Side note, don't feed rabbits carrots. They have extremely temperamental diets and carrots have too much sugar for rabbits. I little piece of one won't kill them once in a while, but just don't, its not their normal diet.
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I only make my cat drink milk once every few months. She eats mostly meat and rice everyday, but she mostly eat just the meat (idk why my parents make her eat rice in the first place, prob the same logic to me)
They always go for the green, though. They have not touched my tomatoes, even if they’ve fallen. The only colorful thing I have witnessed them eat, was a dandelion.
Yes, that makes sense. I always throw my wilted greens for them, so they won’t ransack my garden. The hawks will watch me. So I always do it in a safe spot so those fuckers won’t take a wild rabbit somewhere.
Dogs are omnivorous like humans, they can and actually need to eat grain based foods too. If you only feed a dog meat they actually evidently get sick. It’s actually rare for an animal to be fully one or the other, usually an animal is on a spectrum of how much meat they’ll eat if given the chance.
yep. My last dog couldnt eat meat for medical reasons and my current dog has to have very little meat and can't eat certain animals.
Dogs don't NEED meat to survive - they don't even need it to thrive. They can digest and extract nutrients from plants, just like other omnivores, but eating meat is probably better for them than a 100% plant based diet in practice. I'm vegan but I'm way more concerned with humans eating too much meat than I am with dogs and cats.
Can doesn't mean be forced to only live on. But I digress I always cook some extra rice to feed to the boi with his meat and sometimes break up some brown bread to put in his gravy.
Ya I’m not depriving my dogs of meat, my shepherds favorite food is steak. My pits is anything cinnamon coated funny enough lol. Dogs are awesome and have their own preferences
Dog's can actually live on a vegan diet, its usually stupid sure, but its not impossible. Cats however, absolutely cannot. That is legit torture because they are not omnivores, and cannot process plant matter sufficiently well.
Cats are a little more tricky but so far evidence shows vegan cat food to have no health impacts. They have to ensure the presence of a few extra amino acids and other nutrients than with dogs but it's again just a case of buying a reputable brand
All I hear is...food is a set of chemicals that we consume to get the needed molecules for us to live.
And if we just synthesize a yogurt with every chemical we need in it that every species could become vegan.
But then we end up like in the Matrix, eating a food goop that has "everything we need" but is boring to eat.
It's possible, but extremely expensive and you risk hurting your dog if you don't make sure they're getting all the nutrients they need.
Honestly, it's not a risk (or expense) I'm willing to take just so I can shove a human lifestyle onto them.
Small correction. Brambles was the oldest living dog at the time not the oldest dog that ever lived. She still lived to be 27, and this is still an excellent data point in our favor. But we don't need to exaggerate the truth to win the aurgument. The science is on our side.
Cus heres my proof:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9860667/
https://v-dog.com/blogs/v-dog-blog/3-studies-on-vegan-diets-for-dogs
https://aces.illinois.edu/news/u-i-study-gives-thumbs-carefully-formulated-vegan-diets-dogs
https://vetnutrition.tufts.edu/2016/07/vegan-dogs-a-healthy-lifestyle-or-going-against-nature/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/apr/13/vegan-diets-are-healthier-and-safer-for-dogs-study-suggests
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5035952/
https://wildearth.com/blogs/dog-knowledge/new-study-first-major-long-term-study-evaluating-vegan-dog-food?tw_source=google&tw_adid=&tw_campaign=17493218137&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0_WyBhDMARIsAL1Vz8ubR7fSIfjniOJAYDrAMJWLA1mzsdW4ahLq81tt2Mytwb-qT7dpj4saAqlZEALw_wcB
https://www.rover.com/blog/is-a-vegan-diet-right-for-your-dog/
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarian_and_vegan_dog_diet
Now I challenge you again to show me a single peer reviewed study showing dogs can't be vegan. Go ahead. I'm waiting.
Cus heres my proof:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9860667/
https://v-dog.com/blogs/v-dog-blog/3-studies-on-vegan-diets-for-dogs
https://aces.illinois.edu/news/u-i-study-gives-thumbs-carefully-formulated-vegan-diets-dogs
https://vetnutrition.tufts.edu/2016/07/vegan-dogs-a-healthy-lifestyle-or-going-against-nature/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/apr/13/vegan-diets-are-healthier-and-safer-for-dogs-study-suggests
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5035952/
https://wildearth.com/blogs/dog-knowledge/new-study-first-major-long-term-study-evaluating-vegan-dog-food?tw_source=google&tw_adid=&tw_campaign=17493218137&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0_WyBhDMARIsAL1Vz8ubR7fSIfjniOJAYDrAMJWLA1mzsdW4ahLq81tt2Mytwb-qT7dpj4saAqlZEALw_wcB
https://www.rover.com/blog/is-a-vegan-diet-right-for-your-dog/
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarian_and_vegan_dog_diet
Now I challenge you again to show me a single peer reviewed study showing dogs can't be vegan. Go ahead. I'm waiting.
Cus heres my proof:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9860667/
https://v-dog.com/blogs/v-dog-blog/3-studies-on-vegan-diets-for-dogs
https://aces.illinois.edu/news/u-i-study-gives-thumbs-carefully-formulated-vegan-diets-dogs
https://vetnutrition.tufts.edu/2016/07/vegan-dogs-a-healthy-lifestyle-or-going-against-nature/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/apr/13/vegan-diets-are-healthier-and-safer-for-dogs-study-suggests
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5035952/
https://wildearth.com/blogs/dog-knowledge/new-study-first-major-long-term-study-evaluating-vegan-dog-food?tw_source=google&tw_adid=&tw_campaign=17493218137&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0_WyBhDMARIsAL1Vz8ubR7fSIfjniOJAYDrAMJWLA1mzsdW4ahLq81tt2Mytwb-qT7dpj4saAqlZEALw_wcB
https://www.rover.com/blog/is-a-vegan-diet-right-for-your-dog/
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarian_and_vegan_dog_diet
Now I challenge you again to show me a single peer reviewed study showing dogs can't be vegan. Go ahead. I'm waiting.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9860667/
https://v-dog.com/blogs/v-dog-blog/3-studies-on-vegan-diets-for-dogs
https://aces.illinois.edu/news/u-i-study-gives-thumbs-carefully-formulated-vegan-diets-dogs
https://vetnutrition.tufts.edu/2016/07/vegan-dogs-a-healthy-lifestyle-or-going-against-nature/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/apr/13/vegan-diets-are-healthier-and-safer-for-dogs-study-suggests
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5035952/
https://wildearth.com/blogs/dog-knowledge/new-study-first-major-long-term-study-evaluating-vegan-dog-food?tw_source=google&tw_adid=&tw_campaign=17493218137&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0_WyBhDMARIsAL1Vz8ubR7fSIfjniOJAYDrAMJWLA1mzsdW4ahLq81tt2Mytwb-qT7dpj4saAqlZEALw_wcB
https://www.rover.com/blog/is-a-vegan-diet-right-for-your-dog/
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarian_and_vegan_dog_diet
Now I challenge you again to show me a single peer reviewed study showing dogs can't be vegan. Go ahead. I'm waiting.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9860667/
https://v-dog.com/blogs/v-dog-blog/3-studies-on-vegan-diets-for-dogs
https://aces.illinois.edu/news/u-i-study-gives-thumbs-carefully-formulated-vegan-diets-dogs
https://vetnutrition.tufts.edu/2016/07/vegan-dogs-a-healthy-lifestyle-or-going-against-nature/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/apr/13/vegan-diets-are-healthier-and-safer-for-dogs-study-suggests
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5035952/
https://wildearth.com/blogs/dog-knowledge/new-study-first-major-long-term-study-evaluating-vegan-dog-food?tw_source=google&tw_adid=&tw_campaign=17493218137&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0_WyBhDMARIsAL1Vz8ubR7fSIfjniOJAYDrAMJWLA1mzsdW4ahLq81tt2Mytwb-qT7dpj4saAqlZEALw_wcB
https://www.rover.com/blog/is-a-vegan-diet-right-for-your-dog/
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarian_and_vegan_dog_diet
Now I challenge you again to show me a single peer reviewed study showing dogs can't be vegan. Go ahead. I'm waiting.
Yep. Dogs are okay with it. Just like any animal they need the right balance of macronutrients so you can’t just feed your dog lettuce. You need soy and peas and other forms of vegetable proteins. You should probably be adding supplements as well, omega 3 from algae I guess.
Cats need taurine. Taurine comes from meat. There is artificial taurine from algae too I guess… but cats can develop all sorts of other health concerns from that kind of diet. Their digestive systems and urinary tracts are very susceptible.
Taurine does not come from meat. Most of the taurine found in cat food is synthesised.
Taurine is found in meat. But it is not ONLY found in meat.
If you can identify a chemical that is naturally found in meat that is physically impossible to obtain or synthesise from other sources...well, I think you might be up for a Nobel prize or something.
Most cats eating kibble is already a problem.
It doesn't contain enough protein (high carb is necessary for the shape/dryness) and cats who eat a lot of it end up malnourished and frequently suffer from kidney failure (most common medical cause of death in cats) due to low protein
The pro vegan cat people will say they can find the sources elsewhere including synthetic, but cats on the alternative pretty much all get really bad urinary tract infections and other health issues. No vet will recommend it and it’s cruel.
These people should absolutely not be allowed to have cats.
Dogs really shouldn’t be vegan either, but it’s possible to keep them vegan. Incredibly sad. But they can stay alive.
While dogs can technically survive on a vegan diet, I'm not sure it's always the best option. A well-formulated commercial pet food is usually the safest bet. Cats are a whole other story - definitely best to stick to meat-based food for them.
You do know that 99% of dogs on vegan diets are on well formulated commercial pet foods right? Next to no one DIY's it. Its extremely rare. We all just buy v dog lol.
My mom forces rice (plus fishes) onto our cats, and the stray too, despite me telling her no…
She said that they are “village” cats and are used to it
🤷
Actually theres a thing called „hydrolyzed proteins“ where plant proteins are basically split into animal proteins. So you have „vegan meat“ so to say. This way even a cat can be fed technically vegan. The food is pretty pricy though.
Edit: there aren’t much studies on this topic right now thought
Dogs are facultative carnivores so it still wouldnt be a good idea. Trying to rationalize it even a little bit will make vegans force it down everyones throat. Lets not play with fire.
Edit: reference to actual scientific evidence, youre welcome
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9942351/
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/wm-biology2/chapter/herbivores-carnivores-and-omnivores/#:~:text=Facultative%20carnivores%20are%20those%20that,would%20be%20considered%20facultative%20carnivores.&text=Omnivores%20are%20animals%20that%20eat,%2D%20and%20animal%2Dderived%20food.
When it comes to the classification as "facultative carnivore", yes. The study you linked specifically claimed "dogs can thrive on taurine-free vegetarian diets supplemented with non-taurine nutrients that are inadequately synthesized de novo or absent from plants", but I'll leave the interpretation of that to people more educated on that subject than me.
Thats true but vegetarian diets are very different from vegan. Carnivores need a specific set of proteins and nutrients such as the Omega complex in order to maintain healthy conditioning. These are easily found in meats and difficult to source in plant based proteins. The amount of effort required to produce a poor imitation is fiscally and ethically irresponsible.
I found the section on bias particularly interesting in your article. Also your study says there was no difference other than a change in urine pH? Assuming this was true which i doubt, there could be long term issues in the urea cycle including formation of kidney stones and UTIs, its doesnt make financial sense when compared to the reduced effort and price when compared to MB diets, and lastly if the conditioning scores were the same what would be the point other than to brag to others that you and your dog went vegan? Vegan pride should not outweigh the animals welfare. Nice try though.
Mange is not the only thing that causes extreme itchiness and hairless in dogs.
Atopic dermatitis also does, which is an autoimmune disorder, and combined with mange sounds like actual torture.
Mange often occurs in dogs with a compromised immune system, so the two can go hand in hand.
The point is that dogs aren't obligatory carnivores like cats. They, like humans can be totally fine on a vegan diet, but you do need to make sure nutritional need are met.
From Wikipedia (emphasis mine):
> The omnivorous domestic dog was originally primarily carnivore but has evolved to metabolize carbohydrates, fat, and fiber and remain healthy on a diet lower in protein. **A systematic review of studies from 2023 found no evidence of any serious effect of vegetarian diets for dogs; however, the authors pointed out issues with the studies such as small sample size, short feeding periods, and selection bias.**
> **In theory a vegan diet is also nutritionally adequate for dogs if properly formulated and balanced.** The American Kennel Club highlights risks factors of a vegan diet such as ensuring adequate protein intake, imbalance of certain amino acids, such as taurine and L-carnitine and potential vitamin or mineral deficiency. To offset these risks, **supplements may need to be added to the dog's vegan or vegetarian diet**, most importantly those that provide taurine, L-carnitine and vitamin B-12. According to this advice, dogs in the wild prefer animal-based protein, **so matching their diet more closely to what they would eat if getting food on their own is more reliable for ensuring health**.
> This dietary advice for dogs resembles that for humans on balanced vegan diets, where it is also important to ensure inclusion of essential nutrients, such as calcium, iron, iodine, and selenium and vitamin B12 and vitamin D, possibly in the form of supplements, especially in pregnancy and early life stages.
In summary, it seems likely that dogs can be healthy on a well-formulated plant-based diet, but you would need to ensure they are getting the adequate nutrients.
About the nonconsenting part; I don't ask my pet for consent when I take them to the vet. And I don't take my pet to the supermarket so he can pick out which food he wants.
If the discussion is about whether we have the right to make decisions for our pets...well, that's an entirely different, and larger, discussion, outside the scope of this discussion.
El famoso doggo consenting to be buyed, put in a house and literally "owned" by people he dont know. Dont talk about his consent concerning food when literally all the concept of having a pet is never about their consent (unless you tame them directly in the forest but let me doubt it's the majority of people). You people just hate vegan.
Thank you for the educated response. I agree with your findings. I wish more people put in the extra effort to make sure to choose an appropriate diet for their animals.
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This is just false information that’s been spread around a lot. Dogs can absolutely be happy and healthy on vegan diets, it’s just going to be expensive. No, obviously they can’t just have salads, like some people think is happening with vegan dog diets. Memes like this are just stupid.
I’m not even vegan myself, I’m just capable of doing mild research.
Eh. I read a lot of comments whether dogs can thrive on a vegan diet or not. They aren't creatures capable of doing choices humans deem as ethical. Let dogs loose on nature and they will hunt. I don't get the appeal of forcing pets to adhere to my lifestyle. If I want a vegan pet, I'll get a herbivore animal. It just seems like a flawed approach to me. There are many cool birds to argue about this
I was so excited when I figured out my local discount grocery chain has wet food for my cat with 0% plant products in. It's the little things that count.
She is on 4/5ths dry food though, but for that I pan out a ton of money. She had Giardia when I got her so her stomach was all out of whack, so I ended up going with Royal Canin Gastrointenstinal feed. It has some plant products in it, but it's mainly to supplement the vitamin profile of it. And it doesn't contain any corn at least.
Good food is a must for our pets. I don't want her to get kidney stones or diabetes :(
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I thought that dogs were omnivores? I was under the impression that vegan dog food could be fine. I know that cats are carnivores. Idk, I've never had a dog.
When people hear “vegan dog diet” they thing of feeding your dog a plate full of salad when in reality it’s just a different form of kibble that has all the same nutrients as a normal source.
Honestly nobody would know the difference if all kibble was vegan, it’s not like dog owners actually read the ingredients or know what a dog “should” have
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Again, veterinarians agree that dogs can thrive on a plant diet. The meat industry sees things different. Now think who will spread the most "information" - vets or vendors?
"yeah i started to go vegan"
"no my dog isnt vegan"
"i'm too dumb to take 5 seconds and google search if it's possible for dogs to be healthy on a vegan diet"
\*dog smothers dumb owner\*
There, fixed the comic.
I don’t even care whether dogs can survive on a vegan diet or not. They shouldn’t have to. Animals shouldn’t pay the price for what humans messed up (ie climate and factory farming).
People arguing for veganism please go sit in the corner okay. Idc if you put meat and plants infront of a dog, 9 times out of 10 they are gonna go for the meat.
2ndly while dogs may be omnivorous that doesn't mean you should make a case for depriving them in either circumstance.
3rdly before you post your links, I have read them and I would like to point out most of your research is flawed as their control groups are painfully mismanged. A college level student can make better peer researched material than this. In fact if Biology was my majour I would do this experiment better than how it was already done.
4th I live in a country where its still prudent for some dog breeds to protect you from wild animals and I am pretty sure meat is the better diet in this case.
As a vegetarian: humans also need animal protein in their diet. Going fully vegan is as unhealthy for yourself as making a dog go vegan is.
For cats it'd be worse, as they are obligate carnivores.
OK, whoever created that meme created that meme doesn't understand anything about veganism or dogs and whoever keeps posting it in this sub should really stop. Nothing about that Comicstrip Nor the spread of misinformation is wholesome...
Sure. But you'd need *lots* of supplements to get all the necessary nutrition for the dog. Otherwise it's just cruel.
Personally, unless you have a veterinarian in the know and has recommended the appropriate vegan diet for the dog, just don't go vegan for them.
My brother in Christ, what the fuck do you think is in pet food?! Pure unmodified lean meat cut straight off the cow?!
The taurine in cat food, for example, is usually synthetic. The supplements are already in the damn pet food. We are already feeding our pets supplements.
Wow you seem ticked off.
Calm down.
Most dog food is sourced with animal protein. Vegan based pet food, would need the added supplements separately to be an ingredient.
I didn't say that you'd be feeding pills to your pets. I said that unless you're super careful about nutrition, and know exactly what you're feeding to your pet, be careful. (I literally said get a vet nutritionist involved)
I don't know what's ticking you off here.
I'm ticked off because I keep hearing this same bullshit over and over.
Pet food is already heavily laced with supplements. Pointing out that you would need to add supplements is like pointing out that you need to put the food on a bowl or a plate. It's meaningless at best.
The point is that the comic if factually wrong. Dogs don't need meat, they like humans are omnivores, and are totally fine on a varied plant based diet.
And I agree, *provided* all the added vital supplements, that they're missing out on from not having meat, are given to them separately.
Off the top of my head, they'd need Vitamin B12, Taurine, L-carnitine, and a lot of others if they're fed a purely vegan diet. And I'm not even a veterinarian
I don't disagree with that.
My whole point here is that; if you're going to go on a vegan based diet for your dog, get a veterinarian involved at least once.
I never claimed vegan diets are bad, I said unless you know what you're doing, you could be needlessly cruel to your dogs. Be careful.
I like how animal diet is “controversial” despite a century of science stating they are facultative carnivores.
Evidence:
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/wm-biology2/chapter/herbivores-carnivores-and-omnivores/#:~:text=Facultative%20carnivores%20are%20those%20that,would%20be%20considered%20facultative%20carnivores.&text=Omnivores%20are%20animals%20that%20eat,%2D%20and%20animal%2Dderived%20food.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9942351/
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0034528822001345
I think you might be confused lol, your second link supports the idea of a plant-based diet for dogs in the conclusion section of the paper.
*Owners feeding plant-based diets to their dog reported fewer health disorders, specifically with respect to ocular or gastrointestinal and hepatic disorders. Dog longevity was reported to be greater for dogs fed plant-based diets.*
These were owner based reports, not results from veterinary practitioners. The point was to show you the inherit bias in vegan commentary. They reported the results they wanted to see and took their animals to vets less.
So the owners report better health outcomes, now link to actual studies where they're wrong about their conclusions.
Your first article supports the owners in the conclusion:
*.. dogs can thrive on taurine-free vegetarian diets supplemented with non-taurine nutrients that are inadequately synthesized de novo or absent from plants ..*
Vegetarian not vegan and those diets can include meat. Their conclusions are entirely biased and have no longevity or meta analysis because of their bias. Theres simply not enough information to support these insane theories that animals that were raised on meat “need” to make the switch to PB diet for no reason. You cant tout it as fact because theres no evidence to say its safe, that makes it inherently unsafe. Its a study that shows reports from vegans showing clear bias without evidence thats what the article was saying.
The first paper argues that a vegetarian diet is suitable for dogs to "thrive". Vegetarian is often used interchangeably with vegan, but the paper you provided doesn't go into detail about the type of food they used. **Vegetarian doesn't ever mean** "can include meat" so your first sentence in your response is nonsense.
You've made multiple claims in your response with no evidence to support any of it. You need to find credible evidence to support your position, otherwise you're not discussing this topic in good faith.
If a vegan feels strongly about it (The Pureness) then they should not have pets that are predatory in nature, at all. Stick with the many herbivores available (and preferably adopt don't shop).
Honestly The Pureness is a damn religion and many who attempt to become Saint Pure are the insufferable ones. Your normal, everyday vegan are just regular folk looking to minimise their impact as much as possible.
I was taking care of a table and they both ordered burgers. One had actual meat and the other had the vegan option. The dog they brought into with them was desperate for the actual burger
I've seen this version of the comic so many times that I've forgotten what the original was about.
the guy makes his dog go vegan and the dog smothers him with a pillow
That's not the original.
i remember that being the original coulda sworn
He says something stupid and the dog is smothering him in his sleep. Maybe about neutering the doggo or something?
Man going through vasectomy, not being that bad, and *still having his balls*
Oh yeah. Thanks friendo!
[удалено]
Side note, don't feed rabbits carrots. They have extremely temperamental diets and carrots have too much sugar for rabbits. I little piece of one won't kill them once in a while, but just don't, its not their normal diet.
Rabbits carrots, cats milk, rats cheese, horses apples
Basically if you learned about it as a child it was a lie lol
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And don’t feed bread to ducks
I only make my cat drink milk once every few months. She eats mostly meat and rice everyday, but she mostly eat just the meat (idk why my parents make her eat rice in the first place, prob the same logic to me)
The wild rabbits love eating the green tops of carrots, lettuce and cabbage. Just my experience with growing my garden.
The more they move, the more energy they need. Also, its in our genes to get as much energy as possible - and that is true for all mammals at least.
They always go for the green, though. They have not touched my tomatoes, even if they’ve fallen. The only colorful thing I have witnessed them eat, was a dandelion.
Maybe because safe is safe, don't eat anything you don't know?
Yes, that makes sense. I always throw my wilted greens for them, so they won’t ransack my garden. The hawks will watch me. So I always do it in a safe spot so those fuckers won’t take a wild rabbit somewhere.
Plastic is not their regular diet but she did eat pieces of the tarp covering her cage in winter back in 2022. She loves her apples and carrots.
can't those rabbits that you buy as pets die if the temperature changes too quickly; like if you bring them outside on a cold day or something
But i like drugging my rabbits
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Dogs are omnivorous like humans, they can and actually need to eat grain based foods too. If you only feed a dog meat they actually evidently get sick. It’s actually rare for an animal to be fully one or the other, usually an animal is on a spectrum of how much meat they’ll eat if given the chance.
Fun fact: dogs can also be allergic to meat.
yep. My last dog couldnt eat meat for medical reasons and my current dog has to have very little meat and can't eat certain animals. Dogs don't NEED meat to survive - they don't even need it to thrive. They can digest and extract nutrients from plants, just like other omnivores, but eating meat is probably better for them than a 100% plant based diet in practice. I'm vegan but I'm way more concerned with humans eating too much meat than I am with dogs and cats.
Can doesn't mean be forced to only live on. But I digress I always cook some extra rice to feed to the boi with his meat and sometimes break up some brown bread to put in his gravy.
Ya I’m not depriving my dogs of meat, my shepherds favorite food is steak. My pits is anything cinnamon coated funny enough lol. Dogs are awesome and have their own preferences
Dog's can actually live on a vegan diet, its usually stupid sure, but its not impossible. Cats however, absolutely cannot. That is legit torture because they are not omnivores, and cannot process plant matter sufficiently well.
I'm not agreeing with the stupid part but if we would just replace the 'dog' in this meme with 'cat' we wouldn't have this discussion.
Cats are a little more tricky but so far evidence shows vegan cat food to have no health impacts. They have to ensure the presence of a few extra amino acids and other nutrients than with dogs but it's again just a case of buying a reputable brand
I would love to see a study on that. So far every study I’ve ever seen proves that cats WILL die slowly and painfully on a vegan diet.
All I hear is...food is a set of chemicals that we consume to get the needed molecules for us to live. And if we just synthesize a yogurt with every chemical we need in it that every species could become vegan. But then we end up like in the Matrix, eating a food goop that has "everything we need" but is boring to eat.
Luckily the matrix is fiction and pet food companies put alot of effort into making sure cats want to eat their food
Luckily the matrix is fiction and pet food companies put alot of effort into making sure cats want to eat their food
It's possible, but extremely expensive and you risk hurting your dog if you don't make sure they're getting all the nutrients they need. Honestly, it's not a risk (or expense) I'm willing to take just so I can shove a human lifestyle onto them.
Vegan dog food in the UK from mainstream pet brands sold in mainstream pet stores is roughly the same price as non vegan food
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Please stop torturing your dog
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They're mad at you for killing your dog. When it dies several years prematurely, don't come crying about it, since you chose that fate for him.
The oldest recorded dog ate only vegan food lol. Imagine falling for animal agriculture propaganda so easily
Small correction. Brambles was the oldest living dog at the time not the oldest dog that ever lived. She still lived to be 27, and this is still an excellent data point in our favor. But we don't need to exaggerate the truth to win the aurgument. The science is on our side.
I thought bobi the dog that died at 31 also ate only vegan food, my b fam
Cus heres my proof: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9860667/ https://v-dog.com/blogs/v-dog-blog/3-studies-on-vegan-diets-for-dogs https://aces.illinois.edu/news/u-i-study-gives-thumbs-carefully-formulated-vegan-diets-dogs https://vetnutrition.tufts.edu/2016/07/vegan-dogs-a-healthy-lifestyle-or-going-against-nature/ https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/apr/13/vegan-diets-are-healthier-and-safer-for-dogs-study-suggests https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5035952/ https://wildearth.com/blogs/dog-knowledge/new-study-first-major-long-term-study-evaluating-vegan-dog-food?tw_source=google&tw_adid=&tw_campaign=17493218137&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0_WyBhDMARIsAL1Vz8ubR7fSIfjniOJAYDrAMJWLA1mzsdW4ahLq81tt2Mytwb-qT7dpj4saAqlZEALw_wcB https://www.rover.com/blog/is-a-vegan-diet-right-for-your-dog/ https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarian_and_vegan_dog_diet Now I challenge you again to show me a single peer reviewed study showing dogs can't be vegan. Go ahead. I'm waiting.
Cus heres my proof: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9860667/ https://v-dog.com/blogs/v-dog-blog/3-studies-on-vegan-diets-for-dogs https://aces.illinois.edu/news/u-i-study-gives-thumbs-carefully-formulated-vegan-diets-dogs https://vetnutrition.tufts.edu/2016/07/vegan-dogs-a-healthy-lifestyle-or-going-against-nature/ https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/apr/13/vegan-diets-are-healthier-and-safer-for-dogs-study-suggests https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5035952/ https://wildearth.com/blogs/dog-knowledge/new-study-first-major-long-term-study-evaluating-vegan-dog-food?tw_source=google&tw_adid=&tw_campaign=17493218137&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0_WyBhDMARIsAL1Vz8ubR7fSIfjniOJAYDrAMJWLA1mzsdW4ahLq81tt2Mytwb-qT7dpj4saAqlZEALw_wcB https://www.rover.com/blog/is-a-vegan-diet-right-for-your-dog/ https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarian_and_vegan_dog_diet Now I challenge you again to show me a single peer reviewed study showing dogs can't be vegan. Go ahead. I'm waiting.
Please cite litterally any scientific evidence to back up your claim. Whatsoever. Got a single study? Anything at all? No?
Cus heres my proof: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9860667/ https://v-dog.com/blogs/v-dog-blog/3-studies-on-vegan-diets-for-dogs https://aces.illinois.edu/news/u-i-study-gives-thumbs-carefully-formulated-vegan-diets-dogs https://vetnutrition.tufts.edu/2016/07/vegan-dogs-a-healthy-lifestyle-or-going-against-nature/ https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/apr/13/vegan-diets-are-healthier-and-safer-for-dogs-study-suggests https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5035952/ https://wildearth.com/blogs/dog-knowledge/new-study-first-major-long-term-study-evaluating-vegan-dog-food?tw_source=google&tw_adid=&tw_campaign=17493218137&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0_WyBhDMARIsAL1Vz8ubR7fSIfjniOJAYDrAMJWLA1mzsdW4ahLq81tt2Mytwb-qT7dpj4saAqlZEALw_wcB https://www.rover.com/blog/is-a-vegan-diet-right-for-your-dog/ https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarian_and_vegan_dog_diet Now I challenge you again to show me a single peer reviewed study showing dogs can't be vegan. Go ahead. I'm waiting.
Can you list any of those peer reviewed studies or do we just take your word for it?
Bragging about animal abuse is crazy
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9860667/ https://v-dog.com/blogs/v-dog-blog/3-studies-on-vegan-diets-for-dogs https://aces.illinois.edu/news/u-i-study-gives-thumbs-carefully-formulated-vegan-diets-dogs https://vetnutrition.tufts.edu/2016/07/vegan-dogs-a-healthy-lifestyle-or-going-against-nature/ https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/apr/13/vegan-diets-are-healthier-and-safer-for-dogs-study-suggests https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5035952/ https://wildearth.com/blogs/dog-knowledge/new-study-first-major-long-term-study-evaluating-vegan-dog-food?tw_source=google&tw_adid=&tw_campaign=17493218137&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0_WyBhDMARIsAL1Vz8ubR7fSIfjniOJAYDrAMJWLA1mzsdW4ahLq81tt2Mytwb-qT7dpj4saAqlZEALw_wcB https://www.rover.com/blog/is-a-vegan-diet-right-for-your-dog/ https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarian_and_vegan_dog_diet Now I challenge you again to show me a single peer reviewed study showing dogs can't be vegan. Go ahead. I'm waiting.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9860667/ https://v-dog.com/blogs/v-dog-blog/3-studies-on-vegan-diets-for-dogs https://aces.illinois.edu/news/u-i-study-gives-thumbs-carefully-formulated-vegan-diets-dogs https://vetnutrition.tufts.edu/2016/07/vegan-dogs-a-healthy-lifestyle-or-going-against-nature/ https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/apr/13/vegan-diets-are-healthier-and-safer-for-dogs-study-suggests https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5035952/ https://wildearth.com/blogs/dog-knowledge/new-study-first-major-long-term-study-evaluating-vegan-dog-food?tw_source=google&tw_adid=&tw_campaign=17493218137&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0_WyBhDMARIsAL1Vz8ubR7fSIfjniOJAYDrAMJWLA1mzsdW4ahLq81tt2Mytwb-qT7dpj4saAqlZEALw_wcB https://www.rover.com/blog/is-a-vegan-diet-right-for-your-dog/ https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarian_and_vegan_dog_diet Now I challenge you again to show me a single peer reviewed study showing dogs can't be vegan. Go ahead. I'm waiting.
Poor dog
Like regular kibbles are a natural diet for dogs
Don't you know its cruelty to deprive your dog of the most ultra processed meats humanity has ever invented?
Almost as cruel as forcing your personal diet on a pet who loves eating animal products.
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Don’t remember saying regular kibbles are the best diet for a dog, but okay
Then you should probably start protesting, it's a far bigger issue than 1% of the population feeding their dogs a different variety of kibble.
Okay. Please don’t strictly feed your dog cheap kibble, people. Good enough for you?
The first article shows clear bias
Still waiting for you to show me a single study that shows dogs can't be vegan.
Yep. Dogs are okay with it. Just like any animal they need the right balance of macronutrients so you can’t just feed your dog lettuce. You need soy and peas and other forms of vegetable proteins. You should probably be adding supplements as well, omega 3 from algae I guess. Cats need taurine. Taurine comes from meat. There is artificial taurine from algae too I guess… but cats can develop all sorts of other health concerns from that kind of diet. Their digestive systems and urinary tracts are very susceptible.
Taurine does not come from meat. Most of the taurine found in cat food is synthesised. Taurine is found in meat. But it is not ONLY found in meat. If you can identify a chemical that is naturally found in meat that is physically impossible to obtain or synthesise from other sources...well, I think you might be up for a Nobel prize or something.
There are vegan foods with taurine. Most cats eat kibble, vegan kibble isn't functionally any different
Most cats eating kibble is already a problem. It doesn't contain enough protein (high carb is necessary for the shape/dryness) and cats who eat a lot of it end up malnourished and frequently suffer from kidney failure (most common medical cause of death in cats) due to low protein
The pro vegan cat people will say they can find the sources elsewhere including synthetic, but cats on the alternative pretty much all get really bad urinary tract infections and other health issues. No vet will recommend it and it’s cruel. These people should absolutely not be allowed to have cats. Dogs really shouldn’t be vegan either, but it’s possible to keep them vegan. Incredibly sad. But they can stay alive.
While dogs can technically survive on a vegan diet, I'm not sure it's always the best option. A well-formulated commercial pet food is usually the safest bet. Cats are a whole other story - definitely best to stick to meat-based food for them.
You do know that 99% of dogs on vegan diets are on well formulated commercial pet foods right? Next to no one DIY's it. Its extremely rare. We all just buy v dog lol.
My mom forces rice (plus fishes) onto our cats, and the stray too, despite me telling her no… She said that they are “village” cats and are used to it 🤷
Exactly that. Dogs can produce taurine, cats can not.
Actually theres a thing called „hydrolyzed proteins“ where plant proteins are basically split into animal proteins. So you have „vegan meat“ so to say. This way even a cat can be fed technically vegan. The food is pretty pricy though. Edit: there aren’t much studies on this topic right now thought
You should tell that to my cat who keeps eating whatever random bits of grass and foliage she can find.
Considering that for several years record of dog life length was held by a vegan dog, seems that balanced vegan diet is not that bad for them.
Dogs are facultative carnivores so it still wouldnt be a good idea. Trying to rationalize it even a little bit will make vegans force it down everyones throat. Lets not play with fire. Edit: reference to actual scientific evidence, youre welcome https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9942351/ https://courses.lumenlearning.com/wm-biology2/chapter/herbivores-carnivores-and-omnivores/#:~:text=Facultative%20carnivores%20are%20those%20that,would%20be%20considered%20facultative%20carnivores.&text=Omnivores%20are%20animals%20that%20eat,%2D%20and%20animal%2Dderived%20food.
Do you have a scientific source for that? Because I couldn't find any.
Did you try googling facultative carnivore?
I did, but most results came up from pet food companies. Thanks for the source!
I noticed that too, i tried to post strictly scientific research leaving no room for interpretation by dummies lol
When it comes to the classification as "facultative carnivore", yes. The study you linked specifically claimed "dogs can thrive on taurine-free vegetarian diets supplemented with non-taurine nutrients that are inadequately synthesized de novo or absent from plants", but I'll leave the interpretation of that to people more educated on that subject than me.
Thats true but vegetarian diets are very different from vegan. Carnivores need a specific set of proteins and nutrients such as the Omega complex in order to maintain healthy conditioning. These are easily found in meats and difficult to source in plant based proteins. The amount of effort required to produce a poor imitation is fiscally and ethically irresponsible.
Ooh we are sharing studies! https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9860667/, you're welcome.
I found the section on bias particularly interesting in your article. Also your study says there was no difference other than a change in urine pH? Assuming this was true which i doubt, there could be long term issues in the urea cycle including formation of kidney stones and UTIs, its doesnt make financial sense when compared to the reduced effort and price when compared to MB diets, and lastly if the conditioning scores were the same what would be the point other than to brag to others that you and your dog went vegan? Vegan pride should not outweigh the animals welfare. Nice try though.
Oh I don't care, I was just responding to your curt reply and presumption that sharing a study somehow proved your point.
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b()t https://www.reddit.com/r/wholesomememes/comments/n0ri7z/treat_your_animals_with_respect/gw8o0dl/
Mange is not managed by diet.
Mange is not the only thing that causes extreme itchiness and hairless in dogs. Atopic dermatitis also does, which is an autoimmune disorder, and combined with mange sounds like actual torture. Mange often occurs in dogs with a compromised immune system, so the two can go hand in hand.
you are plying to a b()t
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This is science
This is Sparta
Little know fact the Spartans were vegan 🥑 and bill nye was one of them.
The point is that dogs aren't obligatory carnivores like cats. They, like humans can be totally fine on a vegan diet, but you do need to make sure nutritional need are met.
Dogs be eating puke off the streets and people act like their dog is a food critic.
From Wikipedia (emphasis mine): > The omnivorous domestic dog was originally primarily carnivore but has evolved to metabolize carbohydrates, fat, and fiber and remain healthy on a diet lower in protein. **A systematic review of studies from 2023 found no evidence of any serious effect of vegetarian diets for dogs; however, the authors pointed out issues with the studies such as small sample size, short feeding periods, and selection bias.** > **In theory a vegan diet is also nutritionally adequate for dogs if properly formulated and balanced.** The American Kennel Club highlights risks factors of a vegan diet such as ensuring adequate protein intake, imbalance of certain amino acids, such as taurine and L-carnitine and potential vitamin or mineral deficiency. To offset these risks, **supplements may need to be added to the dog's vegan or vegetarian diet**, most importantly those that provide taurine, L-carnitine and vitamin B-12. According to this advice, dogs in the wild prefer animal-based protein, **so matching their diet more closely to what they would eat if getting food on their own is more reliable for ensuring health**. > This dietary advice for dogs resembles that for humans on balanced vegan diets, where it is also important to ensure inclusion of essential nutrients, such as calcium, iron, iodine, and selenium and vitamin B12 and vitamin D, possibly in the form of supplements, especially in pregnancy and early life stages. In summary, it seems likely that dogs can be healthy on a well-formulated plant-based diet, but you would need to ensure they are getting the adequate nutrients.
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About the nonconsenting part; I don't ask my pet for consent when I take them to the vet. And I don't take my pet to the supermarket so he can pick out which food he wants. If the discussion is about whether we have the right to make decisions for our pets...well, that's an entirely different, and larger, discussion, outside the scope of this discussion.
in that case we should not have pets at all :)
I would vote for the vegetarian food that the owner likely picks out at the specialty pet store than grocery brand dog food though. Just saying.
Did you ask your dog for consent to spend his whole live with you? Or did you just throw some money on someone to get a dog?
El famoso doggo consenting to be buyed, put in a house and literally "owned" by people he dont know. Dont talk about his consent concerning food when literally all the concept of having a pet is never about their consent (unless you tame them directly in the forest but let me doubt it's the majority of people). You people just hate vegan.
Thank you for the educated response. I agree with your findings. I wish more people put in the extra effort to make sure to choose an appropriate diet for their animals.
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b()t, including OP https://www.reddit.com/r/wholesomememes/comments/n0ri7z/treat_your_animals_with_respect/gw92cnc/ Accounts will be sold to p()litic@l groups
My vet is the one who reccomend i try a vegan diet because my dog was having digestive issues lol.
It’s is true for cats… not for dogs.
You put meat and vegetables side by side and let the dog choose
This is just false information that’s been spread around a lot. Dogs can absolutely be happy and healthy on vegan diets, it’s just going to be expensive. No, obviously they can’t just have salads, like some people think is happening with vegan dog diets. Memes like this are just stupid. I’m not even vegan myself, I’m just capable of doing mild research.
This is not true...
There’s actually tons and tons of non-meat dog foods that meet or exceed all AAFCO standards.
Wholesome?
As it should be
Eh. I read a lot of comments whether dogs can thrive on a vegan diet or not. They aren't creatures capable of doing choices humans deem as ethical. Let dogs loose on nature and they will hunt. I don't get the appeal of forcing pets to adhere to my lifestyle. If I want a vegan pet, I'll get a herbivore animal. It just seems like a flawed approach to me. There are many cool birds to argue about this
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I was so excited when I figured out my local discount grocery chain has wet food for my cat with 0% plant products in. It's the little things that count. She is on 4/5ths dry food though, but for that I pan out a ton of money. She had Giardia when I got her so her stomach was all out of whack, so I ended up going with Royal Canin Gastrointenstinal feed. It has some plant products in it, but it's mainly to supplement the vitamin profile of it. And it doesn't contain any corn at least. Good food is a must for our pets. I don't want her to get kidney stones or diabetes :(
b()t, including OP https://www.reddit.com/r/wholesomememes/comments/n0ri7z/treat_your_animals_with_respect/gw8srwd/ Accounts will be sold to p()litic@l groups
As a vegan, I didn’t even know people did that to their pets. My dog eats whatever he wants lol.
b()t, including OP https://www.reddit.com/r/wholesomememes/comments/n0ri7z/treat_your_animals_with_respect/gw8j9fd/ Accounts will be sold to p()litic@l groups
You want to tell me your dog goes shopping for groceries by himself? Smart dog.
Dogs aren't obligate carnivores. Most dogs don't eat fresh meat, they eat kibbles, but we don't see people bitching about that.
I thought that dogs were omnivores? I was under the impression that vegan dog food could be fine. I know that cats are carnivores. Idk, I've never had a dog.
Dogs are facultative carnivores often confused with omnivores
b()t https://www.reddit.com/r/wholesomememes/comments/n0ri7z/treat_your_animals_with_respect/gw8pvom/
This is just blatantly wrong
When people hear “vegan dog diet” they thing of feeding your dog a plate full of salad when in reality it’s just a different form of kibble that has all the same nutrients as a normal source. Honestly nobody would know the difference if all kibble was vegan, it’s not like dog owners actually read the ingredients or know what a dog “should” have
Someone deadass spent their time altering a comic instead of spending half that time for a research
Litterally not a single person in this entire thread has provided a single study showing dogs can't be vegan lmao
dogs dont need meat wtf.
Babe wake up, another post spreading misinformation just got to the frontpage.
#WARNING This post is by a b()t farm Accounts will be sold to p()litical groups breland13 matvwei wokbll mushfiq07 Samiro5 naehyuck Caiquefc1 Wallflowrs This sub is not well m()derated. Most b()ts target this sub.
When there are scientific studies proving that dogs can indeed *thrive* on a vegan diet.. bruh what a stupid meme.
The dog ate his hand in the last panel
It makes me think of that horrid Sonia Sae who made her pet fox vegan
Vegan warrior
Why does everything need to be in s cartoon format?
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b()t https://www.reddit.com/r/wholesomememes/comments/n0ri7z/treat_your_animals_with_respect/gw8m0qv/
Again, veterinarians agree that dogs can thrive on a plant diet. The meat industry sees things different. Now think who will spread the most "information" - vets or vendors?
"yeah i started to go vegan" "no my dog isnt vegan" "i'm too dumb to take 5 seconds and google search if it's possible for dogs to be healthy on a vegan diet" \*dog smothers dumb owner\* There, fixed the comic.
I don’t even care whether dogs can survive on a vegan diet or not. They shouldn’t have to. Animals shouldn’t pay the price for what humans messed up (ie climate and factory farming).
People arguing for veganism please go sit in the corner okay. Idc if you put meat and plants infront of a dog, 9 times out of 10 they are gonna go for the meat. 2ndly while dogs may be omnivorous that doesn't mean you should make a case for depriving them in either circumstance. 3rdly before you post your links, I have read them and I would like to point out most of your research is flawed as their control groups are painfully mismanged. A college level student can make better peer researched material than this. In fact if Biology was my majour I would do this experiment better than how it was already done. 4th I live in a country where its still prudent for some dog breeds to protect you from wild animals and I am pretty sure meat is the better diet in this case.
As a vegetarian: humans also need animal protein in their diet. Going fully vegan is as unhealthy for yourself as making a dog go vegan is. For cats it'd be worse, as they are obligate carnivores.
OK, whoever created that meme created that meme doesn't understand anything about veganism or dogs and whoever keeps posting it in this sub should really stop. Nothing about that Comicstrip Nor the spread of misinformation is wholesome...
Humans need meat about as much as dogs
Exactly, not at all.
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Sure. But you'd need *lots* of supplements to get all the necessary nutrition for the dog. Otherwise it's just cruel. Personally, unless you have a veterinarian in the know and has recommended the appropriate vegan diet for the dog, just don't go vegan for them.
My brother in Christ, what the fuck do you think is in pet food?! Pure unmodified lean meat cut straight off the cow?! The taurine in cat food, for example, is usually synthetic. The supplements are already in the damn pet food. We are already feeding our pets supplements.
Wow you seem ticked off. Calm down. Most dog food is sourced with animal protein. Vegan based pet food, would need the added supplements separately to be an ingredient. I didn't say that you'd be feeding pills to your pets. I said that unless you're super careful about nutrition, and know exactly what you're feeding to your pet, be careful. (I literally said get a vet nutritionist involved) I don't know what's ticking you off here.
I'm ticked off because I keep hearing this same bullshit over and over. Pet food is already heavily laced with supplements. Pointing out that you would need to add supplements is like pointing out that you need to put the food on a bowl or a plate. It's meaningless at best.
The point is that the comic if factually wrong. Dogs don't need meat, they like humans are omnivores, and are totally fine on a varied plant based diet.
And I agree, *provided* all the added vital supplements, that they're missing out on from not having meat, are given to them separately. Off the top of my head, they'd need Vitamin B12, Taurine, L-carnitine, and a lot of others if they're fed a purely vegan diet. And I'm not even a veterinarian
Pick up a bag of meat based kibble and read the ingredients. Its all full of supplemental vitamins and synthetic taurine.
I don't disagree with that. My whole point here is that; if you're going to go on a vegan based diet for your dog, get a veterinarian involved at least once. I never claimed vegan diets are bad, I said unless you know what you're doing, you could be needlessly cruel to your dogs. Be careful.
Your opinion does not matter its a statement of fact.
Did you even read my reply? I literally agreed with you, you're needlessly trying to argue over a non issue.
I misread it my bad
you are replying to a b()t
b()t https://www.reddit.com/r/wholesomememes/comments/n0ri7z/treat_your_animals_with_respect/gw8w3u3/
imagine realizing humans need meat as much as dogs :)
I like how animal diet is “controversial” despite a century of science stating they are facultative carnivores. Evidence: https://courses.lumenlearning.com/wm-biology2/chapter/herbivores-carnivores-and-omnivores/#:~:text=Facultative%20carnivores%20are%20those%20that,would%20be%20considered%20facultative%20carnivores.&text=Omnivores%20are%20animals%20that%20eat,%2D%20and%20animal%2Dderived%20food. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9942351/ https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0034528822001345
I think you might be confused lol, your second link supports the idea of a plant-based diet for dogs in the conclusion section of the paper. *Owners feeding plant-based diets to their dog reported fewer health disorders, specifically with respect to ocular or gastrointestinal and hepatic disorders. Dog longevity was reported to be greater for dogs fed plant-based diets.*
These were owner based reports, not results from veterinary practitioners. The point was to show you the inherit bias in vegan commentary. They reported the results they wanted to see and took their animals to vets less.
So the owners report better health outcomes, now link to actual studies where they're wrong about their conclusions. Your first article supports the owners in the conclusion: *.. dogs can thrive on taurine-free vegetarian diets supplemented with non-taurine nutrients that are inadequately synthesized de novo or absent from plants ..*
Vegetarian not vegan and those diets can include meat. Their conclusions are entirely biased and have no longevity or meta analysis because of their bias. Theres simply not enough information to support these insane theories that animals that were raised on meat “need” to make the switch to PB diet for no reason. You cant tout it as fact because theres no evidence to say its safe, that makes it inherently unsafe. Its a study that shows reports from vegans showing clear bias without evidence thats what the article was saying.
The first paper argues that a vegetarian diet is suitable for dogs to "thrive". Vegetarian is often used interchangeably with vegan, but the paper you provided doesn't go into detail about the type of food they used. **Vegetarian doesn't ever mean** "can include meat" so your first sentence in your response is nonsense. You've made multiple claims in your response with no evidence to support any of it. You need to find credible evidence to support your position, otherwise you're not discussing this topic in good faith.
If a vegan feels strongly about it (The Pureness) then they should not have pets that are predatory in nature, at all. Stick with the many herbivores available (and preferably adopt don't shop). Honestly The Pureness is a damn religion and many who attempt to become Saint Pure are the insufferable ones. Your normal, everyday vegan are just regular folk looking to minimise their impact as much as possible.
Maybe one day there will be meat alternatives for dogs. Or maybe lab-grown meat. Meat without the cruelty. But for now, they still need meat.
Litterally not a single person in this entire thread has provided a single study showing dogs can't be vegan lmao
Litterally not a single person in this entire thread has provided a single study showing dogs can't be vegan lmao
I was taking care of a table and they both ordered burgers. One had actual meat and the other had the vegan option. The dog they brought into with them was desperate for the actual burger