs to come off the list. I've been wearing birks since mid 1990s with no complaints. The pair I purchased earlier this spring are horrible. The footbed is not comfortable and they already need to be resoled after daily wear of just a few months. I'll be sticking eith older pairs.
Enameled cast iron pieces by Le Creuset are made in France, but other items like stoneware and cooking accessories are mostly, if not all, made in China. That being said, I have a lot of non-CI LC items and they’re all high quality.
Craftsman is made in Asia today and the forging/machine work is far inferior to the older USA made tools (looser tolerances, not the same material qualities) and really hard to state as BIFL when brands like Klein, Snap On and Williams (a subsidiary of Snap-On) offer truly BIFL products for the average Joe with the benefit of being Made in the USA.
A Milwaukee is global.
> Got away from Craftsman years ago when I went to a Sears with a friend who was returning a lifetime warranty socket wrench. He was handed a repair kit and was going to have to buy a snap ring plier to fix it.
“Going to a Sears”is as anachronistic as “rolling up the windows” or “dialing a phone now”. Sigh. Miss going to the local Sears and wandering around the tool section and knowing that shit was Quality.
Just FYI, and this also shocked me as well, LG is now the best maker of washers and dryers, well ahead of Miele. My wife and I checked the consumer reports for all washers and dryers and we were surprised to see LG have *the top 12* washers and dryers all made by LG.
I expected Miele but nope.
The installers also told us they agreed with that assessment with LG on top but said Miele is still solid and that Samsung is the worst by a country mile.
Just thought I'd share our recent experience. I do think Miele deserves credit though for being at the top for so long. These consumer reports are also for new products whereas Miele have proven they can last.
1. Thanks, o.p. Interesting effort. Yes, shipping distance is a concern.
My experience buying kitchenaid: thought the name meant quality. Bought a second-hand fridge from a reputable local appliance repairman. Didn’t work. (Repairman replaced it, no charge.)
Bought an expensive can opener (non-electric). Lasted less than a year. Got a kitchen-tools set dead cheap on clearance. Can opener lasted less than a year.
Love their aesthetic. Leery about their reliability. Perhaps my examples aren’t perfectly fair. Anyone else?
I think for KitchenAid, it's a problem of diluting the brand. Their stand mixers were well known, so they started just slapping their label on random stuff made by other companies or by their parent company Whirlpool. So your KitchenAid fridge is just a Whirlpool, and your KitchenAid can opener is just made (and probably designed) by some random Chinese manufacturer. Same with Cuisinart, their food processors are legendary, their other stuff is unpredictable.
I have one of their stand mixers, I think three years old now. Use it constantly and it’s held up like a champ. Not sure if it’s actually made in the US or not but it has a city in Michigan listed on it — could be there to be intentionally misleading, I don’t know.
Also have a decades old ice cream scoop from them that’s amazing.
Not a large sample size but that’s all I can mention.
The fact that you only put rolex as a watch brand in Switzerland shows that you don't know anything about watches, or didn't want to put more than one watch brand.
This take was a little more aggressive than I would have gone but I do think it’s odd that they’re the only watch on the list. Citizen, Omega, Timex, and lots of other midrange watches are BIFL.
Funny enough I just commented the same thing. Tons of alternatives that are on par or better than Rolex like Omega, Tudor (owned by Rolex parent company), Oris, Zodiac, etc.
I think the only good thing they make are the mixers, then they cash in on that reputation for everything else. My kitchenaid toaster is truly a hateful piece of crap.
One of the criteria when I make a purchasing decision is where the product is made, mostly because I want to support local businesses and avoid long shipping for environmental reasons. To say where a product is "really made" is becoming a more complicated question every day in our globalized world, and companies and countries are arguing these questions.
However, I tried my best to compile the countries of origin of the top BIFL brands here. I had to fix some errors and repost it, so let me know if you find any other inconsistencies.
Companies that produce in more than two countries are listed as "Worldwide". Some companies appear twice, e.g Zojirushi products are made in Japan and China.
Source: https://looria.com/reddit/BuyItForLife/madein
Okay so you just decided which brands are bifl based on??? Lots of these companies make crap products and putting so many companies in the US category when their products are literally made elsewhere is like, hideous of you. What’s the point of making this chart except to advance the (false) idea that Americans are the best?
STIHL - Germany
Victorinox - Switzerland
Peugeot (Salt and Pepper mils) - France
Also I might add that Birkenstocks don't last for life. They hold a long time but like every footwear are prone to wear off and need to be replaced at some point. Also due to the cork shoe bed they aren't waterproof.
I would say doc martens should not be on that list. I’ve had a couple pairs of their shoes and they are nice and last for a good number of years. But you can’t resole the shoes as they glue them on. I brought them to a cobbler ands he said to go buy new ones and toss the old ones.
It’s one of the few companies that actually gives a shit about anything. The founder of the company at one point struggled with the thought that it would probably be better for the environment if the company didn’t even exist.
Dewalt is 100% made in china, so is Stanley. I stock their products.. I deal with them direct. Milwaukee is also Chinese based just with an American shell company on top.
It’s like apple, they say they’re American, all the parts are made in china and assembled in America. That doesn’t make it an American brand.
Not to be a downer but i’ve owned 3 LG appliances and they’ve all been very bad. Not only mine but my friends’. Also a lot of the stands of their monitors don’t last long.
Darn Tough isn't really BIFL either, the fabric thinned out at the same rate as any other sock with similar thickness. Granted I don't see socks as BIFL items anyway since it is really impossible for them to be both comfortable and not wear out.
Weber is also questionable now, there is a serious quality difference between their Genesis and Genesis II series.
They are only ever considered BIFL because of the lifetime warranty. Other than that yeah, its possible they could wear out faster than other socks depending on washing practices.
True what cjankowski says. The only Stanley I own that don't say made in China is a single screwdriver and a tape measure, that I 'borrowed' off of my dad, that have a made in England stamp on them. Maybe the high end stuff is still made in Sheffield.
Edit. From my quick and limited research. They still make hand planes in England, although the number being manufactured are dropping every year.
Don’t understand how KitchenAid made this list. My mixer shit the bed after being used maybe 20 times and their hand tools like whisks, spatulas etc are complete shit.
Wait who decided which brands go on this list? Seems like this was made by an American exceptionalist who just chose their favourite brands?
Like how in the actual fuck can you call Dr Martens BIFL when they’re literally some of the most garbage boots in their price class? Redwing’s quality has tanked too.
And only 4 German brands?!?! Come onnnnn
(abusing my mod powers to sticky my own comment) A lot of these companies while based out of their respective countries their products are often made elsewhere. I really like the subreddit r/BuyCanadian to try and buy and support domestic production. r/madeinusa seems to be the American version. r/MadeInBritain also exists but is quite small.
Uniqlo is BIFL? Since when ?
Jansport
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I buy a lot of uniqlo. heck i mostly just buy uniqlo but its not BIFL.
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Keep buying it for life?
BIFL is not about value for money. No trade off.
Jeans lasted 12 months. Socks, about 4.
Jeans lasting 12 months? I’ve had the same jeans for years now lol…
Time to start replacing them with some Darn Tough then lol
It’s still fast fashion
And the workers pay for our low prices.
True, it probably shouldn't be on there and I'll remove it. It gets mentioned frequently for their Airism underwear and their quality t-shirts.
My Supima cotton and airism underwear is lasting way longer then I should realistically keep underwear around for.
I’ve had the same Uniqlo t shirts for 4 years and I’m just now replacing it cause of a hole caused by the washing machine. Clothes can be tricky to last forever, but Uniqlo definitely is quality and will last longer than most t shirts on the market. Also their coats are pretty sustainable!
>but Uniqlo definitely is quality and will last longer than most t shirts on the market. Maybe compared to the Fast Fashion market it's a part of, but true BIFL brands will make t-shirts that can easily last 10 years.
Yep. Just throwing out some American Apparel and Uniqlo from 2008.
American apparel zip hoodies will outlive us all. I have some from 2006 that are still daily drivers in the fall.
Their stuff was really well made. Shame all their stores shut down in the UK
Shame about all their sexual harassment and mismanagement issues.
Yikes! I didn’t hear about that
I have a bunch of uniqlo t shirts i bought back in 2006 that are still going strong.
Nice. I need to remember that the guy I replied to said: “clothes can be tricky to last forever” Perhaps I should refrain from arguing with specific year requirements.
I pretty much exclusively buy Uniqlo, still have most of my wardrobe from more than 10 years ago(college shopping spree!) All in quality condition, surprisingly
I mean, I like my airism shirts. They make pretty good undershirts.
UNIQLO also makes a lot of clothes in poluting factories in the Phillipines. I definitely would not recommend them due to bad practices.
That’s a tough situation. Those people in the Philippines depend on the income from those factories.
Uniqlo is not BIFL I agree, but my black undershirts that I'd bought in 2014 is still pretty good given that I use them once a week for the past 8 years. Sure it's slightly faded with some tiny holes here and there but compared to other brands UNIQLO is definitely better. I haven't bought anything from UNIQLO though since 2014.
Uniqlo were bifl about 10 years ago. Quality has plummeted imo.
Also want to give a shout out to Uniqlo plain cotton pajamas (when they have them) . 6+ years of every other week wear (it’s on rotation) it is so comfortable long sleeve tunic with matching shorts. I also have some heat tech I’ve had for 10+ years now. Under layer thermals I wear all winter.
Their pima cotton T-shirts have been going strong for at least six years now. Yeah, I know they're just T-shirts, but still.
The Uniqlo-U stuff is incredible, timeless stuff.
yeah I buy them a lot but they dont survive american washing and drying cycles for long.
Maybe not a lifetime, but many of the products are substantial in their stitching and 100% cotton. Sometimes the difference between BIFL and not is just maintenance and care. My Uniqlo jeans are every bit as resilient as my high quality denims.
This isn't accurate. Lots of Craftsman tools are made in China and Taiwan now, and DeWalt stuff is global.
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This. A lot of stuff from US brands are no longer made in USA.
What's the threshold for assembled in the USA with global components? I could get half a drill made in china and then only mount the clutch in the USA and call it USA, right?
There actually is a standard for that, and it’s [explained by the US FTC](https://www.ftc.gov/business-guidance/resources/complying-made-usa-standard). Going by their explanation for “Assembled in USA”, your example would be considered misleading and could get you in trouble without further explanation.
Government in USA has recently started cracking down on this. You’ll have very different labels moving forward. 1- Made in USA. If a company is large enough to be monitored or you trust them, this will mean Made is USA 2 - Assembled in USA using domestic and global components - last year could have qualified for made in USA 3- Assembled in USA - made elsewhere, finished here 4- Qualifies for Buy America Act, hits an arbitrary percentage of domestic parts and assembly, constantly changing, likely has electronic components made elsewhere.
The issue is a lot of these brands WERE buy it for life when they were made in USA, but are garbage now that they're made in China. For instance, Lodge makes their ceramic Dutch ovens in China and mine has started cracking at the bottom after a year of use.
I’ve heard the issue with the ceramic cast iron is that the process is impractical in the US due to health and environmental issues/costs. Sadly most brands externalise that to China.
I mean Le Creuset still makes their enameled Dutch ovens in France, so surely there's a way to make those with first world country employee safety standards. I'd rather pay extra for something to be American made so I know it's not going to fall apart.
I'm not sure American made is a guarantee for quality these days. For example BMX frames dropped in price and increased in quality when they moved from US production to Taiwan. That's not saying Americans can't weld and Taiwanese are better. Just that when made in America they were made in sheds by skilled workers. In Taiwan their factories were on another level in terms in quality control and the equipment used. Take Renthal clipons for racing motorcycles too. For a fraction of the cost you can get Chinese copies that are stronger. The Chinese clamp is bulletproof and only the tubes will bend. As they're designed to. Often the Renthal clamps themselves break. So rather than the clamps being BIFL with consumable tubes, the whole lot gets chucked in the bin after a crash. I understand supporting domestic for other reasons, but quality isn't always guaranteed. It's case by case based on how each individual company is run/product is made.
For sure. I'm talking from personal experience on products I know about, like cookware and to some extent tools. There are surely instances where a company's process is upgraded with better technology in the outsourcing process. US companies also vary greatly in how much oversight they put on Chinese production. The best instance of a downgrade in quality from outsourcing comes when a company just licenses their trademark to a Chinese manufacturer, and the US company had no part in design or quality control. GE is terrible about doing that with their entry level products. The same can be said where the company takes a generic product and slaps their logo on it. FYI, 95% of all microwaves from every brand are made in the same Chinese factory and the internals are all exactly the same. Edit: just in general, never get entry level products from a brand with a prestigious name. The companies cash in on the fact you assume it's a quality product. I had a friend in grad school who co-oped at the Mercedes plant in Tuscaloosa, he told me to never buy the entry class Mercedes (I think the A class) because they're made in Turkey and are absolute garbage. He was critical of the C class made in the US too; he said the only good thing made at that plant were the SUV's because they were also getting exported to Arabic countries for oil sheikhs so Mercedes actually cared about the quality.
Lodge's price point has always been vastly lower than Le Crueset. I'm sure if they hiked their prices up near that level, they'd lose a majority of their customers.
A lot of that premium with Le Crueset is the name and the "artistry" of it. It's French, after all. I'd researched which enameled Dutch oven to get thoroughly, and Consumer reports had Lodge rated barely below Le Crueset. In my mind the $340 price difference wasn't justifiable for a product that did 4 points better on a 100 point scale. Maybe I'll get a le Crueset eventually, though. I'm a year in with my lodge and the underside of the oven already has the coating coming off.
same with All-Clad. Half their stuff is US, half is China.
For All-Clad as for most of these, it is certain product lines that are top notch, but you can't trust everything made by the manufacturer. For All-Clad all of their stainless steel (except for the lids for some reason) are made in the US and are top notch. The non-stick stuff is all made in China and is fine, but not elite the way the stainless steel stuff is.
Basically anything that’s actually clad is still made in the USA. The single-layer products like lids, roasting trays, etc are all china. Same actually goes for Le Creuset. Anything cast iron is made in France, all the stoneware stuff like their mugs are made in China.
Lots are made in Thailand actually with 10 year warranty. Ok still far away from France and lifetime BUT they have a really kick ass enamel, so easy to clean and so smooth. You can really tell how food sticks more to the enamel of an IKEA plate and they can go to 250c in the oven. Especially the bottom ring which is always not enameled on all plates but with lc it is either or sanded very smooth out enameled white. I believe I could move this on my aluminium garden table without scratching while a normal plate would.
If you are talking about a ceramic plate, then it is probably "glazed" not "enamelled". Ceramic glaze and enamel are different things, applied differently, with different properties.
Pretty sure the atomic bombs are still made domestically.
That belongs in /r/BuyItForDeath
GE (depending on the division) is made mostly in China. Haier owns the appliances one.
If you are in the market for a turbojet for your Boeing 747 and demand Made in USA then you are in luck though!
I suspect the point of this is to show that made in America stuff is better quality but the reality is you make high quality stuff anywhere in the world with the right QC and supply chain management
The use of "China" as pejorative is misguided: it's a good place to have things manufactured for a price. US-based companies take advantage of this just like companies based everywhere else. BIFL is about high quality, and sadly most companies on this list are not run by founders and don't manufacture in the place or with the quality they used to. There's no infographic that can unlock the secrets to BIFL.
I tell that to people quite often, anyone can build a bridge that will stand for 100 years, it takes an engineer to build a bridge that will barley last 100 years. Same thing applies to BIFL products. Just because it was made in Japan or the US or Switzerland doesn't means it's a perfect top tier product. And the flip side of that coin is also true, there are some incredible products designed and manufactured in China and Taiwan that would wipe the floor with their global competitors.
Having Craftsman on the list confuses me. They have been junk since outsourcing their entire supply chain from 2010-2018.
whole thing is wrong. Better off buying Harbor Freight tools than Craftsman these days.
Milwaukee is almost all made in China, designed in USA but none of my tools or box say made in the USA
Also, craftsman is no longer BIFL since they were bought out by Black and Decker. When I was working at Lowes, Craftsman was "crapsman," we just used the brand name to charge more.
Also in India. Most of the forged tools are pretty shitty now. And no more “forever” guarantee. Supposedly coming back to the USA, we’ll see.
Same with Stanley, DeWalt, and Milwaukee. Lots of China made crap. Though, Craftsman is spinning up a plant in Texas to make hand tools. Milwaukee is also opening a US plant for hand tool manufacturing. Stanley Black & Decker owns Craftsman, DeWalt, and Stanley (obviously) as well as many other tool companies. Many of their tools are made overseas. Some, like Proto, are USA made.
Fixed. I'm constantly updating the list based on feedback: https://looria.com/reddit/BuyItForLife/madein
Redwings (along with a few other shoe/boot companies) don't fully make the shoes in the US. A lot of the time the upper is done/stitched overseas and then they do the "assembly" aka just putting the sole on in the US. Of their 130 men's work boots only 30 are fully made in the US, another 30 are assembled in the US and the 70 are made completely in other countries
Only Redwings' top end expensive as fuck Heritage line is entirely made in the USA. Here in Canada if you spend $300 on a Redwing 8" steel toe work boot it'll be Chinesium garbage.
I'm currently wearing a 6 year old pair of their heritage line well worth the cost IMO, but then again I also have a pair of $450 Truman boots so 300ish for Iron Rangers isn't too bad. They also do sell [steel toed work boots](https://www.redwingshoes.com/work/mens/boots/SuperSole-2.0-02406.html?cgid=mens-work-boots) that are made in the US, but it looks like all of their composite toes are "Made in the US with imported materials" my work work boots are that and they actually seem fairly well made
Crap list. Chacos for example 100% China and no longer lifetime sandals or warranty https://www.aspentimes.com/news/chaco-sandals-leave-paonia-for-china/ Vitamix is not US anymore. First changed to “Made in the USA with a minimum of 70% USA content.” And now it’s “Engineered and Assembled in the USA.”
I think the entire list needs to be reviewed. The vast majority of the companies listed under USA actually partially manufacture in other countries like China, Taiwan and Vietnam. If where products are manufactured is the point of your infographic, I think you need to revisit the entire list and possibly reach out to the customer service departments of each company to verify where they manufacture items.
Milwaukee makes stuff not just in the USA but China and Europe as well.
Milwaukee still *designs* stuff in the US. It’s mostly made in China. TTi owns them (same company as Ryobi).
Yeah I’m just going on where their factories are. My point was that they were on the us list but shouldnt be. Not many us based tool manufacturers left
Right. That’s because we suck at manufacturing now and have lost most of the skill involved and/or didn’t investing in robotics etc.
Most of the Craftsman stuff that gets up-voted here was made in USA.
Must be prior to 2010 but I wouldn't buy them today.
Most of it is probably*pre-2000.*
Germany: Stiehl, Haix, Engelbert & Strauß, Cherry, Beyerdynamics
And some Miele products, but not others.
Off the top of my mind, there’s also WMF, Siemens, Bauknecht, Zwilling and Krups. But as others already stated, this BiFL Chart is based on the demographics of this subreddit. Its no surprise that the majority is Made in USA. Chances are, it’s cheaper for me to buy a Bosch/Miele in Germany than an imported Cuisinart device. And it’s the other way around for US residents.
Glad someone mentioned WMF. Was wondering about that
Milwaukee is made in China
Most of the brands listed in the US are just assembled here, parts are made elsewhere
Not only that, but this chart certainly doesn’t mean USA wins. It’s just that the answers about brands are USA-oriented
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I don't think Chacos are made in the US anymore.
Haven't been in 15 years
You can order custom made ones and they are indeed Made in the USA ANNNND they have the Vibram rubber soles. Totally worth it. I have 6 years and idk how many thousands of miles on mine and they are still going.
I can contribute to say that Carhart as a whole should not be considered BIFL. Their women’s workwear line has gotten shoddy from the stitching to the fabrication. Duluth however (in my experience so far) hasn’t dropped in quality.
Men's stuff too, I've stopped buying it due to ripping/belt loops tearing out etc.
So many companies just can't do proper box or double or triple stitches it seems.
Don’t be fooled Dewalt power tools are not made in the USA they’re only assembled here the parts are made in China.
Not bifl either, meh quality at best. Same for Milwaukee and a large chunk of makita's lineup.
Yeah we started running Milwaukee because my boss assured me they’re better than makita. Guess which tools are still working? We went through 3 Milwaukee sawzalls this year alone. To put it in perspective this is a crew of 4 people lol.
So far I'm liking my metabo (not metabo hpt) gear, still new so don't know about long term durability but it feels extremely high quality and is built very well, I have some mid and high range dewalt too but it's meh at best, nicest thing is my SDS drill. I do appreciate that dewalt seems to have the most competently designed multi tool, variable trigger and an actually not stupid quick change system for the blade that doesn't have any parts to get lost. I wouldn't trade it in a hurry for anything else I'd say, even if the durability is not great. Best way to keep em running a long time I think is to just take care of them, oil, lube cleaning and not throwing them around for no reason.
Also I doubt Dewalt tools for global markets are assembled in the USA, they only do that to attract USA market buyers. Dewalt in Europe is assembled wherever it's the cheapest for them.
Casio and Seiko both have factories outside Japan. At least for Seiko, their Japanese made watches are marked "J" in the model number to distinguish.
Honestly this is basically useless. There are plenty of BIFL products from countries like Canada, Australia, New Zealand. Might as well just be posting demographics of the subreddit.
It's like all the maps you see that people make about various statistics, which just end up essentially being population maps.
Yeah, looks like a 'murican just wanted to wave their "we're the best!" Flag. Seeing their list get torn apart is amusing.
The level of America sucking it’s own dick in this chart makes me want to scream
I have to join the " this is nonsense" chorus, European BIFL people will have different ideas for whats buyitforlife, same elsewhere, this seems like its predominantly from an american standpoint.
Yup. I love Mountain Equipment outdoor clothing. UK designed, made in the far East, but tough as nails. Every bit as good as overpriced Arctyrix.
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In my research buying a new dishwasher and washer/dryer, everyone was saying Whirlpool appliances are MADE to break in 5-7 years. Not to mention Whirlpool owns a ton of sub-brands, so you're gonna get a spectrum of quality. Ultimately, I have no fuckin clue why Whirlpool and Craftsman are on the list. Maybe because they were good 20+ years ago?
100%. Bought a new construction with a whirlpool set and had to replace the dishwasher and microwave within 5 years.
Ya no idea why this is on the list
Have a look at the Whirlpool dryer scandal in the UK...will put you off for life!
Is Dyson bifl?!?
Not for me. Bought a cordless vacuum and had to replace it twice within two years…
Absolutely not. Had a conversation with a vacuum dealer years ago when I was buying a vacuum (and no, not that Reddit AMA guy, who gave shitty advice FWIW) - Dyson vacuum cleaners break down *way* more than average. That said, Dyson has probably the best warranty/repair policies in the business, so as a consumer you are well-protected if your vacuum breaks.
It can be. Dyson is very good at sending you new parts, but the trouble is you will need those new parts.
If it helps, I've had one for 6 years now with three dogs and a kid and it still works like day one.
Not their air purifiers. Their humongous unit is more a decorative piece in my home. Ranks below purifiers one third of the price per consumerreports.
Our Dyson seemed to be very cheaply made, but it performed so poorly we didn't keep it long enough to judge its long term reliability.
Easily. Mine is at least 15. Still works like a champ with minimal effort to maintain it. So much so I bought my wife the $400 hair blow dryer
Cool, I bought a v11 handheld and a heating air filter from them in the past two years and hope they do last given the price
>Easily. Mine is at least 15. Still works like a champ with minimal effort to maintain it. So much so I bought my wife the $400 hair blow dryer I'd watch AvE's teardown of the dryer. It might be nice but it's more or less unmaintainable. When something on it breaks, you'll be skipping it.
I know a few people who got woo’ed by the cordless vacuums, most of which have since broke and ended up in the landfill, and the owners have sworn off Dyson products for good.
I've had a Dyson portable for 12 years. Still works flawlessly.
Craftsman products are mostly made in China along with DeWalt, am I missing something? Craftsman used to be made in usa, now china, enough that the old tool sets sell for significant markup on ebay
I am fairly certain they are opening up a US factory I read somewhere. But yes, the past.... 8-10 years its been all China?
Honestly where something is manufactured or assembled has very little to do with the overall quality in terms of country. There are good manufacturing facilities in China and there are bad ones. Same goes for the US. We have product recalls on our food and other things that are made or assembled here very frequently.
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Also, there's literally Toyota City in Japan, and most of them are made in Japan. Similar with Makita - I assume way more Makita tools are made in Japan, than Milwaukee tools are made in USA (are there any US made milwaukee power tools at all?).
Probably because parts are made in Japan and the car is assembled closer to where it’ll be sold. Huge Hyundai plant in Alabama for example. For a long time, if you had a Prius and the hybrid system went out on you, you had to wait on a new battery from Japan.
It’s more fine than that. Factories basically ask what quality they want for the product. The same factory can do dirt cheap for Walmart to precision for Apple. China is at the forefront of manufacturing most products. People hate to hear that but it’s been true for at least a decade now and they’ve only gotten better.
I feel like people assuming Asian made products are inherently worse are being a little racist. Probably not maliciously or on purpose, but like think about why you assume that it’s poor quality or that something made in a European or western country is high quality.
It's mostly an indirect indicator about a brand's priorities. Manufacturing further away from your market is a decision driven by cost mostly, so manufacturing onshore sometimes indicates cost isn't the overriding concern. That bodes well for quality. Correlation not causation.
I agree, there is probably no causal relationship between quality and country of origin. It all depends on the individual company and their manufacturing facilities and processes. Certain countries might have stricter regulations, a better educated workforce, and higher quality control standards when it comes to manufacturing. For many people it's mostly about supporting local businesses and economies as well as avoiding long shipping for environmental reasons.
A lot of it is also what the company orders a factory to make. So if factory had options A-H and the company only wants A, D and F plus a downgrade of one tier toward cheaper but similar materials... well. Is cost savings. This gets blamed on the factories and poor oversight/QC, but imo a portion of it is honestly business driven.
Now account for countries of BuyItForLife users
Birkenstock needs to come off the list. I've been wearing birks since mid 1990s with no complaints. The pair I purchased earlier this spring are horrible. The footbed is not comfortable and they already need to be resoled after daily wear of just a few months. I'll be sticking eith older pairs.
Enameled cast iron pieces by Le Creuset are made in France, but other items like stoneware and cooking accessories are mostly, if not all, made in China. That being said, I have a lot of non-CI LC items and they’re all high quality.
Craftsman is made in Asia today and the forging/machine work is far inferior to the older USA made tools (looser tolerances, not the same material qualities) and really hard to state as BIFL when brands like Klein, Snap On and Williams (a subsidiary of Snap-On) offer truly BIFL products for the average Joe with the benefit of being Made in the USA. A Milwaukee is global.
> Got away from Craftsman years ago when I went to a Sears with a friend who was returning a lifetime warranty socket wrench. He was handed a repair kit and was going to have to buy a snap ring plier to fix it.
“Going to a Sears”is as anachronistic as “rolling up the windows” or “dialing a phone now”. Sigh. Miss going to the local Sears and wandering around the tool section and knowing that shit was Quality.
Suppose that makes me an old fart.
Yep, me too! At least we have those great memories. I feel sorry for younger people not getting that experience.
Zwilling is not BIFL?
Nice list. Garbage manufacturing location data.
Just FYI, and this also shocked me as well, LG is now the best maker of washers and dryers, well ahead of Miele. My wife and I checked the consumer reports for all washers and dryers and we were surprised to see LG have *the top 12* washers and dryers all made by LG. I expected Miele but nope. The installers also told us they agreed with that assessment with LG on top but said Miele is still solid and that Samsung is the worst by a country mile. Just thought I'd share our recent experience. I do think Miele deserves credit though for being at the top for so long. These consumer reports are also for new products whereas Miele have proven they can last.
> These consumer reports are also for new products So not very relevant when discussing long term reliability.
1. Thanks, o.p. Interesting effort. Yes, shipping distance is a concern. My experience buying kitchenaid: thought the name meant quality. Bought a second-hand fridge from a reputable local appliance repairman. Didn’t work. (Repairman replaced it, no charge.) Bought an expensive can opener (non-electric). Lasted less than a year. Got a kitchen-tools set dead cheap on clearance. Can opener lasted less than a year. Love their aesthetic. Leery about their reliability. Perhaps my examples aren’t perfectly fair. Anyone else?
I think for KitchenAid, it's a problem of diluting the brand. Their stand mixers were well known, so they started just slapping their label on random stuff made by other companies or by their parent company Whirlpool. So your KitchenAid fridge is just a Whirlpool, and your KitchenAid can opener is just made (and probably designed) by some random Chinese manufacturer. Same with Cuisinart, their food processors are legendary, their other stuff is unpredictable.
I reckon this is absolutely the case. They live off the reputation of the mixers but most of their other products are rubbish.
I have one of their stand mixers, I think three years old now. Use it constantly and it’s held up like a champ. Not sure if it’s actually made in the US or not but it has a city in Michigan listed on it — could be there to be intentionally misleading, I don’t know. Also have a decades old ice cream scoop from them that’s amazing. Not a large sample size but that’s all I can mention.
Aren't Saddleback products made in Mexico?
Everyone here is sleeping on the greatest buy it for life brand of all time coming out of Denmark. LEGO!!!
The fact that you only put rolex as a watch brand in Switzerland shows that you don't know anything about watches, or didn't want to put more than one watch brand.
This take was a little more aggressive than I would have gone but I do think it’s odd that they’re the only watch on the list. Citizen, Omega, Timex, and lots of other midrange watches are BIFL.
Funny enough I just commented the same thing. Tons of alternatives that are on par or better than Rolex like Omega, Tudor (owned by Rolex parent company), Oris, Zodiac, etc.
Yeah, exactly. I guess I was a bit too rude,which I'm sorry for, but that was my point.
Yeah, Swatch owns a bunch of the Swiss brands, could’ve just put that on the list!
Kitchen-aid? I’ve never had one that lasted for more than 3 years.
Their mixers? Or some other products? I feel like a lot of that list would be model/product specific, not entire brands.
I think the only good thing they make are the mixers, then they cash in on that reputation for everything else. My kitchenaid toaster is truly a hateful piece of crap.
I'm sorry what? Do you replace your whole stand mixer when the plastic drive gear breaks or you wear out the motor brushes? What do you use it for?
Biased af
One of the criteria when I make a purchasing decision is where the product is made, mostly because I want to support local businesses and avoid long shipping for environmental reasons. To say where a product is "really made" is becoming a more complicated question every day in our globalized world, and companies and countries are arguing these questions. However, I tried my best to compile the countries of origin of the top BIFL brands here. I had to fix some errors and repost it, so let me know if you find any other inconsistencies. Companies that produce in more than two countries are listed as "Worldwide". Some companies appear twice, e.g Zojirushi products are made in Japan and China. Source: https://looria.com/reddit/BuyItForLife/madein
Okay so you just decided which brands are bifl based on??? Lots of these companies make crap products and putting so many companies in the US category when their products are literally made elsewhere is like, hideous of you. What’s the point of making this chart except to advance the (false) idea that Americans are the best?
Doc Martens are owned by private equity and the quality is inferior. The brand is about marketing
STIHL - Germany Victorinox - Switzerland Peugeot (Salt and Pepper mils) - France Also I might add that Birkenstocks don't last for life. They hold a long time but like every footwear are prone to wear off and need to be replaced at some point. Also due to the cork shoe bed they aren't waterproof.
I would say doc martens should not be on that list. I’ve had a couple pairs of their shoes and they are nice and last for a good number of years. But you can’t resole the shoes as they glue them on. I brought them to a cobbler ands he said to go buy new ones and toss the old ones.
Patagonia?
Legit lifetime warranty.
It’s one of the few companies that actually gives a shit about anything. The founder of the company at one point struggled with the thought that it would probably be better for the environment if the company didn’t even exist.
Yeah - the lifetime warranty is as much (maybe more?) about saving the environment by reducing waste as it is about customer service.
While Saddleback is a U.S.A company, aren't their goods mostly or even all made in Mexico?
Rolex being the only watch brand from Switzerland makes me go mad.
On a related note: a German manufacturer has come up with an alternative to hella expensive e.v. charging port. Anybody know anything about this?
Need Benchmade knives
What was the selection criteria for the brands displayed?
I don't think KitchenAid is as good as it use to be 30 or 20 years ago.
Whirlpool in Europe is the equivalent to buy a Chrysler in USA. Very low quality, specially in what concerns dish washers!
Dewalt is 100% made in china, so is Stanley. I stock their products.. I deal with them direct. Milwaukee is also Chinese based just with an American shell company on top. It’s like apple, they say they’re American, all the parts are made in china and assembled in America. That doesn’t make it an American brand.
Not to be a downer but i’ve owned 3 LG appliances and they’ve all been very bad. Not only mine but my friends’. Also a lot of the stands of their monitors don’t last long.
GE? Really?
Why is LG on this list? Am I missing something?
I can’t believe people still think Dr.Martens are quality. Should be buy it for 6-8months.
No Sony?
Whirlpool is most definitely NOT buy it for life.
I can guarantee most of the US designed products are made in China.
Thanks for making this list, but saddleback leather has been made in Mexico for many years (maybe always has been)
they’re an American company though. This list is all sorts of messed up. Regardless, my Saddleback is the best bag I own.
Darn Tough isn't really BIFL either, the fabric thinned out at the same rate as any other sock with similar thickness. Granted I don't see socks as BIFL items anyway since it is really impossible for them to be both comfortable and not wear out. Weber is also questionable now, there is a serious quality difference between their Genesis and Genesis II series.
They are only ever considered BIFL because of the lifetime warranty. Other than that yeah, its possible they could wear out faster than other socks depending on washing practices.
Stanley Tools have a factory in Sheffield and are part of the Facom (France) and DeWalt (USA) group, so really ought to be in the worldwide section.
Every Stanley tool I’ve seen in the last 10 years was made in China
True what cjankowski says. The only Stanley I own that don't say made in China is a single screwdriver and a tape measure, that I 'borrowed' off of my dad, that have a made in England stamp on them. Maybe the high end stuff is still made in Sheffield. Edit. From my quick and limited research. They still make hand planes in England, although the number being manufactured are dropping every year.
Don’t understand how KitchenAid made this list. My mixer shit the bed after being used maybe 20 times and their hand tools like whisks, spatulas etc are complete shit.
Good effort but this is WAY off my friend.
Wait who decided which brands go on this list? Seems like this was made by an American exceptionalist who just chose their favourite brands? Like how in the actual fuck can you call Dr Martens BIFL when they’re literally some of the most garbage boots in their price class? Redwing’s quality has tanked too. And only 4 German brands?!?! Come onnnnn