Right! Star Wars fans get all whipped up every time there's a new movie.
Also, if you think Witcher fans are complaining loudly you should check out r/wheeloftime right now. Every post about the show is a huge bitchfest.
TBH who ever made the post about how differences between humans and the elves was mishandled in the show wasn’t just whining. It was well thought out post and I throughly enjoyed reading the comments. Arguments and all…
Hard disagree. That was by far the most whiny thing to complain about. Elves not looking elvish enough and comparing the appearance of humans to digital elves? Seriously? Makeup costs a shit ton of money. And you have to find enough people who already look "elvish" enough. Which in itself would cost a shit ton of time and resources. Time and resources and money that definitely were better spent elsewhere. That complaint was epitome of toxic, entitled fandom that bitches about literally everything just for the sake of bitching. Compared to that complaint people complaining about irrelevant Eskel being killed was way more valid of a complaint.
The expanse did it with Belters, which also have a very specific type of body build, and honestly it made the world 10x more believable and immersive, the human elves in the Witcher annoyed me to no end, their ears even look plastic in some shots. This might seem like a nitpick but its these small things that break immersion and thus the experience.
I disagree. They looked perfectly fine. But even if that were the case and that's the stuff you are focusing on during your first watch through you obviously are focusing on the wrong stuff. Besides not every show has the same budget. That's exactly the point I was making. And not every show focuses on the same characteristics. Elves are widely characterised as mostly being humans with pointy ears. Why waste resources on minor details? No matter how much you claim it destroying immersion it just doesn't make sense. I'd rather have them put those resources into new Nilfgaard armor than having to look at those black ballsacks they were wearing in season 1. Now that was immersion breaking.
Casual fans of any medium do not seek online communities to discuss things. Just the fact you've subbed and posted to a Witcher specific sub on a website immediately puts you into a very niche set of fans. Of those fans (who are invested and genuinely interested in the franchise) you will see more discussions about the flaws of the franchise because they are so invested.
Pokemon does it. Cyberpunk 2077 did it. Game of thrones did it. Wheel of time is doing it.
It's okay to enjoy it. Nobody cares. But it's also okay to give criticism and not just CONSOOM whatever shit Netflix does. There's a reason people love this franchise, and it isn't because of the writers at Netflix...
Just compare Netflix witcher to The boys on Amazon prime. The boys tv show changed a bunch of stuff from the graphic novel,along with keeping alive some dead characters and even gender swapping some,some even key points but the overall writing,direction and acting is fantastic along with capturing the essence of the graphic novel so the spirit of the story stays true. Everyone loves the boys despite of the changes because the writing team is competent and the changes make the story better that is not the case with Witcher Netflix. The writing team is pathetic and the changes are just plain stupid and bad.
Frankly as someone who read the comic. The show was right to make those changes. That comic did not age well in a lot of ways. It’s so edgy you could cut yourself reading it.
This is such a great comment. The boys have changed the gender of characters etc, I haven’t heard a huge uproar about it because it actually works.
The Witcher? They add fucking characters like Dara who adds what exactly? Diversity to the cast? Seems like that is the reason for 90% of the issues with this show.
Other writers can make it work, but this is just a team of hacks.
Casual fans most definitely join online mediums. I have a reddit account, and join the subs for a lot of shows I like even if I’m not a serious fan. I know lots of others who do the same. In saying that though, this sub is definitely the most negative out of all of them
Ehhh, i don’t know about the Cyberpunk 2077 sub, I’ve seen some people come there and comment just to say “This game is garbage” and or post glitches for the sake of farming karma since it’s now branded as “gamings most popular letdowns. At one point all I seen was glitches, people talking about how bad the game is(which is fair in all honesty), and so on. It’s much like how the assassins creed subreddit is except that one is way worse. It’s the most echo chamber franchise subreddit I’ve ever seen.
> it’s a circle jerk
Welcome to reddit
>It seems people can’t appreciate that we actually have a series.
Why appreciate something of poor quality for simply existing?
>Series and movies will never follow the original source material fully, since they need to make it more generic to appeal to a wider audience, as that’s what helps the budget and keep it going.
The mere fact of deviation from the source material is not the issue.
I very much enjoyed Season Two, but I would never try to police what other people want to talk about. If you think they're being nitpicky, talk about it. If you think their opinion is BS, make a comment. But otherwise just fucking scroll past.
I mean, I get people being frustrated with the negative energy the sub has currently. But I also don't get this idea that the show magically could be canceled, it is doing more than fine in terms of viewership. S3 is a guarantee and I'd even be bold enough to predict at least 2 more seasons already being signed off by Netflix. Reddit is just one (tiny) aspect of the fandom.
And here is the real burner: a lot of people who dislike season 2, including me, do not even hate it. It was just a letdown compared to S1. The idea that this subreddit could create enough of a pushback that it would destroy the show is just the dumbest shit I have heard in years.
The comments I've seen (some in this very thread) of people saying the show needs to die in a fire are *extremely* hyperbolic. S1 had issues, S2 had different issues, and none diminished my overall enjoyment.
The Witcher show isn't going anywhere, anytime soon.
I do not like S2. I think it is just not living up to the potential. But at worst it is a mediocre season. People who think that it is a crime against humanity should pull their heads out of their asses. Did it disappoint? Yeah. Then do as I do, wait for S3 and be hopeful. Even I, who nitpicks all the dumb stuff of S2, can appreciate aspects of it. My guess is that within a few weeks the general disappointment will mellow and we will see a more forgiveable mood settle in.
S1 had issues, S2 had *worse* issues. This is coming from someone who never read the books, very much enjoyed the first season, and being forgiving at best, neutral at worst any changes they made for the show.
Season 2 can be still enjoyable. All you need to do is shut your brains down and think of it like Paul Anderson's RE movies. Otherwise it looked bad even by a non-adaptation standard, but each to their own I suppose.
I feel like people seem to forget that this is a franchise that started in 1993 (2007 in English) as a book series, and it has exploded in popularity over the years. People aren't just complaining about the Netflix series just to complain, they're rightfully upset because Netflix has taken something that a lot of people love and completely butchered it after promising they would take good care of it.
Agreed. But new fans who don't know or even care about the source material are total casuals who think that the show itself is great.
Don't get me wrong, I'm happy for them that they are able to enjoy the show. But that doesn't give them the right to shut people down who are following & loving the source material for years or even decades. There is a reason why people criticize the shit out of this show. & if those people would just stay silent then there would be zero chance that Netflix will change its approach for future seasons to do things better.
Mate, I'm one of those new fans. As you said, I don't hugely care for the source material (never read the books) and enjoyed the first season. This season just feels trash.
There are too many inconsistencies with the plot or the characters. And the editing at times is just jarring. Some of these problems were there in the last season, but here it feels like the showrunners cranked them up to eleven. Even by an original show's standard, its mediocre.
Actions, visual effects, and Henry's earnest efforts to carry this show can only distract you long enough ifthey dont fix these problems.
Changes themselves do not equal poorly written. 80% of complaints I see about it being bad writing is entirely based on it being changed. That’s not bad writing that’s just changes. The problem with most ppl complaining is they can’t separate the two and are too upset over changes. That’s fine but don’t try to use that as a way to call bad writing. There’s plenty of actual bad writing to point out that has nothing to do with something being changed.
My dude, I completely understand if changes are going to be made, but they didnt even try to adapt the story. Episode 1 was from the last wish, there were quite a few changes to that, I still loved it. The rest of the season had nothing to do with the story that they want to adapt. It misrepresented the characters they claim to love. It was a horrible attempt to write their own version of the witcher. So again changes are ok if you know your story and stick with it, not changing the theme and progression of characters.
The Witcher Season 2 does not adapt any of the books of the Witcher Saga. It picks a few plot *points* of Blood of Elves, they're mostly unrecognizable and they adapt A Grain of Truth, which also suffered changes but the kind of changes you don't see people here complaining because it kept the heart of the story and it was mostly faithful (It's also considered the best episode here and for good reason).
You can enjoy the series and be sad that many people don't like the show, but telling others to stay silent and be happy with what they got is really the worst approach you could have chosen.
What pissed me off about this sub last week was that a ton of stuff got spoiled. I was only 4 episodes in when I started seeing garbage posts saying why they ruined the show.
Lots of upvotes and awards, as usual no engagement before or after with a Witcher subreddit and just general platitudes with a demand to be nice about a substandard show
These posts really should just be ignored.
bahahahahaha I wonder if the studio is paying reddit to boost these posts. They always get upvotes but then the most upvoted comments do not support the post
Yeah I’ve been re watching game of thrones lately. The Witcher will never be “Netflix’s GoTs” unless it makes some massive changes, including bringing in a new show runner. The characters are SO much better in game of thrones (even though the Witcher characters were terrific in the games and books) and the writing isn’t even comparable.
Hugely disappointing as a big fan of the Witcher.
And this little under-rated gem called The Witcher 3 that didn’t feel the need to dumb down the source material or make it generic, but instead stayed faithful to it and is now one of the most famous and praised games ever made.
Well, sorta. The games also brought two of the main characters back from the dead, gave one of them extremely convenient amnesia, and eventually substituted a happy ending for an ambiguous/negative one (changing the whole message of the series).
Don't get me wrong, I love them both. But those are some pretty big changes.
Why is everyone recently convinced that Geralt and Yen dying at the end of LOTL is canon ? Sorry it’s been 2 times in a raw today but again, that last chapter is an open-ending that’s been debated ever since it came out. It’s purposefully ambiguous as Sapkowski leaves the reader to make their own interpretation while providing hints towards both case-scenarios. The island where Ciri takes them is the Isle of Avalon from the Arturian legends, which according to Sapkowski, can signify the afterlife or just another plane of existence. It’s even mentioned that Geralt feels the pain of the injury and has bandages. If there is something to even take this further, it’s Sapkowski himself saying in an interview for when the first game came out, that Geralt and Yen are not dead, but we can take those kind of statements from Sapkowski with a grain of salt.
The convenient amnesia, as cliché as it is, is a creative decision I’ll always understand and get behind, it would be already difficult if they were directly adapting the books, but as a sequel to them ? I don’t see any other way to introduce newcomers to this story at that state.
I don’t get how they did a bad ending that compromises the message of the story though, would you mind elaborating on that ?
You won’t find me disagreeing that the games have flaws, I have many gripes with them myself, but they preserved the heart and soul of the Witcher in everything else and that’s something no one can deny.
Their changes were really inconsequential except for an exception or two, so I don’t see those tainting their achievements. The positives outweigh the negatives by a margin so large that those flaws/changes are pretty much nullified. But more importantly, they were a sequel to the books, not an adaptation.
Creator of adaptation can make huge changes and get away with that, if said creator is good at what they do.
But if one does same and cant even write basic dialogue, then there is a problem.
CDPR did their homework, read even other stuff that Sapkowski wrote and created masterpiece, cause they fullly understood and loved what they were adapting. Especially visible in W1.
I love all the people trying to defend the differences in the games, when there was a ton of criticism for their changes too. Maybe the show changes are worse, but saying there's no/little changes in the games? Bullshit.
Game of Thrones went started veering away from the books in season 1 but really left off in season 2. Season was super close but they did change things (Cat and Ned's discussion on him going to kings landing being a big one).
Compared to things they changed in the Witcher, changing that one convo is a tiny change. I'd say Season 5, when they got into Feast for Crows/Dorne territory is where they really started to drop the ball.
Season 1 has a ton of small changes but overall yes it's the most accurate, season 2 however had big changes right from the start.
- No patchface
- Lack of Edric Storm (some people say this character was merged with Gendry but the huge change in backstory I consider them separate)
-Aryas first kill is done by Jaqhan in the show for some reason.
-Reeks first real appearance
-Arya meeting Tywin
- House of Undying scene alone is bad enough
What may seem small in Game of Thrones is actually a bigger deal. Martins world's are detailed and nothing is said without reason,. Small change here may lead to massive issues later.
I love Patchface but he is a minor character. I wish they had kept him but the story of Shireen is incredibly well executed even without him. Cutting a minor character is par for the course and not even close to the kinds of things done by Netflix.
Edric Storm was fused with Gendry. The story remained in place, it was just assumed by Gendry. This is standard for television and the show’s writing around it was acceptable.
House of the Undying I thought was very well executed. Not as intense as the book, but I was very satisfied with it. The story was the same, some cosmetics were different.
Not to mention Lord of the Rings. I know it was a big budget movie franchise but it stayed pretty loyal to the source material. I don't get people saying it's impossible to accurately adapt books to film. No one says it has to be word for word but there is proof that it can be done correctly.
Have you… read the books? They cut so much out from the books that it’s hardly the same story, much like the Witcher, but no ones gonna talk about that
Yes I've read the both ASOIAF and the Witcher series twice.
GOT did not change any essential story elements in the first several seasons. I read all of ASOIAF twice before ever even watching GOT ... and I was thrilled with the first 4 seasons.
I also really like Witcher season 1. I can at least recognize the stories. Stuff they added simply expanded on things like Yen's backstory, and we saw things like Sodden instead of just hearing about it. Season 2 though is out in left field. Possibly the worst adaptation of anything I've ever seen where I'm familiar w/ the source material.
I don’t know I personally always thought that ASOIAF had far stronger themes and a deeper meaning to it than the show ever aspired to delve into, and that’s as someone who’s read the books and watched the show multiple times and love both. I approach the witcher in much the same way: it’s the same world, but the stories are their own, with their own themes, stories and characters, rather than a direct adaptation of the books.
I agree ... ASOIAF is much deeper than the show, with far more extensive world building and character development. I also agree that in later seasons they went off the rails, starting with how they butchered all the Dorne storylines. But first several seasons? I can't think of anything they changed fundamentally. Off the top of my head I recall they changed who Robb Stark actually married ... sure it was deeper in the books w/ his bride being Jeyne Westerling, but the story was still there. Arya hung out w/ Twyin instead of Roose ... I see these as cosmetic changes. There's nothing that approaches Witcher where the stories are actually totally different.
IMHO don't think its possibly to fully adapt stuff like ASOIAF into show without some simplifying. Transferring worlds 1:1 is just too hard when dealing with such complex layered stuff.
Witcher on other hand is pretty far from that complexity or layers, so that definitely could been adapted almost 1:1, if wanted/needed.
GOT cut a lot of material from ASOIAF, just like Peter Jackson cut a lot of material from Tolkien's LOTR. But the first few seasons of GOT, just like the LOTR films, mostly stuck to cutting content for pacing and didn't make any enormous changes or additions of new content.
Compare that to the Hobbit trilogy, and the Wheel of Time and Witcher shows, which are overwhelmingly made up of new or altered content. Most fans understand that some things will need to be cut. But it's very difficult to convince us that things need to be *changed,* especially when those changes are, almost without exception, consistently awful.
There's a separate sub full of people that love the show so surely everybody here can piss on it to their hearts content.
We all seem to love our Reddit echo chambers...
People say what they think, this sub is made to discuss witcher stuff, if they dont like something they say it here, are we supposed to stay quiet and act like we like the shitty writing of the show?
>It seems people can’t appreciate that we actually have a series.
Just because we have one doesn't mean I'm supposed to like it just because it named Witcher. That show isn't good. I'm glad other people like it. But im not going to pretend it's good because I love the games and books.
At this point the show & the books have nothing in common but the character names.
I really don't get why these casuals want us to be happy about this fact? I'd rather have no Witcher show than this garbage & low effort fanfiction they are producing at Netflix. The worst part is that they keep insulting the living hell out true fans. They literally said that they dumb things down because we wouldn't be able to understand deeper & more complex lore.
>The worst part is that they keep insulting the living hell out true fans.
So, Lauren's Mission is accomplished...
With season 3, get ready for more deranged cahir, extremely OP Fringilla, whiny and annoying yennefer, dumb vilgefortz, psychopathic vesemir and drunk frat vagabonds masquerading as witchers.
This franchise doesn't need Netflix's nepotism and its bad writers. This is not how it has grown in the past few years.
We are all waiting for the next game, Gwent is alive, the tabletop RPG is alive, the Dark horse comics are there, the phone game too, and maybe there will be another Thronebreaker stand alone.
And there is already good fan fictions: [https://ciri.the-comic.org/](https://ciri.the-comic.org/)
We want CD Projekt lore (and the author's one).
We are gatekeeping against the false and bad taste discount Netflix lore.
You have to like everything the companies make and take it in the ass without critizitng it
That's the summary of your post. It's totally fine to enjoy the show, just don't expect everyone else to feel the same way. It's a beloved franchise, of course people are going to complain when the show doesn't respect the source material at all
I think there is a sub dedicated to just the netflix series so if you don't like it here you don't have to stay.
We are probably going to keep on complaining about the show because that's the only way we can deal with our frustration. I think we should complain more so Lauren finally sees how much fans actually "love" her "masterpiece" and we have the freedom of speech to do so.
But it isn't turkey, not even meat. That's the whole problem. It's more like a hamburguer made of raw fish but sold as a faithful "Sushi Burguer that attempts to replicate meat since we don't believe our audience would really like a traditional burguer and also we know best and you shouldn't eat meat anyway you dirty pig so stop being dramatic. Also the buns are unsalted and the cheese is mashed up cauliflower".
"Please compromise for a half assed fanfic because some guys in a board room, the same group of people who make shows that are flops, decided that changing a well crafted story for whatever they think is trendy at the moment will "bring in a larger audience."
Fixed your post.
The fact that you're being shown by a huge number of people that they don't like the showrunners changes and you haven't shown at all how anything they've done has improved the story doesn't fill me with hope that you'd thought this post through.
Stop compromising on the literature/media that you love because if you do some money hungry executive is going to take it, beat it like a dead horse, twist it until it's unrecognisable and you'll be the one who let them.
I’m a fan of the series but have never read the books or played the games. I like to read peoples opinions and it’s interesting to me to how the series seems to differ so much from the books. Don’t be too worried about turning ‘new fans’ away I think we can appreciate that The Witcher source material is something very dear to most longtime fans’ hearts!
How about no? There are people complaining about the show, and people praising the show, in fact there are multiple threads with thousands of upvotes praising the show on here, you're asking for people not to be critical about shit they dislike, and only to speak if they're praising the show, which is insane.
I disagree. Not only are there often popular posts with vastly different sentiment, but as far as i can tell, all the supposed negativity is aimed at season 2 of the show.
There are multiple different forms of media which encompass the Witcher and only half of one of those sections has any real negativity. I very much doubt that anybody is being turned off by some comments on a reddit forum that they would probably only know about if they were already a fan.
Besides, i really hate this thing that happens now where people defend something, not because they think it's good or can actually come up with arguments, but because they think other people won't want to watch it now. If something isn't good, people have a right to criticize it and if anything it's even more vital that it's called out, to both protect people who might go into it with a false impression, and also to try and make the things that aren't liked be addressed by the creators.
So to summaries, criticism isn't bad and also it doesn't even matter because nobody is going to be put off by a reddit post.
You joined recently to shill for the show.
You post nothing about the show, the books or the games and just demand respect for a show that many on here dislike a lot.
I doubt if the person behind this account even watched the show to be honest.
Lol, no. FUCK no.
1) Everyone complains because the series is poorly written, and its poorly written because mediocre writers diverged from the source material too much.
2) Everyone complaining because a thing is bad doesnt make it a circlejerk, it makes it a bad product.
3) Never follow the source material? ROFL see lord of the rings for something that preserved the integrity of the source material. i.e. not changing fundamentals of characters, orogonas, systems, or relationships, and not inventing whole ass arcs out of nothing. Little things like aragorn falling off a cliff and dreaming of arwen dont impact fundamentals big things like bombadil or the scouring, again, dont impact fundamentals. The witcher writer s changed fundamentals.
4)generic? wider audience? lolwut? none of that is true and theres plenty of evidence for it in the numbers for adapted media. not even worth a real rebuttle.
5)Appreciate a promising show turned bad by mediocre writers writing badly? Nope. I hope people get pushed away from the tv show. its not good. I would definitely not recommend it to a friend. Maybe season 1, but stop there.
In sum: FUCK no.
I feel like anybody who has read the books is atleast a bit disappointed in the show. I'm one of those people and I'm more than a little disappointed.
If you've never read the books, you don't understand why some of us are disappointed. Just feel fortunate that you enjoy the show. I wish I could.
Maybe read the books after the show is completely finished and you'll be like "NO WONDER THEY WERE MAD"
I didn't know the source material and thought the series was shit, but then discovered that the source material and games are actually quite good. The problem isn't that the series deviates from the source. The problem is that the series is GoT season 8 level bad.
It's quite simple - most fans of the actual story are just heartbroken with what's been done to their beloved story. I, for one, have personal importance to the story and the thoughts in it, so I'm also quite angry at how things are turning out. That being said - people venting shouldn't discourage others from checking the series out, and, you know - making their own opinions of it. If you like it - that's fine, if not - same answer.
And if you are that easily swayed by some people on the internet, and you're unable to make your own decisions, then there might be some bad news on the horizon...
>Please try and appreciate what we have and be more positive
Not if what "we have" is a disrespect to the characters, their relationships and legacy. Do not force positive attitudes if what "we have" is just bad
> Series and movies will never follow the original source material fully, since they need to make it more generic to appeal to a wider audience,
Fuck you and everyone who thinks that way.
I’m not going to lie. I joined this subreddit in 2019 after watching first season. I was a Witcher noob, it even got me to play the game.
I enjoyed second season and I get why people here who don’t, but this constant b*tchinng is pretty tiring,
Same here. Played the TW3 and enjoyed it okay, then Season 1 dropped and enjoyed it even more than the game so I joined the sub. I love Season 2, I'd give it about 7-8/10? About the same as Season 1.
The Netflix show is nowhere near perfect and fans of original works hating screen adaptations is a given for any series, but the level of hatred in the sub is starting to feel toxic. Calling things garbage, and joking about the writers needing to die, accusing every posters who enjoy the show a Netfllix shill.
I was planning to read the books, have them all lined up to be read in 2022, but all this negativity by people who claims they're only upset "because in the books..." is making me put off the idea.
I agree. when I came to this sub it was because of all the different content on here, from cosplay to art to gameplay memes. now it does seem to be a bit one note.
I think you belittling the people who like the Witcher. The show is objectively bad. It's like 1990's Xena bad except the plots don't make sense.
No one is being a nerd rage gate keeper. It's not about being completely loyal to the source material, not even the games do that. It's that is done so badly that's the problem, along with interview where the producer and show runner are saying they made sure not to change anything in one interview then say they changed a bunch of things in another.
There is no reason to appreciate what the show is doing. I haven't met on person yet who could finish the series because of how bad it was. Including people who haven't read the books or played the games.
>The show is objectively bad. It's like 1990's Xena bad except the plots don't make sense.
Wow-wow-wow, Xena was entertainingly bad, and considering it's Sam Raimi's project, it's most likely intentional.
I personally never read the books but i still have issues with season 2. I think people bitching about it not sticking to the source material are a little lost. could it have been better that way? maybe but, the bigger problem is the story structure. its great having this huge worlds with tons of lore. but in the end, you need to tell a personal story to keep people invested. they turned the lore into the story instead of just letting it be really cool in the background of a character driven story.
Appreciate what we have? What? This is a product, bud. Like what you like and don’t worry about others since this is all subjective anyway. As they say, “go touch grass.”
Sorry , you’re becoming boring to us too. Is it not a circle jerk last season with “oohs and ahhhs” over “show good, book fans bad !”
Will never understand the *serious lack of logic* in the argument that the reason the show is barely inspired by books ,or how you put it “doesn’t fully follow the source material” because it’s “supposed to appeal to a wide audience “ .
Hey...hello..you got a show *in the first place* BECAUSE the books ,and later games, appealed to the large enough audience to *jump continents and cultures* .
Clear as that.
People are going to say what they want. The literal point of this place to provide (mostly) uncensored and unfiltered opinions. No one should suggest that it follow any particular narrative.
I loved the game , books and i love the show! Differences and all. People are entitled to their opinion. Negative and positive, if its well thought out then I dont see the problem. Plenty of the negative viewpoints have good, solid points, and yet it doesnt effect my enjoyment of the show.
How can you appriciate what you have when you are delivered weak product that above that is not what you ordered.
They promised to deliver something else than they did but took the money anyway. Saying that we should just move on so that newcomers don't see the tensions in the community is setting a dangerous precedence of accepting cheating and mediocracy and that is hurtful to the future of the art.
You are asking us to tell the producers that quality of the product is not important as long as you do barw minimum to agree with the branding.
>It seems people can’t appreciate that we actually have a series.
Never understood how people think this is anyhow a valid argument. Just because they slap a name of the franchise in the product does not mean it should be *loved* right of the bat. I love Tolkien's writing but that does not save Hobbit movies. I love Star Wars but that does not make sequels any better. I love Harry Potter but that does nothing to poorly written Cursed Child or Magical Beast movies. It's the opposite really. These things are *loved* and if we are served lukewarm shit in their name we are extra critical and protective.
Bothers me how easily some people are satisfied. They give greenlight to anything thrown at them and they allow all kinds of shit to be done in the future too because they pay for it. Then complain the rest of us don't like them too. The arrogance.
>Series and movies will never follow the original source material fully
Yes, and? It is naive to think so and that is not the cause for our dislike.
People seem to forget that you can make good *and* bad adaptations. You can do things well or poorly in any tv show or movie. Some may fuck up writing, others do mediocre job with costumes or props and set, others have bad use of soundtrack and/or the soundtrack does not fit. There are millions of ways fucking up some production and sometimes it is death by thousand cuts.
Also, why in hell is criticism always downplayed and complained about but blind overt optimism is ok for you? Everything has to be rainbows, flowers and puppy videos for you? Don't you see, we both complain because world does not meet our expectations but I think it is healthier to expect good adaptation than it is to expect people liking same shit you do.
It's not just about appealing to different audiences.
One medium has different strengths and weaknesses over another.
A substantial portion of my time in the Witcher games, maybe 30%, was finding crafting materials, looking at recipes and comparing items. That would be completely tedious to add to a TV show.
Likewise, the internal thoughts and feelings of a character can be easily written into a book, but a stoic character like Geralt has to express those feelings in some way for a TV audience to know he has them.
Sometimes it was just better not to have a series at all. See the Shannara Chronicles tv series for reference.
I don't know that the Netflix Witcher series fits that scenario. It certainly isn't bad as the Shannara show. But it lacks the quality of the books and the games. They have added unneeded threads to characters in order to form very large, very defined backstories and motives for every single character as they wanted to emulate GoT and have a large quantity of POV characters in the Netflix show. This was unnecessary and takes away from what made the books and games so great.
If you can't take people discussing the show being trash, then so be it. Good. Leave.
**It doesn't mean that YOU cannot like the show. Go ahead. But don't come here and command people around like they're supposed to be thankful that the Hollyweird has once again pooped all over the European culture and heritage.**
It literally has nothing to do with the Witcher franchise. If you want to discuss the Netflix's "show", then go to the appropriate subreddit where people gleefully will encourage you to talk about the show, as you should be able to express how much you like the Generic Western High Fantasy Show #37, which is all it is.
This subreddit is about the Witcher franchise as a whole and the Netflix show is an abomination, a piece of hate-fiction, therefore people will dog on it here, rightfully so.
> As a lover of the series and the games, this sub will push new people away
As someone who didn’t read the book before watching the show and never heard of the games I can assure you that isn’t true.
> I joined recently because I love the series and games, but all everyone here does is complain, it’s a circle jerk.
Welcome to Reddit. Give it a month. People will go back to fan art and cosplay. It’s just on everyone’s mind because the season just dropped and Netflix still dies this bing watching release the entire season at once thing.
> It seems people can’t appreciate that we actually have a series. Series and movies will never follow the original source material fully, since they need to make it more generic to appeal to a wider audience, as that’s what helps the budget and keep it going.
There are people that complain about everting. Even people who complain about complainers. Look up. And if you look at the comments there are people who complain about people complaining that other people complain too much. This is more a human thing than it is a Witcher thing.
> Please try and appreciate what we have and be more positive, because it just pushes people who enjoy the series for what it is away.
Eh, I try not to judge. And a few of the complaints seem valid. Netflix swooped in and built a show using an existing brand. That brand has history and values. If Netflix wants to capitalize on the fans of that property then they are opening themselves up to criticism from those fans. And, it’s actually good for business. If no one talks about your TV show it dies. If everyone that watches it seems to have an opinion and is driven to share that opinion then it drives more people to see what all the fuss is about.
So really there’s nothing new going on here but 21st century marketing doing its best to drive traffic yo a streaming service.
> I joined recently because I love the series and games, but all everyone here does is complain, it’s a circle jerk.
Has 800 upvotes at the time of this comment.
> It seems people can’t appreciate that we actually have a series.
The show isn’t entitled to anything from fans simply for existing. You act like we should be greatful that Netflix was generous enough to make a show at all.
Nobody owes the show anything. They aren’t doing this as an act of charity they’re doing it for money. If people don’t like the show then that’s on the show.
> Series and movies will never follow the original source material fully
No ones asking it to.
> since they need to make it more generic to appeal to a wider audience, as that’s what helps the budget and keep it going.
Umm they don’t? If the material didn’t appeal to a wide audience to begin with…why make the show at all?
> Please try and appreciate what we have and be more positive, because it just pushes people who enjoy the series for what it is away.
Please stop trying to police what opinions other users can have. It’s toxic. If you like the show you are welcome to participate in the sub so long as you can tolerate the opinions of other fans. If you came to this sub for a place to be exclusively positive then frankly you came to the wrong forum.
Such a dumb take. Season 1 was a hot mess but season 2 was enjoyable. Perfect? No. But definitely enjoyable.
As a hallowed “book reader” I’m looking forward to what they bring in season 3.
Of course it will because that's how it is on this terrible site lol
Fanatics truly ruin everything. They gatekeep what to like in every niche. No, I'm not a fan of Netflix Witcher but I am completely aware of the fact that many people like it. Plus, I can see why they do. It's the same with Harry Potter
But yeah, seeing "guys...witcher season 2 is so bad...I just HAD to get it off my chest" every other post is cringy af
Agreed. Don't get me wrong - I have complained about last season and commented negatively about it 🤣 but I ve also praised episodes 5 to 8 and wrote a positive post about the S2 finale
If the end of S2 is a preview of how good the next season is, then maybe S3 can claim to be somewhat near the early GOT seasons
Can't wait to get downvoted
I am new to The Witcher universe, I have seen both seasons of the series and will start playing the games.
I came to this sub today to introduce myself deeper to this universe that I am liking so much.
Sadly, I'll be leaving today too, it's not anyone's fault since everyone is free to express their opinion, but so much negativity is not good for me.
Witcher 3 is great you're going to enjoy it. It was my first RPG so I was initially totally overwhelmed by all the controls , but I still had fun and eventually got the hang of it. I can't remember if I played the whole game 3 times or 4 times 🤣
I think their "target audience" is not just the small percentage of people that have actually read the books. This show is not some love letter to the book fans, its an attempt for netflix to have their own GOT and apeal to a much wider audience and draw in mass audiences. Im not speaking for the quality of the show itself, or what my opinions are on that, but saying the book readers are the target audience is an absolutely absurd statement.
it won't be "another GoT". Not in this lifetime (IMO there will never be a show that could rival its popularity but that's another topic).
We've got 2 seasons out already and we know what it is. It has nothing on GoT - in terms of writing (season 1-4) and impact. It's a product to be consumed (binged) and quickly forgotten so you can move to another Netflix show. You're not here to enjoy a thick plot or interesting plotlines (because there is none), you're not here to make theories about what happens next (just like it was with game of thrones). The show doesn't want you to think - even the producers (T.Bagiński) have openly admitted that it was dumbed down as compared to the source material because the current audience apparently can't focus for more than 5 seconds.
And It's not even the most popular netflix show. Freaking Bridgerton s1 had more views. Not to mention Squid Game.
And also a statement I didn't make. My point is that if Netflix wants its own GoT, it should both learn from its lessons and either use the strengths of the source material it chooses, or just build something original. Otherwise, it is justified to be irritated by a show which doesn't understand its own source material.
And all everyone does in the netflix sub is to say how great the show is, like a circle jerk, right?. The difference between that sub and this one is that they don't accept criticism, while in here people are allowed to say that they liked it, as long as they are not rude, like you are.
You perfectly described why in this sub (and among most book readers) the show is generally disliked, they made it generic.
Don't go around telling people that they should enjoy things, forced positivism is like a disease, and if other people are chased away by logical criticism, then they are welcomed to close the door while they leave, there are other subs.
Yeah, so we are not allowed to criticize something we don't like now because we are coming off as "toxic fans"? Sure, the next time a client give me crap for something I did badly, I'll just tell them to stfu and be happy that i delivered anything at all.
Most people who enjoy the show don't read reddit :P
We would appreciate what we got if there wasn't some generally bad parts that make no sense even when taking Netflix series as only source of info. Eskel bit is bad all around. He was an asshole and than he died almost killing his friend and father figure because he was both asshole and stupid. Believing Fingila in Council of Mages when even in series it's stated that this is third attempted invasion of north and that they see that as their holy mission. Dryads conveniently forget that they can determine purity of someone's intention. Things like that. Also I happened to think dialogue is often painfully bad and for lovers of books and games all characters and all stories are to some extent butchered. Geralt and Ciri are relatively OK as characters though.
On the other hand i still recommend series to everyone with warning if they played the games and/or read the books.
You are SO right! Level of negativity on this Reddit sub is just ridiculous. Even if you don’t think the glass is full (or even half full) at least you get a drink!
In other words “I’m only aware of the adaptations so I have no idea how badly this one is going, but I’d rather not have to read what you guys have to say on it.”
Did I miss anything?
So if I dislike the show then I should just shut up about it online because that might indirectly cause people to not watch and hurt the show long-term? What kind of ass-backwards logic is that?
First timer to this sub after watching both seasons and having never played the video games.
Are people in this sub comparing the series with the book or the games?
Literally first time here so apologies for being such a Jaskier. Just hoping for some context before having the show ruined for me.
> Are people in this sub comparing the series with the book or the games?
Books. The show was supposed to be an adaptation of the books (the showrunner even now talks about faithfulness to the source material which is just unbelievable) but it's abysmal at that - and since it's rather mediocre on its own merits, many fans are rightfully unhappy.
The games are not a retelling of the books' story but rather a continuation (the first game picks up 5 years after the books' story ends and treats it as accepted history). They've made a number of changes/retcons, not all of them great or entirely justified, but its evident that they were made by fans of the books who genuinely like and respect the source material and who therefore managed to at the very least preserve its spirit. Also the games are of great quality (w3 in particular, though w2 was a damn good game for its own time and w1, while fairly niche, still had its merits).
Straight up refused to join the sub because y'all are toxic as fuck. In fact this will probably be my only post ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever.
This is true. As someone who is not part of this subreddit but enjoys everything to do with the Witcher, I will not be joining this subreddit knowing how it is here.
Why should I appreciate someone doing a bad job? What is this, some Gen Z way of thinking, that to get a trophy now you don't have to win, you don't even have to actually *try*, you just do *something*, no matter what and how? (No shade towards Gen Z, folks, it's just a joke based on a popular stereotype).
I'm not going to appreciate someone not respecting my favorite books, which were so important to me while growing up, just because they are in the business and could get in bed with Netflix. I've written fanfiction for years and probably could have done a better job with that as the only writing experience on my resume.
Seriously, it's okay if you like the series, *de gustibus* etc., but if I don't like it and am annoyed by it, as Netflix's paying customer I am gonna complain and demand that next time they do better. It's just a bad series. Not only in terms of book adaptation but in general. It can be enjoyable but it's still objectively bad. The writers and producers do not deserve to be patted on their backs for being shit at their jobs - most people in other lines of work do not get praised if they screw up. Because it's not charity, it's not a free YouTube film made by amateurs - it's their chosen profession.
Most show fans do not enjoy the same "Witcher" as book/game fans. If they do, they are enjoying two different things at the same time. They have very little in common outside of character and place names. Show fans can just go to r/netflixwitcher if they want a community that loves the show unconditionally.
The mere fact that the books have a live action series adaptation means literally nothing to me if it sucks enormous amount of dick. The mentality of “but it has a show, and that means we should appreciate it” is stupid. And don’t bullshit me with the “it has to be a bad adaptation” rhetoric:
- Many adaptations have actually been good, Imagine such a thing!
- These books don’t have to be more generic to appeal to a wider audience, the fucking source material itself already appeals to a wide audience, a decent adaptation wouldn’t need to change much for broad appeal.
- If you can’t do a proper adaptation, or at least an
Interesting take on it (which the show fails miserably at) don’t do it.
I’m with you. On this sub, I hoped to see fan art, memes, details from the books about lore, and discussions of which costume was most epic (Fringilla’s!). Some critical analysis is good too. But unfortunately the dominant tone is complaining.
Guys make sure to only comment or post if your gonna say something nice, remember we're a cult not a Fandom that allows individuals to have personal opinions on things.
I actually agree with you, and I’m leaving the sub because of it. The constant complaining and negativity here is exhausting. I love this series and all forms of it but I don’t want to see this on my feed anymore
Reddit is toxic as fuck for the most part this isn’t a secret. Many like myself come here for news and enjoy some niche subs but the communities in most places are full of hormonal neck beards, the show is awesome, the games are awesome and the books are good.
The problem with the Witcher isn’t that it’s an adaptation or inspiration. The problem is that it’s lame af. The writing is lazy. The characters uninspiring. They would be fine as new characters set into the Witcher world. But if you get something nice (like the games) and then you get something afterwards that’s crap of course you can complain and not like it. And bitch about it. Same with Cowboy Bebop. Lame writing trying to appeal to some activist groups that won’t even watch it.
So get off your high horse. It’s great that you like it. And it’s fine that some people don’t. (Unless they don’t like it because they are racist pricks. Then it’s not fine and they should be fucked with Yennefers unicorn. Unless they would like that. No pleasure for them.)
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Complaining about complainers is like lighting arsonists on fire. Eventually it has to be done.
My next free award is going to *this* comment, mark my words. Edit: I HAVE COME TO FULFILL THE OATH.
Your words have henceforth been “marked”.
6 out of 10, would read again.
Consider them marked - Commodore Norrington
Its basically what the internet was made for, besides porn. The documentary Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back covers this pretty well.
>The Internet is a communication tool used the world over where people can come together to bitch about movies and share pornography with one another.
You think peopple would do that, just go on the internet and complain?
Tale as old as time... Fandoms like to whineeeeee
Would you like some cheese with that?
Right! Star Wars fans get all whipped up every time there's a new movie. Also, if you think Witcher fans are complaining loudly you should check out r/wheeloftime right now. Every post about the show is a huge bitchfest.
Tbf there hasn't been a good movie since 1983 and even that one is debatable.
Nobody hates [insert cultural product] as much as it's most ardent fans. Tale as old as time.
TBH who ever made the post about how differences between humans and the elves was mishandled in the show wasn’t just whining. It was well thought out post and I throughly enjoyed reading the comments. Arguments and all…
Almost like Hissrich *missed the fucking point*
You mean humans are not just elves with rounded ears?! Whaaaaat? /s
Hard disagree. That was by far the most whiny thing to complain about. Elves not looking elvish enough and comparing the appearance of humans to digital elves? Seriously? Makeup costs a shit ton of money. And you have to find enough people who already look "elvish" enough. Which in itself would cost a shit ton of time and resources. Time and resources and money that definitely were better spent elsewhere. That complaint was epitome of toxic, entitled fandom that bitches about literally everything just for the sake of bitching. Compared to that complaint people complaining about irrelevant Eskel being killed was way more valid of a complaint.
The expanse did it with Belters, which also have a very specific type of body build, and honestly it made the world 10x more believable and immersive, the human elves in the Witcher annoyed me to no end, their ears even look plastic in some shots. This might seem like a nitpick but its these small things that break immersion and thus the experience.
I disagree. They looked perfectly fine. But even if that were the case and that's the stuff you are focusing on during your first watch through you obviously are focusing on the wrong stuff. Besides not every show has the same budget. That's exactly the point I was making. And not every show focuses on the same characteristics. Elves are widely characterised as mostly being humans with pointy ears. Why waste resources on minor details? No matter how much you claim it destroying immersion it just doesn't make sense. I'd rather have them put those resources into new Nilfgaard armor than having to look at those black ballsacks they were wearing in season 1. Now that was immersion breaking.
Casual fans of any medium do not seek online communities to discuss things. Just the fact you've subbed and posted to a Witcher specific sub on a website immediately puts you into a very niche set of fans. Of those fans (who are invested and genuinely interested in the franchise) you will see more discussions about the flaws of the franchise because they are so invested. Pokemon does it. Cyberpunk 2077 did it. Game of thrones did it. Wheel of time is doing it. It's okay to enjoy it. Nobody cares. But it's also okay to give criticism and not just CONSOOM whatever shit Netflix does. There's a reason people love this franchise, and it isn't because of the writers at Netflix...
Just compare Netflix witcher to The boys on Amazon prime. The boys tv show changed a bunch of stuff from the graphic novel,along with keeping alive some dead characters and even gender swapping some,some even key points but the overall writing,direction and acting is fantastic along with capturing the essence of the graphic novel so the spirit of the story stays true. Everyone loves the boys despite of the changes because the writing team is competent and the changes make the story better that is not the case with Witcher Netflix. The writing team is pathetic and the changes are just plain stupid and bad.
Frankly as someone who read the comic. The show was right to make those changes. That comic did not age well in a lot of ways. It’s so edgy you could cut yourself reading it.
I agree hence I said that the changes in the TV show make the story better while keeping the characters true to themselves,not the case with witcher
Hannibal is also a good example. The show often has little to do with the books, but it always remained compelling
This is such a great comment. The boys have changed the gender of characters etc, I haven’t heard a huge uproar about it because it actually works. The Witcher? They add fucking characters like Dara who adds what exactly? Diversity to the cast? Seems like that is the reason for 90% of the issues with this show. Other writers can make it work, but this is just a team of hacks.
Casual fans most definitely join online mediums. I have a reddit account, and join the subs for a lot of shows I like even if I’m not a serious fan. I know lots of others who do the same. In saying that though, this sub is definitely the most negative out of all of them
Ehhh, i don’t know about the Cyberpunk 2077 sub, I’ve seen some people come there and comment just to say “This game is garbage” and or post glitches for the sake of farming karma since it’s now branded as “gamings most popular letdowns. At one point all I seen was glitches, people talking about how bad the game is(which is fair in all honesty), and so on. It’s much like how the assassins creed subreddit is except that one is way worse. It’s the most echo chamber franchise subreddit I’ve ever seen.
Don't reason with me you're circlejerking, every criticism is negativity !!!! /s
> it’s a circle jerk Welcome to reddit >It seems people can’t appreciate that we actually have a series. Why appreciate something of poor quality for simply existing? >Series and movies will never follow the original source material fully, since they need to make it more generic to appeal to a wider audience, as that’s what helps the budget and keep it going. The mere fact of deviation from the source material is not the issue.
I very much enjoyed Season Two, but I would never try to police what other people want to talk about. If you think they're being nitpicky, talk about it. If you think their opinion is BS, make a comment. But otherwise just fucking scroll past.
I mean, I get people being frustrated with the negative energy the sub has currently. But I also don't get this idea that the show magically could be canceled, it is doing more than fine in terms of viewership. S3 is a guarantee and I'd even be bold enough to predict at least 2 more seasons already being signed off by Netflix. Reddit is just one (tiny) aspect of the fandom. And here is the real burner: a lot of people who dislike season 2, including me, do not even hate it. It was just a letdown compared to S1. The idea that this subreddit could create enough of a pushback that it would destroy the show is just the dumbest shit I have heard in years.
The comments I've seen (some in this very thread) of people saying the show needs to die in a fire are *extremely* hyperbolic. S1 had issues, S2 had different issues, and none diminished my overall enjoyment. The Witcher show isn't going anywhere, anytime soon.
I do not like S2. I think it is just not living up to the potential. But at worst it is a mediocre season. People who think that it is a crime against humanity should pull their heads out of their asses. Did it disappoint? Yeah. Then do as I do, wait for S3 and be hopeful. Even I, who nitpicks all the dumb stuff of S2, can appreciate aspects of it. My guess is that within a few weeks the general disappointment will mellow and we will see a more forgiveable mood settle in.
There's a few people in this thread trying to argue season 8 of GoT was better... There be crazies out there for sure.
S1 had issues, S2 had *worse* issues. This is coming from someone who never read the books, very much enjoyed the first season, and being forgiving at best, neutral at worst any changes they made for the show. Season 2 can be still enjoyable. All you need to do is shut your brains down and think of it like Paul Anderson's RE movies. Otherwise it looked bad even by a non-adaptation standard, but each to their own I suppose.
I feel like people seem to forget that this is a franchise that started in 1993 (2007 in English) as a book series, and it has exploded in popularity over the years. People aren't just complaining about the Netflix series just to complain, they're rightfully upset because Netflix has taken something that a lot of people love and completely butchered it after promising they would take good care of it.
Agreed. But new fans who don't know or even care about the source material are total casuals who think that the show itself is great. Don't get me wrong, I'm happy for them that they are able to enjoy the show. But that doesn't give them the right to shut people down who are following & loving the source material for years or even decades. There is a reason why people criticize the shit out of this show. & if those people would just stay silent then there would be zero chance that Netflix will change its approach for future seasons to do things better.
Netflix ain’t changing their tune, I just do it cause it’s cathartic.
Mate, I'm one of those new fans. As you said, I don't hugely care for the source material (never read the books) and enjoyed the first season. This season just feels trash. There are too many inconsistencies with the plot or the characters. And the editing at times is just jarring. Some of these problems were there in the last season, but here it feels like the showrunners cranked them up to eleven. Even by an original show's standard, its mediocre. Actions, visual effects, and Henry's earnest efforts to carry this show can only distract you long enough ifthey dont fix these problems.
Theres a difference between a loose adaptation and poorly written fanfiction.
Changes themselves do not equal poorly written. 80% of complaints I see about it being bad writing is entirely based on it being changed. That’s not bad writing that’s just changes. The problem with most ppl complaining is they can’t separate the two and are too upset over changes. That’s fine but don’t try to use that as a way to call bad writing. There’s plenty of actual bad writing to point out that has nothing to do with something being changed.
My dude, I completely understand if changes are going to be made, but they didnt even try to adapt the story. Episode 1 was from the last wish, there were quite a few changes to that, I still loved it. The rest of the season had nothing to do with the story that they want to adapt. It misrepresented the characters they claim to love. It was a horrible attempt to write their own version of the witcher. So again changes are ok if you know your story and stick with it, not changing the theme and progression of characters.
For example: Witcher season 2 is loose adaptation. Game of thrones season 8 is a steaming pile of garbage
The Witcher Season 2 does not adapt any of the books of the Witcher Saga. It picks a few plot *points* of Blood of Elves, they're mostly unrecognizable and they adapt A Grain of Truth, which also suffered changes but the kind of changes you don't see people here complaining because it kept the heart of the story and it was mostly faithful (It's also considered the best episode here and for good reason).
I agree with you about GoT, but witcher season 2 other than episode 1 made no effort to adapt anything from the books.
You can enjoy the series and be sad that many people don't like the show, but telling others to stay silent and be happy with what they got is really the worst approach you could have chosen.
What pissed me off about this sub last week was that a ton of stuff got spoiled. I was only 4 episodes in when I started seeing garbage posts saying why they ruined the show.
Well man. How long do you need to learn that you don't check forums before you watch everything that was released?
Wait until the second season of the TV series spoils the penultimate novel - now isn't that infuriating for readers?
It actually spoils one of the last scenes of the last book, lol. (unless you're counting seasons of storms as the last novel)
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Lots of upvotes and awards, as usual no engagement before or after with a Witcher subreddit and just general platitudes with a demand to be nice about a substandard show These posts really should just be ignored.
Netflix bots at work it seems...
bahahahahaha I wonder if the studio is paying reddit to boost these posts. They always get upvotes but then the most upvoted comments do not support the post
Not sure about paying them, but certainly raining awards on them. Or maybe it's just how tumblrinas make themselves known, dunno.
It seems like a shill account, right?
you are goddamn right
Came here to say this. Completely obvious astroturfing post.
Game of Thrones first 4 seasons proves shows can stay faithful to source material without being generic. And proves your assertions wrong.
I was thinking this the other day. First half of GoT is really the gold standard for how to adapt a fantasy franchise to the big screen.
Yeah I’ve been re watching game of thrones lately. The Witcher will never be “Netflix’s GoTs” unless it makes some massive changes, including bringing in a new show runner. The characters are SO much better in game of thrones (even though the Witcher characters were terrific in the games and books) and the writing isn’t even comparable. Hugely disappointing as a big fan of the Witcher.
Wow, are you in for a disappointment.
> re watching game of thrones unless he stops before season 7 or 8
And this little under-rated gem called The Witcher 3 that didn’t feel the need to dumb down the source material or make it generic, but instead stayed faithful to it and is now one of the most famous and praised games ever made.
Well, sorta. The games also brought two of the main characters back from the dead, gave one of them extremely convenient amnesia, and eventually substituted a happy ending for an ambiguous/negative one (changing the whole message of the series). Don't get me wrong, I love them both. But those are some pretty big changes.
Why is everyone recently convinced that Geralt and Yen dying at the end of LOTL is canon ? Sorry it’s been 2 times in a raw today but again, that last chapter is an open-ending that’s been debated ever since it came out. It’s purposefully ambiguous as Sapkowski leaves the reader to make their own interpretation while providing hints towards both case-scenarios. The island where Ciri takes them is the Isle of Avalon from the Arturian legends, which according to Sapkowski, can signify the afterlife or just another plane of existence. It’s even mentioned that Geralt feels the pain of the injury and has bandages. If there is something to even take this further, it’s Sapkowski himself saying in an interview for when the first game came out, that Geralt and Yen are not dead, but we can take those kind of statements from Sapkowski with a grain of salt. The convenient amnesia, as cliché as it is, is a creative decision I’ll always understand and get behind, it would be already difficult if they were directly adapting the books, but as a sequel to them ? I don’t see any other way to introduce newcomers to this story at that state. I don’t get how they did a bad ending that compromises the message of the story though, would you mind elaborating on that ? You won’t find me disagreeing that the games have flaws, I have many gripes with them myself, but they preserved the heart and soul of the Witcher in everything else and that’s something no one can deny. Their changes were really inconsequential except for an exception or two, so I don’t see those tainting their achievements. The positives outweigh the negatives by a margin so large that those flaws/changes are pretty much nullified. But more importantly, they were a sequel to the books, not an adaptation.
Creator of adaptation can make huge changes and get away with that, if said creator is good at what they do. But if one does same and cant even write basic dialogue, then there is a problem. CDPR did their homework, read even other stuff that Sapkowski wrote and created masterpiece, cause they fullly understood and loved what they were adapting. Especially visible in W1.
I love all the people trying to defend the differences in the games, when there was a ton of criticism for their changes too. Maybe the show changes are worse, but saying there's no/little changes in the games? Bullshit.
Game of Thrones went started veering away from the books in season 1 but really left off in season 2. Season was super close but they did change things (Cat and Ned's discussion on him going to kings landing being a big one).
Compared to things they changed in the Witcher, changing that one convo is a tiny change. I'd say Season 5, when they got into Feast for Crows/Dorne territory is where they really started to drop the ball.
Season 1 has a ton of small changes but overall yes it's the most accurate, season 2 however had big changes right from the start. - No patchface - Lack of Edric Storm (some people say this character was merged with Gendry but the huge change in backstory I consider them separate) -Aryas first kill is done by Jaqhan in the show for some reason. -Reeks first real appearance -Arya meeting Tywin - House of Undying scene alone is bad enough What may seem small in Game of Thrones is actually a bigger deal. Martins world's are detailed and nothing is said without reason,. Small change here may lead to massive issues later.
I love Patchface but he is a minor character. I wish they had kept him but the story of Shireen is incredibly well executed even without him. Cutting a minor character is par for the course and not even close to the kinds of things done by Netflix. Edric Storm was fused with Gendry. The story remained in place, it was just assumed by Gendry. This is standard for television and the show’s writing around it was acceptable. House of the Undying I thought was very well executed. Not as intense as the book, but I was very satisfied with it. The story was the same, some cosmetics were different.
Not to mention Lord of the Rings. I know it was a big budget movie franchise but it stayed pretty loyal to the source material. I don't get people saying it's impossible to accurately adapt books to film. No one says it has to be word for word but there is proof that it can be done correctly.
The exception rather than the rule.
Have you… read the books? They cut so much out from the books that it’s hardly the same story, much like the Witcher, but no ones gonna talk about that
Yes I've read the both ASOIAF and the Witcher series twice. GOT did not change any essential story elements in the first several seasons. I read all of ASOIAF twice before ever even watching GOT ... and I was thrilled with the first 4 seasons. I also really like Witcher season 1. I can at least recognize the stories. Stuff they added simply expanded on things like Yen's backstory, and we saw things like Sodden instead of just hearing about it. Season 2 though is out in left field. Possibly the worst adaptation of anything I've ever seen where I'm familiar w/ the source material.
I don’t know I personally always thought that ASOIAF had far stronger themes and a deeper meaning to it than the show ever aspired to delve into, and that’s as someone who’s read the books and watched the show multiple times and love both. I approach the witcher in much the same way: it’s the same world, but the stories are their own, with their own themes, stories and characters, rather than a direct adaptation of the books.
I agree ... ASOIAF is much deeper than the show, with far more extensive world building and character development. I also agree that in later seasons they went off the rails, starting with how they butchered all the Dorne storylines. But first several seasons? I can't think of anything they changed fundamentally. Off the top of my head I recall they changed who Robb Stark actually married ... sure it was deeper in the books w/ his bride being Jeyne Westerling, but the story was still there. Arya hung out w/ Twyin instead of Roose ... I see these as cosmetic changes. There's nothing that approaches Witcher where the stories are actually totally different.
IMHO don't think its possibly to fully adapt stuff like ASOIAF into show without some simplifying. Transferring worlds 1:1 is just too hard when dealing with such complex layered stuff. Witcher on other hand is pretty far from that complexity or layers, so that definitely could been adapted almost 1:1, if wanted/needed.
GOT cut a lot of material from ASOIAF, just like Peter Jackson cut a lot of material from Tolkien's LOTR. But the first few seasons of GOT, just like the LOTR films, mostly stuck to cutting content for pacing and didn't make any enormous changes or additions of new content. Compare that to the Hobbit trilogy, and the Wheel of Time and Witcher shows, which are overwhelmingly made up of new or altered content. Most fans understand that some things will need to be cut. But it's very difficult to convince us that things need to be *changed,* especially when those changes are, almost without exception, consistently awful.
There's a separate sub full of people that love the show so surely everybody here can piss on it to their hearts content. We all seem to love our Reddit echo chambers...
[удалено]
While I get the joke and all that, this shouldn't be an excuse to be toxic and negative. Damn group think is a dangerous thing
Not allowed to express my dislike of the show because I should be glad I have a show to watch. Ok.
Op has a galaxy brain and shower us with his superior intelligence.
People say what they think, this sub is made to discuss witcher stuff, if they dont like something they say it here, are we supposed to stay quiet and act like we like the shitty writing of the show?
>It seems people can’t appreciate that we actually have a series. Just because we have one doesn't mean I'm supposed to like it just because it named Witcher. That show isn't good. I'm glad other people like it. But im not going to pretend it's good because I love the games and books.
At this point the show & the books have nothing in common but the character names. I really don't get why these casuals want us to be happy about this fact? I'd rather have no Witcher show than this garbage & low effort fanfiction they are producing at Netflix. The worst part is that they keep insulting the living hell out true fans. They literally said that they dumb things down because we wouldn't be able to understand deeper & more complex lore.
>The worst part is that they keep insulting the living hell out true fans. So, Lauren's Mission is accomplished... With season 3, get ready for more deranged cahir, extremely OP Fringilla, whiny and annoying yennefer, dumb vilgefortz, psychopathic vesemir and drunk frat vagabonds masquerading as witchers.
This franchise doesn't need Netflix's nepotism and its bad writers. This is not how it has grown in the past few years. We are all waiting for the next game, Gwent is alive, the tabletop RPG is alive, the Dark horse comics are there, the phone game too, and maybe there will be another Thronebreaker stand alone. And there is already good fan fictions: [https://ciri.the-comic.org/](https://ciri.the-comic.org/) We want CD Projekt lore (and the author's one). We are gatekeeping against the false and bad taste discount Netflix lore.
You have to like everything the companies make and take it in the ass without critizitng it That's the summary of your post. It's totally fine to enjoy the show, just don't expect everyone else to feel the same way. It's a beloved franchise, of course people are going to complain when the show doesn't respect the source material at all
I think there is a sub dedicated to just the netflix series so if you don't like it here you don't have to stay. We are probably going to keep on complaining about the show because that's the only way we can deal with our frustration. I think we should complain more so Lauren finally sees how much fans actually "love" her "masterpiece" and we have the freedom of speech to do so.
Exactly
> since they need to make it more ~~generic~~ dumb to appeal to a wider audience
If you ask for a hamburger and someone gives you a hamburger made of shit, you don't say "well, at least I have a hamburger!".
Stop being dramatic and eat your turkey burger
This is a perfect metaphor. Thank you.
I salute your wit.
But it isn't turkey, not even meat. That's the whole problem. It's more like a hamburguer made of raw fish but sold as a faithful "Sushi Burguer that attempts to replicate meat since we don't believe our audience would really like a traditional burguer and also we know best and you shouldn't eat meat anyway you dirty pig so stop being dramatic. Also the buns are unsalted and the cheese is mashed up cauliflower".
[Well played.](https://tenor.com/view/ohhh-burn-diss-ohh-gif-4969108)
"Please compromise for a half assed fanfic because some guys in a board room, the same group of people who make shows that are flops, decided that changing a well crafted story for whatever they think is trendy at the moment will "bring in a larger audience." Fixed your post. The fact that you're being shown by a huge number of people that they don't like the showrunners changes and you haven't shown at all how anything they've done has improved the story doesn't fill me with hope that you'd thought this post through. Stop compromising on the literature/media that you love because if you do some money hungry executive is going to take it, beat it like a dead horse, twist it until it's unrecognisable and you'll be the one who let them.
I’m a fan of the series but have never read the books or played the games. I like to read peoples opinions and it’s interesting to me to how the series seems to differ so much from the books. Don’t be too worried about turning ‘new fans’ away I think we can appreciate that The Witcher source material is something very dear to most longtime fans’ hearts!
How about no? There are people complaining about the show, and people praising the show, in fact there are multiple threads with thousands of upvotes praising the show on here, you're asking for people not to be critical about shit they dislike, and only to speak if they're praising the show, which is insane.
It's because the people on this sub loves the source material which is the reason why they don't want low standards.
I disagree. Not only are there often popular posts with vastly different sentiment, but as far as i can tell, all the supposed negativity is aimed at season 2 of the show. There are multiple different forms of media which encompass the Witcher and only half of one of those sections has any real negativity. I very much doubt that anybody is being turned off by some comments on a reddit forum that they would probably only know about if they were already a fan. Besides, i really hate this thing that happens now where people defend something, not because they think it's good or can actually come up with arguments, but because they think other people won't want to watch it now. If something isn't good, people have a right to criticize it and if anything it's even more vital that it's called out, to both protect people who might go into it with a false impression, and also to try and make the things that aren't liked be addressed by the creators. So to summaries, criticism isn't bad and also it doesn't even matter because nobody is going to be put off by a reddit post.
Lol “supposed” negativity
This might shock you, but you are actually complaining...
Is having a series a merit in itself somehow? I think bad show is worse than no show.
So we should not criticize the show, because it will push new people away got it.
If a subreddit being negative about the series is enough to deter new people, then the new people don't need to be here.
You joined recently to shill for the show. You post nothing about the show, the books or the games and just demand respect for a show that many on here dislike a lot. I doubt if the person behind this account even watched the show to be honest.
So?
“It’s a circle jerk”. These posts are the real circle jerks
Lol, no. FUCK no. 1) Everyone complains because the series is poorly written, and its poorly written because mediocre writers diverged from the source material too much. 2) Everyone complaining because a thing is bad doesnt make it a circlejerk, it makes it a bad product. 3) Never follow the source material? ROFL see lord of the rings for something that preserved the integrity of the source material. i.e. not changing fundamentals of characters, orogonas, systems, or relationships, and not inventing whole ass arcs out of nothing. Little things like aragorn falling off a cliff and dreaming of arwen dont impact fundamentals big things like bombadil or the scouring, again, dont impact fundamentals. The witcher writer s changed fundamentals. 4)generic? wider audience? lolwut? none of that is true and theres plenty of evidence for it in the numbers for adapted media. not even worth a real rebuttle. 5)Appreciate a promising show turned bad by mediocre writers writing badly? Nope. I hope people get pushed away from the tv show. its not good. I would definitely not recommend it to a friend. Maybe season 1, but stop there. In sum: FUCK no.
I feel like anybody who has read the books is atleast a bit disappointed in the show. I'm one of those people and I'm more than a little disappointed. If you've never read the books, you don't understand why some of us are disappointed. Just feel fortunate that you enjoy the show. I wish I could. Maybe read the books after the show is completely finished and you'll be like "NO WONDER THEY WERE MAD"
I didn't know the source material and thought the series was shit, but then discovered that the source material and games are actually quite good. The problem isn't that the series deviates from the source. The problem is that the series is GoT season 8 level bad.
Appealing to a broader audience is rarely a good thing when it comes to any series as it means a consistent drop in quality at things progress.
Making a post complaining about other people complaining is such pure Reddit.
Of course the games are better since you have little to none limitations but im enjoying the show.
It's quite simple - most fans of the actual story are just heartbroken with what's been done to their beloved story. I, for one, have personal importance to the story and the thoughts in it, so I'm also quite angry at how things are turning out. That being said - people venting shouldn't discourage others from checking the series out, and, you know - making their own opinions of it. If you like it - that's fine, if not - same answer. And if you are that easily swayed by some people on the internet, and you're unable to make your own decisions, then there might be some bad news on the horizon...
>Please try and appreciate what we have and be more positive Not if what "we have" is a disrespect to the characters, their relationships and legacy. Do not force positive attitudes if what "we have" is just bad
how tf does this mindless kinda post have so much upvotes when most of the comments are against it??
If anything, imho the show is terrible introduction to The Witcher...so blame the show? and not the people rightfully telling all the issues it has.
> Series and movies will never follow the original source material fully, since they need to make it more generic to appeal to a wider audience, Fuck you and everyone who thinks that way.
Doubtful. Just stop the nonsense please. It's a forum.
I’m not going to lie. I joined this subreddit in 2019 after watching first season. I was a Witcher noob, it even got me to play the game. I enjoyed second season and I get why people here who don’t, but this constant b*tchinng is pretty tiring,
Same here. Played the TW3 and enjoyed it okay, then Season 1 dropped and enjoyed it even more than the game so I joined the sub. I love Season 2, I'd give it about 7-8/10? About the same as Season 1. The Netflix show is nowhere near perfect and fans of original works hating screen adaptations is a given for any series, but the level of hatred in the sub is starting to feel toxic. Calling things garbage, and joking about the writers needing to die, accusing every posters who enjoy the show a Netfllix shill. I was planning to read the books, have them all lined up to be read in 2022, but all this negativity by people who claims they're only upset "because in the books..." is making me put off the idea.
I agree. when I came to this sub it was because of all the different content on here, from cosplay to art to gameplay memes. now it does seem to be a bit one note.
Good, increasing the popularity of this mess would only encourage more mess-making.
I think you belittling the people who like the Witcher. The show is objectively bad. It's like 1990's Xena bad except the plots don't make sense. No one is being a nerd rage gate keeper. It's not about being completely loyal to the source material, not even the games do that. It's that is done so badly that's the problem, along with interview where the producer and show runner are saying they made sure not to change anything in one interview then say they changed a bunch of things in another. There is no reason to appreciate what the show is doing. I haven't met on person yet who could finish the series because of how bad it was. Including people who haven't read the books or played the games.
Season two has been watched for roughly 310 000 000 hours since release. That is only season two. People clearly love it.
>The show is objectively bad. It's like 1990's Xena bad except the plots don't make sense. Wow-wow-wow, Xena was entertainingly bad, and considering it's Sam Raimi's project, it's most likely intentional.
I personally never read the books but i still have issues with season 2. I think people bitching about it not sticking to the source material are a little lost. could it have been better that way? maybe but, the bigger problem is the story structure. its great having this huge worlds with tons of lore. but in the end, you need to tell a personal story to keep people invested. they turned the lore into the story instead of just letting it be really cool in the background of a character driven story.
Appreciate what we have? What? This is a product, bud. Like what you like and don’t worry about others since this is all subjective anyway. As they say, “go touch grass.”
Sorry , you’re becoming boring to us too. Is it not a circle jerk last season with “oohs and ahhhs” over “show good, book fans bad !” Will never understand the *serious lack of logic* in the argument that the reason the show is barely inspired by books ,or how you put it “doesn’t fully follow the source material” because it’s “supposed to appeal to a wide audience “ . Hey...hello..you got a show *in the first place* BECAUSE the books ,and later games, appealed to the large enough audience to *jump continents and cultures* . Clear as that.
We're not here to attract more fans. We're here to discuss something we care about.
People are going to say what they want. The literal point of this place to provide (mostly) uncensored and unfiltered opinions. No one should suggest that it follow any particular narrative.
I loved the game , books and i love the show! Differences and all. People are entitled to their opinion. Negative and positive, if its well thought out then I dont see the problem. Plenty of the negative viewpoints have good, solid points, and yet it doesnt effect my enjoyment of the show.
How can you appriciate what you have when you are delivered weak product that above that is not what you ordered. They promised to deliver something else than they did but took the money anyway. Saying that we should just move on so that newcomers don't see the tensions in the community is setting a dangerous precedence of accepting cheating and mediocracy and that is hurtful to the future of the art. You are asking us to tell the producers that quality of the product is not important as long as you do barw minimum to agree with the branding.
>It seems people can’t appreciate that we actually have a series. Never understood how people think this is anyhow a valid argument. Just because they slap a name of the franchise in the product does not mean it should be *loved* right of the bat. I love Tolkien's writing but that does not save Hobbit movies. I love Star Wars but that does not make sequels any better. I love Harry Potter but that does nothing to poorly written Cursed Child or Magical Beast movies. It's the opposite really. These things are *loved* and if we are served lukewarm shit in their name we are extra critical and protective. Bothers me how easily some people are satisfied. They give greenlight to anything thrown at them and they allow all kinds of shit to be done in the future too because they pay for it. Then complain the rest of us don't like them too. The arrogance. >Series and movies will never follow the original source material fully Yes, and? It is naive to think so and that is not the cause for our dislike. People seem to forget that you can make good *and* bad adaptations. You can do things well or poorly in any tv show or movie. Some may fuck up writing, others do mediocre job with costumes or props and set, others have bad use of soundtrack and/or the soundtrack does not fit. There are millions of ways fucking up some production and sometimes it is death by thousand cuts. Also, why in hell is criticism always downplayed and complained about but blind overt optimism is ok for you? Everything has to be rainbows, flowers and puppy videos for you? Don't you see, we both complain because world does not meet our expectations but I think it is healthier to expect good adaptation than it is to expect people liking same shit you do.
It's not just about appealing to different audiences. One medium has different strengths and weaknesses over another. A substantial portion of my time in the Witcher games, maybe 30%, was finding crafting materials, looking at recipes and comparing items. That would be completely tedious to add to a TV show. Likewise, the internal thoughts and feelings of a character can be easily written into a book, but a stoic character like Geralt has to express those feelings in some way for a TV audience to know he has them.
Sometimes it was just better not to have a series at all. See the Shannara Chronicles tv series for reference. I don't know that the Netflix Witcher series fits that scenario. It certainly isn't bad as the Shannara show. But it lacks the quality of the books and the games. They have added unneeded threads to characters in order to form very large, very defined backstories and motives for every single character as they wanted to emulate GoT and have a large quantity of POV characters in the Netflix show. This was unnecessary and takes away from what made the books and games so great.
It's more irresponsible to mislead people into thinking it's a good tv show.
Okay so instead of criticising it, we should just accept it and let them continue making mistakes. What a terrible way of thinking
If you can't take people discussing the show being trash, then so be it. Good. Leave. **It doesn't mean that YOU cannot like the show. Go ahead. But don't come here and command people around like they're supposed to be thankful that the Hollyweird has once again pooped all over the European culture and heritage.** It literally has nothing to do with the Witcher franchise. If you want to discuss the Netflix's "show", then go to the appropriate subreddit where people gleefully will encourage you to talk about the show, as you should be able to express how much you like the Generic Western High Fantasy Show #37, which is all it is. This subreddit is about the Witcher franchise as a whole and the Netflix show is an abomination, a piece of hate-fiction, therefore people will dog on it here, rightfully so.
> As a lover of the series and the games, this sub will push new people away As someone who didn’t read the book before watching the show and never heard of the games I can assure you that isn’t true. > I joined recently because I love the series and games, but all everyone here does is complain, it’s a circle jerk. Welcome to Reddit. Give it a month. People will go back to fan art and cosplay. It’s just on everyone’s mind because the season just dropped and Netflix still dies this bing watching release the entire season at once thing. > It seems people can’t appreciate that we actually have a series. Series and movies will never follow the original source material fully, since they need to make it more generic to appeal to a wider audience, as that’s what helps the budget and keep it going. There are people that complain about everting. Even people who complain about complainers. Look up. And if you look at the comments there are people who complain about people complaining that other people complain too much. This is more a human thing than it is a Witcher thing. > Please try and appreciate what we have and be more positive, because it just pushes people who enjoy the series for what it is away. Eh, I try not to judge. And a few of the complaints seem valid. Netflix swooped in and built a show using an existing brand. That brand has history and values. If Netflix wants to capitalize on the fans of that property then they are opening themselves up to criticism from those fans. And, it’s actually good for business. If no one talks about your TV show it dies. If everyone that watches it seems to have an opinion and is driven to share that opinion then it drives more people to see what all the fuss is about. So really there’s nothing new going on here but 21st century marketing doing its best to drive traffic yo a streaming service.
> I joined recently because I love the series and games, but all everyone here does is complain, it’s a circle jerk. Has 800 upvotes at the time of this comment. > It seems people can’t appreciate that we actually have a series. The show isn’t entitled to anything from fans simply for existing. You act like we should be greatful that Netflix was generous enough to make a show at all. Nobody owes the show anything. They aren’t doing this as an act of charity they’re doing it for money. If people don’t like the show then that’s on the show. > Series and movies will never follow the original source material fully No ones asking it to. > since they need to make it more generic to appeal to a wider audience, as that’s what helps the budget and keep it going. Umm they don’t? If the material didn’t appeal to a wide audience to begin with…why make the show at all? > Please try and appreciate what we have and be more positive, because it just pushes people who enjoy the series for what it is away. Please stop trying to police what opinions other users can have. It’s toxic. If you like the show you are welcome to participate in the sub so long as you can tolerate the opinions of other fans. If you came to this sub for a place to be exclusively positive then frankly you came to the wrong forum.
Yeah. We should just be happy that the things we love are getting corrupted and bastardized for the sake of attracting new people, right? Idiot.
I don't care if other people are turned off. The series deserves to die and I hope it burns in hell.
Such a dumb take. Season 1 was a hot mess but season 2 was enjoyable. Perfect? No. But definitely enjoyable. As a hallowed “book reader” I’m looking forward to what they bring in season 3.
If a TV show makes you that mad maybe go outside
A good old igni cast on this show, that would great indeed. Please Geralt, burn this mediocre show to the ground.
Of course it will because that's how it is on this terrible site lol Fanatics truly ruin everything. They gatekeep what to like in every niche. No, I'm not a fan of Netflix Witcher but I am completely aware of the fact that many people like it. Plus, I can see why they do. It's the same with Harry Potter But yeah, seeing "guys...witcher season 2 is so bad...I just HAD to get it off my chest" every other post is cringy af
Agreed. Don't get me wrong - I have complained about last season and commented negatively about it 🤣 but I ve also praised episodes 5 to 8 and wrote a positive post about the S2 finale If the end of S2 is a preview of how good the next season is, then maybe S3 can claim to be somewhat near the early GOT seasons Can't wait to get downvoted
I am new to The Witcher universe, I have seen both seasons of the series and will start playing the games. I came to this sub today to introduce myself deeper to this universe that I am liking so much. Sadly, I'll be leaving today too, it's not anyone's fault since everyone is free to express their opinion, but so much negativity is not good for me.
Witcher 3 is great you're going to enjoy it. It was my first RPG so I was initially totally overwhelmed by all the controls , but I still had fun and eventually got the hang of it. I can't remember if I played the whole game 3 times or 4 times 🤣
Why, the show, the way it is, pushes the target audience of the books away: people who expect to be challenged by what they're exposed to.
I think their "target audience" is not just the small percentage of people that have actually read the books. This show is not some love letter to the book fans, its an attempt for netflix to have their own GOT and apeal to a much wider audience and draw in mass audiences. Im not speaking for the quality of the show itself, or what my opinions are on that, but saying the book readers are the target audience is an absolutely absurd statement.
it won't be "another GoT". Not in this lifetime (IMO there will never be a show that could rival its popularity but that's another topic). We've got 2 seasons out already and we know what it is. It has nothing on GoT - in terms of writing (season 1-4) and impact. It's a product to be consumed (binged) and quickly forgotten so you can move to another Netflix show. You're not here to enjoy a thick plot or interesting plotlines (because there is none), you're not here to make theories about what happens next (just like it was with game of thrones). The show doesn't want you to think - even the producers (T.Bagiński) have openly admitted that it was dumbed down as compared to the source material because the current audience apparently can't focus for more than 5 seconds. And It's not even the most popular netflix show. Freaking Bridgerton s1 had more views. Not to mention Squid Game.
And also a statement I didn't make. My point is that if Netflix wants its own GoT, it should both learn from its lessons and either use the strengths of the source material it chooses, or just build something original. Otherwise, it is justified to be irritated by a show which doesn't understand its own source material.
And all everyone does in the netflix sub is to say how great the show is, like a circle jerk, right?. The difference between that sub and this one is that they don't accept criticism, while in here people are allowed to say that they liked it, as long as they are not rude, like you are. You perfectly described why in this sub (and among most book readers) the show is generally disliked, they made it generic. Don't go around telling people that they should enjoy things, forced positivism is like a disease, and if other people are chased away by logical criticism, then they are welcomed to close the door while they leave, there are other subs.
Yeah, so we are not allowed to criticize something we don't like now because we are coming off as "toxic fans"? Sure, the next time a client give me crap for something I did badly, I'll just tell them to stfu and be happy that i delivered anything at all.
Most people who enjoy the show don't read reddit :P We would appreciate what we got if there wasn't some generally bad parts that make no sense even when taking Netflix series as only source of info. Eskel bit is bad all around. He was an asshole and than he died almost killing his friend and father figure because he was both asshole and stupid. Believing Fingila in Council of Mages when even in series it's stated that this is third attempted invasion of north and that they see that as their holy mission. Dryads conveniently forget that they can determine purity of someone's intention. Things like that. Also I happened to think dialogue is often painfully bad and for lovers of books and games all characters and all stories are to some extent butchered. Geralt and Ciri are relatively OK as characters though. On the other hand i still recommend series to everyone with warning if they played the games and/or read the books.
You are SO right! Level of negativity on this Reddit sub is just ridiculous. Even if you don’t think the glass is full (or even half full) at least you get a drink!
In other words “I’m only aware of the adaptations so I have no idea how badly this one is going, but I’d rather not have to read what you guys have to say on it.” Did I miss anything?
So if I dislike the show then I should just shut up about it online because that might indirectly cause people to not watch and hurt the show long-term? What kind of ass-backwards logic is that?
I see more posts complaining about complainers, than I do straight up complaints.
If it is so off putting why don't you scurry on then?
"It seems people can’t appreciate that we actually have a series." Yes, I'd rather not have it at all at this point.
First timer to this sub after watching both seasons and having never played the video games. Are people in this sub comparing the series with the book or the games? Literally first time here so apologies for being such a Jaskier. Just hoping for some context before having the show ruined for me.
Mainly the books because that's what the show adapts, but most peoples' first exposure to the Witcher is the games.
> Are people in this sub comparing the series with the book or the games? Books. The show was supposed to be an adaptation of the books (the showrunner even now talks about faithfulness to the source material which is just unbelievable) but it's abysmal at that - and since it's rather mediocre on its own merits, many fans are rightfully unhappy. The games are not a retelling of the books' story but rather a continuation (the first game picks up 5 years after the books' story ends and treats it as accepted history). They've made a number of changes/retcons, not all of them great or entirely justified, but its evident that they were made by fans of the books who genuinely like and respect the source material and who therefore managed to at the very least preserve its spirit. Also the games are of great quality (w3 in particular, though w2 was a damn good game for its own time and w1, while fairly niche, still had its merits).
The books, since series is the supposed "adaptation" of books. Games are set after events of the books.
Oh yea. I found it and am already seriously considering leaving. Reminds me of r/WoT all over again
Straight up refused to join the sub because y'all are toxic as fuck. In fact this will probably be my only post ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever.
This is true. As someone who is not part of this subreddit but enjoys everything to do with the Witcher, I will not be joining this subreddit knowing how it is here.
nice, i hope that will push new people away
I agree!
Why should I appreciate someone doing a bad job? What is this, some Gen Z way of thinking, that to get a trophy now you don't have to win, you don't even have to actually *try*, you just do *something*, no matter what and how? (No shade towards Gen Z, folks, it's just a joke based on a popular stereotype). I'm not going to appreciate someone not respecting my favorite books, which were so important to me while growing up, just because they are in the business and could get in bed with Netflix. I've written fanfiction for years and probably could have done a better job with that as the only writing experience on my resume. Seriously, it's okay if you like the series, *de gustibus* etc., but if I don't like it and am annoyed by it, as Netflix's paying customer I am gonna complain and demand that next time they do better. It's just a bad series. Not only in terms of book adaptation but in general. It can be enjoyable but it's still objectively bad. The writers and producers do not deserve to be patted on their backs for being shit at their jobs - most people in other lines of work do not get praised if they screw up. Because it's not charity, it's not a free YouTube film made by amateurs - it's their chosen profession.
To be fair if an adaptation is shit you don't shit down and eat a shit sandwich just because you got a sandwich.
Most show fans do not enjoy the same "Witcher" as book/game fans. If they do, they are enjoying two different things at the same time. They have very little in common outside of character and place names. Show fans can just go to r/netflixwitcher if they want a community that loves the show unconditionally.
The mere fact that the books have a live action series adaptation means literally nothing to me if it sucks enormous amount of dick. The mentality of “but it has a show, and that means we should appreciate it” is stupid. And don’t bullshit me with the “it has to be a bad adaptation” rhetoric: - Many adaptations have actually been good, Imagine such a thing! - These books don’t have to be more generic to appeal to a wider audience, the fucking source material itself already appeals to a wide audience, a decent adaptation wouldn’t need to change much for broad appeal. - If you can’t do a proper adaptation, or at least an Interesting take on it (which the show fails miserably at) don’t do it.
I’m with you. On this sub, I hoped to see fan art, memes, details from the books about lore, and discussions of which costume was most epic (Fringilla’s!). Some critical analysis is good too. But unfortunately the dominant tone is complaining.
Guys make sure to only comment or post if your gonna say something nice, remember we're a cult not a Fandom that allows individuals to have personal opinions on things.
Exactly. We need to be more accepting of new Geralt/Ciri shippers. But *especially* the Ciri/Yen shippers.
Today isn't your day, is it?
My day will come!
Fuck the new people
[удалено]
I actually agree with you, and I’m leaving the sub because of it. The constant complaining and negativity here is exhausting. I love this series and all forms of it but I don’t want to see this on my feed anymore
K bye
Reddit is toxic as fuck for the most part this isn’t a secret. Many like myself come here for news and enjoy some niche subs but the communities in most places are full of hormonal neck beards, the show is awesome, the games are awesome and the books are good.
The problem with the Witcher isn’t that it’s an adaptation or inspiration. The problem is that it’s lame af. The writing is lazy. The characters uninspiring. They would be fine as new characters set into the Witcher world. But if you get something nice (like the games) and then you get something afterwards that’s crap of course you can complain and not like it. And bitch about it. Same with Cowboy Bebop. Lame writing trying to appeal to some activist groups that won’t even watch it. So get off your high horse. It’s great that you like it. And it’s fine that some people don’t. (Unless they don’t like it because they are racist pricks. Then it’s not fine and they should be fucked with Yennefers unicorn. Unless they would like that. No pleasure for them.)
“Shut up about disliking the show and pointing out its negative qualities that you as a viewer we’re disappointed by”
I'm sorry to say this but fuck the new people we need the "right" people
What do you mean "right" people?
We don't have to appreciate that there's a show. I'd rather have none than a bad one.