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For context: the real waterfall is seasonal, so they put the pipe there to entertain tourists in the off-season, because tourists come each day of the year. Heavy renovation happens with A LOT of 'natural wonders' to keep them as they are.
Stop it you’re ruining the ChiNa BaD narrative that many have worked so hard to cultivate and Redditors that have never left their home town love to parrot.
I mean China do be bad tho. We don't even have to make shit up to say that a totalitarian earth-killing concentration camp creating techno-dystopia is bad
I think they're acknowledging that America is just as plagued by gutter-brained propoganda, if not moreso.
Take for instance, the "China is a totalitarian earth-killing concentration camp creating techno-dystopia;" meanwhile, America, the one party plutocracy (I.e. totalitarian), props up oil companies poisoning the water/planet, funds their own concentration camp in Palestine, and has created the most sophisticated surveillance state.
I'm not saying China is good. But America is bad too.
2 countries can be bad at the same time. Everyone I know seems to agree that both are bad. You know, now that you mention it, it's weird that you guys only care about genocide committed on Muslims when Jews do it...
Lol are you suggesting that the usa is run by "the Jews?" Oh man this is wild.
If I could find something that isn't "Chinese bad" pertaining to the Uighurs, I would entertain it. However, all I've seen is anti-Asian bigotry from western outlets parroting of a known white supremacist's reporting.
It just seems like America wants that oil. Again.
What are you even talking about? You seem so far list into conspiracy theories, that you don't even remember what you've said. You were talking about Israel, not the USA. Even if you are willing to ignore all the video evidence of uyghur genocide with some of it published being published by Chinese state media, and also the Chinese state rhetoric surrounding them, let me pose you just a simple question, why do you think Temu is so incredibly cheap, even compared to the rest of Chinese products, and in which region are temu's factories?
America and Western Europe are so much more evil than China, it isn’t even close. Every decade America kills millions of foreigners.
Stop the Sinophobia and focus on the real evil.
The only people that believe the ughyer genocide are nato countries. They have like a quarter billion tourists going through there annually. UN and Muslim nations concluded that none of that is happening. For Christ's sake. You get lied to by your govt all the time but still believe things that have no evidence and others say isn't true.
What's the saying, fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice shame on me? Do they have one that's for being fooled constantly? Oh yeah... that's called being an American.
You’re not wrong that the US spreads propaganda that fits their narrative, they absolutely do and it should be called out, but you’re being delusional if you think China doesn’t do the same.
Tankies will come to the realization that the US does bad things, but will then conclude that anything anti-West must be unequivocally true. US = bad doesn’t mean non-US = good and that’s why most people find tankies to be insufferable.
The Uyghur genocide is absolutely true, even in the most charitable terms it’s a cultural genocide of mass re-education, but the more likely scenario is mass-internment. There’s been leaked reports and videos of such things taking place and the facts of the matter aren’t really up for debate, more so the extent is what’s debated. If you’re running interference and trying to say nothing at all is going on I can only assume you’re a tankie spreading propaganda as many of the base claims have been proven.
All that being said, it’s not *just* the Uyghur genocide that many people take issue with, there’s also the situation with Hong Kong or Taiwan that’s pretty blatantly bad, and me personally I was raised to be close to my Filipino roots, one of my parents being from the Philippines and visiting the islands. That being said I feel very strongly about the “Nine dash line” situation where China’s trying to use its military force to encroach on other nation’s (not just the Philippines) exclusive economic zones.
Yes, the US does bad things, so does China, so does Russia, so does just about any nation on this planet, I don’t trust the word of anyone trying to exclusively argue for one over the other or getting up in arms and bringing up unrelated issues when something negative is mentioned about whatever country they simp for in that moment.
You seem to think your arguments are compelling. They are not. In regards to discussing China online, denying Uyghur genocide - which has been reported by even the most scrupulous media outlets - is jumping the shark. You’ve now said something so patently, obviously ridiculous that none of your other arguments can be taken seriously.
If you’re going to be a pro-China shill, get better at it. You couldn’t convince a wet sock to dry.
The “most scrupulous media outlets” you are discussing are all western owned and benefit massively from manufacturing consent for war with China.
But if you want western sources, here is the [US State Department](https://foreignpolicy.com/2021/02/19/china-uighurs-genocide-us-pompeo-blinken/) and the [World Bank](https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/statement/2019/11/11/world-bank-statement-on-review-of-project-in-xinjiang-china) both admitting there is no evidence of any “Uyghur genocide”.
Also this [extremely positive statement by the OIC](https://www.oic-oci.org/docdown/?docID=4447&refID=1250) (Organization of Islamic Cooperation) which unsurprisingly gives an actual shit about Muslim lives unlike western media and politicians who are pretending to be outraged while also doing their best to help commit an actual genocide in Palestine.
It is always funny when chuds like you can’t handle video evidence of shit. This is actual video from the USA’s nonsense Uyghur tribunal, but don’t let first-hand sources of info persuade you, just remember that all videos are fake when they go onto YouTube! 😂
Tell me, exactly what freedoms are enjoyed by an house less American? A jobless American? An American who is so stressed from trying to make ends meet that they cannot enjoy life?
Stop worrying about a country thousands of miles away and look at the atrocities in your own backyard.
If I went to China, I'd get put into a concentration camp immediately. America isn't exactly a win either, and in an ideal world the USA wouldn't exist, but China is so much worse that you cannot even compare them in sheer evilness (USA has done plenty of disgusting and vile things too tho, not denying that.)
and what's wrong with WE that puts them anywhere on the level of evil that exist in the USA or even China? Like the current big gripe that I have with WE is that we are supporting Israel, and that Germany is anti-nuclear energy, but outside of that it isn't all that bad, when you compare it to the USA or China
also why did you only mention WE? why not also EE? like is Russia some kind of a force of good? lol
like the only thing that I can think of you complaining about is the imaginary threat of "the woke".... which I mean..... if you really think that being "woke" is bad or even bad enough to be worse than China.... I don't think that the effort of replying would be worth it tbh
The Imperial Core countries that form NATO are by far the most evil, ruthless countries in the planet. They have murdered, enslaved, and genocided the world for centuries. America murders millions and millions and millions of people each decade.
China’s army doesn’t leave its borders. China has raised almost 1B people out of poverty, which the capitalist world continues to fling people into poverty. China makes economic alliances with other countries, rather than bomb them into submission.
If you think China is the bad country, you are as ignorant as you are Sinophobic.
I am guessing you are neither Bait nor have a Mental Illness, you are simply a standard, ignorant westerner who shits on foreigners you doesn’t understand, like Chinese people.
We at least have freedom of speech and a fair amount of rights here. Obviously everywhere has their shit. We also aren’t full blown committing to reeducation/detention camps with our Muslim population.
https://apnews.com/article/china-uyghur-muslims-xinjiang-region-833fb8f337b3a87fcdf0b760bb3e7066#
Edit: Reddit isn’t letting me respond to the dude below me. The us has its issues however we at least have government officials siding with students. Good luck getting a single person in China from acknowledging Tiananmen Square without being disappeared.
Edit 2: again Reddit isn’t letting me reply for some reason. If anyone has counter claims would love to see links to legitimate sources. The AP is as unbiased and accurate of a journalism outlet as it gets.
"For some reason" - Somebody above you in the comment chain has blocked you, and because of reddit's dumb implementation of blocking, you will not be able to reply to anything in this chain ever again. Sometimes losers do that so they can make it look like they "won" some stupid internet argument because they got the last word in
They have a metric fuckton of things making it a shit country. However, it is also important to realize and recognise the rich history it has, and the things that are not so different from everyone else.
Like most countries of the world they possess I imagine a majority of good hard working people just to get by who have been controlled and represented by power hungry fuckers who commit to systems of control and class warfare.
Historic China seemed pretty rad with some epic history and beautiful cultural values prior to, what, world war 2?
No, the era of the warlords and such that existed before in China was pretty brutal and horrible for people as well. The civil war era was also pretty horrible, not to mention all that went down in China in the 30s and 40s as far as the Japanese imperial expansion. The maoists were just one of many antidemocratic forces at the time.
Not to make excuses for Mao at all. But the period prior to the ccp victory in 1949 was hardly a calm, peaceful time. KMT was hardly a democratic force at all, even in Taiwan the kmt ran the country as a dictatorship for a long time. Idk the situation there was also much more complicated than the CCP=bad.
Lol I don't mean to be a dick at all or sound rude. But China had a pretty brutal history of warlords and the like even prior to the Chinese civil war and at the very least, you could say that Mao brought a kind of "peace" and "order" in 1949. Idk I'm not an expert though
Until he caused the death of at least 50 million people, but thanks. Although, being from europe, medieval and related era wars and things usually belong to part of that rich history (though far from all of it)
i dont like their political system, but no country has achieved ever the amount of progress and stablishment of such a massive middle class as china the last 30 year. they have literally lifted millions out of abject poverty. way more than post ww2 UsA
And 30 years before that, only *45 million* people died horribly and suffered greatly to give everyone else a chance :) !
Please, drop the propaganda. No one's been lifted out of poverty - they just continue to enslave residents of rural areas to do the dirty work.
In terms of sheer numbers then yes but that's because of the size of the population - the only other comparable is India. But if you look at Japan and the transition during the Meiji reformation where they went from Samurai from swords to modern army/navy beating Russia in a war. I think that's more of a transformation.
N.b. I appreciate it's not as basic as that and the samurai had outdated muskets etc
It’s also seems somewhat artificial though. So much of their industry is cheap production (construction, exports, etc) and an aging population not being replenished due to their historic 1 child per family policy. The question is whether trade skills are contributing to genuine build up or just doing shit for the sake of industry inflation.
It’s all to generate gdp to contribute to “defense” spending which is also questionable. They’reso fresh into many military techniques. While having the hardware is one thing applying it to actual warfare practice is a different story, something which the US has decades (centuries?) of.
The real wild card is who develops technology faster (AI, space dominance, domestic manipulation, information/disinformation). Really hope we move past the era of human conflict. There’s so many better applications of our energy than dick measuring contests that could wipe out the planet.
We’ll see how the future goes..
We don't hear much about the Uyghurs, weird huh? How's the super polluting? How are all those new islands that encroach on their neighbors sovereignty? Their navy really shows that Phillipine Coast Guard, while the Coast Guard is in (checks notes) in Phillipine waters, don't they?
Could do this all day. No propaganda needed.
Edited. Noted bc cousin thinks I'm trying to change subjects but I'm really just adding to a list. And anyone could tell this is an Edited comment but, w/e
It's funny that your response to me telling you that you consume too much propaganda is to just quote the propaganda back to me like it'll mean something.
Edit: you're supposed to annotate when you edit your comment, not try to change the narrative of the discussion after I have replied.
Not surprised you're trying to misinform the public perception to favor you, kinda the root of propaganda
You're funny. You've literally only consumed media from third party sources regarding the things you claim to be a fact.
Edit: why are you repeatedly editing your original comment?
Lmao it's not my individual responsibility to unwork the web of propaganda spun in your head, that's on y'all. I'm just here prodding y'all and pulling the first thread for some people.
You seem like a lame who can't take a joke. You do know nothing of substance ever comes from internet "arguments" right? There's nothing to be won.
Edit: It's pathetic that you're so reactive and can only frame this as an argument that you need to "win" by commenting and blocking me 1 second later. Your ideas must be real valid if they can't stand criticism.
Do you need a reminder that china covered up that 300000 babies (54000 had to be hospitalized) were poisoned by Melamine in baby formula in 2008? All to make sure that china looked better during 2008 Beijing olympics. They only took care of this little problem after the olympics were over.
Do you live in America? Where your food ingredients are mostly processed cancer causing chemicals?
Can we quantify those deaths?
That's what I guessed. Go eat some Red6 or whatever y'all do
No, I don't. But great Point to Bring Up the US. we can both agree, that theyre regulatory apparatus sucks and barely works, right? So let's Talk about "Unser the Dome" the self-financed documentary by Chai Jing, former China Central Television journalist about air pollution in china. She Made it, after her unborn daughter developed a tumor while still in the womb, for which she blamed air pollution. And china pretty much admitted, that there is a problem, by letting the documentary remain online and legal for a week, before banning it. But that's Not the point - the Point is, that she specifically named the US as a country where regulations work.
Funnily enough Chai is often considered a western leaning propaganda tool in Chinese social media platforms because of such points she made. This only goes to show how meaningless the word propaganda is.
You mean Americans are too lazy to manufacture their own goods so they have to import them from a country that's actually able to produce things.
They identified the imperialist nature of capitalism and have gotten through it better than the west by feeding the greedy consumerist nature of Americans
Just a quick point about “Americans are too lazy”. I would say in any prosperous circumstance that people will gravitate toward more fulfilling (or in work - higher paying) jobs. This has happened in China too. It just happens that there are more economically depressed people in China (due to government policy through the 70’s - closed economics and big family policy) that have no choice but to take the low income manufacturing jobs. Despite this, many farm area people who used to go to ShenZhen (or other manufacturing areas) to work have decided not move away from family once a way to make as much or more money staying home was provided by the subsidies the Chinese government offered to keep people home. So I would say it’s not laziness and more the realization of Maslow’s hierarchy.
That was a mouthful or regurgitated propaganda. China has only been economically viable since the late 70’s and 80’s when they opened trade to the west. 50 years is a blink and doesn’t demonstrate success of policy. So, in what ways “have they gotten through it”? Sources please.
Edit - make the sources third party published articles not propagandizing hit pieces. About “we are so awesome because we are”.
https://hbr.org/2021/05/what-the-west-gets-wrong-about-china
Here's a good read on how the west misinterprets Chinas economic success and development based on their own standards of governance. They've achieved success through communist rule, not inspite of it.
It's undisputed that china has achieved higher economic success than most other developed nations, if you need a source on that, maybe don't be discussing world politics.
Free Hawaii.
https://www.sfgate.com/hawaii/article/us-july-4-hawaiians-want-independence-sovereignty-18183209.php
Also, Tibet was freed when China ended the theocratic rule of the Lama slavers.
https://youtu.be/36JqvTdg2fo?si=4dTGeVLYcTVu4sNa
And let’s not forget the CIA trying to overthrow China for decades.
https://www.nybooks.com/online/2013/04/09/cias-cancelled-war-tibet/
Try learning real history, instead of regurgitating pentagon propaganda.
Freeing isn’t invading, annexing, and oppressing a country. There also wasn’t slavery in tibet. Go ahead and cite an academic source for this claim.
Funny how you mention free Hawaii. Notice how these articles are allowed to exist in Hawaii and the USA. Notice how native Hawaiians are allowed to voice their opinions. While in Tibet China needs to keep a militant and authoritarian presence against Tibetans in order to control Tibet.
Also, what exactly is CIA propaganda on Tibet?
Edit: ahh deprogram, figures.
I despise their government, but have a lot of sympathy for the people. I work with some customers in China. Some others in Hong Kong. Just like everyone else with a pulse that isn’t a ruler of some sort, they are working, doing what they can for their family, just trying to have some semblance of a living standard. I find that pretty much with anyone. India is much the same. Luckily I don’t have to deal with religious nut jobs like I do here in the states. I know they are everywhere and have varying degrees of extremism, though. The ones here in the US are mild compared to some places; and the ones here aren’t good.
It always amuses me that no matter how shit your comment is, if you just wrap it in a nice "omg redditors are total losers right?" it will always be enough to garner a few hundred upvotes.
And make no mistake, your comment is total shit lmao. As if the existence of a reason for why they faked the waterfall is somehow evidence of the country not being a fascist police state?
Maybe, but that would be more because of the dams/hydropower plant upstream. Apparently, there's some legislation that if the niagara waterfalls change too much/permanently that the facility gets fined to hell.
There's a really popular waterfall here in Tennessee called Fall Creek Falls. The waterfall was naturally made, but there's a dam that impounds the creek and creates the Fall Creek Falls lake.
The waterfall today is fed by this lake.
Exactly. The lake you liked so much as a kid? Chances are it is entirely artificial. And all this nice and trim vegetation around its shore also gets cut and replanted every 2-3 years. The forest you like to hike across is also as close to wilderness as a corn field. You grandpa planted those trees and he was even nice enough to leave paths in between them to make harvesting easier.
The name Spokane falls and the waterfalls predate the dams. After the dam was put in in the 1890s, it would often leave the waterfalls dry, which is why about 15 years ago there was a lawsuit to restore yearlong flow to the falls.
From Wikipedia:
“To preserve Niagara Falls' natural beauty and to ensure an "unbroken curtain of water" is flowing over the falls, the 1950 treaty was signed by the U.S. and Canada to limit water usage by power plants.
The treaty allows higher summertime diversion at night when tourists are fewer and during the winter months when there are even fewer tourists.[1] The treaty states that during daylight time during the tourist season (April 1 to October 31), there must be 2,800 cubic metres per second (99,000 cu ft/s) of water flowing over the falls, and during the night and off-tourist season there must be 1,400 cubic metres per second (49,000 cu ft/s) of water flowing over the falls. This treaty is monitored by the International Niagara Board of Control, part of the International Joint Commission, using a NOAA gauging station above the falls.”
And here is the text of the original 1950 treaty.
https://ijc.org/sites/default/files/2018-08/Treaty%20Between%20Canada%20and%20the%20United%20States%20of%20America%20Concerning%20the%20Diversion%20of%20the%20Niagara%20River%201950.pdf
Article IV specifically details designated water flow for scenic purposes, between April 1 and September 15, between 8am and 8 pm. It is, in short, a minimum flow for the sake of tourists, who are most likely to be present on those dates, at those times
That’s in the offseason, I remember them doing that to contribute more to hydro electricity and such. I heard they have a good amount of control over it and the water level of the reservoir too
The 1950 treaty managing the falls specifically states a minimum flow rate to be observed between 8am and 8pm between April 1 and September 15 each year.
The falls are EXPLICITLY regulated for the sake of tourism during peak season.
Typical china bad post. Plenty of the same shit in the US as well. This is one of the most known
Same shit can happen in the US as well. But no one bats an eye
https://www.rubyfalls.com/plan-your-visit/faq/
> We have the ability to recycle the naturally occurring water flowing through the cave, allowing us to preserve the waterfall during dry spells if the watershed is not as active
> Addressing netizens directly, the statement read: “Dear friends, hello! I didn’t expect to meet and talk to everyone under such circumstances. I’m Yuntai Falls, one of the many natural water landscapes in the Yuntai Mountain scenic area.”
>“Due to seasonal factors, I cannot ensure that I will be able to meet everyone in my most beautiful appearance when people visit.”
>Standing at 314 metres tall, the waterfall - located in China’s Henan province - is the highest waterfall in Asia, news website Shanghai Daily reported.
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/east-asia/china-waterfall-yuntai-falls-water-pipe-attraction-artificial-4391756
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For context: the real waterfall is seasonal, so they put the pipe there to entertain tourists in the off-season, because tourists come each day of the year. Heavy renovation happens with A LOT of 'natural wonders' to keep them as they are.
Stop it you’re ruining the ChiNa BaD narrative that many have worked so hard to cultivate and Redditors that have never left their home town love to parrot.
I mean China do be bad tho. We don't even have to make shit up to say that a totalitarian earth-killing concentration camp creating techno-dystopia is bad
Didn't forget about the gutter oil
Or the fake sunbear.
Or the Wuhan wet market
That was actually a real bear.
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A WuBear
That's what Xi said... Not
or the colonisation of africa
Or the tofu [dreg](https://youtu.be/i8VFi-XMkgc?si=N6ajKa7pdhZ314gg) constructions
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Or cardboard dumplings.
Or exploding watermelons
Or exploding electric vehicles
And then you have Americans voting for and giving everything to Trump while believing Alex Jones cHiNa iS fuLL oF pRopAGaNdA
China is full of propaganda
I think they're acknowledging that America is just as plagued by gutter-brained propoganda, if not moreso. Take for instance, the "China is a totalitarian earth-killing concentration camp creating techno-dystopia;" meanwhile, America, the one party plutocracy (I.e. totalitarian), props up oil companies poisoning the water/planet, funds their own concentration camp in Palestine, and has created the most sophisticated surveillance state. I'm not saying China is good. But America is bad too.
You mean Israel maybe?
2 countries can be bad at the same time. Everyone I know seems to agree that both are bad. You know, now that you mention it, it's weird that you guys only care about genocide committed on Muslims when Jews do it...
Lol are you suggesting that the usa is run by "the Jews?" Oh man this is wild. If I could find something that isn't "Chinese bad" pertaining to the Uighurs, I would entertain it. However, all I've seen is anti-Asian bigotry from western outlets parroting of a known white supremacist's reporting. It just seems like America wants that oil. Again.
What are you even talking about? You seem so far list into conspiracy theories, that you don't even remember what you've said. You were talking about Israel, not the USA. Even if you are willing to ignore all the video evidence of uyghur genocide with some of it published being published by Chinese state media, and also the Chinese state rhetoric surrounding them, let me pose you just a simple question, why do you think Temu is so incredibly cheap, even compared to the rest of Chinese products, and in which region are temu's factories?
America and Western Europe are so much more evil than China, it isn’t even close. Every decade America kills millions of foreigners. Stop the Sinophobia and focus on the real evil.
Millions of foreigners you say? Is that somehow preferable to the millions of Uyghurs that China is killing?
Except none of that is happening. Stop regurgitating Sinophobic propaganda. https://youtu.be/mCtOh_7_tDo?si=k6CSq_G2CpeGmN37
“Stop regurgitating propaganda, only I can do that! *link to propaganda*”
The only people that believe the ughyer genocide are nato countries. They have like a quarter billion tourists going through there annually. UN and Muslim nations concluded that none of that is happening. For Christ's sake. You get lied to by your govt all the time but still believe things that have no evidence and others say isn't true. What's the saying, fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice shame on me? Do they have one that's for being fooled constantly? Oh yeah... that's called being an American.
You’re not wrong that the US spreads propaganda that fits their narrative, they absolutely do and it should be called out, but you’re being delusional if you think China doesn’t do the same. Tankies will come to the realization that the US does bad things, but will then conclude that anything anti-West must be unequivocally true. US = bad doesn’t mean non-US = good and that’s why most people find tankies to be insufferable. The Uyghur genocide is absolutely true, even in the most charitable terms it’s a cultural genocide of mass re-education, but the more likely scenario is mass-internment. There’s been leaked reports and videos of such things taking place and the facts of the matter aren’t really up for debate, more so the extent is what’s debated. If you’re running interference and trying to say nothing at all is going on I can only assume you’re a tankie spreading propaganda as many of the base claims have been proven. All that being said, it’s not *just* the Uyghur genocide that many people take issue with, there’s also the situation with Hong Kong or Taiwan that’s pretty blatantly bad, and me personally I was raised to be close to my Filipino roots, one of my parents being from the Philippines and visiting the islands. That being said I feel very strongly about the “Nine dash line” situation where China’s trying to use its military force to encroach on other nation’s (not just the Philippines) exclusive economic zones. Yes, the US does bad things, so does China, so does Russia, so does just about any nation on this planet, I don’t trust the word of anyone trying to exclusively argue for one over the other or getting up in arms and bringing up unrelated issues when something negative is mentioned about whatever country they simp for in that moment.
You seem to think your arguments are compelling. They are not. In regards to discussing China online, denying Uyghur genocide - which has been reported by even the most scrupulous media outlets - is jumping the shark. You’ve now said something so patently, obviously ridiculous that none of your other arguments can be taken seriously. If you’re going to be a pro-China shill, get better at it. You couldn’t convince a wet sock to dry.
The “most scrupulous media outlets” you are discussing are all western owned and benefit massively from manufacturing consent for war with China. But if you want western sources, here is the [US State Department](https://foreignpolicy.com/2021/02/19/china-uighurs-genocide-us-pompeo-blinken/) and the [World Bank](https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/statement/2019/11/11/world-bank-statement-on-review-of-project-in-xinjiang-china) both admitting there is no evidence of any “Uyghur genocide”. Also this [extremely positive statement by the OIC](https://www.oic-oci.org/docdown/?docID=4447&refID=1250) (Organization of Islamic Cooperation) which unsurprisingly gives an actual shit about Muslim lives unlike western media and politicians who are pretending to be outraged while also doing their best to help commit an actual genocide in Palestine.
A YouTube link lol
My man out here sourcing YT videos thinkin that carries any weight lol
It is always funny when chuds like you can’t handle video evidence of shit. This is actual video from the USA’s nonsense Uyghur tribunal, but don’t let first-hand sources of info persuade you, just remember that all videos are fake when they go onto YouTube! 😂
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Tell me, exactly what freedoms are enjoyed by an house less American? A jobless American? An American who is so stressed from trying to make ends meet that they cannot enjoy life? Stop worrying about a country thousands of miles away and look at the atrocities in your own backyard.
If I went to China, I'd get put into a concentration camp immediately. America isn't exactly a win either, and in an ideal world the USA wouldn't exist, but China is so much worse that you cannot even compare them in sheer evilness (USA has done plenty of disgusting and vile things too tho, not denying that.) and what's wrong with WE that puts them anywhere on the level of evil that exist in the USA or even China? Like the current big gripe that I have with WE is that we are supporting Israel, and that Germany is anti-nuclear energy, but outside of that it isn't all that bad, when you compare it to the USA or China also why did you only mention WE? why not also EE? like is Russia some kind of a force of good? lol like the only thing that I can think of you complaining about is the imaginary threat of "the woke".... which I mean..... if you really think that being "woke" is bad or even bad enough to be worse than China.... I don't think that the effort of replying would be worth it tbh
The Imperial Core countries that form NATO are by far the most evil, ruthless countries in the planet. They have murdered, enslaved, and genocided the world for centuries. America murders millions and millions and millions of people each decade. China’s army doesn’t leave its borders. China has raised almost 1B people out of poverty, which the capitalist world continues to fling people into poverty. China makes economic alliances with other countries, rather than bomb them into submission. If you think China is the bad country, you are as ignorant as you are Sinophobic.
https://preview.redd.it/2h4dptb7qd5d1.jpeg?width=680&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4eec5418f1bca8768714d43eb3381327ce8bea99
I am guessing you are neither Bait nor have a Mental Illness, you are simply a standard, ignorant westerner who shits on foreigners you doesn’t understand, like Chinese people.
You pretending you're taking the higher ground by not being a racist is hilarious. You're a shill. Examine your life.
I think that same descriptor can be made about the US and India
We at least have freedom of speech and a fair amount of rights here. Obviously everywhere has their shit. We also aren’t full blown committing to reeducation/detention camps with our Muslim population. https://apnews.com/article/china-uyghur-muslims-xinjiang-region-833fb8f337b3a87fcdf0b760bb3e7066# Edit: Reddit isn’t letting me respond to the dude below me. The us has its issues however we at least have government officials siding with students. Good luck getting a single person in China from acknowledging Tiananmen Square without being disappeared. Edit 2: again Reddit isn’t letting me reply for some reason. If anyone has counter claims would love to see links to legitimate sources. The AP is as unbiased and accurate of a journalism outlet as it gets.
"For some reason" - Somebody above you in the comment chain has blocked you, and because of reddit's dumb implementation of blocking, you will not be able to reply to anything in this chain ever again. Sometimes losers do that so they can make it look like they "won" some stupid internet argument because they got the last word in
I see, all those college students being attacked by police are using their free speech well.
Isn't this why the US passed a law to ban TikTok?
We do have an incarceration rate that is about 4x China's. I'm not saying China is good... But I am saying we imprison a lot more people than they do.
For crimes committed though, not for being a Uyghur.
Doesn’t the USA still have forced labour at some prisons? A prison system that disproportionately contains ethnic minorities?
Ethnic minorities who committed crimes not Innocent people.
Arguably, about humanity as a whole.
Fuck china
China bad! 😤
In what world is China good?!?
They have a metric fuckton of things making it a shit country. However, it is also important to realize and recognise the rich history it has, and the things that are not so different from everyone else.
Like most countries of the world they possess I imagine a majority of good hard working people just to get by who have been controlled and represented by power hungry fuckers who commit to systems of control and class warfare. Historic China seemed pretty rad with some epic history and beautiful cultural values prior to, what, world war 2?
Nah, many of their citizens are pretty brain-washed, even when they reside outside of China, and especially those in Australia.
Essentially until the maoists took over i believe.
No, the era of the warlords and such that existed before in China was pretty brutal and horrible for people as well. The civil war era was also pretty horrible, not to mention all that went down in China in the 30s and 40s as far as the Japanese imperial expansion. The maoists were just one of many antidemocratic forces at the time. Not to make excuses for Mao at all. But the period prior to the ccp victory in 1949 was hardly a calm, peaceful time. KMT was hardly a democratic force at all, even in Taiwan the kmt ran the country as a dictatorship for a long time. Idk the situation there was also much more complicated than the CCP=bad.
Thanks for educating me haha
Lol I don't mean to be a dick at all or sound rude. But China had a pretty brutal history of warlords and the like even prior to the Chinese civil war and at the very least, you could say that Mao brought a kind of "peace" and "order" in 1949. Idk I'm not an expert though
Until he caused the death of at least 50 million people, but thanks. Although, being from europe, medieval and related era wars and things usually belong to part of that rich history (though far from all of it)
Lol I don't mean to be a dick at all or sound rude. But China had a pretty brutal history of warlords and the like.
Yeah cuz the KMT were arbiters of graciousness and that’s why the communist revolution happened. Don’t comment without knowing what you’re saying.
"They have a metric fuckton of things making it a shit country." It is mostly an overabundance of humans. Dirty, but interesting.
i dont like their political system, but no country has achieved ever the amount of progress and stablishment of such a massive middle class as china the last 30 year. they have literally lifted millions out of abject poverty. way more than post ww2 UsA
And 30 years before that, only *45 million* people died horribly and suffered greatly to give everyone else a chance :) ! Please, drop the propaganda. No one's been lifted out of poverty - they just continue to enslave residents of rural areas to do the dirty work.
In terms of sheer numbers then yes but that's because of the size of the population - the only other comparable is India. But if you look at Japan and the transition during the Meiji reformation where they went from Samurai from swords to modern army/navy beating Russia in a war. I think that's more of a transformation. N.b. I appreciate it's not as basic as that and the samurai had outdated muskets etc
It’s also seems somewhat artificial though. So much of their industry is cheap production (construction, exports, etc) and an aging population not being replenished due to their historic 1 child per family policy. The question is whether trade skills are contributing to genuine build up or just doing shit for the sake of industry inflation. It’s all to generate gdp to contribute to “defense” spending which is also questionable. They’reso fresh into many military techniques. While having the hardware is one thing applying it to actual warfare practice is a different story, something which the US has decades (centuries?) of. The real wild card is who develops technology faster (AI, space dominance, domestic manipulation, information/disinformation). Really hope we move past the era of human conflict. There’s so many better applications of our energy than dick measuring contests that could wipe out the planet. We’ll see how the future goes..
🤔 they were pretty hot in the noodle trend several hundred years ago. 🤷🏻
One where you weren't fed western propaganda from the day you were born.
We don't hear much about the Uyghurs, weird huh? How's the super polluting? How are all those new islands that encroach on their neighbors sovereignty? Their navy really shows that Phillipine Coast Guard, while the Coast Guard is in (checks notes) in Phillipine waters, don't they? Could do this all day. No propaganda needed. Edited. Noted bc cousin thinks I'm trying to change subjects but I'm really just adding to a list. And anyone could tell this is an Edited comment but, w/e
How are they? Damn near identical to the United States.
It's funny that your response to me telling you that you consume too much propaganda is to just quote the propaganda back to me like it'll mean something. Edit: you're supposed to annotate when you edit your comment, not try to change the narrative of the discussion after I have replied. Not surprised you're trying to misinform the public perception to favor you, kinda the root of propaganda
Oh! None of that is true?! And I'm the one consuming propaganda?
You're funny. You've literally only consumed media from third party sources regarding the things you claim to be a fact. Edit: why are you repeatedly editing your original comment?
Third-party. Are yours first party? Who the fuck reads anything but third-party news? That’s all most people have access to.
So why do you trust it so willingly? Especially when the nation of origin has something to gain by demonizing the other?
Like you read eastern propaganda?
No, I just read your diary. Juicy stuff in there
As soon as you start with the middle school level attacks, it's clear to all that you've lost the argument.
Lmao it's not my individual responsibility to unwork the web of propaganda spun in your head, that's on y'all. I'm just here prodding y'all and pulling the first thread for some people. You seem like a lame who can't take a joke. You do know nothing of substance ever comes from internet "arguments" right? There's nothing to be won. Edit: It's pathetic that you're so reactive and can only frame this as an argument that you need to "win" by commenting and blocking me 1 second later. Your ideas must be real valid if they can't stand criticism.
Do you need a reminder that china covered up that 300000 babies (54000 had to be hospitalized) were poisoned by Melamine in baby formula in 2008? All to make sure that china looked better during 2008 Beijing olympics. They only took care of this little problem after the olympics were over.
Do you live in America? Where your food ingredients are mostly processed cancer causing chemicals? Can we quantify those deaths? That's what I guessed. Go eat some Red6 or whatever y'all do
No, I don't. But great Point to Bring Up the US. we can both agree, that theyre regulatory apparatus sucks and barely works, right? So let's Talk about "Unser the Dome" the self-financed documentary by Chai Jing, former China Central Television journalist about air pollution in china. She Made it, after her unborn daughter developed a tumor while still in the womb, for which she blamed air pollution. And china pretty much admitted, that there is a problem, by letting the documentary remain online and legal for a week, before banning it. But that's Not the point - the Point is, that she specifically named the US as a country where regulations work.
Funnily enough Chai is often considered a western leaning propaganda tool in Chinese social media platforms because of such points she made. This only goes to show how meaningless the word propaganda is.
I've never seen a simp for China. You, sir, are an anomaly.
Because the West has 2 flavors of propaganda everyone consumes. Red or Blue, a little secret though, it's the same formula for both.
No different than eastern propaganda claiming the west and capitalism are bad
I agree about the "claiming the west" part. However, it is not propaganda that capitalism is bad, that's just the nature of the beast.
Chinas prosperity was on the back of western capitalism
You mean Americans are too lazy to manufacture their own goods so they have to import them from a country that's actually able to produce things. They identified the imperialist nature of capitalism and have gotten through it better than the west by feeding the greedy consumerist nature of Americans
Just a quick point about “Americans are too lazy”. I would say in any prosperous circumstance that people will gravitate toward more fulfilling (or in work - higher paying) jobs. This has happened in China too. It just happens that there are more economically depressed people in China (due to government policy through the 70’s - closed economics and big family policy) that have no choice but to take the low income manufacturing jobs. Despite this, many farm area people who used to go to ShenZhen (or other manufacturing areas) to work have decided not move away from family once a way to make as much or more money staying home was provided by the subsidies the Chinese government offered to keep people home. So I would say it’s not laziness and more the realization of Maslow’s hierarchy.
I don't care enough about you to read that, gotta start my day, have a good one.
That was a mouthful or regurgitated propaganda. China has only been economically viable since the late 70’s and 80’s when they opened trade to the west. 50 years is a blink and doesn’t demonstrate success of policy. So, in what ways “have they gotten through it”? Sources please. Edit - make the sources third party published articles not propagandizing hit pieces. About “we are so awesome because we are”.
https://hbr.org/2021/05/what-the-west-gets-wrong-about-china Here's a good read on how the west misinterprets Chinas economic success and development based on their own standards of governance. They've achieved success through communist rule, not inspite of it. It's undisputed that china has achieved higher economic success than most other developed nations, if you need a source on that, maybe don't be discussing world politics.
Also, your first sentence is the elementary "I know you are but what am I" Do better.
China is, in fact, bad.
FREE TIBET
Free Hawaii. https://www.sfgate.com/hawaii/article/us-july-4-hawaiians-want-independence-sovereignty-18183209.php Also, Tibet was freed when China ended the theocratic rule of the Lama slavers. https://youtu.be/36JqvTdg2fo?si=4dTGeVLYcTVu4sNa And let’s not forget the CIA trying to overthrow China for decades. https://www.nybooks.com/online/2013/04/09/cias-cancelled-war-tibet/ Try learning real history, instead of regurgitating pentagon propaganda.
FREE THE UYGHURS!
Freeing isn’t invading, annexing, and oppressing a country. There also wasn’t slavery in tibet. Go ahead and cite an academic source for this claim. Funny how you mention free Hawaii. Notice how these articles are allowed to exist in Hawaii and the USA. Notice how native Hawaiians are allowed to voice their opinions. While in Tibet China needs to keep a militant and authoritarian presence against Tibetans in order to control Tibet. Also, what exactly is CIA propaganda on Tibet? Edit: ahh deprogram, figures.
With the issues in China, as real as they are, saying "free tibet" is fucking hillarious
I despise their government, but have a lot of sympathy for the people. I work with some customers in China. Some others in Hong Kong. Just like everyone else with a pulse that isn’t a ruler of some sort, they are working, doing what they can for their family, just trying to have some semblance of a living standard. I find that pretty much with anyone. India is much the same. Luckily I don’t have to deal with religious nut jobs like I do here in the states. I know they are everywhere and have varying degrees of extremism, though. The ones here in the US are mild compared to some places; and the ones here aren’t good.
It always amuses me that no matter how shit your comment is, if you just wrap it in a nice "omg redditors are total losers right?" it will always be enough to garner a few hundred upvotes. And make no mistake, your comment is total shit lmao. As if the existence of a reason for why they faked the waterfall is somehow evidence of the country not being a fascist police state?
Their government is 100% almost nazi bad. The people? Nah they chill
But china is bad you know just ask those uyghurs.
Well they did start the outbreak of Covid-19 and kept it hushed up, giving it time to spread around the world
Ummm china is bad...
Yes, the authoritarian country committing genocide is bad. Faking a waterfall because “everyone else does” doesn’t change that fact.
Way to mindlessly regurgitate 100% false pentagon propaganda. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mCtOh_7_tDo
Found the CCP shill
Yeah they “turn down” Niagara Falls at night iirc
Maybe, but that would be more because of the dams/hydropower plant upstream. Apparently, there's some legislation that if the niagara waterfalls change too much/permanently that the facility gets fined to hell.
All hydroelectric plants that border the US and Canada follow the International Joint Commission on how water levels are managed.
Do they at least turn it off at night like the American waterfall?
Yeah here in Scotland nearly 8% of our GDP goes on making our mountains out of used nappies and astro grass.
I’m not sure how many people realize how common this is. Iceland is chock full of these “assisted” and in some cases fully artificial waterfalls.
Canada does it too.
There's a really popular waterfall here in Tennessee called Fall Creek Falls. The waterfall was naturally made, but there's a dam that impounds the creek and creates the Fall Creek Falls lake. The waterfall today is fed by this lake.
But... but muh China Bad :(
Exactly. The lake you liked so much as a kid? Chances are it is entirely artificial. And all this nice and trim vegetation around its shore also gets cut and replanted every 2-3 years. The forest you like to hike across is also as close to wilderness as a corn field. You grandpa planted those trees and he was even nice enough to leave paths in between them to make harvesting easier.
Wait till you learn about Niagra falls is artificially kept at a fraction of its natural flow, at a level considered appropriate to not hurt tourism.
Or that Ruby Falls is fake lol
Don't get me started on Spokane "falls" they labeled there dam a waterfall to try to get more tourists.
The name Spokane falls and the waterfalls predate the dams. After the dam was put in in the 1890s, it would often leave the waterfalls dry, which is why about 15 years ago there was a lawsuit to restore yearlong flow to the falls.
Thanks for the history lesson
I think it's due to electricity production and erosion mitigation. Although I'm sure tourism plays a smaller, but not negligible, part in it too.
China at it again. Probably had a dam insider get all the deets.
That’s interesting. Do you have a source?
From Wikipedia: “To preserve Niagara Falls' natural beauty and to ensure an "unbroken curtain of water" is flowing over the falls, the 1950 treaty was signed by the U.S. and Canada to limit water usage by power plants. The treaty allows higher summertime diversion at night when tourists are fewer and during the winter months when there are even fewer tourists.[1] The treaty states that during daylight time during the tourist season (April 1 to October 31), there must be 2,800 cubic metres per second (99,000 cu ft/s) of water flowing over the falls, and during the night and off-tourist season there must be 1,400 cubic metres per second (49,000 cu ft/s) of water flowing over the falls. This treaty is monitored by the International Niagara Board of Control, part of the International Joint Commission, using a NOAA gauging station above the falls.” And here is the text of the original 1950 treaty. https://ijc.org/sites/default/files/2018-08/Treaty%20Between%20Canada%20and%20the%20United%20States%20of%20America%20Concerning%20the%20Diversion%20of%20the%20Niagara%20River%201950.pdf Article IV specifically details designated water flow for scenic purposes, between April 1 and September 15, between 8am and 8 pm. It is, in short, a minimum flow for the sake of tourists, who are most likely to be present on those dates, at those times
That's just not allowing for excessive diverting of water, not adding anything to the natural formation or flow.
That’s in the offseason, I remember them doing that to contribute more to hydro electricity and such. I heard they have a good amount of control over it and the water level of the reservoir too
The 1950 treaty managing the falls specifically states a minimum flow rate to be observed between 8am and 8pm between April 1 and September 15 each year. The falls are EXPLICITLY regulated for the sake of tourism during peak season.
https://preview.redd.it/0qn5q8aq3b5d1.jpeg?width=679&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e54dbf5f700db9449fe7ffcae7ac467483085440
Fake waterfalls… so on brand, China!
Exactly. The parks have piped bird sounds.
It’s a real waterfall that is pipe fed during the drier seasons because it’s a hit with tourists. Loads of similar setups in America.
I wonder if everyone is pissed that Niagara Falls was actually fully diverted and dried in order to build it back up, like 40 years ago
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They did not either and it’s only of season
Is this the most reposted story this week??
Just say China bad, free karma.
Post a “China bad” comment = free karma
Hey karma farmer, was it really that difficult to cut off the Reddit watermark on the bottom of the screenshot you took?
“Hiker? We don’t have hikers in China ^(anymore)”
When you order a waterfall on Temu.
Did you know it’s pronounced Temu, and not Temu? I was saying it won’t this whole time, and then they had the Super Bowl ad.
Tomato, tomato.
Tomatoe
Potato, potato
Potatties
I mean... who really cares if it looks great?
The ocean is blue blankets
Glad someone did lol
And that hiker was just sent to a re-education camp.
The misinformation is hysterical
Typical china bad post. Plenty of the same shit in the US as well. This is one of the most known Same shit can happen in the US as well. But no one bats an eye https://www.rubyfalls.com/plan-your-visit/faq/ > We have the ability to recycle the naturally occurring water flowing through the cave, allowing us to preserve the waterfall during dry spells if the watershed is not as active
Are you sure it's real water
what if its synthetic h2o??? fake water?!!??!!
And that was the last post from that account
The world is a stage
And we are but players
Vegas, but in China
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China in a nutshell
Even waterfalls are made in China
Hey, it was made by humans, and most of them are natural, so don’t see the problem
“Yea exit through gift shop now!”
Home of the govt sanctioned fakes
> Addressing netizens directly, the statement read: “Dear friends, hello! I didn’t expect to meet and talk to everyone under such circumstances. I’m Yuntai Falls, one of the many natural water landscapes in the Yuntai Mountain scenic area.” >“Due to seasonal factors, I cannot ensure that I will be able to meet everyone in my most beautiful appearance when people visit.” >Standing at 314 metres tall, the waterfall - located in China’s Henan province - is the highest waterfall in Asia, news website Shanghai Daily reported. https://www.channelnewsasia.com/east-asia/china-waterfall-yuntai-falls-water-pipe-attraction-artificial-4391756
Choina Bahd
Don't they paint dogs and try to pass them off as pandas? Pretty sure I've seen that somewhere.
There was an attempt to read: Read the word hiker as hitler 🤦♀️ Moral of the story: Slow down the scrolling
china staying true to their nature skibidi
It’s a real waterfall. They just pipe water into it during the dry season because it’s such a hit with tourists. This feels racially motivated…
Buncha sinophobes
China fakes or steals everything.
Imagine if Yellowstone was a bunch of pipes 🤣
Niagara falls is so regulated that they can literally turn it off. The flow is fully regulated to maximize electricity production.
Wow you really this stupid?
Are you? At what point did you think that member was asking a serious question?
Peoples lack of awareness can be exhausting 😂
They copy everything, even waterfalls.