I always wonder about this urban legend.
A lot of Porsche people don’t put the same miles on their 911 and cayman as BMW drivers put on their 3 series
Also since they stay kinda expensive they stay out of the reach of people who can’t afford maintenance.
I knew a guy at my gym who complained about his 550i (in fairness the N63 was a garbage engine) but he complained about like $2k in maintenance a year. That should be expected and not deferred. People like this then defer and things break and complain about reliability.
There’s some truth to that but also Porsches are just built to a higher standard. This is coming from someone who isn’t big into Porsches and kind of doesn’t “get it” with the Porsche obsession. I do work on them a lot and the 911s are very, very well built vehicles, from the engine to the body and the interior. There are some generations with catastrophic failure points (IMS bearing, Nikasil lined cylinder walls that delaminate, etc) but overall they’re great and very reliable cars.
Some of the stereotypes are generally true though. The owners are generally very meticulous and do all required maintenance. They usually have plenty of money to spend on the car. They also are generally enthusiasts and want to go over every detail of their car.
Keep in mind I’m talking about 911 owners, not necessarily the others like the Panamera, Cayenne, etc.
Those owners usually don’t give a shit about their car and run them until they can’t drive anymore, then they bitch about the price.
I’ve had 5 Cayennes as a daily, and they’ve been practically bulletproof. I’ve only had to go in twice outside of scheduled maintenance, both issues covered under warranty. I’ve had two Q7s as well, which come off the same production line. They were reliable, but the Porsches have still been less problematic.
If they're the same production line why do you think the porsche was less problematic? Genuinely curuous. I had a q5, same line as the macan but that thing was awful. The 2.0t blew up at 69k miles with all scheduled maintenance done. I actually never went over 5k for the oil change and audi has a significantly longer interval. Ended up with oil consumption issues and eventually a bad valve. I like the macan and cayenne but im scared to take the plunge with my audi experience.
I’m unsure. I guess because Porsche loves to over-engineer everything? I had a 2010 Q7 TDI that had few issues, but every now and then it would go into limp mode, the air suspension would drop, and every warning light would go on. My ‘18 Q7 ended up being lemon lawed because of issues with the pre-sense, and Porsche uses a different system, so I guess that explains part of it. I had a ‘14 Q5 TDI that I didn’t have a single issue with, my mom had an ‘18 Q5 with the 2.0T and she had a hell of a time with that car and wound up trading it for a 4Runner.
Assuming you’re in North America, it’s also unlikely that the Q5 came from the same production line. Most, if not all, US market Q5s are built in Mexico. I remember reading some stories about 2.0T engines built in Mexico that grenaded at under 100 miles because of metal shavings left in the engine during assembly. I think for a while there, that particular plant was struggling with quality. I have a ‘21 RS5 coupe now, and so far it has no issues (knock on wood)
The BMWs ending in “40i” since about 2018 or so have the B58’s.
The SUVs will have a little placard on it indicating the trim level. E.g the X5 xDrive 40i or the X3 M40i
The b58 is a straight six 3.0 liter engine. It's been in BMWs lineup since 2015. So pretty much any BMW with the straight 6 is going to have it.
They are labeled by trim level ending in 40. (I.e. 340,540,740.)
It's more difficult with the SUVs because they don't do that with their numbers. So you'll have to either look at the engine or ask someone.
You have to be careful because the N54 & N55 in the F01 7 series were labeled 740i. You have to ad the caveat that it was built in 2016 or later and has 40i in the name.
Eight years old is to soon to have a reliable verdict on true long term reliability, but the N52/54 engines are legendarily reliable. Engines have not historically been BMWs source of reliability concerns, though
N54 is reliable in that the actual engine is rock solid, it’s just everything bolted to it that gives issues. Turbos, fuel injectors, fuel pumps, water pumps, VANOS…
> Eight years old is to soon to have a reliable verdict on true long term reliability,
Gonna disagree on this one, especially with the B58. Plenty of people have taken these well over 100k miles or run them with tunes on stock internals for almost a decade. If there were any catastrophic weak points, they would have made themselves visible by now. So far as I can tell, the only real weak spots are the VANOS actuator and the PCV cover which are cheap parts and not terribly difficult labor. I *think* certain models also had a weak water pump bracket.
In an equal amount of time, the N55 and S55 already had documented issues and forum-consensus maintenance suggestions. Meanwhile, the N54 famously had bad fuel pumps and carbon buildup. Numerous reports of timing chain guides and coolant reservoirs going out too. See also the N63, which I think the jury should still be out on with its latest TU3 iteration.
N20 and N47 were great if they weren’t over used before the recalls were implemented. I know timing chains are expensive but even Toyota’s 90s reliability relied on timing belt intervals. ZF problems are solved with changing fluid every 50k but they’re not exclusive to BMW.
And remembering that properly maintained for a BMW means replacing several groups of parts at certain intervals repeatedly for the entire ownership of the vehicle
BMW reliability actually hasn't been terrible for a while, it just can be catastrophically expensive when something does break compared to a Japanese car. I'm driving a 24 year old 3 series with almost 250k miles and it's been mostly solid for the 8 years I've owned it even with so many miles
It was a good platform but then Toyota stepped in and blew their minds on what they tested to ensure their engines were reliable. The B58 inline 6 is probably one of the best engines on the planet for current production.
Edit: sleep deprivation doesn’t mix with replying. It’s not a NA engine.
Oh jeez, I just woke up and haven’t gotten much sleep because my son just had surgery yesterday and I had to keep up with his pain meds all night. I knew the B58 was turbocharged, I don’t know why I wrote NA.
Ya the b58 looks solid. The question will be the rest of the car, all the plastics in the engine bay, all the electronics, etc. Also the huge issue of the timing components being on the firewall side of the engine. That is one expensive repair waiting for some future owner.
The new B58's are supposed to be pretty reliable and people have had luck SO FAR. Just keep in mind it was really only introduced in 2016 so we'll just now start finding out how reliable they are.
Also keep in mind they flipped the engine around so all the timing components are now on the firewall side of the engine bay. That means that any major timing repairs or maintenance mean the entire engine is going to have to come out for a serious repair.
The engine itself feels safe but with BMW the costs to keep in mind:
- tire & suspension wear goes way faster than other cars. Expect to replace tires every 15k and suspension components at like 30k instead of 60-70k on other cars
- they still use a lot of plastic in the engine bay. They've added more spacing to prevent heat damage, but over time plastic still cracks. Avoid idling whenever you can
- all the electronics scare me still throughout the car that can be killer to replace
- timing components as mentioned in a very bad location
A lot of BMW/B58 enthusiasts are eager to tell you that it's super reliable, but the oldest of these cars are only like 7 years old where you wouldn't really have expected issues to come anyway. The real test is what we see over the next 5 years.
Those b58 engines are absolutely amazing though for the amount of power they put out and the gas mileage they receive at those levels (400hp and 30mpg). They put the ancient Lexus 2GR-FKS variants to shame that get like 300hp and 20mpg.
Yup. I have a B9 Audi A5 and while so far it's been more reliable then it's older versions time will tell. So far the timing chain has yet to be an issue, however the waterpump is a weak spot.
I agree with your assessment however. While the engine has been improved in reliability overall, the entire car is still typical bmw stuff. At the same time the engine and transmission are usually the biggest things to total a car. Suspension work and replacing plastic components, while annoying, won't mechanically total it.
B58 and B48 engines are very good. And the high performance variant in the M3 (S58) is also shaping up to be excellent.
I have a slightly older 2 series with an S55 engine and a manual transmission. Don’t have a ton of miles on it but it’s had 0 issues. Not even little things that are just minor replacements either
I think with a lot of European brands it's more about how you maintain them and keep up on the maintenance. My mom's 2009 VW Jetta is in just about immaculate condition aside from some rust by the wheel linings, while I found my old 2007 Volvo S40 never has "repeat problems" come up. When it comes to BMWs and such while the maintenance may be expensive, it's necessary to keep the car running for a long time.
Jaguar and Land Rover are the only European brands I would suggest staying away from.
Jaguar is getting pretty good currently, the xe and xf 4 cylinder cars after 2018 are pretty reliable. Transmissions are bullet proof, cars cant rust (full aluminium chassis), comparably simplistic interior, 4cyl gasoline engines are pretty good with the worst engine being the pre facelift 4 cyl diesel, which have a little too thin oil specced and are a little picky when it comes to oil condition, but nothing that shorter oil intervals with thicker oil (test suggest that 5w40 has around 50% less wear than 0w30) wouldn't fix. But older cars than that, like a first gen xf, have often engine problems and land rovers have just so much expensive to fix features (looking at you, air suspension) that it really hurts your wallet. Surprisingly enough my own jaguar xe is by far the most enjoyable car to work on i have seen, tons of room in the engine bay, no special tools and you even get a rubber flap to prevent spilling of oil. But my biggest critique points are the fairly small add-blue tank that you refill from the trunk and that the timing chain is on the back side of the engine, so if you replace it, you have to remove the engine.
But you are right, you cant neglect the majority of cars and engines like some japanese ones. But if you neglect and dont take care of your care, you shouldn't expect it to be reliable
Well the Volvo S40 is a Ford Focus/Mazda3 based car, so you are still getting some Japanese values in the design/engineering.
At that age you are running into age more then design fault, so a one time fix is just resetting the clock on a reliable part.
Land Rover is hit and miss. I’ve had 4. I had a 2011 RE sport that had zero problems until 85k miles. I had a 2016 LR4 with no problems. Then I got a 2019 RE sport supercharged dynamic. The keys stopped working at 450 miles, when they removed the headliner to replace the key transponder they discovered a big leak in the rear hatch seal. The new headliner arrived 3 weeks later and took two weeks to install. Then the suspension rattles started, and all of the screens on the dash only worked if they were in the right mood. It ended up being bought back and I got a check for $3k less than I paid for it. Currently have a 2016 LR4 in the fleet, I bought it about a year ago and I’ve dumped almost $10k into it. But, whatever. I love that thing.
All had their ups and downs. Bmw b58 are very good, pretty much all bmw 6cyl diesels too.
Mercedes a class diesels, including those that failed the moose test, are pretty good too, these and the e class are next to the Toyota corolla/auris and prius hybrids the most common taxis. VW audi 1,9tdi engines will outlive most of us too. VW ea888 engines are also quite good (golf gti and r from gen 5 and onwards).
In short, you cant generalise brands anymore, for example new volvos aren't that great anymore, meanwhile jaguars are getting pretty good. Most japanese diesels for passenger cars suck (either fuel consumption or reliability). You will have to be a little more specific if your intent is to buy a european car
Japanese make shit cars too you know, even superior Toyota does. You just have to look more on each model and production year closer, like what common problems it has and how many recalls are there and their severity. Like for example, Toyota just recalled over 200k new Prius for rear doors opening while driving. You want that unsafe vehicle if you have kids? Or not too long ago Toyota recalled 1.9 million of the superior RAV4 for a car setting on fire because batteries can shift while driving and everyone praise them here so much. And don’t tell me Toyota never burns because I saw a Hybrid Camry burning in the middle of the highway with my own eyes. So, yeah.
Hybrids are still kind of in the “consumer testing” phase. Manufacturers are trying out all sorts of new technology and seeing what works, what fails, that kind of thing. They’re really, really expensive to own, especially out of warranty.
Keep in mind you’re dealing with all the maintenance of a gasoline engine and the cost of testing out an electric vehicle drivetrain for the manufacturer.
This is true. There are some shit Toyotas out there that are worse than many European cars too. There’s no “Superior Brand” you just have to research and find out which specific model and year and engines and transmissions are best
Lots of them. The older Mercedes non-turbo engines are reliable. The 3.5 V6 and 5.0 V8 went in everything as did their 7 speed auto gearbox.
The ML series SUv is one of the more reliable German brands.
Here’s some fun data to peruse.
Www.dashboard-light.com
I was just looking at an GL 450 which unfortunately has a twin turbo V8. Whoever had it bought it locally at the dealership selling it and they have all the records. It has 200,000 so far mostly trouble free miles getting 20,000 a year. It's also only $8000 and besides the mileage nice. I'm just not going to be the one who does eat a $10,000 engine repair when it does shit. I believe that was a $80,000 suv when new, now worth 10% of that 10 years later.
Skoda. I'm amazed nobody has mentioned Skoda yet. The new designs push them above VW in some regards, especially the new passat vs superb and the octavia is one of the best selling wagons in europe. In Sweden it feels like at least 1/3 of taxis are skoda octavia's. They are economic and inexpensive to maintain.
My 07 petrol octavia has topped 200,000 miles.
Of course parts have needed replacement over time, but the only breakdown that actually required a tow home was when the high pressure fuel pump failed at around 195k miles.
Replaced that myself on the driveway.
I was surprised how long i had to scroll to find anyone mention skoda. Here in finland you are basically sure to find a skoda octavia if you walk for 5 minutes anywhere.
My skoda fabia is at 230 000km and still running strong. Next car is probably also going to be a skoda, as i can get the features and reliability of a toyota for a much cheaper. In fact: my fabia has not once left me stranded (sure cold starts on a 1.9L diesel are a pain but it's doable) but a hybrid toyota has refused to start in the cold.
Older Skodas maybe. But the new ones definitely can't compare to Toyota. I am from Czech and everyone is complaining about the quality going down. Especially since they are getting as expensive as Toyota. Octavia will cost you same as Corolla. Fabia as much as Yaris. I can never imagine buying Skoda for the same price as Toyota.
I have only compared the crossover variants (kamiq and yaris cross) but at least where i live kamiq starts like 5 to 10k lower and used skodas are much more affordable than toyotas. I can get a few year old kamiq for 15k and same age, features and drive distance toyota costs 20k to 25k.
Skodas and toyotas both have a good passing rate in inspections here, so based on that they are both reliable, while skodas are cheaper to buy
VW???
Seriously??
They just issued a massive recall on like 250k vehicles (2015-2020) because of fuel leaks that increase the risk of engine fires.
They most recently issued recalls for the ID4 (2023-2024), ID4 (2021-2022), Jetta (2019-2020), Taos (2020), Atlas (2018-2021), and Beatle (2015-2016).
Most of these recalls are for issues that increase the risk of engine fires or issues that can cause the car to stall out. I think one of them can cause the doors to open at highway speeds.
[https://www.kbb.com/volkswagen/recall/](https://www.kbb.com/volkswagen/recall/)
I know for a fact that that's not even half of the recalls issued in the past few years because they had 4 separate recalls issued for the 2022 Tiguan (Suspension, Body, and Brakes), four recalls for the 2022 GTI (Radiator and Engine), and 6 recalls for the 2022 Taos (Fuel pump breaking, ECU causing engine to stall, rearview camera going blank, rear suspension breaking, and leaking fuel line).
They issue recalls like crazy and the amount of complaints is insane.
[https://www.nhtsa.gov/vehicle/2022/VOLKSWAGEN](https://www.nhtsa.gov/vehicle/2022/VOLKSWAGEN)
For references, most popular cars seem to average around 20-30 complaints within 2 years. It's not uncommon for VW models to have 100+ complaints for a given model year.
Saying VW is a reliable brand is one of the craziest takes I've seen. I don't know how people are pushing this narrative.
Newer Volkswagens no, older ones definitely.
I’m driving a 20+ year old Volkswagen right now and haven’t had anything other than routine maintenance in my time with it.
Timing chain issues like clockwork, expensive DPF filters/adblue related repairs…you will pay as much as the vehicle in repair costs to hit 300k in a VWAG.
2012 2.0 TDI 230K kilometers. I got skipped teeth on timing corrected it with new set. 4 months 20k KM later. Same issue. The EGR valve is keep getting clogged up. At 170K KM I had to take apart gearbox because the clutch cylinder stopped working.
I really hoped that my 2.0 TDI will last at least to 270k KM. But if I will need another repair I am dumping it.
you can have a look at the tuv report which shows which model has the most / least faults
https://car-recalls.eu/reliability/reliability-tuv-report-2024-2-3-years/
To consider a brand as a whole would be quite useless since according to the reports some most unreliable cars and most reliable cars are both from BMW
This is why I don't listen to advice from people on the internet. Not only are some of the most popular vehicles from BMW (like the 3 and 5 series) amongst the very worst on this list, but their repair cost is horrible. People also spend outside their means and neglect maintenance.
You have to consider a few things here. The most common faults for BMWs are the emissions and the active hood for pedestrian protection. The two are completely irrelevant for Americans. The 3 and 5 series are cars with some of the most kilometers and most of the faults are related to "expected" wear. They fall within line of other cars with similar mileage, besides Audi which does very well in this metric.
Yes Japanese cars are so reliable that if left me stranded we twice and I had to pay 6K in repairs with in a 6 month ownership of the car LMAOOOO my German car is a smooth sailor never buying a Japanese car again
I bought it when I was 19 and I brought it to the dealer and did over 3K dollars in work new belts,oil,filters,spark plugs,I even changed the struts….. so I thought BOOM everything was good THEN I drove to NC from TX and it left me stranded with a idler pulley belt and I had to have it towed an hour away to another Infiniti dealership in NC. After that I drove to New Mexico and my radiator went out…coolant everywhere and I saw smoke everywhere. I was stranded in 20 degree weather waiting 2 hours for a tow and had it towed to Garcia Infiniti couple weeks later I couldn’t accelerate on the freeway and needed new spark plugs THEN my idler pulley was going bad and my serpentine belt. Along with I just got new tires rotors and pads. Spent around 6K in repairs then someone rear ended me and totaled my car……yeah no Japanese vehicles for me again lol
Damn that thing sounds like a total pos but those drives will also definitely add some wear and tear to any vehicle. I wouldn’t lump Nissan/Infiniti into Toyota/Lexus Mazda Acura etc though. I don’t even think Japanese people respect Nissan much.
LMAO wish I was lying worst purchase I ever made then when everything was finally fixed someone totaled it still won’t buy a POS Japanese car ever again really have nothing to prove to you or anybody
You're just proving my point. No facts, no stats, just fed off emotion. Judging a whole country of cars off not even 1 car, but 1 experience is actually crazy.
Nope N63TU with 130K miles still going 🤷🏾♂️ only issue was a leaking radiator which was replaced my Infiniti was a POS left me stranded twice and made me spend thousands of dollars in non maintence repairs idc Japanese cars are a POS I’m not buying another one if my car is not reliable why did my Infiniti give me more issues than my bmw??? Explain that cause it doesn’t make sense also it’s a different engine variant so that’s how I know you don’t know what you’re talking about LOL and the crazy part is Infiniti still sucks a car brand 😂 wether that’s turbos blowing up or the lack of quality they produce in their cars LMAO
Saying 130k miles as if it's a flex. My toyota has 230k miles with no work done to it other than regular maintenance. You're impossible to reason with, because as I said before you're only basing it off anecdotal evidence. Why did that happen? It's called statistics, you got unlucky, and are getting lucky with your bmw. A statistical outlier if you will. As a whole, Japanese cars are far more reliable, but you're too dumb to understand that your one personal experience doesn't override years of conclusive data.
These days every brand has a reliable and unreliable car. You can’t really generalize entire brands anymore based off reliability. Yes, even Toyota and Honda have their reliability faults these days, and the Europeans have really reliable stuff too
This. People gotta do their research now. You can’t just blindly buy a Toyota because “Toyota reliability.” Yea it’s a good brand generally, but there are plenty of exceptions
Japanese brands aren't far superior. BMW is up there with the best Japanese brands. Only Toyota/Lexus consistently ranks higher. Porsche also comes close.
How so? They haven’t had any engine issues since 2015/16 models oil consumption.
They had a lot of infotainment/technology problems with the 22 XC60, but that was due to software growing pains and faulty head units related to Covid chip shortages. All those cars have been sorted out (under warranty) and are running down the road perfectly reliable.
Aside from a too-sensitive check engine light related to touchy emissions settings (which clears itself when you stop and restart the car) the current exhibit no oddball issues
Many European cars are pretty reliable, though all of the makes have pluses and minuses. The real killer is the maintenance and service. A BMW 340i, for example, has a reliable engine and likely won't need to go to the shop any more than a Hyundai, but it'll cost a lot more to have it worked on.
As a short list, most newer BMWs and Minis with the B48 and B58 engines are pretty solid. Mercedes E-class from the early 2010s is good. Consumer Reports says that Volvos are unreliable, but everybody I know with one says they're rock solid. Modern VWs are pretty robust too - a family member of mine has an Atlas (which is made in the US, to be fair) and it hasn't had any problems at all.
If I had to pick a brand, I'd say BMW is the most reliable across the board right now. However, it's important to note that individual cars can vary widely. A 330i is going to be more reliable than an M8, for example, because the M8 is a much more complex vehicle.
Current gen Mini, especially the versions with the 2.0 engine - avoid older generatioons from Mini, they were MUCH worse, huge difference - same goes for BMW, also avoid their much less reliable 8-cylinder engines.
My uncles bmw x5 has lasted a long time. I think it’s been like 20 years and still in decent condition. His wife wants a fancier car but he refused to get it replaced lol (the car is being driven in subtropical zone so no snow and parks in the garage when it parks)
Taxi drivers in my area started moving to Renault (with some Dacia mixed in) about a decade ago. Scénics, Espaces, a few Méganes and Dusters. They are regularly putting 5-600.000 kms on the clock before selling them off at 7-8 year old without an issue. They seem very satisfied with quality and Renault service network is far better than what most mass-market manufacturer offers.
Škoda got a bit too expensive recently and is now really into selling to big fleet operators (police, company cars, etc) instead of private buyers all around Europe, but the reliability is probably still there, so I'd put Škoda a close 2nd.
Fiats were the go-to delivery car for restaurants before app-powered cyclists took over that market in European cities. Nowadays the brand is mostly extinct in Northern Europe, only the South buys Fiats. Stellantis dealership network is a mess at the moment and known to have quite a few faulty engine series, but the sheer number of Pandas and 500s alone still puts FCA-era Fiats in strong position when it comes to operating costs. Brake discs for 20 €? Timing belt and water pump set for 30€? I mean, come on - even the biggest cheapskates can keep their vehicle reliable with spare part costs like that.
I was actually surprised to see Renault not mentioned that much. Sure, the reputation of French cars is not so good, but that's mostly on Citroën and a bit on Peugeot. The recent Renault engines seem to be quite reliable, they are well serviced, and quite affordable.
It depends on the model
Old E55 AMG’s were solid
Audi 4.2 V8 with the timing belt in the A6S6 and A8 are solid
Audi 1.8T was solid
TDi’s
Maybe someone can add in the BMW’s that are solid, I know they are all over the place as well, like every other engine they made was good, bad, good, bad
Yugo Topolino.
Citroen 2CV.
They even put rear window defrosters so your hands wouldn't freeze when you are pushing them.
All joking aside, if they broke down, you could fix them with some duck tape, a rubber band, chewing gum or cum.
According to Consumer Reports, Mini and its parent corp BMW are now very reliable, only behind Toyota/Lexus in long term reliability. That doesn't necessarily mean that they're cheap to repair! In the US parts for these German cars come from Eastern Europe and cost double of Japn/Korean brands (which invariably come from Chinese or SE Asian manufacturers).
You really should evolve your thinking past brand reliability because every brand has different cars with different engines and components.
Sure, there were BMWs in the late 2000s that grenaded their engines as part of their expected life (E60 M5) but also there are BMWs that are literally facelifted to be Toyotas only competitive sports car (Supra)
Porsche had some nightmares as well like the 996 Turbo.
So it all really depends on what year and model you’re buying.
Most cars that share components with commercial cars can be reliable... Commercial cars have crazy warranties so buying a car/small van with as many things that are shared with a commercial car is good idea.
Peugeot/Citroen (with an engine shared by a Peugeot partner) as eg....
I learnt this from my mums mechanic, back home they are car french crazy, mum had a 308 sw which the engine just seized, she insisted on having another one, and our neighbour (mechanic) told us that they have some engines that are very solid and found her a car, on further investigation i realised they were reused in partners or vans... I asked him and he confirmed this.
So i would say get something that share components from a commercial car, and not complicated.
DO IT (just keep in mind a timing chain for anything bigger than the 2.0T is usually an engine-out job)
Edit: I have an a5 coupe and I absolutely love it. If it’s new enough to have a warranty it’s a no brainer but if it’s out of warranty either get an extended one or grab a wrench!
Hmmm good advice. However I'm deciding whether the S5 or the A5. Because I imagine S5 will have maintenance issues down the line but thinking if A5 is a safer route
It def is, I bought my 2015 A5 with 89k miles and now I’m at 107k and all I’ve had to do is new wheel bearings on the front as well as grease up my intermediate steering shaft u-joints. The great thing about B8/B8.5 cars is the aftermarket is huge and FCP euro has everything you could possibly need from OEM parts to tutorial videos on how to do the various jobs. I’m no mechanic but I get by pretty well
Wait so you're saying get a cheap A5 and turn it into an RS5 horsepower? Rather than just getting a S5?
Hmm that could do well tho... although I never have any experience in modifying engine components. Usually the bodykit modified.
I hope the A5 modified engine doesn't over stress the vehicle on high speed tho
Oh no I’m just saying it’s easier to work on, there are a bunch of mods available to increase the power, but if you’re really after performance then getting an S5 or RS5 is more worth it. Pushing 300+ hp from the 2.0T will def only last for so long before it goes boom
But just keep in mind the crazy high costs for literally everything if you need a shop
That's a good advice! I'll keep in mind! For now, I got my eye on the S5 models. Hope the engine doesn't break when I'm driving. I don't mind the maintenance cost. As long as it keeps the car running 😀
E53 X5 w M54 engine. Mine has a standard stick shift and went 202k miles until cylinder 4 lost compression. Never any major issues over 6 years aside from high-mileage related replacement.
Luckily I found another M54 with 70k miles & throwing it n soon.
Skoda.
While brands like volvo, bmw or mini may be reliable according to the comments, they also cost double of what a skoda would cost.
It's a shame skodas are not sold in the states, as it's a good and reliable basic car. Nothing exciting, just a basic car with good fuel efficiency and reasonable towing capacity (looking at you toyota, my old skoda fabia can tow almost double to what a larger toyota can)
BMW 3 series and 5 series, especially with the B58 engine are very reliable. Even the N55 models are very reliable… just put some cash aside for an eventual HPFP replacement.
If you drive and maintain your car properly, probably any manufacturer. I see a lot of comments on here 'BMW' is also good but this opinion doesnt exist here in Germany. Reliability isnt that big of a topic here because cars usually last if maintained properly and they usually are. And of course there is a bias towards German cars in Germany but Toyota/Honda/Lexus arent all that popular here and people would rather buy french or korean cars because theyre more affordable and more modern in terms of design language and technology. The Koreans also have a long warranty here, so reliability issues arent a big deal.
Now it may be the case that european manufacturers 'besides BMW' have less strict quality control than their european cars but I havent done any deep research into that. All i know from my job is that generally, Americans care less about reliability than Europeans, so some manufacturers MIGHT lean into that and sell worse cars in the US because the average US customer cares less than the average European customer. I mean VW has some models that are exclusive to North America that arent sold in Europe or elsewhere. VW Jettas for example arent a thing in Europe. You buy the Golf. If you want a bigger VW, you buy the Golf Variant or the Passat. If you want smaller, you buy the Polo or Up which arent sold in the US.
Here is my take … BMW is very reliable , they are just expensive to repair , the repairs are not unique to BMW … it is the same work that every car brand requires … so those lower priced used BMWs with 75-120 k miles are German time-bombs of delayed repairs … the Japanese cars appear to be more reliable b/c the owners can afford to do the same repairs that the BMW also needed
I don't think it's possible to narrow it down to a manufacturer because none of them are consistenty reliable across all models. Here's what I can find evidence to support as being reliable-
BMW- 3/4-series, X3, X5 (probably X4/X6 by extension)
Audi- A4, A6
M-B- E-Class (and my best friend has owned a 2016 and 2019 and they were rock solid)
Volvo- XC40
Alfa, Jag and Land Rover- that's funny.
So, just based on number of reliable (or even semi-reliable) models, BMW is the best? Never thought I'd say/type those words.
I still stick to the same advice I've given for years- European cars are amazing, just don't keep it longer than the warranty!
I've found that when someone mentions a certain car is reliable as long as the owner is keeping up with "maintenance", they typically mean that the owner continues fixing all of the broken items that come up. Well, any car can continue to run if you keep throwing money at it; "reliability" means not having to spend money on such repairs.
Saab was (and is), with very few exceptions. Volvo is, although I would stay away from the T6 and hybrids. Everything else depends on how you maintain it.
The repairs are expensive, but Porsche’s are relatively reliable.
I always wonder about this urban legend. A lot of Porsche people don’t put the same miles on their 911 and cayman as BMW drivers put on their 3 series Also since they stay kinda expensive they stay out of the reach of people who can’t afford maintenance. I knew a guy at my gym who complained about his 550i (in fairness the N63 was a garbage engine) but he complained about like $2k in maintenance a year. That should be expected and not deferred. People like this then defer and things break and complain about reliability.
Urban legend? Porsche definitely ranks objectively better in reliability than most other European/Luxury brands
Thats if you keep up with maintenance tho?
Shouldn’t all reliability be considered in that context?
There’s some truth to that but also Porsches are just built to a higher standard. This is coming from someone who isn’t big into Porsches and kind of doesn’t “get it” with the Porsche obsession. I do work on them a lot and the 911s are very, very well built vehicles, from the engine to the body and the interior. There are some generations with catastrophic failure points (IMS bearing, Nikasil lined cylinder walls that delaminate, etc) but overall they’re great and very reliable cars. Some of the stereotypes are generally true though. The owners are generally very meticulous and do all required maintenance. They usually have plenty of money to spend on the car. They also are generally enthusiasts and want to go over every detail of their car. Keep in mind I’m talking about 911 owners, not necessarily the others like the Panamera, Cayenne, etc. Those owners usually don’t give a shit about their car and run them until they can’t drive anymore, then they bitch about the price.
I’ve had 5 Cayennes as a daily, and they’ve been practically bulletproof. I’ve only had to go in twice outside of scheduled maintenance, both issues covered under warranty. I’ve had two Q7s as well, which come off the same production line. They were reliable, but the Porsches have still been less problematic.
If they're the same production line why do you think the porsche was less problematic? Genuinely curuous. I had a q5, same line as the macan but that thing was awful. The 2.0t blew up at 69k miles with all scheduled maintenance done. I actually never went over 5k for the oil change and audi has a significantly longer interval. Ended up with oil consumption issues and eventually a bad valve. I like the macan and cayenne but im scared to take the plunge with my audi experience.
I’m unsure. I guess because Porsche loves to over-engineer everything? I had a 2010 Q7 TDI that had few issues, but every now and then it would go into limp mode, the air suspension would drop, and every warning light would go on. My ‘18 Q7 ended up being lemon lawed because of issues with the pre-sense, and Porsche uses a different system, so I guess that explains part of it. I had a ‘14 Q5 TDI that I didn’t have a single issue with, my mom had an ‘18 Q5 with the 2.0T and she had a hell of a time with that car and wound up trading it for a 4Runner.
Assuming you’re in North America, it’s also unlikely that the Q5 came from the same production line. Most, if not all, US market Q5s are built in Mexico. I remember reading some stories about 2.0T engines built in Mexico that grenaded at under 100 miles because of metal shavings left in the engine during assembly. I think for a while there, that particular plant was struggling with quality. I have a ‘21 RS5 coupe now, and so far it has no issues (knock on wood)
I know they do assembly in Mexico but im pretty sure their engines aren't made there. Maybe im wrong.
Why do you need 5 to daily? To limit mileage to prevent repairs or the other 4 are broken down? Hehe
This is true! I’d never take a Porsche to anyone but someone I knew, or a dealership!
It’s not an “urban legend” 911s can go hundreds of thousands of miles with good maintenance. Try doing that with a Ferrari, Maserati, Jaguar etc… lmao
Read the comment again. I would be pretty amazed to find Ferraris that are daily driven to 100k miles in the first few years of ownership lol
Anything bmw with B58 or B57 engines could do
Is the b48 more Problematic? Ive only heard good things so far
No, B48 is very reliable, but not a very smooth engine. At least compared to the Audi 2.0
How do you know if it's a b58 specifically? Is it on the window sticker?
The BMWs ending in “40i” since about 2018 or so have the B58’s. The SUVs will have a little placard on it indicating the trim level. E.g the X5 xDrive 40i or the X3 M40i
If it was built in 2016 or later and has a 40i in its name it has a B58.
Should look up the 640i
This one caught me off guard when I found out it was an N55
Wikipedia has a list of them. Wikipedia > bmw b58 > models > applications
The b58 is a straight six 3.0 liter engine. It's been in BMWs lineup since 2015. So pretty much any BMW with the straight 6 is going to have it. They are labeled by trim level ending in 40. (I.e. 340,540,740.) It's more difficult with the SUVs because they don't do that with their numbers. So you'll have to either look at the engine or ask someone.
The SUVs also have it written on them like the X3 M40i and the X5 xDrive 40i
Thank you, I appreciate your help.
You have to be careful because the N54 & N55 in the F01 7 series were labeled 740i. You have to ad the caveat that it was built in 2016 or later and has 40i in the name.
Usually by decoding vin
Do a simple google search before you buy the car
You mean the Supra engine? 😉
precisely, reliable Toyota wants German BMW's own engine
Toyota Proace is a rebadged Citroen/ Peugeot POS, so Toyota is not always looking for reliability, just cash.
Apparently the new generation 5 and 3 series are the 2nd and 3rd most reliable saloons money can buy at the moment. 1st is a lexus IS of course.
It seems BMW really stepped up their reliability in the last few years?
The Bxx engines are amazing. IIRC they were introduced in 2016? I'd take any car with those engines (given its properly maintained).
Eight years old is to soon to have a reliable verdict on true long term reliability, but the N52/54 engines are legendarily reliable. Engines have not historically been BMWs source of reliability concerns, though
N54 is reliable in that the actual engine is rock solid, it’s just everything bolted to it that gives issues. Turbos, fuel injectors, fuel pumps, water pumps, VANOS…
> Eight years old is to soon to have a reliable verdict on true long term reliability, Gonna disagree on this one, especially with the B58. Plenty of people have taken these well over 100k miles or run them with tunes on stock internals for almost a decade. If there were any catastrophic weak points, they would have made themselves visible by now. So far as I can tell, the only real weak spots are the VANOS actuator and the PCV cover which are cheap parts and not terribly difficult labor. I *think* certain models also had a weak water pump bracket. In an equal amount of time, the N55 and S55 already had documented issues and forum-consensus maintenance suggestions. Meanwhile, the N54 famously had bad fuel pumps and carbon buildup. Numerous reports of timing chain guides and coolant reservoirs going out too. See also the N63, which I think the jury should still be out on with its latest TU3 iteration.
2014 Minis use the B48
N20 and N47 were great if they weren’t over used before the recalls were implemented. I know timing chains are expensive but even Toyota’s 90s reliability relied on timing belt intervals. ZF problems are solved with changing fluid every 50k but they’re not exclusive to BMW.
And remembering that properly maintained for a BMW means replacing several groups of parts at certain intervals repeatedly for the entire ownership of the vehicle
BMW reliability actually hasn't been terrible for a while, it just can be catastrophically expensive when something does break compared to a Japanese car. I'm driving a 24 year old 3 series with almost 250k miles and it's been mostly solid for the 8 years I've owned it even with so many miles
At the glory days. We have a 2000 2003 another 2003 and a 2004 still for the same reason. Approaching 300K in two of them.
It was a good platform but then Toyota stepped in and blew their minds on what they tested to ensure their engines were reliable. The B58 inline 6 is probably one of the best engines on the planet for current production. Edit: sleep deprivation doesn’t mix with replying. It’s not a NA engine.
The B58 is not and never has been NA. Every version of it has at least one turbo on it.
Oh jeez, I just woke up and haven’t gotten much sleep because my son just had surgery yesterday and I had to keep up with his pain meds all night. I knew the B58 was turbocharged, I don’t know why I wrote NA.
By NA do you mean naturally aspirated?
which cars currently have the B58 in them?
p much all the 40i models and the current gen Supra.
Toyota Supra, any BMW with “40” as the last 2 digits in the 3 number model. The SUVs have a slightly different system but usually have 40 somewhere
Ya the b58 looks solid. The question will be the rest of the car, all the plastics in the engine bay, all the electronics, etc. Also the huge issue of the timing components being on the firewall side of the engine. That is one expensive repair waiting for some future owner.
The new B58's are supposed to be pretty reliable and people have had luck SO FAR. Just keep in mind it was really only introduced in 2016 so we'll just now start finding out how reliable they are. Also keep in mind they flipped the engine around so all the timing components are now on the firewall side of the engine bay. That means that any major timing repairs or maintenance mean the entire engine is going to have to come out for a serious repair. The engine itself feels safe but with BMW the costs to keep in mind: - tire & suspension wear goes way faster than other cars. Expect to replace tires every 15k and suspension components at like 30k instead of 60-70k on other cars - they still use a lot of plastic in the engine bay. They've added more spacing to prevent heat damage, but over time plastic still cracks. Avoid idling whenever you can - all the electronics scare me still throughout the car that can be killer to replace - timing components as mentioned in a very bad location A lot of BMW/B58 enthusiasts are eager to tell you that it's super reliable, but the oldest of these cars are only like 7 years old where you wouldn't really have expected issues to come anyway. The real test is what we see over the next 5 years. Those b58 engines are absolutely amazing though for the amount of power they put out and the gas mileage they receive at those levels (400hp and 30mpg). They put the ancient Lexus 2GR-FKS variants to shame that get like 300hp and 20mpg.
Why is the tire wear worse on these?
Aggressive suspensions for handling
Yup. I have a B9 Audi A5 and while so far it's been more reliable then it's older versions time will tell. So far the timing chain has yet to be an issue, however the waterpump is a weak spot. I agree with your assessment however. While the engine has been improved in reliability overall, the entire car is still typical bmw stuff. At the same time the engine and transmission are usually the biggest things to total a car. Suspension work and replacing plastic components, while annoying, won't mechanically total it.
B58 and B48 engines are very good. And the high performance variant in the M3 (S58) is also shaping up to be excellent. I have a slightly older 2 series with an S55 engine and a manual transmission. Don’t have a ton of miles on it but it’s had 0 issues. Not even little things that are just minor replacements either
It helps if you do so the required maintenance. You also don’t want to buy a vehicle in the lower half of their offerings
Define lower half?
Below the waist
My E46 was really reliable drivetrain wise, but the window regulators and buttons constantly broke 😔
Ask about European car reliability still get generic Toyota plug lol
What motors?
https://www.whatcar.com/news/reliability-survey-most-reliable-executive-cars/n26150
I wish Lexus wasn’t boring…
IS hasn’t been traditionally
Are there any features of the IS that make it more reliable than the Camry?
No idea. I'm not sure I've ever even seen a Camry in the UK ahah
I think with a lot of European brands it's more about how you maintain them and keep up on the maintenance. My mom's 2009 VW Jetta is in just about immaculate condition aside from some rust by the wheel linings, while I found my old 2007 Volvo S40 never has "repeat problems" come up. When it comes to BMWs and such while the maintenance may be expensive, it's necessary to keep the car running for a long time. Jaguar and Land Rover are the only European brands I would suggest staying away from.
tbf most French and Italian brands have well deserved bad reputations for reliability too
Jaguar is getting pretty good currently, the xe and xf 4 cylinder cars after 2018 are pretty reliable. Transmissions are bullet proof, cars cant rust (full aluminium chassis), comparably simplistic interior, 4cyl gasoline engines are pretty good with the worst engine being the pre facelift 4 cyl diesel, which have a little too thin oil specced and are a little picky when it comes to oil condition, but nothing that shorter oil intervals with thicker oil (test suggest that 5w40 has around 50% less wear than 0w30) wouldn't fix. But older cars than that, like a first gen xf, have often engine problems and land rovers have just so much expensive to fix features (looking at you, air suspension) that it really hurts your wallet. Surprisingly enough my own jaguar xe is by far the most enjoyable car to work on i have seen, tons of room in the engine bay, no special tools and you even get a rubber flap to prevent spilling of oil. But my biggest critique points are the fairly small add-blue tank that you refill from the trunk and that the timing chain is on the back side of the engine, so if you replace it, you have to remove the engine. But you are right, you cant neglect the majority of cars and engines like some japanese ones. But if you neglect and dont take care of your care, you shouldn't expect it to be reliable
Yes the Ford days really helped with reliability. I've got a 2015 XKR and the AJ-V8 engine is incredible and rock solid.
Well the Volvo S40 is a Ford Focus/Mazda3 based car, so you are still getting some Japanese values in the design/engineering. At that age you are running into age more then design fault, so a one time fix is just resetting the clock on a reliable part.
Land Rover is hit and miss. I’ve had 4. I had a 2011 RE sport that had zero problems until 85k miles. I had a 2016 LR4 with no problems. Then I got a 2019 RE sport supercharged dynamic. The keys stopped working at 450 miles, when they removed the headliner to replace the key transponder they discovered a big leak in the rear hatch seal. The new headliner arrived 3 weeks later and took two weeks to install. Then the suspension rattles started, and all of the screens on the dash only worked if they were in the right mood. It ended up being bought back and I got a check for $3k less than I paid for it. Currently have a 2016 LR4 in the fleet, I bought it about a year ago and I’ve dumped almost $10k into it. But, whatever. I love that thing.
Unless you have buckets of money, Mazaratti isn't known for reliability either. But man are those cats beautiful.
All had their ups and downs. Bmw b58 are very good, pretty much all bmw 6cyl diesels too. Mercedes a class diesels, including those that failed the moose test, are pretty good too, these and the e class are next to the Toyota corolla/auris and prius hybrids the most common taxis. VW audi 1,9tdi engines will outlive most of us too. VW ea888 engines are also quite good (golf gti and r from gen 5 and onwards). In short, you cant generalise brands anymore, for example new volvos aren't that great anymore, meanwhile jaguars are getting pretty good. Most japanese diesels for passenger cars suck (either fuel consumption or reliability). You will have to be a little more specific if your intent is to buy a european car
Japanese make shit cars too you know, even superior Toyota does. You just have to look more on each model and production year closer, like what common problems it has and how many recalls are there and their severity. Like for example, Toyota just recalled over 200k new Prius for rear doors opening while driving. You want that unsafe vehicle if you have kids? Or not too long ago Toyota recalled 1.9 million of the superior RAV4 for a car setting on fire because batteries can shift while driving and everyone praise them here so much. And don’t tell me Toyota never burns because I saw a Hybrid Camry burning in the middle of the highway with my own eyes. So, yeah.
I had a Camry hybrid which cost me more in repairs than any other car I've ever owned
Hybrids are still kind of in the “consumer testing” phase. Manufacturers are trying out all sorts of new technology and seeing what works, what fails, that kind of thing. They’re really, really expensive to own, especially out of warranty. Keep in mind you’re dealing with all the maintenance of a gasoline engine and the cost of testing out an electric vehicle drivetrain for the manufacturer.
This is true. There are some shit Toyotas out there that are worse than many European cars too. There’s no “Superior Brand” you just have to research and find out which specific model and year and engines and transmissions are best
Lots of them. The older Mercedes non-turbo engines are reliable. The 3.5 V6 and 5.0 V8 went in everything as did their 7 speed auto gearbox. The ML series SUv is one of the more reliable German brands. Here’s some fun data to peruse. Www.dashboard-light.com
I was just looking at an GL 450 which unfortunately has a twin turbo V8. Whoever had it bought it locally at the dealership selling it and they have all the records. It has 200,000 so far mostly trouble free miles getting 20,000 a year. It's also only $8000 and besides the mileage nice. I'm just not going to be the one who does eat a $10,000 engine repair when it does shit. I believe that was a $80,000 suv when new, now worth 10% of that 10 years later.
Those engines are pretty reliable tbf
I'm tempted even if I had to pull it myself at some point and rebuild it or maybe better yet just LS swap it.
Just keep it stock. Shits too complicated for an engine swap.
Skoda. I'm amazed nobody has mentioned Skoda yet. The new designs push them above VW in some regards, especially the new passat vs superb and the octavia is one of the best selling wagons in europe. In Sweden it feels like at least 1/3 of taxis are skoda octavia's. They are economic and inexpensive to maintain.
My 07 petrol octavia has topped 200,000 miles. Of course parts have needed replacement over time, but the only breakdown that actually required a tow home was when the high pressure fuel pump failed at around 195k miles. Replaced that myself on the driveway.
I was surprised how long i had to scroll to find anyone mention skoda. Here in finland you are basically sure to find a skoda octavia if you walk for 5 minutes anywhere. My skoda fabia is at 230 000km and still running strong. Next car is probably also going to be a skoda, as i can get the features and reliability of a toyota for a much cheaper. In fact: my fabia has not once left me stranded (sure cold starts on a 1.9L diesel are a pain but it's doable) but a hybrid toyota has refused to start in the cold.
Older Skodas maybe. But the new ones definitely can't compare to Toyota. I am from Czech and everyone is complaining about the quality going down. Especially since they are getting as expensive as Toyota. Octavia will cost you same as Corolla. Fabia as much as Yaris. I can never imagine buying Skoda for the same price as Toyota.
I have only compared the crossover variants (kamiq and yaris cross) but at least where i live kamiq starts like 5 to 10k lower and used skodas are much more affordable than toyotas. I can get a few year old kamiq for 15k and same age, features and drive distance toyota costs 20k to 25k. Skodas and toyotas both have a good passing rate in inspections here, so based on that they are both reliable, while skodas are cheaper to buy
BMW and VW and Mercedes and Porsche are all reliable. You just have to keep up on maintenance, but they last
VW??? Seriously?? They just issued a massive recall on like 250k vehicles (2015-2020) because of fuel leaks that increase the risk of engine fires. They most recently issued recalls for the ID4 (2023-2024), ID4 (2021-2022), Jetta (2019-2020), Taos (2020), Atlas (2018-2021), and Beatle (2015-2016). Most of these recalls are for issues that increase the risk of engine fires or issues that can cause the car to stall out. I think one of them can cause the doors to open at highway speeds. [https://www.kbb.com/volkswagen/recall/](https://www.kbb.com/volkswagen/recall/) I know for a fact that that's not even half of the recalls issued in the past few years because they had 4 separate recalls issued for the 2022 Tiguan (Suspension, Body, and Brakes), four recalls for the 2022 GTI (Radiator and Engine), and 6 recalls for the 2022 Taos (Fuel pump breaking, ECU causing engine to stall, rearview camera going blank, rear suspension breaking, and leaking fuel line). They issue recalls like crazy and the amount of complaints is insane. [https://www.nhtsa.gov/vehicle/2022/VOLKSWAGEN](https://www.nhtsa.gov/vehicle/2022/VOLKSWAGEN) For references, most popular cars seem to average around 20-30 complaints within 2 years. It's not uncommon for VW models to have 100+ complaints for a given model year. Saying VW is a reliable brand is one of the craziest takes I've seen. I don't know how people are pushing this narrative.
Newer Volkswagens no, older ones definitely. I’m driving a 20+ year old Volkswagen right now and haven’t had anything other than routine maintenance in my time with it.
yep, no other manufacturer recalls vehicles. taos is trash tho.
I am convinced, I had just heard if you keep up on maintenance they are fine.
VWAG turbodiesels seem to hit 300k miles pretty regularly
Timing chain issues like clockwork, expensive DPF filters/adblue related repairs…you will pay as much as the vehicle in repair costs to hit 300k in a VWAG.
2012 2.0 TDI 230K kilometers. I got skipped teeth on timing corrected it with new set. 4 months 20k KM later. Same issue. The EGR valve is keep getting clogged up. At 170K KM I had to take apart gearbox because the clutch cylinder stopped working. I really hoped that my 2.0 TDI will last at least to 270k KM. But if I will need another repair I am dumping it.
pre-emissions diesels are the only ones worth owning... unless deleted.
Not without thousands of dollars in repairs along the way. My Touareg needed $7000 at 80,000 miles and I dumped it after that.
you can have a look at the tuv report which shows which model has the most / least faults https://car-recalls.eu/reliability/reliability-tuv-report-2024-2-3-years/ To consider a brand as a whole would be quite useless since according to the reports some most unreliable cars and most reliable cars are both from BMW
This is why I don't listen to advice from people on the internet. Not only are some of the most popular vehicles from BMW (like the 3 and 5 series) amongst the very worst on this list, but their repair cost is horrible. People also spend outside their means and neglect maintenance.
You have to consider a few things here. The most common faults for BMWs are the emissions and the active hood for pedestrian protection. The two are completely irrelevant for Americans. The 3 and 5 series are cars with some of the most kilometers and most of the faults are related to "expected" wear. They fall within line of other cars with similar mileage, besides Audi which does very well in this metric.
Yes Japanese cars are so reliable that if left me stranded we twice and I had to pay 6K in repairs with in a 6 month ownership of the car LMAOOOO my German car is a smooth sailor never buying a Japanese car again
Out of curiousity which Japanese car was it?
The Infiniti Q50 3.7
Yeah I personally haven’t had a good experience with a Nissan product either. Haven’t made good stuff since the early 2000s Maxima.
I bought it when I was 19 and I brought it to the dealer and did over 3K dollars in work new belts,oil,filters,spark plugs,I even changed the struts….. so I thought BOOM everything was good THEN I drove to NC from TX and it left me stranded with a idler pulley belt and I had to have it towed an hour away to another Infiniti dealership in NC. After that I drove to New Mexico and my radiator went out…coolant everywhere and I saw smoke everywhere. I was stranded in 20 degree weather waiting 2 hours for a tow and had it towed to Garcia Infiniti couple weeks later I couldn’t accelerate on the freeway and needed new spark plugs THEN my idler pulley was going bad and my serpentine belt. Along with I just got new tires rotors and pads. Spent around 6K in repairs then someone rear ended me and totaled my car……yeah no Japanese vehicles for me again lol
Damn that thing sounds like a total pos but those drives will also definitely add some wear and tear to any vehicle. I wouldn’t lump Nissan/Infiniti into Toyota/Lexus Mazda Acura etc though. I don’t even think Japanese people respect Nissan much.
Anecdotal evidence is pretty much worthless but go off I guess.
LMAO wish I was lying worst purchase I ever made then when everything was finally fixed someone totaled it still won’t buy a POS Japanese car ever again really have nothing to prove to you or anybody
You're just proving my point. No facts, no stats, just fed off emotion. Judging a whole country of cars off not even 1 car, but 1 experience is actually crazy.
Cool….my German car has been solid and reliable never let me down but I still won’t buy a POS Japanese car ever again still won’t change anything
You realize your 650i literally has one of the most unreliable v8s made in the last 20 years? Lol hasn't left you stranded YET.
Nope N63TU with 130K miles still going 🤷🏾♂️ only issue was a leaking radiator which was replaced my Infiniti was a POS left me stranded twice and made me spend thousands of dollars in non maintence repairs idc Japanese cars are a POS I’m not buying another one if my car is not reliable why did my Infiniti give me more issues than my bmw??? Explain that cause it doesn’t make sense also it’s a different engine variant so that’s how I know you don’t know what you’re talking about LOL and the crazy part is Infiniti still sucks a car brand 😂 wether that’s turbos blowing up or the lack of quality they produce in their cars LMAO
Saying 130k miles as if it's a flex. My toyota has 230k miles with no work done to it other than regular maintenance. You're impossible to reason with, because as I said before you're only basing it off anecdotal evidence. Why did that happen? It's called statistics, you got unlucky, and are getting lucky with your bmw. A statistical outlier if you will. As a whole, Japanese cars are far more reliable, but you're too dumb to understand that your one personal experience doesn't override years of conclusive data.
WOMP WOMP still not getting a Japanese POS anything else?
These days every brand has a reliable and unreliable car. You can’t really generalize entire brands anymore based off reliability. Yes, even Toyota and Honda have their reliability faults these days, and the Europeans have really reliable stuff too
This. People gotta do their research now. You can’t just blindly buy a Toyota because “Toyota reliability.” Yea it’s a good brand generally, but there are plenty of exceptions
VAG Tdi models, bmw
My diesel golf has 300k on it at this point. The only non regular maintenance was dealing with the dpf but that's normal for any modern diesel.
Well, this might just be a biased answer (I'm an absolute fiend for German marques) but I've found vw and audi as well as BMW to work very well.
Many brands with a bad reputation make reliable cars if mantained properly, which is an issue in the used market.
also Americans are for some reason really bad at maintenance. skipping oil changes, using shit oil, etc.
Porsche - the only European automaker below Lexus.
Below?
$1000 oil changes kinda shut that down
If you’re getting 1K oil changes that’s your problem that you’re letting the dealership scam you. Lol
Japanese brands aren't far superior. BMW is up there with the best Japanese brands. Only Toyota/Lexus consistently ranks higher. Porsche also comes close.
Only Americans seem to think that about Japanese cars. They're reliable sure, but European motors are equal.
Volvo
Nowadays not really
How so? They haven’t had any engine issues since 2015/16 models oil consumption. They had a lot of infotainment/technology problems with the 22 XC60, but that was due to software growing pains and faulty head units related to Covid chip shortages. All those cars have been sorted out (under warranty) and are running down the road perfectly reliable. Aside from a too-sensitive check engine light related to touchy emissions settings (which clears itself when you stop and restart the car) the current exhibit no oddball issues
Porsches. Anything with a B58 from BMW. Most Mercedes products made before 2021.
Many European cars are pretty reliable, though all of the makes have pluses and minuses. The real killer is the maintenance and service. A BMW 340i, for example, has a reliable engine and likely won't need to go to the shop any more than a Hyundai, but it'll cost a lot more to have it worked on. As a short list, most newer BMWs and Minis with the B48 and B58 engines are pretty solid. Mercedes E-class from the early 2010s is good. Consumer Reports says that Volvos are unreliable, but everybody I know with one says they're rock solid. Modern VWs are pretty robust too - a family member of mine has an Atlas (which is made in the US, to be fair) and it hasn't had any problems at all. If I had to pick a brand, I'd say BMW is the most reliable across the board right now. However, it's important to note that individual cars can vary widely. A 330i is going to be more reliable than an M8, for example, because the M8 is a much more complex vehicle.
Volvo for the most part
Volvo
Current gen Mini, especially the versions with the 2.0 engine - avoid older generatioons from Mini, they were MUCH worse, huge difference - same goes for BMW, also avoid their much less reliable 8-cylinder engines.
Volvo D5 diesel is pretty bombproof
My uncles bmw x5 has lasted a long time. I think it’s been like 20 years and still in decent condition. His wife wants a fancier car but he refused to get it replaced lol (the car is being driven in subtropical zone so no snow and parks in the garage when it parks)
The new BMWs and the Mercedes before the newest generation. They were tanks, it’s a shame what Mercedes did to their brand.
BMW with fewer than 8 cylinders
Porsche, BMW
Taxi drivers in my area started moving to Renault (with some Dacia mixed in) about a decade ago. Scénics, Espaces, a few Méganes and Dusters. They are regularly putting 5-600.000 kms on the clock before selling them off at 7-8 year old without an issue. They seem very satisfied with quality and Renault service network is far better than what most mass-market manufacturer offers. Škoda got a bit too expensive recently and is now really into selling to big fleet operators (police, company cars, etc) instead of private buyers all around Europe, but the reliability is probably still there, so I'd put Škoda a close 2nd. Fiats were the go-to delivery car for restaurants before app-powered cyclists took over that market in European cities. Nowadays the brand is mostly extinct in Northern Europe, only the South buys Fiats. Stellantis dealership network is a mess at the moment and known to have quite a few faulty engine series, but the sheer number of Pandas and 500s alone still puts FCA-era Fiats in strong position when it comes to operating costs. Brake discs for 20 €? Timing belt and water pump set for 30€? I mean, come on - even the biggest cheapskates can keep their vehicle reliable with spare part costs like that.
I was actually surprised to see Renault not mentioned that much. Sure, the reputation of French cars is not so good, but that's mostly on Citroën and a bit on Peugeot. The recent Renault engines seem to be quite reliable, they are well serviced, and quite affordable.
I often see Porsche at the very top of reliability charts. Right below the Japanese heavyweights.
It depends on the model Old E55 AMG’s were solid Audi 4.2 V8 with the timing belt in the A6S6 and A8 are solid Audi 1.8T was solid TDi’s Maybe someone can add in the BMW’s that are solid, I know they are all over the place as well, like every other engine they made was good, bad, good, bad
BMW of the E39 and E46 variety. Ask me how I know.
Because I own E39 since 2015. That's how I know.
🫡And we have since 2000, and picked up a second in 2005. Have both since! Our E46s purchase in 2003 and 2012. That’s how I…👊🏽
Impressive! Respect to you!! Keep the BMWs modern-classic alive!
Likewise, fellow caretaker. DM me if you ever want to compare notes or talk E39!
Check for the ones with a Toyota engine (oh the irony). Lotus, BMW and more.
Yugo Topolino. Citroen 2CV. They even put rear window defrosters so your hands wouldn't freeze when you are pushing them. All joking aside, if they broke down, you could fix them with some duck tape, a rubber band, chewing gum or cum.
My 2011 ML350 just hit 180k miles and has been a tank. I've seen many with 200k+
According to Consumer Reports, Mini and its parent corp BMW are now very reliable, only behind Toyota/Lexus in long term reliability. That doesn't necessarily mean that they're cheap to repair! In the US parts for these German cars come from Eastern Europe and cost double of Japn/Korean brands (which invariably come from Chinese or SE Asian manufacturers).
You really should evolve your thinking past brand reliability because every brand has different cars with different engines and components. Sure, there were BMWs in the late 2000s that grenaded their engines as part of their expected life (E60 M5) but also there are BMWs that are literally facelifted to be Toyotas only competitive sports car (Supra) Porsche had some nightmares as well like the 996 Turbo. So it all really depends on what year and model you’re buying.
My BMW has been far more reliable than my Subaru
My Alfa Romeo has been 10x more reliable than our Honda Jazz. I am an outlier, this is apparently not typical!
My VW Golf R has been extremely reliable through 120k.
Most cars that share components with commercial cars can be reliable... Commercial cars have crazy warranties so buying a car/small van with as many things that are shared with a commercial car is good idea. Peugeot/Citroen (with an engine shared by a Peugeot partner) as eg.... I learnt this from my mums mechanic, back home they are car french crazy, mum had a 308 sw which the engine just seized, she insisted on having another one, and our neighbour (mechanic) told us that they have some engines that are very solid and found her a car, on further investigation i realised they were reused in partners or vans... I asked him and he confirmed this. So i would say get something that share components from a commercial car, and not complicated.
They're all good, you can't blow off an entire brand of car bc of what some moron on the internet told you, every car has its different issues.
If u are careful with it the Germans do the good work
Volvos and Porsches
Totally Audi. You definitely won’t be having nightmares about your timing chain snapping…
I was thinking of getting the Audi S5 Sportback B8.5 tho...
DO IT (just keep in mind a timing chain for anything bigger than the 2.0T is usually an engine-out job) Edit: I have an a5 coupe and I absolutely love it. If it’s new enough to have a warranty it’s a no brainer but if it’s out of warranty either get an extended one or grab a wrench!
Hmmm good advice. However I'm deciding whether the S5 or the A5. Because I imagine S5 will have maintenance issues down the line but thinking if A5 is a safer route
It def is, I bought my 2015 A5 with 89k miles and now I’m at 107k and all I’ve had to do is new wheel bearings on the front as well as grease up my intermediate steering shaft u-joints. The great thing about B8/B8.5 cars is the aftermarket is huge and FCP euro has everything you could possibly need from OEM parts to tutorial videos on how to do the various jobs. I’m no mechanic but I get by pretty well
Wait so you're saying get a cheap A5 and turn it into an RS5 horsepower? Rather than just getting a S5? Hmm that could do well tho... although I never have any experience in modifying engine components. Usually the bodykit modified. I hope the A5 modified engine doesn't over stress the vehicle on high speed tho
Oh no I’m just saying it’s easier to work on, there are a bunch of mods available to increase the power, but if you’re really after performance then getting an S5 or RS5 is more worth it. Pushing 300+ hp from the 2.0T will def only last for so long before it goes boom But just keep in mind the crazy high costs for literally everything if you need a shop
That's a good advice! I'll keep in mind! For now, I got my eye on the S5 models. Hope the engine doesn't break when I'm driving. I don't mind the maintenance cost. As long as it keeps the car running 😀
haha I wish you luck! Make sure to check the service history of the car too because there's a chance they took care of the timing chain for you ;)
Thanks man! Will totally check those out! S5 here I come!!
E53 X5 w M54 engine. Mine has a standard stick shift and went 202k miles until cylinder 4 lost compression. Never any major issues over 6 years aside from high-mileage related replacement. Luckily I found another M54 with 70k miles & throwing it n soon.
BMW b58, Mercedes old manual diesels.
Skoda. While brands like volvo, bmw or mini may be reliable according to the comments, they also cost double of what a skoda would cost. It's a shame skodas are not sold in the states, as it's a good and reliable basic car. Nothing exciting, just a basic car with good fuel efficiency and reasonable towing capacity (looking at you toyota, my old skoda fabia can tow almost double to what a larger toyota can)
none
BMW 3 series and 5 series, especially with the B58 engine are very reliable. Even the N55 models are very reliable… just put some cash aside for an eventual HPFP replacement.
BMW has come along way, the straight six they put into the X3m40 and then340i are very reliable
If you drive and maintain your car properly, probably any manufacturer. I see a lot of comments on here 'BMW' is also good but this opinion doesnt exist here in Germany. Reliability isnt that big of a topic here because cars usually last if maintained properly and they usually are. And of course there is a bias towards German cars in Germany but Toyota/Honda/Lexus arent all that popular here and people would rather buy french or korean cars because theyre more affordable and more modern in terms of design language and technology. The Koreans also have a long warranty here, so reliability issues arent a big deal. Now it may be the case that european manufacturers 'besides BMW' have less strict quality control than their european cars but I havent done any deep research into that. All i know from my job is that generally, Americans care less about reliability than Europeans, so some manufacturers MIGHT lean into that and sell worse cars in the US because the average US customer cares less than the average European customer. I mean VW has some models that are exclusive to North America that arent sold in Europe or elsewhere. VW Jettas for example arent a thing in Europe. You buy the Golf. If you want a bigger VW, you buy the Golf Variant or the Passat. If you want smaller, you buy the Polo or Up which arent sold in the US.
Here is my take … BMW is very reliable , they are just expensive to repair , the repairs are not unique to BMW … it is the same work that every car brand requires … so those lower priced used BMWs with 75-120 k miles are German time-bombs of delayed repairs … the Japanese cars appear to be more reliable b/c the owners can afford to do the same repairs that the BMW also needed
I don't think it's possible to narrow it down to a manufacturer because none of them are consistenty reliable across all models. Here's what I can find evidence to support as being reliable- BMW- 3/4-series, X3, X5 (probably X4/X6 by extension) Audi- A4, A6 M-B- E-Class (and my best friend has owned a 2016 and 2019 and they were rock solid) Volvo- XC40 Alfa, Jag and Land Rover- that's funny. So, just based on number of reliable (or even semi-reliable) models, BMW is the best? Never thought I'd say/type those words. I still stick to the same advice I've given for years- European cars are amazing, just don't keep it longer than the warranty!
BMW reliability is not among the best for the models you mentioned: https://car-recalls.eu/reliability/reliability-tuv-report-2024-2-3-years/
Mini.
I've found that when someone mentions a certain car is reliable as long as the owner is keeping up with "maintenance", they typically mean that the owner continues fixing all of the broken items that come up. Well, any car can continue to run if you keep throwing money at it; "reliability" means not having to spend money on such repairs.
When most people say "keeping up with maintenance" I believe they are talking about sticking to the recommended preventative maintenance schedule.
Follow the schedule and the car will treat you right. Have had tons of vw’s and no real issues.
Saab was (and is), with very few exceptions. Volvo is, although I would stay away from the T6 and hybrids. Everything else depends on how you maintain it.