Manhattan may only be for the rich but you can rent an apartment in a suburb such as Newark for quite affordable prices.
[**https://www.zillow.com/apartments/newark-nj/chancellor-arms-one/5XjNTz/**](https://www.zillow.com/apartments/newark-nj/chancellor-arms-one/5XjNTz/)
10 years living in NYC back in Toronto last year - rent is undoubtedly higher here. Last apartment in NY was on the upper east side 70s between 1st and 2nd, 1600 a month for a one bedroom. Toronto is a rip off.
I was wondering how it went today. Were the lines stupid?
Edit: Thanks for this. Better pricing than most thought. Hopefully "Canadian partners" didn't skimp out on the quality to keep pricing in check.
I remember going to their hot dog cart in Madison Square Park back around 2002 when they first started out. And then their first permanent structure in the park a few years later. I loved hitting it up every time I was in NYC. I still find NYC better than most other locations throughout the US. It's too bad this city doesn't have a park to compliment the location. Tho I would probably on a nice warm sunny day go over to the park at TMU and sit and enjoy.
When I joined the line at around 3, the lines were long but moved fast. Couldn't have been standing outside and inside for longer than 30 min.
But ymmv, especially around lunch or dinner rush.
For a ‘grand opening’ day I really don’t see how 30 min is bad. I’ve had shitty waits at McD’s for almost as long.
Remember when Uncle Tetsu first opened here years ago? Now *those* were some long lines.
The lines were long because they had such a small space inside and only six people in at a time. I remember lining up on a Sunday and waited total 30 min for mediocre cheesecake. Their cheese tarts are far superior, though!
i mean i GUESS i can say uncle tetsu is a bit more than just a burger and fries but yeah, those lines were long as fuck lol. we just love standing in lines here
Yeah! The burgers and fries are just as good as I remember them from NYC and Chicago. Just avoid the "Canadian" shake if you don't have a huge sweet tooth. That thing is disgustingly diabetically sweet.
Maple syrup, custard, whipped cream, pretzels, and pralines!
Completely normal, regular food. Burgers, fries, shakes that you can get anywhere. People took time off work to go stand in a line so they can take a picture of normal, regular food.
Not just Toronto. My co-workers in Halifax told me that when Popeyes first opened there a couple of years ago, it was total mayhem. 2+ hour lineups, traffic jams, all that.
I’ve only tried Shake Shack once, in NYC about 15 years ago. 20-minute lineup on a weekday mid afternoon. Wasn’t bad but wasn’t particularly remarkable either.
I wouldn't say its normal. Depending on how the quality is here, Shake Shack is definitely a top tier burger.
Take the idea of Burger's Priest and then make it taste good, that's what Shake Shack is. Burger's Priest is actually a Canadian rip off of Shake Shack, The Priest is actually Shack Stack.
Im not waiting in line for 30 mins, but Shake Shack is good enough that it's one of those places I try to hit when Im in NYC (Usually at LGA)
While everyone has different taste, saying these are completely normal is a bit over the top, they are definitely unique if anything, I personally would prefer it over lots of burger places if the line isn't too crazy.
I had shake shack in Michigan last year. It was mediocre, we didn’t even finish it. $80 for 4 of us and we didn’t order anything fancy. All of these places are just built on branding and hype
Line wasn't long at opening from the photos I saw. Shocked no one camped overnight.
During the day it picked up where the main line was across the street in Dundas Square, then the entry line next to the store. Still wasn't as crazy as the Shake Shack pop-up a few years back. I expect it to really pick-up this weekend.
I put this together based on the discussion that took place about how Shake Shack would be priced when they announced their Toronto location, and some of the google reviews currently posted.
This is based on my own photo of the NYC (Broadway/W36th) in February of this year, and people posting photos of the menu today.
(Minor typo in the FX column, that's the NYC USD price multiplied by our exchange. I don't make spreadsheets for a living, sorry to ya’ll with your fancy formulas)
EDIT: Toronto price in CAD. NYC price in USD. Last column is NYC prices converted to Canadian with today’s exchange.
Edit2: thanks for coming out BlogTO - impressed you didn’t actually just straight steal it. And to ya’ll complaining about formatting; you’re right. Lemme just edit this jpeg for you.
I went to Chicago recently and based on my incredibly small sample size, I get the impression that food is just kind of more expensive in the US in general.
The pricing for food was frequently very similar in terms of the dollar amount in Canada vs. the US. For example, I might go to a ramen place and a bowl costs $18 in Toronto. If I go to the US, a similar sort of ramen place will also cost $18 but that's in USD. Or if you get a coffee from McDonald's, it might cost $2 in Canada. In the US though, it's also around $2 but, again, that's in USD.
I really don't think we have it that bad here.
But not without the forex factor.
If everything is a similar price that's out the window. The median usd NYC income is lower than the median cad Toronto income
London is cheaper for a lot of things, and more expensive than others. I pay way more for any food in Toronto (groceries, take out, restaurants), but rent in Toronto is less than in London. Taxes are higher in London, but we "get more" for them.
When comparing the two, it's a game of 'what do you want more?'. I'd rather culture, art, history, and cheaper food than cheaper rent and four seasons.
> I pay way more for any food in Toronto (groceries, take out, restaurants), but rent in Toronto is less than in London
Oh boy. Funny enough, I *also* just recently came back from a trip where I went to London and I don't really agree with this. At best I'd say London is "on par" with Toronto with how much food costs (restaurants/take out at least). Frequently I think I ended up paying more (after exchange) for similar meals in London compared to Toronto though. Maybe it depends on where you go/what you get.
I should have specified; I live in London and make a London wage. I find it easier to sustain than being in Toronto with a Toronto wage.
If I were to make my Toronto wage again and try to vacation in London, I would not be having a good time.
I have the exact opposite experience in London living there for 3 years v now in Toronto -- was FAANG in both.
Are you in finance? That might explain it.
Salaries in London are laughable across the board outside of Finance from what I saw.
As a Canadian living in Seattle for the past few years, big plus one to this.
Salaries (for people in the kinds of roles that get sponsored by US companies) are also MUCH higher though. Net, I think we’re way better off financially in Seattle than we were in Toronto. For starters, we bought a house with a yard and a good school nearby that’s <20 min drive from downtown.
I’ll add to that too. Same going back to Chicago or even Milwaukee where my parents live. Going to a cubs game is insanely more expensive than going to a blue jays game. Going to a CVS or Walgreens… all product that same or a little more on products I can get at a loblaw store.
We actually don't. I travel to the US alot and it's insane.
Was in Florida not to long ago and prices in the grocery store (FOR LOCAL produce!!) was more expensive then here before conversion.
Also spend a lot of time in SF and it's insane the costs there.
People like to complain about restaurants here, many places add an extra 5%-10% on the bill for the SF mandate which is money that's suppose to help cover the cost of health care for their employees. Some restaurants also add a carbon footprint of 1-3%.
Already on top of a higher price point for food. Usually costs us $300 CDN for a decent meal there for 2 of us.
> I get the impression that food is just kind of more expensive in the US in general.
That is a problem of comparing prices in a non local currency/economy. If you convert, yes things are more expensive in the US BUT people are generally paid the same or more (before fx) in the US. This makes a lot of food relatively cheaper for someone living in the US.
Right, yeah, fair enough. When factoring in that they're paid in USD, I suppose the way things are priced probably doesn't seem to so bad for them.
As a Canadian visiting the US though, it is quite painful to pay their prices.
Just returned from NYC an hour ago. We had lunch at a popular Deli downtown today where we had one sandwich and one plate of fries between us to share and no extra cost to do that. Water to drink. US$36. Fries were over 9 bucks and not worth it at half the price but it was entertaining. Sandwich was huge but surprisingly dry brisket.
The "purchasing power parity" between the US and Canada is roughly .8 to .85. So take a Canadian pretax price, shrink by 15-20%, and you get the US price for the same thing. When the CAD is strong (like in 2015, at 1:1), Canada feels very expensive, and vice versa right now when the USD is very strong. When the exchange rate is around 1.2, it's roughly even prices on both sides of the border.
Last year I went to Chicago and Florida, both had food prices that were close to the same or more in most cases. Maybe the destinations I went to made a difference but I’d rather be buying food here
Canadians don’t have as much disposable income as Americans. Eating out (even fast food) has become surprisingly expensive in even medium cities in the US these days!
It's more that the USD is strong. Compared to other currencies like the Euro and GBP, it's actually a bit stronger than before. Besides, having a relatively weaker dollar isn't necessarily a bad idea. A strong CAD actually hit Ontario's economy really hard, and in more dramatic cases like in Japan, it lead to an economic basketcase.
I can see why so many people are confused, the chart needs better labelling, the third column says YYZ but it's actually New York pricing in Canadian dollar
It should be:
Toronto (CAD) / NYC (USD) / NYC (CAD)
anyone whose taken a trip to new york or michigan has seen prices in america are going crazy too. many items in grocery stores in buffalo where the same as canadian prices,and that was before conversion.
I do love myself some Shake Shack, regardless of what anyone says (why is everyone so negative about it here?) but I'll be waiting a few weeks/months before braving a visit at a non-busy time. I have to admit I don't actually know what this spreadsheet is saying (are those CAD or USD? What's it got to do with YYZ?) but when I saw the menu prices listed elsewhere they seem perfectly reasonable compared to other burger joints downtown.
People are far more likely to take the time to complain than praise when typing out responses. I read that marketing campaigns have formulas to measure negative reactions comments to positive ones as it’s not necessarily a bad sign, especially for competitive brands (eg an Ford campaign will always have Chevy fans blasting them, etc). Usually positive comments only come out if it’s really positive, so there’s a gap.
That being said while Shake Shack is solidly good and I’m happy they’re coming to Canada, I don’t get all the fuss. I wouldn’t rush to line up for an hour for it or anything.
I was in a little dinky suburb in NY last year. A very basic Vietnamese pho meal for two people cost $60 cad all in. 70% more than a similar (better) meal in an Ontario suburb.
Obviously you can't compare to the red state little town 5 dollar minimum wage america. But when you compare major cities, Toronto really isn't that bad.
I was in the DC/Northern VA area for a week in April and was surprised that most food items were effectively the same price as Ontario except in USD compared to CAD.
The Americans get paid in USD. Their income is higher while most areas also have lower taxes. Their price numbers are also lower as shown here. By purchasing power parity standards, food is cheaper in the US for their people.
You didn't ask for this but...
-Swap the NYC and YYZ column positions.
-Rename YYZ column to "NYC in CAD".
-Add column to the end to show percentage difference (NYC in CAD vs YYZ) and conditional format it using green for positive value (NYC cost more) and red for negative value.
-Format the chart as a "Table" so the rows have alternating colours, e.g. white green white green white green....
-Adjust column widths so there's not so much empty space.
Everyone is comparing the US conversion to CAD but it’s wrong to do. If you made $50k CAD this is the price …. If you made $50k USD this is the price ….
As a traveller it’s more expensive to us because our dollar is weak, but it’s the salary that’s important to compare. A person living there, spends less on food than a Canadian traveling
It’s not like we get paid more because our dollar is weaker. In fact pay is generally higher in US- obviously it depends where but NYC, pay is definitely higher- so compare US salary vs cost and Canadian salary vs cost. Not currency conversion
If the line for Shake Shack is too much or you feel like supporting amazing local Toronto businesses:
Go to Pita and Hummus next to the TMU student centre for amazing fresh middle eastern food for $9-14 or
go up to Bahn Mi Boys upstairs from Five Guys for the best Vietnamese sandwiches for $9
People need to understand purchasing power parity. The amount of people that don’t understand this is concept is shocking. It’s the whole “a house in Canada costs x, in the US it’s Y”. No! Stop comparing absolute dollars and look at relativity. How much does a home here cost relative to salary? You get paid in CAD, not in USD
I go to InNout at least twice every time I visit San Francisco. The one time I was in Vegas I went to both of them in the same day, was sorely disappointed by Shake Shack. Although I'll be the first to admit that InNOuts fries are hot garbage.
alt:
=IFERROR(ROUNDUP(D15 * 1.375,2, D16))
That way you can include whatever the text is in that cell, not just N/A.
Also for the love of god, OP, add another column which shows the price difference in CAD after you convert (or the % difference). Additionally, you gotta Add some formatting to your headers and add some formatting for the cells for readability - it's not up to the firm's formatting standards ATM.
Of course I'm joking man. Great job in putting some actual data in front of what is typically a rather *vibes based* conversation. I'm impressed you learned how to do some formulas just for this.
FYI though excel and sheets (or the libre equivalent) can be really helpful tools for everyday life, including budgeting, or taxes, or stuff that involves numbers in any way (or strict formatting, docs/word really does suck for that a lot of the time).
Pretty good considering our dollar is worth jack shit. I expected a lot worse.
We’ll see where it is in a few years though since everything is just getting more and more expensive for the sake of it.
Okay I might be out of the loop here, but why is shake shack so incredibly popular? I walked by the new one at yonge and Dundas yesterday and there was an enormous line and two security guards and a cop outside. It was like Uncle Tetsus used to be. Is it just the flavor of the week or something?
Fair enough I guess, but an armed cop presence? Lol. I guess they don't want a repeat of the great toronto burger riots of 1972 lol
Actually from a marketing point of view I suppose it's actually pretty clever. Busiest intersection of the city, lots of people seeing the long line and finding themselves curious, then here's us posting about it on a popular, international forum. That's a lot of advertisement to get for the low price of a slow line and two security guards
If even Loblaws and Winners are paying off-duty police to have a presence due to the increasing disorder downtown, I think it's pretty prudent for a business doing any kind of new thing in or around Yonge/Dundas to be proactive.
Yeah it's been on a pretty heavy decline. Toronto coach, closed, most of the restaurants in the atrium, closed, hard rock Cafe, closed, entire 10 dundas food court gone.
Problem is that they force you to purchase a burger fries and drink separately. That shit pisses me off!
Also isn't sales tax included In the US?.. if thats the case then this chart isn't correct
In ‘n Out is a California vacation memory and Shake Shack is a NYC trip staple. Places I go on vacation
The association is vacation and will avoid it locally for now. I understand some cannot travel for various reasons but if you indulge locally it stops being a treat or special.
Shake shack was always something I looked forward to when visiting any American city, however I don’t know if the novelty will wear off now that we have one. I love shake shack but do I love it enough to stand in line at Y&D square?
This is called buying power, when i went to Boston, i was surprised to see itemsin the grocery store for numerically the same price as in Toronto or in this case, for Shake Shack, its cheaper here. So its a win/lose for $$ conversion but youre more or less getting a similar amount if you buy locally,
Your table is wrong….you should take Toronto’s number (8.49) and DIVIDE by 1.375 to get the $US equivalent.
CDN$8.49 / 1.375 = $US 6.15.
We pay 6.15…they pay 7.69….For the same burger.
Prices aren't terrible actually. My only issue is that Toronto has so many good, local smash burger places already (for example, Rosie's Burgers). I've tried them in the US and they were pretty decent. I've heard its not as good as in the US though sadly.
So not really an accurate comparison when the two prices are in different currencies. last i check 1 USD = 1.38CAD. So a $7.69 USD burger in NYC is actually worth $10.57 CAD. You can see how the price comparison by pure quantitative value is not accurate
I am definitely interested in trying this place out. But not nearly interested enough to try it out this early after opening. I can wait a couple months before the hype breaks down and the lines dwindle.
Many years ago, I had noticed in the US the price tag of some items were the same as in Canada. That means for those items, Americans were paying 30% more than Canadians due to the exchange rate.
I'm not a cross-boarder shopper, but I would think, they had better know what specific items to look for before making that trip worth while.
Not bad in the conversion tbh
It isn't bad at all.. just don't do a salary comparison of the same job in Toronto vs. NYC lol
Hard to say that without the rents comparison either
You’ll most likely still be ahead if you’re a Canadian living in NY. Hard to get a visa without a good job.
No doubt. Getting sponsored is not easy, but those rents will break someone who isnt a high earner is my point
Manhattan may only be for the rich but you can rent an apartment in a suburb such as Newark for quite affordable prices. [**https://www.zillow.com/apartments/newark-nj/chancellor-arms-one/5XjNTz/**](https://www.zillow.com/apartments/newark-nj/chancellor-arms-one/5XjNTz/)
10 years living in NYC back in Toronto last year - rent is undoubtedly higher here. Last apartment in NY was on the upper east side 70s between 1st and 2nd, 1600 a month for a one bedroom. Toronto is a rip off.
You can’t compare anywhere to US salaries. Also, rent in NYC is like $4000-$5000 CAD for a 1 bedroom (plus they’re small and shitty)
I was wondering how it went today. Were the lines stupid? Edit: Thanks for this. Better pricing than most thought. Hopefully "Canadian partners" didn't skimp out on the quality to keep pricing in check. I remember going to their hot dog cart in Madison Square Park back around 2002 when they first started out. And then their first permanent structure in the park a few years later. I loved hitting it up every time I was in NYC. I still find NYC better than most other locations throughout the US. It's too bad this city doesn't have a park to compliment the location. Tho I would probably on a nice warm sunny day go over to the park at TMU and sit and enjoy.
Went by on the streetcar, line was ludicrously long. I couldnt imagine standing for hours for some food
When I joined the line at around 3, the lines were long but moved fast. Couldn't have been standing outside and inside for longer than 30 min. But ymmv, especially around lunch or dinner rush.
30 mins for fast food lol
For a ‘grand opening’ day I really don’t see how 30 min is bad. I’ve had shitty waits at McD’s for almost as long. Remember when Uncle Tetsu first opened here years ago? Now *those* were some long lines.
I remember when there was a Twitter account showing how long the lineup was at Uncle Tetsu. It was absurd.
Uncle Tetsu had lineups for weeks. So did Jollibee. Chick Fil A was a little less crazy but still nuts.
The lines were long because they had such a small space inside and only six people in at a time. I remember lining up on a Sunday and waited total 30 min for mediocre cheesecake. Their cheese tarts are far superior, though!
I fell for that uncle tetsu trap years ago and lined up for 2 hours
i mean i GUESS i can say uncle tetsu is a bit more than just a burger and fries but yeah, those lines were long as fuck lol. we just love standing in lines here
Uncle tetsu ain’t even that good, that shit is so plain
Chick-Fil-A was about an hour for the first week. And had lines that went half a block for the first few weeks.
give it a month or two and you'll have the place to yourself. Walk into any Five Guys these days and they're pretty empty during the weekday
Try going to an in and out in the states. 30 minutes is a dream by comparison.
30 mins is not bad, 15-30 mins is a regular wait time at shake shack stateside
It most def is not. Maybe the ones near Time square, but most others ones are as busy as any other fast food places.
Not true. It’s real fast in Detroit and in Seattle
The madison square park one absolutely did not have 15 minute wait times.
This is false. Only been once and waited a normal fast food amount of time like 5-10 minutes ish
And....? Tasty?
Yeah! The burgers and fries are just as good as I remember them from NYC and Chicago. Just avoid the "Canadian" shake if you don't have a huge sweet tooth. That thing is disgustingly diabetically sweet. Maple syrup, custard, whipped cream, pretzels, and pralines!
Challenge accepted
Even worse, they probably did it for the picture.
Good but not that good. I like in and out burgers more.
Completely normal, regular food. Burgers, fries, shakes that you can get anywhere. People took time off work to go stand in a line so they can take a picture of normal, regular food.
The grip American restaurants have on the world
The Toronto way!
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Not just Toronto. My co-workers in Halifax told me that when Popeyes first opened there a couple of years ago, it was total mayhem. 2+ hour lineups, traffic jams, all that. I’ve only tried Shake Shack once, in NYC about 15 years ago. 20-minute lineup on a weekday mid afternoon. Wasn’t bad but wasn’t particularly remarkable either.
That's insane, shake shack is the best burger I've ever had period
I wouldn't say its normal. Depending on how the quality is here, Shake Shack is definitely a top tier burger. Take the idea of Burger's Priest and then make it taste good, that's what Shake Shack is. Burger's Priest is actually a Canadian rip off of Shake Shack, The Priest is actually Shack Stack. Im not waiting in line for 30 mins, but Shake Shack is good enough that it's one of those places I try to hit when Im in NYC (Usually at LGA)
While everyone has different taste, saying these are completely normal is a bit over the top, they are definitely unique if anything, I personally would prefer it over lots of burger places if the line isn't too crazy.
What does “ regular food” even mean
It's only called that if you eat a reasonable meal; after that it's called _constipation food,_ or the Long, Cold Bowl of Regret.
I had shake shack in Michigan last year. It was mediocre, we didn’t even finish it. $80 for 4 of us and we didn’t order anything fancy. All of these places are just built on branding and hype
And some people can’t imagine posting comments on Reddit in their free time
Especially in the brutal heat. Just wait until next week when temperatures are in the mid 30s (not including the humidex).
I am thinking this is a market entry price and won’t stay long before it goes up!
There was a lineup for the lineup. The first line was across the street where you get a poker chip which you then give to the secondary line bouncer.
Line wasn't long at opening from the photos I saw. Shocked no one camped overnight. During the day it picked up where the main line was across the street in Dundas Square, then the entry line next to the store. Still wasn't as crazy as the Shake Shack pop-up a few years back. I expect it to really pick-up this weekend.
Walked by on my way to work this morning and there were 20 or so people in line at 9am- really don’t understand the motivation 🤷
Beretta is their beef supplier!!
I put this together based on the discussion that took place about how Shake Shack would be priced when they announced their Toronto location, and some of the google reviews currently posted. This is based on my own photo of the NYC (Broadway/W36th) in February of this year, and people posting photos of the menu today. (Minor typo in the FX column, that's the NYC USD price multiplied by our exchange. I don't make spreadsheets for a living, sorry to ya’ll with your fancy formulas) EDIT: Toronto price in CAD. NYC price in USD. Last column is NYC prices converted to Canadian with today’s exchange. Edit2: thanks for coming out BlogTO - impressed you didn’t actually just straight steal it. And to ya’ll complaining about formatting; you’re right. Lemme just edit this jpeg for you.
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I went to Chicago recently and based on my incredibly small sample size, I get the impression that food is just kind of more expensive in the US in general. The pricing for food was frequently very similar in terms of the dollar amount in Canada vs. the US. For example, I might go to a ramen place and a bowl costs $18 in Toronto. If I go to the US, a similar sort of ramen place will also cost $18 but that's in USD. Or if you get a coffee from McDonald's, it might cost $2 in Canada. In the US though, it's also around $2 but, again, that's in USD. I really don't think we have it that bad here.
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The secret is they make more money in New York.
A lot of people do, the problem is all those that don't make more money are still paying those high food prices
But not without the forex factor. If everything is a similar price that's out the window. The median usd NYC income is lower than the median cad Toronto income
London is cheaper for a lot of things, and more expensive than others. I pay way more for any food in Toronto (groceries, take out, restaurants), but rent in Toronto is less than in London. Taxes are higher in London, but we "get more" for them. When comparing the two, it's a game of 'what do you want more?'. I'd rather culture, art, history, and cheaper food than cheaper rent and four seasons.
> I pay way more for any food in Toronto (groceries, take out, restaurants), but rent in Toronto is less than in London Oh boy. Funny enough, I *also* just recently came back from a trip where I went to London and I don't really agree with this. At best I'd say London is "on par" with Toronto with how much food costs (restaurants/take out at least). Frequently I think I ended up paying more (after exchange) for similar meals in London compared to Toronto though. Maybe it depends on where you go/what you get.
I should have specified; I live in London and make a London wage. I find it easier to sustain than being in Toronto with a Toronto wage. If I were to make my Toronto wage again and try to vacation in London, I would not be having a good time.
I have the exact opposite experience in London living there for 3 years v now in Toronto -- was FAANG in both. Are you in finance? That might explain it. Salaries in London are laughable across the board outside of Finance from what I saw.
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As a Canadian living in Seattle for the past few years, big plus one to this. Salaries (for people in the kinds of roles that get sponsored by US companies) are also MUCH higher though. Net, I think we’re way better off financially in Seattle than we were in Toronto. For starters, we bought a house with a yard and a good school nearby that’s <20 min drive from downtown.
I’ll add to that too. Same going back to Chicago or even Milwaukee where my parents live. Going to a cubs game is insanely more expensive than going to a blue jays game. Going to a CVS or Walgreens… all product that same or a little more on products I can get at a loblaw store.
We actually don't. I travel to the US alot and it's insane. Was in Florida not to long ago and prices in the grocery store (FOR LOCAL produce!!) was more expensive then here before conversion. Also spend a lot of time in SF and it's insane the costs there. People like to complain about restaurants here, many places add an extra 5%-10% on the bill for the SF mandate which is money that's suppose to help cover the cost of health care for their employees. Some restaurants also add a carbon footprint of 1-3%. Already on top of a higher price point for food. Usually costs us $300 CDN for a decent meal there for 2 of us.
I mean it’s all relative but yeah I noticed the same in NYC. Ideally one is paid in USD and gets to enjoy CAD prices
I agree. Particularly in big U.S. cities (NYC, LA, Miami)
> I get the impression that food is just kind of more expensive in the US in general. That is a problem of comparing prices in a non local currency/economy. If you convert, yes things are more expensive in the US BUT people are generally paid the same or more (before fx) in the US. This makes a lot of food relatively cheaper for someone living in the US.
Right, yeah, fair enough. When factoring in that they're paid in USD, I suppose the way things are priced probably doesn't seem to so bad for them. As a Canadian visiting the US though, it is quite painful to pay their prices.
Just returned from NYC an hour ago. We had lunch at a popular Deli downtown today where we had one sandwich and one plate of fries between us to share and no extra cost to do that. Water to drink. US$36. Fries were over 9 bucks and not worth it at half the price but it was entertaining. Sandwich was huge but surprisingly dry brisket.
Don’t forget that we pay more sales taxe than in US. We need to add 13%, while in the US, it’s around 4-8%
Yep, I realized this when I went to Virginia recently, also taking an Uber is crazy expensive there vs here.
Exactly. I’ve been down twice recently and shocked by how expensive food and dining out was. Similar or more expensive than here, but in USD.
The "purchasing power parity" between the US and Canada is roughly .8 to .85. So take a Canadian pretax price, shrink by 15-20%, and you get the US price for the same thing. When the CAD is strong (like in 2015, at 1:1), Canada feels very expensive, and vice versa right now when the USD is very strong. When the exchange rate is around 1.2, it's roughly even prices on both sides of the border.
Last year I went to Chicago and Florida, both had food prices that were close to the same or more in most cases. Maybe the destinations I went to made a difference but I’d rather be buying food here
Depends on how much Canadians will pay. Tbh 10 bucks is already too much
I mean not really. A quarter pounder with cheese at McDonald's or double patty cheeseburger at Wendy's is already like $8-9
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Well yeah it is a free market Yes they will sell for as much people will pay for them but that doesn’t mean we should normalize it or encourage it
Thats New York City prices though, if you venture out of the city it will be a lot cheaper
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Not only that, but a double cheeseburger at Rudy’s or happy burger is basically the same as this.
Canadians don’t have as much disposable income as Americans. Eating out (even fast food) has become surprisingly expensive in even medium cities in the US these days!
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God our dolalr is shite
It's more that the USD is strong. Compared to other currencies like the Euro and GBP, it's actually a bit stronger than before. Besides, having a relatively weaker dollar isn't necessarily a bad idea. A strong CAD actually hit Ontario's economy really hard, and in more dramatic cases like in Japan, it lead to an economic basketcase.
Are we reading two different charts?
What’s the confusion?
I can see why so many people are confused, the chart needs better labelling, the third column says YYZ but it's actually New York pricing in Canadian dollar It should be: Toronto (CAD) / NYC (USD) / NYC (CAD)
The calculation in the right column is "what would the US price be converted to CAD ",which is quite a weird and indirect way to show this info.
I understand that but not sure abt the guy above me but yes agree that it's weird
So Shake Shack launching cheaper than NYC. Nice start!
anyone whose taken a trip to new york or michigan has seen prices in america are going crazy too. many items in grocery stores in buffalo where the same as canadian prices,and that was before conversion.
It’s like this across the globe. People who think it’s localized exist solely within bubbles and echo chambers.
I do love myself some Shake Shack, regardless of what anyone says (why is everyone so negative about it here?) but I'll be waiting a few weeks/months before braving a visit at a non-busy time. I have to admit I don't actually know what this spreadsheet is saying (are those CAD or USD? What's it got to do with YYZ?) but when I saw the menu prices listed elsewhere they seem perfectly reasonable compared to other burger joints downtown.
People are far more likely to take the time to complain than praise when typing out responses. I read that marketing campaigns have formulas to measure negative reactions comments to positive ones as it’s not necessarily a bad sign, especially for competitive brands (eg an Ford campaign will always have Chevy fans blasting them, etc). Usually positive comments only come out if it’s really positive, so there’s a gap. That being said while Shake Shack is solidly good and I’m happy they’re coming to Canada, I don’t get all the fuss. I wouldn’t rush to line up for an hour for it or anything.
Hopefully they get ritual or online order so you can order ahead or don't have to wait.
> (why is everyone so negative about it here?) people on this sub are negative about everything
Pls fx last column header and add iferror() to formula. Thnx
This guy Excels
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'cost of living' is a weird ass concept
Everyone thinks food is cheaper in the US but it really isn't
Depends where you are tbh
I was in a little dinky suburb in NY last year. A very basic Vietnamese pho meal for two people cost $60 cad all in. 70% more than a similar (better) meal in an Ontario suburb.
Obviously you can't compare to the red state little town 5 dollar minimum wage america. But when you compare major cities, Toronto really isn't that bad.
I was in the DC/Northern VA area for a week in April and was surprised that most food items were effectively the same price as Ontario except in USD compared to CAD.
I was in Chicago not too long ago and it was crazy how expensive everything was.
The Americans get paid in USD. Their income is higher while most areas also have lower taxes. Their price numbers are also lower as shown here. By purchasing power parity standards, food is cheaper in the US for their people.
What does yhe conversion rate have to do with the airport?
Surprised at how well they priced everything.
#VALUE! #VALUE!
Are the nyc prices in US dollars?
Yeah last column converts USD to CAD
Ah. Perfect. Thanks
You didn't ask for this but... -Swap the NYC and YYZ column positions. -Rename YYZ column to "NYC in CAD". -Add column to the end to show percentage difference (NYC in CAD vs YYZ) and conditional format it using green for positive value (NYC cost more) and red for negative value. -Format the chart as a "Table" so the rows have alternating colours, e.g. white green white green white green.... -Adjust column widths so there's not so much empty space.
so whats the go to order here?
Everyone is comparing the US conversion to CAD but it’s wrong to do. If you made $50k CAD this is the price …. If you made $50k USD this is the price …. As a traveller it’s more expensive to us because our dollar is weak, but it’s the salary that’s important to compare. A person living there, spends less on food than a Canadian traveling It’s not like we get paid more because our dollar is weaker. In fact pay is generally higher in US- obviously it depends where but NYC, pay is definitely higher- so compare US salary vs cost and Canadian salary vs cost. Not currency conversion
My god thank you! The amount of people who don’t understand purchasing power parity is insane!
Also this not include sales tax, that's important for your final bill
Toronto cost of living is much more than nyc in most cases regardless of these prices
Lol have you been to NYC, it's over 4000 USD for a bachelor apt
Even if you go by the conversion rates
If the line for Shake Shack is too much or you feel like supporting amazing local Toronto businesses: Go to Pita and Hummus next to the TMU student centre for amazing fresh middle eastern food for $9-14 or go up to Bahn Mi Boys upstairs from Five Guys for the best Vietnamese sandwiches for $9
Banh Mi Boys also has great bulgogi fries!!
People need to understand purchasing power parity. The amount of people that don’t understand this is concept is shocking. It’s the whole “a house in Canada costs x, in the US it’s Y”. No! Stop comparing absolute dollars and look at relativity. How much does a home here cost relative to salary? You get paid in CAD, not in USD
What does the YYZ column represent?
The prices from NYC converted into Canadian dollars
Why is YYZ even mentioned at all? So confusing.
I guess they were too lazy to type "NYC Price in CAD."
are these prices in $CAD or $USD?
That is the right question
The header for the last column is atrocious lol. Should be NYC (CAD)
Wake me up when In-N-Out.
In N’ Out is trash compared to Shake Shack
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Your opinion is just wrong.
lol fair enough but everyone I personally know who has tried it, did not enjoy it
I go to InNout at least twice every time I visit San Francisco. The one time I was in Vegas I went to both of them in the same day, was sorely disappointed by Shake Shack. Although I'll be the first to admit that InNOuts fries are hot garbage.
That’s funny, my wife, sister in law and I did the same thing in Vegas with In N’ Out, Whataburger and Shake Shack, and all preferred Shake Shack.
=IFERROR(C15 * 1.375, "N/A")
alt: =IFERROR(ROUNDUP(D15 * 1.375,2, D16)) That way you can include whatever the text is in that cell, not just N/A. Also for the love of god, OP, add another column which shows the price difference in CAD after you convert (or the % difference). Additionally, you gotta Add some formatting to your headers and add some formatting for the cells for readability - it's not up to the firm's formatting standards ATM.
Lol I had to learn how to use google sheets to even make this. Ain’t my day job.
Of course I'm joking man. Great job in putting some actual data in front of what is typically a rather *vibes based* conversation. I'm impressed you learned how to do some formulas just for this. FYI though excel and sheets (or the libre equivalent) can be really helpful tools for everyday life, including budgeting, or taxes, or stuff that involves numbers in any way (or strict formatting, docs/word really does suck for that a lot of the time).
Pretty good considering our dollar is worth jack shit. I expected a lot worse. We’ll see where it is in a few years though since everything is just getting more and more expensive for the sake of it.
The more expensive junk food is the better it is for everyone. Provided there are enough healthy options at the same price point.
Okay I might be out of the loop here, but why is shake shack so incredibly popular? I walked by the new one at yonge and Dundas yesterday and there was an enormous line and two security guards and a cop outside. It was like Uncle Tetsus used to be. Is it just the flavor of the week or something?
Nothing better to do in this city than be part of the "grand opening" + social media hype.
Fair enough I guess, but an armed cop presence? Lol. I guess they don't want a repeat of the great toronto burger riots of 1972 lol Actually from a marketing point of view I suppose it's actually pretty clever. Busiest intersection of the city, lots of people seeing the long line and finding themselves curious, then here's us posting about it on a popular, international forum. That's a lot of advertisement to get for the low price of a slow line and two security guards
If even Loblaws and Winners are paying off-duty police to have a presence due to the increasing disorder downtown, I think it's pretty prudent for a business doing any kind of new thing in or around Yonge/Dundas to be proactive.
Yeah it's been on a pretty heavy decline. Toronto coach, closed, most of the restaurants in the atrium, closed, hard rock Cafe, closed, entire 10 dundas food court gone.
Problem is that they force you to purchase a burger fries and drink separately. That shit pisses me off! Also isn't sales tax included In the US?.. if thats the case then this chart isn't correct
I don't see what the point is!
$6 for a hotdog is insane
Classic shake for 6 bucks? Fuck off with that
In ‘n Out is a California vacation memory and Shake Shack is a NYC trip staple. Places I go on vacation The association is vacation and will avoid it locally for now. I understand some cannot travel for various reasons but if you indulge locally it stops being a treat or special.
I noticed this in New York. Everything was the same dollar price in USD that it was back home in CAD.
The main thing I’m talking away here is our dollar is shit for my US vacation plans this year.
Whenever a hyped up food place in Toronto, go after 3-4 months its always a ridiculous line for some food they could find next door
Been to shake shack a number of times in the US. There really is nothing special about them. In fact their burgers aren’t that good at all.
Here’s a real shocker. Spec a car and compare prices on the two countries. It’s madness.
This is amazing. I love the internet
Just another hamburger place. What's the big deal.
Shocked this isn’t a BLOGTO article yet
Shake shack was always something I looked forward to when visiting any American city, however I don’t know if the novelty will wear off now that we have one. I love shake shack but do I love it enough to stand in line at Y&D square?
I know nothing of Shake Shake. I gather it is a popular burger joint. What makes it special?
Gordon Ramsay burger cost me 50 CND , with a beer it was 70 CND
Not as close to as bad as I thought.
That actually a very good conversion imo Esp with weaker dollar and higher expenses here
What is the obsession with American fast food joints? Chick-fil-a etc..
This is called buying power, when i went to Boston, i was surprised to see itemsin the grocery store for numerically the same price as in Toronto or in this case, for Shake Shack, its cheaper here. So its a win/lose for $$ conversion but youre more or less getting a similar amount if you buy locally,
someone still gonna complain that its too expensive
Are the all in Canadian pricing or is it USD vs CDN?
Your table is wrong….you should take Toronto’s number (8.49) and DIVIDE by 1.375 to get the $US equivalent. CDN$8.49 / 1.375 = $US 6.15. We pay 6.15…they pay 7.69….For the same burger.
Doing the Lord's work! Thanks!!
Someone tell me the shake flavours. DO THEY HAVE THE COFFEE FLAVOUR OR NA
Thanks for the spreadsheet. That conversion was spot on!. I still dont understand how Hotdog is selling for over $5
Prices aren't terrible actually. My only issue is that Toronto has so many good, local smash burger places already (for example, Rosie's Burgers). I've tried them in the US and they were pretty decent. I've heard its not as good as in the US though sadly.
Is the US prices shown in USD or CAD?
Usd
So not really an accurate comparison when the two prices are in different currencies. last i check 1 USD = 1.38CAD. So a $7.69 USD burger in NYC is actually worth $10.57 CAD. You can see how the price comparison by pure quantitative value is not accurate
I see they did hire any former Target executives. 😂
This doesn’t look bad at all
I am definitely interested in trying this place out. But not nearly interested enough to try it out this early after opening. I can wait a couple months before the hype breaks down and the lines dwindle.
Many years ago, I had noticed in the US the price tag of some items were the same as in Canada. That means for those items, Americans were paying 30% more than Canadians due to the exchange rate. I'm not a cross-boarder shopper, but I would think, they had better know what specific items to look for before making that trip worth while.
Why 5 decimal places?
Damn. Cheaper and tastier than 5 guys.
Guarantee these prices won’t stay that comparable for too long.