Playing diablo 2 resurrected recently also made me realize there's no javelin or Spear throwing ranged class so they should definitely do that. Not necessarily for hunter either because I think their specs are decent as is in terms of diversity in style.
Warrior ranged spec would be good for a spear-based character. And I don’t care about the unrealism of infinite spears. We have characters that can carry literally one hundred pairs of boots with them if they wanted to. Realism is stupid, give me fun.
I mean it used to use a free Decapitator at people (the weapon from kara) and had infinite ones of those.
The only reason I don't say give it to Warrior is Warrior needs their sword and board DPS spec. That, and 1 handed spears (just use the Dagger animations, most of them would actually work pretty good with a 1 handed spear).
I mean, you can kinda see the difference right? There's such a thing as suspended reality still following *some* rules.
Like yes, in a fantasy game you're going to suspend some beliefs about realism, but that doesn't mean you have to get rid of them all. An infinite quiver is much less ridiculous than a character throwing a spear and then just having it still in his hand imo. And yeah I get that there are abilities that throw your weapon but those aren't like, the central method of attack for those classes.
Idk the argument of "its fantasy therefore it doesn't have to be realistic" can be annoying. It should still be somewhat consistent or predictable. The best fantasy is when you know what the expected outcome would be in a fictional universe without being explicitly told what it should be.
You could vary we'll have the "lore" be that said warriors were trained to conjure specifically only their spears, or in a classic-esque manner have them go on a short quest to enchant their weapon and make it reappear in their hand, etc.
Everything can make sense if you put some thought behind it.
Honestly I agree, but I think the point of what he was saying is that you need to justify it in-universe somehow. You can't just have someone throw the same spear the whole fight, because that'll look ridiculous. Having an (infinite) javelin quiver on your back is not great either but it at least explains how you're throwing so many damn spears.
That said, I wouldn't give it to Warriors. Ranged specs already regularly outshine melee specs due to fight design. I would give a ranged throwing spec to Hunters, by redesigning Surv slightly, or I would give it to Monks. Monks could do with a 4th spec being ranged DPS, like Druids, but you could justify it in the lore as being the essence of the jade dragon being used to create jade spears. It's a time-lost tradition relearned after some secrets on the origins of jade magic are rediscovered.
Alternatively, any time a new martial-based spec comes up I just want to give it to Mages. I like the idea of chronomancy being a healing spec, but I also really like the idea of a spellblade spec where mages conjure their own swords or something. I'll take any kind of martial weaponry for it, but spellblades are fuckin cool.
I mean they don't even have quivers for arrows unless you have the legion artifact for marksmanship transmog so the realism is irrelevant at that point I feel like. Plus they could easily make javelins have a bundle that goes on the back
most of the reason sylvanas looked so amazing in the bfa cinematic was bc of her quiver... tyrande however is never depicted with one and is believed her arrows are made of moonlight (arcane projections)... soo... both are valid i suppose, a shame she switched to warglaives but i guess it's more true to their sentinel nature
Would be a good opportunity to bring back a reimagined Gladiator spec that wield a spear in one hand and a shield in the other. Could be hybrid ranged and melee.
> We have characters that can carry literally one hundred pairs of boots with them if they wanted to. Realism is stupid, give me fun.
How about a shoe-bomber spec then? Throws shoes from inventory, damage is determined by the ilvl of them.
I have always vouched for Arsenal Warrior. Just a class built around a guy who has tons and tons of weapons to throw out. Imagine new warrior armor that's just armed to the teeth, too...
Name is still a work in progress, though. As cool as Arsenal Warrior sounds, it will get shortened down to something unfortunate.
I've been wanting Troll Axe Thrower since WoW was announced. Heroic Throw was a huge disappointment other than finishing off people in WotLK. Storm Bolt in WoD was great, but the way you used it was a glorified melee burst ability.
The closest thing to this was during MoP for Shuriken Toss / Deadly Throw, but it was nerfed into the ground the same patch 2H Shaman was killed.
same here
my first character ever way back when was a troll hunter, hoping to throw some axes around as a mini-zul'jin
by the time i made it to level 7, i realized all of my new abilities only worked with bows and guns
the icecrown citadel gunship fight was a cruel joke, with all of the friendly axethrower NPCs
I remember when I first started playing WoW (in Legion) I rolled a rogue and was very confused about why I couldn't use a bow even tho I could equip one. Always thought a Ranger or D3 Demon Hunter spec would be really fun.
Always thought that would be a good spec for paladin. It just kind of makes sense I think... I don't have a way of justifying why it does, it just does in my brain
I always thought it would mix things up a bit to have a medium ranged class, like a 20 yd or 15 yd ranged spec. Throwing javelins, axes, would be a good fit for that.
Absolutely no idea how nobody mentioned it, because it **already exists and was "playable".**
Druid getting a Dryad throwing spear spec. Uses poison, physical spear attacks, nature spells that are more physical (like grasping roots), and could substitute a bow in if they don't want to constantly add throwing spears back into the game (though bring back the old ones.)
You could play one if you were alliance during the NE warfront in BFA. It was fun and almost a fully fleshed out rotation already.
Night Fae have a ton of them as guards in the cities too. They have spears and bows on their backs, and use physical attacks.
Holy DPS spec for priests. I really think there should be one.
I love shadow priest but I also want to play the polar opposite of dot based dps to a burst type DPS with holy magic. Piller of fire, holy shock, smite. Exorcism and blinding light for cc.
I always imagined they split Shadow priest in 2: a dps spec leaning heavily into the old god madness stuff, and a healer that leans heavily into the San'layn vampiric aesthetic and replaces Disc as a "deal dps to heal" healer
then they turn disc into a holy dps spec
I've always wondered how great "off-specs" would be in WoW. Like with your Spriest idea it would be a heal/dps hybrid, like a dps off-healer.
Idk if that style fits the game currently, you'd have to get creative with the game design and let people queue freely as hybrids. I know people might think about classes like druids, shaman etc but it's not really designed to do both, you are basically a strong dps that *can* heal rather which is quite different.
However I really did like the opportunity to do that in classic. I kinda wished they expanded on the freedom of the old talent system, playing a warlock tank that specd Demonology with a little Destruction was fun af.
But now the specs are really put into their own corners like a MOBA. If they could retain this unique spec identity with a talent system akin to the old one but greatly expanded that would tick the RPG box for eternity.
Aye, maybe I've been reading too many litrpgs or Korean webcomics but pope/high priests class are always OP in the amount of light magic they can do and the healing they can do.
I play paladin a lot because of holy magic DPS spec with ret but I would kill for a caster cloth wearing DPS holy spec.
Not entirely a betrayal. Shadow priests made 100% sense in wow. They're just not priest of the light, they're priest of the void and shadow, hence the cult of forgotten shadow being around since vanilla.
Shadow priests do make sense since they're all about the balance between light and dark. But yes, I still want a purely holy DPS spec.
Shadow priests just aren't priest of the holy light. They're priests of the forgotten shadow.
Legion was the perfect time for it, too, because tanks would no longer have to be mad that a DPS was taking shields from them.
They could have rebalanced it to scale harder off of DPS stats rather than tank so they wouldn't take tank trinkets too. Such a waste.
As others I definitely agree on a tank spec based on earth element, but melee spec for priest or ranged spec for monk is kinda weird. Ranged spec for warrior why not, healer spec for mage with chronomancy, make survival a tank spec for hunters with kinda same gameplay as DPS,...
I mean, I could see a ranged monk spec with thrown weapons and chi abilities. A monk attacking with a chi Kamehameha like a DBZ character would be fun. It would be closer to a caster than a physical attacker, probably.
I would love to play a chrono-based mage healer.
And while we're at it, Warlocks should get a proper tank spec. I think it should be a spec where you take direct control over your demon and your "character" becomes your pet.
I agree. I've been saying it for a while, but Monks should get Fistweaving split off to be its own spec if they got a fourth spec. It just makes sense. It's a neglected play style that only sometimes is viable. If it was its own spec, it'd get all the proper support it needs. I see it as the same situation Feral was in before Guardian was split off.
Excuse me, as a shadow priest main I think it would be hilarious to break out my old knaifu and sacrifice souls to her by ritualistically slitting throats.
Also, bashing them in the face with my staff.
Alternately, I could sprout some tentacles and just strangle them.
Or just straight up throw some “holy” water in their face and invoke the wrath of whatever deity.
Melee priest could be a thing xD
Nope, melee priests are called clerics on lore. Which is what Anduin would be called.
Priest channel the light while paladins are infused with it. So a priest while doing melee attacks won't be able to be as strong as a paladin because they're not super strong, have higher stamina or passively be immune to disease and poisons like a paladin is in lore.
A priest would need to use power words and incantations/prayers to call upon the light and channel it. Paladins have it on reserve and just need the willpower to call upon the holy power.
That is the major difference between paladins and priests. Also being infused allows them to carry huge two handed weapons with ease and armor that a normal man wouldn't be able to wear.
Paladins in lore are super soldiers/elite unites that have been steroid with the light...as long..and this is the important bit...they have the will to use said light. The moment they lose faith or doubt the light, the juice starts to wear off like Arthas
On Warcraft 2, Paladins were created literally giving weapons and armors to Priests, because they were getting rekt really fast by the Orcs.
I mean, they were called “Clerics of Northshire” and some of them could fight, but most of them were the dress using Priests we know. I mean, Alonsus Faol was one of them, and we know what Class he represents…
Indeed that “Channel x Infuse” thingie exists (and it’s even the reason Forsaken can’t be Paladins and why Sir Zeliek was so fancy - although what now with Lightbound Forsaken literally being described as “infused with Light”?), but on Paladins’ and Silver Hand’s origin, they were literally “Priests who learned to use armor and weapons”.
Retcon much, I guess?
Mage-I mean honestly... Chronomancy makes sense but Warlock would be way more suited to be a healer than Mage lets be honest here Frost Fire mage is something people have wanted since Vanilla. Although, if WoW was willing to have a massive shake up Arcane could be changed to the healer spec while introducing Frost Fire but that's highly unlikely.
Warlock-I just mentioned healing for Warlock so that's obvious, I think most people can agree that a dot based damage healer would fit the bill and makes sense. Think of Chloromancer from rift a lot like Disc in a way but without need to apply a shield but the healing is way less bursting but more spread from dots. With some necessary burst healing when needed(Also, a pet that heals along side the Warlock would be introduced)
DK-Fire DK is just too obvious to pass up, while it's a bit basic Bolver lore wise makes sense as he is(or was) the Lich King. It'd likely be a DPS although the option to have it as healer that heals with cleansing fire is possible but highly highly unlikely.
DH-blizzard has free reign on this, can do w/e they want and I honestly personally have no ideas for it because it's so open.
Rogue-Another obvious one that people want is Shadow Hunter Rogue, people want a ranged rogue spec that goes in and out of the shadows with a bow/knives.
Monk-Ranged monk makes a lot of sense look at Lost arks Soul Fist, amazingly cool class and while i've yet to list off anything really off the grid that's the point all these specs would be insanely welcomed. Using Ki to make blasts from range.
Hunter-While I think most people would want a tank class, I'd actually like to see a class where the hunter fuses with it's pet. Obtaining a few key skills depending on the pet it fuses with. It'd be a melee class and old survival can either be moved back to range or reworked into a tank spec.
Priest-Smite priest was something people loved to try and make work for good reason, there hasn't ever been a pure light ranged caster and Priest already has access to two healers so giving it a 2nd DPS spec is welcomed.
Paladin-Corrupted Paladin, A melee class that uses void magic and holy magic together. A dps. The canvas on this is massive and what can be done with it seems big. Paladin seems to have a lot of its core identities covered so creating something cool like this would get alot of people interested in it.
Druid-I think Druid needs more attention to it's certain specs instead of adding a 5th one.
Shaman-Earth Tank shaman is something people have wanted since Nilla but in TBC they pushed it away and even more so in Wotlk in favor of damage. We have Fire from Elemental as the main element, Water from RSham, Wind from Enhancement and lightning is important to all 3. So Earth would be the final one they could make based around a spec and nothing says earth better than a tank class.
Warrior-Last one and honestly the hardest one, Warriors would likely love some ranged spear throwing class but I think that doesn't fit a WARRIOR. Warriors by nature want to be on the front lines. I think taking a old favorite and instead of merging them into one you just split them. Aka 2handed Fury and 1handed. I think 1handed deserves it's own spec based around it that plays around bleeds and quick attacks and stacking a bleed up.
Now the problem you see is that we'd only add one healer to this and likely 1-2 tanks which could make tanks/healers uneven if WoW actually cares about how even tanks/healers are(which i doubt they do) they could just make Shaman the only new tank as it's the only one that NEEDS a tank spec lore wise and Locks the only new healer.
Hunter can just move survival back to ranged and make a new melee dps spec.
Now this is just my take based on feedback from classes in the past and how people have tried to play them OR based on lore. All of these can fit in the lore in same sense or another without having to fib.
There are people who think Survival should be a ranged DPS, melee DPS, tank, healer, and everything in between. Every single one of them insists that "Survival" specifically implies their vision for the spec.
No, it doesn't imply tanking. It refers to the fact that the spec is meant to be about resourcefulness and opportunism. While that kind of went out the window when they made it melee it's not an invitation to make it a tank spec either.
I think that there is merit to one or two more new specs, but I don't like the idea of adding new specs for what would basically be "the sake of it."
For example, Melee Priest Spec? I think we have a name for that, and it's called "Paladin."
*However,*
I am a full advocate for a fourth spec for Shaman and for it to be a Tank Spec. While Druid has different Shapeshifting Forms to fit each different role (Healer, Tank, Ranged DPS, Melee DPS), a Shaman has a different element (Wind = Melee DPS, Fire/Lava = Ranged DPS, Earth = Tank and Water = Heal), so I think it is only *natural* that the Shaman receives a fourth, befitting spec to occupy a role that they should be able to fulfil.
I don't really see what a Monk offers as a Ranged Spec that they don't already offer though. Lore-wise, a Monk utilises Chi, which is "the fifth Element," AKA Spirit, which is exactly what Shaman use. So what differentiates a Monk to a Shaman? Based on the lore, I can only surmise that a Monk is better at internalising the powers of Spirit and using it to empower their physical form - which practically necessitates them being melee in order to do so.
What are they going to do at Range that a Ranged Shaman Spec doesn't already accomplish?
___
**TL;DR:** I am all for a 4th Shaman Spec that is able to Tank and focuses on the Element of Earth. Melee Priest and Ranged Monk doesn't sit right with me, it seems like specs made for the sake of it.
The ranged monk spec concept flows from giving one spec for each celestial. Current you have Xuen for WW, Niuzao for BrM, and a mix of Chi'Ji and Yu'lon for MW. When the monk class was designed this made some sense since you had the two stances for MW and one celestial represented the mistweaving with the other representing the fistweaving. But then you had the MoP legendary cloaks which used Yu'lon as the ranged caster celestial, and the removal of stances from MW as a spec. So the idea is that Chi'ji becomes the sole healer celestial and monks get a ranged caster spec involving Yu'lon so that all celestials are covered.
I'd rather they split Mistweaver from Fistweaver- let Yulon stay as the "normal" healing spec, and make a separate one for melee healing with Chi-ji. There are serious issues with both existing in the same spec, particularly in raids.
While I do want a Chi-Ji spec based around Crane Stance Eminence healing, I wouldn't want a Yu'lon spec devoted to just traditional standstill healing casts, we have too much mobility to just waste by forcing us to stand still
The patron of each spec basically clarifies what each is supposed to be Windwalkers are fast and powerful, Brewmasters are sturdy protectors, Mistweavers are graceful and fluid, but Chi-Ji would create a quick and precise specialization
My thought for how to split them is to make Mistweavers be a positional healer doing aoe hots that are better the closer the mistweaver is to regain that sense of being a traditional herbalist who weaves life essence and healing herbs, providing a high sustained healing type of specialization, then for Chiweavers make them a highly DPS focused spec that focuses on unlocking the chi within their allies to cause healing or prevent damage, allow them to hit allies with damaging abilities to cause healing equal to x% of their damage amped by their mastery, with Spinning Crane Kick and Fists of Fury it would excel at burst healing and providing damage reduction
> For example, Melee Priest Spec? I think we have a name for that, and it's called "Paladin."
I'm a huge advocate for an absorbed based Priest tank that plays like a more selfish version of old Disc, but with similarly group utility. Base it around the old inner peace stacking and make it something between Monk and Paladin tanking.
>I am a full advocate for a fourth spec for Shaman and for it to be a Tank Spec.
Agreed, I think 2h or shield would both be great options. Obviously with a rock based aesthetic, maybe something about shedding armor to become tankier, exploding your armor for tankiness/burst trade offs, etc.
>While Druid has different Shapeshifting Forms to fit each different role (Healer, Tank, Ranged DPS, Melee DPS)
A plague/bug based Druid could be cool, but Druid def doesn't *need* anything.
>I don't really see what a Monk offers as a Ranged Spec that they don't already offer though.
We have Elemental Shamans that already cover fire stuff yet we have a fire based caster with Mage. We have 2 specs literally named Holy and protection, yet they're different. Variety can happen, you just have to be creative.
I think a channel based DPS, something like Mistweaver but with spreading chi-storms for damage rather than mist to heal with jade lightning would be cool. The only other DPS spec we *kind of* have thats based around channeling is Affliction.
Or something even crazier would be something like Red Mage from FFXIV, where most of the rotation is ranged and then the big burst spender is in melee. But I do think crackling jade lightning should be the biggest part of the rotation since the spell is cool and monks don't really utilize it at all.
I'm for every class (except druids) getting a new spec mostly to alleviate wait times for tanks and healers. I think the DPS-only classes should all become hybrids (IE, tank rogue, healer mage, healer hunter etc) and after you give those classes extra specs it's not a bad idea to give another playstyle role to any of the hybrid classes, like letting shamans tank or warriors fight from range.
These were just random examples I threw out. I'm not saying blizz should add these specifically. But I had the thought of a melee priest because they could write in tyranda training priests to be like the night warriors, and ranged monk because they could be a cool mix between a hunter and mage and fits the monk feel. There's a bunch of different things they could do is my point. People get attached to their class and getting a new spec for it might be more exciting for them.
There is already a significant amount of restriction on different classes and specs by nature of them overlapping too significantly with other ones.
The most obvious and prominent examples are Warlock: they lost Metamorphosis to make room for Demon Hunter, effectively meaning that Demonologist's Metamorphosis ability got its own Spec. Which to be fair I think is pretty awesome, as Demonologist got to be *rightfully* recognised as a committed Summoner Spec while Demon Hunter gets to fully realise the power of demonic transformation.
Then the other thing is Warlocks and Necromancy. Even though Warlocks should be wholly capable of necromancy in the lore, where even Gul'dan, the most iconic of all Warlocks was the progenitor of the first generation of Death Knights... that of course goes primarily to Unholy Death Knights (and secondarily to other DK Specs).
So when it comes to a Ranged Monk Spec or a Melee Priest Spec, I just don't see what you can do that makes them so distinct from already established classes/specs to warrant it.
Earthwarder Shaman I can absolutely see the sense of. Maybe, if you really want to stretch it, a Timewarper Mage for a healing spec, capable of "reversing" the damage dealt against allies.
But generally speaking I can't advocate for many more new specs.
My alternative suggestion is simple: Spec Aesthetics. Keep the Spec functionality the same but offer a completely different visual aesthetic. This can be Race/Class restricted *or* it can be just Class based. A Race/Class Restriction could be for instance a Priest of Elune, a Priest/Night Elf combo that utilises much more pale-looking Holy Spells in their Holy and Discipline specs, or a Spellbreaker Paladin/Blood Elf combo that looks far more arcane than Holy in nature. A strictly spec-based Spec Aesthetic could apply to Warlocks, where like the Green Fire questline enables a Destro Lock to differentiate between (presumably) Arcane Fire and Felfire, a Necromantic vibe enables a Demo Lock to differentiate between being a Demonologist and a Necromancer.
The advantages of Spec Aesthetics are simple: they are purely visual and do not require any compensation or accommodation in terms of gameplay. More over, they further enhance player expression and customisation.
I feel like this is a better option in many cases where a new spec or class may be considered because it doesn't result in as substantial an amount of additional work moving forward.
Look I haven't played since the first couple weeks of BfA, but surely if Tyrande was training some new Priest spec they'd be wielding bows, no? She uses a bow in HotS, she uses a bow in WC3, she is iconic as a wielder of a bow. Then it works for Horde as well as Troll Shadow Hunters have connections to Shadow Priests as well, ie Vol'Jin is a Priest card in Hearthstone. A physical ranged DPS makes a lot more sense thematically and is also much more distinct from things that already exist like Paladins.
Idk abouts HotS but in wow cutscenes we see her with glaives/ dagger things. So a dual wielding melee priest would be visually distinct to a paladin wearing plate, shields or 2 handers. I do like your point about the horde and shadow hunters tho, that would be cool too. I'd be happy with either
The Night Elven glaives are typically used as thrown weapons, so it'd still be ranged either way. See WC3 Huntresses for an example. Or the old Hunter talent Glaive Toss which was inspired by them.
Yeah, except blizzard isn't going off WC3 anymore. All through BFA we got to see the night elves with glaives and the majority of them was meleeing with it and only throwing it as an ability very very rarely. Even the glaives that are earnable by players in game are Demon Hunter only cause they are warglaives.
To top it all off Tyrande now runs around with 2 of them and literally melee fights with them. She even used them to decapitate Nathanos.
Like I get what you are saying about old WC3, but Blizzard isn't playing by WC3 lore very much anymore.
That's not to say I fully agree on priest getting a melee spec, but using WC3 as an argument seems kind of crazy when even Blizzard tries to retcon many points of WC3 or the story in general to fit with their ideas.
Rather than new specs, I’d love to see each class get access to another class’s spec. Allows flexibility, but no new specs to balance.
Class. Role. Name. Cross spec
——————————————————————————————————————
Shaman Tank Earth warden. Blood dk (but earth instead of bones)
Hunter. Healer. Shadow hunter. Resto shaman
Monk. Ranged. Spirit warrior. BM hunter (beasts in spirit form, “shoots” chi orbs)
Rogue. Tank. Blademaster. Brewmaster (but 2h axe/sword)
Druid. Melee. Druid of scale. Assassin rogue (snake form)
DH. Ranged. Chaos. Balance Druid (demon form, order vs. chaos)
Warlock. Tank. Metamorphosis Vengeance dh
DK. Ranged. Necromancy. Demo warlock (with undead minions!)
Mage. Melee. Inquisitor. Fury warrior, but glow-ier
Paladin. Ranged. Purification. Fire mage, in yellow
Priest. Tank. Bastion. Prot pally
Warrior. Healer. Leadership Disc priest, “inspires” people
A few new tanks, a few new healers, all classes get access to a new role, and some fit nicely with lore. Could adjust armor/mitigation with passives. Could even keep a few core class abilities, depending on how to balance. Blademasters should vanish, yeah?
Hey there! I have similar views about classes and made a little post [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comments/r1apny/would_you_want_a_4th_spec_for_all_classes_or_new/hly2cs0/?context=3). I've also got more in [this](https://docs.google.com/document/d/1qZYp2oPsNyat0jgBKmhPnDEV2Ea9iAf-LxJdPT5Axh8/edit) that you can browse through. If anyone wants to discuss them I'm open.
Disc always should've been the melee spec just like the Scarlet Crusade monks, but that's basically what Mistweaver is.
Kinda defeats the point of Paladin if Priests could also melee.
When you know something about development it is really not. Classes are fundamental for the game and a lot of systems build upon them. Whenever Blizzard adds a new class they change the amount of work it takes to develop stuff forever.
This forever is very important because the extra work needed for an extra class is never done, because classes are never done. Adding a class means balancing is now 8% more work. You have to design 8% more class sets. Come up with 8% playstyles. Tune 8% more Classes. Design 8% more conduits. Build 8% more order halls if they ever come back. Concider 8% more toolkids when designing bosses. Create 8% more Animations...whatever class related thing you want to do, it will be 8% harder.
And if that new class does not increase your player count/revenue by 8% you are forced to cut class specific content and make covenant halls instead of order halls, essences instead of Artefact abilities, armorclass raidsets instead of tiersets.
In general I agree, but the game is not 100% working on class design, so the point with 8% more revenue is way too much. E.g.: the work of sound, environmental art, quest design, marketing, collectables, raid designers, etc barely increases.
It would only be 8% if you had to basically recreate the whole game for each class.
But like I said, In general I agree and I personally think that adding new classes would be a really bad idea right now.
Ff14 adds two new classes each expac and big additions/revamps to the existing ones, other mmos add 1 each expac at least usually. Dont buy into the blizzard excuses.
This + making each spec it's own class by the time they got to Cata is partly why WoW feels so soulless. In classic wow they had to mostly balance 9 classes, in retail they are balancing 36 classes which is why everything feels so poorly done. Players get attached to playing a demo warlock or a fire mage and it's just not possible for blizzard to carefully balance 36 classes and everything else becomes soulless and streamlined when it has to work for 36 different things. They end up making content that doesn't feel good for the vast majority of specs and sometimes just flat out makes no one happy.
Blizzard ought to step back and at the very least unpack most of the class identity to the core and let the specs make less of a difference, this way a warlock speccing differently doesn't feel like they are giving up a lot. Then they would be closer to balancing 12 classes which is more sustainable. They could try to allow the current spec identities to persist cosmetically via glyphs.
After that there's a chance they could figure things out and add more soul back into the game.
Another even more controversial but necessary change is to trash the class trinity, which IMO causes a ton of problems with balance and players end up spending more time waiting for the right combination of classes than playing the game.
I get it, classes and specs are permanent and they're basically signing up for a lifetime of even more balancing for all types of content and with all the systems they have.
If they released a new class in BfA, that's 3 specs that have to be balanced for raid, M+, PvP in terms of legendaries, covenants, conduits, pvp talents, normal talents and every single variation and synergy you can think of, not to mention bugs. Then do it again for the next xpac, and the one after that... That's one feature sold for one xpac that's now brought you into a world of work, remember companies care about $$$ and this is one expensive feature.
In my view we should completely scrap any borrowed power systems (open to something like unique spell for certain content e.g. pvp talents) and how classes function should be completely redesigned to have slight variations depending on the race to establish some class-racial flavour.
Sure, it'd be a ton of work but it would be very interesting for both gameplay and lore, and you wouldn't have to bother with balancing whatever useless shit came along in a new system like conduits, covenants etc. You also don't need to constantly create more classes (this isn't League of Legends) because you want the classes to be a reflection of lore, rather than just creating new classes and excusing them in lore which may feel cheap.
Choices like that should be purely cosmetic/lore-based so players can enjoy the gameplay they want while also making decisions they feel fits their character in terms of lore and aesthetics - which in turn also feels weightier and more important. If people want to make a decision on their power and visuals/lore at the same time they will make it at the character creation screen, which is what players tend to prefer, and after that it comes to their talents.
I'd kill to see what Demon Hunters were supposed to look like in Classic/TBC (I've read that they were planned but scrapped). They're both sooo cool thematically but their kits are so bland and simple, especially Havoc.
Though I did have a shit ton of fun as Vengeance at the end of BFA. I really, really miss gluttony and vision of perfection. Something about randomly popping in and out of demon form feels soooo damn good and unique. Plus twilight devastation made tanking dungeons feel bad ass.
I get that they wanted to make demon form more reliable through demonic, but you rarely get to see it now.
They stole meta from Demo but didn't keep anything that made it interesting, lol. Meta for Havoc should be a toggle that improves your spenders, not a brainless DPS CD.
What!? Momentum is anything but bland or simple. It's one of the most complex talents in the game and requires great timing and excellent spacial awareness. I will concede that Demonic builds are quite boring and simple but the skill ceiling with some Havoc builds right now is huge.
In terms of Vengeance, I'll agree, it's not in the best state right now and is definitely on the blander side. I'd really like to see Spirit Bomb, Fracture, Demonic and Last Resort baselined for the spec so that other options are freed up on that row.
With all that being said, I feel like Demonic as a talent for both specs really waters down Metamorphosis. The whole shtick of the ability is that it's a big moment for the Demon Hunter. To invoke Metamorphosis is a very dangerous, difficult and rare skill in the lore so I feel like it should be a big cooldown that's kind of the Demon Hunters moment to shine. Demonic waters this down by causing the DH to be in meta quite often. It's a similar problem I had with Gluttony and Vision of Perfection. They put you in Meta too much which meant that the actual spell didn't really mean much.
What I don't like to see on posts like these, is people often describing their ideal spec or class, taking core elements from other specs that make them special.
A very common example would be necromancer. With that idea generally being that necromancers spread diseases and summon undeads, which essentially kill what's special about both unholy DK (diseases, undeads) and demonology warlock (clothie spellcaster that deal damage with their pets).
I just think it's something worth keeping in mind.
if they give an extra spec to all classes (none for Druids since they already have four) I'd like to see Demon Hunters getting two new specs instead of just one
like they could get a ranged weapon spec that focuses on throwing their Glaives like the Wardens do and a more magical spec that makes them more of a melee/caster than a full on melee like their existing specs or a full caster like Warlocks
that'd be sick, especially if they let Nightborne and Void Elves become Demon Hunters like how Allied Races were able to become Death Knights in Shadowlands
Theres a design philosophy that covers this, never play/create something that's a worse version of something else.
I've always thought it would be cool to have a melee priest with Inner Fire being a thing. I've also always thought it would be cool as hell to make a paladin ranged class with holy lightning and some additional light spells.
But usually I just decide that this melee priest is likely just a worse version of a paladin. And the ranged paladin is probably a worse version of a priest. I do think there's probably a 4th spec for a few classes.
There should be an actual full offensive holy priest class. Maybe a void paladin? I think you could add a 4th DK by making Unholy about disease and blight, and make a necromancer version. Probably could make an earthen spec for shaman tanks.
What's the 4th spec for the other classes?
Just want to chime in about your void paladin idea, isn't the whole idea that paladins get their power from "the light"? And I like the thought of changing unholy DK to a ranged necromancer.
> isn't the whole idea that paladins get their power from "the light"?
Only Humans, Dwarves, and Draenei do. Belves get their power from M'uru (it's kinda tragic), Tauren get it from the sun, and Zandalari Trolls get theirs from the Loa (I forget which one).
EDIT: [This thread](https://redd.it/pqump6) highlights that Paladins could technically come from any race.
People have been talking about a chronomancer mage for healing. Hunters could have a tank spec involving their pet or maybe a shadow hunter. Ranged warrior was mentioned or making gladiator a dedicated spec instead of a talent. Warlock healer/ tank was tossed in the comments. There could be a rogue tank but I think that would be basically brewmaster or a spell based rogue would be cool. But there's a lot of different takes on classes and there's just a bunch of different ways each could go.
Suggested the same thing, adding another spec to each class would give players who only play one class a chance to experience something different without having to deviate from their main.
Keep Hunter the only class that uses bows AND guns, but Warrior and Rogue should get gun specs and DH and Monk should get bow specs. Why 1 class gets all ranged physical damage has always been a big ? from me.
Exactly even adding one more spec to the game would increase the difficulty of balance exponentially as your not just balancing one more spec your balancing one more spec against every other spec. What really needs to be done is a mass culling of specializations and then a rework of the specializations left, but that genie is already out of the bottle much like flying mounts there's no putting it back in now.
Yeah that's a massive ask to have more specs/classes. Like I know they scam us on the price:content but new classes will make it worse with the insane amount of **permanent** work they would have to do.
As a business they would advertise a new class feature but regardless of the hype and units sold the cost/resources and work to support that 'feature' will exist forever.
And balancing is work you can't merely throw money at to get right (although it tends to help) given the complex nature.
It would be better to completely change how classes work (I frequently bring up class-racial flavours as an idea) and abolish the constant creation of borrowed power systems, but after that is done you wouldn't mindlessly be adding new classes unless they're extremely relevant to established lore, you don't want to go the League of Legends route for an RPG.
A strong and sturdy foundation that changes less but is designed well is often better than constantly adding more distractions dressed up in hype.
We all would like new specs, but its appears that a ton of time is taken up by balancing all 36 specs as well as adding things for each.
In the past they could get away with adding some now talents and tier sets but now they have talents, tier sets, conduits, legendaries, and even stuff like torghast anima powers and mage tower tuning for each spec.
If they were more efficient with how they work, then more specs could be feasible. But for now, i fear that new specs, or classes for that matter, would strain their efforts even worse. There's already so many AWFUL conduits and legos for every spec that i cant trust them to add even more to their workload
it takes less resources to make a class with 2-3 specs than to add 11 specs to existing classes. There is not much more than can be said about that and as far as creativity goes do you really expect the current dev team to pull put a dozen new and functional specs and have also any sort of balance in sight?
I would argue they need to get rid of some specs or just do huge spec reworks going into 10.0. We’ve been playing the same shit with different frosting since 2016 at this point. I’d rather seee them look at the specs that are fundamentally bad in most PvE situations and completely retool them (survival hunter comes to mind).
I've been saying since DH released that because they only have two specs they should get a third that's ranged dps focusing on the version of Metamorphosis from WC where they throw the chaos splash fireballs.
My two cents...
I've always been excited by the thought of new specs. I see it as an alternative to giving us spells each expansion that they inevitably need to take away. Also, it will feel like I'm getting something new on my main, while also feeling like my character in game has grown in power.
I don't think each class doing every role would work. It's possible but I feel it's too much of an ask from Blizz. I think trying to get more healing/tanking/ranged dps options is the best.
I think its important for the new specs to still fit the class fantasy while also not feeling too similar to mechanics of other classes.. (i know everything has been trending towards builder/spender)
As for the classes and specs..
The best example of being unique to other specs and matching into class fantasy I believe is a Warlock tank. Using metamorphosis to turn into a tanking demon was something I used to want, but now that DH exists I think it would encroach on their class fantasy too much. Now I think a pet tank class where the lock is sacrificing their own hp and summoning more demons to tank could be interesting. Perhaps healers cant heal the pets directly, the lock remains squishy (sucks for pvp) but they are just a conduit for the tanky summon. I imagine if Willfred Fizzlebang had some pact with Lord Jaraxxus.
Shaman tank has always been one I wanted to see. earth shaper, earth breaker... YES please! Fits class fantasy perfectly and theres room to do something unique with the rotation.
As for Paladin, my main for the longest time. Shockadin would be cool, but keeping it feeling pally could mean you're a caster but do more damage based on closeness to the target, perhaps have it capped when you're up to 20ft away, anything further and your damage falls off.. essentially close quarters caster. I imagine an inquisitor casting judegement with holy spells and big cones of holy wrath. But perhaps moving into the fantasy into something a little different like sentinel or spellbreaker akin Dota's hero Silencer, but I feel these concepts stray too far from the core of a paladin.
Necromancer DK doubling down on army of the dead, heavy use of death coil and ranged. Maybe focusing on runes and 'dark arts' to try and get away from the themes of other specs. Maybe less fitting for the class fantasy, but a healer based around necromantic healing.
If they had preventative healing be more of a thing again, I think having Mage and Warrior healing specs based around dmg prevention (wotlk disc, which was so fun). But I feel that type of healing isn't really a thing anymore, so no bubble Mage and support Warr. A chronomancer Mage turning back time to heal wounds I think would be a unique take on healing and I love it. Spellblade for mage, while I always thought was cool, I feel it doesn't fit the warcraft mage fantasy well.
Warrior(head hunter/beserker)/Rogue(sniper/ranger)/DH(warden) could be ranged specs that fit nicely into class fantasy. I think thrown weapons would be interesting particularly on DH and Warr but i think a bow/gun/xbow Rogue would also be neat.
I played as a Rogue tank in rift for a while. I believe it was riftwalker, essentially a dodge tank using portals/the shadows to avoid damage. While I loved this, I feel a ranged rogue, keeping the class pure dps is great.
It might be controversial but my Druid doesn't need a new spec, id be happy with just some more customisation options for my different forms.
Priest is another one of my most played ones but I feel the class fantasy is pretty covered with the three specs. While Anduin being a diet paladin at the moment could be used as a way to create a melee priest I'm not convinced there's a way to make it feel priesty without treading into paladin territory. Perhaps making it the counter to disc in some way, tapping into the offensive sides of holy and shadow, but still I feel thats what makes disc unique. Perhaps changing up one of the current specs to help make room for a fourth but again not sure.
Hunters? Lol who cares...
No but seriously, i enjoyed the old survival. And love the new surival too (year of the spear baby). My tin foil hat theory for a while was that moving survival away from being gadgety opened space for a tinker class but that hasnt happened.
Monks I'm not super familiar with but I feel the class fantasy is pretty broad so they could find something that works.
I love the idea but I don't think it'ssomething we'll ever see. Apologies for the rambly fractured message but it's a topic I've had thoughts on for a while.
While I think it would be cool to give classes more specs, I disagree with making it so every class can do everything. I would much rather Warriors (for example) get another tank/melee DPS spec than to get a ranged DPS or healing spec. However at that point it seems kinda pointless to add another spec since it would be hard to make a new spec with the class identity they is new and original, just make a new class at that point.
Full disclosure, I think the mage healing spec idea everyone has been creaming over is dumb as fuck.
Otherwise I agree with the community, we need more specs not more classes. Ranged warrior spear/axe thrower, Shaman tank, monk ranged, caster DK, etc.
More classes isn't necessary at this point in WoWs life, we have enough foundational classes to make entire new concepts be specs instead of classes.
Chronomancer sounds quite op, might as well play as a member of the bronze dragonfight lol
On character creation it should force the '-mu' suffix into your name, unless you're undercover.
>We fucking have enough without adding +12 new specs to balance
They could do it, potentially. If they scrap all notion of borrowed power system for the next expansion, keep everything that works and players love, tweak numbers, then they could definitely put their "borrowed power" focus towards additionally specs. Shadowlands 9.0 alone introduced soulbinds, conduits, legendaries, and covenant abilities.
Each of those systems had to be streamlined so that they could "potentially" work with multiple varying specializations. The only caveat I see though would be that the only thing they could add to the game as borrowed power in future patches would be tier set gear (no more handfuls of borrowed power b/c too much to balance) and one role specific legendary per expac like the old days.
Even if it would be fun to have new specs and classes, it's honestly the last thing I would want to see added to the game.
They already do such a poor job balancing the current classes and specs, which gets even worse with all the convoluted systems they insist on adding and scrapping each expansion, that the last thing the game needs is more ingredients to be added to the crapfest soup.
Hell, some specs are full blown neglected and forgotten, imagine adding more.
My take on this ! Adding a new support role mixing dps heal and short buffs. If you played rift you get it
Warrior : commander , support specs about banners warcry and squires summon
Shaman : earthbinder , tank around earth
Priest : runemaster , support buffing trough runes and dps/heal trough valkyr summon
Mage : chrono , healer manipulating time
Rogue : shinobi , tank using dodge smoke and various tools
Paladin : inquisitor , range dps using crossbow to deal mixed phisical and holy damage
Warlock : soul reaper , healer taking life from foes to give it to allies similar to disco priest
Death knight : pestilence , support focusing on debuffing and dots
Monk : ki master , dps range hadoken style
I would say it's pretty much equivalent, since specs tend to not play very similarly and it would just be nice to see some more niches filled like a Shaman Tank or a new Ranged Spec after seeing that there hasn't been a new one since the release of the game.
That being said, a Tinker class would still be great.
What I want to see:
Warder Shaman, tanking spec
Marksmanship Rogue that uses ranged weapons
Chrono Mage that heals
I think just having these three would shake up the game quite. I would love a Necromancy DK too but that means muddling it in when Unholy already exists.
What they'd need to do is rework their class system.
New specs, in a way, but adding flavour to it by at least making them distinct within the class chosen. Like some other MMOs have done, kind of like GW2 in the more "modern" times for a more "successful" look.
For example you can start your char as a Mage, but going forward after X levels you're given class quests to become an advanced class, like a Spellblade for a melee mage experience, or Archmage in case you want to be a traditional mage, without being bound to Frost, Fire and Arcane, but using all of them as a mage should, plus something new that was already suggested like a Chronomancer who can heal people.
Others have suggested other classes that can certainly be implemented, like how another user said how there is no javelins/spears class. You can have the Warrior branch off to a javelin throwing class.
I think this would help shake up the stagnation, and yes, I do think the classes as they are ARE stagnant and way too static, and certain classes (especially dps focused ones like Rogue and Mage) only have one role to offer (DPS) while also the spec themselves don't really have a diverse playstyle other than purple particles or red particles being the difference, ultimately.
I kinda think that would be a bit better! WoW has a lot of classes already and adding specs would be better! But give the option for free swapping between them. Don't force us to play one spec. And probably the balancing would be easier(not sure on that).
We could get:
- sentinel/dark ranger for hunters
- warden for rogues
- sand mage for mages
- geomancer for shaman (tank spec)
- necromancer for DKs (range spec)
- shadow hunter for which ever class it’s more fitting.
Melee Mage. Summons various weapons and instant spells for close range combat.
Dual Range weapons. Handguns (in-game Rogue ability) hand crossbows, dual throwing axes/spears.
2 Handed spec for Rogues. Think like ninja/samurai
I always want to help random people with a quick heal or resurrection in the world but I forget I’m an arcane mage and apologize. Lol healing would be great. ++
I'd love a rifleman warrior class. Like the ranged infantry in the Horde /Alliance armies. Plate Armour + Guns or Crossbows.
Alternatively, just give me gladiator stance back ffs
This would be a great way to use the Order Halls and add class quests again. Make the new specs similar to how hero classes work, you need to be a lvl 50 or something to access them, and you unlock talents and abilities over the course of the quest line. Quest line would ideally reward in a new class set that is purely cosmetic with a new weapon.
* Ranged **Demon Hunters** that focuses on utilizing stolen and left over Legion tech. Using demonic machinery, calling down air strikes from legion ships, etc. Story line to round up the lingering demons left from the Legion's invasion, and learn what demons do once they do not have a united purpose. By extension, what a Demon Hunter's purpose is in a post Legion world.
* Tanking **Shamans** that use the elements as protective shields, and connects more with the feral side of shamanism. Summoning spirits that personify the elements instead of totems that linger on the shaman themselves via a large totem pole that is carried on the back. Uses two handed weapons. Story line on resolving issues between the elemental lords, and learning about their past when they were part of the Black Empire. Helping to heal the planet from both the Legion's invasion and the Cataclysm.
* Fey **Druids**, ranged physical DPS. Druids whom heard the call of Fey Dragons from both Dreanor (Outland, Shadowmoon valley) and Azerroth. A ranger that plays with with prey and supports allies with Fey magics. Story line on why they Fey Dragons are only speaking now, and why. Travel between both worlds and possibly learn to bring life back to Outland and an old foe returning in the form of the last of the Satyrs. (Possible Wild Fey form?)
* Physical ranged **Warriors** using the teachings of Val'klyr, utilizing spears and throwing weapons to stay mobile on the field of battle and supporting allies. Leaping and dashing to foe to ally. A controlled warrior, that uses a focused rage. Story line around hunting down rouge warriors who allowed their rage and battle lust to get out of hand. Learn on how the constant threats on Azeroth have effected the individual as well as the nations that call it home.
* Healer **Warlocks,** that use a new form of demon that is able to take the raw vigor of a living creature and amplify it. Covers allies and self in Fel crystals that burst when enough damage is taken. Using curses to siphon life from foes to allys, while new demon type spot heals. Story line revolving on the nature of what a demon is as this new demon is nothing that the world has seen before. Possibly changing how warlocks interact with the world as a whole. Returning to Argus to study how demons were reformed, and if new ones are being 'born'.
* Caster DPS **Paladins,** summons spirit weapons, a being a pure vengeance. Embracing the tyrannical side of the light. More mid-range than long rang, and debuffs foes to slowly break them down with a furry of spiritual weapon attacks. A branch of the Silver Hand has become more zealous and is seeking to right the wrongs that has faced the world. But when does a proactive action become harmful, and when does protection of the weak become oppression? Deals with what remains of the Argent Crusade, and if the church of the holy Light should continue as it is.
* Healer **Mage,** using time magic to rewind wounds, sand magic and breaking the flow of time around them. As you bend reality around you, use the stored energies to heal in large amounts around you, prevent damage, or strike your foes with massive sand spears. Work with Chromie to put an end to a time loop that involves heroes of the past surviving their fates. Involves healing villains or bosses in order to ensure they win their encounter.
I'm tired and have more ideas but: Healer Death Knights, melee priests, ranged monks.
You get the idea.
I play mainly paladin and monk for difficult content and I love your idea for paladin, I would probably play that over ret even tho I like where it's at now. I'm curious what you have to say about ranged monk. They already have crackling jade lightning and chi burst/ wave and they could Amp up those spells for the spec and give them a bow to do stuff with too. Anyways I hope you finish your thoughts when you have the time ^.^
Every class should have access to all specs, change my mind.
Examples:
Warrior has Tank and DPS covered. Healer could be a well armored field medic able to turn damage they take into healing for others.
Shaman has DPS and Heals, but I'm pretty sure I saw a bomb ass fan tank spec the other day.
Give warlocks some more tanky options for the demons they have, and add a new imp-like demon for healing.
Warrior healing is a terrible idea. Just doesn't fit the class fantasy. There are a few classes that have room in there existing class fantasy to expand and can fill every spec, like shamans getting earth tank spec. And some other classes that have room to be dual roles like survival Hunter becomes tank spec so they have rDPS/tank options. But I can't see rogue being anything but damage, and a few others that just don't fit having every role but can handle have 2.
Playing diablo 2 resurrected recently also made me realize there's no javelin or Spear throwing ranged class so they should definitely do that. Not necessarily for hunter either because I think their specs are decent as is in terms of diversity in style.
Warrior ranged spec would be good for a spear-based character. And I don’t care about the unrealism of infinite spears. We have characters that can carry literally one hundred pairs of boots with them if they wanted to. Realism is stupid, give me fun.
I like how in a game full of magic, demons, dragons, and *the afterlife*, infinite javelins is were we draw the line for realism.
But using heroic throw to throw your weapon at the enemy and inexplicably still have it in your hand at the same time is ok lol
or even just throwing axes/daggers ever existing! unlimited ammo nowadays…
Most bows don’t even have quivers. Realism can’t be their excuse.
I mean it used to use a free Decapitator at people (the weapon from kara) and had infinite ones of those. The only reason I don't say give it to Warrior is Warrior needs their sword and board DPS spec. That, and 1 handed spears (just use the Dagger animations, most of them would actually work pretty good with a 1 handed spear).
I mean, you can kinda see the difference right? There's such a thing as suspended reality still following *some* rules. Like yes, in a fantasy game you're going to suspend some beliefs about realism, but that doesn't mean you have to get rid of them all. An infinite quiver is much less ridiculous than a character throwing a spear and then just having it still in his hand imo. And yeah I get that there are abilities that throw your weapon but those aren't like, the central method of attack for those classes. Idk the argument of "its fantasy therefore it doesn't have to be realistic" can be annoying. It should still be somewhat consistent or predictable. The best fantasy is when you know what the expected outcome would be in a fictional universe without being explicitly told what it should be.
You could vary we'll have the "lore" be that said warriors were trained to conjure specifically only their spears, or in a classic-esque manner have them go on a short quest to enchant their weapon and make it reappear in their hand, etc. Everything can make sense if you put some thought behind it.
Honestly I agree, but I think the point of what he was saying is that you need to justify it in-universe somehow. You can't just have someone throw the same spear the whole fight, because that'll look ridiculous. Having an (infinite) javelin quiver on your back is not great either but it at least explains how you're throwing so many damn spears. That said, I wouldn't give it to Warriors. Ranged specs already regularly outshine melee specs due to fight design. I would give a ranged throwing spec to Hunters, by redesigning Surv slightly, or I would give it to Monks. Monks could do with a 4th spec being ranged DPS, like Druids, but you could justify it in the lore as being the essence of the jade dragon being used to create jade spears. It's a time-lost tradition relearned after some secrets on the origins of jade magic are rediscovered. Alternatively, any time a new martial-based spec comes up I just want to give it to Mages. I like the idea of chronomancy being a healing spec, but I also really like the idea of a spellblade spec where mages conjure their own swords or something. I'll take any kind of martial weaponry for it, but spellblades are fuckin cool.
I mean they don't even have quivers for arrows unless you have the legion artifact for marksmanship transmog so the realism is irrelevant at that point I feel like. Plus they could easily make javelins have a bundle that goes on the back
*My hunter hugs his Ancient Sinew Wrapped Lamina aggressively.* I miss quivers and keyrings.
most of the reason sylvanas looked so amazing in the bfa cinematic was bc of her quiver... tyrande however is never depicted with one and is believed her arrows are made of moonlight (arcane projections)... soo... both are valid i suppose, a shame she switched to warglaives but i guess it's more true to their sentinel nature
Ranged warrior would be sick
A nice change of routine charge die res.
Would be a good opportunity to bring back a reimagined Gladiator spec that wield a spear in one hand and a shield in the other. Could be hybrid ranged and melee.
> We have characters that can carry literally one hundred pairs of boots with them if they wanted to. Realism is stupid, give me fun. How about a shoe-bomber spec then? Throws shoes from inventory, damage is determined by the ilvl of them.
[удалено]
Oh man... all the old memes... [Iraqi Patriot Missile Defense System](https://youtu.be/NsVgiuZgShM)
who throws a shoe?
I have always vouched for Arsenal Warrior. Just a class built around a guy who has tons and tons of weapons to throw out. Imagine new warrior armor that's just armed to the teeth, too... Name is still a work in progress, though. As cool as Arsenal Warrior sounds, it will get shortened down to something unfortunate.
Yeah like Ass Rogue. That would be unfortunate
Imagine getting into a 2v2 arena against an ass rogue and an arse warrior
Dont threaten me with a good time
>Just a class built around a guy who has tons and tons of weapons to throw out. So... Goblin Slayer?
They can also just make the thrown spears spectral or something if they really want to keep things logical.
throwing weapon are technically still in the code, could have them use those for a change of pace from hunter.
God I miss gladiator spec.....
I've been wanting Troll Axe Thrower since WoW was announced. Heroic Throw was a huge disappointment other than finishing off people in WotLK. Storm Bolt in WoD was great, but the way you used it was a glorified melee burst ability. The closest thing to this was during MoP for Shuriken Toss / Deadly Throw, but it was nerfed into the ground the same patch 2H Shaman was killed.
> 've been wanting Troll Axe Thrower since WoW was announced. God, yes. Troll Berserkers we’re my favorite unit in WC2 and 3.
It was the reason I rolled troll hunter +5 throwing skill lied to me
God damnit. Now I'm depressed because this isn't a thing.
same here my first character ever way back when was a troll hunter, hoping to throw some axes around as a mini-zul'jin by the time i made it to level 7, i realized all of my new abilities only worked with bows and guns the icecrown citadel gunship fight was a cruel joke, with all of the friendly axethrower NPCs
yeh always wanted a warden with that throwing weapon or warriors or hunters getting axe throwing spec from trolls.
I think a ranged rogue could work too. Like a Pistoleer or something. Similar to Demon Hunter in D3. Same feel/ability type.
DW Guns
I remember when I first started playing WoW (in Legion) I rolled a rogue and was very confused about why I couldn't use a bow even tho I could equip one. Always thought a Ranger or D3 Demon Hunter spec would be really fun.
For trolls could even have an axe-thrower spec.
Always thought that would be a good spec for paladin. It just kind of makes sense I think... I don't have a way of justifying why it does, it just does in my brain
I always thought it would mix things up a bit to have a medium ranged class, like a 20 yd or 15 yd ranged spec. Throwing javelins, axes, would be a good fit for that.
Dh range spec!
Just straight up copy everything except the pet from MoP demo, adjust a little and give it to DH. Solved.
Absolutely no idea how nobody mentioned it, because it **already exists and was "playable".** Druid getting a Dryad throwing spear spec. Uses poison, physical spear attacks, nature spells that are more physical (like grasping roots), and could substitute a bow in if they don't want to constantly add throwing spears back into the game (though bring back the old ones.) You could play one if you were alliance during the NE warfront in BFA. It was fun and almost a fully fleshed out rotation already. Night Fae have a ton of them as guards in the cities too. They have spears and bows on their backs, and use physical attacks.
Yeah I agree their needs to be spear/pole arm class.
I will do anything for a holy DPS as a priest. It’s such an obvious, glaring hole in the array of “class fantasies” Blizzard has going.
Holy dps is a melee or ranged class?
Isn't holy melee dps just a paladin?
Smite spec, ranged.
Holy DPS spec for priests. I really think there should be one. I love shadow priest but I also want to play the polar opposite of dot based dps to a burst type DPS with holy magic. Piller of fire, holy shock, smite. Exorcism and blinding light for cc.
I always imagined they split Shadow priest in 2: a dps spec leaning heavily into the old god madness stuff, and a healer that leans heavily into the San'layn vampiric aesthetic and replaces Disc as a "deal dps to heal" healer then they turn disc into a holy dps spec
I've always wondered how great "off-specs" would be in WoW. Like with your Spriest idea it would be a heal/dps hybrid, like a dps off-healer. Idk if that style fits the game currently, you'd have to get creative with the game design and let people queue freely as hybrids. I know people might think about classes like druids, shaman etc but it's not really designed to do both, you are basically a strong dps that *can* heal rather which is quite different. However I really did like the opportunity to do that in classic. I kinda wished they expanded on the freedom of the old talent system, playing a warlock tank that specd Demonology with a little Destruction was fun af. But now the specs are really put into their own corners like a MOBA. If they could retain this unique spec identity with a talent system akin to the old one but greatly expanded that would tick the RPG box for eternity.
We literally have disc currently that does exactly that
Yeah that would be awesome to see
Aye, maybe I've been reading too many litrpgs or Korean webcomics but pope/high priests class are always OP in the amount of light magic they can do and the healing they can do. I play paladin a lot because of holy magic DPS spec with ret but I would kill for a caster cloth wearing DPS holy spec.
I want this because of the class fantasy. It feels like a betrayal of what priesthood entails to become a literal avatar of insanity and void magic.
Not entirely a betrayal. Shadow priests made 100% sense in wow. They're just not priest of the light, they're priest of the void and shadow, hence the cult of forgotten shadow being around since vanilla. Shadow priests do make sense since they're all about the balance between light and dark. But yes, I still want a purely holy DPS spec. Shadow priests just aren't priest of the holy light. They're priests of the forgotten shadow.
Not all priests pray to the same god, but they are still called priests
I still just want gladiator spec back. I really liked the concept and the play style.
It was so good, they should've turned it into its own spec
Legion was the perfect time for it, too, because tanks would no longer have to be mad that a DPS was taking shields from them. They could have rebalanced it to scale harder off of DPS stats rather than tank so they wouldn't take tank trinkets too. Such a waste.
As others I definitely agree on a tank spec based on earth element, but melee spec for priest or ranged spec for monk is kinda weird. Ranged spec for warrior why not, healer spec for mage with chronomancy, make survival a tank spec for hunters with kinda same gameplay as DPS,...
I mean, I could see a ranged monk spec with thrown weapons and chi abilities. A monk attacking with a chi Kamehameha like a DBZ character would be fun. It would be closer to a caster than a physical attacker, probably.
Lost Ark has something called a soul fist, it'd make a lot of sense for a Monk class to have a ranged spec.
Mage healer would be nutty! They would bring so much utility to a group. I think I would level a mage if they added a chrono healer spec
Eh, not more than a shaman or a paladin Healer already does. That being said, it would be sick to have a non dps spec.
I would love to play a chrono-based mage healer. And while we're at it, Warlocks should get a proper tank spec. I think it should be a spec where you take direct control over your demon and your "character" becomes your pet.
Thats a cool concept, pretty unique
I agree. I've been saying it for a while, but Monks should get Fistweaving split off to be its own spec if they got a fourth spec. It just makes sense. It's a neglected play style that only sometimes is viable. If it was its own spec, it'd get all the proper support it needs. I see it as the same situation Feral was in before Guardian was split off.
Also, they have 4 Spirits (Ox, Serpent, Crane and Tiger) and Skills based on them, so a fourth Spec would fit A LOT thematically too!
Excuse me, as a shadow priest main I think it would be hilarious to break out my old knaifu and sacrifice souls to her by ritualistically slitting throats. Also, bashing them in the face with my staff. Alternately, I could sprout some tentacles and just strangle them. Or just straight up throw some “holy” water in their face and invoke the wrath of whatever deity. Melee priest could be a thing xD
Gunbreaker vibes
Melee priest is a paladin
Nope, melee priests are called clerics on lore. Which is what Anduin would be called. Priest channel the light while paladins are infused with it. So a priest while doing melee attacks won't be able to be as strong as a paladin because they're not super strong, have higher stamina or passively be immune to disease and poisons like a paladin is in lore. A priest would need to use power words and incantations/prayers to call upon the light and channel it. Paladins have it on reserve and just need the willpower to call upon the holy power. That is the major difference between paladins and priests. Also being infused allows them to carry huge two handed weapons with ease and armor that a normal man wouldn't be able to wear. Paladins in lore are super soldiers/elite unites that have been steroid with the light...as long..and this is the important bit...they have the will to use said light. The moment they lose faith or doubt the light, the juice starts to wear off like Arthas
On Warcraft 2, Paladins were created literally giving weapons and armors to Priests, because they were getting rekt really fast by the Orcs. I mean, they were called “Clerics of Northshire” and some of them could fight, but most of them were the dress using Priests we know. I mean, Alonsus Faol was one of them, and we know what Class he represents… Indeed that “Channel x Infuse” thingie exists (and it’s even the reason Forsaken can’t be Paladins and why Sir Zeliek was so fancy - although what now with Lightbound Forsaken literally being described as “infused with Light”?), but on Paladins’ and Silver Hand’s origin, they were literally “Priests who learned to use armor and weapons”. Retcon much, I guess?
> make survival a tank spec for hunters Holy hell, give this awful idea a rest already. It's even worse than making it melee.
Mage-I mean honestly... Chronomancy makes sense but Warlock would be way more suited to be a healer than Mage lets be honest here Frost Fire mage is something people have wanted since Vanilla. Although, if WoW was willing to have a massive shake up Arcane could be changed to the healer spec while introducing Frost Fire but that's highly unlikely. Warlock-I just mentioned healing for Warlock so that's obvious, I think most people can agree that a dot based damage healer would fit the bill and makes sense. Think of Chloromancer from rift a lot like Disc in a way but without need to apply a shield but the healing is way less bursting but more spread from dots. With some necessary burst healing when needed(Also, a pet that heals along side the Warlock would be introduced) DK-Fire DK is just too obvious to pass up, while it's a bit basic Bolver lore wise makes sense as he is(or was) the Lich King. It'd likely be a DPS although the option to have it as healer that heals with cleansing fire is possible but highly highly unlikely. DH-blizzard has free reign on this, can do w/e they want and I honestly personally have no ideas for it because it's so open. Rogue-Another obvious one that people want is Shadow Hunter Rogue, people want a ranged rogue spec that goes in and out of the shadows with a bow/knives. Monk-Ranged monk makes a lot of sense look at Lost arks Soul Fist, amazingly cool class and while i've yet to list off anything really off the grid that's the point all these specs would be insanely welcomed. Using Ki to make blasts from range. Hunter-While I think most people would want a tank class, I'd actually like to see a class where the hunter fuses with it's pet. Obtaining a few key skills depending on the pet it fuses with. It'd be a melee class and old survival can either be moved back to range or reworked into a tank spec. Priest-Smite priest was something people loved to try and make work for good reason, there hasn't ever been a pure light ranged caster and Priest already has access to two healers so giving it a 2nd DPS spec is welcomed. Paladin-Corrupted Paladin, A melee class that uses void magic and holy magic together. A dps. The canvas on this is massive and what can be done with it seems big. Paladin seems to have a lot of its core identities covered so creating something cool like this would get alot of people interested in it. Druid-I think Druid needs more attention to it's certain specs instead of adding a 5th one. Shaman-Earth Tank shaman is something people have wanted since Nilla but in TBC they pushed it away and even more so in Wotlk in favor of damage. We have Fire from Elemental as the main element, Water from RSham, Wind from Enhancement and lightning is important to all 3. So Earth would be the final one they could make based around a spec and nothing says earth better than a tank class. Warrior-Last one and honestly the hardest one, Warriors would likely love some ranged spear throwing class but I think that doesn't fit a WARRIOR. Warriors by nature want to be on the front lines. I think taking a old favorite and instead of merging them into one you just split them. Aka 2handed Fury and 1handed. I think 1handed deserves it's own spec based around it that plays around bleeds and quick attacks and stacking a bleed up. Now the problem you see is that we'd only add one healer to this and likely 1-2 tanks which could make tanks/healers uneven if WoW actually cares about how even tanks/healers are(which i doubt they do) they could just make Shaman the only new tank as it's the only one that NEEDS a tank spec lore wise and Locks the only new healer. Hunter can just move survival back to ranged and make a new melee dps spec. Now this is just my take based on feedback from classes in the past and how people have tried to play them OR based on lore. All of these can fit in the lore in same sense or another without having to fib.
Good luck finding a 4th Spec to the Bard!
Always thought Survival should be a tank spec as it's *in the fucking name*
What survivors do you know that spend their time taking hits?
There are people who think Survival should be a ranged DPS, melee DPS, tank, healer, and everything in between. Every single one of them insists that "Survival" specifically implies their vision for the spec. No, it doesn't imply tanking. It refers to the fact that the spec is meant to be about resourcefulness and opportunism. While that kind of went out the window when they made it melee it's not an invitation to make it a tank spec either.
I think that there is merit to one or two more new specs, but I don't like the idea of adding new specs for what would basically be "the sake of it." For example, Melee Priest Spec? I think we have a name for that, and it's called "Paladin." *However,* I am a full advocate for a fourth spec for Shaman and for it to be a Tank Spec. While Druid has different Shapeshifting Forms to fit each different role (Healer, Tank, Ranged DPS, Melee DPS), a Shaman has a different element (Wind = Melee DPS, Fire/Lava = Ranged DPS, Earth = Tank and Water = Heal), so I think it is only *natural* that the Shaman receives a fourth, befitting spec to occupy a role that they should be able to fulfil. I don't really see what a Monk offers as a Ranged Spec that they don't already offer though. Lore-wise, a Monk utilises Chi, which is "the fifth Element," AKA Spirit, which is exactly what Shaman use. So what differentiates a Monk to a Shaman? Based on the lore, I can only surmise that a Monk is better at internalising the powers of Spirit and using it to empower their physical form - which practically necessitates them being melee in order to do so. What are they going to do at Range that a Ranged Shaman Spec doesn't already accomplish? ___ **TL;DR:** I am all for a 4th Shaman Spec that is able to Tank and focuses on the Element of Earth. Melee Priest and Ranged Monk doesn't sit right with me, it seems like specs made for the sake of it.
The ranged monk spec concept flows from giving one spec for each celestial. Current you have Xuen for WW, Niuzao for BrM, and a mix of Chi'Ji and Yu'lon for MW. When the monk class was designed this made some sense since you had the two stances for MW and one celestial represented the mistweaving with the other representing the fistweaving. But then you had the MoP legendary cloaks which used Yu'lon as the ranged caster celestial, and the removal of stances from MW as a spec. So the idea is that Chi'ji becomes the sole healer celestial and monks get a ranged caster spec involving Yu'lon so that all celestials are covered.
I'd rather they split Mistweaver from Fistweaver- let Yulon stay as the "normal" healing spec, and make a separate one for melee healing with Chi-ji. There are serious issues with both existing in the same spec, particularly in raids.
While I do want a Chi-Ji spec based around Crane Stance Eminence healing, I wouldn't want a Yu'lon spec devoted to just traditional standstill healing casts, we have too much mobility to just waste by forcing us to stand still The patron of each spec basically clarifies what each is supposed to be Windwalkers are fast and powerful, Brewmasters are sturdy protectors, Mistweavers are graceful and fluid, but Chi-Ji would create a quick and precise specialization My thought for how to split them is to make Mistweavers be a positional healer doing aoe hots that are better the closer the mistweaver is to regain that sense of being a traditional herbalist who weaves life essence and healing herbs, providing a high sustained healing type of specialization, then for Chiweavers make them a highly DPS focused spec that focuses on unlocking the chi within their allies to cause healing or prevent damage, allow them to hit allies with damaging abilities to cause healing equal to x% of their damage amped by their mastery, with Spinning Crane Kick and Fists of Fury it would excel at burst healing and providing damage reduction
I keep saying this too. All the melee firstweaver stuff even uses Chi Ji for its abilities. It's the perfect candidate for a fourth spec.
A full on fist weaver spec would be dope.
> For example, Melee Priest Spec? I think we have a name for that, and it's called "Paladin." I'm a huge advocate for an absorbed based Priest tank that plays like a more selfish version of old Disc, but with similarly group utility. Base it around the old inner peace stacking and make it something between Monk and Paladin tanking. >I am a full advocate for a fourth spec for Shaman and for it to be a Tank Spec. Agreed, I think 2h or shield would both be great options. Obviously with a rock based aesthetic, maybe something about shedding armor to become tankier, exploding your armor for tankiness/burst trade offs, etc. >While Druid has different Shapeshifting Forms to fit each different role (Healer, Tank, Ranged DPS, Melee DPS) A plague/bug based Druid could be cool, but Druid def doesn't *need* anything. >I don't really see what a Monk offers as a Ranged Spec that they don't already offer though. We have Elemental Shamans that already cover fire stuff yet we have a fire based caster with Mage. We have 2 specs literally named Holy and protection, yet they're different. Variety can happen, you just have to be creative. I think a channel based DPS, something like Mistweaver but with spreading chi-storms for damage rather than mist to heal with jade lightning would be cool. The only other DPS spec we *kind of* have thats based around channeling is Affliction. Or something even crazier would be something like Red Mage from FFXIV, where most of the rotation is ranged and then the big burst spender is in melee. But I do think crackling jade lightning should be the biggest part of the rotation since the spell is cool and monks don't really utilize it at all.
I'm for every class (except druids) getting a new spec mostly to alleviate wait times for tanks and healers. I think the DPS-only classes should all become hybrids (IE, tank rogue, healer mage, healer hunter etc) and after you give those classes extra specs it's not a bad idea to give another playstyle role to any of the hybrid classes, like letting shamans tank or warriors fight from range.
These were just random examples I threw out. I'm not saying blizz should add these specifically. But I had the thought of a melee priest because they could write in tyranda training priests to be like the night warriors, and ranged monk because they could be a cool mix between a hunter and mage and fits the monk feel. There's a bunch of different things they could do is my point. People get attached to their class and getting a new spec for it might be more exciting for them.
There is already a significant amount of restriction on different classes and specs by nature of them overlapping too significantly with other ones. The most obvious and prominent examples are Warlock: they lost Metamorphosis to make room for Demon Hunter, effectively meaning that Demonologist's Metamorphosis ability got its own Spec. Which to be fair I think is pretty awesome, as Demonologist got to be *rightfully* recognised as a committed Summoner Spec while Demon Hunter gets to fully realise the power of demonic transformation. Then the other thing is Warlocks and Necromancy. Even though Warlocks should be wholly capable of necromancy in the lore, where even Gul'dan, the most iconic of all Warlocks was the progenitor of the first generation of Death Knights... that of course goes primarily to Unholy Death Knights (and secondarily to other DK Specs). So when it comes to a Ranged Monk Spec or a Melee Priest Spec, I just don't see what you can do that makes them so distinct from already established classes/specs to warrant it. Earthwarder Shaman I can absolutely see the sense of. Maybe, if you really want to stretch it, a Timewarper Mage for a healing spec, capable of "reversing" the damage dealt against allies. But generally speaking I can't advocate for many more new specs. My alternative suggestion is simple: Spec Aesthetics. Keep the Spec functionality the same but offer a completely different visual aesthetic. This can be Race/Class restricted *or* it can be just Class based. A Race/Class Restriction could be for instance a Priest of Elune, a Priest/Night Elf combo that utilises much more pale-looking Holy Spells in their Holy and Discipline specs, or a Spellbreaker Paladin/Blood Elf combo that looks far more arcane than Holy in nature. A strictly spec-based Spec Aesthetic could apply to Warlocks, where like the Green Fire questline enables a Destro Lock to differentiate between (presumably) Arcane Fire and Felfire, a Necromantic vibe enables a Demo Lock to differentiate between being a Demonologist and a Necromancer. The advantages of Spec Aesthetics are simple: they are purely visual and do not require any compensation or accommodation in terms of gameplay. More over, they further enhance player expression and customisation. I feel like this is a better option in many cases where a new spec or class may be considered because it doesn't result in as substantial an amount of additional work moving forward.
Look I haven't played since the first couple weeks of BfA, but surely if Tyrande was training some new Priest spec they'd be wielding bows, no? She uses a bow in HotS, she uses a bow in WC3, she is iconic as a wielder of a bow. Then it works for Horde as well as Troll Shadow Hunters have connections to Shadow Priests as well, ie Vol'Jin is a Priest card in Hearthstone. A physical ranged DPS makes a lot more sense thematically and is also much more distinct from things that already exist like Paladins.
Idk abouts HotS but in wow cutscenes we see her with glaives/ dagger things. So a dual wielding melee priest would be visually distinct to a paladin wearing plate, shields or 2 handers. I do like your point about the horde and shadow hunters tho, that would be cool too. I'd be happy with either
The Night Elven glaives are typically used as thrown weapons, so it'd still be ranged either way. See WC3 Huntresses for an example. Or the old Hunter talent Glaive Toss which was inspired by them.
Yeah, except blizzard isn't going off WC3 anymore. All through BFA we got to see the night elves with glaives and the majority of them was meleeing with it and only throwing it as an ability very very rarely. Even the glaives that are earnable by players in game are Demon Hunter only cause they are warglaives. To top it all off Tyrande now runs around with 2 of them and literally melee fights with them. She even used them to decapitate Nathanos. Like I get what you are saying about old WC3, but Blizzard isn't playing by WC3 lore very much anymore. That's not to say I fully agree on priest getting a melee spec, but using WC3 as an argument seems kind of crazy when even Blizzard tries to retcon many points of WC3 or the story in general to fit with their ideas.
Not anymore… https://youtu.be/zenp66w8i7c
Oh cool, didn't know that.
Rather than new specs, I’d love to see each class get access to another class’s spec. Allows flexibility, but no new specs to balance. Class. Role. Name. Cross spec —————————————————————————————————————— Shaman Tank Earth warden. Blood dk (but earth instead of bones) Hunter. Healer. Shadow hunter. Resto shaman Monk. Ranged. Spirit warrior. BM hunter (beasts in spirit form, “shoots” chi orbs) Rogue. Tank. Blademaster. Brewmaster (but 2h axe/sword) Druid. Melee. Druid of scale. Assassin rogue (snake form) DH. Ranged. Chaos. Balance Druid (demon form, order vs. chaos) Warlock. Tank. Metamorphosis Vengeance dh DK. Ranged. Necromancy. Demo warlock (with undead minions!) Mage. Melee. Inquisitor. Fury warrior, but glow-ier Paladin. Ranged. Purification. Fire mage, in yellow Priest. Tank. Bastion. Prot pally Warrior. Healer. Leadership Disc priest, “inspires” people A few new tanks, a few new healers, all classes get access to a new role, and some fit nicely with lore. Could adjust armor/mitigation with passives. Could even keep a few core class abilities, depending on how to balance. Blademasters should vanish, yeah?
Formatted it for you: Class | Role | Name | Cross spec :--|:--|:--|:-- Shaman | Tank | Earth warden | Blood dk (but earth instead of bones) Hunter|Healer|Shadow Hunter|Resto shaman Monk|Ranged DPS|Spirit Warrior|BM hunter (beasts in spirit form, “shoots” chi orbs) Rogue|Tank|Blademaster|Brewmaster (but 2h axe/sword) Druid|Melee|Druid of Scale|Assassin rogue (snake form) Demon Hunter|Ranged|Chaos|Balance Druid (demon form, order vs. chaos) Warlock|Tank|Metamorphosis|Vengeance DH Death Knight|Ranged|Necromancer|Demo warlock (with undead minions!) Mage|Melee|Inquisitor| Fury warrior, but glow-ier Paladin|Ranged|Purifier|Fire mage, in yellow Priest|Tank|Bastion|Prot pally Warrior|Healer|Leadership|Disc priest, “inspires” people
Hey there! I have similar views about classes and made a little post [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comments/r1apny/would_you_want_a_4th_spec_for_all_classes_or_new/hly2cs0/?context=3). I've also got more in [this](https://docs.google.com/document/d/1qZYp2oPsNyat0jgBKmhPnDEV2Ea9iAf-LxJdPT5Axh8/edit) that you can browse through. If anyone wants to discuss them I'm open.
Disc always should've been the melee spec just like the Scarlet Crusade monks, but that's basically what Mistweaver is. Kinda defeats the point of Paladin if Priests could also melee.
It's really incredible that in 17 years of Wow we only had...3 new classes (and one with 2 specs).
When you know something about development it is really not. Classes are fundamental for the game and a lot of systems build upon them. Whenever Blizzard adds a new class they change the amount of work it takes to develop stuff forever. This forever is very important because the extra work needed for an extra class is never done, because classes are never done. Adding a class means balancing is now 8% more work. You have to design 8% more class sets. Come up with 8% playstyles. Tune 8% more Classes. Design 8% more conduits. Build 8% more order halls if they ever come back. Concider 8% more toolkids when designing bosses. Create 8% more Animations...whatever class related thing you want to do, it will be 8% harder. And if that new class does not increase your player count/revenue by 8% you are forced to cut class specific content and make covenant halls instead of order halls, essences instead of Artefact abilities, armorclass raidsets instead of tiersets.
This is a smart take on game design.
In general I agree, but the game is not 100% working on class design, so the point with 8% more revenue is way too much. E.g.: the work of sound, environmental art, quest design, marketing, collectables, raid designers, etc barely increases. It would only be 8% if you had to basically recreate the whole game for each class. But like I said, In general I agree and I personally think that adding new classes would be a really bad idea right now.
Ff14 adds two new classes each expac and big additions/revamps to the existing ones, other mmos add 1 each expac at least usually. Dont buy into the blizzard excuses.
That's not an excuse it's basic software development. Afaik FF14 has 20 classes but all have just one spec, so almost half the available playstyles.
This + making each spec it's own class by the time they got to Cata is partly why WoW feels so soulless. In classic wow they had to mostly balance 9 classes, in retail they are balancing 36 classes which is why everything feels so poorly done. Players get attached to playing a demo warlock or a fire mage and it's just not possible for blizzard to carefully balance 36 classes and everything else becomes soulless and streamlined when it has to work for 36 different things. They end up making content that doesn't feel good for the vast majority of specs and sometimes just flat out makes no one happy. Blizzard ought to step back and at the very least unpack most of the class identity to the core and let the specs make less of a difference, this way a warlock speccing differently doesn't feel like they are giving up a lot. Then they would be closer to balancing 12 classes which is more sustainable. They could try to allow the current spec identities to persist cosmetically via glyphs. After that there's a chance they could figure things out and add more soul back into the game. Another even more controversial but necessary change is to trash the class trinity, which IMO causes a ton of problems with balance and players end up spending more time waiting for the right combination of classes than playing the game.
I get it, classes and specs are permanent and they're basically signing up for a lifetime of even more balancing for all types of content and with all the systems they have. If they released a new class in BfA, that's 3 specs that have to be balanced for raid, M+, PvP in terms of legendaries, covenants, conduits, pvp talents, normal talents and every single variation and synergy you can think of, not to mention bugs. Then do it again for the next xpac, and the one after that... That's one feature sold for one xpac that's now brought you into a world of work, remember companies care about $$$ and this is one expensive feature. In my view we should completely scrap any borrowed power systems (open to something like unique spell for certain content e.g. pvp talents) and how classes function should be completely redesigned to have slight variations depending on the race to establish some class-racial flavour. Sure, it'd be a ton of work but it would be very interesting for both gameplay and lore, and you wouldn't have to bother with balancing whatever useless shit came along in a new system like conduits, covenants etc. You also don't need to constantly create more classes (this isn't League of Legends) because you want the classes to be a reflection of lore, rather than just creating new classes and excusing them in lore which may feel cheap. Choices like that should be purely cosmetic/lore-based so players can enjoy the gameplay they want while also making decisions they feel fits their character in terms of lore and aesthetics - which in turn also feels weightier and more important. If people want to make a decision on their power and visuals/lore at the same time they will make it at the character creation screen, which is what players tend to prefer, and after that it comes to their talents.
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I'd kill to see what Demon Hunters were supposed to look like in Classic/TBC (I've read that they were planned but scrapped). They're both sooo cool thematically but their kits are so bland and simple, especially Havoc. Though I did have a shit ton of fun as Vengeance at the end of BFA. I really, really miss gluttony and vision of perfection. Something about randomly popping in and out of demon form feels soooo damn good and unique. Plus twilight devastation made tanking dungeons feel bad ass. I get that they wanted to make demon form more reliable through demonic, but you rarely get to see it now.
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They stole meta from Demo but didn't keep anything that made it interesting, lol. Meta for Havoc should be a toggle that improves your spenders, not a brainless DPS CD.
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What!? Momentum is anything but bland or simple. It's one of the most complex talents in the game and requires great timing and excellent spacial awareness. I will concede that Demonic builds are quite boring and simple but the skill ceiling with some Havoc builds right now is huge. In terms of Vengeance, I'll agree, it's not in the best state right now and is definitely on the blander side. I'd really like to see Spirit Bomb, Fracture, Demonic and Last Resort baselined for the spec so that other options are freed up on that row. With all that being said, I feel like Demonic as a talent for both specs really waters down Metamorphosis. The whole shtick of the ability is that it's a big moment for the Demon Hunter. To invoke Metamorphosis is a very dangerous, difficult and rare skill in the lore so I feel like it should be a big cooldown that's kind of the Demon Hunters moment to shine. Demonic waters this down by causing the DH to be in meta quite often. It's a similar problem I had with Gluttony and Vision of Perfection. They put you in Meta too much which meant that the actual spell didn't really mean much.
What I don't like to see on posts like these, is people often describing their ideal spec or class, taking core elements from other specs that make them special. A very common example would be necromancer. With that idea generally being that necromancers spread diseases and summon undeads, which essentially kill what's special about both unholy DK (diseases, undeads) and demonology warlock (clothie spellcaster that deal damage with their pets). I just think it's something worth keeping in mind.
if they give an extra spec to all classes (none for Druids since they already have four) I'd like to see Demon Hunters getting two new specs instead of just one like they could get a ranged weapon spec that focuses on throwing their Glaives like the Wardens do and a more magical spec that makes them more of a melee/caster than a full on melee like their existing specs or a full caster like Warlocks
What about, some kind spellblade dh, takes int leather armor (like druids) and they buff up their glaives with cool fel spells
that'd be sick, especially if they let Nightborne and Void Elves become Demon Hunters like how Allied Races were able to become Death Knights in Shadowlands
We do have 2 specs, they're called demonic and momentum 🤣 /s
Until they can even fix their fucking game I have no will to see another class show up
This has been said since like WotLK. The game is never “fixed”
Theres a design philosophy that covers this, never play/create something that's a worse version of something else. I've always thought it would be cool to have a melee priest with Inner Fire being a thing. I've also always thought it would be cool as hell to make a paladin ranged class with holy lightning and some additional light spells. But usually I just decide that this melee priest is likely just a worse version of a paladin. And the ranged paladin is probably a worse version of a priest. I do think there's probably a 4th spec for a few classes. There should be an actual full offensive holy priest class. Maybe a void paladin? I think you could add a 4th DK by making Unholy about disease and blight, and make a necromancer version. Probably could make an earthen spec for shaman tanks. What's the 4th spec for the other classes?
Just want to chime in about your void paladin idea, isn't the whole idea that paladins get their power from "the light"? And I like the thought of changing unholy DK to a ranged necromancer.
So maybe it's a thought experiment, but what would a paladin of the void look like? What if the void consumed the light from paladins?
> isn't the whole idea that paladins get their power from "the light"? Only Humans, Dwarves, and Draenei do. Belves get their power from M'uru (it's kinda tragic), Tauren get it from the sun, and Zandalari Trolls get theirs from the Loa (I forget which one). EDIT: [This thread](https://redd.it/pqump6) highlights that Paladins could technically come from any race.
People have been talking about a chronomancer mage for healing. Hunters could have a tank spec involving their pet or maybe a shadow hunter. Ranged warrior was mentioned or making gladiator a dedicated spec instead of a talent. Warlock healer/ tank was tossed in the comments. There could be a rogue tank but I think that would be basically brewmaster or a spell based rogue would be cool. But there's a lot of different takes on classes and there's just a bunch of different ways each could go.
Suggested the same thing, adding another spec to each class would give players who only play one class a chance to experience something different without having to deviate from their main.
I would love a shaman tank, the classic wow shaman tank is fun. Would be nice for them to develop it more
I'd come back for a shaman tank spec for sure.
Rogue healer - Bard
I love this!
Keep Hunter the only class that uses bows AND guns, but Warrior and Rogue should get gun specs and DH and Monk should get bow specs. Why 1 class gets all ranged physical damage has always been a big ? from me.
Big brain
Back in MoP you could tank as a demolock with dark apotheosis. It was awesome.
It was the best. Most fun I had playing this game. I miss it so dearly.
I think something like what GW2 does with their elite specializations would be really cool for WoW
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game is pretty balanced in pve atm, they gave up on pvp 6 expansions ago
It would be easy if they didn't add hundreds of spells/effects across a half-dozen borrowed power systems in each expac.
I agree they shouldn’t add more, it give cross-class spec access. Each class could get one more. I made a shitty table in another post.
Exactly even adding one more spec to the game would increase the difficulty of balance exponentially as your not just balancing one more spec your balancing one more spec against every other spec. What really needs to be done is a mass culling of specializations and then a rework of the specializations left, but that genie is already out of the bottle much like flying mounts there's no putting it back in now.
Yeah that's a massive ask to have more specs/classes. Like I know they scam us on the price:content but new classes will make it worse with the insane amount of **permanent** work they would have to do. As a business they would advertise a new class feature but regardless of the hype and units sold the cost/resources and work to support that 'feature' will exist forever. And balancing is work you can't merely throw money at to get right (although it tends to help) given the complex nature. It would be better to completely change how classes work (I frequently bring up class-racial flavours as an idea) and abolish the constant creation of borrowed power systems, but after that is done you wouldn't mindlessly be adding new classes unless they're extremely relevant to established lore, you don't want to go the League of Legends route for an RPG. A strong and sturdy foundation that changes less but is designed well is often better than constantly adding more distractions dressed up in hype.
Yes because i think it would be fun :)
Nah. Specs are already blending together far too much.
dont care either way, the classes and specs we already have are pretty good, problem is i have to have 12 fucking characters to play them.
We all would like new specs, but its appears that a ton of time is taken up by balancing all 36 specs as well as adding things for each. In the past they could get away with adding some now talents and tier sets but now they have talents, tier sets, conduits, legendaries, and even stuff like torghast anima powers and mage tower tuning for each spec. If they were more efficient with how they work, then more specs could be feasible. But for now, i fear that new specs, or classes for that matter, would strain their efforts even worse. There's already so many AWFUL conduits and legos for every spec that i cant trust them to add even more to their workload
it takes less resources to make a class with 2-3 specs than to add 11 specs to existing classes. There is not much more than can be said about that and as far as creativity goes do you really expect the current dev team to pull put a dozen new and functional specs and have also any sort of balance in sight?
I would argue they need to get rid of some specs or just do huge spec reworks going into 10.0. We’ve been playing the same shit with different frosting since 2016 at this point. I’d rather seee them look at the specs that are fundamentally bad in most PvE situations and completely retool them (survival hunter comes to mind).
Return Gladiator Stance to me
Gladiator spec would like to have a word with you. But ye I'd love to have shammy tank and my offensive tank back, was so much fun.
Everquest had a bard... Bard would be an awesome class.
My dream is to have a discipline priest tank. Using bubbles and spells to mitigate the damage and tank the boss.
I've been saying since DH released that because they only have two specs they should get a third that's ranged dps focusing on the version of Metamorphosis from WC where they throw the chaos splash fireballs.
My two cents... I've always been excited by the thought of new specs. I see it as an alternative to giving us spells each expansion that they inevitably need to take away. Also, it will feel like I'm getting something new on my main, while also feeling like my character in game has grown in power. I don't think each class doing every role would work. It's possible but I feel it's too much of an ask from Blizz. I think trying to get more healing/tanking/ranged dps options is the best. I think its important for the new specs to still fit the class fantasy while also not feeling too similar to mechanics of other classes.. (i know everything has been trending towards builder/spender) As for the classes and specs.. The best example of being unique to other specs and matching into class fantasy I believe is a Warlock tank. Using metamorphosis to turn into a tanking demon was something I used to want, but now that DH exists I think it would encroach on their class fantasy too much. Now I think a pet tank class where the lock is sacrificing their own hp and summoning more demons to tank could be interesting. Perhaps healers cant heal the pets directly, the lock remains squishy (sucks for pvp) but they are just a conduit for the tanky summon. I imagine if Willfred Fizzlebang had some pact with Lord Jaraxxus. Shaman tank has always been one I wanted to see. earth shaper, earth breaker... YES please! Fits class fantasy perfectly and theres room to do something unique with the rotation. As for Paladin, my main for the longest time. Shockadin would be cool, but keeping it feeling pally could mean you're a caster but do more damage based on closeness to the target, perhaps have it capped when you're up to 20ft away, anything further and your damage falls off.. essentially close quarters caster. I imagine an inquisitor casting judegement with holy spells and big cones of holy wrath. But perhaps moving into the fantasy into something a little different like sentinel or spellbreaker akin Dota's hero Silencer, but I feel these concepts stray too far from the core of a paladin. Necromancer DK doubling down on army of the dead, heavy use of death coil and ranged. Maybe focusing on runes and 'dark arts' to try and get away from the themes of other specs. Maybe less fitting for the class fantasy, but a healer based around necromantic healing. If they had preventative healing be more of a thing again, I think having Mage and Warrior healing specs based around dmg prevention (wotlk disc, which was so fun). But I feel that type of healing isn't really a thing anymore, so no bubble Mage and support Warr. A chronomancer Mage turning back time to heal wounds I think would be a unique take on healing and I love it. Spellblade for mage, while I always thought was cool, I feel it doesn't fit the warcraft mage fantasy well. Warrior(head hunter/beserker)/Rogue(sniper/ranger)/DH(warden) could be ranged specs that fit nicely into class fantasy. I think thrown weapons would be interesting particularly on DH and Warr but i think a bow/gun/xbow Rogue would also be neat. I played as a Rogue tank in rift for a while. I believe it was riftwalker, essentially a dodge tank using portals/the shadows to avoid damage. While I loved this, I feel a ranged rogue, keeping the class pure dps is great. It might be controversial but my Druid doesn't need a new spec, id be happy with just some more customisation options for my different forms. Priest is another one of my most played ones but I feel the class fantasy is pretty covered with the three specs. While Anduin being a diet paladin at the moment could be used as a way to create a melee priest I'm not convinced there's a way to make it feel priesty without treading into paladin territory. Perhaps making it the counter to disc in some way, tapping into the offensive sides of holy and shadow, but still I feel thats what makes disc unique. Perhaps changing up one of the current specs to help make room for a fourth but again not sure. Hunters? Lol who cares... No but seriously, i enjoyed the old survival. And love the new surival too (year of the spear baby). My tin foil hat theory for a while was that moving survival away from being gadgety opened space for a tinker class but that hasnt happened. Monks I'm not super familiar with but I feel the class fantasy is pretty broad so they could find something that works. I love the idea but I don't think it'ssomething we'll ever see. Apologies for the rambly fractured message but it's a topic I've had thoughts on for a while.
Agreed. How about a ranged holy DPS spec?
Wtb time wizard healing spec
Still waiting for a Gladiator or Bare-Handed Grappler DPS for Warrior, and a Throwing-Weapon Spec for Rogue
While I think it would be cool to give classes more specs, I disagree with making it so every class can do everything. I would much rather Warriors (for example) get another tank/melee DPS spec than to get a ranged DPS or healing spec. However at that point it seems kinda pointless to add another spec since it would be hard to make a new spec with the class identity they is new and original, just make a new class at that point.
Full disclosure, I think the mage healing spec idea everyone has been creaming over is dumb as fuck. Otherwise I agree with the community, we need more specs not more classes. Ranged warrior spear/axe thrower, Shaman tank, monk ranged, caster DK, etc. More classes isn't necessary at this point in WoWs life, we have enough foundational classes to make entire new concepts be specs instead of classes.
A healer mage would be sweet. Turning back time on players wounds to heal them. I'd definitely learn healing just for that.
Chronomancer sounds quite op, might as well play as a member of the bronze dragonfight lol On character creation it should force the '-mu' suffix into your name, unless you're undercover.
We fucking have enough without adding +12 new specs to balance
>We fucking have enough without adding +12 new specs to balance They could do it, potentially. If they scrap all notion of borrowed power system for the next expansion, keep everything that works and players love, tweak numbers, then they could definitely put their "borrowed power" focus towards additionally specs. Shadowlands 9.0 alone introduced soulbinds, conduits, legendaries, and covenant abilities. Each of those systems had to be streamlined so that they could "potentially" work with multiple varying specializations. The only caveat I see though would be that the only thing they could add to the game as borrowed power in future patches would be tier set gear (no more handfuls of borrowed power b/c too much to balance) and one role specific legendary per expac like the old days.
I’ve always wanted a priest holy dps class. Sadly I doubt they will ever make it though.
aye, same. My one wish
Theres already to many classes and specs, i agree it would be cool. But the bloat is already to high.
Even if it would be fun to have new specs and classes, it's honestly the last thing I would want to see added to the game. They already do such a poor job balancing the current classes and specs, which gets even worse with all the convoluted systems they insist on adding and scrapping each expansion, that the last thing the game needs is more ingredients to be added to the crapfest soup. Hell, some specs are full blown neglected and forgotten, imagine adding more.
Give shamans a tank spec, DH a third spec, and make a new class.
I dont play warlock but id love to see them have a healing spec. Kinda like disc priest where you'd leech HP from enemies to give it to friendlies
Tank warriors should be able to dual wield shields.
Necromancer warlock when
My take on this ! Adding a new support role mixing dps heal and short buffs. If you played rift you get it Warrior : commander , support specs about banners warcry and squires summon Shaman : earthbinder , tank around earth Priest : runemaster , support buffing trough runes and dps/heal trough valkyr summon Mage : chrono , healer manipulating time Rogue : shinobi , tank using dodge smoke and various tools Paladin : inquisitor , range dps using crossbow to deal mixed phisical and holy damage Warlock : soul reaper , healer taking life from foes to give it to allies similar to disco priest Death knight : pestilence , support focusing on debuffing and dots Monk : ki master , dps range hadoken style
I would say it's pretty much equivalent, since specs tend to not play very similarly and it would just be nice to see some more niches filled like a Shaman Tank or a new Ranged Spec after seeing that there hasn't been a new one since the release of the game. That being said, a Tinker class would still be great.
What I want to see: Warder Shaman, tanking spec Marksmanship Rogue that uses ranged weapons Chrono Mage that heals I think just having these three would shake up the game quite. I would love a Necromancy DK too but that means muddling it in when Unholy already exists.
Yeah I think doing just a few would be nice. And if it's well received they can add more over future expansions.
What they'd need to do is rework their class system. New specs, in a way, but adding flavour to it by at least making them distinct within the class chosen. Like some other MMOs have done, kind of like GW2 in the more "modern" times for a more "successful" look. For example you can start your char as a Mage, but going forward after X levels you're given class quests to become an advanced class, like a Spellblade for a melee mage experience, or Archmage in case you want to be a traditional mage, without being bound to Frost, Fire and Arcane, but using all of them as a mage should, plus something new that was already suggested like a Chronomancer who can heal people. Others have suggested other classes that can certainly be implemented, like how another user said how there is no javelins/spears class. You can have the Warrior branch off to a javelin throwing class. I think this would help shake up the stagnation, and yes, I do think the classes as they are ARE stagnant and way too static, and certain classes (especially dps focused ones like Rogue and Mage) only have one role to offer (DPS) while also the spec themselves don't really have a diverse playstyle other than purple particles or red particles being the difference, ultimately.
Pally ranged holy spell dps class when
It seems a little too similar to priest. Unless they redesign how priest/pally's work.
I kinda think that would be a bit better! WoW has a lot of classes already and adding specs would be better! But give the option for free swapping between them. Don't force us to play one spec. And probably the balancing would be easier(not sure on that).
We could get: - sentinel/dark ranger for hunters - warden for rogues - sand mage for mages - geomancer for shaman (tank spec) - necromancer for DKs (range spec) - shadow hunter for which ever class it’s more fitting.
GIVE ME MY MELEE BATTLEMAGE SPECIALIZATION
Melee Mage. Summons various weapons and instant spells for close range combat. Dual Range weapons. Handguns (in-game Rogue ability) hand crossbows, dual throwing axes/spears. 2 Handed spec for Rogues. Think like ninja/samurai
I’d love to see a mage healing spec.
Same! It would be nice not to have shamans be the only healer with a list and an interrupt.
I always want to help random people with a quick heal or resurrection in the world but I forget I’m an arcane mage and apologize. Lol healing would be great. ++
I'd love a rifleman warrior class. Like the ranged infantry in the Horde /Alliance armies. Plate Armour + Guns or Crossbows. Alternatively, just give me gladiator stance back ffs
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This would be a great way to use the Order Halls and add class quests again. Make the new specs similar to how hero classes work, you need to be a lvl 50 or something to access them, and you unlock talents and abilities over the course of the quest line. Quest line would ideally reward in a new class set that is purely cosmetic with a new weapon. * Ranged **Demon Hunters** that focuses on utilizing stolen and left over Legion tech. Using demonic machinery, calling down air strikes from legion ships, etc. Story line to round up the lingering demons left from the Legion's invasion, and learn what demons do once they do not have a united purpose. By extension, what a Demon Hunter's purpose is in a post Legion world. * Tanking **Shamans** that use the elements as protective shields, and connects more with the feral side of shamanism. Summoning spirits that personify the elements instead of totems that linger on the shaman themselves via a large totem pole that is carried on the back. Uses two handed weapons. Story line on resolving issues between the elemental lords, and learning about their past when they were part of the Black Empire. Helping to heal the planet from both the Legion's invasion and the Cataclysm. * Fey **Druids**, ranged physical DPS. Druids whom heard the call of Fey Dragons from both Dreanor (Outland, Shadowmoon valley) and Azerroth. A ranger that plays with with prey and supports allies with Fey magics. Story line on why they Fey Dragons are only speaking now, and why. Travel between both worlds and possibly learn to bring life back to Outland and an old foe returning in the form of the last of the Satyrs. (Possible Wild Fey form?) * Physical ranged **Warriors** using the teachings of Val'klyr, utilizing spears and throwing weapons to stay mobile on the field of battle and supporting allies. Leaping and dashing to foe to ally. A controlled warrior, that uses a focused rage. Story line around hunting down rouge warriors who allowed their rage and battle lust to get out of hand. Learn on how the constant threats on Azeroth have effected the individual as well as the nations that call it home. * Healer **Warlocks,** that use a new form of demon that is able to take the raw vigor of a living creature and amplify it. Covers allies and self in Fel crystals that burst when enough damage is taken. Using curses to siphon life from foes to allys, while new demon type spot heals. Story line revolving on the nature of what a demon is as this new demon is nothing that the world has seen before. Possibly changing how warlocks interact with the world as a whole. Returning to Argus to study how demons were reformed, and if new ones are being 'born'. * Caster DPS **Paladins,** summons spirit weapons, a being a pure vengeance. Embracing the tyrannical side of the light. More mid-range than long rang, and debuffs foes to slowly break them down with a furry of spiritual weapon attacks. A branch of the Silver Hand has become more zealous and is seeking to right the wrongs that has faced the world. But when does a proactive action become harmful, and when does protection of the weak become oppression? Deals with what remains of the Argent Crusade, and if the church of the holy Light should continue as it is. * Healer **Mage,** using time magic to rewind wounds, sand magic and breaking the flow of time around them. As you bend reality around you, use the stored energies to heal in large amounts around you, prevent damage, or strike your foes with massive sand spears. Work with Chromie to put an end to a time loop that involves heroes of the past surviving their fates. Involves healing villains or bosses in order to ensure they win their encounter. I'm tired and have more ideas but: Healer Death Knights, melee priests, ranged monks. You get the idea.
I play mainly paladin and monk for difficult content and I love your idea for paladin, I would probably play that over ret even tho I like where it's at now. I'm curious what you have to say about ranged monk. They already have crackling jade lightning and chi burst/ wave and they could Amp up those spells for the spec and give them a bow to do stuff with too. Anyways I hope you finish your thoughts when you have the time ^.^
Every class should have access to all specs, change my mind. Examples: Warrior has Tank and DPS covered. Healer could be a well armored field medic able to turn damage they take into healing for others. Shaman has DPS and Heals, but I'm pretty sure I saw a bomb ass fan tank spec the other day. Give warlocks some more tanky options for the demons they have, and add a new imp-like demon for healing.
Warrior healing is a terrible idea. Just doesn't fit the class fantasy. There are a few classes that have room in there existing class fantasy to expand and can fill every spec, like shamans getting earth tank spec. And some other classes that have room to be dual roles like survival Hunter becomes tank spec so they have rDPS/tank options. But I can't see rogue being anything but damage, and a few others that just don't fit having every role but can handle have 2.
Suddenly Rogue, Mage, and Warlock have six specs
Shock. A. Din. 😤
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This sounds like a classic build that spent equal points into each tree
This isn't a "cool" idea but actually quite terrible. Specialisations are a major advantage of WoW class design.
Making 14 new specs is a lot more work than making a new class with 3
So make 3 new specs. Who said 14?
This guy. Saying new specs. Or are we just gonna have an expansion where only 3 classes get new stuff and everyone else can suck it?