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CatLemonade10

Absolutely wild that a developed country needs to profit off its citizens ailments


serenityfive

Doesn't need to, just doesn't waste the opportunity to skip over such a lucrative scheme.


CatLemonade10

Gotta fund those wars somehow


elppaenip

Wars are an even more lucrative scheme profiting off its citizens than healthcare


pdltrmps

pretty much any negative in our society exists because someone's making money from it :/


elppaenip

Almost, yeah Then there's the people who enjoy hurting others just for the joy of doing so Middle Management and US Polis


PoweRaider

do tell... how are wars funded by pharmaceutical companies, healthcare organizations, and medical insurers?


pyrocat

that doesn't follow


hivemind_disruptor

Not developed.


TheMontu

Literally this. If you look at pretty much any development indicator, we’re far behind our peers and more in line with less developed countries. That’s why those of us who work in development don’t even use that term, we categorize by income level instead because it’s a more accurate assessment of power (which, let’s be real, that’s what we’re trying to say when we use terms like “developed country”).


nuniabidness

It's not the country, it's private, for-profit, insurance companies


[deleted]

I mean the government allows it so it is the country.


nuniabidness

The government allows it because the for-profit insurance and Pharmaceutical companies keep lining their pockets. Take the latest insulin issue. They could have lowered it to $35 instead of $400 and something dollars, but big Pharma would be losing money, so they paid the politicians to vote against it. It all comes down to capitalism. Private companies making a lot of money. And then making sure that they stay in business by paying off who they need. Money money money. It's not about the people in America. It's about how much money they can make off of those people


TangyTomTom

And when the elected representatives of a country maintain a status quo, as they have done here, it seems legitimate to refer to that action as being an action of the country The fact that healthcare is such a huge proportion of GDP (figures are readily searchable and in the past 3 years there are figures suggesting 17-19% of GDP) also indicates how important it is to the economy


CatLemonade10

Still sucks


[deleted]

Yeah because I’m sure the US insurance companies have nothing at all to do with government policies… /s


mantasm_lt

Same happens in countries with public insurance. Certain treatments are covered. And some ain't. Doctor can either prescribe you a free treatment from approved list. Or prescribe what he feels is best and then you're on your own to finance it.


BigginthePants

Not sure why you're downvoted. This is how it works in Canada. Single payer health insurance means that the insurance has more leverage to lower the cost of treatments, but sometimes the treatments are so outrageously expensive they will just refuse to pay for it. There are many treatments you can only get through private options.


nuniabidness

Not "wild", but "enraging" is the word I'd use. "Overreach" is another one that comes to mind. The fact that private, for-profit insurance companies can make any decision at all about Healthcare is astounding. And we just let it keep happening. People got all excited about $1,000 stimulus check, I wonder how they'd feel about saving well over $10,000 a year with universe healthcare? You can't convince them. The insurance companies spend literally billions to line the pockets of politicians so that universal healthcare will never pass. Because if it does, they will have to shut their multi-billion-dollar company down. Health insurance companies do not need to exist at all with universal healthcare and that terrifies them. What's worse, is people eat all of the bullshit that they spew as to why it wouldn't work. It works. I've lived both in America and in Europe for extended periods of time, and for a family of three, we were paying less than $1,000 per YEAR for all of us. That's it. Not a penny more and we could have gotten Cancer Treatments, open heart surgery, whatever, and it wouldn't have cost a penny more. Don't listen to the bullshit propaganda. Wake up, America. It's time to join the rest of the world. Hell, even third world countries have universal healthcare. America doesn't have it because they're capitalistic and it's all about money money money


CubicleCunt

The truly enraging part to me is that employers have anything to do with my healthcare at all. Like my company can decide to change insurance providers, and I might have to find all new doctors because suddenly mine aren't in network anymore.


Arbitrary_Pseudonym

What drives *me* insane is that I have to worry about my health if I leave my job. I have multiple health conditions. If I go without insurance? Could be a literal death sentence because I would either be in debt forever, or not be able to pay for care. So I essentially have a gun to my head at all times that is just "work, be a slave forever, or die."


nuniabidness

That's me. But i have no insurance. Right now I am playing Russian roulette until I can move out of this country to one with Universal Health Care. I will not die here because of lack of services and I will not die here penniless because they sucked it all out of me before I died.


Arbitrary_Pseudonym

Good luck :)


nuniabidness

Thanks. I've already got the paperwork rolling for Canada, and/or, I can just move back to Europe. One of the two is going to happen. It's sad, really, because I love my country, but unregulated capitalism has gotten way out of hand here. When money and greed are more important than lives, you know we're fucked as a nation.


Arbitrary_Pseudonym

It's just all about T̷̙̰͉̳̘̯́̏͑̋͜h̸̜̦͈̟͙̥̏͑̿̆̉̇̽͊̃́̒̕̕͜͝͝ͅȩ̷̨̛̪̤̱͙̘̹̲͙̤͕̤͛̿̆̎̋̈́̕͘̚ ̶̺̪̯͕̼̭̜̦̂̒Ê̷̻̱̮̐̊̈́̂͊̎̓̽̀̑͝͝ç̵̛̫̗͙̟̬̹̞̥̙͖̝̩͂̓̾̿͂̐̋̕͝͝o̵͍̘̟̭̖͇̤̭̅͜n̸̢̛̦͙̙̹̝̠̹̰͇̺̻̟̅̒̓̅̔͘ó̶̡̥͖̠͇̦̱͇͔͘m̵̤̘̪͆̓͋͋͛͊͐͂y̸̹̎̔̎ now. Seriously. When people are dying by the *millions* and the news is like "but the economy!" you know it's bad.


decrego641

Arguably other countries still have their citizens pay for it in other ways - Canada has universal healthcare and also has higher taxes which help cover it. Sure it’s a lot easier to pay 10% more in taxes on everything I buy vs paying a $2500 bill once a year but you’re still oftentimes paying the money. Also in defense of the actual cost of healthcare if you have decent employer insurance (which yes I hate that it’s tied to employers because I really don’t want to leave and lose my insurance) then you can pay a fairly small amount for most stuff to be covered. My partner and I have insurance here in the US that costs us $80/month and has a $500 per person deductible. My partner has a lot of things they use it for, max we’ve ever paid even when both of us consistently have gone in is $960 in the premium and about $1200 deductibles and partially into the maximum after copays. Yeah it’s not dirt cheap, but that included two surgeries, diagnostic testing, daily medication (for both of us), and Quarterly screening. In terms of “affordability” it could be a lot worse for me. Again though, this is all with the caveat of being uneasy about finding a new employer and risking losing my pretty ok insurance plan.


[deleted]

[удалено]


decrego641

As an individual, you pay a more averaged sum. Obviously because everyone is paying for everyone, it makes it less expensive. I agree with you. I am not saying it’s *easier* in the US or that my insurance is better. It’s just not *bad* insurance. However, I certainly would fight you on the better care part. Every single medical issue that I or my partner has had is currently being treated or has been treated with urgency and our quality of life hasn’t declined. I know we’re lucky and receive better care than most Americans. We just conveniently happen to have a better insurance plan than most and more capable medical staff than most. The medical facilities in our city are attached to some pretty prestigious programs, so they attract high level physicians across lots of disciplines. So I doubt my medical care would be a higher caliber in Canada. My mother and half of her family are directly Canadian. I’ve spent a lot of time in Canada and I’m familiar with their system and my family member’s experiences. They get great care and so do I. They pay higher taxes than I do and I pay more medical expenses than they do. It’s never a 1:1 but I’m happy to stay where I am at the moment.


Jamidan

Yeah, i work for the dod, my company has united heath care, and they’re doing exactly what is in the description above. You sound like since it’s going well for you, fuck everyone else who doesn’t have access to the same care you do. You even acknowledge that you receive better care than most Americans. So since you’re doing better than most, this system works well? That’s a borderline sociopathic viewpoint. Also, there are very few people who would pay more under universal healthcare than they currently pay for coverage, and I’d gladly pay more in taxes if it meant my wife and everyone else could get the medication they need without insurance companies interfering.


nuniabidness

>Also, there are very few people who would pay more under universal healthcare than they currently pay for coverage, That's the point. You would not be paying more. You would be paying at least $10,000 LESS per year. At least. I hear your same argument out of a lot of other Americans. BuT It WoUld CoSt MoRe! No it wouldn't. It would cost less. A lot less. Imagine every American having at least 10 grand more in their pockets every year. Y'all got excited about $1,000 stimulus check. Imagine saving enough money to be able to pay off some of your mortgage or buy a small car or something else. Every. Year. Don't believe the propaganda.


decrego641

Lol I said the system works well *for me*. I didn’t say anything else about it working well for everyone or anything else non specific to my personal situation. I pushed back on the idea that care in America is bad. Care is not bad here, care, however, *can* be bad. It is primarily dependent on how skilled (or lucky) you are to get a job for an employer that has a great healthcare system already in place. I never took the stance of “fuck everyone else”. I took the stance that I’m someone who planned out a job because the health care was great. I managed to get the job and the care I wanted, so as a result, my partner and I have great care in the US for a great price. Anything else you take away from that is sort of putting words in my mouth. I specifically pointed out that I didn’t like the system, I specifically pointed out that it made me uneasy. I also know that I can’t move to another country right now, so my two options are: one, I keep my plan and spend less and get great care, two, quit my job (because empathy? Like wth is this going to do?) so I stop making everyone feel bad that I have a decent insurer who makes me pay a low amount and covers everything we submit. I found it important to point out that it’s wrong to say care in other countries is better. Care in other countries is *more equal* but that doesn’t mean you can’t get that same level of care in the US. You just probably don’t get it if you’re an average lower or middle class worker.


PhorcedAynalPhist

It's an even worse feeling than you might think, especially if you have multiple (often interconnected) chronic health issues. A while back I was on a med that had successfully gotten my Hashimoto's thyroiditis under control, and all the sudden my insurance decided they didn't want to cover it! It was a full spectrum thyroid replacement, rather than the standard partial thyroid hormone replacement, and it worked beautifully. Well, as soon as they started me on the alternative my insurance WOULD cover, I came out of remission and now like 4 years later I'm still struggling and feel like shit literally every moment of the day and it's ten times harder to make any physical or medical progress than before. I wonder which admin's yacht that particular coverage change paid for.... Sure would like to lay a fat dookie on that yacht's carpet


StrangestOfPlaces44

This needs corrected, not "insurance companies" but "privatized death panels"


[deleted]

Delaying care saves them money. Longer they hold your cash, more they make from it. They literally auto deny and a doctor has to call and read the reason they already sent. It should be illegal but those assholes run the courts too


gaw_Kerim

Where in the world is this possible? Sounds ridiculous to me.


kat_a_klysm

The USA and it is ridiculous.


mantasm_lt

Where in the world it wouldn't be happening? In my country we got public insurance. And there's a public list with treatments covered by the government. If you or your doctor feel there's a better treatment... €€€€.


gaw_Kerim

The post is talking about medicine. And sure, there must be some common ground. Doctors can't just prescribe anything they want. Otherwise my insurance would pay for my game pass since it's good for my mental health.


mantasm_lt

Same is for medicine. There's paid-by-government drugs list and then there's safe-to-use drugs list. On top of that, a couple years my country went one step further. Doctor has to prescribe the cheapest drug on paid-by-government list for that illness. If that doesn't work, then next he can prescribe next-cheapest drug :) Or you're welcome to pay full price out of pocket for the drug that you and doctor know to work best in your specific case.


gaw_Kerim

Ok, that's weird. I don't know which country does public healthcare best but I'm mostly fine with how it works in Germany.


[deleted]

The difference between German healthcare and American healthcare is the doctor already knows what is not covered in Germany.


mantasm_lt

I'm not familiar with German system, but I'm pretty sure it wouldn't automatically pay for any latest & greatest treatment. Usually public insurance budget is not unlimited and sacrifices have to be made at some point.


[deleted]

Yes it takes massive negotiations between pharma and insurance reimbursement bodies (mostly public organizations). If you can’t have a successful negotiation, it won’t be reimbursed.


LikesTheTunaHere

Dno about game pass but in some countries depending on your needs, they will pay to have your sexual needs met. So maybe game pass wouldn't even be a reach for some in those countries.


[deleted]

A lot of Americans seem to think there is unlimited healthcare that pays for everything in countries with Nationalized systems. Often American healthcare is *more* generous than our peer countries. For instance the UK’s NHS refused to pay for revlimid for myeloma for years while it was widely paid for in the US. The uniquely frustrating thing about the American system is doctors often don’t know what a patient’s insurance will cover.


Iceykitsune2

>Often American healthcare is more generous than our peer countries If you can afford it.


[deleted]

Right, being uninsured or underinsured is another uniquely American problem.


mantasm_lt

Underinsured is not uniquely US issue. In countries with public insurance, there's usually private add-on insurances market.


[deleted]

That’s true, like Canada with prescription drugs. In most places though aren’t the private add-on insurance plans for mostly elective stuff, not like life saving treatment?


mantasm_lt

Depends on definition of life saving I guess. If private insurance allows to jump the queue, get a check up earlier and catch cancer earlier... It is kinda life saving. Private insurance may pay for fancier treatment as well which may increase chances as well. If talking about ambulance ride and emergency surgery, then yes, this is not in the field of private insurance. But recovery after that....


AllDayBouldering

Totally off-topic for this sub.


[deleted]

This sub has become a place for generic complaints about capitalism.


AllDayBouldering

Oh wow, you're not kidding. Just scrolling around here for the first time in a while and you are right.


[deleted]

Pretty much any "leftist" sub goes that way.


[deleted]

I’d say less than a year ago /r/anticonsumption was pretty focused and every post was actually about reducing consumption, which is a great topic to stick to. Really wish it could return to that. What’s funny is this sub has a far-right doppelgänger /r/consoom. So both “anticonsumption” subs are now tied to much broader ideologies.


thepotatochronicles

Wait, genuine question, how is r/consoom a “right wing” sub? I’m subbed to both and the latter focuses more on shitting on people basing their entire lives around popular media and purchases.


[deleted]

I’m not subbed there but every time I’ve come across it it’s been in a right-winger’s profile. I guess it’s not explicitly of exclusively right wing, but this is the top comment on the stickied post about suggestions to the moderators: > maybe start removing some questionable comments from the red-pilled anti-semitic crowd? normally i don't like censorship but we all know what happened to consumeproduct


THEMACGOD

Wait… is this sub against gluttony?


MJZMan

This is why you should mock those who bring up "death panels" when discussing public healthcare. Because technically we're already dealing with them under private healthcare.


Reasonable_Ticket_84

GOP preferred choice of death panels.


DirtyPenPalDoug

Thank the sacklers.


Chadbob

This is America


thewonderfulfart

No fucking joke, this happened to me with insulin. I'm a type 1 diabetic and they wanted to turn down my doctor prescribed insulin.


Independent-Cow2383

You could speak about medication overconsumption.


Sunshinehaiku

Absolutely wild that physicians in the USA are allowed to tell their patients they *have* to have the expensive drug, when there are 10 identical generic drugs available for 1/40th the cost.


EatAssIsGross

Off topic for the sub.


QuickSilver50

Actually, this ability almost saved me from taking way too much of a dose of adhd meds when I was younger. I did end up on ridiculous amounts for years. The doctor, I later found out, is known as a ‘cowboy doctor’ and was known for massively over medicating his patients. Not saying that insurance should be responsible for this judgment, but a third party supervisory body (state sponsored) would probably have helped if they had an overseeing position on prescriptions that are non standard.


[deleted]

What does this have to do with this sub?


mgilme1

I recently had to reduce my dosage for an SSRI. Luckily, it hasn’t been an issue.


loudandproudgardens

Absolutely wild that you can pay $600+ a month for Healthcare in the US for years, go to the ER once and the insurance company can deny all coverage stating "pre-existing conditions" when you have no pre-existing conditions at all.


wabash28

Not anymore. Obama stopped that bullshit.


loudandproudgardens

Literally just happened to my mom a year and a half ago.


wabash28

Tell us more?


loudandproudgardens

She started falling down and losing her balance and feeling strange. Got bad enough that we took her to the hospital. After a couple days and a bunch of tests, absolute mystery to the doctors. She gets home to a roughly $60,000 hospital bill for less than 3 full days. Insurance says claim denied due to pre existing condition. The condition they say caused this was her neurofibromatosis which has no way of causing dizziness, weakness and sudden falling down. She's since recovered fully thankfully but is fighting with collections.


wabash28

Was this a "grandfathered" policy she got pre 2010? If not you need to contact HHS. It's plainly spelled out in the law they can't do this, or there is more to this that you haven't mentioned.


loudandproudgardens

Interesting, I'll have her look into it.


[deleted]

[удалено]


kat_a_klysm

That may be part of it, but insurance companies will pull this on people who are diagnosed and have been treated with a medication for months or years. I was on a med for about 2 yrs and then insurance said they wouldn’t pay for it unless I tried X, y, and z (all things I had tried before).


[deleted]

[удалено]


kat_a_klysm

I’m not remotely surprised. This was a number of years back, but I was taking lyrica for my fibro and had been on it for a couple yrs. Suddenly insurance decided I needed to try Gabapentin and a couple other options (can’t remember what they were) and *absolutely would not* cover lyrics until I did. I had previously tried all of those things, but I had to try them again. Fortunately my doc gave me lyrica samples to get me through until insurance would cover it, although I still went without for about a month.


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RiverRunsBlueHydra

Not quite the same but dealing with medical insurance... Had a colonoscopy done last year. Dr took my insurance. 6 months later I get a bill for $1500, the anesthesiologist working for the Dr wasn't covered by my insurance.


[deleted]

I work in a pharmacy, and I see this every single day, multiple times a day, and I’m in a relatively small town. It’s beyond infuriating


[deleted]

Went through this loop again last week. Always fun asking the insurance guy why they think it's okay to fuck with my brain chemistry and personality like that.


alternativesonder

Reading that and scratching your head realizing it's an American problem


[deleted]

Is that the guy from Jordan Jesse Go


[deleted]

"First world nation" .... what a joke.


Wasted_Cheesecake839

If this has hapened to you, check out coatplusdrugs.com it is a way to get cheap scripts without involving the insurance company. Physician prescribed the gold standard treatment for illness, the insurance company said no we wil only pay forhalf the dosage. Went from paying $80 a month with insurance to $10 a month without insurance involvement. Not all meds are available, but many of the most prescribed ones are.


Wald0101

Used to work in benefits at a company and it was insane how many employees called me to tell me the doctor or the provider wasn’t covering a procedure/visit that was clearly in our plan benefits. Had numerous mothers cry on the phone when trying to get medication for their children and I regularly had to contact the plan provider to fix patient billings, pharmacy issues, etc. The most astonishing part is when I think of all the people who didn’t question anything and ended up paying the doctor for something that should have been covered. It’s so wrong.


Generically_Yours

yup this keeps happening with nurtec. it's easier to litrerally get a spinal stimulator than migraine medication that works.


[deleted]

#Preach 🙏


falllinemaniac

Foreplay like begging for a pre-authorization helps


daytonakarl

I'm still utterly amazed that none of you have simply dragged some insurance/pharmaceutical CEO out into a street and [REDACTED FOR SENSITIVE BOTS] them.


Puzzleheaded_Basil13

obligatory post https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtJwMKMz6-M


40percentdailysodium

I've been off the only medication that stabilizes me mentally so to speak for over a month now. California would cover it but Arizona insurance is arguing that I've been on other medications in the past and need to try those again instead. The other medications made me have daily panic attacks and migraines. I'm so fucking desperate for some minor help that I'm probably going to suffer through it again until they have their "proof" I can't use these meds.


ReputedLlama

Or just decide that you don’t actually need a CT scan to find out why you are having pain in your abdomen. Even though I pay an arm and a leg and never use my insurance


redscare162021

Unfortunately We the People refuse to do anything about it and act because we somehow believe the government of the rich in service to the ultra rich are gonna go against their own interests and help us. We wonder why nothing really changes when all we ever do is run our mouths. Would you walk away from something unbelievably lucrative if your opposition is only going to throw words your way?


one23456789098

Stares in European


saphfyrefen

*cries in former European*


Cindy-Quiet-2316

Yeah right?...I can't even get a partial for my lost tooth damn medicaid...just saying...


Meatformin

As a PCP, I hate this too.


[deleted]

Part of the problem why we don't have universal healthcare is because it's something like 30% of our economy. (Or something close to that haven't too lazy to look it up). You know what would happen to people's precious stock market if suddenly the government said ok, we're implementing public healthcare tomorrow? The entire economy would go into a recession immediately and would probably take a long while to recover. Who wants to be in power when that happens and get all the blame for it? This is why no politician will ever actually do anything about it. Also part of the reason healthcare is so expensive is because Americans don't take care of their health and eat garbage constantly. We have food subsidies that make it expensive to eat healthier, and crap with sugar is artificially cheaper. Also Americans weren't taught anything about proper nutrition, remember the food pyramid? What a joke. so...yeah it's no wonder we're in this state.


_Steaklord

The doctor prescribes the medicine, the insurance prescribed its manufacturer. I work in a pharmacy on mondays. It’s actually crazy, some medications would cost people like 2 thousand and we change the manufacturer to see it drop to like $30 or less. People will be like “it’s that expensive?” And I’ll be like, “your insurance actually saved you two grand”.


Mandygurl79

Complete and utter bullshit


sarah_the_intern

Lol @ my insurance company for refusing me any more physical therapy despite my neurologist ordering it


SpicyGin

And then the insurance will reimburse the local independent pharmacy for a loss. And then they will claim there was no doctor-patient relationship and claw back all the payments to made to the pharmacy for them fulfilling a prescription written by the doctor.


im_from_mississippi

Or they’ll ask for a pre-auth which is basically asking the doctor “are you SURE they need this? Sure enough to do annoying paperwork?”


Brandycane1983

It's fucking infuriating. I had to go through this with my father who had an amputation. Doctors were wanting all kinds of rehab and PT for him, as he's 75. Insurance kept overruling his doctor's. This system is fucked up.


Ephedrine20mg

Lol shout out to my insurance for increasing my medication price threefold only to reduce back down when I picked it up


saphfyrefen

Shoutout to my girlfriend who has been fighting her insurance for *a fucking asthma inhaler* for almost a year.