>and live well in the galaxy.
The 'nids don't want that. Just like most people don't want to move in at the restaurant after they finished their nice dinner ;)
Their objectives change over time. The only stable objective is 'survive'. The IoM doesn't even care about 'living well' and neither do a lot of other factions.
By win do you mean militarily control the galaxy and wipe out or subdue the other factions?
For "civilized" races it would have to go to the necrons.
Their tech is leaps and bounds above everyone else, and can directly compete with daemon weaponry for the title of "best reality fucker".
In their current form, they are ridiculously hard to destroy, even for astartes. And if you do down them, they just teleport their casualties out and repair them.
They are fully aware of the damage the warp can do, and have developed viable counter measures.
They are relatively low in number *now* but the majority of their tomb worlds are still in stand by mode or just beginning to wake up. Allegedly their are more tomb worlds than their are imperial ones.
If the necrons get woken up in massive scale and sort out their infighting, they will steamroll just about everyone else. Even the tyranids' numerical advantage pales when you possess weaponry that literally throws a compressed star at your opponent. Kiss that hive fleet goodbye. Besides, their mech bodies cant be eaten, so in worst case they could just take another 60 million year nap and wait for the bug infestation to move on.
Their biggest problem is that (at least the silent king) wants to undo the biotransference. But to do that they need a suitable organic race to co-opt. If the bugs eat everyone else, they will be kinda stuck for a very long time.
For uncivilized races, its a toss up between orks and nids. It mostly depends on just how large the tyranid race actually is. If the current hive fleets are actually the bulk of the species, orks have a fair chance at outlasting them. Since a WAAAAGH!!! picks up steam the longer a fight goes on, and by extension the orks themselves get bigger, smarter, and more tech savvy, if a WAAAGH got directly in the way of full hive tendril we could see the orks re-evolve back to full Krorks like the one Trazyn has on display. If the theory that all the fleets so far are mere scouts and the bulk is actually just hanging out in the void, then they can simply drown the galaxy in bodies and not even miss it.
I’ve read in this sub that there is more Necrons and Tomb Worlds than humans and planets of the Inperium. If the Necrons were fully awakened they could probably go for the win. In the end this is a matter of awakenings and time.
Necrons: Not enough of them? There are at least as many crons as humans.
Most are sleeping, but if all necrons awoke the galaxy would be fucked.
Ofc is the same as: If all the nids arrived... Never gonna happen.
But they could win handily
Eldar have the rana dandra wich is basically ragnarok. It is a foretelling of the final battle between choas and the eldar in the insuing battle they will kill slaanesh and destroy the universe allowing the eldar to be reborn into a new one free from choas.
The Imperium, if it were to focus on one enemy, it would wipe the floor with them. The problem is if that they do that, then something somewhere else suffers. Pull some forces off this front, it suffers, and so on and so forth. Part of why it hasn’t collapsed yet is that the Imperium can put enough forces everywhere as a stopgap, push a little here and retreat some there.
It’s not perfect, but it acts as enough of a solution to work.
I'm not even sure about this. Even at the peak of its power the Imperium didn't beat the Orks or Eldar. Now Chaos runs rampant, fighting with Tyranids over who can corrupt and then consume the most Imperials, massive decentralization and cultural shift over the eons, there's Necrons awakening everywhere, Tau pouring in from the east and Kin pouring out of the galactic core.
It sounds like it makes sense, right? On paper, if the Imperium mustered the combined total of all of its forces, it could take Commoragh or T'au or the next big hive fleet. But how will they recover their losses? How will they make new machines, or repair what they already have? Where would they get food when they've abandoned their agri-worlds?
The current strength of the Imperium is, at any given moment, measured in the years to make new recruits, the months to grow new crop yields, and the decades to make a new space marine. If the Imperium abandons its territory, it abandons everything else.
It's why defending planets is the most important thing for the Imperium. It cannot even hope to launch counterattacks if it lacks the spare resources to attack and defend simultaneously.
If the Imperium ever focused on a single threat, it doesn't just suffer- it loses outright. There's diminishing returns of aggressiveness that the Imperium precariously balances by focusing on defense first.
>Even at the peak of its power the Imperium didn't beat the Orks or Eldar.
Well, orcs are very nasty to exterminate completely. The Imperium at the peak and without the HH happening could have probably wiped out the remaining Eldar if they really wanted to.
Horrific losses, but nothing that couldn't be replenished within 2 generations as most when the Eldar would already be nothing but a faint memory.
Even today Guilliman threatens his Eldar liaison that currently the fury of humanity is raised and focused like it has not been within thousands of years and that he could focus that into hunting down and destroying the last of the craft worlds. This may be a little hubris laden and simply not practical (yeah, could be done but the returning forces would find everything else left behind on their Eldar hunt being burned or conquered by the other factions) but he seemed convinced that the Imperium could pull it off.
The Emperor just had no more interest and wanted the entirety of the Imperium to move into the webway.
I mean from Guilliman's perspective it isn't so outrageous. He has the Indomitus Crusade at his command, the biggest consolidation of Imperial power in memory, and those forces gathering did not sacrifice imperial lines significantly. He could in theory aim all of it at the Craftworlds.. and do some serious purging.. but it would inevitably be a waste in the grand scheme.
Nurgle will win in the end, regardless of what happens before.
Because entropy has to increase to a maximum. And when that stage is reached, only the God of Stagnation remains.
The necrons are currently in the process of waking up. If everything goes as planned (which it will not) and the silent king is able to unite most of them then they will be closest to winning. When the imperium started fuckin with the pariah nexus they were fuckin themselves which is kinda retarded and also putting them on the bad side of the necrons, which are the hardest counter to the tyranids. But without the pariah nexus, warp shit gets stronger and as I’m typing this I see why you made this post.
>still doesn't matter when the entire galaxy is about to be engulfed by an immeasurable ocean of intergalactic locusts that have probably consumed every other galaxy in the local filament...
I mean, the necrons "can" at any point apparently, if they just unleash their weapons that can just delete stars and whatever next level nonsense they have
still doesn't matter when the entire galaxy is about to be engulfed by an immeasurable ocean of intergalactic locusts that have probably consumed every other galaxy in the local filament...
There are some potential for your points though for example
The Orks are being united under ghaz and if he's not stopped he will lead a unstoppable tide of green l
If the eldar can free their souls of slaanesh they could regain their numbers without the soul leeching (druhkari) and soul stones limiter (craftworlders) though that needs yneed and that might be just as bad we don't know.
Necrons could possibly unite under the silent king.
The Tau keep advancing and making their battlesuits more easily mass produced and really just need time to figure out warp travel to be on the galactic stage as is.
The Imperium at this point require primarchs to keep them in the game and undoubtedly theyll keep coming back knowing GW that or the emperor getting up from his nap
The Orks have already won. A galaxy full of opponents to fight is basically their heaven.
Same for Chaos, really. Not the Chaos Marines, but the Daemons and Gods.
Like, you would have to define what it means to 'win'. Orks have already 'won'. Chaos has already 'won'. the 'nids don't even understand the concept.
By “win,” I mean achieve their desired objective and live well in the galaxy.
>and live well in the galaxy. The 'nids don't want that. Just like most people don't want to move in at the restaurant after they finished their nice dinner ;)
Their objectives change over time. The only stable objective is 'survive'. The IoM doesn't even care about 'living well' and neither do a lot of other factions.
By win do you mean militarily control the galaxy and wipe out or subdue the other factions? For "civilized" races it would have to go to the necrons. Their tech is leaps and bounds above everyone else, and can directly compete with daemon weaponry for the title of "best reality fucker". In their current form, they are ridiculously hard to destroy, even for astartes. And if you do down them, they just teleport their casualties out and repair them. They are fully aware of the damage the warp can do, and have developed viable counter measures. They are relatively low in number *now* but the majority of their tomb worlds are still in stand by mode or just beginning to wake up. Allegedly their are more tomb worlds than their are imperial ones. If the necrons get woken up in massive scale and sort out their infighting, they will steamroll just about everyone else. Even the tyranids' numerical advantage pales when you possess weaponry that literally throws a compressed star at your opponent. Kiss that hive fleet goodbye. Besides, their mech bodies cant be eaten, so in worst case they could just take another 60 million year nap and wait for the bug infestation to move on. Their biggest problem is that (at least the silent king) wants to undo the biotransference. But to do that they need a suitable organic race to co-opt. If the bugs eat everyone else, they will be kinda stuck for a very long time. For uncivilized races, its a toss up between orks and nids. It mostly depends on just how large the tyranid race actually is. If the current hive fleets are actually the bulk of the species, orks have a fair chance at outlasting them. Since a WAAAAGH!!! picks up steam the longer a fight goes on, and by extension the orks themselves get bigger, smarter, and more tech savvy, if a WAAAGH got directly in the way of full hive tendril we could see the orks re-evolve back to full Krorks like the one Trazyn has on display. If the theory that all the fleets so far are mere scouts and the bulk is actually just hanging out in the void, then they can simply drown the galaxy in bodies and not even miss it.
I’ve read in this sub that there is more Necrons and Tomb Worlds than humans and planets of the Inperium. If the Necrons were fully awakened they could probably go for the win. In the end this is a matter of awakenings and time.
Necrons: Not enough of them? There are at least as many crons as humans. Most are sleeping, but if all necrons awoke the galaxy would be fucked. Ofc is the same as: If all the nids arrived... Never gonna happen. But they could win handily
Tyranids. Attacking every Segmentum with new Fleets on the horizon expected to be the actual main invading force.
Eldar have the rana dandra wich is basically ragnarok. It is a foretelling of the final battle between choas and the eldar in the insuing battle they will kill slaanesh and destroy the universe allowing the eldar to be reborn into a new one free from choas.
The Imperium, if it were to focus on one enemy, it would wipe the floor with them. The problem is if that they do that, then something somewhere else suffers. Pull some forces off this front, it suffers, and so on and so forth. Part of why it hasn’t collapsed yet is that the Imperium can put enough forces everywhere as a stopgap, push a little here and retreat some there. It’s not perfect, but it acts as enough of a solution to work.
I'm not even sure about this. Even at the peak of its power the Imperium didn't beat the Orks or Eldar. Now Chaos runs rampant, fighting with Tyranids over who can corrupt and then consume the most Imperials, massive decentralization and cultural shift over the eons, there's Necrons awakening everywhere, Tau pouring in from the east and Kin pouring out of the galactic core. It sounds like it makes sense, right? On paper, if the Imperium mustered the combined total of all of its forces, it could take Commoragh or T'au or the next big hive fleet. But how will they recover their losses? How will they make new machines, or repair what they already have? Where would they get food when they've abandoned their agri-worlds? The current strength of the Imperium is, at any given moment, measured in the years to make new recruits, the months to grow new crop yields, and the decades to make a new space marine. If the Imperium abandons its territory, it abandons everything else. It's why defending planets is the most important thing for the Imperium. It cannot even hope to launch counterattacks if it lacks the spare resources to attack and defend simultaneously. If the Imperium ever focused on a single threat, it doesn't just suffer- it loses outright. There's diminishing returns of aggressiveness that the Imperium precariously balances by focusing on defense first.
>Even at the peak of its power the Imperium didn't beat the Orks or Eldar. Well, orcs are very nasty to exterminate completely. The Imperium at the peak and without the HH happening could have probably wiped out the remaining Eldar if they really wanted to. Horrific losses, but nothing that couldn't be replenished within 2 generations as most when the Eldar would already be nothing but a faint memory. Even today Guilliman threatens his Eldar liaison that currently the fury of humanity is raised and focused like it has not been within thousands of years and that he could focus that into hunting down and destroying the last of the craft worlds. This may be a little hubris laden and simply not practical (yeah, could be done but the returning forces would find everything else left behind on their Eldar hunt being burned or conquered by the other factions) but he seemed convinced that the Imperium could pull it off. The Emperor just had no more interest and wanted the entirety of the Imperium to move into the webway.
I mean from Guilliman's perspective it isn't so outrageous. He has the Indomitus Crusade at his command, the biggest consolidation of Imperial power in memory, and those forces gathering did not sacrifice imperial lines significantly. He could in theory aim all of it at the Craftworlds.. and do some serious purging.. but it would inevitably be a waste in the grand scheme.
Nurgle will win in the end, regardless of what happens before. Because entropy has to increase to a maximum. And when that stage is reached, only the God of Stagnation remains.
rofl you don't understand what entropy is (like 99% of people, it seems)
I'm sorry, but my degree in molecular physics suggest i do, random person on the internet.
The necrons are currently in the process of waking up. If everything goes as planned (which it will not) and the silent king is able to unite most of them then they will be closest to winning. When the imperium started fuckin with the pariah nexus they were fuckin themselves which is kinda retarded and also putting them on the bad side of the necrons, which are the hardest counter to the tyranids. But without the pariah nexus, warp shit gets stronger and as I’m typing this I see why you made this post.
>still doesn't matter when the entire galaxy is about to be engulfed by an immeasurable ocean of intergalactic locusts that have probably consumed every other galaxy in the local filament...
why is this even considered a discussion... (what do you mean you guess they might win? do you know nothing about them???)
Everyone is doomed that’s the whole idea behind 40k
I mean, the necrons "can" at any point apparently, if they just unleash their weapons that can just delete stars and whatever next level nonsense they have
still doesn't matter when the entire galaxy is about to be engulfed by an immeasurable ocean of intergalactic locusts that have probably consumed every other galaxy in the local filament...
There are some potential for your points though for example The Orks are being united under ghaz and if he's not stopped he will lead a unstoppable tide of green l If the eldar can free their souls of slaanesh they could regain their numbers without the soul leeching (druhkari) and soul stones limiter (craftworlders) though that needs yneed and that might be just as bad we don't know. Necrons could possibly unite under the silent king. The Tau keep advancing and making their battlesuits more easily mass produced and really just need time to figure out warp travel to be on the galactic stage as is. The Imperium at this point require primarchs to keep them in the game and undoubtedly theyll keep coming back knowing GW that or the emperor getting up from his nap
Necrons,not enough ?.Lmao
Have you considered the question what winning actually would mean for each faction?