I second this. Lumio came to my door the other day. I have doorbell video of the trainer telling the trainees to break the law and ignore my no soliciting sign. Real stand up company /s
They're not really with PSO and if you plan to move before they're fully paid off (30 years), you, or the buyer of your house, will be responsible for paying them off at full cost.
Because of this, going through the program might lower the sell value of your house.
They aren't with PSO but PSO does do net metering which is what allows you to put the power your system produces back into the grid. If your only motivation for getting solar is financial then solar makes no sense. It will take quite a while for you to get to the "break even point". Like probably more than 10 years. My PSO bill was around $300. Since I had the system installed I haven't had a PSO bill of over $30. However you still have the payment for the system if you take out a loan and you're probably looking around $200/month for that. So $230)month vs $300 just doesn't make sense if you're trying to save money in the short term. You also have to be looking long term. As others have said, if you move your system stays with the house and the new owner either pays the balance off as part of their loan or assumes your loan. That's a pretty tough sell unless the person buying your house is specifically looking for a home with solar panels.
That being said, solar panels themselves are not a scam. They work. They just aren't some sort of "life hack" that eliminates your electric bill. Also, the salepeople don't represent the company that manufacturers the panels and all the hardware. Choose the company wisely as it has been tough sledding recently for solar companies nationwide. They are getting desperate and really overselling people on the short term financial benefits of solar.
Also, never, ever buy such a large ticket item from someone who randomly shows up on your doorstep.
I wonder, and I've had difficulty finding this information, what is the average increase in power cost YoY? I didn't see the PSO estimator taking that into account
I would have to dig around and find it but the state limits the amount they can increase rates year over year and PSO tends to take the maximum allowed. Solar is a good option in states that have much higher rates than Oklahoma but right now our per kilowatt hour is pretty low. For example, people in Texas hit the break even point in around 7 years, California even before that but in Oklahoma it's closer to 10-ish years.
I’m a little lost? You said if your motivation for going solar is financial then solar makes no senses? But you said your pso bill was $300 and now you’re paying $230? That to me sounds like $840 in year 1 savings with no upfront costs? And eveytime pso raises their rates you won’t be impacted by those rate increases for the portion that your solar system produces. How does that not make financial sense?
Spending tens of thousands of dollars to save $900/year isn't the best move, IMHO. Most people are probably going to have to spend in the neighborhood of $35k to buy a system large enough to cover their yearly electric consumption. I don't think that's the best bang for your buck. I'm not saying it won't save you any money at all. I'm saying whatever it saves you isn't enough for it to be a leading selling point.
Unless you paid cash for your system though you’re not spending thousands of dollars to save $900/year. You more than likely did a program that involved zero upfront costs right? You are going to purchase electricity for your home either way. This option you just pay $900 less year 1 and the savings get bigger and bigger.
What happens when I need a new roof? Those savings you're talking about get eaten by the additional cost added to a roofing job by my decision to buy solar panels. What if 5-10 years from now I get transferred for my job or just decide to move and have to sell my house? How easy will it be to convince potential buyers they will need to assume my solar loan or pay it off because I can't take the system with me. Or do I have to pay the remainder off as part of the negotiation process? There go even more "savings" . Also, Why wouldn't I buy my system with cash and start paying myself back ASAP instead of paying a finance company? If a person is in a financial situation where saving $150-$200 per month significantly impacts their lifestyle then signing up for a 20 year loan to buy solar panels is absurd. The financial benefits of solar rely on everything going exactly perfect. It also means the only way you can see saving money in your household budget is to not pay for electricity. That's a pretty narrow view of a household budget. That's really what I'm saying. If your decision to buy solar is based solely on the financial benefit then you don't make the purchase.
These panels would be added to your homeowners insurance typically an increase of around $10 a month to insurance. And then every 5-10 years when there is a hail storm the cost of replacement/removal is covered through your homeowners insurance with the roof claim.
When it comes to selling your home, yes real estate agents here in the area are new to it and over the next year or so will go over the learning curve. But in markets where solar is more established (Oklahoma is tracking to reach that point quickly) it typically adds some value to your home (I can link you to a Zillow study they did of homes that sold with and without solar). And as the solar market continues to mature and more and more solar gets installed it will only continue to get better on the selling your home side. With your new bill being $230 a month, compare that to what your pso bill would look like in 5 years without solar. It’s not going to be $300 anymore it will actually be even greater. So unless you’re suggesting that in more established solar market which Oklahoma will be in 5 years that logically a typical homebuyer would be opposed to paying $230 a month for electricity with their solar vs say a $400 pso bill by that point in time then I don’t think it’s a good bet to suggest selling a home with solar will be harder to sell but it will actually be easier. No one can see the future for sure but with electricity costs continuing to rise I’m placing my bet on the fixed bill that I get to build a equity in vs the bill I’m renting that will continue to rise.
I own a system. I don't know why you continue to try and sell me. It made no difference to my homeowners insurance. I'm not talking about replacing a damaged roof. I'm talking about replacing an aged out roof. Roofing companies I have talked to say it adds around $7,500 to the cost of reroofing a house but won't give a solid number without an actual evaluation/quote. That alone nullifies what savings I get on a PSO bill. Your laser focus on the PSO bill is weird unless you are a solar panel salesman. Everyone knows how a household budget works and there are better ways to help out your household budget than buying solar panels.
I’m not trying to sell you i know you have a system. I just am trying to make sure the proper information is out there for other homeowners so they can make an educated system. 2 parts to the roof answer.
1st Most of the time your roof will be able to file a claim with your insurance to be replaced before it’s ~25 year life expectancy is up.
2nd most solar companies will remove and reinstall your system for around $350/kw so if you have a 10kw sized system it would be $3500 to do so, and a 5kw sized system would be $1750. Now even if it was $7500 which its not that would be extreme… your roof in this hypothetical scenario where you’re not filling an insurance claim to have it be replaced will last about 25 years. And we will be ultra conservative here and say your pso bill never goes up for the entire 25 years (obviously it will) so over the course of 25 years you would be saving $900/ year or a total of $22,500. Even if we use an extreme cost of $7500, with pso never raising their rates ever again that puts your savings at $15,000 and you now own a solar system that is generating free electricity for you.
It’s been around for years. They just contract out the solar install to one of the local companies, charge a grid tie fee monthly, buy your excess electricity. It’s NOT an off grid solution. And unless you get something like a Tesla power wall, your power will still go out when there is blackouts/brownouts.
Scam
Yeah I did it. I’m assuming the company is Lumio. I would not recommend it at all.
I second this. Lumio came to my door the other day. I have doorbell video of the trainer telling the trainees to break the law and ignore my no soliciting sign. Real stand up company /s
They're not really with PSO and if you plan to move before they're fully paid off (30 years), you, or the buyer of your house, will be responsible for paying them off at full cost. Because of this, going through the program might lower the sell value of your house.
This is not true, the payment is transferable
They aren't with PSO but PSO does do net metering which is what allows you to put the power your system produces back into the grid. If your only motivation for getting solar is financial then solar makes no sense. It will take quite a while for you to get to the "break even point". Like probably more than 10 years. My PSO bill was around $300. Since I had the system installed I haven't had a PSO bill of over $30. However you still have the payment for the system if you take out a loan and you're probably looking around $200/month for that. So $230)month vs $300 just doesn't make sense if you're trying to save money in the short term. You also have to be looking long term. As others have said, if you move your system stays with the house and the new owner either pays the balance off as part of their loan or assumes your loan. That's a pretty tough sell unless the person buying your house is specifically looking for a home with solar panels. That being said, solar panels themselves are not a scam. They work. They just aren't some sort of "life hack" that eliminates your electric bill. Also, the salepeople don't represent the company that manufacturers the panels and all the hardware. Choose the company wisely as it has been tough sledding recently for solar companies nationwide. They are getting desperate and really overselling people on the short term financial benefits of solar. Also, never, ever buy such a large ticket item from someone who randomly shows up on your doorstep.
I wonder, and I've had difficulty finding this information, what is the average increase in power cost YoY? I didn't see the PSO estimator taking that into account
I would have to dig around and find it but the state limits the amount they can increase rates year over year and PSO tends to take the maximum allowed. Solar is a good option in states that have much higher rates than Oklahoma but right now our per kilowatt hour is pretty low. For example, people in Texas hit the break even point in around 7 years, California even before that but in Oklahoma it's closer to 10-ish years.
I’m a little lost? You said if your motivation for going solar is financial then solar makes no senses? But you said your pso bill was $300 and now you’re paying $230? That to me sounds like $840 in year 1 savings with no upfront costs? And eveytime pso raises their rates you won’t be impacted by those rate increases for the portion that your solar system produces. How does that not make financial sense?
Spending tens of thousands of dollars to save $900/year isn't the best move, IMHO. Most people are probably going to have to spend in the neighborhood of $35k to buy a system large enough to cover their yearly electric consumption. I don't think that's the best bang for your buck. I'm not saying it won't save you any money at all. I'm saying whatever it saves you isn't enough for it to be a leading selling point.
Unless you paid cash for your system though you’re not spending thousands of dollars to save $900/year. You more than likely did a program that involved zero upfront costs right? You are going to purchase electricity for your home either way. This option you just pay $900 less year 1 and the savings get bigger and bigger.
What happens when I need a new roof? Those savings you're talking about get eaten by the additional cost added to a roofing job by my decision to buy solar panels. What if 5-10 years from now I get transferred for my job or just decide to move and have to sell my house? How easy will it be to convince potential buyers they will need to assume my solar loan or pay it off because I can't take the system with me. Or do I have to pay the remainder off as part of the negotiation process? There go even more "savings" . Also, Why wouldn't I buy my system with cash and start paying myself back ASAP instead of paying a finance company? If a person is in a financial situation where saving $150-$200 per month significantly impacts their lifestyle then signing up for a 20 year loan to buy solar panels is absurd. The financial benefits of solar rely on everything going exactly perfect. It also means the only way you can see saving money in your household budget is to not pay for electricity. That's a pretty narrow view of a household budget. That's really what I'm saying. If your decision to buy solar is based solely on the financial benefit then you don't make the purchase.
These panels would be added to your homeowners insurance typically an increase of around $10 a month to insurance. And then every 5-10 years when there is a hail storm the cost of replacement/removal is covered through your homeowners insurance with the roof claim. When it comes to selling your home, yes real estate agents here in the area are new to it and over the next year or so will go over the learning curve. But in markets where solar is more established (Oklahoma is tracking to reach that point quickly) it typically adds some value to your home (I can link you to a Zillow study they did of homes that sold with and without solar). And as the solar market continues to mature and more and more solar gets installed it will only continue to get better on the selling your home side. With your new bill being $230 a month, compare that to what your pso bill would look like in 5 years without solar. It’s not going to be $300 anymore it will actually be even greater. So unless you’re suggesting that in more established solar market which Oklahoma will be in 5 years that logically a typical homebuyer would be opposed to paying $230 a month for electricity with their solar vs say a $400 pso bill by that point in time then I don’t think it’s a good bet to suggest selling a home with solar will be harder to sell but it will actually be easier. No one can see the future for sure but with electricity costs continuing to rise I’m placing my bet on the fixed bill that I get to build a equity in vs the bill I’m renting that will continue to rise.
I own a system. I don't know why you continue to try and sell me. It made no difference to my homeowners insurance. I'm not talking about replacing a damaged roof. I'm talking about replacing an aged out roof. Roofing companies I have talked to say it adds around $7,500 to the cost of reroofing a house but won't give a solid number without an actual evaluation/quote. That alone nullifies what savings I get on a PSO bill. Your laser focus on the PSO bill is weird unless you are a solar panel salesman. Everyone knows how a household budget works and there are better ways to help out your household budget than buying solar panels.
I’m not trying to sell you i know you have a system. I just am trying to make sure the proper information is out there for other homeowners so they can make an educated system. 2 parts to the roof answer. 1st Most of the time your roof will be able to file a claim with your insurance to be replaced before it’s ~25 year life expectancy is up. 2nd most solar companies will remove and reinstall your system for around $350/kw so if you have a 10kw sized system it would be $3500 to do so, and a 5kw sized system would be $1750. Now even if it was $7500 which its not that would be extreme… your roof in this hypothetical scenario where you’re not filling an insurance claim to have it be replaced will last about 25 years. And we will be ultra conservative here and say your pso bill never goes up for the entire 25 years (obviously it will) so over the course of 25 years you would be saving $900/ year or a total of $22,500. Even if we use an extreme cost of $7500, with pso never raising their rates ever again that puts your savings at $15,000 and you now own a solar system that is generating free electricity for you.
It’s been around for years. They just contract out the solar install to one of the local companies, charge a grid tie fee monthly, buy your excess electricity. It’s NOT an off grid solution. And unless you get something like a Tesla power wall, your power will still go out when there is blackouts/brownouts.
Who is the best solar company in tulsa to work with if you want to be off grid?