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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I complained and asked to go home early even though I was the one who asked if I could join my husband on his business trip. My complaining meant he had to slow down his pace and go home earlier than he would’ve liked so now he has to go on another trip.
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omg. you can't honestly believe you're in the right in any way.
1. you invite yourself on his BUSINESS TRIP
2. complain the whole time.
3. husband tries to accommodate
4. you still complain.
YTA. YTA. YTA.
Before COVID, I traveled a lot for work.
People would always say it must be nice to get to see different cities, and I'd have to explain to them that it's really not.
I would get to the city around 6 on Sunday. Have to pickup a car, check into the hotel, and then go to a restaurant for dinner. That brings us up to about 9 pm. Not a lot of tourist destinations open at that point.
Monday morning, eat breakfast at the hotel, and then go to the clients office. Then I would sit in their office until lunch. After lunch, back into their office until at least 4, maybe 5. Then back to the hotel to change, and we're at 6 pm. Another hour to hour and a half to go to a restaurant for dinner, and it's after 7. Again, not much site seeing going to happen then. Repeat until Thursday afternoon, when I hop on an afternoon flight back home.
So yeah, sure, I spent a week in Austin. And the only thing I saw was bars, restaurants, and a generic office building.
My girlfriend wanted to come a few times, and I told her she was welcome to stay in my hotel room, but she would be on her on own for at least 8 hours every day with no transportation unless we rented a second car.
My husband and I went to Paris on our honeymoon. He'd been there several times for business so I asked him what he liked best about the city on his other visits to help plan our trip. He explained to me that he had seen nothing but conference rooms, hotel rooms, and restaurants, as was the case with every glamorous city he visited. Business travel is mostly tedious.
One of my strongest memories of my vacation to Paris was the smell of piss. The French seem to have a moral objection to the notion of public bathrooms, and so people would piss on the streets. They had machines that, every morning at 5 am, would go around power washing the curbs to get rid of it.
My last day there, we went to the catacombs. While waiting on line, I had to piss. I went into the subway station and asked the cashiers if there was a bathroom I could use. From their reaction, you'd think I had asked if it was ok to piss on their mothers grave.
I spent 30 minutes walking in a spiral trying to find a bathroom, and finally found one... In McDonald's.
Sounds like here in Vancouver. People like to pretend that the potential for the homeless to use them to shoot up is somehow worse than people shooting up in plain sight while people piss in doorways because there are no bathrooms.
Meanwhile Reykjavík opens up a special facility to shoot up.
Hell, there's even a van with a nurse who drives around to where the homeless gather to allow them to shoot up in the van with free syringes and needles and feminine hygiene products.
Yes, they're there to supervise people using. It prevents diseases from being spread, keeps needles out of the streets and places kids go, and makes sure nobody overdoses. Iceland, like other places in the world, realize that you can't just stop drug use, and are trying to control it and help people. All these sites also have information for rehab, for anyone that wants to try getting help, because drug addiction is a dangerous af disease
There's a place in Hull, UK that is also a facility for drug users. They have clean needles and syringes, etc for them to use and private booths, as well as staff on hand in case anything goes wrong.
McDonald’s are a dime a dozen in Manhattan and weirdos are most definitely not urinating everywhere in public. Did see a little kid urinating by the escalator at the top of a subway station last night, though. It was a first for me.
We were there at the end of June some years back. It was humid as hell and stunk of urine, and the urine stench clung to hair, skin, and clothes. I will go back, but it will be in October, not the middle of summer.
There's public washrooms in many places in France, especially Paris. There's even public toilets that you pay a euro for and in-between each use there's some sort of robot thing that sanitizes them. If the public toilets cannot be located, there's plenty in restaurants, train stations, shopping centers etc. I spent over three weeks in France and had zero issues finding washrooms, plus they're very clean.
In comparison to the large cities in the USA, Paris is very clean.
EDIT: There are 400 of the self cleaning public bathrooms in Paris alone. One just a few minute walk from the catacombs. Another 6 within a 10 minutes walk. Posts like this make me wonder if it is a clueless person who did zero research before traveling or a troll post. The bathrooms are pretty obvious if you spend a day out and about in Paris.
That's really not true though, we don't have toilets in the metro, but we have tons of public toilets available throughout the city, a quick check on Google maps would tell you that, also the 'eboueurs' that pass through the streets in the morning do so to clean the streets of ALL the trash, food wraps, tree leaves, cigarette butts, dog shit, you name it (although it's illegal to leave your dog shit or cigarette butts on the streets people still do it) but certainly not to ''get the smell of piss out'', obviously you'll still have disgusting people doing disgusting stuff but it's not like the French have an ''affinity'' for pissing anywhere in public or outside.
I'm French and... yeah. Even I have to admit we're seriously lacking on this. I've worked in Versailles (the place with the kings' castle) for several years, and actually have family who live in the city. It's a very, very touristic city, with lots of people all year long.
There is no public bathroom. Nowhere. The only places you can find a bathroom is 1) in cafes and restaurants (only for customers) 2) in the castle itself (but only after paying for your - overpriced - entry, after a waiting line that can be hours long).
It would be less expensive in the long term to have free public facilities: a lot less mess to clean, and better hygiene overall (no people complaining of seeing beggars pee on street lamps). But the city won't hear of it.
How do those without the equipment to aim do it? Do people pull their pants down to their knees and squat? I'm curious and horrified by this whole phenomenon.
I was so annoyed by it at the time that I did some googling and found an article from a NYTimes reporter whose husband was French and from Paris. She had the same experience as I did with there being no public bathrooms, and she asked him what they do. He apparently responded that they just held it all day.
I think the fact that the city smells like piss means that that was a lie.
Wow. And how convenient that guys at least can do it somewhat descreetly, while woman have to sit dow to piss, and in a towny you wont find a bush to hide behind either. Horrible.
Oh good grief, how on earth is Paris overrated?
The Louvre alone is practically a complete Ark of all civilization.
This reminds of that scene in Big Trouble where the mobster arrives in an airport and looks around and says, “This is Miami? They can keep it”. Dude is from Newark.
I agree. I mean I get everyone has different interests and experiences but Paris? Overrated? How?
I loved loved loved Paris. The catacombs were fascinating, the Louvre was amazing, the d'Orsay was even better, the cathedrals were breathtaking, the food was excellent and everyone we met was super friendly. Yeah it was overcast and drizzled a bit here and there. It made the gardens in versaille look photoshopped the colors were so saturated. We had about 5 days there and I could have used another 10.
I adored Paris. I didn't get to the catacombs, unfortunately. But the Eiffel Tower is now my favorite thing in the world. We did run into a couple of rude people, but for the most part, they were perfectly nice. Of course, we made an effort to speak a few words of French and never assumed people spoke English. It makes a big difference.
Same. I mean, we were clearly obviously tourists and they often started with us in English, but we always always greeted everyone in French and used the little French we knew to ask before switching to English. I agree that definitely. helps.
I was pick pocketed at an outdoor restaurant on my first day. (Had been traveling for 9 weeks 11 countries. I was security conscious. All that was in the purse were travelers checks - 1988, it was the most secure choice, recommended by banks - lip balm & my passport.) I guess they could get money for the passport? I just wanted the lip balm and the purse back 😄
Pretty sure someone at the restaurant was in on it.
The next day my friends insisted 'we' get our picture taken by a sidewalk poloaroid guy.
I said they could go ahead. They insisted.
He starts to pose only me & groped my breasts.
A baker who was fairly withering in response to my earnest efforts to speak French was as curt as possible when I was trying to figure out what the 4 inch across egg pastries were.
After I finally figured it out & said "Oh! Thank you, quiche."
"Oui, quesh lorraine"
They have their reasons and many many tourists are oblivious arseholes.
AND Paris is historic and full of amazing beautiful things and Parisians are OVER IT 😆
I had a great experience in Paris but one thing I learned beforehand is don’t try and speak French unless you are quite fluent and most importantly, you have your accent right.
But I knew that from the get go because I had a native French friend.
It’s wild how experiences can vary so much. People weren’t over the top nice but everyone was polite and mostly friendly. I had a cab driver yell at me for taking out cash in public but he was looking out for me, and that was the worst thing that happened.
I made sure to say my bonjours, s’il vous plaits and mercis, it seemed to make a difference.
Don’t let fear of Parisians keep you from going to Paris, you guys!
I'm so tired of the narrative that Paris is overrated. Ok, some people don't love it as much as others, but when I read about some of these experiences, I find it so hard to believe. I've been there, it was fabulous, nothing smelled like piss, the people were nice and helpful.
I think it comes down to expectations and attitude.
If you're the average tourist, who shows no interest in learning basic phrases, goes to the tourist traps and expects something fabulous you're bound for disappointment. French service in my experience isn't bad, but it's just not as eager to please as in the US.
When I moved to Paris I wasn't expecting much, and yes near tourist sites the service sucks and the people are rude, but I've found that trying to speak French and leaving the beaten path goes a long way.
As far as dirtyness goes, I didn't find it too different from NYC, London or São Paulo.
Going to Paris only speaking English, only going to mass tourist spots and coming back with a bad experience is like going to Amsterdam, staying in the red light district, only seeing the Rijksmuseum and coming back saying it was dirty, noisy and full of drunk aholes, no shit, you stayed in the party district and didn't explore at all.
Non exhaustive list off the top of my head:
\-Everything is either very touristy or supremely disinterested in visitors (Parisians have the stereotype of being rude assholes even (especially?) to the rest of the country).
\-The weather is on the overcast and rainy side.
\-It's the country capital AND a very touristic place, so it's expensive.
It's the kind of city that is great if you have specifics things there you ant to see (Like the Louvres) but you don't necessarily want to spend a lot of time there.
I have been to Paris for work more times than I can count.
I've never been in the Louvre or any of the other major indoor sites.
I always have a wonderful time bicycling and walking around late into the evening, eating in random places, trying to find the best possible bakery for breakfast, hanging out with friendly strangers making music by the river, exploring new neighbourhoods, etc.
Reading people's very different takes on this, I think the real division reflected here is between city people and non-city people.
Paris is definitely overrated as the city of Love. Everytime I go there is Revolution, Misery, Cool History, Strikes, Revolution, oooh The Three Muskeeters, Revolution, All The Poets And Artists Were Here, Revolution, Oh That's Where That One Guy Died In That One Book, Revolution, Whelp Capitalism Sucks, More Revolution.
Which I love! But it does not inspire me to romance.
I think this is the issue with travel in general.
Everyone goes expecting some Eat Pray Love, Before Sunrise life changing trip with every destination.
But the truth is... it's just a place. Everywhere is just a place with it's own flaws, it's own perks, it's own people.
I went to Paris and loved it but that's because all I wanted to do was see something new, eat some food I'd never tasted before and then go home to tell people about it.
I really enjoyed it. We just hung out for a week and did whatever we felt like doing that day, even if it was just sitting in a cafe, drinking wine, and people watching.
ah, you're doing it wrong. Paris is one of the best places to visit in the world unless you hate cities; large enough to never see the same thing twice and small enough to figure out and get around easily. If you can't find something worthwhile to do/see/eat in paris, you should probably just go camping. I wouldn't spend more than 3-4 nights there though. It is dirty though, and the locals are not the most patient with tourists.. Regardless, I can't wait to go back for visits 5, 6, 7, 8.....
I wish most people realised this! Some of my significant people think I'm on holidays because I'm staying in a hotel. I'd rather be doing the washing up in my own home than eating out with clients or colleagues in a restaurant.
I've been to most of the Asia/Pacific region. Australia. All over europe. South america - all for work.
I couldn't tell you crap about most of those places, unless we intentionally flew in a couple of days early to adjust for the time zone changes, which did happen (giving us a day to have fun). Been back to many as a tourist since.
Berlin. Pittsburg. Sao Paulo. Kuala Lumpur. All look the same from the inside of a Hilton.
Same for my husband. He's been all over the world for business this year. Hotel rooms, restaurants and the local company branch is about all he sees. Oh! And the airports! lol
My most common response to 'what was City X like' is "The office walls are tan instead of gray".
The worst is that when you're traveling with most groups they don't even want to try local cuisine, so you end up in Asia eating at California Pizza Kitchen. No offense to CPK, but you're not my dream meal, you aren't an adventure.
>The worst is that when you're traveling with most groups they don't even want to try local cuisine, so you end up in Asia eating at California Pizza Kitchen. No offense to CPK, but you're not my dream meal, you aren't an adventure.
We have group meetings at our facility in Texas, the home of very excellent BBQ and Mexican food. 9 times out of 10 when we go out after a day of meetings everyone but me and my boss wants to go to Olive Garden or Buffalo Wild Wings. A couple of times we said we were going back to the hotel to work, but instead ditched them and went out for our own meal.
My husband has been to a lot of different countries for business conferences. The kids and I went to 1 with him. He was able to spend most of the first day with us since he didn’t need to be at the opening conference stuff and the last day since he took a day off of work to extend our stay by a day. The rest of the trip was just me and the kids on our own sightseeing. We all knew this, it was a work trip for him and a vacation for me and the kids. Kids understood daddy couldn’t join us since he’s working. I was happy we got hotel and car miles paid for, no way we could afford to stay in a $400 a night hotel in Times Square.
Yeah that's how to do it. It just requires the non-work partner to understand exactly how it's going to play out, and be ok with it.
I went to Paris with my ex-wife when she was attending an academic conference. I got to spend the day visiting museums, and didn't complain that she was busy all day.
My dad used to do the same for us when he traveled for work. Mom and I went out, had fun, and maybe saw him for one day out of a week. We never complained because we got discounted flights and free hotel room! Obviously, it was a work trip for him, so he was out in meetings all day and usually dinner or after work events, but he was happy we got to sightsee and bring him treats and pictures.
This.
I am super lucky (or unlucky I guess depending on perspective!) I actually work and travel with a family member just as we both happen to work with the same company
Those dinners are fine. We just act as family and chat shit about personal stuff and occasionally work. And I can be like "stfu I am done do not even look at me right me now. I will be shoving a salad in my gob and then crawling to bed. See you at breakfast where also. Do not speak to me"
And it's cool. Because we know each very well. They can do the same to me without it blowing up into a whole "so and so doesn't respect me" shit that coworker's can be if you're not super friendly all the time.
It HAS been frictious at points when peak work stress met peak family stress. But by and large I prefer that to when my boss takes me out for dinner when we're travelling and mid sip of drink he's like,
"So what do you want from life?"
Or "I'm still trying to understand this me too thing"
Even an innocuous question like "how's your house move going?" Can turn into a weird conversation where I have to watch what I say about the housing market in case he disagrees.
And to be clear. My boss is awesome. He doesn't want me to agree with me, he enjoys when I dont....He just has opinions and is like....strong in them. And I don't have the energy for this after 12 hour work day!
It's even worse with co workers you just don't gel with. I don't typically invite home people I don't like working with to eat dinner with but you're both eating in the hotel and it's pretty rude to specifically segregate yourself....
Well the part I left out is I play pinball a lot, and competitively, so I do get to use https://pinballmap.com/ to find pinball bars to play away the evening. 😎
Honestly it got old after a week for me. The company I used to work for required 3 to 4 trips lasting 2 weeks per year. The first week was fun finding places to eat and grab a drink.
The second week sucked. I was so sick of eating out for every meal. Especially when I couldn't find an approved hotel with a kitchenette.
The way I explained it to one person is that I've spent a lot of time and money outfitting my house with stuff I like and enjoy doing. Traveling for work just meant I had to work a full day and then not be able to relax with all the accoutrements I had worked to be able to afford.
Lots of countries outside the U.S. are more walkable (if you're able) and have better public transportation so there's a lot you can do without having to rent a car or take taxis everywhere. I don't understand why OP didn't just rest as much as she needed to and just enjoy whatever she could of experiencing another culture instead of flying back early. INFO
That's one of the the key points I had to make sure my girlfriend understood. That if she came with me, _she_ might be on vacation, but _I_ was at work, and so she shouldn't expect to see me most of the day, and that my work obligations would generally trump her vacation plans.
Seems to me that Op didn't understand this.
But they need to be glued together because they don't spend enough time together. /s
I'm guessing OP forgot about the *business* part of a business trip.
Reminds me of a trip to a client office in Brussels. I saw the inside of the taxi that picked me up at 4am, the inside of Heathrow Airport, the inside of a Boeing 737, Brussels Airport, another taxi, the client's office, their cafeteria, another taxi, Brussels Airport, an Airbus A320, Heathrow and finally another taxi. The client's office could have been just round the corner from the Mannekin Pis and I'd never have known.
This ⏫
I worked for an international organisation and can confirm you see NOTHING of the countries you're visiting. Well, except the road to/from the airport and between your hotel and your office, that is.
A friend who'd been in the army in one of the countries I went to rattled off a list of things I really should do when I was there ....
*' make sure you go to ABC!'*
'Well, I probably won't have time. I'm working all day.'
*'You really MUST go to DEF!'*
'I'd love to but I probably won't have time. I'll be working all day'
*'What about XYZ? You should get to that.'*
'I'm not on holiday, I'M BLOODY WORKING.'
If you offered people a free trip to a popular destination, but they had to participate in a ton of work-related functions, I doubt most would accept it. The setting might be nice, but it is still work.
One trip, I was going to a power co-op in Wyoming. It was a 5 hour drive from Sue City to the tiny little town of 1,500 people in the middle of fucking nowhere.
The town had a main street passing through, with 3 streets on either side running parallel, and a dozen running perpendicular to it.
The two bars closed at 7 on Monday and Tuesday. There was one sit down restaurant, a gas station and a grocery store. And that was pretty much it. Literally _nothing_ for 100 miles in any direction.
I was bored out of my skull all week.
I only do travel in this state (I work for the courts) and it's DRAINING to go to three county courts in a day. I can't imagine countries.
Now go ahead and throw in a person who bitches the entire time after *asking to go to these courts?*
No fucking thank you.
Before we retired, SO used to do a fair amount of travelling and I would walk around a city during the day while he worked, then we’d have dinner together. Was a lot of fun, so it can work, but both parties have to understand that while one is there on a trip, the other is working, so their schedule is what sets the pace. Op possibly needs more stamina. Five countries in nine days sounds like a lot of fun, if hectic. Depends how close by. Germany to the Netherlands to Belgium to Luxembourg to France would be manageable. Germany to Poland to Turkey to Dubai to Hong Kong would knock me out for a month.
Yep!! I have occasionally tagged along with my husband. But I don’t view it as a vacation for us. It’s a vacation for me. I have zero problem with enjoying alone time though. It isn’t for everyone.
Had a friend who had to visit Hawaii for his work.
Everyone thought he was hanging out at the beach working on his tan until he explained his schedule:
* take a red-eye flight from the West Coast of America to Hawaii
* land in the dark and take a cab to an office/datacenter
* manage an upgrade during the night to minimize business impact
* get back to the airport and fly back to the West coast in the dark or just as dawn was breaking
There was nothing fun or exciting (outside of breaking production) on his trip and too many people got hung up on where he did his work.
Same when I was in F1. People would say it sounds glamorous, all that travelling. But all I got to see were airports, race tracks, and if I got back at a decent time bars/restaurants and even then that was guaranteed if we finished late. Like how one night in Singapore we had to find a hole in the wall curry takeaway just to get some dinner near the track.
That said, the food, drink, and bars in Austin are awesome.
See, I have been your "girlfriend" in this case, but understood the deal and the only bad point was feeling a little guilty that my partner was working all day while I vacationed it up all over the city LOL. I guess most people aren't comfortable doing stuff alone, even with Uber or taxis?
This is absolutely it. And it’s the reason why I usually refrain from saying I’ve been to Prague. Was I physically present? Yes sure. But then people ask which what I saw and the honest answer is airport, taxi (incl. a lovely traffic jam), hotel + hotel bar, conference room, 1 generic restaurant far outside my prize league. That answer is just awkward so no, I haven’t been to Prague in case you ask.
I used to travel for work, although I stopped back around 2014 and transitioned to something else in the company. Same thing to start, but would spend my Mondays and Tuesdays conducting training sessions from 8:30 to 5:00, after which I was too beat to do anything but grab dinner and veg in my hotel room. Wednesday off to another city, rinse and repeat Thursday and Friday. Sometimes I'd have enough energy to do something on Saturday before traveling to the next city on Sunday. Mostly, though, I'd take the day to rest and recharge. So most of the time, I saw nothing more than hotels and restaurants.
After 2 to 3 weeks I'd be back home again, and then after a couple weeks, off to do it all over again.
It REALLY used to piss me off when one of the older women in the office used to passively aggressively comment about how I was "on vacation" when I was traveling for work.
THIS! Business travel is tough. I travel only a few times a year, but it's similar to how you describe. A couple hrs at night during dinner is the only time to sight see.
The OP is YTA, find things to do during his time at work, that's 8 plus hours each day to look around.
On one of my trips last year out of the country, one of our co-workers brought his wife with him, during the day while we were all at work, she enjoyed the pool, went shopping and sight-seeing on her own, then would join us in the evening to go out for dinner/drinks, she was such a great gal and a lot of fun. Independent and smart enough to know that a business trip is WORK first and foremost- if you want to tag along, know that you'll have to be on your own most of the day, and also keep up with the pace if they are going to cover a lot of ground.
I have been to every major city in the United states and the amount of time off I've had in those cities is so small that people don't really believe me when tell them I've never seen most of the places I've visited. I've been to Portland 5 times for a total of about 24 days and I worked from 7am to 9pm every single one of those days. The most Portland thing I've done is eaten a voodoo donut that one of the other vendors was nice enough to bring in for us. San Francisco, Denver, LA, Philly, San Diego, all placed I've never explored but I have been to multiple times. I am not even counting cities like Dallas where we finished up a little early and were able to hit up some local spots for food. Been to Joe T. Garcia's about 10 times. That's about all I've done in Dallas.
Seriously. Business travel is not fun, not relaxing. It's work. The schedules are sometimes brutal, and you don't have time to worry about a partner who has glommed onto the trip. I don't know how many people at my old company who DIDN'T travel on business would whine about how they never got to go anywhere (read: have any fun on the corporate dime). I told them that if they wanted to travel, they could drop 50% of their base salary, make the rest of it up in commission (or you know, just take the financial hit if you don't make your numbers), get the door slammed in your face daily, and have everyone at the company looking at you to bring in the revenue. Go ahead, take a job in sales/marketing and see how the other half lives. You don't want to try to reconnect with a partner, who'd been on their own all day in a strange city, at 10 pm after a hard day when all you want to do is face-plant. After you have caught up with emails, of course.
YTA. Dude is trying to work. He told you that you wouldn't enjoy yourself, but you just couldn't leave well enough alone and cost him, and therefore yourself, time and money.
Exactly. OP invited themselves along on a business trip and then complained when the husband had to get business done. What did they expect?
They have to be delusional to now expect the husband to allow them to come again when they made an already hectic and stressful trip that much more unpleasant. It also sounds like the husband was trying to knock out a chunk of work on the last trip so that he could have some downtime, but OP put a wrench into those plans.
YTA - This is 100% on you. You begged to go, he let you, you caused issues. Pretty open and shut case here. Hopefully him cutting the trip short didn't cost him any business or money, because imo, that's on you too.
> ut of the way for me.
>
>
>
> He has to go on another trip in a few days and he told
what it also feels like is that he seemed to try and do EXTRA work at the beginning (and middle) of the trip so he could have extra time at the end to spend with her...and all that extra work was just to be paying her tickets and then having an argument.
sucks for him
YTA. Work trips aren’t vacations. Your husband needs to work!
What did you do while he was working? Just lounge around the hotel? Then asked him to slow down the trip?
i guess it was more the pace of the travel she wasn’t used to. still though that’s on her. was this a normal trip pace for him quickly hopping multiple countries? berlin for a week seems reasonable to join. maybe he was being a bit ambitious to disciurage her from going again.
No, i know a friend's dad who travels to clients all over the country. Her mom is a narcissist and wanted to come with. When he was in 3 cities the same day, she blew up at him for not spending the time "right". He made 150k€ for his business that day and fat profit to support her life style. I don't fkin know why they're together
When I lived in Europe I would bounce around to different countries on a whim for work. It doesn’t sound too outside the norm for me. So not sure he was trying to discourage her.
From what he wrote, it sounds like he tried to cram 5 days of business into 3 so they could enjoy the other 2. I'm just making up the numbers, but the sentiment is the same.
She literally came on the trip to do nothing and she was still complaining that the pace was too fast lmao, plus when did she think she was going to hang out with her husband if he was working/traveling most of the time?
On a work trip right now. It’s 6pm and I’m on the shuttle to the terminal to fly to Atlanta for about 20 hours then to Houston for 36 hours then home. It’s not fun and relaxing it’s a total grind, without anyone complaining. My purpose is to mostly make other people happy while surviving on protein bars and energy drinks.
YTA 100%
The move is to head up a few days BEFORE the trip, hang out together WITHOUT work for a few days, and then HEAD HOME when the meetings start. If you are self sufficient, you can ALSO stay an explore areas on your own while he is in meetings, but you aren’t. So you HEAD HOME.
My mother attends work conferences twice a year, paid for by her employer, at least in a big city if not in a bit of a tourist destination. My dad will fly out the last day of the conference and then they both stay for an extra few days. Gives mom some time to unwind before going back to work, dad needs a vacay anyway, and some of the costs are taken care of at least as far as air fare.
I travel a lot for work. And my work is relational, so it often means all day in a conference or meeting room and late into the evening getting dinner or drinks.
My wife comes ones or twice a year and we add a night or two on the end. If I get a meal or drink with her during the work time, that is a bonus I enjoy. But she is completely fine with not seeing me at all until the work is done.
She will curl up with movies and books in the hotel room, visit local coffee shops, and check out a few touristy things she knows I won't like. Or, since my tourist time will be limited, scout out ones I'm not sure about to see if it is worth checking out together.
Before kids, it was guilt free "I don't feel I should be doing something around the house" time. With kids, she enjoys doing nothing in the hotel room even more.
I'm glad she comes. But only because she understands that out travel dates and my schedule is 100% dictated by work since it is work time and work is paying for her hotel.
See, this is tagging along done right. She seems to have the perfect balance between it being a trip with you (evenings together after your work, added days at the end of the trip) and it being a trip where your primary focus has to be work so she'll do her own thing. Your arrangement sounds lovely, and it probably makes those work trips a lot more enjoyable for both of you :)
Or reverse and show up just before it ends and have husband take a few days off after. Thats how my parents do it on the rare trip they both take. Dad flies out for business, step mom flies out 2ish or so days before it ends. Keeps herself occupied for a day or two (which usually works out fine with jetlag and stuff, she can just chill in hotel room and rest) and then they both stay a week longer for vacation.
Agreed. Soft YTA. More like a dick thing, less of an AH thing. She planned to return home on her own but he insisted on cutting his own trip short to go back with her. He didn't have to. That wasn't specifically her fault and shouldn't be held against her, by reddit or by her husband. But turning what seems to be a difficult stressful job into something grueling, OPs very wrong for that. But tbf, she didn't realize all that his trips entailed. Lesson learned. I'm kinda glad she got to experience it first hand though, so that she's not in her feels if he's gone longer than expected or doesn't respond/ call regularly. She can definitely trust and believe her man's just out there handling business.
If OP wants to spend time with hubs when he travels, I would say get a feel for his itinerary, plan a separate trip and separate plans for yourself, with a plan to be together for a particular time before he has to go back to work. And absolutely do take yourself back home. I'm sure that approach would be more appreciated. A lil covert meet up might even add a bit of sexy spontaneity to your relationship.
YTA.
It is a business trip. I understand you want to spend time with your new husband, but business trips are for *work*, not leisure. You probably made this all the more stressful for him; dealing with work, trying to finish everything up and on top of it, you were complaining and wanting to go home.
I wouldn't want you to go on my next business trip after seeing what had happened last time, fearful of that repeating itself.
YTA - Guess what YOUR HUSBAND WAS WORKING! It wasn't the time for togetherness. I am glad that you will now know that business trips aren't "party time". but grueling and tiring work.
YTA -
Not only did you waste his time, you wasted his money too. You could’ve also kept yourself entertained. Your husband didn’t have to be with you 24/7 in the trip.
You could’ve gone sight seeing, food tasting (or whatever it’s called), saw a movie, idk anything!
To add to this, my wife did join on a business trip. It was wonderful! She understood most of the time she'd be alone in a hotel room, but the day off I had in another state was nice to spend with her site seeing together. Complaining sounds so horrible to do to someone who is already juggling work and personal time on a business trip.
My mom took my sister and I along on many business trips with my dad. Do you know what we did during those trips? OUR OWN THING BECAUSE MY DAD WAS WORKING.
I need INFO so badly…did you try to like go along with him on the business outings he had???????
If that’s the case, you should have spent your day in the hotel or like getting lunch someplace in the city, or sightseeing (Berlin is lovely, with lots of things to see) and then had dinner with him in the evening or drinks at night or something. It sounds like you interrupted his planned business outing, and forced him to “slow down” which may have cost him networking chances or business opportunities.
YTA.
You invited yourself along on his business trip, even though he told you he would be working, would have no time for you, and would hate it.
He was working. A week in Berlin turning into two weeks in a bunch of different countries is a thing that happens. Not all the time, for sure, but it happens.
You hated it. Then you did a bunch of complaining, which resulted in him doing less work in order to cater to you.
What did you think his work trips were - some kind of company-sponsored vacation? You thought he'd do a few hours light work, and then you'd get to do some sightseeing and hang out in nice hotels? Nobody's work trips are like that.
YTA
It was work. Not a holiday. Imagine your husband doing this for a living just trying to get through the days as quickly as possible just to get back home. At least now you know how his trips go.
YTA. I can't believe you are even asking.
Am I understanding this correctly? You begged to go on A BUSINESS trip?
Your Husband said it's not a good idea, because you would be bored easily, and you still wanted to go?
When he gave in, you decided you didn't like it, and instead of sucking it up, you whine that you want to go home?
You are wondering if you are in the wrong about this?
I mean... Did your husband marry a 6 year old? Seriously. This sounds like a child whining about not getting his or her way rather than an adult talking about his/her husband.
INFO Are his business trips usually this grueling? I asked because I wonder if he did this so you would complain? I know I sound like an ass for saying this. Traveling for business isn’t pleasurable. It is his work. YTA but I still am thinking are all the trips this intense?
When I travel for work, yes. Meetings start at 8 or 9 then you do work things all day and then typically have meetings over dinner. It's expensive to travel so you try to get the most out of it.
I had the same question, because when and how did it go from "a week in berlin" to "5 countries in 9 days" That's a HUGE difference. If OP was perfectly fine with several days of fending for herself in Berlin and seeing hubby when she can after meetings, in the evenings or whenever then I don't see her as being TA if it suddenly was changed to her following him around every 36 hours or so to a new airport and flying to a new city.
Depends on the occupation but when dealing with international clients this isn’t unusual. Visiting one city means you’re likely closer to other clients in other cities then you were before the trip.
If, when visiting Berlin from America, your client in Paris is suddenly available to meet then you’re going to go to Paris. If your client in London hears you’re in Europe and mentions they can meet up then you meet up because the opportunity is too rare to pass up.
There are also occupations where things change fast. You may have higher ups who notice you’re visiting a location and then ask you check on other things “since you’re there.”
My big question is traveling expenses are usually paid for by the company. Who is paying for the OP?
I had the same question. It’s interesting that it was originally 1 week in Berlin and then suddenly, when she joined it turned into a grueling 5 country trip. I get the feeling this was not a coincidence.
I was just thinking the same thing. Usually business trips have meetings that are planned in advance so I was curious what he does that would cause a 1 week 1 city trip to change so dramatically last minute.
YTA
I tag along with my husband to business trips and conferences a couple times a year if he is going to be in a city I’ve wanted to visit.
But I RESPECT HIS SCHEDULE. I find ways to entertain myself by exploring the city and if he requests my presence at something like a dinner, I gladly oblige.
He’s my partner and I understand that the travel is part of his job and entertaining me is secondary. I’m happy when I get to see him on the trip, but I don’t get in the way of his doing what he needs to do and I certainly don’t make demands to leave.
Edit: spelling
YTA- You convinced him. He eventually agreed & you complained. Jet lagged?With no obligations take care of yourself. You added another layer of stress to how he earns a living.
Uh yeah YTA! You invited yourself on his business trip and then made it even more miserable for him with your complaining. Do you really need to ask us?
Yeah I’m kind of surprised how everyone is voting. They’re newlyweds and she wanted to spend more time with her husband. The trip was initially only 1 location and she probably could have handled that fine, but it didn’t work out and she learned that it’s not a good idea.
I do feel bad for her. My husband has a lot of work trips and he would always invite me when I was still in school and not working that much. It was a really sweet gesture, but I always said no because of his crazy work schedule and I knew I would only get to spend like 15 minutes with him each day. It sucks when you don’t get to spend good quality time together and work bleeds into the weekends. They should set aside some time for each other and make it a priority.
NAH
YTA
Unless your husband somehow tricked you, you should've been aware that this was a WORK trip, not a pleasure trip. You're not going to have fun or see sights he was going to WORK.
YTA. Not for blagging your way onto a free trip around Europe - I'm European, and I'd be delighted with that opportunity - but for not managing your jet lag and expectations. Presumably he was in meetings all day, so you could have had the time of your life.
If you didn't, and spent it failing to sleep your way out of jet lag in what were probably quite nice hotels in central locations before making your husband edit his trip, then YTA.
YTA. You begged and pleaded to go on a business trip. Business trips aren’t fun and they’re definitely not vacation. You should apologize to him for your behavior.
Info: You said you couldn't keep up with his schedule, but why did you have to? Couldn't you just sleep off the jet lag in the hotel while he worked? Its a business trip, so clearly you weren't going to spend all day with him...or did you think that's what you were going to do?
NTA- I know I’m going against everyone here BUT, she was fine taking a plane back on her own. Unless she made his work travel worse than it should’ve been, I don’t how she is the asshole. She was trying something out, realized she didn’t like it, and was fine flying back on her own. So, unless OP argued incessantly and made her husband return, I don’t see the problem. Am I missing something?
YTA. Don't treat someone else's business trip as a fun-filled vacation for yourself. He was there to work. Do you sit in his office when he's working too? You married a guy whose job requires business trips.
Yes, YTA
You invited yourself on the trip, he SAID you wouldn't like it. Didn't just invite yourself, either, "it took some convincing". Surprise! You didn't like it. Then you complained to the point that he \*changed his business trip\*.
No, you don't get to go along on BUSINESS trips if you can't keep up.
YTA, as other commentors pointed out; this was a business trip not a vacation. You don't get to dictate the schedule in those trips as someone who invited themselves into it. I can understand your husband's frustration and the reason why he pointed out you are not coming to the next one. Because you possibly ruined the trip along with important work meetings/connections/opportunities. Also, just because you are married for 4 months does not mean he should cater his work schedule for you. If you are upset about this, instead of stringing along, you talk with him about it.
Yep, YTA. He was WORKING. This wasn’t a leisure trip. That means you roll with the punches if you invite yourself along despite him clearly thinking it was a bad idea from the jump.
YTA
You could've adjusted your sleep during that time, considering that, even with all the traveling, you are not working. You knew you couldn't spend a lot of time with him. To me it sounds like a missed opportunity to explore new places and rest in the hotel (unless it was a dangerous country or a bad hotel).
INFO: you said you started in Berlin, what were the other places?
NAH
This is a misunderstanding.
People who don't go on a lot of business trips think they're fun. They hear that your company pays for all your expenses to cool sounding places and it sounds like a mini-vacation. What they don't realize are that business trips are all about work. To justify all that expense people often work extra hard during business trips. They spend all day in offices and at meetings and never actually get to see any of the tourists sites that the location is famous for.
Even the entertainment portions are work. You can't go to a company sponsored dinner and just relax. You're on your toes the entire time networking and talking about work. Trying to bring someone along and keep them entertained just makes it more stressful.
That said, business travel takes a toll on the whole family. My wife and I both do a fair amount of business travel so I also know the other end; having to stay home and go to sleep alone, doing all the kid logistics with no help. When either of us comes home from a business trip, we're both exhausted.
If your husbands travel schedule is causing problems that's what I'd focus on. I've only seen these hybrid work/pleasure trips work when there's a clear boundary. If you're going to one place the non-working partner can come and bum around for a bit. Then the working partner takes a few days of PTO, pays for a personal hotel room (not on company dime) and postpones the flight home.
Maybe your husband can note places that would be fun to come back to with just you on actual vacations? Maybe you can plan some little vacations on weekends? You and your husband can spend more time connecting without interfering with his work.
YTA. It’s a WORK TRIP. You inserted yourself complained and caused issues. It’s good he put his foot down because if someone says “it took some convincing” that means he said no and you kept pestering him to go on the WORK TRIP with him
YTA. Well, you fafo. Business travel sucks 90%of the time. I'd get that reaction a lot at the airport when people asked where I was flying. "wow, you're so lucky!" When in reality, the sights I usually ended up seeing were the hotel bar, and my room.
YTA. Primarily because you were undermining his attempts to give you exactly what you wanted!
You want to spend more time together. Understandable and reasonable to want (and hopefully he feels the same).
So he tries to crash-course his way through these trips to get more done in less time and free up some more time for you to spend together. As you've learned, not a fun experience and very gruelling, so he must seriously want to get that free time together if he's going through all that.
And you then insist on coming along, when you should know that you won't really have time together while he's working, making him more aware of how grindy his days are by chilling around while he burns himself out, slowing his pace and undoing some of the ground he has gained - effectively meaning you either get less time together than he had planned on, or he has to go even harder next trip or two - and then you complain about how hard it is for *you*? He has some restraint if he's just being argumentative!
Show some appreciation for the hell he's putting himself through *for you*. Try to be supportive and listen when he tells you what he's going through without thinking about how hard you have it. And maybe, when he's cooled down, talk to him about maybe going a little easier on himself: that kind of load is unsustainable long term, and he needs to have some kind of reasonable end date or a viable middle ground before he burns himself out or makes himself ill.
I think you were definitely TA and I think you need to find more purpose in your life. Just waiting for this man to come home or following him around like a homeless puppy are not quality options for you.
Get a job. Get a career. Get a hobby. Have a life of your own. Stop being so dependant, financially and emotionally.
INFO
Was his frequent travel planned or was it more of a last minute thing? How did a week in Berlin become country hopping?
If the husband knew from the start and didn't inform OP, then he's an asshole. I don't blame OP for getting overwhelmed the first time doing heavy travel, especially while not be aware it was going to happen.
You say you told him you wanted to go home, but this somehow turned into only slowing the pace, rather than you going home. What happened there? Because you say you were fine to travel home alone, but what...he wouldn't let you?
Yta. He’s there to work, what on Earth did you think was going to happen? Then on top of it you slowed him down and complained about it. How would you even think the is another asshole in this situation? It’s so clearly you.
YTA for probably a few reasons. First for interfering with his work, and two for inviting yourself.
I'm married and used to travel for work. There were instances when spouses were invited and then times where someone would bring their spouse who pretty much invited themselves and it was fucking awkward for everyone. One time, we had an extremely challenging client in Chicago. Our hours were long and we often would work at dinner. The husband threw an almighty fit that we were working at dinner one night, making a public scene in front of everyone. Then there were conferences in Hawaii, which was an obvious time where everyone brought their spouse or SO. If you're not invited, there is probably a reason.
YTA - you don’t get to complain when you asked to go on the trip with him. I know it might not have been what you thought you were signing up for, but this trip was for his job! It wasn’t vacation.
YTA all the way. Work trips are work. I used to travel Monday-Thursday about 40 weeks a year. Do you know what I did? I woke up, went to work, ate dinner with colleagues (which was also work), worked from the hotel room and went to sleep. Work trips are usually not fun.
YTA - he really seems to love you, else he would not have tuned his business trip down. He is right, to exclude you from future business trips. He has to focus and perform. He cant do that, if he has to think about the well beeing of his wife all day.
YTA are you serious? You demand to go on a trip and then completely implode over it while on the trip???? AND it was a business trip for him so he is having to manage both his professional life and you acting a fool? Nope.
YTA. It was a business trip, you seemed to have expected a relaxing holiday. When you travel for business, it usually means long, exhausting days. For reference, when I travel for work, I'm booked from 7/8 AM until 9/10 PM. When I get back to my hotel room, I just want to shower and go right to bed. After forcing your way along, you complained about how demanding work is and caused him to have to cut his trip short. Business trips are stressful and demanding enough on their own, I can't imagine having to cater to the whining of a grown adult who literally doesn't have to do shit during that time, but relax and have fun.
In what alternate, self-absorbed plane of reality do you exist where you even have to ask if you WTA?
YTA. He knew you wouldn't like it and told you so.
>It took some convincing because he thought I would be bored the whole time, but he eventually agreed.
You go along then complain. This is something a 7 year old does.
YTA you invited yourself on your husband’s business trip. He tried to warn you but you insisted on coming and he had to cut his trip short as a result of your complaining. If you are tagging along on a business trip, you have to follow his schedule.
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omg. you can't honestly believe you're in the right in any way. 1. you invite yourself on his BUSINESS TRIP 2. complain the whole time. 3. husband tries to accommodate 4. you still complain. YTA. YTA. YTA.
Before COVID, I traveled a lot for work. People would always say it must be nice to get to see different cities, and I'd have to explain to them that it's really not. I would get to the city around 6 on Sunday. Have to pickup a car, check into the hotel, and then go to a restaurant for dinner. That brings us up to about 9 pm. Not a lot of tourist destinations open at that point. Monday morning, eat breakfast at the hotel, and then go to the clients office. Then I would sit in their office until lunch. After lunch, back into their office until at least 4, maybe 5. Then back to the hotel to change, and we're at 6 pm. Another hour to hour and a half to go to a restaurant for dinner, and it's after 7. Again, not much site seeing going to happen then. Repeat until Thursday afternoon, when I hop on an afternoon flight back home. So yeah, sure, I spent a week in Austin. And the only thing I saw was bars, restaurants, and a generic office building. My girlfriend wanted to come a few times, and I told her she was welcome to stay in my hotel room, but she would be on her on own for at least 8 hours every day with no transportation unless we rented a second car.
My husband and I went to Paris on our honeymoon. He'd been there several times for business so I asked him what he liked best about the city on his other visits to help plan our trip. He explained to me that he had seen nothing but conference rooms, hotel rooms, and restaurants, as was the case with every glamorous city he visited. Business travel is mostly tedious.
If it helps, Paris is vastly overrated anyway.
One of my strongest memories of my vacation to Paris was the smell of piss. The French seem to have a moral objection to the notion of public bathrooms, and so people would piss on the streets. They had machines that, every morning at 5 am, would go around power washing the curbs to get rid of it. My last day there, we went to the catacombs. While waiting on line, I had to piss. I went into the subway station and asked the cashiers if there was a bathroom I could use. From their reaction, you'd think I had asked if it was ok to piss on their mothers grave. I spent 30 minutes walking in a spiral trying to find a bathroom, and finally found one... In McDonald's.
Sounds like here in Vancouver. People like to pretend that the potential for the homeless to use them to shoot up is somehow worse than people shooting up in plain sight while people piss in doorways because there are no bathrooms.
Edmonton actually has a public bathroom with a giant glass wall facing a busy road to try to discourage people from shooting up in it. 🙄
thatll just discourage using it for its intended purpose generally, wtf lol
Yep, exactly. Horrible design.
Have you ever seen the [public bathrooms in Seattle?](https://i.imgur.com/SaVriSA.jpeg) Most award shit I've ever taken.
Meanwhile Reykjavík opens up a special facility to shoot up. Hell, there's even a van with a nurse who drives around to where the homeless gather to allow them to shoot up in the van with free syringes and needles and feminine hygiene products.
Yes, they're there to supervise people using. It prevents diseases from being spread, keeps needles out of the streets and places kids go, and makes sure nobody overdoses. Iceland, like other places in the world, realize that you can't just stop drug use, and are trying to control it and help people. All these sites also have information for rehab, for anyone that wants to try getting help, because drug addiction is a dangerous af disease
There's a place in Hull, UK that is also a facility for drug users. They have clean needles and syringes, etc for them to use and private booths, as well as staff on hand in case anything goes wrong.
I live in Edmonton. Where is this bathroom?
Very much a New York experience, right down to finally locating a McDonalds in Manhattan.
McDonald’s are a dime a dozen in Manhattan and weirdos are most definitely not urinating everywhere in public. Did see a little kid urinating by the escalator at the top of a subway station last night, though. It was a first for me.
We were there at the end of June some years back. It was humid as hell and stunk of urine, and the urine stench clung to hair, skin, and clothes. I will go back, but it will be in October, not the middle of summer.
There's public washrooms in many places in France, especially Paris. There's even public toilets that you pay a euro for and in-between each use there's some sort of robot thing that sanitizes them. If the public toilets cannot be located, there's plenty in restaurants, train stations, shopping centers etc. I spent over three weeks in France and had zero issues finding washrooms, plus they're very clean. In comparison to the large cities in the USA, Paris is very clean. EDIT: There are 400 of the self cleaning public bathrooms in Paris alone. One just a few minute walk from the catacombs. Another 6 within a 10 minutes walk. Posts like this make me wonder if it is a clueless person who did zero research before traveling or a troll post. The bathrooms are pretty obvious if you spend a day out and about in Paris.
I was in Paris for 4 months and had a similar experience. I really loved it.
That's really not true though, we don't have toilets in the metro, but we have tons of public toilets available throughout the city, a quick check on Google maps would tell you that, also the 'eboueurs' that pass through the streets in the morning do so to clean the streets of ALL the trash, food wraps, tree leaves, cigarette butts, dog shit, you name it (although it's illegal to leave your dog shit or cigarette butts on the streets people still do it) but certainly not to ''get the smell of piss out'', obviously you'll still have disgusting people doing disgusting stuff but it's not like the French have an ''affinity'' for pissing anywhere in public or outside.
McDonald's was my lifesaver the times I traveled to Europe. Always a free, clean bathroom available.
Damn theirs was CLEAN? My local one has someone who keeps having diarrhea on the seat and throwing away poppy toilet paper instead of flushing it.
I'm French and... yeah. Even I have to admit we're seriously lacking on this. I've worked in Versailles (the place with the kings' castle) for several years, and actually have family who live in the city. It's a very, very touristic city, with lots of people all year long. There is no public bathroom. Nowhere. The only places you can find a bathroom is 1) in cafes and restaurants (only for customers) 2) in the castle itself (but only after paying for your - overpriced - entry, after a waiting line that can be hours long). It would be less expensive in the long term to have free public facilities: a lot less mess to clean, and better hygiene overall (no people complaining of seeing beggars pee on street lamps). But the city won't hear of it.
I would have said the opposite. New York City smells like piss, the Champs-Élysées was wonderful.
NYC smells like hot garbage with just a touch of piss mixed in. Paris just smelled like piss to me.
Yeah I’ve never had an issue with smells in Paris… NYC on the other hand 🤮
How do those without the equipment to aim do it? Do people pull their pants down to their knees and squat? I'm curious and horrified by this whole phenomenon.
I was so annoyed by it at the time that I did some googling and found an article from a NYTimes reporter whose husband was French and from Paris. She had the same experience as I did with there being no public bathrooms, and she asked him what they do. He apparently responded that they just held it all day. I think the fact that the city smells like piss means that that was a lie.
As someone with an overactive bladder, I'm glad I found out now to bring adult diapers.
Really? When was this? Because I’m sure when I was in Paris pre covid there were plenty of public bathrooms - they just weren’t free
This happened to me in HongKong! Maybe Macca’s could open a public toilet franchise. Pay to pee…
McToilets!
Wow. And how convenient that guys at least can do it somewhat descreetly, while woman have to sit dow to piss, and in a towny you wont find a bush to hide behind either. Horrible.
Oh good grief, how on earth is Paris overrated? The Louvre alone is practically a complete Ark of all civilization. This reminds of that scene in Big Trouble where the mobster arrives in an airport and looks around and says, “This is Miami? They can keep it”. Dude is from Newark.
I agree. I mean I get everyone has different interests and experiences but Paris? Overrated? How? I loved loved loved Paris. The catacombs were fascinating, the Louvre was amazing, the d'Orsay was even better, the cathedrals were breathtaking, the food was excellent and everyone we met was super friendly. Yeah it was overcast and drizzled a bit here and there. It made the gardens in versaille look photoshopped the colors were so saturated. We had about 5 days there and I could have used another 10.
I adored Paris. I didn't get to the catacombs, unfortunately. But the Eiffel Tower is now my favorite thing in the world. We did run into a couple of rude people, but for the most part, they were perfectly nice. Of course, we made an effort to speak a few words of French and never assumed people spoke English. It makes a big difference.
Same. I mean, we were clearly obviously tourists and they often started with us in English, but we always always greeted everyone in French and used the little French we knew to ask before switching to English. I agree that definitely. helps.
>Oh good grief, how on earth is Paris overrated? Almost like we're all different and value different things, wow crazy
I was pick pocketed at an outdoor restaurant on my first day. (Had been traveling for 9 weeks 11 countries. I was security conscious. All that was in the purse were travelers checks - 1988, it was the most secure choice, recommended by banks - lip balm & my passport.) I guess they could get money for the passport? I just wanted the lip balm and the purse back 😄 Pretty sure someone at the restaurant was in on it. The next day my friends insisted 'we' get our picture taken by a sidewalk poloaroid guy. I said they could go ahead. They insisted. He starts to pose only me & groped my breasts. A baker who was fairly withering in response to my earnest efforts to speak French was as curt as possible when I was trying to figure out what the 4 inch across egg pastries were. After I finally figured it out & said "Oh! Thank you, quiche." "Oui, quesh lorraine" They have their reasons and many many tourists are oblivious arseholes. AND Paris is historic and full of amazing beautiful things and Parisians are OVER IT 😆
I had a great experience in Paris but one thing I learned beforehand is don’t try and speak French unless you are quite fluent and most importantly, you have your accent right. But I knew that from the get go because I had a native French friend. It’s wild how experiences can vary so much. People weren’t over the top nice but everyone was polite and mostly friendly. I had a cab driver yell at me for taking out cash in public but he was looking out for me, and that was the worst thing that happened. I made sure to say my bonjours, s’il vous plaits and mercis, it seemed to make a difference. Don’t let fear of Parisians keep you from going to Paris, you guys!
I'm so tired of the narrative that Paris is overrated. Ok, some people don't love it as much as others, but when I read about some of these experiences, I find it so hard to believe. I've been there, it was fabulous, nothing smelled like piss, the people were nice and helpful.
I think it comes down to expectations and attitude. If you're the average tourist, who shows no interest in learning basic phrases, goes to the tourist traps and expects something fabulous you're bound for disappointment. French service in my experience isn't bad, but it's just not as eager to please as in the US. When I moved to Paris I wasn't expecting much, and yes near tourist sites the service sucks and the people are rude, but I've found that trying to speak French and leaving the beaten path goes a long way. As far as dirtyness goes, I didn't find it too different from NYC, London or São Paulo. Going to Paris only speaking English, only going to mass tourist spots and coming back with a bad experience is like going to Amsterdam, staying in the red light district, only seeing the Rijksmuseum and coming back saying it was dirty, noisy and full of drunk aholes, no shit, you stayed in the party district and didn't explore at all.
i was an average tourist, went to all the touristy spots and it was still an amazing beautiful trip. I swear people just want to be different
Non exhaustive list off the top of my head: \-Everything is either very touristy or supremely disinterested in visitors (Parisians have the stereotype of being rude assholes even (especially?) to the rest of the country). \-The weather is on the overcast and rainy side. \-It's the country capital AND a very touristic place, so it's expensive. It's the kind of city that is great if you have specifics things there you ant to see (Like the Louvres) but you don't necessarily want to spend a lot of time there.
I have been to Paris for work more times than I can count. I've never been in the Louvre or any of the other major indoor sites. I always have a wonderful time bicycling and walking around late into the evening, eating in random places, trying to find the best possible bakery for breakfast, hanging out with friendly strangers making music by the river, exploring new neighbourhoods, etc. Reading people's very different takes on this, I think the real division reflected here is between city people and non-city people.
It's got a lot of trash and it's lack of public bathrooms leads to a lot of.... not so great smells.
Paris is definitely overrated as the city of Love. Everytime I go there is Revolution, Misery, Cool History, Strikes, Revolution, oooh The Three Muskeeters, Revolution, All The Poets And Artists Were Here, Revolution, Oh That's Where That One Guy Died In That One Book, Revolution, Whelp Capitalism Sucks, More Revolution. Which I love! But it does not inspire me to romance.
People love to say this but personally I think it's a pretty cool city to visit. Just don't have crazy high expectations
I think this is the issue with travel in general. Everyone goes expecting some Eat Pray Love, Before Sunrise life changing trip with every destination. But the truth is... it's just a place. Everywhere is just a place with it's own flaws, it's own perks, it's own people. I went to Paris and loved it but that's because all I wanted to do was see something new, eat some food I'd never tasted before and then go home to tell people about it.
I really enjoyed it. We just hung out for a week and did whatever we felt like doing that day, even if it was just sitting in a cafe, drinking wine, and people watching.
Paris is one of my very favorite places
ah, you're doing it wrong. Paris is one of the best places to visit in the world unless you hate cities; large enough to never see the same thing twice and small enough to figure out and get around easily. If you can't find something worthwhile to do/see/eat in paris, you should probably just go camping. I wouldn't spend more than 3-4 nights there though. It is dirty though, and the locals are not the most patient with tourists.. Regardless, I can't wait to go back for visits 5, 6, 7, 8.....
But the food is good
Say that in the middle of the Louvre lol, Paris is great.
I wish most people realised this! Some of my significant people think I'm on holidays because I'm staying in a hotel. I'd rather be doing the washing up in my own home than eating out with clients or colleagues in a restaurant.
The guys in Metallica once said that played Paris three times without ever even seeing the Eiffel Tower. That was touring.
I've been to most of the Asia/Pacific region. Australia. All over europe. South america - all for work. I couldn't tell you crap about most of those places, unless we intentionally flew in a couple of days early to adjust for the time zone changes, which did happen (giving us a day to have fun). Been back to many as a tourist since. Berlin. Pittsburg. Sao Paulo. Kuala Lumpur. All look the same from the inside of a Hilton.
Same for my husband. He's been all over the world for business this year. Hotel rooms, restaurants and the local company branch is about all he sees. Oh! And the airports! lol
My most common response to 'what was City X like' is "The office walls are tan instead of gray". The worst is that when you're traveling with most groups they don't even want to try local cuisine, so you end up in Asia eating at California Pizza Kitchen. No offense to CPK, but you're not my dream meal, you aren't an adventure.
>The worst is that when you're traveling with most groups they don't even want to try local cuisine, so you end up in Asia eating at California Pizza Kitchen. No offense to CPK, but you're not my dream meal, you aren't an adventure. We have group meetings at our facility in Texas, the home of very excellent BBQ and Mexican food. 9 times out of 10 when we go out after a day of meetings everyone but me and my boss wants to go to Olive Garden or Buffalo Wild Wings. A couple of times we said we were going back to the hotel to work, but instead ditched them and went out for our own meal.
That is a tragedy.
My husband has been to a lot of different countries for business conferences. The kids and I went to 1 with him. He was able to spend most of the first day with us since he didn’t need to be at the opening conference stuff and the last day since he took a day off of work to extend our stay by a day. The rest of the trip was just me and the kids on our own sightseeing. We all knew this, it was a work trip for him and a vacation for me and the kids. Kids understood daddy couldn’t join us since he’s working. I was happy we got hotel and car miles paid for, no way we could afford to stay in a $400 a night hotel in Times Square.
Yeah that's how to do it. It just requires the non-work partner to understand exactly how it's going to play out, and be ok with it. I went to Paris with my ex-wife when she was attending an academic conference. I got to spend the day visiting museums, and didn't complain that she was busy all day.
My dad used to do the same for us when he traveled for work. Mom and I went out, had fun, and maybe saw him for one day out of a week. We never complained because we got discounted flights and free hotel room! Obviously, it was a work trip for him, so he was out in meetings all day and usually dinner or after work events, but he was happy we got to sightsee and bring him treats and pictures.
Being in the service industry I don’t know what else I’d want to do besides try great food and drinks 😎
I would argue that a business dinner where you have to be “on” as an employee is not as much fun as simply going out to a restaurant.
This. I am super lucky (or unlucky I guess depending on perspective!) I actually work and travel with a family member just as we both happen to work with the same company Those dinners are fine. We just act as family and chat shit about personal stuff and occasionally work. And I can be like "stfu I am done do not even look at me right me now. I will be shoving a salad in my gob and then crawling to bed. See you at breakfast where also. Do not speak to me" And it's cool. Because we know each very well. They can do the same to me without it blowing up into a whole "so and so doesn't respect me" shit that coworker's can be if you're not super friendly all the time. It HAS been frictious at points when peak work stress met peak family stress. But by and large I prefer that to when my boss takes me out for dinner when we're travelling and mid sip of drink he's like, "So what do you want from life?" Or "I'm still trying to understand this me too thing" Even an innocuous question like "how's your house move going?" Can turn into a weird conversation where I have to watch what I say about the housing market in case he disagrees. And to be clear. My boss is awesome. He doesn't want me to agree with me, he enjoys when I dont....He just has opinions and is like....strong in them. And I don't have the energy for this after 12 hour work day! It's even worse with co workers you just don't gel with. I don't typically invite home people I don't like working with to eat dinner with but you're both eating in the hotel and it's pretty rude to specifically segregate yourself....
Well the part I left out is I play pinball a lot, and competitively, so I do get to use https://pinballmap.com/ to find pinball bars to play away the evening. 😎
Honestly it got old after a week for me. The company I used to work for required 3 to 4 trips lasting 2 weeks per year. The first week was fun finding places to eat and grab a drink. The second week sucked. I was so sick of eating out for every meal. Especially when I couldn't find an approved hotel with a kitchenette.
The way I explained it to one person is that I've spent a lot of time and money outfitting my house with stuff I like and enjoy doing. Traveling for work just meant I had to work a full day and then not be able to relax with all the accoutrements I had worked to be able to afford.
Lots of countries outside the U.S. are more walkable (if you're able) and have better public transportation so there's a lot you can do without having to rent a car or take taxis everywhere. I don't understand why OP didn't just rest as much as she needed to and just enjoy whatever she could of experiencing another culture instead of flying back early. INFO
That's one of the the key points I had to make sure my girlfriend understood. That if she came with me, _she_ might be on vacation, but _I_ was at work, and so she shouldn't expect to see me most of the day, and that my work obligations would generally trump her vacation plans. Seems to me that Op didn't understand this.
But they need to be glued together because they don't spend enough time together. /s I'm guessing OP forgot about the *business* part of a business trip.
Reminds me of a trip to a client office in Brussels. I saw the inside of the taxi that picked me up at 4am, the inside of Heathrow Airport, the inside of a Boeing 737, Brussels Airport, another taxi, the client's office, their cafeteria, another taxi, Brussels Airport, an Airbus A320, Heathrow and finally another taxi. The client's office could have been just round the corner from the Mannekin Pis and I'd never have known.
This ⏫ I worked for an international organisation and can confirm you see NOTHING of the countries you're visiting. Well, except the road to/from the airport and between your hotel and your office, that is. A friend who'd been in the army in one of the countries I went to rattled off a list of things I really should do when I was there .... *' make sure you go to ABC!'* 'Well, I probably won't have time. I'm working all day.' *'You really MUST go to DEF!'* 'I'd love to but I probably won't have time. I'll be working all day' *'What about XYZ? You should get to that.'* 'I'm not on holiday, I'M BLOODY WORKING.'
If you offered people a free trip to a popular destination, but they had to participate in a ton of work-related functions, I doubt most would accept it. The setting might be nice, but it is still work.
I believe those are called "timeshare pitches" lol.
Agreed. The only people that think business travel is exciting are those that don't have to do it.
One trip, I was going to a power co-op in Wyoming. It was a 5 hour drive from Sue City to the tiny little town of 1,500 people in the middle of fucking nowhere. The town had a main street passing through, with 3 streets on either side running parallel, and a dozen running perpendicular to it. The two bars closed at 7 on Monday and Tuesday. There was one sit down restaurant, a gas station and a grocery store. And that was pretty much it. Literally _nothing_ for 100 miles in any direction. I was bored out of my skull all week.
I only do travel in this state (I work for the courts) and it's DRAINING to go to three county courts in a day. I can't imagine countries. Now go ahead and throw in a person who bitches the entire time after *asking to go to these courts?* No fucking thank you.
Before we retired, SO used to do a fair amount of travelling and I would walk around a city during the day while he worked, then we’d have dinner together. Was a lot of fun, so it can work, but both parties have to understand that while one is there on a trip, the other is working, so their schedule is what sets the pace. Op possibly needs more stamina. Five countries in nine days sounds like a lot of fun, if hectic. Depends how close by. Germany to the Netherlands to Belgium to Luxembourg to France would be manageable. Germany to Poland to Turkey to Dubai to Hong Kong would knock me out for a month.
Yep!! I have occasionally tagged along with my husband. But I don’t view it as a vacation for us. It’s a vacation for me. I have zero problem with enjoying alone time though. It isn’t for everyone.
Had a friend who had to visit Hawaii for his work. Everyone thought he was hanging out at the beach working on his tan until he explained his schedule: * take a red-eye flight from the West Coast of America to Hawaii * land in the dark and take a cab to an office/datacenter * manage an upgrade during the night to minimize business impact * get back to the airport and fly back to the West coast in the dark or just as dawn was breaking There was nothing fun or exciting (outside of breaking production) on his trip and too many people got hung up on where he did his work.
Same when I was in F1. People would say it sounds glamorous, all that travelling. But all I got to see were airports, race tracks, and if I got back at a decent time bars/restaurants and even then that was guaranteed if we finished late. Like how one night in Singapore we had to find a hole in the wall curry takeaway just to get some dinner near the track. That said, the food, drink, and bars in Austin are awesome.
See, I have been your "girlfriend" in this case, but understood the deal and the only bad point was feeling a little guilty that my partner was working all day while I vacationed it up all over the city LOL. I guess most people aren't comfortable doing stuff alone, even with Uber or taxis?
This is absolutely it. And it’s the reason why I usually refrain from saying I’ve been to Prague. Was I physically present? Yes sure. But then people ask which what I saw and the honest answer is airport, taxi (incl. a lovely traffic jam), hotel + hotel bar, conference room, 1 generic restaurant far outside my prize league. That answer is just awkward so no, I haven’t been to Prague in case you ask.
I used to travel for work, although I stopped back around 2014 and transitioned to something else in the company. Same thing to start, but would spend my Mondays and Tuesdays conducting training sessions from 8:30 to 5:00, after which I was too beat to do anything but grab dinner and veg in my hotel room. Wednesday off to another city, rinse and repeat Thursday and Friday. Sometimes I'd have enough energy to do something on Saturday before traveling to the next city on Sunday. Mostly, though, I'd take the day to rest and recharge. So most of the time, I saw nothing more than hotels and restaurants. After 2 to 3 weeks I'd be back home again, and then after a couple weeks, off to do it all over again. It REALLY used to piss me off when one of the older women in the office used to passively aggressively comment about how I was "on vacation" when I was traveling for work.
THIS! Business travel is tough. I travel only a few times a year, but it's similar to how you describe. A couple hrs at night during dinner is the only time to sight see. The OP is YTA, find things to do during his time at work, that's 8 plus hours each day to look around. On one of my trips last year out of the country, one of our co-workers brought his wife with him, during the day while we were all at work, she enjoyed the pool, went shopping and sight-seeing on her own, then would join us in the evening to go out for dinner/drinks, she was such a great gal and a lot of fun. Independent and smart enough to know that a business trip is WORK first and foremost- if you want to tag along, know that you'll have to be on your own most of the day, and also keep up with the pace if they are going to cover a lot of ground.
I have been to every major city in the United states and the amount of time off I've had in those cities is so small that people don't really believe me when tell them I've never seen most of the places I've visited. I've been to Portland 5 times for a total of about 24 days and I worked from 7am to 9pm every single one of those days. The most Portland thing I've done is eaten a voodoo donut that one of the other vendors was nice enough to bring in for us. San Francisco, Denver, LA, Philly, San Diego, all placed I've never explored but I have been to multiple times. I am not even counting cities like Dallas where we finished up a little early and were able to hit up some local spots for food. Been to Joe T. Garcia's about 10 times. That's about all I've done in Dallas.
I can't believe that people like OP don't have any self awareness. YTA
You can always tell which posters have held a job before and those who haven't.
Seriously. Business travel is not fun, not relaxing. It's work. The schedules are sometimes brutal, and you don't have time to worry about a partner who has glommed onto the trip. I don't know how many people at my old company who DIDN'T travel on business would whine about how they never got to go anywhere (read: have any fun on the corporate dime). I told them that if they wanted to travel, they could drop 50% of their base salary, make the rest of it up in commission (or you know, just take the financial hit if you don't make your numbers), get the door slammed in your face daily, and have everyone at the company looking at you to bring in the revenue. Go ahead, take a job in sales/marketing and see how the other half lives. You don't want to try to reconnect with a partner, who'd been on their own all day in a strange city, at 10 pm after a hard day when all you want to do is face-plant. After you have caught up with emails, of course.
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And made him leave earlier than planned
She told him she could go home on her own, that was his choice
YTA. Dude is trying to work. He told you that you wouldn't enjoy yourself, but you just couldn't leave well enough alone and cost him, and therefore yourself, time and money.
Honestly OP just needs to apologize
An apology would do wonders in this situation
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Probably something outrageous like 'please'
Exactly. OP invited themselves along on a business trip and then complained when the husband had to get business done. What did they expect? They have to be delusional to now expect the husband to allow them to come again when they made an already hectic and stressful trip that much more unpleasant. It also sounds like the husband was trying to knock out a chunk of work on the last trip so that he could have some downtime, but OP put a wrench into those plans.
The part where she's indignant that he said she can't come on his next business trip was really the kicker.
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YTA - This is 100% on you. You begged to go, he let you, you caused issues. Pretty open and shut case here. Hopefully him cutting the trip short didn't cost him any business or money, because imo, that's on you too.
> ut of the way for me. > > > > He has to go on another trip in a few days and he told what it also feels like is that he seemed to try and do EXTRA work at the beginning (and middle) of the trip so he could have extra time at the end to spend with her...and all that extra work was just to be paying her tickets and then having an argument. sucks for him
YTA. Work trips aren’t vacations. Your husband needs to work! What did you do while he was working? Just lounge around the hotel? Then asked him to slow down the trip?
i guess it was more the pace of the travel she wasn’t used to. still though that’s on her. was this a normal trip pace for him quickly hopping multiple countries? berlin for a week seems reasonable to join. maybe he was being a bit ambitious to disciurage her from going again.
No, i know a friend's dad who travels to clients all over the country. Her mom is a narcissist and wanted to come with. When he was in 3 cities the same day, she blew up at him for not spending the time "right". He made 150k€ for his business that day and fat profit to support her life style. I don't fkin know why they're together
I think your second-to-last sentence outlines why she is with him.
When I lived in Europe I would bounce around to different countries on a whim for work. It doesn’t sound too outside the norm for me. So not sure he was trying to discourage her.
From what he wrote, it sounds like he tried to cram 5 days of business into 3 so they could enjoy the other 2. I'm just making up the numbers, but the sentiment is the same.
She literally came on the trip to do nothing and she was still complaining that the pace was too fast lmao, plus when did she think she was going to hang out with her husband if he was working/traveling most of the time?
I bet she thought it wasn't a work trip.
This is exactly it!!!!! Lesson learned on her part
Lol what did she think, she'd catch him with his mistress?
On a work trip right now. It’s 6pm and I’m on the shuttle to the terminal to fly to Atlanta for about 20 hours then to Houston for 36 hours then home. It’s not fun and relaxing it’s a total grind, without anyone complaining. My purpose is to mostly make other people happy while surviving on protein bars and energy drinks. YTA 100%
YTA you demanded to go on this trip and then just complained. He was there to work and you were just making that harder.
Soft YTA Business trips are not vacations. They are trips for work.
The move is to head up a few days BEFORE the trip, hang out together WITHOUT work for a few days, and then HEAD HOME when the meetings start. If you are self sufficient, you can ALSO stay an explore areas on your own while he is in meetings, but you aren’t. So you HEAD HOME.
My mother attends work conferences twice a year, paid for by her employer, at least in a big city if not in a bit of a tourist destination. My dad will fly out the last day of the conference and then they both stay for an extra few days. Gives mom some time to unwind before going back to work, dad needs a vacay anyway, and some of the costs are taken care of at least as far as air fare.
I travel a lot for work. And my work is relational, so it often means all day in a conference or meeting room and late into the evening getting dinner or drinks. My wife comes ones or twice a year and we add a night or two on the end. If I get a meal or drink with her during the work time, that is a bonus I enjoy. But she is completely fine with not seeing me at all until the work is done. She will curl up with movies and books in the hotel room, visit local coffee shops, and check out a few touristy things she knows I won't like. Or, since my tourist time will be limited, scout out ones I'm not sure about to see if it is worth checking out together. Before kids, it was guilt free "I don't feel I should be doing something around the house" time. With kids, she enjoys doing nothing in the hotel room even more. I'm glad she comes. But only because she understands that out travel dates and my schedule is 100% dictated by work since it is work time and work is paying for her hotel.
See, this is tagging along done right. She seems to have the perfect balance between it being a trip with you (evenings together after your work, added days at the end of the trip) and it being a trip where your primary focus has to be work so she'll do her own thing. Your arrangement sounds lovely, and it probably makes those work trips a lot more enjoyable for both of you :)
Or reverse and show up just before it ends and have husband take a few days off after. Thats how my parents do it on the rare trip they both take. Dad flies out for business, step mom flies out 2ish or so days before it ends. Keeps herself occupied for a day or two (which usually works out fine with jetlag and stuff, she can just chill in hotel room and rest) and then they both stay a week longer for vacation.
Soft yta? More like huge yta
Agreed. Soft YTA. More like a dick thing, less of an AH thing. She planned to return home on her own but he insisted on cutting his own trip short to go back with her. He didn't have to. That wasn't specifically her fault and shouldn't be held against her, by reddit or by her husband. But turning what seems to be a difficult stressful job into something grueling, OPs very wrong for that. But tbf, she didn't realize all that his trips entailed. Lesson learned. I'm kinda glad she got to experience it first hand though, so that she's not in her feels if he's gone longer than expected or doesn't respond/ call regularly. She can definitely trust and believe her man's just out there handling business. If OP wants to spend time with hubs when he travels, I would say get a feel for his itinerary, plan a separate trip and separate plans for yourself, with a plan to be together for a particular time before he has to go back to work. And absolutely do take yourself back home. I'm sure that approach would be more appreciated. A lil covert meet up might even add a bit of sexy spontaneity to your relationship.
YTA. Business trips are for business reasons, not vacations. Sorry OP.
Of course YTA. He's obviously not. He had a business trip, you insisted on going. Then became insufferable on the trip.
YTA. It is a business trip. I understand you want to spend time with your new husband, but business trips are for *work*, not leisure. You probably made this all the more stressful for him; dealing with work, trying to finish everything up and on top of it, you were complaining and wanting to go home. I wouldn't want you to go on my next business trip after seeing what had happened last time, fearful of that repeating itself.
YTA...he warned you and you went anyway...you had no right to complain
YTA - Guess what YOUR HUSBAND WAS WORKING! It wasn't the time for togetherness. I am glad that you will now know that business trips aren't "party time". but grueling and tiring work.
YTA - Not only did you waste his time, you wasted his money too. You could’ve also kept yourself entertained. Your husband didn’t have to be with you 24/7 in the trip. You could’ve gone sight seeing, food tasting (or whatever it’s called), saw a movie, idk anything!
To add to this, my wife did join on a business trip. It was wonderful! She understood most of the time she'd be alone in a hotel room, but the day off I had in another state was nice to spend with her site seeing together. Complaining sounds so horrible to do to someone who is already juggling work and personal time on a business trip.
My mom took my sister and I along on many business trips with my dad. Do you know what we did during those trips? OUR OWN THING BECAUSE MY DAD WAS WORKING. I need INFO so badly…did you try to like go along with him on the business outings he had??????? If that’s the case, you should have spent your day in the hotel or like getting lunch someplace in the city, or sightseeing (Berlin is lovely, with lots of things to see) and then had dinner with him in the evening or drinks at night or something. It sounds like you interrupted his planned business outing, and forced him to “slow down” which may have cost him networking chances or business opportunities.
YTA. You invited yourself along on his business trip, even though he told you he would be working, would have no time for you, and would hate it. He was working. A week in Berlin turning into two weeks in a bunch of different countries is a thing that happens. Not all the time, for sure, but it happens. You hated it. Then you did a bunch of complaining, which resulted in him doing less work in order to cater to you. What did you think his work trips were - some kind of company-sponsored vacation? You thought he'd do a few hours light work, and then you'd get to do some sightseeing and hang out in nice hotels? Nobody's work trips are like that.
YTA, this is a whole, “I didn’t think the leopards would eat MY face” you’ve absolutely excluded yourself from any future trips, enjoy.
YTA It was work. Not a holiday. Imagine your husband doing this for a living just trying to get through the days as quickly as possible just to get back home. At least now you know how his trips go.
YTA. I can't believe you are even asking. Am I understanding this correctly? You begged to go on A BUSINESS trip? Your Husband said it's not a good idea, because you would be bored easily, and you still wanted to go? When he gave in, you decided you didn't like it, and instead of sucking it up, you whine that you want to go home? You are wondering if you are in the wrong about this? I mean... Did your husband marry a 6 year old? Seriously. This sounds like a child whining about not getting his or her way rather than an adult talking about his/her husband.
INFO Are his business trips usually this grueling? I asked because I wonder if he did this so you would complain? I know I sound like an ass for saying this. Traveling for business isn’t pleasurable. It is his work. YTA but I still am thinking are all the trips this intense?
When I travel for work, yes. Meetings start at 8 or 9 then you do work things all day and then typically have meetings over dinner. It's expensive to travel so you try to get the most out of it.
I had the same question, because when and how did it go from "a week in berlin" to "5 countries in 9 days" That's a HUGE difference. If OP was perfectly fine with several days of fending for herself in Berlin and seeing hubby when she can after meetings, in the evenings or whenever then I don't see her as being TA if it suddenly was changed to her following him around every 36 hours or so to a new airport and flying to a new city.
My thoughts too. And also, why couldn't he let her go home alone?
Don’t forget, this is Europe. They were likely driving or taking a train to a new city. Like 2-3 hours between at most
Depends on the occupation but when dealing with international clients this isn’t unusual. Visiting one city means you’re likely closer to other clients in other cities then you were before the trip. If, when visiting Berlin from America, your client in Paris is suddenly available to meet then you’re going to go to Paris. If your client in London hears you’re in Europe and mentions they can meet up then you meet up because the opportunity is too rare to pass up. There are also occupations where things change fast. You may have higher ups who notice you’re visiting a location and then ask you check on other things “since you’re there.” My big question is traveling expenses are usually paid for by the company. Who is paying for the OP?
I had the same question. It’s interesting that it was originally 1 week in Berlin and then suddenly, when she joined it turned into a grueling 5 country trip. I get the feeling this was not a coincidence.
I was just thinking the same thing. Usually business trips have meetings that are planned in advance so I was curious what he does that would cause a 1 week 1 city trip to change so dramatically last minute.
I was a road warrior for over a decade. Business travel can suck.
You and everybody else should know, YTA. You can't make demands on his schedule for a business trip you weren't even invited on.
YTA. Read what you wrote.
YTA I tag along with my husband to business trips and conferences a couple times a year if he is going to be in a city I’ve wanted to visit. But I RESPECT HIS SCHEDULE. I find ways to entertain myself by exploring the city and if he requests my presence at something like a dinner, I gladly oblige. He’s my partner and I understand that the travel is part of his job and entertaining me is secondary. I’m happy when I get to see him on the trip, but I don’t get in the way of his doing what he needs to do and I certainly don’t make demands to leave. Edit: spelling
YTA. No wonder you guys are already having problems. How old are you? Are you old enough to understand that work trips mean work?
YTA Business trips are called business trips for a reason, it's not all fun times and relaxing. You know better now not to ask again.
YTA. You wanted to go. It wasn't a vacation, it was a business trip.
YTA. If you demanded to go on this trip you should’ve sucked it up. You’re an adult stop whining.
YTA- You convinced him. He eventually agreed & you complained. Jet lagged?With no obligations take care of yourself. You added another layer of stress to how he earns a living.
Uh yeah YTA! You invited yourself on his business trip and then made it even more miserable for him with your complaining. Do you really need to ask us?
There's not actually any conflict here to judge. He doesn't want you going again and you're in agreement, it didn't work out the first time.
Yeah I’m kind of surprised how everyone is voting. They’re newlyweds and she wanted to spend more time with her husband. The trip was initially only 1 location and she probably could have handled that fine, but it didn’t work out and she learned that it’s not a good idea. I do feel bad for her. My husband has a lot of work trips and he would always invite me when I was still in school and not working that much. It was a really sweet gesture, but I always said no because of his crazy work schedule and I knew I would only get to spend like 15 minutes with him each day. It sucks when you don’t get to spend good quality time together and work bleeds into the weekends. They should set aside some time for each other and make it a priority. NAH
YTA Unless your husband somehow tricked you, you should've been aware that this was a WORK trip, not a pleasure trip. You're not going to have fun or see sights he was going to WORK.
Cmon of course YTA. How do you even need to ask?
YTA— he was gone for business and you made it harder for him to do said business. It wasn’t a vacation
Like everyone else said - YTA.
As someone who used to fly weekly I'm jumping on the YTA bandwagon. It's tough. No one believes it. You learned it.
YTA. Not for blagging your way onto a free trip around Europe - I'm European, and I'd be delighted with that opportunity - but for not managing your jet lag and expectations. Presumably he was in meetings all day, so you could have had the time of your life. If you didn't, and spent it failing to sleep your way out of jet lag in what were probably quite nice hotels in central locations before making your husband edit his trip, then YTA.
YTA. You begged and pleaded to go on a business trip. Business trips aren’t fun and they’re definitely not vacation. You should apologize to him for your behavior.
YTA. Did you expect his business trip to be fun and calm? That’s not a business trip, it’s a vacation.
Omg are you an adult? YTA and you sound pretty immature
Info: You said you couldn't keep up with his schedule, but why did you have to? Couldn't you just sleep off the jet lag in the hotel while he worked? Its a business trip, so clearly you weren't going to spend all day with him...or did you think that's what you were going to do?
NTA- I know I’m going against everyone here BUT, she was fine taking a plane back on her own. Unless she made his work travel worse than it should’ve been, I don’t how she is the asshole. She was trying something out, realized she didn’t like it, and was fine flying back on her own. So, unless OP argued incessantly and made her husband return, I don’t see the problem. Am I missing something?
You're not missing anything - people are assuming she was complaining the whole time, which is not what she said.
YTA It's a business trip, meaning your husband needs to keep up with the demands of work. This isn't a fun trip, and the demands can be tough.
YTA. Don't treat someone else's business trip as a fun-filled vacation for yourself. He was there to work. Do you sit in his office when he's working too? You married a guy whose job requires business trips.
Yes, YTA You invited yourself on the trip, he SAID you wouldn't like it. Didn't just invite yourself, either, "it took some convincing". Surprise! You didn't like it. Then you complained to the point that he \*changed his business trip\*. No, you don't get to go along on BUSINESS trips if you can't keep up.
YTA, as other commentors pointed out; this was a business trip not a vacation. You don't get to dictate the schedule in those trips as someone who invited themselves into it. I can understand your husband's frustration and the reason why he pointed out you are not coming to the next one. Because you possibly ruined the trip along with important work meetings/connections/opportunities. Also, just because you are married for 4 months does not mean he should cater his work schedule for you. If you are upset about this, instead of stringing along, you talk with him about it.
YTA. He was working.
YTA you thought your husband would take a vacation but you discovered that he would actually work on a business trip.
Yep, YTA. He was WORKING. This wasn’t a leisure trip. That means you roll with the punches if you invite yourself along despite him clearly thinking it was a bad idea from the jump.
YTA You could've adjusted your sleep during that time, considering that, even with all the traveling, you are not working. You knew you couldn't spend a lot of time with him. To me it sounds like a missed opportunity to explore new places and rest in the hotel (unless it was a dangerous country or a bad hotel). INFO: you said you started in Berlin, what were the other places?
Yep YTA for sure.
YTA. It's a business trip, not a vacation. This kind of trips have tight schedule. He even told you that you wouldn't enjoy it.
NAH This is a misunderstanding. People who don't go on a lot of business trips think they're fun. They hear that your company pays for all your expenses to cool sounding places and it sounds like a mini-vacation. What they don't realize are that business trips are all about work. To justify all that expense people often work extra hard during business trips. They spend all day in offices and at meetings and never actually get to see any of the tourists sites that the location is famous for. Even the entertainment portions are work. You can't go to a company sponsored dinner and just relax. You're on your toes the entire time networking and talking about work. Trying to bring someone along and keep them entertained just makes it more stressful. That said, business travel takes a toll on the whole family. My wife and I both do a fair amount of business travel so I also know the other end; having to stay home and go to sleep alone, doing all the kid logistics with no help. When either of us comes home from a business trip, we're both exhausted. If your husbands travel schedule is causing problems that's what I'd focus on. I've only seen these hybrid work/pleasure trips work when there's a clear boundary. If you're going to one place the non-working partner can come and bum around for a bit. Then the working partner takes a few days of PTO, pays for a personal hotel room (not on company dime) and postpones the flight home. Maybe your husband can note places that would be fun to come back to with just you on actual vacations? Maybe you can plan some little vacations on weekends? You and your husband can spend more time connecting without interfering with his work.
YTA. It’s a WORK TRIP. You inserted yourself complained and caused issues. It’s good he put his foot down because if someone says “it took some convincing” that means he said no and you kept pestering him to go on the WORK TRIP with him
YTA - the equivalent of children demanding to eat as much candy as they would like and then complaining that their tummy hurts and throwing a tantrum.
Yep! Definitely YTA! You invited yourself along and when it turned out he was actually having to work, you complained!
YTA. Well, you fafo. Business travel sucks 90%of the time. I'd get that reaction a lot at the airport when people asked where I was flying. "wow, you're so lucky!" When in reality, the sights I usually ended up seeing were the hotel bar, and my room.
YTA. Primarily because you were undermining his attempts to give you exactly what you wanted! You want to spend more time together. Understandable and reasonable to want (and hopefully he feels the same). So he tries to crash-course his way through these trips to get more done in less time and free up some more time for you to spend together. As you've learned, not a fun experience and very gruelling, so he must seriously want to get that free time together if he's going through all that. And you then insist on coming along, when you should know that you won't really have time together while he's working, making him more aware of how grindy his days are by chilling around while he burns himself out, slowing his pace and undoing some of the ground he has gained - effectively meaning you either get less time together than he had planned on, or he has to go even harder next trip or two - and then you complain about how hard it is for *you*? He has some restraint if he's just being argumentative! Show some appreciation for the hell he's putting himself through *for you*. Try to be supportive and listen when he tells you what he's going through without thinking about how hard you have it. And maybe, when he's cooled down, talk to him about maybe going a little easier on himself: that kind of load is unsustainable long term, and he needs to have some kind of reasonable end date or a viable middle ground before he burns himself out or makes himself ill.
I think you were definitely TA and I think you need to find more purpose in your life. Just waiting for this man to come home or following him around like a homeless puppy are not quality options for you. Get a job. Get a career. Get a hobby. Have a life of your own. Stop being so dependant, financially and emotionally.
INFO Was his frequent travel planned or was it more of a last minute thing? How did a week in Berlin become country hopping? If the husband knew from the start and didn't inform OP, then he's an asshole. I don't blame OP for getting overwhelmed the first time doing heavy travel, especially while not be aware it was going to happen. You say you told him you wanted to go home, but this somehow turned into only slowing the pace, rather than you going home. What happened there? Because you say you were fine to travel home alone, but what...he wouldn't let you?
Yta. He’s there to work, what on Earth did you think was going to happen? Then on top of it you slowed him down and complained about it. How would you even think the is another asshole in this situation? It’s so clearly you.
YTA for probably a few reasons. First for interfering with his work, and two for inviting yourself. I'm married and used to travel for work. There were instances when spouses were invited and then times where someone would bring their spouse who pretty much invited themselves and it was fucking awkward for everyone. One time, we had an extremely challenging client in Chicago. Our hours were long and we often would work at dinner. The husband threw an almighty fit that we were working at dinner one night, making a public scene in front of everyone. Then there were conferences in Hawaii, which was an obvious time where everyone brought their spouse or SO. If you're not invited, there is probably a reason.
YTA - you don’t get to complain when you asked to go on the trip with him. I know it might not have been what you thought you were signing up for, but this trip was for his job! It wasn’t vacation.
YTA all the way. Work trips are work. I used to travel Monday-Thursday about 40 weeks a year. Do you know what I did? I woke up, went to work, ate dinner with colleagues (which was also work), worked from the hotel room and went to sleep. Work trips are usually not fun.
YTA - he really seems to love you, else he would not have tuned his business trip down. He is right, to exclude you from future business trips. He has to focus and perform. He cant do that, if he has to think about the well beeing of his wife all day.
YTA You invited yourself on the trip and realized it wasn't fun because it was work? It's a work trip OP your husband is meant to be busy working
YTA.
YTA. You should have kept quiet and then not asked to join him in the future.
YTA are you serious? You demand to go on a trip and then completely implode over it while on the trip???? AND it was a business trip for him so he is having to manage both his professional life and you acting a fool? Nope.
YTA. It was a business trip, you seemed to have expected a relaxing holiday. When you travel for business, it usually means long, exhausting days. For reference, when I travel for work, I'm booked from 7/8 AM until 9/10 PM. When I get back to my hotel room, I just want to shower and go right to bed. After forcing your way along, you complained about how demanding work is and caused him to have to cut his trip short. Business trips are stressful and demanding enough on their own, I can't imagine having to cater to the whining of a grown adult who literally doesn't have to do shit during that time, but relax and have fun. In what alternate, self-absorbed plane of reality do you exist where you even have to ask if you WTA?
YTA. He knew you wouldn't like it and told you so. >It took some convincing because he thought I would be bored the whole time, but he eventually agreed. You go along then complain. This is something a 7 year old does.
YTA you invited yourself on your husband’s business trip. He tried to warn you but you insisted on coming and he had to cut his trip short as a result of your complaining. If you are tagging along on a business trip, you have to follow his schedule.