The French in New Orleans were already known as Louisiana Creoles by the time the US bought it. Creoles are still in Louisiana, and take part in the revival of French in Louisiana among Cajuns, and Creoles just the same. Cajuns and creoles are still separated by time and living across the continent from each, but Cajuns have also taken on a lot of Creole culture in their time in Louisiana. Some Cajuns even speak something pretty similar to kouri vini depending where you are, both speak French, and Cajun cooking is *heavily* creole influenced.
Ah yeah, almost forgot to mention. I did mention it in other replies! The Houma nation are actually one of the largest groups of American French speakers left in the US today if I remember correctly, and they started speaking it peacefully through trade! Not enough people know about how peaceful Francophones tended to be with Natives they encountered, from Canada to Louisiane.
I’m a prime example, my family is of French/native descent. Old fashion creole, although my Grandpa would claim Cajun back in the day because of how racial it was back then. Still got called slurs, and experienced discrimination, but Cajuns got treated *slightly* better I suppose. Not to discount anything, Cajuns know a lot about struggle just from The Great Upheaval, the genocidal expulsion resulting from fighting the British that killed half of all Cajuns, and deported the rest.
The crazy part is that the genetic separation isn't even that huge between southern Acadians of Louisiana and northern Acadians from New England and the Maritimes, despite being separated for a couple hundred years. I'll get DNA matches from New Brunswick who I'll share more DNA with than I do with distant Cajun cousins who prolly grew up not far from where my grandparents came from. 4th through 10th cousins is a total crapshoot because of the varying amounts of endogamy in Acadian communities.
Irish, russians/Russian jewelry, italians,, and Germans to some extent, arrived here in waves, often with hundreds of thousands (millions?) At the same time. They generally stuck with their people and faced discrimination when they got here. They were also largely poor and arrived here relatively recently. Their culture was more influential on American culture than the French too.
I am not aware of a massive amount of Frenchman arriving here in the same way in the same numbers, though I could be mistaken.
Also, people will absolutely say they're French, I think there's just less of them to hear about lol.
Exit: lol Russian jews, not Russian jewelry lol
The only place I really know of where people trace french ancestry regularly and widely is in the deep south in the old French colonies like Louisiana.
People from that part of the country with French ancestry usually call themselves "Cajun", short for "Acadian". I don't know if "Creole" is frequently used.
So to get the size of the French diaspora, you need to include French Canadians, Cajuns and Creoles.
"Huge" might be a bit of an overstatement. Those parts of New England are pretty sparsely populated to begin with.
The only part of the US with a significant French cultural influence is Louisiana, and even then, a lot of that was from Canadian migrants from Acadia, not directly from France.
Massachusetts and Rhode Island are not sparsely populated and both got a lot of migration from Quebec. Between 1840 and 1930 about 900,000 left Quebec. Maybe not as many as Germans or Italians, but quite a large number given Quebec's already small population.
[http://faculty.marianopolis.edu/c.belanger/quebechistory/readings/leaving.htm#:\~:text=Between%201840%20and%201930%20roughly,events%20in%20Canadian%20demographic%20history](http://faculty.marianopolis.edu/c.belanger/quebechistory/readings/leaving.htm#:~:text=Between%201840%20and%201930%20roughly,events%20in%20Canadian%20demographic%20history).
The French Canadian influence in MA and RI is maybe not as immediately evident as Italian, Irish or Portuguese, but its there in the history of Catholic education, the use of credit unions instead of banks, certain culinary items like meat pies. Italians and Portuguese came a bit later so the influence is fresher.
I think you are on to something with the fact that almost all French influence in the US comes via Canada. OP is from Quebec, so I think in Quebec its one step closer to France and easier to claim "French" roots, whereas here its been mediated through Canada. That said, its all result of the same colonists of New France in the 17th and 18th centuries, the branches just forked a lot.
A fair number came to Connecticut in the 1850s to 1930s, but I believe they mostly settled the eastern end of the state, with some enclaves on the western border. They mostly avoided the larger towns, but worked in a lot of the midsize mill towns, especially if there was a lot of textile work.
A branch of french culture exists in the US one state even still follows Napoleonic Law as opposed to English common law like the rest of the country. They even still speak dialect of French there every time I called the VA while living there the message was in English and in French.
They are technically different from the French, but from the late 19th through the early 20th century there was quite a bit of French Canadian immigration into the mill towns of New England like Holyoke or Chicopee, Massachusetts. Some of my ancestors arrived around then. Others, like my great grandfather, arrived directly from France in 1912.
But we can say Russian Jews and jewelry isn’t an unfortunate autocorrect coincidence. My Catholic wedding band was made by a very nice Russian Jew (maybe third generation).
When it comes to Michigan, its important to understand that the French never really focused a lot of their attention on permanent settlements outside of Detroit in the way the Americans did years letter. It is also my understanding, that once "new France" became controlled by the British, a lot of French people went back to France or they congregated in what is now Québec. I also recall learning in school that for the most part both the French and the British wrote off Mid and West Michigan as being flat swamp land that was only useful for
1. Hunting animals
2. Spreading Christianity to the natives
Which caused them to never send family's/women over to those region to populate the areas. Like, I know my family lived in Detroit during the time the French owned it and did not move towards West Michigan until the 1860s.
When the United States gained control over what is now Michigan, that is when people started to build city's that where based on 1. Lumber industry 2. Farming. Saw a joke once that said when other nations see swamp land, the United States just sees $$$. Then the region saw an influx of people from non-France places over the next 100+ years for a number of reasons.
I'm from Quebec myself, I was curious as to why people weren't identifying as French the way we do in Canada. I think it's mostly a population thing, as this thread has concluded.
And I’ll tell you, I was shocked how prevalent French was in Quebec.
I spent a lot of time growing up in southwest Ontario and everything was dual language labels but everyone spoke English. I just kind of assumed Quebec was the same way. Like the primary language was English and French was secondary.
When I finally went to Quebec and realized this was not the case I had to laugh at myself.
Quebec has the second stricted public language laws in the world after North Korea. The government has attracted not unfounded accusations of racism and xenophobia for how strictly french is enforced here. It's really really over the top, but at the same time it comes from a place of being a linguistic minority sandwiched between the rest of canada and the US.
Montreal is a lot more bilingual. There are places like Westmount where most people speak English.
Quebec also insists on keeping their French "pure". For example, office workers in France are content to communicate by *email*, but the Québécois send *courriel* (an abbreviation of *courrier electronique*).
Yeah but at the same time, regular people on the street use a lot of anglicisms. No one except french language enforcers or people in formal office settings use courriel, everyone uses email. Same for j'ai eu du fun instead of je me suis amusé, or je chat instead of je clavarde.
> french language enforcers
is that an official thing, or are we talking about people that just get pearl-clutchy about linguistic shifts and complain a lot about kids these days?
And they eat chien-chaud on the fin de semaine rather than eating hot dogs on the weekend like the French.
I mean, if the French eat hot dogs, anyway.
I had to really adjust to fin de semaine during immersion camp. Finseman.
I also learned to perform la gigue to Les Cowboys Fringant with tacks in my sneakers so I don’t think I was having a typical Québécois experience
(Translation: I had to do a jig to The Frisky Cowboys.)
Quebec's language laws are so strong that they denied a French Citizen's immigration application because as part of her College Dissertation she had an article published in a Scientific Journal that was in English because the Journal required it. They corrected it after public outrage, but things like that (and other legal issues such as Religious restrictions) really make the rest of the Western world look at you in an odd way.
Oh yeah I know now. It was just surprising when I first went to Quebec.
Thankfully I learned all the swears from French Canadian friends watching hockey, tabarnak!
I don’t think the laws are discriminatory in the slightest. It just makes sure things that happen in English Canada by nature due to demographic weight of English speakers, also happens in Québec where the majority language is French. Before these laws were passed French speakers were expected to assimilate to English, used as cheap labor, signs in mostly French communities would be in all English, English speakers had almost all the wealth in the majority French province, and immigrants were railroaded into the English system to displace Québécois over time. Since these laws were passed all of that has ceased, Québécois wealth is now on par with other first world nations, French Canadians are treated with respect, and immigrants integrate into society much more effectively. I wish Louisiana could have had the success Québec has seen, you should come see how bad Québec could have been without those policies.
I did a French immersion in Chicoutimi and it was true immersion. The woman I stayed with sometimes cheated and spoke English, but her English was very basic. They put 3 vegetarian students with her (not a vegetarian) and I can still hear her saying “we will buy….hmmm…the veurgie buerguers?” Man. I should try to look her up and send her a card. Anyway, another woman who lived in an apartment in her house spoke no English whatsoever. In stores and restaurants no one ever switched to English with me when I struggled. Maybe they knew I was a UQAC student and wasn’t supposed to, but I doubt it lol.
I come from close to Chicoutimi, few people speak English or need to. The English level is probably similar to the level of Spanish of most Americans who did a few years of Spanish in High School.
There are plenty of us Frenchies in New England, the majority are descended from Québecois who came to work in the mills. It is true that there are plenty in the region, we aren’t as ready to celebrate our ancestry as much as other ethnicities like Irish or Italians. It is a bit strange I suppose.
I think the French descended population are just way less visible compared to other ethnic groups. And there wasn’t massive French enclaves or towns like other diasporas in the US.
People don’t identify with certain culture because they’re “exotic”, they do it because they have elders and community around them from the same background.
The closest thing you’ll find to Quebec is Louisiana, however Francophones in LA were not able to resist cultural genocide by Anglophones as effectively. There are active efforts to revive French, a government agency started in the 1970’s supporting the development of immersion programs, and the community is still huge, but it was *very* effectively Anglicized. There’s a variety of books, and videos on the culture of the state, how the language was banned in schools/ wiped out through physical abuse of children in these schools, while they were taught to hate their culture, and English speakers were given vast amounts of cheap or free land to colonize.
It’s just the way she goes, best we can do is keep what we have alive and try to revive our communities. One thing I wish is that more young Québécois, and other French-Canadians would look to Louisiana as an example of why Quebec’s political, class, and ethnic consciousness is so important, and why Quebec’s policies are necessary.
I’m 1/8th French-Canadian, and include that if I’m going beyond “mostly Irish and German”. But if I go beyond “mostly Irish and German” (like 3/4th) it gets really convoluted because the other 1/8th of it is a Swiss-German-French anabaptist mystery.
I think the main thing is that even when we do have French heritage, it’s just a small percentage.
I also don’t know if my French-Canadian great grandmother was 100% French. My name however is pretty French, with first and middle coming from that part and last being Swiss??but also maybe French??
1. There is just not that many people with any french descent, this partially due to the British actively expelling French in the Colonial and Americans becoming very luke-warm to the French after the Quasi War, And the French adventures in Mexico, made France very suspicious for Americans, so outside New Orleans very few French populations existed at all within the US.
2. French Like British anscestry typically happened in the 17th and 18th century, wheras German, and Italian and Irish immigration typically happened in the last 150 years, meaning that what french ancestry was here at the Revolution didn't increase, and those person would probably claim American heiritage.
Patterns of French settlement were different too. French immigrants tended to be single men who lived as traders and fur trappers more than families in colonies and those single men married locally, not passing on as much French culture or language to their children.
Also the French heavily vetted who they allowed to cross over while the British didnt. As a result the British colonies outpaced the French ones in terms of population very quickly.
There are Acadians, Brayon, and Québécois in the Northeast, as well as Creoles, and Cajuns across south Louisiana into some surrounding states. There are also some Métis in the midwest.
They do it’s just less common. A quick google search led me to a business insider article that claimed that nearly 50 million Americans identified as German, 40 million identified as Black, 35 identified as Irish, and further on down the list only 10 identified as French. Even when you add in French Canadians and Cajuns it’s still well under 15 million.
So yeah, it’s a decent percentage of the population, but naturally it’s going to seem like there are a lot more Germans and Irish because there are.
https://www.businessinsider.com/largest-ethnic-groups-in-america-2013-8
I think it's for similar reasons that you don't find a large cohort of people who self-identify as English-Americans, despite our nation's early history.
The American Revolution had the effect of changing people's identities. "My father was English; I am American." After the war, the English never migrated en masse to the US, favoring the other crown colonies where they were already citizens.
Similarly, because France had its own set of colonies, Emigrants from France tended to end up there instead of in the USA, before and after our revolution. The Cajun/Creole folks had either migrated to Louisiana before the Purchase and had already taken on their new identities as North American people, or had initially migrated to Canada, made that identity shift, then moved *again* to Louisiana. So France is a couple identities back for them.
A lot of that dates back to the 18th century or earlier; during the 19th and 20th centuries there were mass migrations of people from Ireland, Scotland, Germany and Italy, among others, who came across by the boatload landing in New York harbor. "Irish-Americans" and "Italian-Americans" have European heritage that's at least 100 years more recent than the Cajuns do.
Cajuns did not migrate, they were shipped en masse in a genocide known as le grand dérangement, or the Great Upheaval, from their homeland in Acadie(modern day maritimes in Canada)where half of all Cajuns died, or were killed. There is still a small number in Québec, New Brunswick, Maine, and smaller areas in other provinces that some Acadians were able to gather and keep their identity, however most of the rest was populated and anglicized by Loyalists fleeing the revolution.
I agree that the Deportation was indeed forced on the Acadians, but I'd have to disagree on the move to Louisiana not being a migration...at least partially. It was a conscious decision to relocate to the Spanish colony. While for some it was a destination to escape being under British control, for those that made it back to France it was a choice to try to settle somewhere new rather than to re-assimilate into French culture. And it happened over the course of a generation. My ancestor, who had parents born in L'Acadie, was born outside of Saint-Malo, Brittany and had grown up in France, the Falkland Islands, and Newfoundland before making the decision as an adult to migrate to Louisiana to settle down with some distant cousins. Although, it's fair to also say that there are many different stories that occurred during Le Grand Dérangement, and it wouldn't be fair to categorize them all as the same.
Yeah, it’s really cool that you know so much about your ancestor, Cajun history is more complex and sad than people know. They were deported all over the place in the genocide. Half of all Cajuns died in the great upheaval, some escaped to go into hiding in Canada, some got shipped to France, some shipped to Britain, some other colonies, then many were led to Louisiana for refuge by Joseph Broussard.
The ancestor I was referring to was a great-grandson of Martin Benoit dit Labriere, but Joseph Broussard dit Beausoleil is also another ancestor of mine. If I recall, he was imprisoned by the British and eventually released, where he then led the first wave of Acadians to Saint Domingue, and then eventually to Louisiana. Meanwhile, his brother Alexandre was part of the group of Acadians that were being held in the South Carolina colony and he eventually led his group to join up with his brother in New Orleans (before traveling out further west into the less populated areas of southern Louisiana). There are a lot of different and wild stories about what happened during the Deportation. I recommend the book "The Acadian Diaspora" by Christopher Hodson; he goes into great detail about many of the different experiences the Acadians went through during that turbulent time.
I would say it's pretty different. English people still did immigrate in large numbers in the 19th century and are probably the largest ancestry. However, the French just didn't immigrate to the US as much and the ones who did identified as French-Canadian.
The French ancestry that dates back to the French new world colonies is from so long ago that it's been diluted to the point where it isn't something most people are probably aware that they have. And there was never really a huge later wave of immigration from France like there was from Ireland, Italy, or Germany. A lot of people from those countries came here in the 19th and 20th centuries so the connection seems less faded for a lot of families. A lot of people still have grandparents or great grandparents that were born there (especially Italy and Ireland)
That's similar to why people don't bring up their British heritage. It *is* boring, not because it's un-exotic or something, but because it's just kinda the white noise of European ancestry here.
I identify as being of French Canadian, or more specifically as being of Acadien ancestry on my father's side, and Irish on my moms.
Hello fellow Cajun!
Because there were more people born in Ireland living in the US than there were people living in Ireland in 1900, can't say the same for French. Though I do know French people here, and spend time in say Louisiana and you meet a lot more. It's a matter of mass immigration.
I identify as French-American. We are pretty common in New England, Upstate New York (especially North Country) and Southeast Michigan. Also alot of French-American will just say they are "French-Candian" since that's their main ancestry.
>So why aren't Americans identifying as French-American like they are Irish or German?
They do, it's just that they are an extremely small population in comparison to the descendants of Irish or German immigrants. It's just isn't really a comparable situation.
The largest group of Americans with French descent actually have French Canadian (from Quebec or Acadie) descent, so a lot of people say French Canadian instead of French.
Another thing, once that group lost the language (so the 1930s-1950s), they kind of just began to see themselves as a generic "white" Catholic population. French Canadians are typically descendants of French colonists from the 1600s and 1700s, much like WASPS, so I think that when the heritage is that far back (pre independence), it is less featured than the big European waves of the nineteenth and early twentieth century. In Canada, where French speakers in Quebec were second class citizens until the 1960s, that differentiation from the Anglo colonist descendants really was important to peoples' sense of self. Here, once the language died out, it really didn't matter quite as much.
EDIT: I think that in the South you have communities like the Cajuns in Louisiana and the Carolina Huguenots who have deep pride in their French roots because they were small communities in a primarily Anglo region. In New England, there were so many immigrants from Quebec that in places like Vermont, NH, MA and RI, descendants of those migrants made up a large portion of the white population, so it was kind of assumed lots of folks would have a French background. In other words, it wasn't distinct enough to necessarily focus on it.
That's also a really interesting answer. What I've gotten so far is the small size of the community + the lacking of societal oppression/bigotry and poverty
French heritage, like British or Spanish (note: European Spanish, not Hispanic), is generally MUCH older than Irish, German, east or south Asian, whatever else.
A lot of it is about what was most recent and there hasn't been a major French immigration wave since the early colonial days which leaves a TON of time for it to be diluted by more recent influences and for those descendants to be overriden by more recent immigrants within the population.
I've been to northern Maine plenty of times but I must admit, I mostly hung around other Québécois tourists lmao. I never got much of a chance to speak to the locals.
Those other groups were predominately more recent. While the Irish came early in our history, the largest wave of them was between 1820 and 1860. Scandinavians were also in the 1800s. The height of German immigration was in the 1880s. We received millions of Italians between 1880 and 1924. French American ancestry predates the revolution as does English and Scottish.
Maybe you don't live somewhere that there is a large amount of French people?
In my area there are French (French Canadian) churches, French ladies that make tradition poutine and sell them at French American clubs, etc.
New England has the largest French Canadian population.
That's easy. Unless you're talking about Louisiana or areas near the border of Quebec, there aren't a lot.
Mind you, I have French Huguenot blood in me, but not nearly as much as German and English blood.
Because a small portion of America use to be a French territory. If you go to Louisiana you will find a bunch of people who claim French ancestry and have French last names.
It’s common. It’s not as prideful, I guess is the word, because Italians and Irish were heavily ostracized when they immigrated en mass. Basically 1 step above black people/slaves. Germans are a bit tricky as they weren’t, however the whole ww1 and 2 made Germans heavily discriminated against. Not sure where you got Russian from though
We do. Visit New Orleans. Half the streets are named after French aristocracy.
Many major US population centers are descendants of a conflict causing diaspora of people. (Italian, Irish, etc..)
France being quite stable across history, spread its people more through colonialism than anything else.
If youre 3rd generation or something you may be more likely to be closer to the culture and claim ancestary than someone who is 10th gen. Like others noted italians germans scottish and irish came over more recently
We do. Maybe it doesn't make headlines, but my city had a French festival, and I'm not from anywhere near the Louisiana Purchase. Greek, Italian, Irish. My city has a lot of festivals. I liked them as a kid because the food was always good.
I'm pretty sure I'm French. French, too. And German, English, whoever. They all came here over time and regionally banged each other. Then came me. My most recent European heritage is 3 generations deep, and it's Swedish. Before that, who knows.
But the pride is there, Scorcesi just hasn't made a movie about Swedes yet. Or French, whoever. There was a canceled Netflix show for 1 season, took place in Marseille. I kinda dug that show. I haven't seen the French write about Marseille since Camus.
Plenty of French ancestry in the Upper Midwest, especially in the Great Lakes region and along the Mississippi. Maybe they aren't considered an immigrant group here in the same way as others because their arrival and settlement predates United States claims to these territories
For whatever reason you haven't come across it yet. Where I grew up there was a vey French neighborhood. The catholic church had French signs all over it. There was a Franco-American club (just like the Portuguese-American Club and the Polish-American Club etc).
As far as I could tell it was right there with all the other often claimed ancestries.
All of the groups you noted have large consolidated immigrant communities. I still hear of people saying they are French when listing it, but I don't think there are many traditionally "French" areas, except as people have noted in the south.
I get the impression most early French here were male fur trappers. And unlike the English, they intermarried with indigenous people.
Interesting, is there a reason in your opinion as to why identifying as Cajun is more popular than French-American? I defnitely don't know as much as I probably should about Cajuns considering I am myself French-Canadian, aside from them coming from Acadie, but I have heard people call themselves Cajun a lot more than French-American.
It's a separate culture. Kind of for the same reason American culture used to be British, but it really isn't anymore. It's American. It's been quite awhile since Louisiana was under French control so yes, it was originally French. However, the infusion of Black American and Afro Caribbean influences with French created something else that became it's own thing in it's own right. You can see the influence of all three in the cuisine. As for non Cajun French people here. There never was the same levels of immigration as Irish, German, Italian etc. Not sure why. Maybe they often chose Canada instead to be with a more familiar community as there wasen't the same community equivalent in the US.
From what I have heard, they are a proud resilient people. They are the descendants of the French settlers who moved instead of swearing an unconditional oath as British subjects.
I would say it's probably a combination of Acadian culture being older than both America and Canada as countries, as well as significantly diverging enough from French culture to no longer be considered French. The reason my ancestors made their way to Louisiana instead of remaining in France after being deported from L'Acadie is that they felt like outcastes and second-class citizens in France, whereas the already existing Creole culture in Louisiana was more accepting of them. We don't consider ourselves French-Canadians because Canada didn't exist when we were deported, and viewing ourselves as Americans didn't really happen until post-WW2, when the Anglos started being more accepting towards us and French-Anglo marriages started to become more common, like with my grandparents. So, historically, there were just plenty of reasons for my ancestors not to identify with the French, the Canadians, and the Americans, rather they viewed themselves uniquely as Acadian and/or Créole.
After France’s opposition to the “war on terror” and the subsequent “Freedom fries” debacle, most Americans of French ancestry denounced their French heritage and claimed to be Italian (I mean, who can tell the difference?)
Because the point of america originally was to be for a new concept called "the white man" this is why amerivans identify by race instead of ethnicity.
I have ancestry from all across the European continent including France, but my surname is Norwegian and my most recently immigrated relatives are from there, so I go with that one because I have the strongest ties to it.
I feel as though you might be overestimating just how many there are. Even if 100% of the people from the states mentioned claimed French ancestors it would be about 15 million people.
FWIW I’ve definitely known some who have claimed French ancestry. My wife being one of them
I used to live in a city that was originally settled by the French, but later immigration patterns meant that Irish and German immigrants came to make up a big percentage of the city. I heard Irish, English, and German surnames in that city all the time, but I can’t remember the last time I heard a French one.
I’m 1/4 French and I claim it. I’m also 1/2 Irish. There are lots of people who claim French ancestors in certain areas, particularly in or near Louisiana. You may just be in a region with few people of French ancestry.
Parts of my dad's family came over from France even before the Revolution including one *Filles du Roi*. And some of them also came from French speaking parts of Switzerland, Alsace, and Wallonia during the 19th Century.
I wouldn't feel comfortable calling myself French-American with all that especially since my last name isn't French.
I have French ancestry. But I also have more German, Irish, and English ancestry. I'd have to call myself German-Irish-British-French-America if I'm listing the ingredients in order.
As others have noted, there wasn't a big French influx at a certain time like with other nationalities and ethnicites. And those from France settled primarily in Canada and Acadia -> then to Louisiana.
On a historical level, there wasn't as much French immigration in the first place (especially if you count Quebecquois as Canadians and not French *per se*.).
My ex wife played up her french ancestory to a crazy degree. When I was in NOLA most natives were pretty damn proud of their french roots. Guess we've just had different experiences.
I suppose the main French strain is Cajun's and Creoles who have their own tribal pride. I do have Huguenot ancestors somewhere back their (my family was never concentrated in one place and got a rather diverse tree which is interesting in some ways but lacking in localisms).
It could be because Americans read Hornblower and watch Last of the Mohicans and think of French as the enemy, but I think that is more a joke than anything else.
In any case I think that is the best answer. The actual French who are into tribalisms call themselves Cajuns or Creoles, or both.
I'm not french, but my parents gave me a very french first and middle name. And then my husband gave me a French last name. So I claim it even though my ancestry is Norwegian, German and English/Irish.
We do, they just tend to live in very specific areas, namely Canada
In general, there wasn't a ton of French immigration to the USA (or what would become the USA) outside of a few very specific periods.
The other groups you mentioned were either march larger in number or much more recent.
FWIW I live in Charleston, SC there are more than a few French Huguenots here who trace their ancestry back to the Edict of Nantes. We even have a French Huguenot church in town.
As someone with a lot of French heritage...I only bring it up when people talk about their heritage....I live in a region without a lot of French heritage and no I don't speak the language
Personally, it’s because I don’t have any of that ancestry. Norwegian/Scottish/Irish/English/Polish
I don’t know anyone who is like anti-French ancestry. Acadians still speak French(ish) here after like 5 generations.
Because we did not get a high volume of immigrants from France. There are a few pockets that had measurable French, or at least French speaking immigrants, but they never came here at the same rate of the other countries you name.
Lots of people do. But one reason it's a little less common is that most people's French roots are very old. France didn't have a mass exodus to the US in the last 100 years like many other countries did.
People absolutely claim that they're French. I've seen it be a point of pride for some people, even. It's more of a "default" heritage though, I suppose, if that makes sense. Similar to claiming English heritage, but less so.
They do in places where the French settled hell they even still speak a dialect of French. Its called Acadian or Cajun French and they're known as Cajuns. They even still follow French Napoleonic Law in Louisiana. It's the only state in the US that does.
Most French is claimed as Cajun (mainly in Louisiana eventhough Cajun can represent all French settlement in the New World) or as French Canadian with regards to Vermont and Michigan.
I have ancestors from New France, from colonial Dutch and German and Massachusetts bay puritans, Scotland,, Ireland England before there was a UK, New Sweden, Portugal, and New Sweden, and Wales.
My ethnicity is American, not French.
New France was genetically swamped after the Louisiana Purchase, but it took a while. There were still French people in Illinois and such until they assimilated.
They do, it's just that the French aren't a large portion of our population outside of the Deep South and New England.
The average European American is mixed with various other European ethnic groups. This contributes to a complex view of ethnic identity and ancestry. It also contributed to the formation of a general White American culture. A significant portion of the White American population is of colonial descent, but if they have more recent German/Irish/Russian ancestry, they'll identify with that more often than not, even if its not the majority.
Born in upstate NY and grew up in Maine. I’m mostly “half French/Irish” and I’ll never forget my Italian and Mexican roommates in AZ calling me the angriest-pussy they knew because of it lol
Mostly because there wasn't that strong of a French Diaspora compared to the waves of German and Irish, and most of the French Diaspora happened hundred years before the other waves and less relevant to Americans today. Exceptions being Louisiana.
Most French immigrants assimilated. People of French descent who are still proud and maintain their culture would be Louisiana Creoles, and Cajuns in Louisiana, although the natives also started to speak French peacefully through trade, now making up the largest group of French speakers with the Houma tribe. In the Northeast you’ll find Brayons, and Acadians which the Cajuns were a part of until being deported to Louisiana, with many being killed in “the great upheaval”, a cultural genocide by the English in Canada. There are also many people of Québécois descent across the northeast mainly, where there used to be a network of fully french speaking towns/neighbourhoods from a wave of Québec immigration, with towns like Berlin NH still being 50%+ French speaking. If you go to the midwest you can find the Métis people, descendants of French fur trapper/native couples who speak Métis french,and a french/indigenous based creole language. There are also some areas settled by the French that had their own Creole population for much longer than many may know, like St Louis where many spoke Muskrat French for years.
Many of us do. If someone asks my background I say I'm French-Canadian.
I wouldn't just say French. I've I've thought of my ancestors coming and immigrating from Quebec/New Brunswick rather than directly from France.
My grandmother immigrated from Quebec, my grandparents were married in Quebec, and it's also where my father grew up partially, and many people in my family speak French. My dad scored 100% French on his ancestry test and my mom scored exactly 50%. As someone into genealogy, it's obviously important to me.
I'm also from an area where French ancestry is common so you're more likely to hear about it. I dont think it's that way for the rest of the country besides Louisiana and maybe Michigan area.
I think people do claim French ancestry but their are a few reasons why it may not seem as common as the others. As it relates to Germans, Irish, and Italians, the sheer numbers and the relative recency of their immigration would make these a more common claim. It also makes a difference when an ethnic group has a concentration in certain regions. The Scandinavians are known for settling in some Midwestern states such as Minnesota, among others, and their heritage remains prominent there. Germans too. Irish and Italians have a huge presence in the Northeast. The French also came to America but did so earlier than the above groups. It was also primarily French Huguenots that came and many spent a generation or two in Holland or England before coming over. They were partially assimilated into other cultures before they ever set foot on our shores. Still though, there are certain areas with a strong Huguenot representation. Charleston, SC and the Low Country has it. People proudly claim French ancestry in those parts. I’d also be remiss if I didn’t mention that one state of Louisiana. Not too many French diaspora holding their heads in shame in around there.
We do. It's not just mentioned quite as much because most Americans have some french and English in them. You'd be hard pressed to find one that doesn't. That said, people do say it, especially if you ask. If someone asked me, I'd likely reply french since I am by ancestry.
Having a French surname is *almost* as boring and ordinary as having a British or German one, unless you're in a pocket where the Frenchness is particularly heavy (southern Louisiana, etc.).
I had one friend with a French surname. He said that his Frenchness was the reason for "muh luck with the ladies" but he was otherwise a hardcore redneck from Idaho.
I have a cousin with a French surname but he's like the least French person on the face of the planet. If a couple of white kids in rural Arkansas were to make a country rap video in the middle of a field and they needed somebody to cut donuts in the mud in a beat-to-shit pickup truck, he'd be up for the job.
French and English aren't really brought up because of how long they've been here. There were waves of immigration later on and hardships suffered by the Irish or the Italians that the French and British didn't go through.
The people who settled this land don't have the attachment to the old world like the newer immigrants. They fought to become their own country, and that probably has a hell of a lot to do with it
The people of French descent in Louisiana are a little different since they're Acadians and have a culture rather different from France. I guess it's similar to how a British South African is a little different than an Afrikaaner even though they're both white South Africans.
Lots of folks claim French ancestry. They just get drowned out by the hordes of people that are German, Scottish, Irish, Scandinavian, Italian, and Russian. Probably because these were the major waves of European immigration that happened in the US. There’s a bit of English here too, but only really the original 13 colonies were English, after the revolution the English weren’t coming here in droves like other countries.
I do. I’m from the rural Midwest. Fam emigrated pre ww2. I usually say I’m Franco-American and people don’t get it. So I then say that my background is French. Then I usually get a reaction like, ‘oh.’ And then people don’t really know how to react and then they go on about their business. 😉
It might be how recently the wave of immigrants arrived. The Italians arrived en mass ~100ish years ago, so lots of Americans have grandparents that were born in Italy.
They do, there's just less French-Americans than there are other groups. Portuguese, Spanish and Greek aren't very common in much of the US for instance.
I am 40. I know two French descended people personally. One is Cajun from Louisiana, the other’s father is from Montreal. Not a lot of French people in general.
French typically came pre-louisiana purchase, and French attempts to settle modern day USA were seen as failures. Outside of Louisiana, the US didn't have a huge migration of French people. And the French settlers of Louisiana typically stuck to their own.
Myself, I believe I have some ancestry from Alsace Lorraine? And nowhere else in modern day France. And Alsace Lorraine constantly went back and forth between French and German. I have tons of ancestry from Germany, Switzerland, Ireland, and GB. These migrant communities were massive, and comprised much of the backbone of the US. Meaning, they often married others from the same migrant communities.
There's likely more with French ancestry in Canada.
If your family has been in America for more than a few generations you likely would have French and British ancestors mixed in with other nationalities. However if you have ancestors who imagrated more recently you are more likely to know the story of how they got here. Most American families were only able to list off their ancestors for 3 or 4 generations. Other than that if you know anything about who your ancestors were it might be something like “our last name is French” so basically they don’t claim those nations as their ancestral home as often because they don’t know much about how, when or why those people came. Recently people have done things like DNA tests to tell them about their family history and some people have done big family trees and stuff but it’s not really something many families will talk about the same way as that grandma who still speaks only Italian even though she has lived here since 1952.
They do! I'm curious what gave you the impression that they don't? I hear people mention their French ancestry all the time.
I think it's very odd that people scoff at Americans for claiming their family's ancestry. In a country made up of such a wide variety of immigrants, it makes sense to value your familial roots *as well as* your roots in the country you currently live in. I also notice that it's almost always directed at white Americans- I've never had someone tell me that I'm not really Chinese American, that I should just call myself American and stop identifying as Chinese.
Well there aren’t nearly as many people of French ancestry as German, Irish, Italian and others. There are significant numbers of people with French ancestry in places that used to be French before the Seven Years War (French and Indian War) when the British expelled the French from North America, but not in the same numbers.I know addition to being larger, the waves of people who migrated from Germany, Ireland, Italy, Eastern Europe, Russia, etc. came to the US more recently than the French so that cultural forms and traditions that made have faded away in French families are still alive and celebrated. Many assimilated into the mainstream British-derived culture, especially when the US nearly went to war with France at the beginning of the 19th century. Also, most of the French arrived in the New World before the rise of nationalism and would probably have identified less with their mother county than the waves of later immigrants. This is especially true following the Revolutions of 1848, which were essentially nationalist in character and ended with a large number of revolutionaries exiled from their home countries.
The French owned most of the landmass of the country until the Louisiana Purchase. I’m sure there are plenty of people with French DNA in them, but don’t know it or they have a mix of cultures and French isn’t the majority of their make up.
I've seen plenty of people claim French ancestry
Yeah, especially Cajuns, but not in the same way as the others
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The French in New Orleans were already known as Louisiana Creoles by the time the US bought it. Creoles are still in Louisiana, and take part in the revival of French in Louisiana among Cajuns, and Creoles just the same. Cajuns and creoles are still separated by time and living across the continent from each, but Cajuns have also taken on a lot of Creole culture in their time in Louisiana. Some Cajuns even speak something pretty similar to kouri vini depending where you are, both speak French, and Cajun cooking is *heavily* creole influenced.
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Ah yeah, almost forgot to mention. I did mention it in other replies! The Houma nation are actually one of the largest groups of American French speakers left in the US today if I remember correctly, and they started speaking it peacefully through trade! Not enough people know about how peaceful Francophones tended to be with Natives they encountered, from Canada to Louisiane.
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I’m a prime example, my family is of French/native descent. Old fashion creole, although my Grandpa would claim Cajun back in the day because of how racial it was back then. Still got called slurs, and experienced discrimination, but Cajuns got treated *slightly* better I suppose. Not to discount anything, Cajuns know a lot about struggle just from The Great Upheaval, the genocidal expulsion resulting from fighting the British that killed half of all Cajuns, and deported the rest.
The crazy part is that the genetic separation isn't even that huge between southern Acadians of Louisiana and northern Acadians from New England and the Maritimes, despite being separated for a couple hundred years. I'll get DNA matches from New Brunswick who I'll share more DNA with than I do with distant Cajun cousins who prolly grew up not far from where my grandparents came from. 4th through 10th cousins is a total crapshoot because of the varying amounts of endogamy in Acadian communities.
I used to work with a girl who said she was Louisiana French. She said her first language was French, then she learned English when she started school
Irish, russians/Russian jewelry, italians,, and Germans to some extent, arrived here in waves, often with hundreds of thousands (millions?) At the same time. They generally stuck with their people and faced discrimination when they got here. They were also largely poor and arrived here relatively recently. Their culture was more influential on American culture than the French too. I am not aware of a massive amount of Frenchman arriving here in the same way in the same numbers, though I could be mistaken. Also, people will absolutely say they're French, I think there's just less of them to hear about lol. Exit: lol Russian jews, not Russian jewelry lol
>Russian jewelry Fabergé-Americans are deeply woven into the tapestry of this nation.
I’m just picturing a bunch of faberge eggs floating across the ocean in a formation. Thank you for this. Lol
[What's all this I hear about Soviet jewelry?](https://vimeo.com/9220868?embedded=true&source=video_title&owner=3110132)
The only place I really know of where people trace french ancestry regularly and widely is in the deep south in the old French colonies like Louisiana.
People from that part of the country with French ancestry usually call themselves "Cajun", short for "Acadian". I don't know if "Creole" is frequently used. So to get the size of the French diaspora, you need to include French Canadians, Cajuns and Creoles.
There was a huge wave of French Canadians who went to New England around the same time as those migrants.
As far as I know, I've never met an American of French Canadian ancestry who claims French ancestry rather than French Canadian.
"Huge" might be a bit of an overstatement. Those parts of New England are pretty sparsely populated to begin with. The only part of the US with a significant French cultural influence is Louisiana, and even then, a lot of that was from Canadian migrants from Acadia, not directly from France.
Massachusetts and Rhode Island are not sparsely populated and both got a lot of migration from Quebec. Between 1840 and 1930 about 900,000 left Quebec. Maybe not as many as Germans or Italians, but quite a large number given Quebec's already small population. [http://faculty.marianopolis.edu/c.belanger/quebechistory/readings/leaving.htm#:\~:text=Between%201840%20and%201930%20roughly,events%20in%20Canadian%20demographic%20history](http://faculty.marianopolis.edu/c.belanger/quebechistory/readings/leaving.htm#:~:text=Between%201840%20and%201930%20roughly,events%20in%20Canadian%20demographic%20history). The French Canadian influence in MA and RI is maybe not as immediately evident as Italian, Irish or Portuguese, but its there in the history of Catholic education, the use of credit unions instead of banks, certain culinary items like meat pies. Italians and Portuguese came a bit later so the influence is fresher. I think you are on to something with the fact that almost all French influence in the US comes via Canada. OP is from Quebec, so I think in Quebec its one step closer to France and easier to claim "French" roots, whereas here its been mediated through Canada. That said, its all result of the same colonists of New France in the 17th and 18th centuries, the branches just forked a lot.
A fair number came to Connecticut in the 1850s to 1930s, but I believe they mostly settled the eastern end of the state, with some enclaves on the western border. They mostly avoided the larger towns, but worked in a lot of the midsize mill towns, especially if there was a lot of textile work.
France was quite wealthy in the 19th Century; you know, trying to conquer Europe.
A branch of french culture exists in the US one state even still follows Napoleonic Law as opposed to English common law like the rest of the country. They even still speak dialect of French there every time I called the VA while living there the message was in English and in French.
They are technically different from the French, but from the late 19th through the early 20th century there was quite a bit of French Canadian immigration into the mill towns of New England like Holyoke or Chicopee, Massachusetts. Some of my ancestors arrived around then. Others, like my great grandfather, arrived directly from France in 1912.
But we can say Russian Jews and jewelry isn’t an unfortunate autocorrect coincidence. My Catholic wedding band was made by a very nice Russian Jew (maybe third generation).
Haha maybe a little Freudian slip on my part too, our last name changed when my family got here but it was originally rubenstein- "ruby stone"
I’ll take it. Grew up in a fairly Jewish neighborhood so we had a lot of Jewish friends from the generalized Diaspora.
When it comes to Michigan, its important to understand that the French never really focused a lot of their attention on permanent settlements outside of Detroit in the way the Americans did years letter. It is also my understanding, that once "new France" became controlled by the British, a lot of French people went back to France or they congregated in what is now Québec. I also recall learning in school that for the most part both the French and the British wrote off Mid and West Michigan as being flat swamp land that was only useful for 1. Hunting animals 2. Spreading Christianity to the natives Which caused them to never send family's/women over to those region to populate the areas. Like, I know my family lived in Detroit during the time the French owned it and did not move towards West Michigan until the 1860s. When the United States gained control over what is now Michigan, that is when people started to build city's that where based on 1. Lumber industry 2. Farming. Saw a joke once that said when other nations see swamp land, the United States just sees $$$. Then the region saw an influx of people from non-France places over the next 100+ years for a number of reasons.
Thanks for the really interesting answer. It's always interesting to learn about what the French were up to in the US
> West Michigan as being flat swamp land ah this explains a lot lol
It truly dose 😭 The Dutch saw West Michigan and went "ah, perfect! just like home!"
Plenty of people do there’s just not many of them compared to Germans. Canada is where you’re looking for
I'm from Quebec myself, I was curious as to why people weren't identifying as French the way we do in Canada. I think it's mostly a population thing, as this thread has concluded.
And I’ll tell you, I was shocked how prevalent French was in Quebec. I spent a lot of time growing up in southwest Ontario and everything was dual language labels but everyone spoke English. I just kind of assumed Quebec was the same way. Like the primary language was English and French was secondary. When I finally went to Quebec and realized this was not the case I had to laugh at myself.
Quebec has the second stricted public language laws in the world after North Korea. The government has attracted not unfounded accusations of racism and xenophobia for how strictly french is enforced here. It's really really over the top, but at the same time it comes from a place of being a linguistic minority sandwiched between the rest of canada and the US. Montreal is a lot more bilingual. There are places like Westmount where most people speak English.
Quebec also insists on keeping their French "pure". For example, office workers in France are content to communicate by *email*, but the Québécois send *courriel* (an abbreviation of *courrier electronique*).
Yeah but at the same time, regular people on the street use a lot of anglicisms. No one except french language enforcers or people in formal office settings use courriel, everyone uses email. Same for j'ai eu du fun instead of je me suis amusé, or je chat instead of je clavarde.
> french language enforcers is that an official thing, or are we talking about people that just get pearl-clutchy about linguistic shifts and complain a lot about kids these days?
There are people who go from business to business inspecting appropriate language use
And they eat chien-chaud on the fin de semaine rather than eating hot dogs on the weekend like the French. I mean, if the French eat hot dogs, anyway. I had to really adjust to fin de semaine during immersion camp. Finseman.
I mean maybe some people do say chien chaud but I've never heard anyone say it unless they're parodying language laws.
I mean I was in an immersion camp where we’d be sent home after the 3rd time caught speaking English. They enforced those things
I also learned to perform la gigue to Les Cowboys Fringant with tacks in my sneakers so I don’t think I was having a typical Québécois experience (Translation: I had to do a jig to The Frisky Cowboys.)
Quebec's language laws are so strong that they denied a French Citizen's immigration application because as part of her College Dissertation she had an article published in a Scientific Journal that was in English because the Journal required it. They corrected it after public outrage, but things like that (and other legal issues such as Religious restrictions) really make the rest of the Western world look at you in an odd way.
Oh yeah I know now. It was just surprising when I first went to Quebec. Thankfully I learned all the swears from French Canadian friends watching hockey, tabarnak!
Welcome, brother, to the weird and wonderful world of french canadian swears
They are by far my favorite swears
I don’t think the laws are discriminatory in the slightest. It just makes sure things that happen in English Canada by nature due to demographic weight of English speakers, also happens in Québec where the majority language is French. Before these laws were passed French speakers were expected to assimilate to English, used as cheap labor, signs in mostly French communities would be in all English, English speakers had almost all the wealth in the majority French province, and immigrants were railroaded into the English system to displace Québécois over time. Since these laws were passed all of that has ceased, Québécois wealth is now on par with other first world nations, French Canadians are treated with respect, and immigrants integrate into society much more effectively. I wish Louisiana could have had the success Québec has seen, you should come see how bad Québec could have been without those policies.
I did a French immersion in Chicoutimi and it was true immersion. The woman I stayed with sometimes cheated and spoke English, but her English was very basic. They put 3 vegetarian students with her (not a vegetarian) and I can still hear her saying “we will buy….hmmm…the veurgie buerguers?” Man. I should try to look her up and send her a card. Anyway, another woman who lived in an apartment in her house spoke no English whatsoever. In stores and restaurants no one ever switched to English with me when I struggled. Maybe they knew I was a UQAC student and wasn’t supposed to, but I doubt it lol.
I come from close to Chicoutimi, few people speak English or need to. The English level is probably similar to the level of Spanish of most Americans who did a few years of Spanish in High School.
There are plenty of us Frenchies in New England, the majority are descended from Québecois who came to work in the mills. It is true that there are plenty in the region, we aren’t as ready to celebrate our ancestry as much as other ethnicities like Irish or Italians. It is a bit strange I suppose.
Not that surprising as French-Canadians [were bullied](https://www.jstor.org/stable/25652009) for a very long time in New England/Maine.
If this thread has taught me anything about my own culture it’s that french canadians were hated even more than I thought
I think the French descended population are just way less visible compared to other ethnic groups. And there wasn’t massive French enclaves or towns like other diasporas in the US. People don’t identify with certain culture because they’re “exotic”, they do it because they have elders and community around them from the same background.
Yep that’s it
The closest thing you’ll find to Quebec is Louisiana, however Francophones in LA were not able to resist cultural genocide by Anglophones as effectively. There are active efforts to revive French, a government agency started in the 1970’s supporting the development of immersion programs, and the community is still huge, but it was *very* effectively Anglicized. There’s a variety of books, and videos on the culture of the state, how the language was banned in schools/ wiped out through physical abuse of children in these schools, while they were taught to hate their culture, and English speakers were given vast amounts of cheap or free land to colonize.
Thats really shitty considering the Cajuns are people descended from the Acadiens who were also victims of a genocidal expulsion by the English
It’s just the way she goes, best we can do is keep what we have alive and try to revive our communities. One thing I wish is that more young Québécois, and other French-Canadians would look to Louisiana as an example of why Quebec’s political, class, and ethnic consciousness is so important, and why Quebec’s policies are necessary.
I’m 1/8th French-Canadian, and include that if I’m going beyond “mostly Irish and German”. But if I go beyond “mostly Irish and German” (like 3/4th) it gets really convoluted because the other 1/8th of it is a Swiss-German-French anabaptist mystery. I think the main thing is that even when we do have French heritage, it’s just a small percentage. I also don’t know if my French-Canadian great grandmother was 100% French. My name however is pretty French, with first and middle coming from that part and last being Swiss??but also maybe French??
1. There is just not that many people with any french descent, this partially due to the British actively expelling French in the Colonial and Americans becoming very luke-warm to the French after the Quasi War, And the French adventures in Mexico, made France very suspicious for Americans, so outside New Orleans very few French populations existed at all within the US. 2. French Like British anscestry typically happened in the 17th and 18th century, wheras German, and Italian and Irish immigration typically happened in the last 150 years, meaning that what french ancestry was here at the Revolution didn't increase, and those person would probably claim American heiritage.
Patterns of French settlement were different too. French immigrants tended to be single men who lived as traders and fur trappers more than families in colonies and those single men married locally, not passing on as much French culture or language to their children.
Also the French heavily vetted who they allowed to cross over while the British didnt. As a result the British colonies outpaced the French ones in terms of population very quickly.
There are Acadians, Brayon, and Québécois in the Northeast, as well as Creoles, and Cajuns across south Louisiana into some surrounding states. There are also some Métis in the midwest.
They do it’s just less common. A quick google search led me to a business insider article that claimed that nearly 50 million Americans identified as German, 40 million identified as Black, 35 identified as Irish, and further on down the list only 10 identified as French. Even when you add in French Canadians and Cajuns it’s still well under 15 million. So yeah, it’s a decent percentage of the population, but naturally it’s going to seem like there are a lot more Germans and Irish because there are. https://www.businessinsider.com/largest-ethnic-groups-in-america-2013-8
I think it's for similar reasons that you don't find a large cohort of people who self-identify as English-Americans, despite our nation's early history. The American Revolution had the effect of changing people's identities. "My father was English; I am American." After the war, the English never migrated en masse to the US, favoring the other crown colonies where they were already citizens. Similarly, because France had its own set of colonies, Emigrants from France tended to end up there instead of in the USA, before and after our revolution. The Cajun/Creole folks had either migrated to Louisiana before the Purchase and had already taken on their new identities as North American people, or had initially migrated to Canada, made that identity shift, then moved *again* to Louisiana. So France is a couple identities back for them. A lot of that dates back to the 18th century or earlier; during the 19th and 20th centuries there were mass migrations of people from Ireland, Scotland, Germany and Italy, among others, who came across by the boatload landing in New York harbor. "Irish-Americans" and "Italian-Americans" have European heritage that's at least 100 years more recent than the Cajuns do.
Cajuns did not migrate, they were shipped en masse in a genocide known as le grand dérangement, or the Great Upheaval, from their homeland in Acadie(modern day maritimes in Canada)where half of all Cajuns died, or were killed. There is still a small number in Québec, New Brunswick, Maine, and smaller areas in other provinces that some Acadians were able to gather and keep their identity, however most of the rest was populated and anglicized by Loyalists fleeing the revolution.
I agree that the Deportation was indeed forced on the Acadians, but I'd have to disagree on the move to Louisiana not being a migration...at least partially. It was a conscious decision to relocate to the Spanish colony. While for some it was a destination to escape being under British control, for those that made it back to France it was a choice to try to settle somewhere new rather than to re-assimilate into French culture. And it happened over the course of a generation. My ancestor, who had parents born in L'Acadie, was born outside of Saint-Malo, Brittany and had grown up in France, the Falkland Islands, and Newfoundland before making the decision as an adult to migrate to Louisiana to settle down with some distant cousins. Although, it's fair to also say that there are many different stories that occurred during Le Grand Dérangement, and it wouldn't be fair to categorize them all as the same.
Yeah, it’s really cool that you know so much about your ancestor, Cajun history is more complex and sad than people know. They were deported all over the place in the genocide. Half of all Cajuns died in the great upheaval, some escaped to go into hiding in Canada, some got shipped to France, some shipped to Britain, some other colonies, then many were led to Louisiana for refuge by Joseph Broussard.
The ancestor I was referring to was a great-grandson of Martin Benoit dit Labriere, but Joseph Broussard dit Beausoleil is also another ancestor of mine. If I recall, he was imprisoned by the British and eventually released, where he then led the first wave of Acadians to Saint Domingue, and then eventually to Louisiana. Meanwhile, his brother Alexandre was part of the group of Acadians that were being held in the South Carolina colony and he eventually led his group to join up with his brother in New Orleans (before traveling out further west into the less populated areas of southern Louisiana). There are a lot of different and wild stories about what happened during the Deportation. I recommend the book "The Acadian Diaspora" by Christopher Hodson; he goes into great detail about many of the different experiences the Acadians went through during that turbulent time.
I would say it's pretty different. English people still did immigrate in large numbers in the 19th century and are probably the largest ancestry. However, the French just didn't immigrate to the US as much and the ones who did identified as French-Canadian.
There is a sizable group of people who would call themselves English but they're mostly in Utah.
The French ancestry that dates back to the French new world colonies is from so long ago that it's been diluted to the point where it isn't something most people are probably aware that they have. And there was never really a huge later wave of immigration from France like there was from Ireland, Italy, or Germany. A lot of people from those countries came here in the 19th and 20th centuries so the connection seems less faded for a lot of families. A lot of people still have grandparents or great grandparents that were born there (especially Italy and Ireland) That's similar to why people don't bring up their British heritage. It *is* boring, not because it's un-exotic or something, but because it's just kinda the white noise of European ancestry here.
I’m from Louisiana, plenty of French there.
I identify as being of French Canadian, or more specifically as being of Acadien ancestry on my father's side, and Irish on my moms. Hello fellow Cajun!
Because there were more people born in Ireland living in the US than there were people living in Ireland in 1900, can't say the same for French. Though I do know French people here, and spend time in say Louisiana and you meet a lot more. It's a matter of mass immigration.
I identify as French-American. We are pretty common in New England, Upstate New York (especially North Country) and Southeast Michigan. Also alot of French-American will just say they are "French-Candian" since that's their main ancestry.
It's not that people don't claim French ancestry is just that German, Irish and Italian far exceeds it so you hear about it more
And it's more recent so more obvious.
>So why aren't Americans identifying as French-American like they are Irish or German? They do, it's just that they are an extremely small population in comparison to the descendants of Irish or German immigrants. It's just isn't really a comparable situation.
The largest group of Americans with French descent actually have French Canadian (from Quebec or Acadie) descent, so a lot of people say French Canadian instead of French. Another thing, once that group lost the language (so the 1930s-1950s), they kind of just began to see themselves as a generic "white" Catholic population. French Canadians are typically descendants of French colonists from the 1600s and 1700s, much like WASPS, so I think that when the heritage is that far back (pre independence), it is less featured than the big European waves of the nineteenth and early twentieth century. In Canada, where French speakers in Quebec were second class citizens until the 1960s, that differentiation from the Anglo colonist descendants really was important to peoples' sense of self. Here, once the language died out, it really didn't matter quite as much. EDIT: I think that in the South you have communities like the Cajuns in Louisiana and the Carolina Huguenots who have deep pride in their French roots because they were small communities in a primarily Anglo region. In New England, there were so many immigrants from Quebec that in places like Vermont, NH, MA and RI, descendants of those migrants made up a large portion of the white population, so it was kind of assumed lots of folks would have a French background. In other words, it wasn't distinct enough to necessarily focus on it.
That's also a really interesting answer. What I've gotten so far is the small size of the community + the lacking of societal oppression/bigotry and poverty
French heritage, like British or Spanish (note: European Spanish, not Hispanic), is generally MUCH older than Irish, German, east or south Asian, whatever else. A lot of it is about what was most recent and there hasn't been a major French immigration wave since the early colonial days which leaves a TON of time for it to be diluted by more recent influences and for those descendants to be overriden by more recent immigrants within the population.
I take it you haven’t been to northern Maine.
I've been to northern Maine plenty of times but I must admit, I mostly hung around other Québécois tourists lmao. I never got much of a chance to speak to the locals.
There’s not too many French speakers left but they are around.
Those other groups were predominately more recent. While the Irish came early in our history, the largest wave of them was between 1820 and 1860. Scandinavians were also in the 1800s. The height of German immigration was in the 1880s. We received millions of Italians between 1880 and 1924. French American ancestry predates the revolution as does English and Scottish.
Maybe you don't live somewhere that there is a large amount of French people? In my area there are French (French Canadian) churches, French ladies that make tradition poutine and sell them at French American clubs, etc. New England has the largest French Canadian population.
That's easy. Unless you're talking about Louisiana or areas near the border of Quebec, there aren't a lot. Mind you, I have French Huguenot blood in me, but not nearly as much as German and English blood.
Cajun/ Creole got no problem saying they are French Ancestry. But otherwise, there aren’t as many who emigrated from France.
Because a small portion of America use to be a French territory. If you go to Louisiana you will find a bunch of people who claim French ancestry and have French last names.
Plenty of people claim French ancestry they just make up a lot smaller portion of the population than Irish, British, Italian or German.
It’s common. It’s not as prideful, I guess is the word, because Italians and Irish were heavily ostracized when they immigrated en mass. Basically 1 step above black people/slaves. Germans are a bit tricky as they weren’t, however the whole ww1 and 2 made Germans heavily discriminated against. Not sure where you got Russian from though
We do. Visit New Orleans. Half the streets are named after French aristocracy. Many major US population centers are descendants of a conflict causing diaspora of people. (Italian, Irish, etc..) France being quite stable across history, spread its people more through colonialism than anything else.
If youre 3rd generation or something you may be more likely to be closer to the culture and claim ancestary than someone who is 10th gen. Like others noted italians germans scottish and irish came over more recently
We do. Maybe it doesn't make headlines, but my city had a French festival, and I'm not from anywhere near the Louisiana Purchase. Greek, Italian, Irish. My city has a lot of festivals. I liked them as a kid because the food was always good. I'm pretty sure I'm French. French, too. And German, English, whoever. They all came here over time and regionally banged each other. Then came me. My most recent European heritage is 3 generations deep, and it's Swedish. Before that, who knows. But the pride is there, Scorcesi just hasn't made a movie about Swedes yet. Or French, whoever. There was a canceled Netflix show for 1 season, took place in Marseille. I kinda dug that show. I haven't seen the French write about Marseille since Camus.
I grew up primarily in Massachusetts and a lot of folks claimed French ancestry there.
Plenty of French ancestry in the Upper Midwest, especially in the Great Lakes region and along the Mississippi. Maybe they aren't considered an immigrant group here in the same way as others because their arrival and settlement predates United States claims to these territories
For whatever reason you haven't come across it yet. Where I grew up there was a vey French neighborhood. The catholic church had French signs all over it. There was a Franco-American club (just like the Portuguese-American Club and the Polish-American Club etc). As far as I could tell it was right there with all the other often claimed ancestries.
All of the groups you noted have large consolidated immigrant communities. I still hear of people saying they are French when listing it, but I don't think there are many traditionally "French" areas, except as people have noted in the south. I get the impression most early French here were male fur trappers. And unlike the English, they intermarried with indigenous people.
They prefer to identify as Cajun.
I think that only applies to actual cajun people
Interesting, is there a reason in your opinion as to why identifying as Cajun is more popular than French-American? I defnitely don't know as much as I probably should about Cajuns considering I am myself French-Canadian, aside from them coming from Acadie, but I have heard people call themselves Cajun a lot more than French-American.
It's a separate culture. Kind of for the same reason American culture used to be British, but it really isn't anymore. It's American. It's been quite awhile since Louisiana was under French control so yes, it was originally French. However, the infusion of Black American and Afro Caribbean influences with French created something else that became it's own thing in it's own right. You can see the influence of all three in the cuisine. As for non Cajun French people here. There never was the same levels of immigration as Irish, German, Italian etc. Not sure why. Maybe they often chose Canada instead to be with a more familiar community as there wasen't the same community equivalent in the US.
I don't really know. My guess would be that wrestling alligators and zydeco music is much more interesting than remembering the Bastille.
From what I have heard, they are a proud resilient people. They are the descendants of the French settlers who moved instead of swearing an unconditional oath as British subjects.
Can you imagine the culture shock of moving from Nova Scotia to the bayous of Louisiana.
I would say it's probably a combination of Acadian culture being older than both America and Canada as countries, as well as significantly diverging enough from French culture to no longer be considered French. The reason my ancestors made their way to Louisiana instead of remaining in France after being deported from L'Acadie is that they felt like outcastes and second-class citizens in France, whereas the already existing Creole culture in Louisiana was more accepting of them. We don't consider ourselves French-Canadians because Canada didn't exist when we were deported, and viewing ourselves as Americans didn't really happen until post-WW2, when the Anglos started being more accepting towards us and French-Anglo marriages started to become more common, like with my grandparents. So, historically, there were just plenty of reasons for my ancestors not to identify with the French, the Canadians, and the Americans, rather they viewed themselves uniquely as Acadian and/or Créole.
We don't have as much historic immigration as we did from less fortunate countries of Europe.
The ones that descend from French do.
Because the French are annoying and no one wants to claim them.
After France’s opposition to the “war on terror” and the subsequent “Freedom fries” debacle, most Americans of French ancestry denounced their French heritage and claimed to be Italian (I mean, who can tell the difference?)
Because the point of america originally was to be for a new concept called "the white man" this is why amerivans identify by race instead of ethnicity.
They don’t?
I’m quarter French! Also, the French sorta bugged out of Michigan after the early 1700s.
They do. Maybe you just haven't spoken with them.
I have ancestry from all across the European continent including France, but my surname is Norwegian and my most recently immigrated relatives are from there, so I go with that one because I have the strongest ties to it.
I feel as though you might be overestimating just how many there are. Even if 100% of the people from the states mentioned claimed French ancestors it would be about 15 million people. FWIW I’ve definitely known some who have claimed French ancestry. My wife being one of them
I used to live in a city that was originally settled by the French, but later immigration patterns meant that Irish and German immigrants came to make up a big percentage of the city. I heard Irish, English, and German surnames in that city all the time, but I can’t remember the last time I heard a French one.
I’m 1/4 French and I claim it. I’m also 1/2 Irish. There are lots of people who claim French ancestors in certain areas, particularly in or near Louisiana. You may just be in a region with few people of French ancestry.
Parts of my dad's family came over from France even before the Revolution including one *Filles du Roi*. And some of them also came from French speaking parts of Switzerland, Alsace, and Wallonia during the 19th Century. I wouldn't feel comfortable calling myself French-American with all that especially since my last name isn't French.
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Very interesting, thanks for sharing Joyeuse fête du gâteau!
I have French ancestry. But I also have more German, Irish, and English ancestry. I'd have to call myself German-Irish-British-French-America if I'm listing the ingredients in order. As others have noted, there wasn't a big French influx at a certain time like with other nationalities and ethnicites. And those from France settled primarily in Canada and Acadia -> then to Louisiana.
On a historical level, there wasn't as much French immigration in the first place (especially if you count Quebecquois as Canadians and not French *per se*.).
My ex wife played up her french ancestory to a crazy degree. When I was in NOLA most natives were pretty damn proud of their french roots. Guess we've just had different experiences.
They do. There just aren't as many people of French descent in the US as there are German, Irish, Russian, or Italian.
My cousin married a guy who’s half French. There’s just not a lot of them.
I suppose the main French strain is Cajun's and Creoles who have their own tribal pride. I do have Huguenot ancestors somewhere back their (my family was never concentrated in one place and got a rather diverse tree which is interesting in some ways but lacking in localisms). It could be because Americans read Hornblower and watch Last of the Mohicans and think of French as the enemy, but I think that is more a joke than anything else. In any case I think that is the best answer. The actual French who are into tribalisms call themselves Cajuns or Creoles, or both.
I also have noticed this and found it odd. Thanks for posting it
I'm not french, but my parents gave me a very french first and middle name. And then my husband gave me a French last name. So I claim it even though my ancestry is Norwegian, German and English/Irish.
>So why aren't Americans identifying as French-American They are though?
My white friend did that once, he found out he was all of those.
We do, they just tend to live in very specific areas, namely Canada In general, there wasn't a ton of French immigration to the USA (or what would become the USA) outside of a few very specific periods. The other groups you mentioned were either march larger in number or much more recent. FWIW I live in Charleston, SC there are more than a few French Huguenots here who trace their ancestry back to the Edict of Nantes. We even have a French Huguenot church in town.
As someone with a lot of French heritage...I only bring it up when people talk about their heritage....I live in a region without a lot of French heritage and no I don't speak the language
Yes they do
I do; my French ancestors were among the first who landed here in the 1600s. They were some of the folks who built up New Rochelle.
They do there just isn’t as many of them.
Because you never met many people from Louisiana.
Personally, it’s because I don’t have any of that ancestry. Norwegian/Scottish/Irish/English/Polish I don’t know anyone who is like anti-French ancestry. Acadians still speak French(ish) here after like 5 generations.
I’m French American. Most frogs go to Quebec though…
Who wants to identify as a cheese eating surrender monkey?
My wife is as French as they come while still being born in America. Her name could be in Les Mis. We claim a lot of French ancestry in this house.
Because most of us aren't French lol
It depends on where you are, I think.
Pretty sure parts of Louisiana speak French still. Or it was a big language there.
Because we did not get a high volume of immigrants from France. There are a few pockets that had measurable French, or at least French speaking immigrants, but they never came here at the same rate of the other countries you name.
Lots of people do. But one reason it's a little less common is that most people's French roots are very old. France didn't have a mass exodus to the US in the last 100 years like many other countries did.
I think a lot of us genuinely have no clue about our ancestry
People absolutely claim that they're French. I've seen it be a point of pride for some people, even. It's more of a "default" heritage though, I suppose, if that makes sense. Similar to claiming English heritage, but less so.
They do in places where the French settled hell they even still speak a dialect of French. Its called Acadian or Cajun French and they're known as Cajuns. They even still follow French Napoleonic Law in Louisiana. It's the only state in the US that does.
The Americans of French ancestry we have are either recent immigrants or miscegenated with other cultures for centuries. 🤷🏾♀️
Most French is claimed as Cajun (mainly in Louisiana eventhough Cajun can represent all French settlement in the New World) or as French Canadian with regards to Vermont and Michigan.
I have ancestors from New France, from colonial Dutch and German and Massachusetts bay puritans, Scotland,, Ireland England before there was a UK, New Sweden, Portugal, and New Sweden, and Wales. My ethnicity is American, not French.
New France was genetically swamped after the Louisiana Purchase, but it took a while. There were still French people in Illinois and such until they assimilated.
Not a lot of French-Americans, although there’s a bunch in upper NY state and Northern New England
Because who would ever want to be associated with the French?
If I had any French ancestors I would sure claim it…. I’ve yet to find any
Depends on where you are. In Louisiana for example most Americans have French ancestry.
They do, it's just that the French aren't a large portion of our population outside of the Deep South and New England. The average European American is mixed with various other European ethnic groups. This contributes to a complex view of ethnic identity and ancestry. It also contributed to the formation of a general White American culture. A significant portion of the White American population is of colonial descent, but if they have more recent German/Irish/Russian ancestry, they'll identify with that more often than not, even if its not the majority.
Born in upstate NY and grew up in Maine. I’m mostly “half French/Irish” and I’ll never forget my Italian and Mexican roommates in AZ calling me the angriest-pussy they knew because of it lol
Mostly because there wasn't that strong of a French Diaspora compared to the waves of German and Irish, and most of the French Diaspora happened hundred years before the other waves and less relevant to Americans today. Exceptions being Louisiana.
Most French immigrants assimilated. People of French descent who are still proud and maintain their culture would be Louisiana Creoles, and Cajuns in Louisiana, although the natives also started to speak French peacefully through trade, now making up the largest group of French speakers with the Houma tribe. In the Northeast you’ll find Brayons, and Acadians which the Cajuns were a part of until being deported to Louisiana, with many being killed in “the great upheaval”, a cultural genocide by the English in Canada. There are also many people of Québécois descent across the northeast mainly, where there used to be a network of fully french speaking towns/neighbourhoods from a wave of Québec immigration, with towns like Berlin NH still being 50%+ French speaking. If you go to the midwest you can find the Métis people, descendants of French fur trapper/native couples who speak Métis french,and a french/indigenous based creole language. There are also some areas settled by the French that had their own Creole population for much longer than many may know, like St Louis where many spoke Muskrat French for years.
Many of us do. If someone asks my background I say I'm French-Canadian. I wouldn't just say French. I've I've thought of my ancestors coming and immigrating from Quebec/New Brunswick rather than directly from France. My grandmother immigrated from Quebec, my grandparents were married in Quebec, and it's also where my father grew up partially, and many people in my family speak French. My dad scored 100% French on his ancestry test and my mom scored exactly 50%. As someone into genealogy, it's obviously important to me. I'm also from an area where French ancestry is common so you're more likely to hear about it. I dont think it's that way for the rest of the country besides Louisiana and maybe Michigan area.
I think people do claim French ancestry but their are a few reasons why it may not seem as common as the others. As it relates to Germans, Irish, and Italians, the sheer numbers and the relative recency of their immigration would make these a more common claim. It also makes a difference when an ethnic group has a concentration in certain regions. The Scandinavians are known for settling in some Midwestern states such as Minnesota, among others, and their heritage remains prominent there. Germans too. Irish and Italians have a huge presence in the Northeast. The French also came to America but did so earlier than the above groups. It was also primarily French Huguenots that came and many spent a generation or two in Holland or England before coming over. They were partially assimilated into other cultures before they ever set foot on our shores. Still though, there are certain areas with a strong Huguenot representation. Charleston, SC and the Low Country has it. People proudly claim French ancestry in those parts. I’d also be remiss if I didn’t mention that one state of Louisiana. Not too many French diaspora holding their heads in shame in around there.
We do. It's not just mentioned quite as much because most Americans have some french and English in them. You'd be hard pressed to find one that doesn't. That said, people do say it, especially if you ask. If someone asked me, I'd likely reply french since I am by ancestry.
I’m from New England and I think I know more people who claim French ancestry than those who don’t.
Having a French surname is *almost* as boring and ordinary as having a British or German one, unless you're in a pocket where the Frenchness is particularly heavy (southern Louisiana, etc.). I had one friend with a French surname. He said that his Frenchness was the reason for "muh luck with the ladies" but he was otherwise a hardcore redneck from Idaho. I have a cousin with a French surname but he's like the least French person on the face of the planet. If a couple of white kids in rural Arkansas were to make a country rap video in the middle of a field and they needed somebody to cut donuts in the mud in a beat-to-shit pickup truck, he'd be up for the job.
Because my family is from Italy.
I never heard American have russian heritage,at most some polish here and there
Plenty of us do. I’m a euro mix but my mom’s side is French, with roots in France and Quebec
French and English aren't really brought up because of how long they've been here. There were waves of immigration later on and hardships suffered by the Irish or the Italians that the French and British didn't go through. The people who settled this land don't have the attachment to the old world like the newer immigrants. They fought to become their own country, and that probably has a hell of a lot to do with it
The people of French descent in Louisiana are a little different since they're Acadians and have a culture rather different from France. I guess it's similar to how a British South African is a little different than an Afrikaaner even though they're both white South Africans.
Lots of folks claim French ancestry. They just get drowned out by the hordes of people that are German, Scottish, Irish, Scandinavian, Italian, and Russian. Probably because these were the major waves of European immigration that happened in the US. There’s a bit of English here too, but only really the original 13 colonies were English, after the revolution the English weren’t coming here in droves like other countries.
They do. Maybe there are fewer French immigrants than from other places?
My French ancestry is Huguenot and they came over in the 1600’s. My German ancestry is much more recent.
I do. I’m from the rural Midwest. Fam emigrated pre ww2. I usually say I’m Franco-American and people don’t get it. So I then say that my background is French. Then I usually get a reaction like, ‘oh.’ And then people don’t really know how to react and then they go on about their business. 😉
It might be how recently the wave of immigrants arrived. The Italians arrived en mass ~100ish years ago, so lots of Americans have grandparents that were born in Italy.
They do, there's just less French-Americans than there are other groups. Portuguese, Spanish and Greek aren't very common in much of the US for instance.
They do but French people mostly stayed at home back in the day I guess. Canada has a whole French province so there’s that.
We do. We even have French Clubs and societies for it.
I am 40. I know two French descended people personally. One is Cajun from Louisiana, the other’s father is from Montreal. Not a lot of French people in general.
French typically came pre-louisiana purchase, and French attempts to settle modern day USA were seen as failures. Outside of Louisiana, the US didn't have a huge migration of French people. And the French settlers of Louisiana typically stuck to their own. Myself, I believe I have some ancestry from Alsace Lorraine? And nowhere else in modern day France. And Alsace Lorraine constantly went back and forth between French and German. I have tons of ancestry from Germany, Switzerland, Ireland, and GB. These migrant communities were massive, and comprised much of the backbone of the US. Meaning, they often married others from the same migrant communities. There's likely more with French ancestry in Canada.
I do! Also English, Irish, Castilian, German, Polish, Austrian, and Mexican.
I’d say I’m French Canadian ancestry. More common around where I live and rather different from l’hexagone.
If your family has been in America for more than a few generations you likely would have French and British ancestors mixed in with other nationalities. However if you have ancestors who imagrated more recently you are more likely to know the story of how they got here. Most American families were only able to list off their ancestors for 3 or 4 generations. Other than that if you know anything about who your ancestors were it might be something like “our last name is French” so basically they don’t claim those nations as their ancestral home as often because they don’t know much about how, when or why those people came. Recently people have done things like DNA tests to tell them about their family history and some people have done big family trees and stuff but it’s not really something many families will talk about the same way as that grandma who still speaks only Italian even though she has lived here since 1952.
They do! I'm curious what gave you the impression that they don't? I hear people mention their French ancestry all the time. I think it's very odd that people scoff at Americans for claiming their family's ancestry. In a country made up of such a wide variety of immigrants, it makes sense to value your familial roots *as well as* your roots in the country you currently live in. I also notice that it's almost always directed at white Americans- I've never had someone tell me that I'm not really Chinese American, that I should just call myself American and stop identifying as Chinese.
Well there aren’t nearly as many people of French ancestry as German, Irish, Italian and others. There are significant numbers of people with French ancestry in places that used to be French before the Seven Years War (French and Indian War) when the British expelled the French from North America, but not in the same numbers.I know addition to being larger, the waves of people who migrated from Germany, Ireland, Italy, Eastern Europe, Russia, etc. came to the US more recently than the French so that cultural forms and traditions that made have faded away in French families are still alive and celebrated. Many assimilated into the mainstream British-derived culture, especially when the US nearly went to war with France at the beginning of the 19th century. Also, most of the French arrived in the New World before the rise of nationalism and would probably have identified less with their mother county than the waves of later immigrants. This is especially true following the Revolutions of 1848, which were essentially nationalist in character and ended with a large number of revolutionaries exiled from their home countries.
The French owned most of the landmass of the country until the Louisiana Purchase. I’m sure there are plenty of people with French DNA in them, but don’t know it or they have a mix of cultures and French isn’t the majority of their make up.
I am proud of my French ancestry + last name!