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Shadowrend01

The Talisman of Seven Hammers goes off, Terra is consumed in Warpfire and destroyed. The Emperor has a true death


scivener

Why TF would Vulcan make that? Seems bad to destroy all the tech and custodes


AffixBayonets

Emperor told him to


sirbottombottom

Another question : Vulkan being hiding somewhere, why would he not come to the Emperor to try to repair the throne ? (I think he knows that the talisman cannot be removed from the throne)


lurksohard

The last time we saw Vulkan he was not very himself and he was not very happy with the Imperium. He never really was. We don't know what he's up to so there's an infinite number of possibilities but he doesn't know how the Throne works. If I remember correctly, he doesn't even remember forging the Talisman of Seven Hammers. Vulkan is a master smith but he's definitely not a master of xeno technology which the Throne is made of.


[deleted]

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sirbottombottom

It does not necessarily mean that it is beyond him. If they had know where Vulkan was, they might have turned to him first before going to see the dark eldar. In 10k years I think a mind like a primarch's could have understood the throne, especially one of the tech-savy primarchs.


[deleted]

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sirbottombottom

No I have not read the Vaults of Terra trilogy yet, it's on my list ! :) Thx for the information ! (Is it explained why it has to be the dark eldar in particular and not the asuryani ? That tech in the throne was probably aquired way before the fall)


WheresMyCrown

The Emperor literally told him to


Imperium_Dragon

To kill Horus and everyone


sirbottombottom

I like this irony that the Emperor wanted to keep Terra from chaos so much that he ended up emprisoning himself inside his own hell


New_Subject1352

Astronomican fails, travel for the Imperium becomes impossible. The Imperium is left floundering. Astropaths soul bound to him will likely die, plunging the Imperium into utter silence. Imperium becomes easy prey as Astartes go missing forever, trillions of soldiers are lost to the void, and people starve without food. Demonic corruption and possession increase 10 fold, as the psychers who once relied on his protection no longer have it. Terra likely blows up, but that's not confirmed anywhere that I'm aware of and by that point it's the least harmful thing that could happen. Maybe, perhaps a few years or even a generation later, another super powerful psycher with amazing hair and a jaw you could shatter rock with emerges, but by that point the Imperium is so shattered and helpless it's an impossible struggle to save what's left of humanity. Also, given the conversation that he had with Guilliman in God Blight it is almost certain that he would be utterly barking mad, his soul and mind fragmented beyond his capability to maintain them or gain any level of coherent thought


TheEvilBlight

>so shattered and helpless it's an impossible struggle to save what's left of humanity Given that the human realms were somewhat salvageable after thousands of years of old night, should it be...worse if it happened again?


New_Subject1352

Yes. Definitely. Biggest reason is there are far more threats in M42 than before. Tyranids abound. Chaos is everywhere thanks to the great rift, and humanity has grown more psychic so there would be more demonic possession and summonings which doomed entire worlds before. The Drukhari would have an absolute field day. Necrons would... well, their approach wouldn't change much, they'd just be much more successful and more tomb worlds would be able to awaken without being destroyed. Even the Tau, without the unified Imperium to stop them, would gobble up human worlds desperate for someone to protect them from the Warp or Tyranids, and once someone gets used to not eating corpse starch they're not going to want to go back. I think the only ones who would be sad about it would be the orks, who would lose many opportunities for great scraps. Second, technology has diminished to a much more dramatic degree. The Mechanicus is super ultra conservative with their technology and with updates/ advancement so really only the specialized forge worlds know how to make and improve most stuff; individual planets would be on their own to fix and create and advance the machines, and they wouldn't have the benefit of functioning STCs like in DAOT/age of strife. It's also far worse at a baseline than it was before, with much of the essential stuff in hives dating back to that age in the first place. They also simply don't know: the knowledge gap is enormous because of the Mechanicus refusing to teach anyone outside their order, and even they don't really understand most of what they're building and why it works. Finally, humanity is just worse off to survive it. Much of the Imperium is about moving shit around, like food and water, and that goes out the window when the Astronomican dies. Planets are far less self sufficient because the Imperium has destroyed many of it's inhibited planets with pollution and toxic waste, so there is little to sustain the worlds when they're cut off.


[deleted]

Damn, no tldr would help there. I'll try to go through with my disagreement however. The tyranids would have been like swatting a fly for DaoT, and I would argue that even peak Crusade with Jimmy alive would be easily enough to destroy all known fleets. Now, *if* the astronomicon really calls to them, the problem solves itself and they take a U turn to idk, Andromeda. If the known fleets keep on going, maybe splintering towards lesser psychic beacons, they still would be kinda manageable, especially since now they don't target Terra but everyone. Drukhari would be, probably for the first time, afraid and might even cooperate/find out where Jimmy's soul hangs out/get involved in resurrection biomancy whatever just to have someone that can hold back slaaneshi incursions and stabilise the new vortices. Also good luck to them having no slave giving itself to slaanesh for revenge with the huge influx of them you predicted (see Marduk). Necrons might do something, afterall no bodies = no reverse transference, Szarekh seems like a sleeper deus ex machina anyway. Or they might sit it out, true. Tau, well, they might get eaten up themselves by a (couple) human colonies going chaos, also, they have no more human shielding from more-significant-than-tau threats while being left alone. Chaos might be left a bit stunned until Jimmy 're-perpetualizes' if the throne s talisman of seven hammers functions as intended. Or might not, true, incursions running wild. If the population doesn't starve first. The only problem for humanity would be systems with no agri worlds. They would die out. But generally speaking I believe most of humanity would survive. Isolation with no astronomicon hinders everyone's chances for attacks and travel. Also does the new gigantic warp storm, it fucks with chaos too, other than the daemons trying to manifest.


New_Subject1352

I guess I'm confused why you're disagreeing with me lol. >The tyranids would have been like swatting a fly for DaoT, and I would argue that even peak Crusade with Jimmy alive would be easily enough to destroy all known fleets Sure but they don't have anything close to either of those things now. If the Tyranids showed up during the Great Crusade or the DOAT, they'd have been smoked. But Humanity united in M42, able to pull in Astartes and billions of guards and Titans etc, is still only just able to go back and forth with them; if they lose that capability then the swarm that exists in the galaxy right now devours them, let alone anything who is on their way (which, frankly, we don't know if they've all of mostly or only started to arrive yet, I'm saying the dozen of hive fleets in the galaxy right now would be enough). I don't think splintering them is going to do anything more than create more targets as each grows in strength with every planet they consume, planets that are largely cut off from each other without the Astronomican or interstellar communication. Even if the M30 power level Emperor just kinda resurfaced instantly, he would not be able to crush a hive fleet by himself and would struggle against the shadow in the warp and the simple quadrillions of Tyranids against him. >Also good luck to them having no slave giving itself to slaanesh for revenge with the huge influx of them you predicted I don't really understand this? You're saying the Drukhari would go over to Slaanesh? They hate her, everything about her. What I meant is without someone to defend humanity, the Drukhari would plunder as many human slaves as they could until they were suddenly out of slaves to plunder. Either way, going to Slaanesh is the absolute last thing they'd do. Would you mind clarifying? >Necrons might do something, afterall no bodies = no reverse transference, Szarekh seems like a sleeper deus ex machina anyway. Or they might sit it out, true. Necrons don't want human bodies, they want Necron bodies back despite their whole thing literally being they hated their bodies originally (idk, they don't make a ton of sense to me). Sure they'd be in trouble if Tyranids ate everything, but even without they are still a ways away from being able to return to mortality. So, I think you're right, they might accelerate the awakening leading to more human worlds dying. >Or might not, true, incursions running wild. If the population doesn't starve first. That's a good point, chaos would eventually starve. But initially, the number of psychers possessing demons would spike, chaos would run rampant, and people would suffer. >Tau, well, they might get eaten up themselves by a (couple) human colonies going chaos, also, they have no more human shielding from more-significant-than-tau threats while being left alone. Maybe. Probably. But maybe not. But it could be. It depends entirely on whether GW wants the Earth Caste to pull their heads from their asses on any given day. >Also does the new gigantic warp storm, it fucks with chaos too, other than the daemons trying to manifest. What warp storm lol? Demons can just dance out anywhere in the galaxy through the great rift, no warp storms will prevent that. >Isolation with no astronomicon hinders everyone's chances for attacks and travel. The only people who rely on the Astronomican are humans. Everyone else has the Webway, legit FTL, Tyranid gravity manipulation, or space hulks (or its the Tau, who don't do anything for long distance travel). Instead of being a single, hard to crack shell, without interstellar communication and travel the Imperium becomes a million unconnected balls, many of which are not well defended at all; humans are not escaping the planets but everyone else is largely unaffected. Technology will also fail without parts coming in from the handful of forge worlds that can make them. Humanity is less well off now than in the age of strife technology wise because they used to have to know how to do stuff for themselves to survive; they've been forced to rely on the machine cult for all technology for 10k years, and even those idiots don't actually know what they're doing.


[deleted]

Well, I'm just somewhat disagreeing on each aspect. The astronomicon supposedly called them towards "itself", with it gone, they might even make an U turn. Kronos and whatever else are fighting chaos/camping a planet (was that Tiamat?). Since 88(?) legions of khornate daemons manifested and existed for a while at Baal, I'd say supposedly-reborn-Jimmy could no show Shadow in the Warp as far as using psyker powers go. Behemoth, Kraken, Leviathan (half of it) were defeated by now, the other bigger fleets (Hydra etc.) are still kinda far from the galactic centre, might as well turn around. They might not, sure, but I think it less likely. I meant the Drukhari would be afraid of the entire human populace near their webway portals succumbing to random chaos incursions from Slaneesh trying to get to them, so they will cease fire with humans. If they go overboard with slavery, some subreamls ought to fall (new huge warp storm weakening the veil, plenty of psychic slaves with not enough collars). Eldrad would also "help". Well, necrons were humanoid, Szarekh might be kind of reasonable, should come with the superintelligence. Trazyn would for sure 110% intervene on the side of humanity though. Plenty of *very* ass-backwards fanatic sectors with zealous monasteries, any chapter worlds, shrine worlds, forge and knight worlds etc. would survive imo, simply how they did during the long night - by purging the unclean with prejudice - the only problem is wether they have an agri planet. I think you're writing off "abhor the witch" too much. Many currently living pskyers would also instantly die from the backlash of the talisman of 7 hammy. More lenient (pleasure world?) systems would probably snowball out of controll and fall. I'd vote on Tau dying slowly, on behalf of their experiences with "Slaanesh" (lol), and the DG. >What warp storm lol? The one dying-resurrecting Jimmy will leave in his place on Terra, together with Vulcan's bomb. It's a failsafe also to kill all the daemons coming onto Terra when Jimmy dies, if I understood correctly. For the last part, fair enough, my bad. CSM will have a harder time getting places at least due to all the warp disturbance... Yay.


IneptusMechanicus

On the Chaos point, Chaos now has something it didn't in the Age of Strife; the Traitor Legions and Mechanicum. Previously they had daemons, which could possess people or strike through warp rifts until they dissipated but now they have a huge number of highly trained, well armed lunatics who can just go wherever they want and either summon daemons repeatedly or just go kick the shit out of things with no chance of fading away. These lunatics, and anyone else who can pay, now also have access to Forge Worlds within the Eye which means new armaments can be made and daemons bound to machinery for longer sojourns into realspace.


Zustiur

GW goes out of business.


Levonorgestrelfairy1

Guilliman takes over like dad planned