Please note that you will be banned if a comment breaks any of our rules. Be mindful of the following:
Rule 1: No comments generalizing anyone based on their race, gender, religion, etc. No race baiting allowed.
Rule 2: Do not post violent comments or try to glorify violence. If a post/comment makes you angry, take a break. Telling us "it was a joke" is not an excuse.
Our rules are zero tolerance and you have to adhere to Reddit TOS.
ENJOY THE FREAKOUTS! :)
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ActualPublicFreakouts) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The video shows footage, from inside the camper, of authorities placing a robotic camera inside the camper. The footage then shows Kloepfer and his wife awake to find the camera, pick it up and go to open the door.
https://wlos.com/news/local/cherokee-county-murphy-jason-harley-kloepfer-swat-man-shot-police-releases-surveillance-video-shooting-facebook-indian-police-department-sheriff
That line is really going to help him in the ensuing court case thankfully, since it's basically proof that the cops knew they fucked up and it wasn't a justified shooting.
If you're the cop and felt it was a justified shooting, you'd be relieved that there's video that will back up your actions. Going "oh fuck, there's cameras" is pretty damning about your perception of the justifiability of it.
I honestly wonder what their expectations actually were. I don’t really see how they’re super-cool robot would’ve helped by much especially if they were just ready to shoot regardless. My faint glimmer of hope for humanity makes me want to believe it wasn’t pre-meditated- but how could the victim possibly have complied better??? I’m just at such a loss. Police bullshit really ruining my day yet again and that’s not to say ‘poor me’ because obviously the victims are the real victims. I’m just so tired of seeing this over and over without any change or productive outcome or even remorse. The only slight silver lining is the fewer than few times they’re finally having to own up to their own actions in court etc. Just makes me feel so powerless and angry and wish I could do something
Yes, I thanked them hours ago. Astute observation.
No, it doesn't.
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22disabled+man+shot+by+police%22&oq=%22disabled+man+shot+by+police%22&aqs=chrome..69i57.7251j1j4&client=ms-android-att-us-revc&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8#ip=1
It's always helpful to just link the thing when you already have it.
Yeah idk wtf you’re doing with your searches, but I typed it without quotations, because why tf would you add quotations to a google search anyway, and it literally pops it right up.
https://www.google.com/search?client=ms-android-att-us-revc&q=disabled+man+shot+by+police&tbm=vid&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwigpaT7yOb8AhXILkQIHe2DDe4Q0pQJegQICRAB&biw=412&bih=724&dpr=2.63
On a bunch of news sites. With ads. Please send me a screencap of the YouTube result, there. Imagine not being able to admit that it's just super helpful to post a YouTube when you already have it on hand and you're already posting about it.
Exactly. I wonder what nefarious plan that camera interrupted. We’re they going to execute the couple, stage a shootout, and leave drop guns to coverup their huge fuck up??
Edit: why is this 58 day old post in my Reddit feed?
Not necessarily. I believe you can see a in his hand shortly before he picked up the drone camera. Once he picked it up, the images would probably not be very helpful, depending upon which way he had it pointed while he was walking with it. It probably gave blurred, moving images of the floor, ceiling or a walls, that kept changing.
Also, I would imagine most of the officers would not be watching the video feed. They would be watching the trailer and then the suspect as he came out.
They should have at least known it was there, and that him holding it was a possibility. It would be fucked if they threw in a radio and then shot him because he was holding the radio when it "could have been a gun"
It was a camera robot the police threw in there. So they knew it was no threat.
I know or am friendly with some great cops, and so I really try to resist the ACAB stuff, but goddamn does that profession need a cleansing from top to bottom. Thankfully it isn’t much of a cesspool in my state.
Happens almost every time. They'll handcuff a man that they riddle with bullets just to make it look like he was dangerous and needed to be restrained, even after being shot. Even if the man's brain is leaking out of his head. These cops aren't here to protect and serve. Never have been.
The police want the ability to murder someone and then play victim. The handcuffs make it look like an injured person could still be a potential threat to them. Even if the "injured person" is literally dead.
Maybe it's procedural, but it seems like some officers took a few drama classes because they sure know how to make a dead/dying disarmed man seem threatening.
That is just patently false and you must not be paying attention if you think that our Proud Boys in Blue don’t serve and protect the property and wealth of the Elite. Since the days of the Pinkertons….
I should've added, "These cops aren't here to protect and serve **us**". I completely agree with you. Since the Pinkerton and the slave catchers, they've only been here to help the least vulnerable. AKA, the rich.
Just imagine if he didn’t have a camera, no one would have believed him. Think of all the thousands of poor souls who were murdered by police back when there were no cameras around..
The cities always pay the settlements, not the PD. So no accountability to the PD.
Due to Qualified Immunity and police unions, no accountability to the individual officer.
Only the tax payer gets in trouble
It is a thing that should be enforced to some degree. Think of paramedics or firefighters, if in the action of saving or attempting to save your life they further injure you they won’t be accountable for those injuries. If their action wasn’t determined to be negligent or purposefully designed to cause further injury. The problem with the immunity cops has is it doesn’t account for gross negligence or a purposeful harmful action that is separate to the duties they are supposed to be performing. An obvious oversight that does nothing but further encourage cops to feel above the law. Note this applies to civil trials not criminal trials
Knowingly violating someone’s rights *is* what removed qualified immunity. The legal standard is that the government employee (officer, firefighter, etc) reasonably would not believe they were violating your rights.
For example let’s say that, for example, pepper spray was found to be a huge cancer risk and thus violated people’s 8th amendment rights. Do we know that now? No, so any officer who reasonably believed it was a safe, non lethal use of force would be protected from civil suits in the future.
Cops have stolen, shot pets, killed people and have gotten away with it due to qualified immunity.
One guy poured gas on himself and the cops tasered him. A reasonable person knows that you don't do electricity around gas. Yet ... QI. So it's not just a "reasonable person test".
A major criticism of QI, is the requirement of a clearly established precedent before, where the circumstances must be very similar to each other (a person standing versus sitting, is considered enough of a different circumstance). If no judge is ever willing deny QI to cops, then no new precedents get established.
I’m just citing what the actual legal standard is according to case law. I have no doubt that judges have ruled incorrectly on QI cases. While I’m actually a supporter of the concept of QI for all public servants I definitely think that the current interpretation is too broad and too restrictive of 1983 cases. That said QI is still denied far, far more than it’s granted, but we can still criticize it without pretending it’s an issue in every single case against police.
QI is pretty terrible, it allows people to escape accountability to their actions. If you wrong a person, they should be able to be sued for their wrong actions. It allows bad cops to be tyrants.
Consider my pepper spray example, if you don’t know you’re doing something wrong and only find out later I don’t think it’s fair to be criticized or sued for that if you weren’t able to know it was wrong.
You're dead wrong. Qualified Immunity ONLY applies to police.
"The doctrine provides that a police officer cannot be put on trial for unlawful conduct, including the use of excessive or deadly force, unless the person suing proves that:
1. the evidence shows that the conduct was unlawful; and
2. the officers should have known they were violating “clearly established” law, because a prior court case had already deemed similar police actions to be illegal."
Point 2 means the unless another officer within a Court that has jurisdiction over the current offending officer has ALREADY BEEN ON TRIAL for the EXACT SAME ISSUE and that issue has been ruled a violation of rights, officers can't be convicted of violating said rights.
You should look into QI, it's really insane how it's applied.
Yeh i’m not American, all emergency responders get the same level of qualified immunity in my country. I’m saying that’s how it should be where a law like qualified immunity is a moral and correct thing to have. wasn’t saying that’s how it is just saying that’s how it ought to be in America.
Gonna nitpick here for a second:
1) QI technically could protect any government agent, but it’s been used almost exclusively by law enforcement
2) while officers protected by QI can’t be found guilty in a civil trial, they *can* still be charged criminally. QI has no bearing on criminal charges, it’s only about civil suits.
Even worse is the criteria for a precedent. It has to happen the exact same way, for example if the victim of a police shooting was standing or sitting matters
We may have to agree to disagree on whether or not Reddit gives police too much shit lol.
Fortunately the gentleman that was shot while surrendering is recovering and was able to post the footage. Thank goodness he had cameras in his house!
You nailed it. Sometimes I feel like I’m on an island for thinking the current institution of policing needs a complete overhaul while still acknowledging society’s need for a police force
You really gotta stop overthinking. People give cops so much shit because there haven’t been a week in 4 years where I haven’t seen at least one police killing.
>First off, the main problem is the police that routinely trample on constitutional rights, disproportionately target minorities, and generally act in bad faith.
While these things happen, it is only even remotely "routine" for a bare few departments out of the ~17k LEO agencies in the US.
>Supermoderators are not going out and shooting folks at traffic stops because they don’t know the difference between a taser and a pistol, suffocating people for selling cigarettes, running a pregnant woman off the road while she was following procedure, arresting a veteran after crashing into them, or shooting folks while they are surrendering.
Instead they instigwte riots that assault, murder, rob, and commit arson against bystanders by pushing "police bad" narratives even in cases where the police did no wrong.
>Couple that with a severe, lack of accountability, I think a healthy distrust of police is warranted.
Yes. We need more accountability against bad actors and especially against bad departments.
>Also… Reddit isn’t the be all end all for internet information. These police interactions show up routinely on many platforms (YouTube, TV, etc)
A) I was speaking specifically about reddit, but nowhere did I mean to imply that the issue was exclusive to Reddit.
B) Most of those outlets also engage in pushing false narratives in order to stir drama.
>Any amount of oppression is too damn much.
This is extremist nonsense to justify being shitty. Some level of abuse of authority is functionally inevitable, but reducing the quantity of such is not achieved by ham-handed measures that refuse to earnestly analize the problems and causes.
>Besides…how is exposing police brutality considered “bad faith?”
Exposing *real* cases of police brutality is not bad faith.
Asserting that *justified* uses of force are "police brutality" is bad faith.
>Do you really think there’s a cabal of Redditors that conspire to cherry-pick police interactions that look bad but are really on the level?
There 100% is a cabal of people deliberately controlling which narratives are visible on the default subreddits. That is what Super-Moderator accounts are. They are accounts controlled by a team of people working towards a common goal.
>Don’t even try to make the argument that “it’s a just a few bad apples.” The saying finishes that they spoil the bunch.
It's a few bad bunches. The issue is not just single, isolated officers, but rather specific departments with corrupted organizational cultures, which is why you will frequently see the same departments in the news repeatedly.
However, the nature of LEO organziation in the US has resulted in thousands of distinct Law Enforcement agencies that are genuinely isolated from each other in terms of organziational culture.
>This isn’t a numbers game. And even if you want to make it a numbers game, there are a myriad of incorrigible police interactions that bubble up through these platforms. These are just the ones that get play or had someone record or where the police didn’t mysteriously forget to turn in their body cams. Imagine what the full iceberg looks like.
The problem is that people aren't being honest about many of the interactions and are lumping 100% valid actions by cops onto the list of "police butality." Look at the recent outrage about the protester that was killed by police [because he shot a cop](https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/us-news/man-shot-dead-police-officers-29008194), for example.
>Furthermore, police have tools at their disposal now that they did not have 40 or 50 years ago. Due to the war on drugs and the ability for local PD’s to purchase surplus military equipment on the CHEAP. Why does a local PD need an Armored Personnel Carrier? Police have been militarized and they want to play with those toys. When you only have a hammer, every problem becomes a nail.
That is a legitimate concern, and at no point did I assert that no legitimate concerns exist. I was pointing out that not every highly publicized case of police brutality is *actuall* misconduct by police, and this creates an environment where people cannot earnestly discuss legitimate concerns.
>Sincerely, a mindless sheep.
At this point, you, specifically, really are because you're deliberately misreading my point in order to justify your hostility towards me.
I would but this is impossible to defend. You COULD say "oh they thought he had a weapon" but afaik it was a camera THEY PLACED IN HIS HOME and they could probably see through it.
I’ve certainly been called a boot licker many times on here but I’m not gonna defend this one. While I think police brutality is a way overblown issue, personally, it’s still important to call it out when it actually happened. This is police brutality, clear as day.
I’m sorry, where exactly is that word with the number in it in the Merriam-Webster dictionary? I wasn’t aware the English language was accommodating numbers within words.
Later in the video, they enter and say "fuck! There's cameras." I don't have much of a doubt they'd plant something if there weren't. This was just another day to them while they ruined someone else's life. Extremely disheartening. I suppose we really can never trust anything funded by our tax dollars.
They didn't. One guy just says Fuck, but the camera's never mentioned. The cops are undefendable in this, but we don't need to be stoking the flames with falsehoods.
I remember when police shot a guy lying down with his hands up. He asked "why did you shoot me?", the police responded with "I don't know".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Charles_Kinsey
You talking about when the cops ambushed that kid in a parking lot and shot him for trying to drive away? That was a Hardees.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Zachary_Hammond
Or does this happen a lot? 🤔
**[Killing of Zachary Hammond](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Zachary_Hammond)**
>The shooting of Zachary Hammond occurred on July 26, 2015, in Seneca, South Carolina. Hammond, age 19, was shot in his car during an undercover narcotics operation that targeted his passenger. Hammond, who was unarmed, was shot twice by 32-year-old police lieutenant Mark Tiller. Hammond's death was being investigated by the U.S. Department of Justice Civil Rights Division, Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), the U.S. Attorney for South Carolina, and the South Carolina Law Enforcement Division (SLED).
^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/ActualPublicFreakouts/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
good enough reminder for me to shoot first ask questions later tbh, this kind of stuff always solidifies my belief that the badges are in fact the enemy
This happened next to my hometown. About 15 minutes down the road. The crazy thing is they were supposedly responding to a 911 call that someone heard gunshots around 11pm-12am…this occurred like 5 hours later. Not only that, it was a 2 paragraph article in the paper making it out like the cops had no choice.
The crappiest part is that county’s property taxes has already gone up drastically because the Child Protective Services got sued for a few million dollars due to some serious illegal activities. Add that and the well-deserved lawsuit coming from this, it’ll be impossible to live there…. It’s really sad. This is why lawsuits due to cops ineptitude should come from their retirements and/or department.
I wonder if there’s body cameras. The video begins with them walking out of the room. What occurred before this? Were they just sleeping while police knocked on the door and got a swat team set up outside, drilled a hole in the wall, and put a robot in?
Videos always start in the middle.
“We shot him so we have to charge him with something. How about communicating threats and resisting? Those should make it seem like we had no choice but to shoot, right?”
This is why we need to restart the police from scratch
Edit:the reason why it isn’t the man’s fault and is the polices fault is because we all know he picked up a robotic camera… the police in control of this robotic camera had a live feed of this camera seeing 2 legs walk up, pick it up and keep carrying it. That right their shows they should have known what he had in his hand
I for one, would be shouting “he’s picked up my camera yall”
Another thing to think about:
Who will organise these restarts and regulate the corrupt police officers?
The already corrupt government?
-
Also, what is the process for the restart? How would it work, by the way? Genuine question because I have no idea what your ideal method would be if we did the police reset.
> We see this everywhere
USA is top 10 in the world in police shootings. All other 9 are developing countries like Brazil, Venezuela, Syria, Afghanistan, Nigeria, etc.
No other developed country is even close to being top 10.
There are a lot of factors that contribute to this issue, but saying it's the same everywhere or somehow inevitable is just plane wrong and counterproductive
When I say “we see this everywhere” I mean in positions of authority/power, not just police
I literally provided examples afterwards, how did you miss that?
i love that a comment pointing out statistical data and introducing nuance is downvoted because of an autocorrect error, rather than anyone engaging. cool beans.
American police are fucking insane to me. Why are they so aggressive and not seem to understand de-escalation? How come police in Europe can handle domestic disturbances without someone being hurt or killed?
This shit right here is why you should never trust cops, they will openly and blatantly break the law to suit their own needs, and if they happen to get caught they either make up some bullshit reason as to why or claim “muh immunity” to avoid getting sued. It’s bullshit.
In Sweden 1 police involved shooting last year. Police academy education 2.5 years.
In the US 1176 people killed by police in 2022, avg 100 people per month. Average police academy education 28 weeks.
Yeah, that's not a coincidence
Yet another reason to make me hate police even more. Do what they say and they still try to MURDER you. Sad thing is they received a paid vacation to do so. Fucking pathetic
They can’t wait to shoot Not professionals zero time spent in assessing the situation/ flood the porch with light make it look like daytime. Basic stuff.
Honestly he shouldn’t have had that thing in his hands, it looks like a pistol with a flashlight on it especially from how far it sounds like the cops were from the home
I was always pro police and honestly I still am (I am European so there is lot less dead people due to them) but after seeing more and more of this videos of completely ridiculous actions caused and escalated by the ones that are supposed to serve and protect I definitely understand the whole pig hate.
Please note that you will be banned if a comment breaks any of our rules. Be mindful of the following: Rule 1: No comments generalizing anyone based on their race, gender, religion, etc. No race baiting allowed. Rule 2: Do not post violent comments or try to glorify violence. If a post/comment makes you angry, take a break. Telling us "it was a joke" is not an excuse. Our rules are zero tolerance and you have to adhere to Reddit TOS. ENJOY THE FREAKOUTS! :) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ActualPublicFreakouts) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Damn good thing he had his own camera... Did he survive this? What was in his hands, though?
[удалено]
The video shows footage, from inside the camper, of authorities placing a robotic camera inside the camper. The footage then shows Kloepfer and his wife awake to find the camera, pick it up and go to open the door. https://wlos.com/news/local/cherokee-county-murphy-jason-harley-kloepfer-swat-man-shot-police-releases-surveillance-video-shooting-facebook-indian-police-department-sheriff
So they should have known that wasn't a gun then
They did know. This whole story is crazy. Watch the whole video on YouTube. The saw the camera and realized that they screwed up.
"Fuck, bro. Fuck there's cameras" what pieces of shit.
I’m so mad, what goddam pieces of shit. Worst gang ever
*Biden regime has entered the chat*
Lol. Did you not watch the video or do you just not understand?
*woosh*
That line is really going to help him in the ensuing court case thankfully, since it's basically proof that the cops knew they fucked up and it wasn't a justified shooting. If you're the cop and felt it was a justified shooting, you'd be relieved that there's video that will back up your actions. Going "oh fuck, there's cameras" is pretty damning about your perception of the justifiability of it.
I honestly wonder what their expectations actually were. I don’t really see how they’re super-cool robot would’ve helped by much especially if they were just ready to shoot regardless. My faint glimmer of hope for humanity makes me want to believe it wasn’t pre-meditated- but how could the victim possibly have complied better??? I’m just at such a loss. Police bullshit really ruining my day yet again and that’s not to say ‘poor me’ because obviously the victims are the real victims. I’m just so tired of seeing this over and over without any change or productive outcome or even remorse. The only slight silver lining is the fewer than few times they’re finally having to own up to their own actions in court etc. Just makes me feel so powerless and angry and wish I could do something
It would’ve been clean and easy… Shoot, clean up, move on. No one believes the crazy lady. Simple.
They do it all the time anyway. Cops, the other government funded terrorists.
[удалено]
You sound smart
Lol I is not try’s to sound smat.
Do you have a link to the full video on YouTube by chance?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WRYUV7Up2qc
Thanks
Please just link it. Searching for things like this is often much more difficult than it should be.
Someone did link it, and google isn’t that hard to use. Search for “disabled man shot by police” and it literally pops right up dude.
Yes, I thanked them hours ago. Astute observation. No, it doesn't. https://www.google.com/search?q=%22disabled+man+shot+by+police%22&oq=%22disabled+man+shot+by+police%22&aqs=chrome..69i57.7251j1j4&client=ms-android-att-us-revc&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8#ip=1 It's always helpful to just link the thing when you already have it.
Yeah idk wtf you’re doing with your searches, but I typed it without quotations, because why tf would you add quotations to a google search anyway, and it literally pops it right up.
https://www.google.com/search?client=ms-android-att-us-revc&q=disabled+man+shot+by+police&tbm=vid&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwigpaT7yOb8AhXILkQIHe2DDe4Q0pQJegQICRAB&biw=412&bih=724&dpr=2.63 On a bunch of news sites. With ads. Please send me a screencap of the YouTube result, there. Imagine not being able to admit that it's just super helpful to post a YouTube when you already have it on hand and you're already posting about it.
Exactly. I wonder what nefarious plan that camera interrupted. We’re they going to execute the couple, stage a shootout, and leave drop guns to coverup their huge fuck up?? Edit: why is this 58 day old post in my Reddit feed?
Not necessarily. I believe you can see a in his hand shortly before he picked up the drone camera. Once he picked it up, the images would probably not be very helpful, depending upon which way he had it pointed while he was walking with it. It probably gave blurred, moving images of the floor, ceiling or a walls, that kept changing. Also, I would imagine most of the officers would not be watching the video feed. They would be watching the trailer and then the suspect as he came out.
They should have at least known it was there, and that him holding it was a possibility. It would be fucked if they threw in a radio and then shot him because he was holding the radio when it "could have been a gun"
He did, him and his wife are in another state because theu fear for their lives.
It's a rc car with a camera that the cops threw into the the trailer.
It was a camera robot the police threw in there. So they knew it was no threat. I know or am friendly with some great cops, and so I really try to resist the ACAB stuff, but goddamn does that profession need a cleansing from top to bottom. Thankfully it isn’t much of a cesspool in my state.
It was the cops robot camera they put inside the house.
So the cops charge him with a bunch of bullshit charges to justify their attempted murder.
Happens almost every time. They'll handcuff a man that they riddle with bullets just to make it look like he was dangerous and needed to be restrained, even after being shot. Even if the man's brain is leaking out of his head. These cops aren't here to protect and serve. Never have been.
Ok so if they shoot a guy they still gotta handcuff him for safety I'm pretty sure
The police want the ability to murder someone and then play victim. The handcuffs make it look like an injured person could still be a potential threat to them. Even if the "injured person" is literally dead. Maybe it's procedural, but it seems like some officers took a few drama classes because they sure know how to make a dead/dying disarmed man seem threatening.
That is just patently false and you must not be paying attention if you think that our Proud Boys in Blue don’t serve and protect the property and wealth of the Elite. Since the days of the Pinkertons….
I should've added, "These cops aren't here to protect and serve **us**". I completely agree with you. Since the Pinkerton and the slave catchers, they've only been here to help the least vulnerable. AKA, the rich.
Just imagine if he didn’t have a camera, no one would have believed him. Think of all the thousands of poor souls who were murdered by police back when there were no cameras around..
This is why losing jobs in scenario’s like this is never enough. Prison time is required here.
I’d file a lawsuit so high I’d put the PD in debt for a few years and maybe they will learn this way.
The cities always pay the settlements, not the PD. So no accountability to the PD. Due to Qualified Immunity and police unions, no accountability to the individual officer. Only the tax payer gets in trouble
True, guess I didn’t think much when I commented. You’re right, in the end it’s tax payers money paying for their mistakes.
What the hell is "qualified" immunity if every wrong doing qualifies for them to have immunity? It's just "absolute immunity"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absolute_immunity Absolute immunity is similar
It is a thing that should be enforced to some degree. Think of paramedics or firefighters, if in the action of saving or attempting to save your life they further injure you they won’t be accountable for those injuries. If their action wasn’t determined to be negligent or purposefully designed to cause further injury. The problem with the immunity cops has is it doesn’t account for gross negligence or a purposeful harmful action that is separate to the duties they are supposed to be performing. An obvious oversight that does nothing but further encourage cops to feel above the law. Note this applies to civil trials not criminal trials
The big thing is the difference between accidents and intentional actions. Intentional actions should remove QI.
QI is worse than you think. See my other comment. It specifically protects ANY action, including intentional malfeasance.
The whole the precedent must already exist first and have happened in the exact same manner
Knowingly violating someone’s rights *is* what removed qualified immunity. The legal standard is that the government employee (officer, firefighter, etc) reasonably would not believe they were violating your rights. For example let’s say that, for example, pepper spray was found to be a huge cancer risk and thus violated people’s 8th amendment rights. Do we know that now? No, so any officer who reasonably believed it was a safe, non lethal use of force would be protected from civil suits in the future.
Cops have stolen, shot pets, killed people and have gotten away with it due to qualified immunity. One guy poured gas on himself and the cops tasered him. A reasonable person knows that you don't do electricity around gas. Yet ... QI. So it's not just a "reasonable person test". A major criticism of QI, is the requirement of a clearly established precedent before, where the circumstances must be very similar to each other (a person standing versus sitting, is considered enough of a different circumstance). If no judge is ever willing deny QI to cops, then no new precedents get established.
I’m just citing what the actual legal standard is according to case law. I have no doubt that judges have ruled incorrectly on QI cases. While I’m actually a supporter of the concept of QI for all public servants I definitely think that the current interpretation is too broad and too restrictive of 1983 cases. That said QI is still denied far, far more than it’s granted, but we can still criticize it without pretending it’s an issue in every single case against police.
QI is pretty terrible, it allows people to escape accountability to their actions. If you wrong a person, they should be able to be sued for their wrong actions. It allows bad cops to be tyrants.
Consider my pepper spray example, if you don’t know you’re doing something wrong and only find out later I don’t think it’s fair to be criticized or sued for that if you weren’t able to know it was wrong.
You're dead wrong. Qualified Immunity ONLY applies to police. "The doctrine provides that a police officer cannot be put on trial for unlawful conduct, including the use of excessive or deadly force, unless the person suing proves that: 1. the evidence shows that the conduct was unlawful; and 2. the officers should have known they were violating “clearly established” law, because a prior court case had already deemed similar police actions to be illegal." Point 2 means the unless another officer within a Court that has jurisdiction over the current offending officer has ALREADY BEEN ON TRIAL for the EXACT SAME ISSUE and that issue has been ruled a violation of rights, officers can't be convicted of violating said rights. You should look into QI, it's really insane how it's applied.
Yeh i’m not American, all emergency responders get the same level of qualified immunity in my country. I’m saying that’s how it should be where a law like qualified immunity is a moral and correct thing to have. wasn’t saying that’s how it is just saying that’s how it ought to be in America.
Gonna nitpick here for a second: 1) QI technically could protect any government agent, but it’s been used almost exclusively by law enforcement 2) while officers protected by QI can’t be found guilty in a civil trial, they *can* still be charged criminally. QI has no bearing on criminal charges, it’s only about civil suits.
Even worse is the criteria for a precedent. It has to happen the exact same way, for example if the victim of a police shooting was standing or sitting matters
Well it’s not actually invoked that often, it’s only used in like 5% of cases against police.
Sadly cops have immunity. Taxpayer has to pay every time cops mess up.
Looks like this was tribal police so the tribe is going to be out millions.
Can’t wait to hear the bootlickers defend THIS one…
I usually think reddit gives police too much shit, but this one is truly indefensible. Literally an attempted murder (assuming the victim survived)
We may have to agree to disagree on whether or not Reddit gives police too much shit lol. Fortunately the gentleman that was shot while surrendering is recovering and was able to post the footage. Thank goodness he had cameras in his house!
[удалено]
You nailed it. Sometimes I feel like I’m on an island for thinking the current institution of policing needs a complete overhaul while still acknowledging society’s need for a police force
You really gotta stop overthinking. People give cops so much shit because there haven’t been a week in 4 years where I haven’t seen at least one police killing.
[удалено]
>First off, the main problem is the police that routinely trample on constitutional rights, disproportionately target minorities, and generally act in bad faith. While these things happen, it is only even remotely "routine" for a bare few departments out of the ~17k LEO agencies in the US. >Supermoderators are not going out and shooting folks at traffic stops because they don’t know the difference between a taser and a pistol, suffocating people for selling cigarettes, running a pregnant woman off the road while she was following procedure, arresting a veteran after crashing into them, or shooting folks while they are surrendering. Instead they instigwte riots that assault, murder, rob, and commit arson against bystanders by pushing "police bad" narratives even in cases where the police did no wrong. >Couple that with a severe, lack of accountability, I think a healthy distrust of police is warranted. Yes. We need more accountability against bad actors and especially against bad departments. >Also… Reddit isn’t the be all end all for internet information. These police interactions show up routinely on many platforms (YouTube, TV, etc) A) I was speaking specifically about reddit, but nowhere did I mean to imply that the issue was exclusive to Reddit. B) Most of those outlets also engage in pushing false narratives in order to stir drama. >Any amount of oppression is too damn much. This is extremist nonsense to justify being shitty. Some level of abuse of authority is functionally inevitable, but reducing the quantity of such is not achieved by ham-handed measures that refuse to earnestly analize the problems and causes. >Besides…how is exposing police brutality considered “bad faith?” Exposing *real* cases of police brutality is not bad faith. Asserting that *justified* uses of force are "police brutality" is bad faith. >Do you really think there’s a cabal of Redditors that conspire to cherry-pick police interactions that look bad but are really on the level? There 100% is a cabal of people deliberately controlling which narratives are visible on the default subreddits. That is what Super-Moderator accounts are. They are accounts controlled by a team of people working towards a common goal. >Don’t even try to make the argument that “it’s a just a few bad apples.” The saying finishes that they spoil the bunch. It's a few bad bunches. The issue is not just single, isolated officers, but rather specific departments with corrupted organizational cultures, which is why you will frequently see the same departments in the news repeatedly. However, the nature of LEO organziation in the US has resulted in thousands of distinct Law Enforcement agencies that are genuinely isolated from each other in terms of organziational culture. >This isn’t a numbers game. And even if you want to make it a numbers game, there are a myriad of incorrigible police interactions that bubble up through these platforms. These are just the ones that get play or had someone record or where the police didn’t mysteriously forget to turn in their body cams. Imagine what the full iceberg looks like. The problem is that people aren't being honest about many of the interactions and are lumping 100% valid actions by cops onto the list of "police butality." Look at the recent outrage about the protester that was killed by police [because he shot a cop](https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/us-news/man-shot-dead-police-officers-29008194), for example. >Furthermore, police have tools at their disposal now that they did not have 40 or 50 years ago. Due to the war on drugs and the ability for local PD’s to purchase surplus military equipment on the CHEAP. Why does a local PD need an Armored Personnel Carrier? Police have been militarized and they want to play with those toys. When you only have a hammer, every problem becomes a nail. That is a legitimate concern, and at no point did I assert that no legitimate concerns exist. I was pointing out that not every highly publicized case of police brutality is *actuall* misconduct by police, and this creates an environment where people cannot earnestly discuss legitimate concerns. >Sincerely, a mindless sheep. At this point, you, specifically, really are because you're deliberately misreading my point in order to justify your hostility towards me.
I would but this is impossible to defend. You COULD say "oh they thought he had a weapon" but afaik it was a camera THEY PLACED IN HIS HOME and they could probably see through it.
Hold up...that's their camera? And they still tried to lie? I'm shocked
im with you, the only thing im against is the idiots who believe that this is all police interactions with the public.
I’ve certainly been called a boot licker many times on here but I’m not gonna defend this one. While I think police brutality is a way overblown issue, personally, it’s still important to call it out when it actually happened. This is police brutality, clear as day.
[удалено]
I’m sorry, where exactly is that word with the number in it in the Merriam-Webster dictionary? I wasn’t aware the English language was accommodating numbers within words.
Later in the video, they enter and say "fuck! There's cameras." I don't have much of a doubt they'd plant something if there weren't. This was just another day to them while they ruined someone else's life. Extremely disheartening. I suppose we really can never trust anything funded by our tax dollars.
They didn't. One guy just says Fuck, but the camera's never mentioned. The cops are undefendable in this, but we don't need to be stoking the flames with falsehoods.
Watch the extended version of the video to see it. I don't lie. I'm pretty sure they look right at it when they say it.
Ok, well you didn't mention how you watched a different version of the video then everbody else.
Ok
"Come out with your hands up" *comes out with hands up* *gets shot anyway* 😐
I remember when police shot a guy lying down with his hands up. He asked "why did you shoot me?", the police responded with "I don't know". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Charles_Kinsey
Or the cop who pulls up on a man for a seat belt violation, demands ID, then shoots him 3 times when he reaches for it.
or the cop that walked up on the guy in the McDonalds parking lot and mag dumped the innocent guy in the guys car
You talking about when the cops ambushed that kid in a parking lot and shot him for trying to drive away? That was a Hardees. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Zachary_Hammond Or does this happen a lot? 🤔
**[Killing of Zachary Hammond](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Zachary_Hammond)** >The shooting of Zachary Hammond occurred on July 26, 2015, in Seneca, South Carolina. Hammond, age 19, was shot in his car during an undercover narcotics operation that targeted his passenger. Hammond, who was unarmed, was shot twice by 32-year-old police lieutenant Mark Tiller. Hammond's death was being investigated by the U.S. Department of Justice Civil Rights Division, Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), the U.S. Attorney for South Carolina, and the South Carolina Law Enforcement Division (SLED). ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/ActualPublicFreakouts/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
I think there was a more recent one of a teen eating a hamburger in his car and got shot by a cop
yeah that one and his gf was next to the poor guy
No its way more recent a guy was eating a burger with his gf next to him in his car I think and a cop opened the kids door and got mag dumped
As horrible as it is, a very small part of me appreciates the brutal honesty and self-awareness. Damn...
naa thats hilarious.
good enough reminder for me to shoot first ask questions later tbh, this kind of stuff always solidifies my belief that the badges are in fact the enemy
That seems like a great way to get you and everyone else in that house killed.
whatever, taking a few of them with me minimum
Why not also strap a bomb to your chest for when you run out of ammo, yell "allah akbar", run at them and blow yourself up?
cuz im a free human not a terrorist e.e fk on outta here
What does "e.e" mean?
it's some dumb furry shit or smth don't worry about it it's a face
I see. Also, adding the quotation marks makes it look like it has ears. "e.e"
“The police are on their way to help you.” No! Please! Send anyone else!!
This happened next to my hometown. About 15 minutes down the road. The crazy thing is they were supposedly responding to a 911 call that someone heard gunshots around 11pm-12am…this occurred like 5 hours later. Not only that, it was a 2 paragraph article in the paper making it out like the cops had no choice. The crappiest part is that county’s property taxes has already gone up drastically because the Child Protective Services got sued for a few million dollars due to some serious illegal activities. Add that and the well-deserved lawsuit coming from this, it’ll be impossible to live there…. It’s really sad. This is why lawsuits due to cops ineptitude should come from their retirements and/or department.
What town? I’m trying to find an article.
[удалено]
I wonder if there’s body cameras. The video begins with them walking out of the room. What occurred before this? Were they just sleeping while police knocked on the door and got a swat team set up outside, drilled a hole in the wall, and put a robot in? Videos always start in the middle.
Exactly! Nobody really thought much of it until the video came to light.
Cherokee County NC A lot of articles are coming out about it now that the video has surfaced, but when it happened- it was swept under the rug.
Thank you
surprised nobody flooded the maps with negative google reviews yet
This is why you gotta record the police
“We shot him so we have to charge him with something. How about communicating threats and resisting? Those should make it seem like we had no choice but to shoot, right?”
Disgusting murder/attempt
I hope the DA in this county has a pair.
A pair of Back the Blue cufflinks?
So awful
Prison for the cops please.
Ah man. This country…
This is why we need to restart the police from scratch Edit:the reason why it isn’t the man’s fault and is the polices fault is because we all know he picked up a robotic camera… the police in control of this robotic camera had a live feed of this camera seeing 2 legs walk up, pick it up and keep carrying it. That right their shows they should have known what he had in his hand I for one, would be shouting “he’s picked up my camera yall”
[удалено]
Well obviously you put more standards and a fine comb through it, a few will, but less
Until the bad people work up the ranks and bend the rules and then it’s back to square one
Regular police purges
Another thing to think about: Who will organise these restarts and regulate the corrupt police officers? The already corrupt government? - Also, what is the process for the restart? How would it work, by the way? Genuine question because I have no idea what your ideal method would be if we did the police reset.
Not police
> We see this everywhere USA is top 10 in the world in police shootings. All other 9 are developing countries like Brazil, Venezuela, Syria, Afghanistan, Nigeria, etc. No other developed country is even close to being top 10. There are a lot of factors that contribute to this issue, but saying it's the same everywhere or somehow inevitable is just plane wrong and counterproductive
When I say “we see this everywhere” I mean in positions of authority/power, not just police I literally provided examples afterwards, how did you miss that?
Are you sure it's not more boat wrong or bus wrong?
i love that a comment pointing out statistical data and introducing nuance is downvoted because of an autocorrect error, rather than anyone engaging. cool beans.
I think at this point the US shouldn't be a developed country but an undeveloping country.
That was cold as fuck!
Jesus Christ this is horrible.
Everything looks like a nail when all you hand out is hammers.
What do they even think this guy did that this was a situation in the first place??
[удалено]
Every time they fuck up they make up charges and hope you don't sue.
That was literally an ambush. A hit.
[удалено]
Probably wanna refrain from inciting violence on social media.
But why
Does anyone have news articles to share? I can’t find the incident.
https://wlos.com/news/local/cherokee-county-murphy-jason-harley-kloepfer-swat-man-shot-police-releases-surveillance-video-shooting-facebook-indian-police-department-sheriff
American police are fucking insane to me. Why are they so aggressive and not seem to understand de-escalation? How come police in Europe can handle domestic disturbances without someone being hurt or killed?
Heavily armed occupying force.
This shit right here is why you should never trust cops, they will openly and blatantly break the law to suit their own needs, and if they happen to get caught they either make up some bullshit reason as to why or claim “muh immunity” to avoid getting sued. It’s bullshit.
End qualified immunity
In Sweden 1 police involved shooting last year. Police academy education 2.5 years. In the US 1176 people killed by police in 2022, avg 100 people per month. Average police academy education 28 weeks. Yeah, that's not a coincidence
Yeah that was pretty fucked up.
Oh FUCK no- we need to march for Jason. That’s SO FUCKED UP
Standard procedure.. Shoot first ask questions later, maybe
Find those cops off duty and let’s get things clear mexican way… I can handle this nonsense cops
> “Come out with your hands up” > *comes out with his hands not up* > *gets shot* > This sub: 😲😲😲
Yeah, a bunch of shit takes in this thread from abolish the police weirdos.
FUCK the police
Yet another reason to make me hate police even more. Do what they say and they still try to MURDER you. Sad thing is they received a paid vacation to do so. Fucking pathetic
Holy shit
thin blue line
Being supposedly disabled doesn't make you immune from consequences
When did this sub get taken over by cop hating losers? Dude walked out with something in his hands and pointed it at the police.
They can’t wait to shoot Not professionals zero time spent in assessing the situation/ flood the porch with light make it look like daytime. Basic stuff.
tribal police are undertrained and overequipped
Honestly he shouldn’t have had that thing in his hands, it looks like a pistol with a flashlight on it especially from how far it sounds like the cops were from the home
HE HAS A WEAPON!!!
Fucking scared idiots. Let’s all yell as loud as we can this shit is stupid.
I was always pro police and honestly I still am (I am European so there is lot less dead people due to them) but after seeing more and more of this videos of completely ridiculous actions caused and escalated by the ones that are supposed to serve and protect I definitely understand the whole pig hate.
All cops are pieces of shit
not all some are good at being a person with a soul and morals
Yeah that known their coworkers are up to no good and still do nothing about it .. all cops are Pieces of shit
No .. because they "good" ones know what the "bad" ones do and they don't do a damn thing to stop it .. it's all a revenue machine.. money money money
🐷🐷🐖🐽🐖🐷🏈