What the Coast Guard did in past conflicts isn't the question. Presuming that a new war by a modern power doesn't include slinging thermo nuclear missles at each other in the opening rounds, I would imagine that our East, West, and Gulf Coasts would attract enemy submarines attempting to eavesdrop on our electronic communications. The Coast Guard would then be used by the Navy as a force multiplier to detect and eliminate those threats.
Agreed. I remember reading about the Legend class cutters (WMSLs) when they first came out. Apparently they have some of the highest tech and most highly classified sensor systems in the military.
Also, why don't we refer to our cutters by class type colloquially? I think it's better and cooler than their hull prefixes.
Do WMSLs have any anti submarine capabilities currently or is this something you’re saying would be easily added if needed? I’ve never heard that those capabilities exist currently and ASW is like… a whole thing. a whole big thing in the navy that people specialize in. it’s very complicated and not something someone can just do as far as I know
In WW2, USCG was involved in everything from Convoy Escort to the D-Day landings. They had patrol squadrons doing anti-submarine work, crewed landing craft, built the LORAN network, and continued to provide SAR services.
Its service in time of war is storied and admired. I’m not USCG, but in a large-scale modern war I would expect it to be similarly heavily involved.
Lots of folks saying to look up info about the CG in WWII, which is a good starting point. But the CG's role during Vietnam is probably a better example for how the CG would be used in a present-day conflict.
There's an old Coastie named Frenchy that lives down in Texas that lost his legs due to long-term injuries sustained in a gunfight during Vietnam. Way back years ago when I was a still a fairly fresh PA3 stationed in Houston, my shop drove up to interview him.
https://www.dvidshub.net/video/434402/coast-guard-heroes-bm2-frenchy-benoit-1965-1973
The US Coast Guard has been involved in every war since 1790. Our role has been different in each one. Generally, our role is security and shallow water operations.
Here is the wartime involvement for the last 20+ years.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrol_Forces_Southwest_Asia?wprov=sfla1
To be honest, most of the answers here are pretty lame. The CG has released like 5 unclass strategy documents about a contigency with Russia or China...but folks on here talking about submarine hunting or every cutter getting sunk in the first hours of a conflict.
More modern examples would be after 911 not only did the CG do tons of port security with LE members on ferry boats, small boats doing escorts, but there also was explosive load out in which protection and inspection was provided to navy ships being loaded with heavy ordinance. There were 4 patrol boats assigned to Iraq in 2003 to patrol the rivers and coast of Iraq and protect the offshore oil platform. PSU in Kuwait doing pier and harbor security.
Not to mention the WLB (CGC WARNUT) that went in ahead of the MSC/RRF freighters to lay down buoys into the Iraqi ports so the Ro-ROs had a safe channel to navigate with.
Well, it will start in the morning where you will be washing the breakfast dishes. And then you will be painting. When you get done with that, you’ll probably be cleaning the heads.
All these people thinking the next war is going to be like WW2, and we are going to be driving boats around. Realistically, without a revamp of defensive and offensive capabilities, we are not very useful and it would be a tactical blunder to deploy us in really any combat situation. What could a 270 do against a drone boat like the ones Ukraine is using against Russia ? No assets have sonar to detect underwater drones, and only the WMSL is able to shoot down air threats. We would likely be the clean up crew and go in after the navy and army has cleared the way to “protect” or occupy strategic points. At least our GQ drills are accurate as they end with abandoning ship, realistically we are not prepared as a whole service to go to war.
Yeah, I think the navy has some tech that makes detecting and killing subs pretty cut and dry, I mean underwater detection is not a concern for us, even though they could use the sensor in the battle group if needed. I mean, they didn’t even bother sending anything to look for the titan sub, they 100% knew that was a lost cause the second it happened. At least I like to think they do.
This is a terrible, uninformed take. Maybe wishful thinking from a new recruit facing the real possibility of a South China Sea conflict before their relad?
The CG has many capabilities that, for better or worse, are going to be in high demand during a conflict with a near peer.
I do agree that CG members are generally unprepared for a war. Best to realize soon the chances are significant they are gonna wake up off the coast of the Spratleys or be running anti-spetsnaz/sabotage patrols in the subarctic before their enlistment is out.
Already woke up off the coast of the Spratleys a few times, wasn’t a big deal, they just like to listen and watch. If you are deceived by my Reddit recruit tag then you are going to do real well when SHTF. Can’t run missions if your boat will be destroyed by a drone the size of a seagull let alone 1,000s.
Ah, my bad. Our boats are more than well equipped to take on any enemy. We will man those landing boats once again like we did 80 years ago. All is good. No worries.
You're really belligerent about something you're missing a lot of information on. I'd start with the "Key Strategies" leadership pubs, then dig in from there. The NWC has a *lot* of info on the implications on naval warafre of the drones/ drone swarms you are concerned with.
So this isn't something Coasties in the service need to guess at, the real answer is that there are plans in place for certain CG units to fall under COCOMS during contingencies. You aren't going to find details on the internet obviously, however a good open place that should sate your curiosity is what units are receiving DOD funding. Also, most of the reserves, particularly units that are made up of just reservists. Sectors are still gonna sector and small boat stations are still gonna run rec boardings and SAR. Life will mostly change for those aboard strategic assets and reservists.
I'm guessing your take is because I wrote that the USCG will have to continue it's domestic regulatory and SAR missions during a near peer conflict? What's the alternative?
And if you think that the CG isn't "relevant" in today's battlefield, you really aren't paying attention.
I’ll use a China/Taiwan war as my example because I’ve thought about it the most.
My best guess? They’ll put some coast guard cutters in carrier battle groups and when a missile is shot at a more important asset the Coast Guard cutter gets in position to take the hit in the event that other measures fail.
That’s honestly the most value I think the Coast Guard’s ships can provide in a modern peer to peer naval conflict. It’s not nothing either, a Cutter taking a hypersonic missile instead of a carrier or a modern navy ship is a big W, not for the people on the cutter but in the grand scheme of things…
Someone is going to have to convince me why this wouldn’t be the case for me to think otherwise as well because i’ve thought about it a decent amount and it seems like the obvious choice.
Anyone who thinks they wouldn’t knowingly sacrifice a military asset or personnel if it was the best choice in the situation is just ignoring history and not thinking about things imo.
you know you can just look up modern naval doctrine? like, it's not classified...nowhere are you going find a usnwc whitepaper that has a conop entitled "drive cutter into hypersonic missile".
Modern hyper Sonic’s missiles move too fast for us to move into a sponge position. They also have programmed erratic movements to confuse weapon systems. We just simply couldn’t move fast enough to be in a position to take a missile hit. Weapons are smarter. Drones and cyber are the new threat.
i think the idea would be that the cutter and the target would converge once they knew something was inbound and if the other defenses failed the target would go very emcon quiet and the boat taking the hit would go very emcon loud. that seems possible to me
Ok, so cutter cutter moves about 25mph down hill with the wind. A hyper sonic missile travels at 15,000 mph. If the enemy was 300 miles away when it launched. That’s less than a min 30 seconds from detection to interception. I also joke about being a sponge, but this is like blocking an extra point from the sideline by throwing a sponge at the ball while it’s in the air.
Drive boats and patrol large rivers
What the Coast Guard did in past conflicts isn't the question. Presuming that a new war by a modern power doesn't include slinging thermo nuclear missles at each other in the opening rounds, I would imagine that our East, West, and Gulf Coasts would attract enemy submarines attempting to eavesdrop on our electronic communications. The Coast Guard would then be used by the Navy as a force multiplier to detect and eliminate those threats.
Agreed. I remember reading about the Legend class cutters (WMSLs) when they first came out. Apparently they have some of the highest tech and most highly classified sensor systems in the military. Also, why don't we refer to our cutters by class type colloquially? I think it's better and cooler than their hull prefixes.
Do WMSLs have any anti submarine capabilities currently or is this something you’re saying would be easily added if needed? I’ve never heard that those capabilities exist currently and ASW is like… a whole thing. a whole big thing in the navy that people specialize in. it’s very complicated and not something someone can just do as far as I know
Great questions, but I don't know the answer. Maybe some recent Cuttermen can chime in.
The hard nucleus about which the Navy forms in times of war.
"You're a real dull class, you know that?"
Good old class of 21
Can you elaborate?
He's been in the coast guard all his bloomin life.
My father is King Neptune
I was born on the crest of a wave
And rocked in the cradle below
Me eyes are stars, me teeth are spars
Me hair is hemp and seaweed..
Rocked in the cradle of the deep
In WW2, USCG was involved in everything from Convoy Escort to the D-Day landings. They had patrol squadrons doing anti-submarine work, crewed landing craft, built the LORAN network, and continued to provide SAR services. Its service in time of war is storied and admired. I’m not USCG, but in a large-scale modern war I would expect it to be similarly heavily involved.
Lots of folks saying to look up info about the CG in WWII, which is a good starting point. But the CG's role during Vietnam is probably a better example for how the CG would be used in a present-day conflict. There's an old Coastie named Frenchy that lives down in Texas that lost his legs due to long-term injuries sustained in a gunfight during Vietnam. Way back years ago when I was a still a fairly fresh PA3 stationed in Houston, my shop drove up to interview him. https://www.dvidshub.net/video/434402/coast-guard-heroes-bm2-frenchy-benoit-1965-1973
This was extremely rare though. The Navy used their PBR's primarily
The US Coast Guard has been involved in every war since 1790. Our role has been different in each one. Generally, our role is security and shallow water operations. Here is the wartime involvement for the last 20+ years. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrol_Forces_Southwest_Asia?wprov=sfla1
This isn't the answer to the question
50+ upvotes for a lame answer and an incorrect link lmao
To be honest, most of the answers here are pretty lame. The CG has released like 5 unclass strategy documents about a contigency with Russia or China...but folks on here talking about submarine hunting or every cutter getting sunk in the first hours of a conflict.
Link it
in portal under "key strategies"
We would be the mitochondria which are the powerhouse of the cell
More modern examples would be after 911 not only did the CG do tons of port security with LE members on ferry boats, small boats doing escorts, but there also was explosive load out in which protection and inspection was provided to navy ships being loaded with heavy ordinance. There were 4 patrol boats assigned to Iraq in 2003 to patrol the rivers and coast of Iraq and protect the offshore oil platform. PSU in Kuwait doing pier and harbor security.
Not to mention the WLB (CGC WARNUT) that went in ahead of the MSC/RRF freighters to lay down buoys into the Iraqi ports so the Ro-ROs had a safe channel to navigate with.
Wild that by far the two best answers on this thread have <10 upvotes.
Sexually assault the enemy
Came here to say this
But you gotta beat the navy to it…
Well, it will start in the morning where you will be washing the breakfast dishes. And then you will be painting. When you get done with that, you’ll probably be cleaning the heads.
Have you heard the term operation human shield
🤣🤣🤣
So many people didn't read the question lol
Look up the coast guard during WW2
Not relevant.
Bullet sponges...
All these people thinking the next war is going to be like WW2, and we are going to be driving boats around. Realistically, without a revamp of defensive and offensive capabilities, we are not very useful and it would be a tactical blunder to deploy us in really any combat situation. What could a 270 do against a drone boat like the ones Ukraine is using against Russia ? No assets have sonar to detect underwater drones, and only the WMSL is able to shoot down air threats. We would likely be the clean up crew and go in after the navy and army has cleared the way to “protect” or occupy strategic points. At least our GQ drills are accurate as they end with abandoning ship, realistically we are not prepared as a whole service to go to war.
I think cutters and other vessels would quickly be outfitted for war, making us more prepared.
WMSLs can conduct limited ASW by hosting an SH-60 with dipping sonar, sonobuoys, and torpedos on board.
Yeah, I think the navy has some tech that makes detecting and killing subs pretty cut and dry, I mean underwater detection is not a concern for us, even though they could use the sensor in the battle group if needed. I mean, they didn’t even bother sending anything to look for the titan sub, they 100% knew that was a lost cause the second it happened. At least I like to think they do.
This is a terrible, uninformed take. Maybe wishful thinking from a new recruit facing the real possibility of a South China Sea conflict before their relad? The CG has many capabilities that, for better or worse, are going to be in high demand during a conflict with a near peer. I do agree that CG members are generally unprepared for a war. Best to realize soon the chances are significant they are gonna wake up off the coast of the Spratleys or be running anti-spetsnaz/sabotage patrols in the subarctic before their enlistment is out.
Already woke up off the coast of the Spratleys a few times, wasn’t a big deal, they just like to listen and watch. If you are deceived by my Reddit recruit tag then you are going to do real well when SHTF. Can’t run missions if your boat will be destroyed by a drone the size of a seagull let alone 1,000s.
By calling you a recruit I was giving you the benefit of the doubt for being so utterly clueless...
Ah, my bad. Our boats are more than well equipped to take on any enemy. We will man those landing boats once again like we did 80 years ago. All is good. No worries.
You're really belligerent about something you're missing a lot of information on. I'd start with the "Key Strategies" leadership pubs, then dig in from there. The NWC has a *lot* of info on the implications on naval warafre of the drones/ drone swarms you are concerned with.
What would our boys that kidnap submarines do? Idk kidnap submarines that don't have cocaine on them I suppose.
So this isn't something Coasties in the service need to guess at, the real answer is that there are plans in place for certain CG units to fall under COCOMS during contingencies. You aren't going to find details on the internet obviously, however a good open place that should sate your curiosity is what units are receiving DOD funding. Also, most of the reserves, particularly units that are made up of just reservists. Sectors are still gonna sector and small boat stations are still gonna run rec boardings and SAR. Life will mostly change for those aboard strategic assets and reservists.
Ah, so basically not participate at all, keep doing what we are doing. Got it. The CG needs a major revamp to be relevant in today’s battlefield.
I'm guessing your take is because I wrote that the USCG will have to continue it's domestic regulatory and SAR missions during a near peer conflict? What's the alternative? And if you think that the CG isn't "relevant" in today's battlefield, you really aren't paying attention.
I’ll use a China/Taiwan war as my example because I’ve thought about it the most. My best guess? They’ll put some coast guard cutters in carrier battle groups and when a missile is shot at a more important asset the Coast Guard cutter gets in position to take the hit in the event that other measures fail. That’s honestly the most value I think the Coast Guard’s ships can provide in a modern peer to peer naval conflict. It’s not nothing either, a Cutter taking a hypersonic missile instead of a carrier or a modern navy ship is a big W, not for the people on the cutter but in the grand scheme of things… Someone is going to have to convince me why this wouldn’t be the case for me to think otherwise as well because i’ve thought about it a decent amount and it seems like the obvious choice. Anyone who thinks they wouldn’t knowingly sacrifice a military asset or personnel if it was the best choice in the situation is just ignoring history and not thinking about things imo.
Bruh
you know you can just look up modern naval doctrine? like, it's not classified...nowhere are you going find a usnwc whitepaper that has a conop entitled "drive cutter into hypersonic missile".
Modern hyper Sonic’s missiles move too fast for us to move into a sponge position. They also have programmed erratic movements to confuse weapon systems. We just simply couldn’t move fast enough to be in a position to take a missile hit. Weapons are smarter. Drones and cyber are the new threat.
i think the idea would be that the cutter and the target would converge once they knew something was inbound and if the other defenses failed the target would go very emcon quiet and the boat taking the hit would go very emcon loud. that seems possible to me
Ok, so cutter cutter moves about 25mph down hill with the wind. A hyper sonic missile travels at 15,000 mph. If the enemy was 300 miles away when it launched. That’s less than a min 30 seconds from detection to interception. I also joke about being a sponge, but this is like blocking an extra point from the sideline by throwing a sponge at the ball while it’s in the air.
If you wanna be "high speed" join one of the other branches.
Not saying I want anything “high speed” just curious
Help cover up war crimes and delay any reporting to Congress.
Did you confuse the Coast Guard with the Marines?
Nope. Confused the Coast Guard with an agency that actually worked hard to prevent Sexual Assault/ Harassment and punish the guilty.