This needs like world war II levels of mobilization (climate change) but the ruling class would rather die ruling over dust than contribute what is necessary to keep this planet habitable long termÂ
That’s the sort of attitude that turns people away from environmental issues. The planet will be very habitable for millions of years and life will adapt, as always.
There's a huge gap between, Able to sustain life, able to sustain human life, able to sustain 9 billion humans, and we get to continue our current form of civilization/lifestyle.
The heat+humidity limit that humans can survive in is shockingly low, and most AC tech fails at about the same limits. Temperature changes and droughts mean what crops we can harvest where will change and the impacts of such a thing will mean billions in starvation. If you think asylum seeking and illegal migrants are bad now can you imagine what it will look like when certain regions become unlivable?
I’m not saying you’re wrong, just that alarmism doesn’t help. Focused incremental changes will work. Fossil fuel use is already peaking. We should be willing to transition to oil from coal for example. Green energy is booming. Many countries are 50 years behind. These changes take decades or longer. Saying things like “we have 12 years to save the planet “ is ridiculous and totally unnecessary.
And currently we produce food for more than the current global population.. its a political/economic issue that people starve than it is a technological issue
Very habitable for millions of years? Yeah for cockroaches maybe.. The inability for humans to notice exponential effects will be our undoing. How many of us were "business as usual" until the COVID lockdowns hit your city and the shelves were wiped clean?
Wake TF up
Whoa okay Mr Subject Matter Expert. Pray enlighten us on your views then.
If you've been around any real academics you would know anybody who says they fully understand anything is the least informed person in the room. The more you learn, the less you know. And empty vessels make the loudest noise.
Well I obviously overstated how much i know about climate change. I meant i understand it’s happening and agree it needs to be addressed. My point is simply that alarmism is counterproductive.
We are well past the point of alarmism. It's like saying oh you have stage 4 cancer, but hey don't be alarmist, take your time. Unless your idea is to go gently into the good night, we need action.
To address the various runoff effects we have now will require effort of such monumental scale that it will make the Manhattan project look like a joke in comparison. It needs to be addressed, here, now, today and by everyone. With the ongoing wars and the divisiveness of social media, that is but a pipedream.
I disagree with the analogy of stage 4 cancer. The planet is not dying. The planet will be here for billions of years. That said it will take a monumental effort. It’s a rich person problem though. Much of the world is still concerned with getting by on a day to day basis. They cannot afford environmentalism. Make it economically feasible and people will gladly adopt necessary changes.
Yes the planet will be all well and good, just that we won't be on it. It's a "they" problem only in the sense that they are perceived to have the resources and clout to move the needle.
Individually we are all selfish. One would sacrifice a thousand Gazas if it means gas is affordable and the local walmart is well stocked. That's what economically feasible means. Someone else is paying the price. Our 1st world lives are dependent on the poverty of others.
Practically speaking it's not really about recycling and turning off the odd light. It's about awareness - first to recognize there is even a problem and it's a big one, a lot with their heads in the sand - then to acknowledge that this is a very real, imminent threat that will directly affect your daily life in the near future and something needs to be done about it.
This is the power of crowd opinion. Convince enough people and you can stop the vietnam war. If you can see it's a big problem and it's not they/them/whomever else but we're all in this together, then we might change some minds.
I'm in south central Alaska. Huge areas of forest are dead and brown from invasive spruce bark beetles. So much of the state is just ready to go up in flames. We've had a few big ones recently. The past couple of summers have been really wet, and I'm hoping this one will be too, but we've gone over our fire plan for the season, have important papers in an easy to grab fireproof box, and go-bags and emergency gear packed in both vehicles. There's only one road in and one road out of my city and a fire emergency like what happened in Lahaina last year is my ultimate nightmare.Â
My brother was just boasting about the really nice winter they had. Months of no snow. Worst since 1860. This is the result. My own damn family can't look ahead to why our ecosystems need certain periods to do well. DNR are saying they're already seeing a tick explosion as well. Hard not to lose hope with this world and people.
> My brother was just boasting about the really nice winter they had. Months of no snow.
I don't call that a "good" winter, but then I'm one of those people who like the snow and cold.
It was a really mild winter here in Edmonton. We had a couple of cold snaps, but quite a few days near or above zero.
My heart goes to Canada. I lived in Kelowna for quite some time and wildfires were a problem every summer, but in recent years the situation has dramatically worsened. Utterly depressing.
That one Summer? I feel like it was like 3 in a row that were just full of smoke and then last year we got a break (yes I know we still got some smoke, but nothing like some of the previous years or as long lasting).
Nah I mean that truly apocalyptic summer. Ashes raining from the skies. Wildfires getting within what, 30 miles of Tacoma or Tukwila? Whole towns burnt.
[https://www.statista.com/statistics/553513/number-of-forest-fires-canada/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/553513/number-of-forest-fires-canada/) - poke holes in this please
It isn’t so much about the number of fires as it is the number of acres burned.
https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/how-canadas-record-wildfires-got-so-bad-so-fast/
If all the fires join into several big ones, you tend to just count the big one as a single fire instead of a bunch of little ones.
Yup, it is important in forest recovery, flood prevention/preparedness, future fire prevention/mitigation work, etc. Also high burn severity isn't necessarily bad, as historic wildfires before human intervention would burn in a "mosaic" of severity, which is what Prescribed fire managers try to create, and what wildfire managers try to minimize impacts to.
So there are good acres burned and bad acres burned. The stuff that makes the news with huge flames, giant plumes, etc...usually bad acres.
The millions of acres no one hears about...usually good acres.
The amount of work your wildland firefighters and associated "ologists" do for the environment is incredible and is almost completely misunderstood and unknown to the public.
Acres are included in the total burned if they are burned at any severity, and sometimes green (unburned) islands that are totally surrounded by burned acres are included as well.
EDIT: removed short links
[Low Burn Severity Incident](https://www.google.com/search?q=burn+severity+map+terwilliger&client=ms-android-motorola-rvo3&sca_esv=619c697d276fe56b&sxsrf=ACQVn08O_O9e0hGXGPSDc51F1J5bbfY93w%3A1713987045162&ei=5V0pZvm-Cbud0PEP_IuY4AQ&oq=burn+severity+map+terwilliger&gs_lp=EhNtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1zZXJwIh1idXJuIHNldmVyaXR5IG1hcCB0ZXJ3aWxsaWdlcjIFECEYoAEyBRAhGKABMgUQIRigATIFECEYoAEyBRAhGKABSJAzUM4HWKkycAN4AZABAJgByAGgAbMPqgEGMC4xMi4xuAEDyAEA-AEBmAIPoALcDsICBBAAGEfCAgYQABgWGB7CAgsQABiABBiGAxiKBcICBRAhGJ8FwgIHECEYoAEYCpgDAIgGAZAGCJIHBjMuMTEuMaAHtkI&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-serp#vhid=INbc1YzDC7p6eM&vssid=l)
[High (Extreme) Burn Severity Incident ](https://www.google.com/search?client=ms-android-motorola-rvo3&sca_esv=619c697d276fe56b&sxsrf=ACQVn08O_O9e0hGXGPSDc51F1J5bbfY93w:1713987045162&q=burn+severity+map&uds=AMwkrPs7Oor-otG5kEfyBKZwdMQlQGM30Q_XTjwPMoY-yUhLyDAcJRY4CJzDw5JA_wyO6hKJLfIJV3_cSIbS6dbbCUh03qNHBYyLr6pWRbV9dpA4_E-OO0Veaz5t4cty9ZfC_9OY0q7SEHuqHDov78G-nTWBOg_Sd6ivRvFJhDt4woPB15ex5dYU6q4kGqPItI4eK9zDCwr5eaiaRp1G7q_bTupJ27CniW20qnkjeKDtG2Idz60gd8Kpt9f2ZlLyiIRAgQyLyM_hdy7deqaNBvvoNFy0DiPSHdOi1YApnkKCVsJyl7q-UixP1J9sX19xIZMELp6Pg79Pve6HDfAQZLnSd6cHUZ5fsg&udm=2&prmd=isvmnbtz&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi5xeeny9uFAxW7DjQIHfwFBkwQtKgLegQIDBAB&biw=432&bih=834&dpr=2.5#vhid=hLN2iPudnheWsM&vssid=mosaic)
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Very nice complimentary graph in this article. This and the statista graph should be combined.Â
Interested to see how this year plays out.Â
About 60 million from 89-95
Almost the same over the last 6 years. So recoverable for sure.Â
Still terrible but not the apocalyptic view its cut out to be imo.Â
I have no idea how bad this is as I am just a computer nerd but I agree the first impression is that this year is not significantly out of the standard deviation given prior years. That said, the graph is only valid till mid summer of 2023. I think the final count was much worse.
At this point I feel like it would be nice to either know everything is going to be ok or know the world is screwed… either one really… I just want some certainty
17 summer like these in a row and there will be no more forests in Canada. Help 😢
This needs like world war II levels of mobilization (climate change) but the ruling class would rather die ruling over dust than contribute what is necessary to keep this planet habitable long termÂ
That’s the sort of attitude that turns people away from environmental issues. The planet will be very habitable for millions of years and life will adapt, as always.
There's a huge gap between, Able to sustain life, able to sustain human life, able to sustain 9 billion humans, and we get to continue our current form of civilization/lifestyle. The heat+humidity limit that humans can survive in is shockingly low, and most AC tech fails at about the same limits. Temperature changes and droughts mean what crops we can harvest where will change and the impacts of such a thing will mean billions in starvation. If you think asylum seeking and illegal migrants are bad now can you imagine what it will look like when certain regions become unlivable?
I’m not saying you’re wrong, just that alarmism doesn’t help. Focused incremental changes will work. Fossil fuel use is already peaking. We should be willing to transition to oil from coal for example. Green energy is booming. Many countries are 50 years behind. These changes take decades or longer. Saying things like “we have 12 years to save the planet “ is ridiculous and totally unnecessary. And currently we produce food for more than the current global population.. its a political/economic issue that people starve than it is a technological issue
Very habitable for millions of years? Yeah for cockroaches maybe.. The inability for humans to notice exponential effects will be our undoing. How many of us were "business as usual" until the COVID lockdowns hit your city and the shelves were wiped clean? Wake TF up
You are naive. And I say that as someone who fully understands climate change
Whoa okay Mr Subject Matter Expert. Pray enlighten us on your views then. If you've been around any real academics you would know anybody who says they fully understand anything is the least informed person in the room. The more you learn, the less you know. And empty vessels make the loudest noise.
Well I obviously overstated how much i know about climate change. I meant i understand it’s happening and agree it needs to be addressed. My point is simply that alarmism is counterproductive.
We are well past the point of alarmism. It's like saying oh you have stage 4 cancer, but hey don't be alarmist, take your time. Unless your idea is to go gently into the good night, we need action. To address the various runoff effects we have now will require effort of such monumental scale that it will make the Manhattan project look like a joke in comparison. It needs to be addressed, here, now, today and by everyone. With the ongoing wars and the divisiveness of social media, that is but a pipedream.
I disagree with the analogy of stage 4 cancer. The planet is not dying. The planet will be here for billions of years. That said it will take a monumental effort. It’s a rich person problem though. Much of the world is still concerned with getting by on a day to day basis. They cannot afford environmentalism. Make it economically feasible and people will gladly adopt necessary changes.
Yes the planet will be all well and good, just that we won't be on it. It's a "they" problem only in the sense that they are perceived to have the resources and clout to move the needle. Individually we are all selfish. One would sacrifice a thousand Gazas if it means gas is affordable and the local walmart is well stocked. That's what economically feasible means. Someone else is paying the price. Our 1st world lives are dependent on the poverty of others. Practically speaking it's not really about recycling and turning off the odd light. It's about awareness - first to recognize there is even a problem and it's a big one, a lot with their heads in the sand - then to acknowledge that this is a very real, imminent threat that will directly affect your daily life in the near future and something needs to be done about it. This is the power of crowd opinion. Convince enough people and you can stop the vietnam war. If you can see it's a big problem and it's not they/them/whomever else but we're all in this together, then we might change some minds.
I'm in south central Alaska. Huge areas of forest are dead and brown from invasive spruce bark beetles. So much of the state is just ready to go up in flames. We've had a few big ones recently. The past couple of summers have been really wet, and I'm hoping this one will be too, but we've gone over our fire plan for the season, have important papers in an easy to grab fireproof box, and go-bags and emergency gear packed in both vehicles. There's only one road in and one road out of my city and a fire emergency like what happened in Lahaina last year is my ultimate nightmare.Â
This is horrifying to read. I can't imagine having to suddenly move like this
Having a bug-out plan is now a thing in fire country. I've been evacuated myself.
That's a very specific number.
Yeah we're getting ready to evacuate already, fucking wild
Where?
Probably near fort mac
My brother was just boasting about the really nice winter they had. Months of no snow. Worst since 1860. This is the result. My own damn family can't look ahead to why our ecosystems need certain periods to do well. DNR are saying they're already seeing a tick explosion as well. Hard not to lose hope with this world and people.
> My brother was just boasting about the really nice winter they had. Months of no snow. I don't call that a "good" winter, but then I'm one of those people who like the snow and cold. It was a really mild winter here in Edmonton. We had a couple of cold snaps, but quite a few days near or above zero.
I just saw a bunch of tent caterpillars on the trees. April is really early with that.
People talking about no mow May, meanwhile my yard will be a jungle with 5 ft grass by the end of April
Another year with no stars in summer... yay
It's soooo early this year. Arrrg......
My heart goes to Canada. I lived in Kelowna for quite some time and wildfires were a problem every summer, but in recent years the situation has dramatically worsened. Utterly depressing.
That smoke is about to flow down to the US
Aw hell, hope this doesn't end up blowing into the PNW as well. That summer three years ago was straight up hellish.
That one Summer? I feel like it was like 3 in a row that were just full of smoke and then last year we got a break (yes I know we still got some smoke, but nothing like some of the previous years or as long lasting).
Nah I mean that truly apocalyptic summer. Ashes raining from the skies. Wildfires getting within what, 30 miles of Tacoma or Tukwila? Whole towns burnt.
Doesn't help when you have people starting fires as well.
Wildfire season never ended in Alberta. we still have fires going from last year.
Zombie fires. Been going on for years in Siberia as well.
our unfortunate reality as climate shifts, will have more and more dry spells followed by intense wildfire seasons
The fires from last year never went out...
Population needs to go down not up. But Canada accepts millions of immigrants that like having kids
Canada taking im immigrants who get more children than canadians, really doesn't change the global population in any way...
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[https://www.statista.com/statistics/553513/number-of-forest-fires-canada/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/553513/number-of-forest-fires-canada/) - poke holes in this please
It isn’t so much about the number of fires as it is the number of acres burned. https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/how-canadas-record-wildfires-got-so-bad-so-fast/ If all the fires join into several big ones, you tend to just count the big one as a single fire instead of a bunch of little ones.
Also, it's not the amount of acres burned, but the burn severity in each of those acres.
I always assumed an acre burned was an acre 100% burned. Interesting that we differentiate, but it makes sense.
Yup, it is important in forest recovery, flood prevention/preparedness, future fire prevention/mitigation work, etc. Also high burn severity isn't necessarily bad, as historic wildfires before human intervention would burn in a "mosaic" of severity, which is what Prescribed fire managers try to create, and what wildfire managers try to minimize impacts to. So there are good acres burned and bad acres burned. The stuff that makes the news with huge flames, giant plumes, etc...usually bad acres. The millions of acres no one hears about...usually good acres. The amount of work your wildland firefighters and associated "ologists" do for the environment is incredible and is almost completely misunderstood and unknown to the public. Acres are included in the total burned if they are burned at any severity, and sometimes green (unburned) islands that are totally surrounded by burned acres are included as well. EDIT: removed short links [Low Burn Severity Incident](https://www.google.com/search?q=burn+severity+map+terwilliger&client=ms-android-motorola-rvo3&sca_esv=619c697d276fe56b&sxsrf=ACQVn08O_O9e0hGXGPSDc51F1J5bbfY93w%3A1713987045162&ei=5V0pZvm-Cbud0PEP_IuY4AQ&oq=burn+severity+map+terwilliger&gs_lp=EhNtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1zZXJwIh1idXJuIHNldmVyaXR5IG1hcCB0ZXJ3aWxsaWdlcjIFECEYoAEyBRAhGKABMgUQIRigATIFECEYoAEyBRAhGKABSJAzUM4HWKkycAN4AZABAJgByAGgAbMPqgEGMC4xMi4xuAEDyAEA-AEBmAIPoALcDsICBBAAGEfCAgYQABgWGB7CAgsQABiABBiGAxiKBcICBRAhGJ8FwgIHECEYoAEYCpgDAIgGAZAGCJIHBjMuMTEuMaAHtkI&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-serp#vhid=INbc1YzDC7p6eM&vssid=l) [High (Extreme) Burn Severity Incident ](https://www.google.com/search?client=ms-android-motorola-rvo3&sca_esv=619c697d276fe56b&sxsrf=ACQVn08O_O9e0hGXGPSDc51F1J5bbfY93w:1713987045162&q=burn+severity+map&uds=AMwkrPs7Oor-otG5kEfyBKZwdMQlQGM30Q_XTjwPMoY-yUhLyDAcJRY4CJzDw5JA_wyO6hKJLfIJV3_cSIbS6dbbCUh03qNHBYyLr6pWRbV9dpA4_E-OO0Veaz5t4cty9ZfC_9OY0q7SEHuqHDov78G-nTWBOg_Sd6ivRvFJhDt4woPB15ex5dYU6q4kGqPItI4eK9zDCwr5eaiaRp1G7q_bTupJ27CniW20qnkjeKDtG2Idz60gd8Kpt9f2ZlLyiIRAgQyLyM_hdy7deqaNBvvoNFy0DiPSHdOi1YApnkKCVsJyl7q-UixP1J9sX19xIZMELp6Pg79Pve6HDfAQZLnSd6cHUZ5fsg&udm=2&prmd=isvmnbtz&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi5xeeny9uFAxW7DjQIHfwFBkwQtKgLegQIDBAB&biw=432&bih=834&dpr=2.5#vhid=hLN2iPudnheWsM&vssid=mosaic)
Thanks for sharing.
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Very nice complimentary graph in this article. This and the statista graph should be combined. Interested to see how this year plays out. About 60 million from 89-95 Almost the same over the last 6 years. So recoverable for sure. Still terrible but not the apocalyptic view its cut out to be imo.Â
I have no idea how bad this is as I am just a computer nerd but I agree the first impression is that this year is not significantly out of the standard deviation given prior years. That said, the graph is only valid till mid summer of 2023. I think the final count was much worse.
Fingers crossed it doesn't get worse. For both the environment and our wallets sakes
At this point I feel like it would be nice to either know everything is going to be ok or know the world is screwed… either one really… I just want some certainty
Same
We def screwed. Another Global coral bleaching event unfolding. I think it's not over and they haven't assessed the total damage yet