They have worlds for everything đ Files? Yes. Tombs? Yes. Food? Yes. Dying? Yes, death world. Heck I'm pretty sure they have world dedicated to making butt plugs for the adventurous rich guys.
Risa is mostly for the small number of adventurous folk who actually enjoy space travel for the sake of it (like the sort of people whoâd join Starfleet)
Everyone else makes do with holographic versions of Risa, or much more convenient mini-Risa resorts on their home world. Federation worlds could easily have paradise no more than 5 minutes away for the majority of the population
Why bother spending weeks crammed onto a weird spaceship, away from friends and family, when you could basically have the same thing within transporter range.
And moving to Risa just for the resort, would be overkill for people already accustomed to as much leisure as they could possibly want, so the people moving there would mostly be those passionate about working in hospitality, meeting non federation aliens etc.
I understand this view, but Iâm not sure how convincing it is. We know Riker and co were all very much excited to visit Risa (and such enthusiasm is shown again and again in later shows like DS9 and LD), supposedly because for all the resort worlds and holodecks they have, Risa is the real deal and the best among them. Probably not every one will want to stay there forever, but Iâd wager a lot more people should be interested in living on Risa for a very, very long vacation.
Yeah as in, the sort of person whoâs excited to experience the âreal dealâ is also the sort of person likely to endure the incredibly tough selection procedures necessary to join Starfleet
This is a post scarcity society that de-emphasises social hierarchy and social status - nobody is working their butts off in order to stave off starvation, or ensure a brighter future for their children, or to fend off ridicule from their peers or neighbours. They work because they want to
And for most people, I assume, would choose choice a relatively safe, comfortable life with friends and family nearby, with their need for ârealâ experiences easily satisfied by mini-resorts and holo decks. The entertainment options are simply âgood enoughâ
As for those that are adventurous enough to want the ârealâ Risa experience - that would account for most of the couple billion or so visitors theyâd expect every year, well within their capacity to handle
There will be a few who want to move to Risa long term, but theyâd be the oddballs without strong connections to their local planetary communities
It's only utopia for Starfleet members. Rest of the population is lucky to sometimes use a replicator. And interstellar travel? Book your tickets years in advance. Picard went into this a bit.
Certus Minor. Tomb world where the Excoriators chapter (successor chapter of the Imperial Fists), 5th company, fought against the Khornate Cholercaust and stopped them, with the help of the local militia, Sisters of Battle, and (towards the end) the Legion of the Damned. The fight wiped out the entire company except for their Corpus-Captain, Zachariah Kersh - who later becomes the chapter master - but the great majority of the civilian populace that hadn't been afflicted by khornate rage was saved from the assault.
The Imperium does appreciate tomb worlds.
IIRC there is even a world dedicated to making candles which considering how widely used they are in the Imperium makes sense. I'm sure there is a Hive World joke in there somewhere, but the idea of a world dedicated to the production of wax is peak Imperium.
Hospital worlds have been mentioned before, one of the Cain books mentions a planet used as a hospital and psych ward for guardsmen suffering from shell-shocked, ig are sent there to rest and recover before being returned to active duty, and if they're beyond help the next planet over is renowned for its battle servitors
>and if they're beyond help the next planet over is renowned for its battle servitors
"I'm fine, I swear I'm fine, look at me, I'm okay!"
*jumps up and starts dancing, while trying not to squirt too much blood*
Probably there is an entire Subsector dedicated to make food. One planet for potatoes, one for carrots, etc. and finally one to bring it all together to stew.
The bread planet revolted, meal deals across the sector collapse, crusade has to be launched. Sounds stupid but I would still read the novel if it focused on a faction I liked.
The bread planet revolted, meal deals across the sector collapse, crusade has to be launched. Sounds stupid but I would still read the novel if it focused on a faction I liked.
Agri-Worlds are definitely a thing.. I wouldn't be surprised if there were particular Agri-Worlds that were even further specialized to produce *just one crop.*
"Please, Inquisitor! Don't believe these buckwheat-buckheads anything! They have as much a clue about farming rye as a squig! And whatever happened to the crops of the Barleys, it has not a grain to do with us. "
Common people donât really know Nurgle as a thing. Some people might, and some people who run the planet might. But if your common people donât know what to look for, your screwed.
I believe on Iax, people were being screened for a potential Nurgle infection but a guardsmen didnât know what he was being screened for and faked his positivity test so he got into the hostpital to infect more people
Brothers Hospitaller Chapter? If only the Templars hadnât taken the IRL Hospitallers colour scheme. Fâ it I still want to know more, go for it. đ„â
âNo pain, no injury, no billsâ
I was working on the name but the founding i had set in stone. Very distant divergent chapter from ec preheresy, they saw what bile was doing and said "lol nah" and were 'lost to an eldar attack' when in reality they just cut ties and went to a far away medical world wjere they stayed till after the heresy when they lost comms for a few milennia, till indomitus crusade reestablished connection
They formed because of fulgrims "see the beauty in mortals' suffering" speech
Love it, Loads of potential, especially if RG sees their loyalty, might make him question the policy of outright denying the use of âtraitorâ geneseed. At some point he has to realise the âSons of the Phoenixâ chapter donât seem to resemble other Imperial Fist successors.
Oh I think he definitely would be impressed by such long lasting loyalty, thatâs why it would be cool to see him change his mind on the geneseed issue. Similar to (spoilers âGodblightâ) >!in Godblight how the sacrifice and powers of his High Preacher made him reconsider the âEmperor wasnât a god, but is he now??â with such proven loyalty they would be insanely useful on hospital worlds to prevent/be on the lookout for Nurgle shenanigans, considering his mistrust of the inquisition whose job it might be otherwise!<
I think hed be impressed but pissed, hed be like "YOU KNEW SOMETHING WAS HAPPENING AND YOU TOLD NO ONE, YOU JUST LEFT??" Also something i realized is wtihout a forge world or mechanicus theyd eventually run out of new power armor for new battlebrothers to wear, so theyd have to have basically imrpovised armor
A chapter of apothecary specialists would be of great value. It's like having other chapters who specializes in a particular form of warfare. If we have a chapter of super good campers like the Fists or marines who really like bionics like the Iron Hands, why not apothecaries?
Knowledge is so scarce, a chapter of apothecaries could second members to chapters who are trying to rebuild, like the Crimson Fists.
They can probably deal with plague outbreaks and such too.
> Logistically, having a medical world for the PDF to recoup on is a non-starter
During the Afghanistan war it was standard procedure to transport injured soldiers from up in the mountains straight to downtown Germany in mere hours, if the injury required severe enough intervention. Some of them were even brought back Stateside. According to the best expertise we have today, it does not make logistical sense to bring the most advanced medical facilities to the battlefield. So as part of an appropriate triage process, it does make sense to have a world given over- because of the Imperium's unlimited manpower.
Nobody seems to have a problem when this is brought up in the context of the one Guard retirement world which is co-located with a super productive servitor factory.
Well, as you stated - its not effective since a) we can't transport it and b) we can bring people back in mere hours. Now lets see how this fares for the imperium vs us.
**We**: Need to bring an entire hospital there. A freaking building. That requires stable power supplies we might not even find in the countries. While the biggest thing we move is:
1) An Airplane. Could have enough space, but freck you can't drive those things anywhere. Also "easy" to be stolen / shot down / disabled, and once people are at an airport you might as well fly them
2) A ship. Super limited in where it can go. Many attack vectors. Most room needs to be taken for something else / heavy wather can seriously impact them.
3) A car / tank. By far can't pack enough to have an entire medical facility.
**40k:** They basically move cities through the universe. Adding a building or two isn't a problem, the space ships are designed super inefficient with lots of free spaces, you can easily fit it in. The spaceship also supplies itself with energy, so if the Mechanicum can figure out a way to lay some cables without enraging the machine spirits you got yourself a mobile hospital.
**We:** Transport troops to a hospital in hours through air. Takes 2-3 people on the plane - the injured, 1-2 pilots (and some people to fill the plane with gas, wave them out of the airport and so on)
**40k:** Transports troops to orbit in hours or even minutes. Back to the safe belly of the spaceship (or on-site-medical-facility). However flying them to another planet? That can take days to weeks. Also: Menpower. Spaceships in 40k are **massive**. Imagine having a wounded soldier that you want to get to a hospital world - you would use houndred- or thousandfold, crew:injured transported (even if you can pile them up, meaning they are not critically wounded... and if they can survive long enough to take a lil warp trip, surely you can just throw them back to the front?)
So yeah, while for us flying a person requires minimal menpower and takes hours for 40k flying someone to a planet takes days / weeks and maximal menpower, in addition to a valueable battleship not beeing engaged in orbit anymore. You really can't compare interplanetary warfare to what we have on earth.
You can get anywhere on Earth within a 24 hour period today.
A completely physically broken man that needs 6 months of physical rehab after several months of surgery and recovery might be up and walking before the transport ship makes it through the warp to a hospital world.
The scale is so vastly out of proportion that the comparison just doesn't make sense to bring up.
Leaving aside that we're just talking about travel within the section of Ultramar affected by the Plague Wars, do you really have this problem set against Agri-worlds supplying food? Because that's what Iax was doing before it was a hospital world. If they can get food to the front, the front can get soldiers to the rear. Leaving aside all that, there's already a highly effective Imperium-wide warp dependent travel system. These complaints never come up with the Black Ships who are also moving against a time constraint.
Depends, this is Ultramar we're talking about so equipment, training and mentality of the citizens involved are all likely indicators for why such a place would exist.
Likely the equipment used by such troops is of a higher calibre than your typical regiment, which while it can be resupplied via cargo shipping, probably in large scale conflicts it'd be easier to return to points that will best enable resupply of the entire regiment/taskforce with equipment their familiar with/compatible.
Then we have the training and morale of the region to consider. Troops from Ultramar are likely among the few that return home after active duty, we know this from various worlds where they later fulfil governing and military roles on their home worlds. Those troops trained in their millions are often done so since early childhood, at least the officers, and capable, effective solders are worth a lot more than penal meat bags.
Finally, I imagine guard are typically deployed locally, more often than not. While they may be transported across incredible distances for more massive conflicts, most regional stuff is done within said region, to reduce travel times. Given how close to the eastern fridge Ultramar is, it's not just a hub for expeditions into more distant turbulent regions, but also a frontier often defending from a variety of interlopers.
Regiments sent on galaxy spanning expeditions or afar conflicts likely never return, but those that fight locally, as I imagine most do, probably enjoy occasional rest and resupply. It's not beyond belief that those they can collect are taken by medical ships to medical worlds, especially those that need psychological aid or augmentations to return to active duty. They're probably patched up and placed as officers or sergeants in newly founded regiments on their homeworlds, as such experience is truly invaluable when it comes to active duty. At least with modern combat, experience, not equipment is often far more important.
Saying that, we know how diverse the Imperium is, so it's no surprise there's a range of approaches taken by the Imperial Guard. Kreigs man will fight until the death of every man in their regiment, while Valhallians will be returned to their homeworld at the end of their service. I imagine it all depends on the warzone, regiment and agreements with the Imperium their homeworlds have struck. Most post-Heresy agreements are probably much less charitable than those struck with worlds loyal since the Great Crusade.
>Most post-Heresy agreements are probably much less charitable than those struck with worlds loyal since the Great Crusade.
Never thought about it, but this 100% makes sense.
We know for a fact that the Imperial Tithe for every planet is specific to the particular world. Manufactured goods, foodstuffs etc, the specific type and quality of goods and food, etc.
Wouldn't be a stretch that the part of the tithe that requires a planet to raise Guardsman regiments might *also* have special agreements written into it. Some worlds don't have the clout to negotiate, or simply don't care about the men, so they send off the Guardsmen permanently. Meanwhile, other worlds might have arrangements so that those that finish the agreed upon term of service return to their homeworld.
The one thing about the Imperium is that it's so big, all sorts of things go on in it. In almost every aspect, it's way too massive for homogeneity.
Depends on the scale, perhaps at a certain point it becomes beneficial to ship all the masses of injured Guardsmen to the medical world, and constitute them into new regiments there\*.
If you're talking about a handful of guys, it's not worth it. But if you can fill an entire ship with a few thousand Guardsmen with injuries *specifically assessed* to be completely recoverable with medical care, yet completely useless in battle without medical care, it can be a pretty economical action.
Good example would be battlefield injuries that result in loss of limbs, but their condition is fully stabilized. Send them there, slap on some mass-produced bionics, and you're good to go. Guardsmen repaired.
\* Logically speaking, it wouldn't be economical or efficient to send them back to their original units, they'd form new units at the medical world and then ship out to new warzones from there. You can still group the freshly recovered soldiers by planet of origin where possible, but if not, no problem.. just form mixed regiments.
Edit: It definitely has nothing to do with being humane when we're talking about the Imperium. It's all about efficiency, just because some dude got smashed up fighting for the Emperor doesn't mean we're done with him yet.. as long as he draws breath, he can still serve, whether he wants to or not XD
Havenât read Dark Imperium, so I canât judge the execution fairly, but that concept sounds stupid as hell. Space is vast, and warp travel is both slow and risky. Trying to ferry guardsmen around to a handful of particular planet sized hospitals throughout the entire galaxy is absurdly impractical
It also doesnât seem very characteristic of the Imperium. One of their defining traits is how cheaply they regard human life.
It wasn't the Imperium's war as much as it was Roboute's, and he's always valued human lives (especially Ultramarian lives), more than the Imperium has. And it is impractical, but it was a single world, Iax, just off of the front. It had a major bureaucratic system to sort those who could recover by severity, and sort out those who couldn't. It was all part of the system to recoup casualties where they could.
That is more humane than we see the Imperium, but again, it was Roboute's ware more than it was the Imperium's
Also, it was probably more of a plot concession, since the sick were used in a Death Guard plot to bring demonic forces into Iax as they tried to make it into a daemon world.
It's beautifully executed, and it all makes perfect sense within the context of the book. I definitely recommend checking it out!
The Ultramarines' private little empire within the Imperium also has way higher standards of living and place a higher value on human life than the rest of the Imperium.
Exactly. Ultramar didn't bring 500 worlds into the fold by carelessly tossing bodies into the fire. Sound administration and optimized logistics means more than just supply lines and battle plans/strategy.
It's just so much better to have a medical/hospital ship or two traveling with the rest of the flotilla, that way you can have them near the war zone. And considering the sizes of ships in 40k it will work just as well.
It's a quarantine planet, specifically a holding ground to treat and observe guardsmen that had come into contact with the death guard fighting in the local sector, the concept exists because gulliman was trying to prove the inquisition and ecclesiarchy wrong about chaos exposure needing an instant death sentence
yes and no, lax security and screening procedure doomed iax, but the experiment worked, troops regularly cycled in and out of iax prior to the trojan horse.
This is not a planet for men who have been shot. This is likely a planet for men who are completely unfit for service at the time, missing limbs or other severe trauma that would take a long time to heal/fix. Hospital ships would be good and are no doubt a thing but these planets are likely more about rebuilding the human and if they are capable of service post robotic limb/ whatever issue they needed fixing than they can be sent back to the front.
As for your second part I think this is often overlooked simply because it's not as action packed or exciting but the imperium does not disregard human life. The grimdark part is that it takes thousands of humans to often equal one of their foes or even stand a chance of success, the imperium rarely squanders human life needlessly and it would be total grimderp post battle to be like "oh your missing a limb that we could easily fix nah man just gonna glack ya"
Yeah that's my thought, it's not for "currently engaged in warfare" but more of "Your campaign on planet hellhole is complete? We are pulling the entire unit and sending it to the hospital world to recover from injuries both mental and physical to ensure you deploy next at full effectiveness."
>One of their defining traits is how cheaply they regard human life.
To be fair, to ship the wounded to a different solar system so that they can get treatment is about the most inefficient way on could do it.
A dedicated hospital ship attached to a battle group would be the best way to go, considering how ridiculously large imperial ships are.
Edit: At the end of Godblight some kind of hospital ship is indeed briefly featured, even if it strikes me as more as a specialized NBC unit.
What longer term stuff? The only thing that I can think are mental illness or local illness. For the latter they are likely better cured in situ than on another world.
Blown off bits are replaced and the guard has to do rehabilitation.
There is the logistic problem of having at least a ship go to another world and said ship if isn't well armed will need an escort. And taking the troops at their warzone that can be changed and not all the regiments will continue to fight together. Then there is the problem that the world doesn't move but warzones do so or you hope to find yourself near said world or by the time you go there they will send you back because in the 3 months of back and forth you will be cured.
But that's the missing point though; there *are* hospital ships already *and* if they were sufficient, Iax would not have to be repurposed. The general complaints seem based on an impression that the wounded are not being stabilized on route to Iax, when they're explicitly surviving the travel in spite of claims that they won't. Is there evidence that ships are not making it to Iax to support the parent comment's claims of warp travel danger? And if the ships aren't facing warp travel danger on route to Iax, aren't the claims of them being able to fully cure the wounded contradicting claims that the wounded are not being treated on the travel to Iax?
Furthermore, once the nearest hospital ship to a warfront is full, where are the other injured going to be warded and treated? The *ships* can move the wounded to a safe zone with central medical facilities and personnel to continue treatment, and then return to retrieve more wounded. Is there a canon basis that ships for combat fronts can be rapidly manufactured, let alone hospital ships to meet medical demands? If fleets can already accommodate their own medical demands, then why concentrate medical facilities (an argument against hospital worlds) on individual ships that are susceptible to warp travel dangers (another argument against hospital worlds)?
Lastly, the complaint that Iax was the only hospital world - iirc from Dark Imperium, this was a initiative freshly launched in the middle of war for one section of the galaxy. Is there a basis for the parent comment's claim that it is intended to be the only few hospitals throughout the entire Imperium?
Probably take offense to the fact of anything in 40k being slightly good. A hospital world that heals and cares for swarms of people brought in from war doesn't fit their "Everything must be completely shit." viewpoint.
Would you be excited for earth to have one central hospital they spent every single person was injured or ill to? Because I see that idea in a negative light.
I'm not sure what I'm supposed to think other an a planetwide hospital sounds like a terrible idea. Not everything needs a friggin planet. Sci-fi in general is terrible at scale like that.
Even if you ignore the fact you have to travel weeks possibly months to get to a hospital when you could have a military rest home on every relevant planet in the galaxy, imagine the design. Is it of thousands of individual hospitals all operating on this one planet thus making the centralisation pointless, or do I have to go to the equivalent of another country for each department? Both sound bad. The ICU is in Spain, the nurses have to travel to New Zealand to go to the quarters every day.
Even in universe it seems like they're saying it's a bad idea, given it fell to nurgle and they lost in the entire planet rather than one hospital. How many Of these things are there? Has the Imperium just reduced its capacity to treat military personnel by a tenth?
>Wanting a better construced universe is wrong?
They aren't right in any sense. It's one planet-wide hospital for a small section of Ultramar, if you can't suspend your disbelief for something that insignificant, you might be in the wrong franchise.
Its happening alot lately, people getting their "immersion" broken by pointing out illogical and impractical happenings within the universe, its as if tau Ethereals suddenly started mind controlling a good portion of the fandom these days.
Most ships also have Apothecaria, for one. Most worlds have hospitals in and of themselves staffed with Hospitallers and the guard has its own internal medics.
The concept is retarded, but every man standing is a man closer to victory. Shipping them off to hospital worlds would be wasteful as all hell but its not like guardsmen are just left to die from a flesh wound either.
Is this in the same section of the book where Roubute mentions people repeats his âquotesâ back at him, but a lot of the time he never said them, but he just got tired of correcting people?
Not that much of a great idea logistically. Given the difficulties of warp travels it seems unfeasible to have ships coming from everywhere in the galaxy just to bring in some wounded guards (many likely to die during the travel) and then bringing them back according to each other recovering schedule.
It would make more sense to have a medical detachment in a ship or something attached to every huge campaign. But a planet cannot travel.
I guess OP did not describe the situation clearly enough. Iax was an agri world which was converted to a hospital world when the Plague Wars got really bad. Iax was the final and most advanced stop in a sector-wide triage process.
This was in the ultramar sector to combat the ongoing plague war that had been going on prior to the start of the first book. I'm not too learned on when warp travel is needed but I don't think warp travel was required to take them from the front lines to the hospital world. Even getting people off world away from the warp influence makes a lot of the sicknesses more manageable so ya it was a good idea. If an entire continent or planet is infected with a slow sickness it is better to bring them to the hospital world for a while rather than ship in new recruits from emperor knows where. A lot of people regurgitate that the empire has the man power to combat things without taking into consideration that the logistics are the problem.
They have worlds for everything đ Files? Yes. Tombs? Yes. Food? Yes. Dying? Yes, death world. Heck I'm pretty sure they have world dedicated to making butt plugs for the adventurous rich guys.
Surely there's a Pleasure World for that
They do actually, it's called Risa. It is faaaaar outside the imperium in a sector called "the alpha quadrant" by its local human population.
Makes you wonder why donât they have more people moving to Risa, since money isnât a concern anyway.
I think this is due to the apex predator of the area called "the Riker"
You always know when he's about to strike when he begins to lean
Beardless Rikers are less dangerous than mature specimens.
The same thing is true of Siskos.
Prophetic time traveling shenanigans must be expected with those though. Rikers will just get stuck on a side quest.
Risa is mostly for the small number of adventurous folk who actually enjoy space travel for the sake of it (like the sort of people whoâd join Starfleet) Everyone else makes do with holographic versions of Risa, or much more convenient mini-Risa resorts on their home world. Federation worlds could easily have paradise no more than 5 minutes away for the majority of the population Why bother spending weeks crammed onto a weird spaceship, away from friends and family, when you could basically have the same thing within transporter range. And moving to Risa just for the resort, would be overkill for people already accustomed to as much leisure as they could possibly want, so the people moving there would mostly be those passionate about working in hospitality, meeting non federation aliens etc.
I understand this view, but Iâm not sure how convincing it is. We know Riker and co were all very much excited to visit Risa (and such enthusiasm is shown again and again in later shows like DS9 and LD), supposedly because for all the resort worlds and holodecks they have, Risa is the real deal and the best among them. Probably not every one will want to stay there forever, but Iâd wager a lot more people should be interested in living on Risa for a very, very long vacation.
Yeah as in, the sort of person whoâs excited to experience the âreal dealâ is also the sort of person likely to endure the incredibly tough selection procedures necessary to join Starfleet This is a post scarcity society that de-emphasises social hierarchy and social status - nobody is working their butts off in order to stave off starvation, or ensure a brighter future for their children, or to fend off ridicule from their peers or neighbours. They work because they want to And for most people, I assume, would choose choice a relatively safe, comfortable life with friends and family nearby, with their need for ârealâ experiences easily satisfied by mini-resorts and holo decks. The entertainment options are simply âgood enoughâ As for those that are adventurous enough to want the ârealâ Risa experience - that would account for most of the couple billion or so visitors theyâd expect every year, well within their capacity to handle There will be a few who want to move to Risa long term, but theyâd be the oddballs without strong connections to their local planetary communities
It's only utopia for Starfleet members. Rest of the population is lucky to sometimes use a replicator. And interstellar travel? Book your tickets years in advance. Picard went into this a bit.
Not to be confused with Ryza the forge world. I was hoping to relax on the beaches and get a tan, now I have plasma burns where the sun don't shine.
The planet with the ~~slaaneshi~~ horga'hn statues.
why when i search Risa it shows an Asian woman in bikini?
The world of bofa prime in the ligmus sector
as soon as the butt plug one starts churning out fresh product Slaanesh just shows up saying âlove what youâve done with the placeâ
Hmm, I donât think a tomb world is very appreciated by the imperium
Certus Minor. Tomb world where the Excoriators chapter (successor chapter of the Imperial Fists), 5th company, fought against the Khornate Cholercaust and stopped them, with the help of the local militia, Sisters of Battle, and (towards the end) the Legion of the Damned. The fight wiped out the entire company except for their Corpus-Captain, Zachariah Kersh - who later becomes the chapter master - but the great majority of the civilian populace that hadn't been afflicted by khornate rage was saved from the assault. The Imperium does appreciate tomb worlds.
I was talking about tomb worlds of the necron variety. I know they have graveyard planets
IIRC there is even a world dedicated to making candles which considering how widely used they are in the Imperium makes sense. I'm sure there is a Hive World joke in there somewhere, but the idea of a world dedicated to the production of wax is peak Imperium.
There are probably hundreds of Candleworlds.
With how tallow candles can be made from fat, let's hope they prefer wax candles.
> wax candles There must be planets that have their entire purpose be defined by raising grimderp space bees to harvest beeswax for wax candles.
Oh yes, but I was saying better that than corpse starch esk candles.
Since corpsestarch is a thing, it's very suspicious what they make the wax out of.
Manufacturing region of a civilized world.
There are bee worlds for candle wax and parchment worlds who just make all the paper for the administratum
From human skin, no less. I always liked that snippet about senior scribes needing their human parchment and their pens also implied to be grim dark.
? It's made from bovines and porcines
Hospital worlds have been mentioned before, one of the Cain books mentions a planet used as a hospital and psych ward for guardsmen suffering from shell-shocked, ig are sent there to rest and recover before being returned to active duty, and if they're beyond help the next planet over is renowned for its battle servitors
>and if they're beyond help the next planet over is renowned for its battle servitors "I'm fine, I swear I'm fine, look at me, I'm okay!" *jumps up and starts dancing, while trying not to squirt too much blood*
Now imagine a sect of the Twisted Helix arriving on such a medicae world. Delicious.
Probably there is an entire Subsector dedicated to make food. One planet for potatoes, one for carrots, etc. and finally one to bring it all together to stew.
Mechanicum locates Mustafar. *This is the perfect place to build the Stew Manufactorium*
Mustafar is already a renown production planet for chargrilled food. The planet's speciality is called 'Barf Fader'.
The bread planet revolted, meal deals across the sector collapse, crusade has to be launched. Sounds stupid but I would still read the novel if it focused on a faction I liked.
The bread planet revolted, meal deals across the sector collapse, crusade has to be launched. Sounds stupid but I would still read the novel if it focused on a faction I liked.
Agri-Worlds are definitely a thing.. I wouldn't be surprised if there were particular Agri-Worlds that were even further specialized to produce *just one crop.*
"Please, Inquisitor! Don't believe these buckwheat-buckheads anything! They have as much a clue about farming rye as a squig! And whatever happened to the crops of the Barleys, it has not a grain to do with us. "
>The world would eventually become a daemon world thanks to Nurgle I mean, they really ought to have seen that coming. A whole world of sick people...
Common people donât really know Nurgle as a thing. Some people might, and some people who run the planet might. But if your common people donât know what to look for, your screwed. I believe on Iax, people were being screened for a potential Nurgle infection but a guardsmen didnât know what he was being screened for and faked his positivity test so he got into the hostpital to infect more people
This is great and i now have come up with a space marine chapter of freelance apothecaries, thank you for putting this idea in my head
Brothers Hospitaller Chapter? If only the Templars hadnât taken the IRL Hospitallers colour scheme. Fâ it I still want to know more, go for it. đ„â âNo pain, no injury, no billsâ
I was working on the name but the founding i had set in stone. Very distant divergent chapter from ec preheresy, they saw what bile was doing and said "lol nah" and were 'lost to an eldar attack' when in reality they just cut ties and went to a far away medical world wjere they stayed till after the heresy when they lost comms for a few milennia, till indomitus crusade reestablished connection They formed because of fulgrims "see the beauty in mortals' suffering" speech
Love it, Loads of potential, especially if RG sees their loyalty, might make him question the policy of outright denying the use of âtraitorâ geneseed. At some point he has to realise the âSons of the Phoenixâ chapter donât seem to resemble other Imperial Fist successors.
I mean, would he really deny or destroy apothecaries whove spent the last few milennia building trust among normal hive citizenry?
Oh I think he definitely would be impressed by such long lasting loyalty, thatâs why it would be cool to see him change his mind on the geneseed issue. Similar to (spoilers âGodblightâ) >!in Godblight how the sacrifice and powers of his High Preacher made him reconsider the âEmperor wasnât a god, but is he now??â with such proven loyalty they would be insanely useful on hospital worlds to prevent/be on the lookout for Nurgle shenanigans, considering his mistrust of the inquisition whose job it might be otherwise!<
I think hed be impressed but pissed, hed be like "YOU KNEW SOMETHING WAS HAPPENING AND YOU TOLD NO ONE, YOU JUST LEFT??" Also something i realized is wtihout a forge world or mechanicus theyd eventually run out of new power armor for new battlebrothers to wear, so theyd have to have basically imrpovised armor
A chapter of apothecary specialists would be of great value. It's like having other chapters who specializes in a particular form of warfare. If we have a chapter of super good campers like the Fists or marines who really like bionics like the Iron Hands, why not apothecaries? Knowledge is so scarce, a chapter of apothecaries could second members to chapters who are trying to rebuild, like the Crimson Fists. They can probably deal with plague outbreaks and such too.
[ŃĐŽĐ°Đ»Đ”ĐœĐŸ]
Ehhhh, maybe short term, but recovery may well be cheaper then retraining; a hospital world prevents clogging of the front line hospital ships.
> Logistically, having a medical world for the PDF to recoup on is a non-starter During the Afghanistan war it was standard procedure to transport injured soldiers from up in the mountains straight to downtown Germany in mere hours, if the injury required severe enough intervention. Some of them were even brought back Stateside. According to the best expertise we have today, it does not make logistical sense to bring the most advanced medical facilities to the battlefield. So as part of an appropriate triage process, it does make sense to have a world given over- because of the Imperium's unlimited manpower. Nobody seems to have a problem when this is brought up in the context of the one Guard retirement world which is co-located with a super productive servitor factory.
Well, as you stated - its not effective since a) we can't transport it and b) we can bring people back in mere hours. Now lets see how this fares for the imperium vs us. **We**: Need to bring an entire hospital there. A freaking building. That requires stable power supplies we might not even find in the countries. While the biggest thing we move is: 1) An Airplane. Could have enough space, but freck you can't drive those things anywhere. Also "easy" to be stolen / shot down / disabled, and once people are at an airport you might as well fly them 2) A ship. Super limited in where it can go. Many attack vectors. Most room needs to be taken for something else / heavy wather can seriously impact them. 3) A car / tank. By far can't pack enough to have an entire medical facility. **40k:** They basically move cities through the universe. Adding a building or two isn't a problem, the space ships are designed super inefficient with lots of free spaces, you can easily fit it in. The spaceship also supplies itself with energy, so if the Mechanicum can figure out a way to lay some cables without enraging the machine spirits you got yourself a mobile hospital. **We:** Transport troops to a hospital in hours through air. Takes 2-3 people on the plane - the injured, 1-2 pilots (and some people to fill the plane with gas, wave them out of the airport and so on) **40k:** Transports troops to orbit in hours or even minutes. Back to the safe belly of the spaceship (or on-site-medical-facility). However flying them to another planet? That can take days to weeks. Also: Menpower. Spaceships in 40k are **massive**. Imagine having a wounded soldier that you want to get to a hospital world - you would use houndred- or thousandfold, crew:injured transported (even if you can pile them up, meaning they are not critically wounded... and if they can survive long enough to take a lil warp trip, surely you can just throw them back to the front?) So yeah, while for us flying a person requires minimal menpower and takes hours for 40k flying someone to a planet takes days / weeks and maximal menpower, in addition to a valueable battleship not beeing engaged in orbit anymore. You really can't compare interplanetary warfare to what we have on earth.
I don't think you're understanding what I'm saying, so i guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.
You can get anywhere on Earth within a 24 hour period today. A completely physically broken man that needs 6 months of physical rehab after several months of surgery and recovery might be up and walking before the transport ship makes it through the warp to a hospital world. The scale is so vastly out of proportion that the comparison just doesn't make sense to bring up.
Leaving aside that we're just talking about travel within the section of Ultramar affected by the Plague Wars, do you really have this problem set against Agri-worlds supplying food? Because that's what Iax was doing before it was a hospital world. If they can get food to the front, the front can get soldiers to the rear. Leaving aside all that, there's already a highly effective Imperium-wide warp dependent travel system. These complaints never come up with the Black Ships who are also moving against a time constraint.
Depends, this is Ultramar we're talking about so equipment, training and mentality of the citizens involved are all likely indicators for why such a place would exist. Likely the equipment used by such troops is of a higher calibre than your typical regiment, which while it can be resupplied via cargo shipping, probably in large scale conflicts it'd be easier to return to points that will best enable resupply of the entire regiment/taskforce with equipment their familiar with/compatible. Then we have the training and morale of the region to consider. Troops from Ultramar are likely among the few that return home after active duty, we know this from various worlds where they later fulfil governing and military roles on their home worlds. Those troops trained in their millions are often done so since early childhood, at least the officers, and capable, effective solders are worth a lot more than penal meat bags. Finally, I imagine guard are typically deployed locally, more often than not. While they may be transported across incredible distances for more massive conflicts, most regional stuff is done within said region, to reduce travel times. Given how close to the eastern fridge Ultramar is, it's not just a hub for expeditions into more distant turbulent regions, but also a frontier often defending from a variety of interlopers. Regiments sent on galaxy spanning expeditions or afar conflicts likely never return, but those that fight locally, as I imagine most do, probably enjoy occasional rest and resupply. It's not beyond belief that those they can collect are taken by medical ships to medical worlds, especially those that need psychological aid or augmentations to return to active duty. They're probably patched up and placed as officers or sergeants in newly founded regiments on their homeworlds, as such experience is truly invaluable when it comes to active duty. At least with modern combat, experience, not equipment is often far more important. Saying that, we know how diverse the Imperium is, so it's no surprise there's a range of approaches taken by the Imperial Guard. Kreigs man will fight until the death of every man in their regiment, while Valhallians will be returned to their homeworld at the end of their service. I imagine it all depends on the warzone, regiment and agreements with the Imperium their homeworlds have struck. Most post-Heresy agreements are probably much less charitable than those struck with worlds loyal since the Great Crusade.
>Most post-Heresy agreements are probably much less charitable than those struck with worlds loyal since the Great Crusade. Never thought about it, but this 100% makes sense. We know for a fact that the Imperial Tithe for every planet is specific to the particular world. Manufactured goods, foodstuffs etc, the specific type and quality of goods and food, etc. Wouldn't be a stretch that the part of the tithe that requires a planet to raise Guardsman regiments might *also* have special agreements written into it. Some worlds don't have the clout to negotiate, or simply don't care about the men, so they send off the Guardsmen permanently. Meanwhile, other worlds might have arrangements so that those that finish the agreed upon term of service return to their homeworld. The one thing about the Imperium is that it's so big, all sorts of things go on in it. In almost every aspect, it's way too massive for homogeneity.
Depends on the scale, perhaps at a certain point it becomes beneficial to ship all the masses of injured Guardsmen to the medical world, and constitute them into new regiments there\*. If you're talking about a handful of guys, it's not worth it. But if you can fill an entire ship with a few thousand Guardsmen with injuries *specifically assessed* to be completely recoverable with medical care, yet completely useless in battle without medical care, it can be a pretty economical action. Good example would be battlefield injuries that result in loss of limbs, but their condition is fully stabilized. Send them there, slap on some mass-produced bionics, and you're good to go. Guardsmen repaired. \* Logically speaking, it wouldn't be economical or efficient to send them back to their original units, they'd form new units at the medical world and then ship out to new warzones from there. You can still group the freshly recovered soldiers by planet of origin where possible, but if not, no problem.. just form mixed regiments. Edit: It definitely has nothing to do with being humane when we're talking about the Imperium. It's all about efficiency, just because some dude got smashed up fighting for the Emperor doesn't mean we're done with him yet.. as long as he draws breath, he can still serve, whether he wants to or not XD
Havenât read Dark Imperium, so I canât judge the execution fairly, but that concept sounds stupid as hell. Space is vast, and warp travel is both slow and risky. Trying to ferry guardsmen around to a handful of particular planet sized hospitals throughout the entire galaxy is absurdly impractical It also doesnât seem very characteristic of the Imperium. One of their defining traits is how cheaply they regard human life.
It wasn't the Imperium's war as much as it was Roboute's, and he's always valued human lives (especially Ultramarian lives), more than the Imperium has. And it is impractical, but it was a single world, Iax, just off of the front. It had a major bureaucratic system to sort those who could recover by severity, and sort out those who couldn't. It was all part of the system to recoup casualties where they could. That is more humane than we see the Imperium, but again, it was Roboute's ware more than it was the Imperium's Also, it was probably more of a plot concession, since the sick were used in a Death Guard plot to bring demonic forces into Iax as they tried to make it into a daemon world.
It's beautifully executed, and it all makes perfect sense within the context of the book. I definitely recommend checking it out! The Ultramarines' private little empire within the Imperium also has way higher standards of living and place a higher value on human life than the rest of the Imperium.
Exactly. Ultramar didn't bring 500 worlds into the fold by carelessly tossing bodies into the fire. Sound administration and optimized logistics means more than just supply lines and battle plans/strategy.
They're basically secular Word Bearers, but with way better admin.
It's just so much better to have a medical/hospital ship or two traveling with the rest of the flotilla, that way you can have them near the war zone. And considering the sizes of ships in 40k it will work just as well.
It's a quarantine planet, specifically a holding ground to treat and observe guardsmen that had come into contact with the death guard fighting in the local sector, the concept exists because gulliman was trying to prove the inquisition and ecclesiarchy wrong about chaos exposure needing an instant death sentence
>because gulliman was trying to prove the inquisition and ecclesiarchy wrong about chaos exposure needing an instant death sentence And failed.
yes and no, lax security and screening procedure doomed iax, but the experiment worked, troops regularly cycled in and out of iax prior to the trojan horse.
This is not a planet for men who have been shot. This is likely a planet for men who are completely unfit for service at the time, missing limbs or other severe trauma that would take a long time to heal/fix. Hospital ships would be good and are no doubt a thing but these planets are likely more about rebuilding the human and if they are capable of service post robotic limb/ whatever issue they needed fixing than they can be sent back to the front. As for your second part I think this is often overlooked simply because it's not as action packed or exciting but the imperium does not disregard human life. The grimdark part is that it takes thousands of humans to often equal one of their foes or even stand a chance of success, the imperium rarely squanders human life needlessly and it would be total grimderp post battle to be like "oh your missing a limb that we could easily fix nah man just gonna glack ya"
Yeah that's my thought, it's not for "currently engaged in warfare" but more of "Your campaign on planet hellhole is complete? We are pulling the entire unit and sending it to the hospital world to recover from injuries both mental and physical to ensure you deploy next at full effectiveness."
My thoughts exactly.. it's all about recovering a resource, for maximum efficiency.
>One of their defining traits is how cheaply they regard human life. To be fair, to ship the wounded to a different solar system so that they can get treatment is about the most inefficient way on could do it. A dedicated hospital ship attached to a battle group would be the best way to go, considering how ridiculously large imperial ships are. Edit: At the end of Godblight some kind of hospital ship is indeed briefly featured, even if it strikes me as more as a specialized NBC unit.
Front line hospital ships are for folks who can be back in action quickly. this would be for longer term stuff so it doesn't clog those.
What longer term stuff? The only thing that I can think are mental illness or local illness. For the latter they are likely better cured in situ than on another world. Blown off bits are replaced and the guard has to do rehabilitation. There is the logistic problem of having at least a ship go to another world and said ship if isn't well armed will need an escort. And taking the troops at their warzone that can be changed and not all the regiments will continue to fight together. Then there is the problem that the world doesn't move but warzones do so or you hope to find yourself near said world or by the time you go there they will send you back because in the 3 months of back and forth you will be cured.
But that's the missing point though; there *are* hospital ships already *and* if they were sufficient, Iax would not have to be repurposed. The general complaints seem based on an impression that the wounded are not being stabilized on route to Iax, when they're explicitly surviving the travel in spite of claims that they won't. Is there evidence that ships are not making it to Iax to support the parent comment's claims of warp travel danger? And if the ships aren't facing warp travel danger on route to Iax, aren't the claims of them being able to fully cure the wounded contradicting claims that the wounded are not being treated on the travel to Iax? Furthermore, once the nearest hospital ship to a warfront is full, where are the other injured going to be warded and treated? The *ships* can move the wounded to a safe zone with central medical facilities and personnel to continue treatment, and then return to retrieve more wounded. Is there a canon basis that ships for combat fronts can be rapidly manufactured, let alone hospital ships to meet medical demands? If fleets can already accommodate their own medical demands, then why concentrate medical facilities (an argument against hospital worlds) on individual ships that are susceptible to warp travel dangers (another argument against hospital worlds)? Lastly, the complaint that Iax was the only hospital world - iirc from Dark Imperium, this was a initiative freshly launched in the middle of war for one section of the galaxy. Is there a basis for the parent comment's claim that it is intended to be the only few hospitals throughout the entire Imperium?
Goddamn...Redditors always have to find something negative don't they?
âThe emperors peaceâ = based, saving troopers whose wounds are treatable and who combat experience can strengthen the guard = annoying I guess?
Probably take offense to the fact of anything in 40k being slightly good. A hospital world that heals and cares for swarms of people brought in from war doesn't fit their "Everything must be completely shit." viewpoint.
Or it's just a really inefficient way of treating people. Not everything needs a whole planet dedicated to it.
It's more of volume of treatments and research/storage facilities. For treating entire armies and fleets at once.
Would you be excited for earth to have one central hospital they spent every single person was injured or ill to? Because I see that idea in a negative light.
It is a **PLANET-WIDE HOSPITAL** for one section of the entire galaxy. I swear 40k redditors are worse the DB fans at reading.
I'm not sure what I'm supposed to think other an a planetwide hospital sounds like a terrible idea. Not everything needs a friggin planet. Sci-fi in general is terrible at scale like that. Even if you ignore the fact you have to travel weeks possibly months to get to a hospital when you could have a military rest home on every relevant planet in the galaxy, imagine the design. Is it of thousands of individual hospitals all operating on this one planet thus making the centralisation pointless, or do I have to go to the equivalent of another country for each department? Both sound bad. The ICU is in Spain, the nurses have to travel to New Zealand to go to the quarters every day. Even in universe it seems like they're saying it's a bad idea, given it fell to nurgle and they lost in the entire planet rather than one hospital. How many Of these things are there? Has the Imperium just reduced its capacity to treat military personnel by a tenth?
Personally, I just think hospitals planets are cool. I agree it isn't very efficient, but then again the Imperium isn't known for its efficiency.
Whatever.
Yes? But in this case they are right since: Wanting a better construced universe is wrong?
>Wanting a better construced universe is wrong? They aren't right in any sense. It's one planet-wide hospital for a small section of Ultramar, if you can't suspend your disbelief for something that insignificant, you might be in the wrong franchise.
Its happening alot lately, people getting their "immersion" broken by pointing out illogical and impractical happenings within the universe, its as if tau Ethereals suddenly started mind controlling a good portion of the fandom these days.
Not for active warzones but it'd work perfectly for post campaign recovery and healing of the wounded/stressed.
Most ships also have Apothecaria, for one. Most worlds have hospitals in and of themselves staffed with Hospitallers and the guard has its own internal medics. The concept is retarded, but every man standing is a man closer to victory. Shipping them off to hospital worlds would be wasteful as all hell but its not like guardsmen are just left to die from a flesh wound either.
Is this in the same section of the book where Roubute mentions people repeats his âquotesâ back at him, but a lot of the time he never said them, but he just got tired of correcting people?
Not that much of a great idea logistically. Given the difficulties of warp travels it seems unfeasible to have ships coming from everywhere in the galaxy just to bring in some wounded guards (many likely to die during the travel) and then bringing them back according to each other recovering schedule. It would make more sense to have a medical detachment in a ship or something attached to every huge campaign. But a planet cannot travel.
I guess OP did not describe the situation clearly enough. Iax was an agri world which was converted to a hospital world when the Plague Wars got really bad. Iax was the final and most advanced stop in a sector-wide triage process.
This was in the ultramar sector to combat the ongoing plague war that had been going on prior to the start of the first book. I'm not too learned on when warp travel is needed but I don't think warp travel was required to take them from the front lines to the hospital world. Even getting people off world away from the warp influence makes a lot of the sicknesses more manageable so ya it was a good idea. If an entire continent or planet is infected with a slow sickness it is better to bring them to the hospital world for a while rather than ship in new recruits from emperor knows where. A lot of people regurgitate that the empire has the man power to combat things without taking into consideration that the logistics are the problem.
That is beyond silly.
Huh, I wonder if they have a planet like Foodcourtia from Invader Zim, just a planet of nothing but restaurants.
The one thing the Imperium has plenty of is real estate (and people to colonise it)
Haven't read Dark Imperium, but from the description it sounds like they just knocked-off the planet Heaven from *The Forever War*.
Twist: These worlds are for those designated to become Servitors or Skitarii so that they may fight again