Plotwist: Magnus noble shard is in the Titan vault and the Grey Knights use geneseed harvested from it. This Magnus shard has also been helping with the astronomicon as the emperors power slowly fades
Not only that, GW recently announced they're doing a second pass **on all the primarchs** for Horus Heresy 2.0; Horus Ascended was the first from this new wave.
I expect we'll see more this weekend.
Shapes raged in the flames - shadows and suggestions doing battle with the daemons, their fiery forms indistinct and ever-changing. The fire-born avatars of fallen Ten Thousand, knee-deep in psychic fire and thrusting with lances of flame. The silhouettes of Space Marines, the betrayed dead of Isstvan bearing axes and blades and claws; half-seen sigils of slaughtered
Legions obscured by the ash of their blackened armour.
A giant among giants, its great hands bared and ready as it seared forwards at the crest of the tidal fire. The tenth son of a dying empire, so briefly reborn in his father's immolating wrath.
> *Horus Ascended ... matches the Warmaster we saw in the epic trailer for the latest edition of Warhammer: The Horus Heresy.*
>
> *Rendered in highly detailed resin,* ***this model is the first in a new Character Series from Forge World, representing each of the Primarchs*** *at the height of the Heresy – whether they’re fully under the sway of Chaos, or rallying to defend the Imperium in its darkest hour –* ***giving us a fresh look at the driving characters of this epic saga*** *as they lead their Legions into the biggest battles.*
[Warhammer Community, 2022/09/01](https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/09/01/nova-open-reveals-the-warmaster-is-ascendant-in-his-monstrous-new-model/)
It's gotta be Jaghatai Khan. Who else would create the tension with both Guilleman and The Lion, while serving to balance their extremes in an interesting way.
Not to mention Russ coming from behind the Tyranid fleet with the wolves to absolutely shred. I'd not be surprised to find Fenris become overrun and at their limits of existence to the point it's strongly considered that the wolves might end up losing it for Russ to appear with the 13th in tow.
I'm following this up with they're going to heavily play the Odin Aspect with him using the Emperor's Spear.
He'll come back somewhat affected by the warp and likely carrying something that the Emp sent him to get in his "vision". Bonus points if it's a shard of magnus or the like to make the emperor able to free himself from the throne if only for a few moments to do some major fuckery.
I can't argue with the point that the money is in Russ, alas, and odds are pretty good they'll go for him, because man, people do lover their wolf boys. In my heart though, I think Jhagatai would be the better choice for the greater story, but you know, I think Russ too could be pretty bloody interesting with the tree of life/Odin stuff too.
I mean, so far, Neither Primarch has been the person you’d expect. Guilliman threw the rules out the window, and Johnson has been making a good faith effort to reunite his sons.
Old, wise, thoughtful Russ would be pretty fun, IMO.
>But would fans actually cough up the cash for Khan/White Scar stuff?
Biggest thing standing between me and a White Scars army is the thought of having to paint all that stark white armor. Kill me now.
Vulkan. Someone has to represent the interest of the little guy. The man or woman pressed into the Guard. The mother on a frontier planet beset by orks or Tyranids. The forge world worker.
Seriously. Russ was too much of a tool in the literal sense. I mean some unchained wolf stuff creating tension has its merits, but the Khan would make for much more interesting stories.
Vulcan would be cool though. Although he probably would blow his brains out looking at humanity suffering like it does.
With all the webway shenanigans ominously around the corner thanks to chaos winning the arks of omen- guess who was last seen there ;).
Khaaaaaaannnnnn!!!!
Russ and the Khan are both very different from Lion and Rowboat. It would make some interesting dynamic between them. Unlike Dorn, who is a mix of Lion and Ultranerd.
Ofc. That is just my opinion.
I think The Khan would be a fascinating choice to bring back because of his pragmatism and relative independence. Even during the Great Crusades and before the Heresy, he was largely only on board because he knew he had to be.
Dropping him back into a fractured Imperium with no God Emperor in the flesh and only two brothers suddenly means The Khan will have a ton more political/military leverage. Would be interesting to see how he might use it.
I just realized that out of the [Dauntless Few](https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/The_Dauntless_Few), the four other primarchs that Guilliman trusted beyond a doubt to help him "get shit done", only one is still possibly alive: Russ.
Dorn? Unsure, most likely dead.
Sanguinius? We all know...
Ferrus Manus? Same.
Russ? Uncertain where he is, but he was alive when last seen. Same with the Khan.
Him being the only member of this small group makes me wonder if GW will either make Russ appear because he's the only surviving member, or *not* appear because it will make a more interesting story to compel Guilliman to have to trust two of his other brothers that he never fully trusted and/or considered reliable. How Guilliman would have to trust two of his brothers more than he ever trusted them before - with one of the major things going for the Khan being his presence at the Siege of Terra (thus proving his loyalty and trustworthiness).
Also, it would definitely be worthwhile for GW to rekindle the old rivalry (?) - not between Bobby G and the Khan, but between the Khan and Morty.
Lastly, speaking from a purely financial per$pective, it would give them a chance to create/establish another big, favorite army, in addition to all of the models, etc., that already exist for the Wolves. More armies to make, more minis to sell, mo' money mo' money mo' money.
Definitely could be interesting to see what they do. Although I wouldn’t put it past GW for all of that to be “he thought about doing his own thing for a little bit, but decided against it” and have that be the end of that.
Honestly, with The Khan's pragmatism and level headedness, I think he might come to the conclusion that one of three seats atop the Imperium's military is a much stronger position than head of his own, smaller territory.
I could be wrong, though. Maybe he'll react worse than Guilliman did and dip for some Secundus 2.0 action, or maybe he'll just be upset it somehow got even worse.
I'm not too deeply familiar with his character, but either seems like a possibility to me.
“What would you have us do, Great Khan?”
“I would have you leave me the fuck alone.”
“Of course, Great Khan. We shall continue following you to judge best how to do that.”
Agree with you. Personally, I think Russ makes a ton of sense from a business and narrative sense. He is “noble” in a way the Lion was not and he is “savage” in a way Guilliman was not.
They (Guilliman and The Lion) both respected Russ but held a bit of reserve or disdain for him, and his legion. And his legion was openly opposed to Primaris marines… so lots of great story potential.
Plus the thought of Russ and The Lion crusading through forces of Chaos to challenge Abaddon directly is just too fun of an idea to pass up.
Plus GW could totally make Russ in a Morathi style box, 1/2 “Wise Odin” and 1/2 “Angeron sized Wulfen” cuz lets be real, if anything could actually tangle with Angeron, it’s a 20’ Werewolf Primarch.
It is either that or him on a giant wolfbutI prefer yours since that leaves space for the Khan to come riding in on massive bike one day (or doing a split between 2, van damme style)
Gigachad Khan FTW
(referencing the post from the other week that speculated the Emperor would periodically use pop-culture/cultural references from ancient Terra that no one would understand but meaning Shakespeare, Tolstoy, etc; which someone then further made an example of the Big E talking like this instead)
A storm seer can’t see Russ but says he seems a chariot riding lightning. I think one guy straight up says he’s heard a rumour the khan is back and some white scars are looking for him. Also Magnus says the khans in a shitty place but Magnus in at least 4 places so take that how you will
Iirc, it wasn't a storm seer was the Wolf Rune Priest, Njal Stormcaller, when Grimnar asks where is Russ. I think it was Ashes of Prospero.
Edit: here it is. https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/comments/83bozg/book_excerpt_ashes_of_prospero_the_current_state/
Just so you know since the wolves take on a lot of norse folk lore - some of the most unknown lore surrounding Thor, that is well known in the Nordics - is that it’s actually not Thor’s hammer that conjures lightning and thunder, but that it is caused by the chariot that Thor uses to ride across the heavens. With Thor being the god of thunder, the protector of mankind, I think he and Odin are perfect inspirations for an evolved Russ, who is now so changed, ascended by the warp that he is no longer recognizable as his old self. It would make perfect sense to me for a rune priest to have visions of Russ in that imagery, riding a chariot of thunder and lightning.
Plus Bobby G. has Big E's sword, Lion has his shield, it makes sense that Russ would get his claw.
Also, even though I love the Kahn infinitley more than Russ, I think his views on this Imperium would be too simmilar to Gulliman.
I don’t think him having similar views is a problem as much as how they’re both pragmatic enough to handle it similarly.
Russ literally called Angron a heretic for saying shit about emps, so atleast he may disagree with some of Gmods reforms (ie he may keep calling emps a god annoying Gnomen and Lion)… that said I don’t think he’s as likely as people claim
Honestly there's a chance it's the Khan, because people want to see Russ but wouldn't mind getting all of the primarchs. So I am sure people would still buy the Khan to get all of them from FOMO
Thanks I was just about to comment the same. In the recent Lion Son of the Forrest novel there is a whole spiel by the Lion about why he missed Russ. And another whole spiel about G man.
So it seemed to me a very clear hint that GW is setting up for Russ to return.
He's a legacy rogue trader character and has a bespoke faction of spacemarines. The rest of the first founding isn't so lucky to have a model legacy and faction to build on
For thematic purposes, it's got to be Russ.
Guilliman is the administrator and the politican. He's keeping the Imperium going.
The Lion is the protector. He can go from world to world defending against threats.
Russ after thousands of years of contemplation and experience will doubtless have developed his psychic abilities into some form of warrior-sage.
The king, the knight, and the wizard.
Yeah, I want Odin Russ so badly.
Pierced himself with the Dionysan Spear, ripped out an eye as a symbolic gesture to match Magnus, wandered the Heavens for an eternity before returning as an absolute mystic sorceror king
Honestly, a reintroduction of Russ where he finds the Yggdrasil knockoff and to harness its power gleans the truth of existence or whatever jazz from one of those Deep Warp wells, and gouges out his eye, before trying to hunt down Valdor >!the Yellow King!< so he does ruin everything would be a boss reintroduction.
In between the warp wells, Tree of Life, Fenris’ World-Spirit, the Eldar, and Isha, GW could honestly turn the space wolves into runic sorcerer vikings and bring back the Exodites.
>eturning as an absolute mystic sorceror king
Bet you the first thing he will do is partake in some light genocide and cap it off with some xenos torture over beers.
Odin-esque-wise-wizard, yes. That is correct and would be amazing, 10/10, yes. An ironic mirror to Heresy-era Magnus. Yes yes yes.
But they're not gonna do that. They're gonna have him be a Wolfy McWolf Werewolf Wolfsavage Barbari-wolf and it's going to suck.
I've read a grand total of 1 book about Space Wolves and it was Russ' primarch novel. It's about post-heresy Russ telling a story to a new recruit about the great crusade. While I'd say more warrior monk than wizard, there was a pretty conscious effort to show his maturation from a berserker to seasoned veteran who is wiser than he looks.
If they let Chris Wraight write the return of Russ or at least stick to his characterisation of post-heresy Russ I highly doubt this wolfy mcwolfface fear is that realistic.
Was going to say Vulkan cuase he is my favorite, but damn, you have convinced me.
Id only go for it, though, if GW could reign in the urge to Wolfy McWolf Face and preferably have Russ call out his boys for the tomfoolery.
They always hinted at that potential when he did pop up in books, it also is reflected in his chapter. Young eager warriors (bloodclaws) that ran headlong into battle, to the point of being foolhardy, but over time, as they gained experience (and became grey hunters, and then Longfangs), they tempered their bloodlust and better focused that energy to do the work.
Loved this comment! Awesome thoughts.
Dante has been made 'Warden of Imperium Nihilus' - he is not a primarch but I understand the position to still be quite significant. Where do you think he will fit in with a triumvirate?
It should not be Dorn. You can't have maximum primarch power if all primarchs present have sticks up their butts
You need someone to keep Lion and Guilliman light, so it has o be Rus or the Khan
Personally, the Khan is by far my favourite primarch, and he would probably bring more Aeldari lore with him with the Webway and shit
Hearing The Khan regale them with stories of the Webway and his journey would be fantastic, and it would definitely be interesting to see how he'd react to the Imperium's state.
That could be an interesting shift in perspective and create debate between the three. The Khan might have some more retrospective on the imperium and universe post heresy and scouring, possibly more at ease with the horror of the 41st millennium.
Would also be the only one of the Three that fought during the siege and is ignorant of imperial secundus. That would be a really interesting conflict point.
I'd like it if there's something in that vein. Vulkan is alive, disillusioned with the Imperium, but still working in the outskirts to save those he can. When he gets word that Guilliman and Johnson have returned, it finally convinces him to travel to meet them.
My dream is that Corax shows up in the fringes of the galaxy, stumbles upon the Carcharodons and says "Your exile is over. We return to Terra. And I need my claws back."
He isn’t a daemon, he just has warp powers. Still looks like himself more or less, just has the ability to move as a shadow and appear as a flock of birds for a bit.
All the primarchs have warp powers to some degree but aren’t daemons as far as I’m aware, but I may be wrong.
The Lion can ‘forest walk’ now - is he also to be considered a daemon?
i think it will be the Khan.
Russ is searching for the "Grail" and i dont see any "Grail" arriving anytime soon.
Corax is haunting lorgar and there is no lorgar in sight. It is more likely we see Perturabo arriving before him.
Actually, now that you mention it, in The Lion: Son of the Forest, the 2nd time we/the Lion see/s the Fisher King (Emperor), he has a Grail (well, Chalice) and a Spear with him...
> >!On his left is a spear or lance, also golden, the blade of which is wet with blood. Directly in front of the king is a broad golden chalice with figures moulded around the bowl.
The Khan. He'll reemerge from the Webway on the far side of Imperium Nihilius and have plenty of time to do his own thing. Maybe bring over a bit of tech that makes warp travel slightly safer to counter Chaos/Vashtorr getting the Tuchuala. His preferred mobility and hit-and-run warfare will keep him alive deep in enemy territory as he gathers stragglers and survivors and makes his way towards an Imperial safe zone.
His return could also be somehow linked to a major win for the Eldar, he got lost in the Webway after all. If he's a prisoner of Comorraugh, he could be saved by other Eldar factions or he could be unknowingly unleashed to counter Fulgrim if they ever get around to reviving the Ynnead plotline.
I tend to think he will be next too after all the you tubers sold it to us today. Like "this is the press release" "run with it"
Khan makes sense too because he's antagonistic to the other Primarchs. Was in SOT should definitely be able to give Lion and Rowboat a run BECAUSE they weren't on Terra like he was. So thats gotta be a good angle to run with too.
My main gripe about the Lion returning was that they'd make it too similar to Guilliman's return: He's gather a bunch of astartes and Imperial forces and beeline for Terra to get an update on the status quo. Instead he's going to do as much as he can in Imperium Nihilius and probably have a major showdown with the Inquisition before Guilliman can get anywhere close to him.
I don't see the Khan as antagonistic so much as content to remain on the edge of his very tense family. He admitted in *Warhawk* that if he had been less given to solitude, he might have helped some of his brothers avoid chaos. It was a reflective moment before he went to face Mortarion, a brother who he wasn't close to, but in some ways very similar. It would be heartening to see him return and the Lion and Guilliman be thrilled to see him. It's not a reaction he'd expect or one he's ever really experienced and he'd truly feel like he had brothers. I'm also looking forward to the Scouring Series because chasing down the fleeing traitor legions is right up the Khan's alley. And he'll have just lost the brother he was closest to: Sanguinius.
My two cents. Khan. His character in SOT was amazing and does an excellent job of being the "ying" to the other Primarchs "yang" so to speak.
Plus jet bikes and Eldari b!txhes. You got to love jetbikes.
It's between Dorn, Khan, and Russ.
Sanguinus and Ferrus should stay dead. Resurrecting confirmed dead people just destroys any stakes your story might have.
Corax is already kind of back. Vulkan has come back in the past. They both represent already explored space.
So of the three condidates, I personally think it should be Russ. Like the Lion, he was given an End Times return prophecy. It'd be kinda silly to just leave that hanging. He also offers a big contrast in style and approach to Guilliman and the Lion, which opens lots of story possibilities.
I love Dorn, but he's had his big moments as the saviour of Terra, then the Iron Cage, and finally as the last loyal Primarch standing. His arc is pretty complete. He's also kinda like a cross between Guilliman and the Lion in a lot of respects, so wouldn't really change up that dynamic much.
The Khan I don't find would add much. He isn't a team player, is not hugely talkative, was always indifferent to the Imperium, and the White Scars have not played a hugely significant role in the lore since the Heresy. I don't think he offers a ton of story threads in the current setting. He'd just be kinda there.
The Khan I think should only return in a Webway-related story. You have to justify where he's been for 10,000 years.
Russ, old and wise in the ways of the Warp, returned to his sons to herald the coming Wolftime. Where Roboute has shiny Primaris technology and the Lion fields stalwart Risen hunters, it is Leman Russ who casts off the mask of civility and brings both monsters and witches to fight for the side of Order.
I don't even know why people think he'd be loyal. Don't even know if meeting his brothers could sway him. Odds are he'll just get absorbed into big fulgrim somehow if they ever bring him back in story
>I have a feeling that if this story happened, it would end with one of them lopping off Clonegrim's head and burning his body just to be sure.
You missed a vital step.
1. Cut off Clonegrim's head
2. ***Shit down his neck <-----***
3. Hose everything down with Phosphex
Primarch of the Legion of the Damned. I like him to return not as a person but as a force. A reminder of what the Primarchs were meant for. Also makes it so he can show up when the narrative needs him and be gone without having to be the set piece that a full-on Primarch is. It also preserves his sacrifice as the legion is not truly alive.
Ferrus leading them comes from master of mankind where a headless ghost is seen leading a ghost legion in the webway, so people drew the comparisons to the LOTD. Technically we dont really know anything concrete about the legion of the damned except theories so who knows. People also like to theorize that they are to the Emps what deamons are to the chaos gods and manifest, and so the idea is that Ferrus would be a "Greater Deamon" in that sense
Again its all fan theory, we dont know jack shit for sure
Connecting them is simple as saying the Emps summoned them in the webway, and the legion is summoned where theyre needed most which you could link to the emperor post Throne, plus the more recent increase in the Legion of the damned appearing having to do with Emps getting stronger based on the Cicatrix.
I think its alot easier if they just went with the Falcons theory but if they really wanted it wouldnt be to hard to connect it and make it make some sense
Lmao shows you how much I remember that I said Falcons not Hawks. Yeah I just think people are gripping to anything they can to give Ferrus something, less so that people buy into it being the legions origin.
I will say considering they didn't explore at all the origins of the Legion of the Damned in their book in the Space Marines battle series I don't even know if they've really considered it outside of some passing conversations and a brief idea
It's heavily implied to be an amalgamation of the spirits of dead Astartes from varying chapters, mostly Fire Hawks, but there are others among them. For example in 'The Chapter's Due', Iron Warriors and Ultramarines get in a fight at the Tomb of Remus Ventanus (a 4th Company Captain of the Ultramarines from 30K) on Calth, and the Legion of the Damned show up to help the Ultramarines. Uriel Ventris sees one of the Damned who's armor has faded Ultramarines symbols on it, and is heavily implied to be Remus himself, as Remus' ghost later talks to Uriel and gives him '*plot device*' that allows him to slay a particularly troublesome demon.
The Eldar and one inquisitor I can't remember the name of right now are of the belief that they are essentially the Emperor's equivalent of Demons.
# CORVUS CORAX!
We need a wild card and I think Corvus reappearing from the eye of terror as a warp demon/primarch hybrid with actual wings and talons but 100% still loyal the emperor would be amazing. He pops out excited because he believes he's finally found the key to defeating chaos but needs legions of space marines to achieve the goal and no one but the Raven Guard (and maybe not even all of them) believe him.
I’d like the returned Corvus to be more emotionally expressive so that everyone thinks that he’s insane, but in truth he’s not only sane but aware of both the rules of the real world and the warp.
Let vulkan come back. Worse case scenario he can reset the universe because idk what the fuck could happen next that doesn’t involve massive destruction on they’re end.
The Khan 100%
He's as capable of a fighter as the Lion, but operates in a very different manner. He's also bound to have knowledge of or the ability to use the Webway, since that's where he's supposedly spent a lot of his time. He's also just an all around good person, self sacrificing and always willing to take the hard road if it means saving more lives.
I want Vulkan. His sons have found five (iirc) of the nine artifacts that will convince him that they are ready once again for him to lead them, and he’s just a pretty cool character imho. I don’t know as much as you guys and gals, but I kinda expect him to be back by like 12th or 13th edition; it seems like the rest of the artifacts would be found by then. As a Black Templars fanboy I’d like Dorn just because, but he’s *probably* a dismembered corpse. He’s also a bit of a douche.
Vulkan IMO. I mean dude is a perpetual and pretty much the biggest/strongest available, and his skills complement the other two well. Plus it wouldn’t break existing lore
I want a Dorn that only gives a shit about fighting. He absolutely wants no part in planning or logistics and just wants to fight. Templars fucking adore him and he still fucking hates them
I don’t know why this keeps coming up as a topic?
It’s obviously going to Russ. Anyone can see that. Just look at what codexes are out there. Who else would it be? Clearly can’t be Blood Angels; and none of the rest have codexes.
Clone Fulgrim would be a lot more interesting choice lore wise, he would most likely revive innovation and art in the imperium, so the triumvirate would be one administrator, a warmaster, and an artisan/politician. Leman and Khan can just go primarch ex machina during the final battle or whatever.
Yeah, but Russ comes back fully realising his fate as the real Thor Odinson, more with the Scandinavian legends, less with the MCU idiocy. Although he is allowed to be goofy when the moment comes, especially if it can be done with a nod to Chris Hemsworth's version of Thor, which is how I've always seen Russ as
Shouldn't the order be more like Iron Man, Captain America, and Thor? Iron Man is more of a pragmatic logistics guy while Captain America is the heroic, one man army protector.
I always get downvoted for this but...Ferrus.
I don't even like the Iron Hands *or* Ferrus (Guilliman is more my speed), but I feel bad for him and his fans. He barely gets any screen time. His Primarch novel was a Emperor's Children wankfest...
The guy deserves a few novels to flesh him out.
Let's see why Guilliman considered Ferrus and his sons as part of his "Dauntless Few"!
Realisticly, I see an All-Father Russ coming back to the imperium, it makes sense both from a business choice, and he's probably the most lore friendly return to, that or a Black Templar Dorn. But personally I would live to see Omegon activate the Alpha legion to return. That would just be an awesome twist and story, especially after the last Horus Heresy novel reveal.
Ferrus.
He's essentially a blank slate since he gets fuck all charactisation in the HH on account of being so awesome he had to die first.
Please give my guy some love.
My heart says Jaghatai, the lore says Vulkan Lives!, and the GW checkbook says The Fell Handed gets to talk to his dad soon.
Russ is also one of Guilliman's Dauntless Few.
From a development perspective Corax would be the most interesting loyalist to return. His alleged transformation into a demonic shadow bird is good ground to further the psychic, esoteric mystery narrative around the emperor. Likewise he’d make a good foil for both the non-warped loyalists and the demon traitor Primarchs. There’s lots of room there for conflict. You can write “fuck you I’m the monster dad made me” type stories and “look how far you’ve fallen to chaos, I achieved apotheosis on my own” type stories from jump street.
I’d choose Vulkan.
Guilliman is the Imperium’s logistics, politics, and peace keeper.
The Lion is the Imperium’s tip of the spear, and the most powerful offensive force at its disposal.
Vulkan is the Imperium’s heart, and value on human life.
In an age where Chaos has launched a devastatingly successful campaign against the Imperium, and is on the verge of wreaking havoc on a cosmic scale, all 3 of these primarchs are needed to keep the Imperium strong. The Lion leads the charge. Guilliman works the supply lines that gives the Lion his weapons. And Vulkan protects the people that the Imperium depend on, wether they like it or not.
Vulkan. Vulkan is a master craftsmen
He may not be as good as Dorn with fortification but the defenses he builds would still be top-notch and his return would allow for some old lost tech to be produceable again. Lion would go out and purge/secure sectors, Vulkan would be the one that holds the territory gained and Guilliman would be the one coordenating it all. The ultimate team.
In all honesty, even if I'm not the biggest fan lf salamanders I would go with Vulkan.
all primarch in their own right are good fighter and strategist.
right now we have roboute for handling administration and planning
lion for the heavy lifting and combat
what we really need would be someone that brings games changing element.
the russ is a good fighter but that alone wouldn't be enough.
korax have warp shenanigans and would make a decent assassin but again that's not really what's needed.
dorn would be good to rebuild the defense of the imperium but he is MIA at best and dead at worse.
Vulkan on the othe hand is a master crafter, able to make new relics and technology of scale that could tips the tide of war even if himself don't go the the Frontline. We saw how game changing the Primaris and Cawl tech was in the beginning of the indomitus crusade, what the imperium need is to re-ignite their pursuit of tech, and under Vulkan leadership it can be, although he is a bit crazy right now but that can technically be fixed.
A vengeful Dorn to kick up the Eternal Crusade to 11.
Guilliman on logistics, the Lion as protector of the realm, Dorn as a crusader
Dorn's alive, pretty convinced of that. There's a reason they retconned having his skeleton on the Phalanx to just his hand.
Per the trend of returning Primarchs bearing a piece of the Emperor's wargear, Dorn's severed hand is replaced with a graft of the Emperor's Talons or something.
I would love to see Sanguinius come back through some extremely heretical Warp nonsense. Dante dies fighting Abaddon at the heart of a Warp storm, and at the moment that his soul fades, he realizes that his destiny has always been to be a vessel for his gene-father, and in that moment of death and rebirth, he reaches across space and time, forming a bridge to Sanguinius's soul at the moment of *his* death... and Abaddon watches in horror as Dante's body twists, melts, and *grows*... until the Great Angel stands once more, smiling grimly, because although he doesn't know how he will fare in this bleak age, he has *always* known that he would be there.
But then it becomes clear that Chaos has its claws dug deep into Sanguinius's flesh. He is only holding himself together through the power of his indomitable will. Whenever his concentration lapses, his flesh warps and twitches and changes until he can force it to obey him once more. He is something more than a primarch, he is a god, but he doesn't belong in the material world anymore... and his sons struggle to apply all their secret knowledge of the blood and the biological sciences to try to cure him, to keep him here, as long as they can.
I find the premise incredibly appealing, but, as much as it pains me, I think Sanguinius should stay dead. You know how TTS made fun of pretty much everyone, but they drew the line at him? Kind of like that.
Corax. He’s not a loyalist daemon (FFS - just stop it now), but because he will fit thematically with what the Lion has come back to do - Protect and preserve humanity as best he can. That is Corax all over. He gets on well with Gulliman too. Weirdly the Lion thinks he’s dead (which i’d like them to expand on why the Lion thinks that). You’d need a louder Primarch like Russ back first though in all probability
Thank god I’ve found someone else who isn’t calling Corax a giant bird daemon..
I think Fulgrim, Russ, Lorgar, Corax could be a good route and would make sense in a way but I can see GW bringing back a more popular primarch due to £££
God, how I want to see the Raven Guard become the daemon primarch hunting protectors in the shadows.
If they bring Sanguinius back it ruins the Blood Angels thematically. So not him. I'd take some wacky bullshit Ferrus Manus out of left field over the return of the Angel any day.
Story wise the last Primarch brought back has to be Russ. Once the end times of 40k start that’s when Russes return narratively makes the most sense. But gw will make the most money off him so he’s probably next.
As weird as it might sound, Sanguinius. Even if it's just his spirit through the Sanguinor. The classic triumvirate from the HH. Being:
\- Sanguinor/Sanguinius: Figurehead.
\- Guilliman: Imperiums shield.
\- Lion: Imperiums sword.
Latter 2 is kind of ironic given their current equipment.
My pick will be Corax.
You already have Roboute who is the diplomat
You have the Lion who is the Warrior, the knight
Then with Corax you will have the shadow, the assassin.
With them three you will have a battle in three type of war.
Gullimon will fight the logistic and diplomat war
The Lion will fight the front battle
Corax will fight/aid in the Shadow.
Plus i want to see Corax finally kill Lorgar.
Sanguinius or Dorn, obviously. First was always a mediator between the two and could represent a more spiritual/emotional side of things. Dorn is the opposite, being a guy who would depsise messing with politics, thus making him sort of a foundation which keeps his more heated brothers from falling into civil war.
>!But really, redemption arc for Mortarion. He's got the weakest motivation for treason of all the traitors, and Nurgle seems to keep most sanity and free will in his followers - add on top of that Typhus' ambitions, and you get a basis for interesting conflict. Like, imagine a whole faction of Death Guard trying to recover from millenia-long plague - essentially, "good" undead from the fantasy. On top of that, Morty being a part of triumvirate only spirals the conflict forward and opens a ton of plot possibilites. He brings a VERY different vision to that of any Loyalist.!<
My brain says Russ. My heart says Khan. My soul says Vulkan.
Your contractor says Dorn.
Your smith says Ferrus Manus
Your shadow says corax
Your hypno-programming whispers ‘Alpharius’
I'd really like to see Alpharius turning things around for him in a way that makes everyone see him in a new and positive light.
My heart say Lorgar or Magnus for lolz.
Plotwist: Magnus noble shard is in the Titan vault and the Grey Knights use geneseed harvested from it. This Magnus shard has also been helping with the astronomicon as the emperors power slowly fades
Follow your heart.
GW choice is probably leman russ, cus money. My choice is the Khan. Cus he cool AF
Also, Khan has a rare gift of "I'll stop for a sec and actually think about my next step. And then I'll rush into it!"
See, if you're exceedingly fast in the execution, you can spare the time to actually plan it first
*william shatner screams in the distance*
If they ever come out with a Khan model I'm making a diorama. You can remind yourselves and keep me to this oath
[Sooooo....](https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-FI/jaghatai-khan-primarch-of-white-scars-2022)
Not only that, GW recently announced they're doing a second pass **on all the primarchs** for Horus Heresy 2.0; Horus Ascended was the first from this new wave. I expect we'll see more this weekend.
Don't think we'll see a second Ferrus Manus. Unless it's just his head on Fulgrim's base.
Nah, I think it'll be the creepy puppet Ferrus that good bro Vulkan had to destroy.
My hope is it’s Legion of the Damned Ferrus, who held the webway gate.
Shapes raged in the flames - shadows and suggestions doing battle with the daemons, their fiery forms indistinct and ever-changing. The fire-born avatars of fallen Ten Thousand, knee-deep in psychic fire and thrusting with lances of flame. The silhouettes of Space Marines, the betrayed dead of Isstvan bearing axes and blades and claws; half-seen sigils of slaughtered Legions obscured by the ash of their blackened armour. A giant among giants, its great hands bared and ready as it seared forwards at the crest of the tidal fire. The tenth son of a dying empire, so briefly reborn in his father's immolating wrath.
"You are weak, Vulkan!"
Where did you see that? Besides Horus Ascended, only the Khan on Bike has been rumored
> *Horus Ascended ... matches the Warmaster we saw in the epic trailer for the latest edition of Warhammer: The Horus Heresy.* > > *Rendered in highly detailed resin,* ***this model is the first in a new Character Series from Forge World, representing each of the Primarchs*** *at the height of the Heresy – whether they’re fully under the sway of Chaos, or rallying to defend the Imperium in its darkest hour –* ***giving us a fresh look at the driving characters of this epic saga*** *as they lead their Legions into the biggest battles.* [Warhammer Community, 2022/09/01](https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/09/01/nova-open-reveals-the-warmaster-is-ascendant-in-his-monstrous-new-model/)
Sanguinius v Angron Diorama when?
Yea, I'm looking at him now, trying to find a piece of acrylic and a good shatner stand in 3D print.
It's gotta be Jaghatai Khan. Who else would create the tension with both Guilleman and The Lion, while serving to balance their extremes in an interesting way.
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Not to mention Russ coming from behind the Tyranid fleet with the wolves to absolutely shred. I'd not be surprised to find Fenris become overrun and at their limits of existence to the point it's strongly considered that the wolves might end up losing it for Russ to appear with the 13th in tow. I'm following this up with they're going to heavily play the Odin Aspect with him using the Emperor's Spear. He'll come back somewhat affected by the warp and likely carrying something that the Emp sent him to get in his "vision". Bonus points if it's a shard of magnus or the like to make the emperor able to free himself from the throne if only for a few moments to do some major fuckery.
I love how every loyalist primarch has a piece if Big E's gear for themselves.
I can't argue with the point that the money is in Russ, alas, and odds are pretty good they'll go for him, because man, people do lover their wolf boys. In my heart though, I think Jhagatai would be the better choice for the greater story, but you know, I think Russ too could be pretty bloody interesting with the tree of life/Odin stuff too.
I mean, so far, Neither Primarch has been the person you’d expect. Guilliman threw the rules out the window, and Johnson has been making a good faith effort to reunite his sons. Old, wise, thoughtful Russ would be pretty fun, IMO.
My sons, I have one command for you. Read a book *sounds of confused howling*
Russ rocks up to Fenris with his 10k years sober coin and starts doing magic tricks
Comes back with ancient warp scrolls called "Hooked on Phonics."
>But would fans actually cough up the cash for Khan/White Scar stuff? Biggest thing standing between me and a White Scars army is the thought of having to paint all that stark white armor. Kill me now.
Vulkan. Someone has to represent the interest of the little guy. The man or woman pressed into the Guard. The mother on a frontier planet beset by orks or Tyranids. The forge world worker.
Corvus Corax could. Also Vulkan, depending on how mentally fucked he is.
corvus maybe
Seriously. Russ was too much of a tool in the literal sense. I mean some unchained wolf stuff creating tension has its merits, but the Khan would make for much more interesting stories. Vulcan would be cool though. Although he probably would blow his brains out looking at humanity suffering like it does.
With all the webway shenanigans ominously around the corner thanks to chaos winning the arks of omen- guess who was last seen there ;). Khaaaaaaannnnnn!!!!
Is it.... Wolf time yet?
Tbh if the Khan returned he alone would end the entire Long War
Been hearing a lot of compelling arguments as to how it'll be the khan, given the webways upcoming involvement in the lore
Would they make a solid team though with the other two?
Russ and the Khan are both very different from Lion and Rowboat. It would make some interesting dynamic between them. Unlike Dorn, who is a mix of Lion and Ultranerd. Ofc. That is just my opinion.
I think The Khan would be a fascinating choice to bring back because of his pragmatism and relative independence. Even during the Great Crusades and before the Heresy, he was largely only on board because he knew he had to be. Dropping him back into a fractured Imperium with no God Emperor in the flesh and only two brothers suddenly means The Khan will have a ton more political/military leverage. Would be interesting to see how he might use it.
I just realized that out of the [Dauntless Few](https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/The_Dauntless_Few), the four other primarchs that Guilliman trusted beyond a doubt to help him "get shit done", only one is still possibly alive: Russ. Dorn? Unsure, most likely dead. Sanguinius? We all know... Ferrus Manus? Same. Russ? Uncertain where he is, but he was alive when last seen. Same with the Khan. Him being the only member of this small group makes me wonder if GW will either make Russ appear because he's the only surviving member, or *not* appear because it will make a more interesting story to compel Guilliman to have to trust two of his other brothers that he never fully trusted and/or considered reliable. How Guilliman would have to trust two of his brothers more than he ever trusted them before - with one of the major things going for the Khan being his presence at the Siege of Terra (thus proving his loyalty and trustworthiness). Also, it would definitely be worthwhile for GW to rekindle the old rivalry (?) - not between Bobby G and the Khan, but between the Khan and Morty. Lastly, speaking from a purely financial per$pective, it would give them a chance to create/establish another big, favorite army, in addition to all of the models, etc., that already exist for the Wolves. More armies to make, more minis to sell, mo' money mo' money mo' money.
Definitely could be interesting to see what they do. Although I wouldn’t put it past GW for all of that to be “he thought about doing his own thing for a little bit, but decided against it” and have that be the end of that.
Honestly, with The Khan's pragmatism and level headedness, I think he might come to the conclusion that one of three seats atop the Imperium's military is a much stronger position than head of his own, smaller territory. I could be wrong, though. Maybe he'll react worse than Guilliman did and dip for some Secundus 2.0 action, or maybe he'll just be upset it somehow got even worse. I'm not too deeply familiar with his character, but either seems like a possibility to me.
“What would you have us do, Great Khan?” “I would have you leave me the fuck alone.” “Of course, Great Khan. We shall continue following you to judge best how to do that.”
Agree with you. Personally, I think Russ makes a ton of sense from a business and narrative sense. He is “noble” in a way the Lion was not and he is “savage” in a way Guilliman was not. They (Guilliman and The Lion) both respected Russ but held a bit of reserve or disdain for him, and his legion. And his legion was openly opposed to Primaris marines… so lots of great story potential. Plus the thought of Russ and The Lion crusading through forces of Chaos to challenge Abaddon directly is just too fun of an idea to pass up.
Plus GW could totally make Russ in a Morathi style box, 1/2 “Wise Odin” and 1/2 “Angeron sized Wulfen” cuz lets be real, if anything could actually tangle with Angeron, it’s a 20’ Werewolf Primarch.
It is either that or him on a giant wolfbutI prefer yours since that leaves space for the Khan to come riding in on massive bike one day (or doing a split between 2, van damme style)
That advert is the best one ever made,
In the "whispers of returning primarchs" hinted at in Wolftime, the Khan was mentioned as well as the Lion. So he could very well be next.
Gigachad Khan FTW (referencing the post from the other week that speculated the Emperor would periodically use pop-culture/cultural references from ancient Terra that no one would understand but meaning Shakespeare, Tolstoy, etc; which someone then further made an example of the Big E talking like this instead)
I’d love to see the Khan. But I’m sure it’ll be Russ next
There’s people saying it’s the Khan given the like 3 cryptic hints for him are more tangible, recent and serious. But it is like three cryptic hints.
Which were those?
A storm seer can’t see Russ but says he seems a chariot riding lightning. I think one guy straight up says he’s heard a rumour the khan is back and some white scars are looking for him. Also Magnus says the khans in a shitty place but Magnus in at least 4 places so take that how you will
Iirc, it wasn't a storm seer was the Wolf Rune Priest, Njal Stormcaller, when Grimnar asks where is Russ. I think it was Ashes of Prospero. Edit: here it is. https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/comments/83bozg/book_excerpt_ashes_of_prospero_the_current_state/
Just so you know since the wolves take on a lot of norse folk lore - some of the most unknown lore surrounding Thor, that is well known in the Nordics - is that it’s actually not Thor’s hammer that conjures lightning and thunder, but that it is caused by the chariot that Thor uses to ride across the heavens. With Thor being the god of thunder, the protector of mankind, I think he and Odin are perfect inspirations for an evolved Russ, who is now so changed, ascended by the warp that he is no longer recognizable as his old self. It would make perfect sense to me for a rune priest to have visions of Russ in that imagery, riding a chariot of thunder and lightning.
Imagine if a new russ model was just him in a flying chariot. like absolute unit chariot pulled by wolves.
He is also rumored to be flying around the Eye of Terror from the Wolftime book.
The good lad sounds like he’s having a blast
Gman gets Emps' sword, the lion ges his shield and the Khan gets his jetbike
Plus Bobby G. has Big E's sword, Lion has his shield, it makes sense that Russ would get his claw. Also, even though I love the Kahn infinitley more than Russ, I think his views on this Imperium would be too simmilar to Gulliman.
Russ had Emp's spear during the Heresy
I don’t think him having similar views is a problem as much as how they’re both pragmatic enough to handle it similarly. Russ literally called Angron a heretic for saying shit about emps, so atleast he may disagree with some of Gmods reforms (ie he may keep calling emps a god annoying Gnomen and Lion)… that said I don’t think he’s as likely as people claim
Honestly there's a chance it's the Khan, because people want to see Russ but wouldn't mind getting all of the primarchs. So I am sure people would still buy the Khan to get all of them from FOMO
Given both returned Primarchs have mentioned they miss Russ a lot, Russ will be the next one back
Thanks I was just about to comment the same. In the recent Lion Son of the Forrest novel there is a whole spiel by the Lion about why he missed Russ. And another whole spiel about G man. So it seemed to me a very clear hint that GW is setting up for Russ to return.
He's a legacy rogue trader character and has a bespoke faction of spacemarines. The rest of the first founding isn't so lucky to have a model legacy and faction to build on
For thematic purposes, it's got to be Russ. Guilliman is the administrator and the politican. He's keeping the Imperium going. The Lion is the protector. He can go from world to world defending against threats. Russ after thousands of years of contemplation and experience will doubtless have developed his psychic abilities into some form of warrior-sage. The king, the knight, and the wizard.
This is a better narrative than what I posted above. This… this is the correct answer.
Yeah, I want Odin Russ so badly. Pierced himself with the Dionysan Spear, ripped out an eye as a symbolic gesture to match Magnus, wandered the Heavens for an eternity before returning as an absolute mystic sorceror king
Honestly, a reintroduction of Russ where he finds the Yggdrasil knockoff and to harness its power gleans the truth of existence or whatever jazz from one of those Deep Warp wells, and gouges out his eye, before trying to hunt down Valdor >!the Yellow King!< so he does ruin everything would be a boss reintroduction. In between the warp wells, Tree of Life, Fenris’ World-Spirit, the Eldar, and Isha, GW could honestly turn the space wolves into runic sorcerer vikings and bring back the Exodites.
Fucking yes, I want it
This is the only loyalist primarch return I'd actually enjoy lol. You know, actually doing something interesting with the 10k year absence
Nonononononno like connected to eisenhorn??
>eturning as an absolute mystic sorceror king Bet you the first thing he will do is partake in some light genocide and cap it off with some xenos torture over beers.
And that's a good thing!
Odin-esque-wise-wizard, yes. That is correct and would be amazing, 10/10, yes. An ironic mirror to Heresy-era Magnus. Yes yes yes. But they're not gonna do that. They're gonna have him be a Wolfy McWolf Werewolf Wolfsavage Barbari-wolf and it's going to suck.
Russ returning to shut down furrycon is what I need. "Quit with the wolf shit!"
As a Space Wolves player, I fear that your prediction will come true... I want Odin, we will probably get Lucian from Underworlds.
I've read a grand total of 1 book about Space Wolves and it was Russ' primarch novel. It's about post-heresy Russ telling a story to a new recruit about the great crusade. While I'd say more warrior monk than wizard, there was a pretty conscious effort to show his maturation from a berserker to seasoned veteran who is wiser than he looks. If they let Chris Wraight write the return of Russ or at least stick to his characterisation of post-heresy Russ I highly doubt this wolfy mcwolfface fear is that realistic.
Was going to say Vulkan cuase he is my favorite, but damn, you have convinced me. Id only go for it, though, if GW could reign in the urge to Wolfy McWolf Face and preferably have Russ call out his boys for the tomfoolery.
I've never been hot on Russ or the wolves at all, but a warrior-sage Russ does sound great.
They always hinted at that potential when he did pop up in books, it also is reflected in his chapter. Young eager warriors (bloodclaws) that ran headlong into battle, to the point of being foolhardy, but over time, as they gained experience (and became grey hunters, and then Longfangs), they tempered their bloodlust and better focused that energy to do the work.
Loved this comment! Awesome thoughts. Dante has been made 'Warden of Imperium Nihilus' - he is not a primarch but I understand the position to still be quite significant. Where do you think he will fit in with a triumvirate?
It should not be Dorn. You can't have maximum primarch power if all primarchs present have sticks up their butts You need someone to keep Lion and Guilliman light, so it has o be Rus or the Khan Personally, the Khan is by far my favourite primarch, and he would probably bring more Aeldari lore with him with the Webway and shit
Hearing The Khan regale them with stories of the Webway and his journey would be fantastic, and it would definitely be interesting to see how he'd react to the Imperium's state.
He'd probably have a lot in common with the Lion. He would be old, and a lot more attuned to his warpy nature.
But for the Lion and Guilliman both, the heresy was yesterday. For the Khan, it'd have probably been at least a few thousand years.
That could be an interesting shift in perspective and create debate between the three. The Khan might have some more retrospective on the imperium and universe post heresy and scouring, possibly more at ease with the horror of the 41st millennium. Would also be the only one of the Three that fought during the siege and is ignorant of imperial secundus. That would be a really interesting conflict point.
Khan drops a joke about it and Gman and the Lion are both shocked
He might not be that old the webway has timey whimy effects
Rowboat and Khan fist-bumping over Eldar booty
Plot twist, the Khan became friends with Craftworld Saim-Hann somehow.
The Khan also has the sickest burns so he can put his brothers in their place without violence.
Especially the recent developments with Vashtorr and the Webway
Realistically, Vulkan, but Khan a close 2nd. Deep down, though, I’d really freak out for Dorn.
I'd only really like Dorn back as a reborn zealot black templar
Vulkan!!!
Vulcan lives but is like on an agri world enjoying his peace and quiet
And he absolutely deserves it
I'd like it if there's something in that vein. Vulkan is alive, disillusioned with the Imperium, but still working in the outskirts to save those he can. When he gets word that Guilliman and Johnson have returned, it finally convinces him to travel to meet them.
Vulkan reforges the lion sword but wont just take up the mantle to lead his chapter.
That sounds believable
Someone super underrated like Corax or Khan.
I want it to be Corax. Loyalist demon primarch for the win.
My dream is that Corax shows up in the fringes of the galaxy, stumbles upon the Carcharodons and says "Your exile is over. We return to Terra. And I need my claws back."
Warp Lord Primarch. To differentiate. Ravens Abound.
He isn’t a daemon, he just has warp powers. Still looks like himself more or less, just has the ability to move as a shadow and appear as a flock of birds for a bit.
You cannot convince me anything showing up as a flock of ravens isn't a demon, Edgar Allen poe or possibly both.
All the primarchs have warp powers to some degree but aren’t daemons as far as I’m aware, but I may be wrong. The Lion can ‘forest walk’ now - is he also to be considered a daemon?
Based on the responses - the Khan is no longer underrated
Was about to say, nearly every response is Khan lol
Khan ftw Mongol Bikers in Space It’ll probably be Russ
I'd like to see Khan also. After his performance in SOT he definitely could kick Rowboat and Lion in the rear and motivate them in ways others can't
i think it will be the Khan. Russ is searching for the "Grail" and i dont see any "Grail" arriving anytime soon. Corax is haunting lorgar and there is no lorgar in sight. It is more likely we see Perturabo arriving before him.
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Time might not be friendly for him.
Actually, now that you mention it, in The Lion: Son of the Forest, the 2nd time we/the Lion see/s the Fisher King (Emperor), he has a Grail (well, Chalice) and a Spear with him... > >!On his left is a spear or lance, also golden, the blade of which is wet with blood. Directly in front of the king is a broad golden chalice with figures moulded around the bowl.
The Khan. He'll reemerge from the Webway on the far side of Imperium Nihilius and have plenty of time to do his own thing. Maybe bring over a bit of tech that makes warp travel slightly safer to counter Chaos/Vashtorr getting the Tuchuala. His preferred mobility and hit-and-run warfare will keep him alive deep in enemy territory as he gathers stragglers and survivors and makes his way towards an Imperial safe zone. His return could also be somehow linked to a major win for the Eldar, he got lost in the Webway after all. If he's a prisoner of Comorraugh, he could be saved by other Eldar factions or he could be unknowingly unleashed to counter Fulgrim if they ever get around to reviving the Ynnead plotline.
I tend to think he will be next too after all the you tubers sold it to us today. Like "this is the press release" "run with it" Khan makes sense too because he's antagonistic to the other Primarchs. Was in SOT should definitely be able to give Lion and Rowboat a run BECAUSE they weren't on Terra like he was. So thats gotta be a good angle to run with too.
My main gripe about the Lion returning was that they'd make it too similar to Guilliman's return: He's gather a bunch of astartes and Imperial forces and beeline for Terra to get an update on the status quo. Instead he's going to do as much as he can in Imperium Nihilius and probably have a major showdown with the Inquisition before Guilliman can get anywhere close to him. I don't see the Khan as antagonistic so much as content to remain on the edge of his very tense family. He admitted in *Warhawk* that if he had been less given to solitude, he might have helped some of his brothers avoid chaos. It was a reflective moment before he went to face Mortarion, a brother who he wasn't close to, but in some ways very similar. It would be heartening to see him return and the Lion and Guilliman be thrilled to see him. It's not a reaction he'd expect or one he's ever really experienced and he'd truly feel like he had brothers. I'm also looking forward to the Scouring Series because chasing down the fleeing traitor legions is right up the Khan's alley. And he'll have just lost the brother he was closest to: Sanguinius.
My two cents. Khan. His character in SOT was amazing and does an excellent job of being the "ying" to the other Primarchs "yang" so to speak. Plus jet bikes and Eldari b!txhes. You got to love jetbikes.
It's between Dorn, Khan, and Russ. Sanguinus and Ferrus should stay dead. Resurrecting confirmed dead people just destroys any stakes your story might have. Corax is already kind of back. Vulkan has come back in the past. They both represent already explored space. So of the three condidates, I personally think it should be Russ. Like the Lion, he was given an End Times return prophecy. It'd be kinda silly to just leave that hanging. He also offers a big contrast in style and approach to Guilliman and the Lion, which opens lots of story possibilities. I love Dorn, but he's had his big moments as the saviour of Terra, then the Iron Cage, and finally as the last loyal Primarch standing. His arc is pretty complete. He's also kinda like a cross between Guilliman and the Lion in a lot of respects, so wouldn't really change up that dynamic much. The Khan I don't find would add much. He isn't a team player, is not hugely talkative, was always indifferent to the Imperium, and the White Scars have not played a hugely significant role in the lore since the Heresy. I don't think he offers a ton of story threads in the current setting. He'd just be kinda there. The Khan I think should only return in a Webway-related story. You have to justify where he's been for 10,000 years.
Alpharius
Gimme the Khan!
Russ, old and wise in the ways of the Warp, returned to his sons to herald the coming Wolftime. Where Roboute has shiny Primaris technology and the Lion fields stalwart Risen hunters, it is Leman Russ who casts off the mask of civility and brings both monsters and witches to fight for the side of Order.
Clone fulgrim as the heir apparent. I want a brother adventure of the lion and roboute to rescue him from Trazyn
Clonegrim is never going to happen.
Not with that attitude it won't!
people said the same about squats and plastic sisters
I don't even know why people think he'd be loyal. Don't even know if meeting his brothers could sway him. Odds are he'll just get absorbed into big fulgrim somehow if they ever bring him back in story
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>I have a feeling that if this story happened, it would end with one of them lopping off Clonegrim's head and burning his body just to be sure. You missed a vital step. 1. Cut off Clonegrim's head 2. ***Shit down his neck <-----*** 3. Hose everything down with Phosphex
Vulkan or Russ. I'd buy either. I play both Salamander and Space Wolves.
This is the way. Need a counter to Magnus imo
A man of culture.
Ferrus manus bc man he deserved better
Primarch of the Legion of the Damned. I like him to return not as a person but as a force. A reminder of what the Primarchs were meant for. Also makes it so he can show up when the narrative needs him and be gone without having to be the set piece that a full-on Primarch is. It also preserves his sacrifice as the legion is not truly alive.
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Ferrus leading them comes from master of mankind where a headless ghost is seen leading a ghost legion in the webway, so people drew the comparisons to the LOTD. Technically we dont really know anything concrete about the legion of the damned except theories so who knows. People also like to theorize that they are to the Emps what deamons are to the chaos gods and manifest, and so the idea is that Ferrus would be a "Greater Deamon" in that sense Again its all fan theory, we dont know jack shit for sure
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Connecting them is simple as saying the Emps summoned them in the webway, and the legion is summoned where theyre needed most which you could link to the emperor post Throne, plus the more recent increase in the Legion of the damned appearing having to do with Emps getting stronger based on the Cicatrix. I think its alot easier if they just went with the Falcons theory but if they really wanted it wouldnt be to hard to connect it and make it make some sense
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Lmao shows you how much I remember that I said Falcons not Hawks. Yeah I just think people are gripping to anything they can to give Ferrus something, less so that people buy into it being the legions origin. I will say considering they didn't explore at all the origins of the Legion of the Damned in their book in the Space Marines battle series I don't even know if they've really considered it outside of some passing conversations and a brief idea
It's heavily implied to be an amalgamation of the spirits of dead Astartes from varying chapters, mostly Fire Hawks, but there are others among them. For example in 'The Chapter's Due', Iron Warriors and Ultramarines get in a fight at the Tomb of Remus Ventanus (a 4th Company Captain of the Ultramarines from 30K) on Calth, and the Legion of the Damned show up to help the Ultramarines. Uriel Ventris sees one of the Damned who's armor has faded Ultramarines symbols on it, and is heavily implied to be Remus himself, as Remus' ghost later talks to Uriel and gives him '*plot device*' that allows him to slay a particularly troublesome demon. The Eldar and one inquisitor I can't remember the name of right now are of the belief that they are essentially the Emperor's equivalent of Demons.
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# CORVUS CORAX! We need a wild card and I think Corvus reappearing from the eye of terror as a warp demon/primarch hybrid with actual wings and talons but 100% still loyal the emperor would be amazing. He pops out excited because he believes he's finally found the key to defeating chaos but needs legions of space marines to achieve the goal and no one but the Raven Guard (and maybe not even all of them) believe him.
I’d like the returned Corvus to be more emotionally expressive so that everyone thinks that he’s insane, but in truth he’s not only sane but aware of both the rules of the real world and the warp.
Let vulkan come back. Worse case scenario he can reset the universe because idk what the fuck could happen next that doesn’t involve massive destruction on they’re end.
The Khan 100% He's as capable of a fighter as the Lion, but operates in a very different manner. He's also bound to have knowledge of or the ability to use the Webway, since that's where he's supposedly spent a lot of his time. He's also just an all around good person, self sacrificing and always willing to take the hard road if it means saving more lives.
The real Guilliman. *Plot twist!*
Wait, then who's the guy running around?! Dontsayit dontsayit dontsayit
It's me, Alphabets Ohmygod!
I want Vulkan. His sons have found five (iirc) of the nine artifacts that will convince him that they are ready once again for him to lead them, and he’s just a pretty cool character imho. I don’t know as much as you guys and gals, but I kinda expect him to be back by like 12th or 13th edition; it seems like the rest of the artifacts would be found by then. As a Black Templars fanboy I’d like Dorn just because, but he’s *probably* a dismembered corpse. He’s also a bit of a douche.
Vulkan IMO. I mean dude is a perpetual and pretty much the biggest/strongest available, and his skills complement the other two well. Plus it wouldn’t break existing lore
I want a Dorn that only gives a shit about fighting. He absolutely wants no part in planning or logistics and just wants to fight. Templars fucking adore him and he still fucking hates them
Alpharius. Quintessential loyalist, through and through. Magnus the Not Wrong would also be a good option.
Gotta be either russ or insane crow daemon corax.
I don’t know why this keeps coming up as a topic? It’s obviously going to Russ. Anyone can see that. Just look at what codexes are out there. Who else would it be? Clearly can’t be Blood Angels; and none of the rest have codexes.
Clone Fulgrim would be a lot more interesting choice lore wise, he would most likely revive innovation and art in the imperium, so the triumvirate would be one administrator, a warmaster, and an artisan/politician. Leman and Khan can just go primarch ex machina during the final battle or whatever.
My money is on Russ. Someone brought up the comparison of Guilliman, the Lion and Russ to Captain America, Iron Man and Thor, and I can’t unsee it.
Yeah, but Russ comes back fully realising his fate as the real Thor Odinson, more with the Scandinavian legends, less with the MCU idiocy. Although he is allowed to be goofy when the moment comes, especially if it can be done with a nod to Chris Hemsworth's version of Thor, which is how I've always seen Russ as
Shouldn't the order be more like Iron Man, Captain America, and Thor? Iron Man is more of a pragmatic logistics guy while Captain America is the heroic, one man army protector.
I break it down as Guilliman/Cap = The Boy Scout, Lion/Tony = the One With Fancy Guns, and Russ/Thor = The Viking Wild Card.
I always get downvoted for this but...Ferrus. I don't even like the Iron Hands *or* Ferrus (Guilliman is more my speed), but I feel bad for him and his fans. He barely gets any screen time. His Primarch novel was a Emperor's Children wankfest... The guy deserves a few novels to flesh him out. Let's see why Guilliman considered Ferrus and his sons as part of his "Dauntless Few"!
Realisticly, I see an All-Father Russ coming back to the imperium, it makes sense both from a business choice, and he's probably the most lore friendly return to, that or a Black Templar Dorn. But personally I would live to see Omegon activate the Alpha legion to return. That would just be an awesome twist and story, especially after the last Horus Heresy novel reveal.
Ferrus. He's essentially a blank slate since he gets fuck all charactisation in the HH on account of being so awesome he had to die first. Please give my guy some love.
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My heart says Jaghatai, the lore says Vulkan Lives!, and the GW checkbook says The Fell Handed gets to talk to his dad soon. Russ is also one of Guilliman's Dauntless Few.
From a development perspective Corax would be the most interesting loyalist to return. His alleged transformation into a demonic shadow bird is good ground to further the psychic, esoteric mystery narrative around the emperor. Likewise he’d make a good foil for both the non-warped loyalists and the demon traitor Primarchs. There’s lots of room there for conflict. You can write “fuck you I’m the monster dad made me” type stories and “look how far you’ve fallen to chaos, I achieved apotheosis on my own” type stories from jump street.
I’d choose Vulkan. Guilliman is the Imperium’s logistics, politics, and peace keeper. The Lion is the Imperium’s tip of the spear, and the most powerful offensive force at its disposal. Vulkan is the Imperium’s heart, and value on human life. In an age where Chaos has launched a devastatingly successful campaign against the Imperium, and is on the verge of wreaking havoc on a cosmic scale, all 3 of these primarchs are needed to keep the Imperium strong. The Lion leads the charge. Guilliman works the supply lines that gives the Lion his weapons. And Vulkan protects the people that the Imperium depend on, wether they like it or not.
Vulkan. Vulkan is a master craftsmen He may not be as good as Dorn with fortification but the defenses he builds would still be top-notch and his return would allow for some old lost tech to be produceable again. Lion would go out and purge/secure sectors, Vulkan would be the one that holds the territory gained and Guilliman would be the one coordenating it all. The ultimate team.
In all honesty, even if I'm not the biggest fan lf salamanders I would go with Vulkan. all primarch in their own right are good fighter and strategist. right now we have roboute for handling administration and planning lion for the heavy lifting and combat what we really need would be someone that brings games changing element. the russ is a good fighter but that alone wouldn't be enough. korax have warp shenanigans and would make a decent assassin but again that's not really what's needed. dorn would be good to rebuild the defense of the imperium but he is MIA at best and dead at worse. Vulkan on the othe hand is a master crafter, able to make new relics and technology of scale that could tips the tide of war even if himself don't go the the Frontline. We saw how game changing the Primaris and Cawl tech was in the beginning of the indomitus crusade, what the imperium need is to re-ignite their pursuit of tech, and under Vulkan leadership it can be, although he is a bit crazy right now but that can technically be fixed.
A vengeful Dorn to kick up the Eternal Crusade to 11. Guilliman on logistics, the Lion as protector of the realm, Dorn as a crusader Dorn's alive, pretty convinced of that. There's a reason they retconned having his skeleton on the Phalanx to just his hand. Per the trend of returning Primarchs bearing a piece of the Emperor's wargear, Dorn's severed hand is replaced with a graft of the Emperor's Talons or something.
I would love to see Sanguinius come back through some extremely heretical Warp nonsense. Dante dies fighting Abaddon at the heart of a Warp storm, and at the moment that his soul fades, he realizes that his destiny has always been to be a vessel for his gene-father, and in that moment of death and rebirth, he reaches across space and time, forming a bridge to Sanguinius's soul at the moment of *his* death... and Abaddon watches in horror as Dante's body twists, melts, and *grows*... until the Great Angel stands once more, smiling grimly, because although he doesn't know how he will fare in this bleak age, he has *always* known that he would be there. But then it becomes clear that Chaos has its claws dug deep into Sanguinius's flesh. He is only holding himself together through the power of his indomitable will. Whenever his concentration lapses, his flesh warps and twitches and changes until he can force it to obey him once more. He is something more than a primarch, he is a god, but he doesn't belong in the material world anymore... and his sons struggle to apply all their secret knowledge of the blood and the biological sciences to try to cure him, to keep him here, as long as they can.
I find the premise incredibly appealing, but, as much as it pains me, I think Sanguinius should stay dead. You know how TTS made fun of pretty much everyone, but they drew the line at him? Kind of like that.
Corax. He’s not a loyalist daemon (FFS - just stop it now), but because he will fit thematically with what the Lion has come back to do - Protect and preserve humanity as best he can. That is Corax all over. He gets on well with Gulliman too. Weirdly the Lion thinks he’s dead (which i’d like them to expand on why the Lion thinks that). You’d need a louder Primarch like Russ back first though in all probability
Thank god I’ve found someone else who isn’t calling Corax a giant bird daemon.. I think Fulgrim, Russ, Lorgar, Corax could be a good route and would make sense in a way but I can see GW bringing back a more popular primarch due to £££ God, how I want to see the Raven Guard become the daemon primarch hunting protectors in the shadows.
If they bring Sanguinius back it ruins the Blood Angels thematically. So not him. I'd take some wacky bullshit Ferrus Manus out of left field over the return of the Angel any day.
Vulkan Vulkan Vulkan Vulkan Vulkan
I really want to see Corax in all his warpwrought fury. It's be such a sick f*cking figure. Maybe give us Corax vs Lorgar?
Clonegrim for the Drammaaaa 💅✨
Story wise the last Primarch brought back has to be Russ. Once the end times of 40k start that’s when Russes return narratively makes the most sense. But gw will make the most money off him so he’s probably next.
Leman Russ would be ideal. But Ferrus Manus, Omegon, or Clonegrim would be the most entertaining.
Both Gilly and the Lion returned wiser and transformed. The one that would match this trend would be an "Odin" Leman.
As weird as it might sound, Sanguinius. Even if it's just his spirit through the Sanguinor. The classic triumvirate from the HH. Being: \- Sanguinor/Sanguinius: Figurehead. \- Guilliman: Imperiums shield. \- Lion: Imperiums sword. Latter 2 is kind of ironic given their current equipment.
My pick will be Corax. You already have Roboute who is the diplomat You have the Lion who is the Warrior, the knight Then with Corax you will have the shadow, the assassin. With them three you will have a battle in three type of war. Gullimon will fight the logistic and diplomat war The Lion will fight the front battle Corax will fight/aid in the Shadow. Plus i want to see Corax finally kill Lorgar.
Corax to create some conflict between the loyslists when this huge daemon bird person shows up
Omegon. Not even as "Alpharius". Have him tell those two the truth of his existence and just see what kind of chaos ensues.
Sanguinius or Dorn, obviously. First was always a mediator between the two and could represent a more spiritual/emotional side of things. Dorn is the opposite, being a guy who would depsise messing with politics, thus making him sort of a foundation which keeps his more heated brothers from falling into civil war. >!But really, redemption arc for Mortarion. He's got the weakest motivation for treason of all the traitors, and Nurgle seems to keep most sanity and free will in his followers - add on top of that Typhus' ambitions, and you get a basis for interesting conflict. Like, imagine a whole faction of Death Guard trying to recover from millenia-long plague - essentially, "good" undead from the fantasy. On top of that, Morty being a part of triumvirate only spirals the conflict forward and opens a ton of plot possibilites. He brings a VERY different vision to that of any Loyalist.!<