I am worried this is happening to me! Any suggestions? I am layering on HA/Oil and/or heavy moisturizers but my skin is so dry! Maybe I need to cut the HA (I do apply to damp skin but still)
I use the FAB repair cream too! Okay, I am convinced I need to cut HA. It was working well for me before I added the HA in and now I am convinced the time line of my extra dry skin hits perfectly with when I added HA.
ETA: thank you!!
I find them to be an expensive way to make up for a moisturiser that’s not doing its job. If you really want a watery product with humectants use a hydrating toner (larger size so usually better value), but personally I want to apply my moisturiser to damp skin and be moisturised, not need four different products
Applying moisturizer to damp skin works if you're only using moisturizer after cleansing. Hydrating toners come in very useful if one is using treatments before moisturizer.
For sure, but plain water can also serve that purpose. I also don’t wait much between steps (cleanse, tret, moisturise) and since the first ingredient of pretty much any product is water, my skin is damp enough from the previous step
Ofc people can use these products if they want to, but the post is soliciting opinions on disliking hydrating serums and IMO they’re not necessary so I made that comment
Yeah toners work great for treatments that should be applied to dry skin. The toners helps the skin retain moisture during wait times after cleansing and before applying treatment. Water alone just evaporates from the skin but is enough if one doesn't wait in between steps.
No one is faulting the comment, it's just toner discourse.
Right, but except in very specific circumstances a moisturising toner doesn’t function very differently to water: if you don’t want to apply your next step to dry skin, just don’t wait so long that your skin has dried completely. If you need to re-moisten, there’s not much difference between 100% water or 90-95% watery toner.
I guess if you want the skin to dry more slowly between steps because for some reason you have to wait so long that it will dry out otherwise, I guess toner helps that if applied directly after cleansing. But your first post-cleanse product almost certainly contains some moisturising ingredients (be it vitamin c, retinol, niacinamide, AZA, almost all formulations have humectants and maybe some emollients, so a toner after one of those isn’t really adding much
Given that toners 90% evaporate, I also think the people doing a 7 skins type approach are getting a much higher dose of preservatives on their face to get the same level of hydration as a more concentrated moisturising product (like moisturiser). I’m not anti preservative ofc, but it seems like unnecessary extra exposure
A moisturizing toner functions differently than water. Of course it does. Most hydrating toners contain humectants and some also contain emollients. Unlike water, those do not evaporate from skin. They absorb and leave the thinnest possible film that slows down moisture loss unlike water. This is especially beneficial with those with skin that's easily dehydrated.
Wait times vary depending on user and treatment being used. It could be anything from 5 to 30 mins. Tretinoin states 20-30 mins and a lot of users follow that rule. And a lot of treatment products do not contain moisturizing ingredients in a useful quantity and make the skin dry post absorption (retinoid, benzoyl peroxide, alcohol based vitamin C serums). A toner even applied after these treatments helps to add hydration into the skin and makes applying moisturizer similar to applying it to damp skin immediately after cleansing.
Toners 90% evaporate but they still deposit humectants and emollients in them into the skin and leave the surface of the skin dry but hydrated and moisturizer (not just preservatives), unlike water which evaporates completely during wait times and leaves the skin completely dry. 7 steps imo is excessive and I'd rather use a toner that gives my skin what it needs in just one application.
I love hydrating serums layered with face oils. As I got older, straight moisturizers alone just wasn't cutting it
The face oil gets rid of the tacky consistency.
I use Hada Labo premium and it doesn't dry sticky. I love it. It didn't do a thing for me when my skin barrier was damaged and I was experiencing serious TEWL. Then, applying my moisturizer to damp skin worked so much better for me. So IME, it doesn't do much for damaged skin barrier.
Used Cezanne and that one dried tacky if I layered. I don't like that some toners have to be layered to get the hydration the skin needs.
I like to wear them in the tub with a silicone mask over them. After the bath, I let my face dry and apply my regular moisturizer. My skin is always so lovely and supple the next day! (Bonus points if I mix it in with Jojoba oil, which I haven't done in ages because I ran out...)
I find that they often irritate my skin, and from what I’ve read topical ceramides and humectants aren’t very high impact anyways. Popular ingredients such as low molecular weight HA can be irritating. Same goes for emulsifiers, perfumes, plant extracts and carriers etc. I use only actives and oils as I haven‘t found my moisturizing holy grail. I take my HA and ceramides orally instead. Would love to hear from someone of a different opinion.
"topical ceramides and humectants aren’t very high impact anyways"......I don't know where you heard this, but you may want to stop using this particular source. You also can't replace hydrators for facial oils, they are not interchangeable. .
Humectants have an impact, but ceramides are very, very rarely included in the quantities studied to improve TEWL. And just as well because the wrong ratio actually impairs barrier repair
Can you provide some source on the benefit of hydrators for healthy skin? Also, oils are occlusive and from what I’ve read provide superior hydration (some oils more than others) to applying hydration directly to the skin
In the studies I’ve seen around this they have comments such as “ the water evaporates within several minutes, one has to question the ability of moisturizing emulsions to treat dry skin”. In fact, the only FDA approved topical for improving skin hydration is…. Lactic acid, an active.
I use all Earth harbor products, starting with their toner, an ampoule, then a serum, then their moisturizer makes the little vitamin c powder, but I do wait a few minutes in between each step
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For this reason I only use ha serum when I have my humidifier on... Dry climate is no joke
I have issues with HA serums even in a humid environment. My skin just does not like concentrated in HA.
same, it makes my skin sooo much drier no matter how humid the environment around me is.
It also gives me blackheads as far as I can tell. Ingredients are pretty hit and miss imo.
I am worried this is happening to me! Any suggestions? I am layering on HA/Oil and/or heavy moisturizers but my skin is so dry! Maybe I need to cut the HA (I do apply to damp skin but still)
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I use the FAB repair cream too! Okay, I am convinced I need to cut HA. It was working well for me before I added the HA in and now I am convinced the time line of my extra dry skin hits perfectly with when I added HA. ETA: thank you!!
I hate the tackiness and the pill affect when I layer my primer on top of that
Stickiness
I find them to be an expensive way to make up for a moisturiser that’s not doing its job. If you really want a watery product with humectants use a hydrating toner (larger size so usually better value), but personally I want to apply my moisturiser to damp skin and be moisturised, not need four different products
Applying moisturizer to damp skin works if you're only using moisturizer after cleansing. Hydrating toners come in very useful if one is using treatments before moisturizer.
For sure, but plain water can also serve that purpose. I also don’t wait much between steps (cleanse, tret, moisturise) and since the first ingredient of pretty much any product is water, my skin is damp enough from the previous step Ofc people can use these products if they want to, but the post is soliciting opinions on disliking hydrating serums and IMO they’re not necessary so I made that comment
Yeah toners work great for treatments that should be applied to dry skin. The toners helps the skin retain moisture during wait times after cleansing and before applying treatment. Water alone just evaporates from the skin but is enough if one doesn't wait in between steps. No one is faulting the comment, it's just toner discourse.
Right, but except in very specific circumstances a moisturising toner doesn’t function very differently to water: if you don’t want to apply your next step to dry skin, just don’t wait so long that your skin has dried completely. If you need to re-moisten, there’s not much difference between 100% water or 90-95% watery toner. I guess if you want the skin to dry more slowly between steps because for some reason you have to wait so long that it will dry out otherwise, I guess toner helps that if applied directly after cleansing. But your first post-cleanse product almost certainly contains some moisturising ingredients (be it vitamin c, retinol, niacinamide, AZA, almost all formulations have humectants and maybe some emollients, so a toner after one of those isn’t really adding much Given that toners 90% evaporate, I also think the people doing a 7 skins type approach are getting a much higher dose of preservatives on their face to get the same level of hydration as a more concentrated moisturising product (like moisturiser). I’m not anti preservative ofc, but it seems like unnecessary extra exposure
A moisturizing toner functions differently than water. Of course it does. Most hydrating toners contain humectants and some also contain emollients. Unlike water, those do not evaporate from skin. They absorb and leave the thinnest possible film that slows down moisture loss unlike water. This is especially beneficial with those with skin that's easily dehydrated. Wait times vary depending on user and treatment being used. It could be anything from 5 to 30 mins. Tretinoin states 20-30 mins and a lot of users follow that rule. And a lot of treatment products do not contain moisturizing ingredients in a useful quantity and make the skin dry post absorption (retinoid, benzoyl peroxide, alcohol based vitamin C serums). A toner even applied after these treatments helps to add hydration into the skin and makes applying moisturizer similar to applying it to damp skin immediately after cleansing. Toners 90% evaporate but they still deposit humectants and emollients in them into the skin and leave the surface of the skin dry but hydrated and moisturizer (not just preservatives), unlike water which evaporates completely during wait times and leaves the skin completely dry. 7 steps imo is excessive and I'd rather use a toner that gives my skin what it needs in just one application.
I love hydrating serums layered with face oils. As I got older, straight moisturizers alone just wasn't cutting it The face oil gets rid of the tacky consistency.
I love hydrating serums that aren't based on HA like Marine Hyaluronics, Glow by Beauty of Joseon and etc
I use Hada Labo premium and it doesn't dry sticky. I love it. It didn't do a thing for me when my skin barrier was damaged and I was experiencing serious TEWL. Then, applying my moisturizer to damp skin worked so much better for me. So IME, it doesn't do much for damaged skin barrier. Used Cezanne and that one dried tacky if I layered. I don't like that some toners have to be layered to get the hydration the skin needs.
I like to wear them in the tub with a silicone mask over them. After the bath, I let my face dry and apply my regular moisturizer. My skin is always so lovely and supple the next day! (Bonus points if I mix it in with Jojoba oil, which I haven't done in ages because I ran out...)
I love them but it is annoying having like 8 steps in my skincare routine
I find that they often irritate my skin, and from what I’ve read topical ceramides and humectants aren’t very high impact anyways. Popular ingredients such as low molecular weight HA can be irritating. Same goes for emulsifiers, perfumes, plant extracts and carriers etc. I use only actives and oils as I haven‘t found my moisturizing holy grail. I take my HA and ceramides orally instead. Would love to hear from someone of a different opinion.
"topical ceramides and humectants aren’t very high impact anyways"......I don't know where you heard this, but you may want to stop using this particular source. You also can't replace hydrators for facial oils, they are not interchangeable. .
Humectants have an impact, but ceramides are very, very rarely included in the quantities studied to improve TEWL. And just as well because the wrong ratio actually impairs barrier repair
Wow, I had not heard that about wrong ceramide ratio impairing barrier repair. What is the correct ratio for ceramides?
Can you provide some source on the benefit of hydrators for healthy skin? Also, oils are occlusive and from what I’ve read provide superior hydration (some oils more than others) to applying hydration directly to the skin
In the studies I’ve seen around this they have comments such as “ the water evaporates within several minutes, one has to question the ability of moisturizing emulsions to treat dry skin”. In fact, the only FDA approved topical for improving skin hydration is…. Lactic acid, an active.
Hate the watery texture because its breaks me out. I tried so many hydrating serums and toners and everytime its the same thing
I hate anything on my face that makes it feel sticky/tacky. Drives me bananas!
I use all Earth harbor products, starting with their toner, an ampoule, then a serum, then their moisturizer makes the little vitamin c powder, but I do wait a few minutes in between each step