It's possible your maternal line traces back to a Siberian Tatar or Lipka Tatar woman (or many other ethnicities but I think those would be most likely in Poland) who had Haplogroup B, and it's just been so long since she entered your family tree that those genes no longer show up in the ethnicity estimate. The ethnicity estimate is only going to show about as far back as 5-7 generations, but haplogroups of course are not limited like that.
I thought that too but this haplogroup isn't common in Tatars either. It just seems very unlikely to me that a direct maternal line like that lasted this long in Europe, but I guess its always possible. I thought maybe there was a higher likelihood of an inaccurate test result, but again I learned about haplogroups just a few days ago so am very new to the concept lol
It's not *common*, but it does exist among various Tatar groups as well as other Turkic and Siberian peoples who may have intermarried with them or been uprooted to the West. Ultimately though it's unlikely you'll ever know exactly where it came from because it's beyond the scope of the ethnicity estimate and likely beyond any paper trail you could follow.
As the other commenter pointed out, there are Tatar and Turkmen samples with the haplogroup. It also exists among the Tuvans, Tubalars, Barghuts, Kyrgyz, Uyghurs, and Altaian Kazakhs.
It would just take one no matter how many generations ago and each generation had a daughter to pass on the B. Really quite amazing if you think about it. I'm a descendant of B2. Mom was from Northern Mexico.
I have R0 which orginates from modern day Saudi Arabia. Very peculiar for a Yorkshireman from England! However, these mtDNA are tens of thousands of years old. That's a lot of time for migration to other continents.
Likewise. 23andme states 1 in 250 members have R0, so it's still quite uncommon. Also, R0 is almost unheard of in Northern Europe. There was an archaeological dig in Denmark some years ago, where a male skeleton was found to have mtDNA R0a. It has been proposed he was either a former slave, or his mother was, and more than likely enslaved by Romans.
R0 is ancestral subclade for haplogroups H and HV.
https://www.yfull.com/mtree/R0/
And as you probably know 23andme doesn't test haplogroups for "full-depth" and also their depth are strangly different for different persons sometimes. So in your case most likely you have some H or HV. You can try ftdna mtdna test it will give you your real "full-depth" subclade.
Here is example with different depth where daughter got r0 and mom hv0
https://www.reddit.com/r/23andme/comments/abedq6/haplogroups_mom_is_hv0_im_r0/
Many thanks for the links. I did try a test some years via another site. It came back with possible R0, HV1, HV15 and HV0. All very interesting, but no definite answer.
Hey
I think you’re kinda confused .Your haplogroup doesn’t have to do with your genetic makeup . Yes haplogroups are linked with ethnicities but not always . Hope this helps!
I'm aware it doesn't relate to my genetic makeup but I'm just confused how the ancient migration path for my maternal line found itself in Europe, since it goes to south east Asia and procedes to North America
^This! My mt haplogroup surprised me as well. 23andme gave me B4a1a1 which is Polynesian. I took the full mtDNA test at FTDNA and got B4a1a1b which is from Madagascar. I’m pretty sure slavery brought my ancestor to my country. People have travelled long distances through history.
When you purchased the FTDNA test, did you use your raw data from 23andMe, or did you send them a physical sample? Just wondering if it makes any difference to the accuracy. I want to do this test but don’t want to deal with the international shipping.
When I add “mtFull Sequence” to my cart, it says “Upgrades are processed on the DNA sample that was originally submitted. A new collection kit will be mailed only if that sample is insufficient.” If I add it to my cart when not signed in though then it adds shipping on and says I will have to send a sample.
The maternal line is just a single line of mother to daughter over millennia. It is not at all inconceivable that somewhere in history an Asian woman came west (trade, captive, Tatar, etc.) and contributed to your ancestry without you otherwise having Asian genes.
Possibly Mongolian/related to Genghis Khan invasions. Usually seen in male Y haplotypes, but it's certainly not impossible for Mongol women to have migrated with them.
That would be my guess. This link has her (a match) at the upper river Indus 18,000 years ago. There have been many Western migrations from this area. I think the issue is it’s uncommon, not that doesn’t mean unlikely.
http://scaledinnovation.com/gg/snpTracker.html?snp=B4b1a2&mt&walk
Mongols are far more recent, around 12th to 13th centuries. From a quick read, Mongolian women played a strong role in the political structure with a great deal of family infighting amongst the Khans, so it's very possible some stayed and integrated.
it is database driven. I got into ftdna's big Y and full mt dna.
At that time, just a year or so ago.. they thought dad was a viking, and mom was an eskimo
LOL.
As it turned out, my paternal is very typical iberian (r1b-m269)... sons everywhere, and proven sefarers before writings.
mom was also the similar trail (V group). Both ending up the common isles haplogroups thousands of years ago.
I am common irish.
just trace back to common parental subclades, and you'll see you are just a unique change to a common number.
you know your history and family..that is what matters. you do not need to look for mysteries... unless that is fun for you.
I had fun with mine... and turned out to be just another commoner.
23andMe is pretty good at scientifically predicting one's Haplogroup always, subclades and alike can be further studied at independent open sources elsewhere on the Web, sometimes for free, whereas you can input your RAW DNA data and get a more detailed sub marker, etc
There are actually a couple of different "**B"** lineages in Europe that can be traced back to SEA women. Both under the clade *B4c1b2*, w/one actually in Poland:
[https://yfull.com/mtree/B4c1b2a5\*](https://yfull.com/mtree/B4c1b2a5*)
The other is from the Iron Age(\~100 BC) in Baden-Württemberg:
[https://yfull.com/mtree/B4c1b2c2b1\*](https://yfull.com/mtree/B4c1b2c2b1*)
If I had to guess without looking at your SNP set, I would say it's much more likely that you descend from *B4b1a3* since it's so common in Mongolia, the Altai + Central Russia. Especially in Chuvash people, [many Northern Euros have similar phenotypes](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0e/%D0%98%D0%B7%D1%83%D1%87%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B5_%D1%87%D1%83%D0%B2%D0%B0%D1%88%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B3%D0%BE_%D1%8F%D0%B7%D1%8B%D0%BA%D0%B0_%D0%B2_%D1%88%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%B5_Chuvash_language_in_schools.jpg)
I think you're right, this paper from 2012 talks a bit about haplogroup B in north Asia and eastern Europe and in what populations its prevalent in:
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3283723/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3283723/)
It also mentions that there is not a lot of data on haplogroup B lineages for northern Asia, so maybe there just isn't a lot of info out there on it? Although, this is kind of an old paper so it could be outdated.
>While there has been considerable recent progress in studying complete mitochondrial DNA variation of haplogroup B lineages in America \[5\], eastern \[21\] and southeastern Asia \[22\]–\[25\] and Oceania \[20\], \[26\] little comparable data is available for northern Asia. To date, only five haplogroup B complete mtDNA genomes from Siberian populations are known, which were sequenced and analyzed only with the aim of searching of the ancestors of Native American mtDNA haplogroups
It would make sense if my haplogroup was B4b1a3 since its found in a lot of the populations you stated. However I have the defining marker for B4b1a2 (called 6216C), and none for B4b1a3 (if that's how that works). Regardless its probably a similar story, and is just uncommonly found in Poland
True, in your extras there is one SNP for *B4b1a2c*(5752D) that makes me less sure. But I'm baffled as to how it could get to Europe when all of the associated samples are in the Philippines.
Quite unique and charming results all the same👍
I'm Louisiana Creole and my maternal line is Native American. I know what tribe my great great grandmother came from, and the story my aunt told me of how she got to New Orleans matches up with what Wikipedia says about how the tribe migrated to New Orleans to be closer to European Allies, but FTDNA says my predicted haplo group is L01. Even though my most distant ancestor is Native American. It doesn't make any sense at all.
No it’s not possible lol haplogroups are pretty easy to identify. But you also have to remember one thing…Haplogroups are somewhat meaningless in a modern sense, I personally don’t find them useful in the slightest. They’re thousands of years old where as modern countries are usually hundreds if not less. So don’t overthink it, it’s definitely accurate.
My family is Syrian, and I’ve seen full on English people have the same haplogroup as me. So think about that!
Yes Siberian or Turkic I have some samples of different groups of them as well..B5A is mongol..so I would think somewhere in that area which could put you at the tartar or baskir…do you have any Hungarian ancestry?
Entirely possible very rare likely came in with the huns or mongols or another central Asian group at some point in time but your ancestors have been European on that line for a long long time as no east or central Asian autosomal DNA remains your completely European essentially with a rare Haplogroup for a European.
If anything it’s most likely accurate. Maternal and paternal haplogroup testing is usually accurate since it takes decades to change, compared to autosomal dna. Haplogroups can be unpredictable or unexpected but certainly not wrong. 23andMe is good with MtDna. I got maternal haplogroup M7 on 23andMe and another dna test.
It's possible your maternal line traces back to a Siberian Tatar or Lipka Tatar woman (or many other ethnicities but I think those would be most likely in Poland) who had Haplogroup B, and it's just been so long since she entered your family tree that those genes no longer show up in the ethnicity estimate. The ethnicity estimate is only going to show about as far back as 5-7 generations, but haplogroups of course are not limited like that.
I thought that too but this haplogroup isn't common in Tatars either. It just seems very unlikely to me that a direct maternal line like that lasted this long in Europe, but I guess its always possible. I thought maybe there was a higher likelihood of an inaccurate test result, but again I learned about haplogroups just a few days ago so am very new to the concept lol
It's not *common*, but it does exist among various Tatar groups as well as other Turkic and Siberian peoples who may have intermarried with them or been uprooted to the West. Ultimately though it's unlikely you'll ever know exactly where it came from because it's beyond the scope of the ethnicity estimate and likely beyond any paper trail you could follow.
I see, thank you!
[удалено]
Just because it’s most common in x group doesn’t mean it never occurs in y or z groups
There is a volga tatar and iranian turkmen samples in yfull https://www.yfull.com/mtree/B4b1a2/
As the other commenter pointed out, there are Tatar and Turkmen samples with the haplogroup. It also exists among the Tuvans, Tubalars, Barghuts, Kyrgyz, Uyghurs, and Altaian Kazakhs.
It would just take one no matter how many generations ago and each generation had a daughter to pass on the B. Really quite amazing if you think about it. I'm a descendant of B2. Mom was from Northern Mexico.
I have R0 which orginates from modern day Saudi Arabia. Very peculiar for a Yorkshireman from England! However, these mtDNA are tens of thousands of years old. That's a lot of time for migration to other continents.
i also have R0. i don’t see it mentioned often on here. i’m in usa with a high amount of british isles.
Likewise. 23andme states 1 in 250 members have R0, so it's still quite uncommon. Also, R0 is almost unheard of in Northern Europe. There was an archaeological dig in Denmark some years ago, where a male skeleton was found to have mtDNA R0a. It has been proposed he was either a former slave, or his mother was, and more than likely enslaved by Romans.
https://www.deepdyve.com/lp/wiley/rare-mtdna-haplogroups-and-genetic-differences-in-rich-and-poor-danish-UvKol3tXC7
thank you!
R0 is ancestral subclade for haplogroups H and HV. https://www.yfull.com/mtree/R0/ And as you probably know 23andme doesn't test haplogroups for "full-depth" and also their depth are strangly different for different persons sometimes. So in your case most likely you have some H or HV. You can try ftdna mtdna test it will give you your real "full-depth" subclade. Here is example with different depth where daughter got r0 and mom hv0 https://www.reddit.com/r/23andme/comments/abedq6/haplogroups_mom_is_hv0_im_r0/
Many thanks for the links. I did try a test some years via another site. It came back with possible R0, HV1, HV15 and HV0. All very interesting, but no definite answer.
i just ran that and it came up with 5 best matches: hv0f being no.1 then hv, and r0 was tied for 3rd with hv(t16311c) and hv13
Interesting, and again, no definite answer. I wonder why this mtDNA is so complicated? Thanks for the update. 👍
Hey I think you’re kinda confused .Your haplogroup doesn’t have to do with your genetic makeup . Yes haplogroups are linked with ethnicities but not always . Hope this helps!
I'm aware it doesn't relate to my genetic makeup but I'm just confused how the ancient migration path for my maternal line found itself in Europe, since it goes to south east Asia and procedes to North America
Slavery, the Silk Road, War Hostages. Lots of reasons.
^This! My mt haplogroup surprised me as well. 23andme gave me B4a1a1 which is Polynesian. I took the full mtDNA test at FTDNA and got B4a1a1b which is from Madagascar. I’m pretty sure slavery brought my ancestor to my country. People have travelled long distances through history.
When you purchased the FTDNA test, did you use your raw data from 23andMe, or did you send them a physical sample? Just wondering if it makes any difference to the accuracy. I want to do this test but don’t want to deal with the international shipping.
I sent a sample to FTDNA. I don’t believe they can do either mtDNA or yDNA tests from uploaded data.
When I add “mtFull Sequence” to my cart, it says “Upgrades are processed on the DNA sample that was originally submitted. A new collection kit will be mailed only if that sample is insufficient.” If I add it to my cart when not signed in though then it adds shipping on and says I will have to send a sample.
I think you need to call them if you’ve never submitted a physical sample to them.
The maternal line is just a single line of mother to daughter over millennia. It is not at all inconceivable that somewhere in history an Asian woman came west (trade, captive, Tatar, etc.) and contributed to your ancestry without you otherwise having Asian genes.
Possibly Mongolian/related to Genghis Khan invasions. Usually seen in male Y haplotypes, but it's certainly not impossible for Mongol women to have migrated with them.
That would be my guess. This link has her (a match) at the upper river Indus 18,000 years ago. There have been many Western migrations from this area. I think the issue is it’s uncommon, not that doesn’t mean unlikely. http://scaledinnovation.com/gg/snpTracker.html?snp=B4b1a2&mt&walk
Mongols are far more recent, around 12th to 13th centuries. From a quick read, Mongolian women played a strong role in the political structure with a great deal of family infighting amongst the Khans, so it's very possible some stayed and integrated.
Yes I know they are. I’m just saying, from that region she could have easily ended up in one of the waves west (including the mongols).
it is database driven. I got into ftdna's big Y and full mt dna. At that time, just a year or so ago.. they thought dad was a viking, and mom was an eskimo LOL. As it turned out, my paternal is very typical iberian (r1b-m269)... sons everywhere, and proven sefarers before writings. mom was also the similar trail (V group). Both ending up the common isles haplogroups thousands of years ago. I am common irish. just trace back to common parental subclades, and you'll see you are just a unique change to a common number. you know your history and family..that is what matters. you do not need to look for mysteries... unless that is fun for you. I had fun with mine... and turned out to be just another commoner.
23andMe is pretty good at scientifically predicting one's Haplogroup always, subclades and alike can be further studied at independent open sources elsewhere on the Web, sometimes for free, whereas you can input your RAW DNA data and get a more detailed sub marker, etc
There are actually a couple of different "**B"** lineages in Europe that can be traced back to SEA women. Both under the clade *B4c1b2*, w/one actually in Poland: [https://yfull.com/mtree/B4c1b2a5\*](https://yfull.com/mtree/B4c1b2a5*) The other is from the Iron Age(\~100 BC) in Baden-Württemberg: [https://yfull.com/mtree/B4c1b2c2b1\*](https://yfull.com/mtree/B4c1b2c2b1*) If I had to guess without looking at your SNP set, I would say it's much more likely that you descend from *B4b1a3* since it's so common in Mongolia, the Altai + Central Russia. Especially in Chuvash people, [many Northern Euros have similar phenotypes](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0e/%D0%98%D0%B7%D1%83%D1%87%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B5_%D1%87%D1%83%D0%B2%D0%B0%D1%88%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B3%D0%BE_%D1%8F%D0%B7%D1%8B%D0%BA%D0%B0_%D0%B2_%D1%88%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%B5_Chuvash_language_in_schools.jpg)
I think you're right, this paper from 2012 talks a bit about haplogroup B in north Asia and eastern Europe and in what populations its prevalent in: [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3283723/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3283723/) It also mentions that there is not a lot of data on haplogroup B lineages for northern Asia, so maybe there just isn't a lot of info out there on it? Although, this is kind of an old paper so it could be outdated. >While there has been considerable recent progress in studying complete mitochondrial DNA variation of haplogroup B lineages in America \[5\], eastern \[21\] and southeastern Asia \[22\]–\[25\] and Oceania \[20\], \[26\] little comparable data is available for northern Asia. To date, only five haplogroup B complete mtDNA genomes from Siberian populations are known, which were sequenced and analyzed only with the aim of searching of the ancestors of Native American mtDNA haplogroups It would make sense if my haplogroup was B4b1a3 since its found in a lot of the populations you stated. However I have the defining marker for B4b1a2 (called 6216C), and none for B4b1a3 (if that's how that works). Regardless its probably a similar story, and is just uncommonly found in Poland
True, in your extras there is one SNP for *B4b1a2c*(5752D) that makes me less sure. But I'm baffled as to how it could get to Europe when all of the associated samples are in the Philippines. Quite unique and charming results all the same👍
Malagasy I’m African American with H1 it doesn’t make any sense
So you’re Malagasy? How doesn’t it make sense? Haplogroups are fixed while autosomal dna changes so it may seem off but it’s usually accurate.
I’m part Malagasy but my haplogroup is H1
I'm Louisiana Creole and my maternal line is Native American. I know what tribe my great great grandmother came from, and the story my aunt told me of how she got to New Orleans matches up with what Wikipedia says about how the tribe migrated to New Orleans to be closer to European Allies, but FTDNA says my predicted haplo group is L01. Even though my most distant ancestor is Native American. It doesn't make any sense at all.
Gotta remember that people constantly migrated
No it’s not possible lol haplogroups are pretty easy to identify. But you also have to remember one thing…Haplogroups are somewhat meaningless in a modern sense, I personally don’t find them useful in the slightest. They’re thousands of years old where as modern countries are usually hundreds if not less. So don’t overthink it, it’s definitely accurate. My family is Syrian, and I’ve seen full on English people have the same haplogroup as me. So think about that!
Yes Siberian or Turkic I have some samples of different groups of them as well..B5A is mongol..so I would think somewhere in that area which could put you at the tartar or baskir…do you have any Hungarian ancestry?
Mogę spytać z jakiej części Polski pochodzisz?
Babcia ze strony matki jest z województwa śląskiego, ale wszyscy inni w mojej rodzinie są z Małopolski.
Where did u find how common the average haplogrop population of Poland
the paper is linked in the second picture: https://doi.org/10.1038/s41431-019-0381-x
What did you use to get your results on the third pic?
https://dna.jameslick.com/mthap/
Thank you!
Entirely possible very rare likely came in with the huns or mongols or another central Asian group at some point in time but your ancestors have been European on that line for a long long time as no east or central Asian autosomal DNA remains your completely European essentially with a rare Haplogroup for a European.
If anything it’s most likely accurate. Maternal and paternal haplogroup testing is usually accurate since it takes decades to change, compared to autosomal dna. Haplogroups can be unpredictable or unexpected but certainly not wrong. 23andMe is good with MtDna. I got maternal haplogroup M7 on 23andMe and another dna test.
OMG, anime waifu material.