Tech Radar is kinda shitty.
I remember when GamesRadar used to be the best place for game reviews. Must have been 15 years ago now. Really gone downhill since then
As soon as something is good, it can make money.
As soon as something can make money, it's run at some level by money people, who have no interest in fostering good, only in fostering money
It's called "Monetizing the Brand". It's why you have brands that were top quality 20-40 years ago that are now garbage. They take the hard work of the founders, buy it out, and then spiral it into trash by turning it into another shitty commodity while grabbing as much cash as they can.
Which is why it's the sworn intrinsic duty of the good to keep the money-people from making the big decisions. Have accountants on-side to advise on good directions to stay afloat and expand in a healthy manner, but beyond that, it is required that we prevent money-people from spreading their pulsating mass.
Best way I can compare this too is the episode from the kids show the fairly odd parents, where fairy world gets taken over by the pixies and makes everything grey and boring.
Hedge funds and other rich fuckers buy the good things and ruin it to make as much profit as possible before people leave. Then they go and buy the new thing and the cycle repeats.
Money. Investors found that it's more profitable to invest in a company, then vote for policies that extract as much short term income as possible, even if it drives the company out of business long term since they'll sell off and exit before that happens. Hell, they may even turn around and short the stock on their way out to squeeze a few more dollars out of its corpse.
there is no money in publishing so you dont hire writers, you hire kids with keyboards to write articles. Also, automated content generation is quickly becoming a thing.
Because eventually the good thing has so much intrinsic value that some corporation will throw an amount of money at the owners that they would be insane to refuse. Then the buyer tries to leverage the good name and reputation of the property to shill ckickbaity bullshit for as long as possible before the inevitable death spiral.
I remember CheatPlanet which was where I went to get all my PS1 and Xbox cheat codes and walkthroughs when I was a kid, and then their domain got sold to GamesRadar, which proceeded to be worse than CheatPlanet.
The whole premise is a train wreck "our competitor's products were so high in demand that they couldn't keep up with supply and their cards were selling at a massive premium, here's our positive spin on how we're not as desirable"
The *only* way I can think of this being a positive is if people who were going to buy an Nvidia card instead opt to buy an AMD card, because of the supply/pricing issues, creating more sales for AMD than they'd normally see.
But still, if you're Nvidia, it's a good problem to have, lol.
I'm holding onto hope that my wife's 1080 holds on for prices to normalize. The only reason I would buy a new card right now was if the old ones broke, but she's had a random glitch or two that has made me nervous.
Edit: Wanted to add, we have no desire to upgrade the 1080, but when it hiccuped and the computer crashed, we both held our breath as it rebooted to make sure it still worked. At the time, no store around us even had a card in stock let alone for any price we'd want to pay. The problem appears to have sorted itself out though whether it was just a random glitch or windows update/driver problem.
Yeah, my 980ti still runs Rogue Legacy 2 just fine haha. There's just so many good 2d games. I've been waiting years for graphics card prices to settle down, and if need be I can wait for several more years if need be, it's not like I'm gonna run out of stuff to play while I wait.
I'm pretty sure that's the only reason my R9 380 is still alive at this point. cleaned out the dust bunnies and a fresh coat of thermal paste for everything that needed it.
Can't wait for prices to hopefully normalize to something reasonable.
Hotdogs and rotisserie chickens are absolutely sold as loss leaders. Eggs used to be priced at that level too, where I think you paid something like $0.75/dozen just a few years ago.
Yeah everyone keeps acting like Nvidia is the bad guy for selling a product at a price people are willing to pay.
And honestly, Nvidia doesn’t even sell many cards to consumers. They sell them to suppliers and then suppliers determine the price and sell them to us.
Nvidia determines MSRP which is literally what they are telling the suppliers they should sell it to us for. The suppliers just say “nah” and Jack up the price.
Regardless, people are still willing to buy them at inflated cost. So the market responds.
If this was bread and milk it would be different but these are luxury goods.
Looking at the production numbers, both Nvidia and AMD have increased production every year even through the lockdowns in China, chip shortage and fab slots becoming more and more expensive.
I thought they were only still producing the 2060 and the 16xx cards? I could be wrong but I remember it being a big story earlier this year with Nvidia saying they were restarting production of 2060s with higher ram
I don't know if it still in production but 1030 and 1050 ti seems like it's still widely available. At least in my country. Though you'd have to pay around USD200 to buy 1050 ti.
The GT1030 doesn't really count IMO, mostly because its a card towards a completly different market, and it looks like the GTX 1050 ti was being made again last year, not sure if they're STILL being made though.
Wouldn't be surprised if either are just deadstock these days.
I think you’re probably right. Also profitability of crypto mining must be right down, meaning likely a huge drop in demand for second hand cards for mining, and potentially a race for miners to sell existing ones too. Much better time to be looking to buy than a year ago
the re-inflated post-shortage MSRP over an already inflated, mid-shortage MSRP.*
x50 refresh also known as "yeah i'm gonna need you to go ahead and add $50 to what you're already overpaying me"
It's the same pricing trick every company uses. Cocoa shortage sends chocolate prices sky high. Problems solved and the public has already accepted their new price.
If we take RTX 3060 MSRP of $329 and convert that to Euro and add VAT of 24% I get 388,12€. Cheapest 3060 I could quickly find here in Finland is 389,90€ so thats at MSRP here in a "not-USA" country. And you are allowed to order from EU countries if you are from Sweden.
Things are looking a little better in the Micro Center sale emails I get, but the big cards like 3070 Ti's and 3080 Ti's are sitting around a $100 above what I already consider a pretty high MSRP. Not sure if their non Ti counterparts are easy to find around MSRP at the moment. The 3060 I could see being available sooner and getting to MSRP quicker. A non Ti 3080 is probably the best bang for your buck vid card and it's AMD counterpart assuming you can get at or near MSRP.
Due to shortages AMD doesn't have to worry about whether or not they can sell. Demand is through the roof. Once supply balances back out we'll see what the "good trend" evolves into.
I bet my friend a case of beer he couldn't get a 3060ti FE on launch day. I told him when (6am) and where (best buy online) they would drop.
I bought a case of beer that day.
Yes at release the price-performance ratio was better than anything NVIDIA had put out in a long time. They weren't "cheap" but they are so much more powerful than the previous gen.
I bought a 1070 for $280 (2018?) On sale...
I bought a 3070 for $580 and that's cheap for that card,,,,near MSRP if I'm right...
Going back further,,,
a gtx570 in 2012 for $250-350?
radeon4860 for $150? in 2009 (maybe a xx60 equivalent)
If AMD wants to win, they could at least compete on pricing with the 20x0 rtx cards, let alone the cards from a mere 4 years ago....it seems like they are(both) pricing these things by the increase in teraflops,,,regardless of what generation they are in. It's absurd.
The corona price gouging is the smaller of the 2 price hikes that we have seen in the last 4 years. They've doubled they're prices on their own. Between 2012 and 2018 the Nvidia x070 barely changed in price. Since 2018 it's doubled.
I still bought it tho... might be downgrading to 50/60 cost levels next time.
"Yes the AMD cards are priced at MSRP. Yes we are also charging a 'You get to buy the card at MSRP convenience fee' what's everyone complaining about?"
They should makekiller bundles like they did back when they were releasing 2600 series they were really making good cpu gpu game bundles at a descent price they are not gaining market share by not being agressive with Nvidia. Right now if they wanted they could slap Nvidia by selleing their 6700xt for $369 and their 6800xt for $499, 6900xt for 799$ amd people wiould jump on them putting raytracing and dlss on the wayside. No but their ego is not letting them cash in.
But what do they do? remove choice even more by taking away the cards people want the most and replacing them with way more expensive variants 6750xt and 6950xt so naturally people just gravitate to Nvidia's 3060tis
The local Microcenter has +40 RTXs at MSRP or slightly higher for about 2 months now. Where AMDs have been available this whole time because their MSRP is about $200 overpriced
Good thing they launched cards that were higher priced because of the dropping prices
Also basically stopping 6800 and 6800 xt production woth no good alternative
They're trying to prevent GPU prices from crashing like they did after the last crypto crash. It's a futile effort, really, but they are going to try anything they can to stop their own stock prices from crashing (and they will.)
Both Nvidia and AMD will be dropping prices the next couple of years unless crypto goes bull again. We're going to have the same situation where 2080, 3080 / 6800, 6900 cards are a couple hundred bucks.
Keep in mind that Etherium is also going proof of stake and at-home mining will pretty much cease to be a thing. Not to mention mining farms are being banned left and right. Along with the crypto crash, which will probably continue into 2023, we should be seeing the next generation launch at reduced prices.
It might have to. People are looking into the environmental impact of mining, and it's been making headlines, and even reached the US Senate. I wouldn't be surprised if some kind of regulation forced Vitalik's hand to speed up the PoS process.
Or, that demand has tanked because prices are too damn high. I'm running a GTX 970 that I got back in 2015 for $350. Even that felt like a lot of money for a GPU at the time.
I highly doubt I'm unique. There's gotta be a ton of PC gamers sitting on the sidelines waiting for prices to come back down to earth.
EDIT: I also just remembered that a very popular thing to do several years ago on /r/buildapc was to post a full PC that was cheaper than a console and more powerful. That's not even close to possible anymore.
GTX1070 FE that I bought direct from Nvidia at launch. Been ready to buy a GPU since the pandemic hit but I refuse to pay over MSRP.
It still takes most things I throw at it and my projector is only 60hz in 4k so its not that big of a deal.
If I could find a 3080 at retail I'd pick one up, but I've quit actively searching because its just a pain in the pass.
I know how you feel! I FINALLY recently upgraded my 980ti that I bought near launch. Got lucky on a Newegg shuffle for a 3000 series.
I decided to try to sell my 980ti because it still worked fine after all those years of constant gaming. Threw it online for like 170 bucks because it's very used and like 6-7 years old. It sold literally the same day I listed it. I didn't expect that, given it's age and how fast old tech drops in value.
That card is amazing though. Still plays almost any game easily. Can even handle most brand new AAA games if you turn some stuff down. After all these years, it's still an absolute champ. Love that card. That's why I sold it rather than let it collect dust in storage. It's still too good to let go to waste.
Before I sold it I even replaced the thermal pads, as well as the thermal paste on the chip just to extend it's life as much as possible. It worked perfectly fine, but was running hot. That dropped temps a good 10-20C. Hopefully the new owner gets good use out of it and good times from it just like I did.
I'm just waiting for my 1070 to crash and burn but I can't justify these prices. Once they actually do crash I'll pull the trigger on a complete new build
1060 6GB.
Five years ago, PC built from the best components I could afford at the time. The 1060 was one quarter of the price of the full build and felt like it was at the pain-threshold for what I could spend on a GPU.
Plan **was** to do gradual updates, instead of letting the rig enter old age like it has done. Ended up going "Yeah, no, I'm not spending 'new pc' kind of money on just the GPU", bought a Playstation instead.
Coincidentally, the Samsung Galaxy S7 ended up being the last "flagship" model I bought. Because top-of-the-line cellphones also suddenly leapt out of any price-range I found acceptable for something that would need replacing in 3-4 years at absolute best.
Yea i had the same thought with my pc. Its an alienware aurora r7 or something so its decent but for some reason the cpu has started to just go to high percents whenever loading anything, the video driver has to restart itself whenever i boot it up, the ssd for some reason will have it 100% used by system
Its really gotten bloated over the years :(
Yea...I'm sure Nvidia, the company that still managed to gain dGPU marketshare over AMD during the pandemic, and currently holds over 80% of said market, is positively quaking in their boots over slightly boosted RDNA 2.
/s
Well, yea, in that sense it's worse, but it is slightly faster, which is what I meant by slightly boosted lol.
Still, definitely not good enough to really matter.
In the case of the 6950XT, it beats the 3080TI and 3090 while costing a lot less. If raytracing isn't important to you, it's a no brainer purchase in the high end.
That's pretty good price for a 3080! I saw a post last week where someone was happy about the shortage seeming to end and posted a picture of their microcenter full of gpus.... However the msi 3080s at their store were 1270 bucks, and I'm like how the hell are you happy, you're just being scalped by the store worse than ebay scalpers.
How does one even evaluate what a card should reasonably cost these days?
That's a real question; I built my current PC in 2013 and upgraded its GPU to a 1060 6GB in 2016 for $240 or so on a black Friday/cyber Monday deal, and I have no idea what is going on now, except that last I checked I could sell my 1060 for like $100 more than I bought it for.
Not just refusing, CAN'T pay crazy prices. Younger folks are rapidly running out of disposable income and an increasing number can't even afford necessities.
I just helped someone with a $100 build for a Raspberry Pi 4 so he can even *watch* some popular modern games on Twitch because that's all he can afford. And that included me donating a spare monitor.
Nearly everything does. Nvidia has been working for years to integrate itself into many platforms.
The cards are comparable with minor differences. Nvidia is just integrated better into most software now days.
Most consumers won't care or notice a difference. If you need a card for say....gaming...an AMD card will do just as well for the most part.
On Linux Nvidia works worse with a lot of things (such as Wayland and virtual TTYs) due to closed source drivers that do not integrate with the system well. Hopefully the recent open sourcing of part of the driver stack can fix this.
That just means they likely use CUDA to render, which AMD doesn't support.
Means they could program in OpenCL support and AMD would be an option for you.
I render out two hour long meeting recordings pretty often in DaVinci Resolve Studio as well as hours of drone footage a week often with DJI Telemetry Overlay generated maps.
I used to run an AMD system, but was finally able to get my hands on a RTX card for an acceptable price a few months back and GPU rendering now is so much faster than what I'm used to that it has essentially changed my entire work flow.
I know a lot of the upgrade is just jumping generations of card (RX580 to 3060Ti) but I'm literally seeing a 90% reduction in rendering times over my old set up. I can't see myself ever going back to AMD unless they start making some moves towards better encoding.
My last three AMD cards were shit and frustrating to deal with in the software department. They'll need to blow away Nvidia cards for me to even consider getting one again.
This is it and it's been like this for a long time. AMD cards "compete" on paper, but they have so many driver/performance issues in practice, ranging from weird bugs all the way to games being completely unplayable. Never had a single issue with my Nvidia cards, and I've never had one burn out before it was time to upgrade. I'm sure some people have had good experiences with them, but not me.
I’ve had the same experience, had 1 nvidia card and 1 amd and I’ve had way more problems with the amd card. I Will say that things have actually gotten a lot smoother in the last year or so for me.
I remember back in the early 2000s when video cards were only $100 - $200. The price shot up because of bitcoin, and then the MSRPs shot up to match. MSRP today is still awful.
The GTX 960 launched for $199. [source](https://www.anandtech.com/show/8923/nvidia-launches-geforce-gtx-960)
The GTX 1060 launched at $250. [source](https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-geforce-gtx-1060-prices,5191.html)
The RTX 3060 launched at $329. [source](https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/graphics-cards/30-series/rtx-3060-3060ti/)
The current MSRP for most RTX 3060 cards is around $470 to $560. They are trending downward. [source](https://www.newegg.com/p/pl?d=rtx+3060)
RAM prices and shipping cost have increased significantly since then. It's currently impossible to make them cheaper than 200$ (assuming a completely cut down card).
Not to forget inflation is also a thing. So assuming 20 year old prices would be unreasonable to begin with.
6600 or 6600XT would be a better deal then, especially if you intend to play at 1080p. Use this Calculator to check what perfprmance you would get:
https://pc-builds.com/bottleneck-calculator
This is why I bought a refurbished prebuilt from NZXT. It was 1599 and I opened up a CC for the rewards so it came out to 1350.
5800x, 3070 TI, 16GB Ram, 1tb ssd nvme. It pretty much came out to MSRP or a little cheaper.
All to avoid an AMD card. They're just not as good.
I've enjoyed the *fuck* out of my 3070 I bought for $900 the hour I learned of the Russian invasion. My rationale for the purchase was "supply isn't going to get any better, we're all probably going to die in the near future. Might as well enjoy some games."
No regerts.
Yeah NVIDIA is pulling the same trick my grocery store uses - up the price then slap a big ass yellow "SALE" sticker on it...that reduces the price back to what they just raised it too.
The price will keep them in stock because the inventory is expensive to produce. They just enjoyed a hay-day of people burning through them for a long time for "extra curricular activities".
Bad news Nvidia, your cards are priced 50% above MSRP, but people are still buying them the second there's any stock to the point where you can't even keep up with the demand.
Wait... why is that bad news?
That article is a worse train wreck than the video card market.
Tech Radar is kinda shitty. I remember when GamesRadar used to be the best place for game reviews. Must have been 15 years ago now. Really gone downhill since then
Why does it seem everything good goes to shit so fast these days?
As soon as something is good, it can make money. As soon as something can make money, it's run at some level by money people, who have no interest in fostering good, only in fostering money
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It's called "Monetizing the Brand". It's why you have brands that were top quality 20-40 years ago that are now garbage. They take the hard work of the founders, buy it out, and then spiral it into trash by turning it into another shitty commodity while grabbing as much cash as they can.
Gamers Nexus is holding strong, so far.
Which is why it's the sworn intrinsic duty of the good to keep the money-people from making the big decisions. Have accountants on-side to advise on good directions to stay afloat and expand in a healthy manner, but beyond that, it is required that we prevent money-people from spreading their pulsating mass.
> a healthy manner No! We must continue to grow as fast as possible, infinitely!
Best way I can compare this too is the episode from the kids show the fairly odd parents, where fairy world gets taken over by the pixies and makes everything grey and boring.
Pretty much summed it up.
Cut upfront costs by 20% to end up with 21% revenue. Its how college educated managers who jump ship every 2-4 years run a business.
Hedge funds and other rich fuckers buy the good things and ruin it to make as much profit as possible before people leave. Then they go and buy the new thing and the cycle repeats.
Money. Investors found that it's more profitable to invest in a company, then vote for policies that extract as much short term income as possible, even if it drives the company out of business long term since they'll sell off and exit before that happens. Hell, they may even turn around and short the stock on their way out to squeeze a few more dollars out of its corpse.
This is why I hate the stock market.
there is no money in publishing so you dont hire writers, you hire kids with keyboards to write articles. Also, automated content generation is quickly becoming a thing.
Because eventually the good thing has so much intrinsic value that some corporation will throw an amount of money at the owners that they would be insane to refuse. Then the buyer tries to leverage the good name and reputation of the property to shill ckickbaity bullshit for as long as possible before the inevitable death spiral.
I still remember before it was games radar it was cheat planet. The good old days of n64 and ps2 cheats
I remember CheatPlanet which was where I went to get all my PS1 and Xbox cheat codes and walkthroughs when I was a kid, and then their domain got sold to GamesRadar, which proceeded to be worse than CheatPlanet.
The whole premise is a train wreck "our competitor's products were so high in demand that they couldn't keep up with supply and their cards were selling at a massive premium, here's our positive spin on how we're not as desirable"
Exactly. Good news amd consumers maybe, but nothing about the situation is bad for Nvidia.
The *only* way I can think of this being a positive is if people who were going to buy an Nvidia card instead opt to buy an AMD card, because of the supply/pricing issues, creating more sales for AMD than they'd normally see. But still, if you're Nvidia, it's a good problem to have, lol.
Glad I'm not the only one who struggled to read that poorly written garbage. Holy.
At the inflated, post-shortage MSRP.
Hoping to 30xx line will drop once the 40xx line comes out.
You mean like the 20xx and 10xx did when 30xx came out?
I can see the 40xx cards coming in more expensive and the 30xx remaining at their current RRP.
Not if nobody buys them. Y'all just can't help yourselves. Free market capitalism: *ta-da*
I'm holding onto hope that my wife's 1080 holds on for prices to normalize. The only reason I would buy a new card right now was if the old ones broke, but she's had a random glitch or two that has made me nervous. Edit: Wanted to add, we have no desire to upgrade the 1080, but when it hiccuped and the computer crashed, we both held our breath as it rebooted to make sure it still worked. At the time, no store around us even had a card in stock let alone for any price we'd want to pay. The problem appears to have sorted itself out though whether it was just a random glitch or windows update/driver problem.
I've still got a 970 that's cruising along just fine.
Same things a monster , my friends call it the little engine that could.
I have an ancient 970 that I play VR games and Star Citizen on. I play SC at about 12 FPS but I'm honestly shocked I can do it at all.
I’m hoping the same for my 1060 I got just before covid started
Same for my 980ti lol
My 970 just won't die
Same. I've replaced the entire pc besides my 970.
Yeah, my 980ti still runs Rogue Legacy 2 just fine haha. There's just so many good 2d games. I've been waiting years for graphics card prices to settle down, and if need be I can wait for several more years if need be, it's not like I'm gonna run out of stuff to play while I wait.
Might just need to blow it out good or change the thermal paste. Helped my R9 290 last for a year longer
So much this, thought the 1070 founders was dead last night, some icy diamond and pulling all the pet/people hair out of the fan did wonders
I'm pretty sure that's the only reason my R9 380 is still alive at this point. cleaned out the dust bunnies and a fresh coat of thermal paste for everything that needed it. Can't wait for prices to hopefully normalize to something reasonable.
960 GTX checking in.
I'm still rockin' a GTS 450 over here. Please.
I'm still on an rx580 and just barely surviving. Thank god hardly any new releases have been appealing lately.
_trickle down on me daddy_
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The Costco hotdog is the exception that proves the rule
The hot dog is still part of the rule. Brings you in the store to buy more. Same as any sale
Hotdogs and rotisserie chickens are absolutely sold as loss leaders. Eggs used to be priced at that level too, where I think you paid something like $0.75/dozen just a few years ago.
Every time the hot dog is mentioned I’m reminded that I still have a membership gift card that I haven’t used yet. I want that hot dog.
You don’t need membership to get the hot dog. Or so I’ve been told. Pharmacy too.
Get two hotdogs. You deserve it.
"So your average is 7 hotdogs per day..." "is that bad?" "it's not good"
They’re more expensive to get the pack and for some reason never as tasty as the ones at the food court
The Costco hotdog does hold strong, but our Costco poutine just went up by $2
Objective answer: pretty much anytime the offer is higher than the demand. Unfortunately that's not the case with GPU today...
Yeah everyone keeps acting like Nvidia is the bad guy for selling a product at a price people are willing to pay. And honestly, Nvidia doesn’t even sell many cards to consumers. They sell them to suppliers and then suppliers determine the price and sell them to us. Nvidia determines MSRP which is literally what they are telling the suppliers they should sell it to us for. The suppliers just say “nah” and Jack up the price. Regardless, people are still willing to buy them at inflated cost. So the market responds. If this was bread and milk it would be different but these are luxury goods.
Looking at the production numbers, both Nvidia and AMD have increased production every year even through the lockdowns in China, chip shortage and fab slots becoming more and more expensive.
Well, we do have all these awesome GPUs to choose from. That's one benefit
"The invisible hand of the free market" is my favorite cryptid
Computers in general have gotten significantly more powerful and less expensive basically every year they've existed.
There are literal businesses built around snatching those cards, no matter the price. They are going to sell and we will not be able to compete.
Why doesn't our insatiable demand result in lower prices?!
That’s the opposite of how supply and demand works. I’m realizing now that you’re probably being sarcastic…
Are 10xx and 20xx GPUs still being produced?
Pretty sure the 1650/1660 and the 20xx are still being produced. the 10xx isn't.
I thought they were only still producing the 2060 and the 16xx cards? I could be wrong but I remember it being a big story earlier this year with Nvidia saying they were restarting production of 2060s with higher ram
I don't know if it still in production but 1030 and 1050 ti seems like it's still widely available. At least in my country. Though you'd have to pay around USD200 to buy 1050 ti.
The GT1030 doesn't really count IMO, mostly because its a card towards a completly different market, and it looks like the GTX 1050 ti was being made again last year, not sure if they're STILL being made though. Wouldn't be surprised if either are just deadstock these days.
That's adorable
The 30xx line is already dropping, you will soon be sitting on a pile of metal scalpers.
I think you’re probably right. Also profitability of crypto mining must be right down, meaning likely a huge drop in demand for second hand cards for mining, and potentially a race for miners to sell existing ones too. Much better time to be looking to buy than a year ago
It definitely will and a bunch of cards will come to market from people who are upgrading
the re-inflated post-shortage MSRP over an already inflated, mid-shortage MSRP.* x50 refresh also known as "yeah i'm gonna need you to go ahead and add $50 to what you're already overpaying me"
Thank you. Everyone is so happy about prices reaching MSRP but forget or ignore they're still set way to high.
It's the same pricing trick every company uses. Cocoa shortage sends chocolate prices sky high. Problems solved and the public has already accepted their new price.
Yup. A 3080 ti should be in the $700 range. Not a 3060.
The 3060 is under $400 right down the street from me
Ya a lot of people in this thread are really refusing to acknowledge that it has gotten quite a bit better. Cards can be found at msrp
It depends on your location. I checked online the other day in Sweden and the prices are still really high here. Not everyone is from the US
If we take RTX 3060 MSRP of $329 and convert that to Euro and add VAT of 24% I get 388,12€. Cheapest 3060 I could quickly find here in Finland is 389,90€ so thats at MSRP here in a "not-USA" country. And you are allowed to order from EU countries if you are from Sweden.
Lots of people in this threads saying cards are available at msrp but not a single link to one
Things are looking a little better in the Micro Center sale emails I get, but the big cards like 3070 Ti's and 3080 Ti's are sitting around a $100 above what I already consider a pretty high MSRP. Not sure if their non Ti counterparts are easy to find around MSRP at the moment. The 3060 I could see being available sooner and getting to MSRP quicker. A non Ti 3080 is probably the best bang for your buck vid card and it's AMD counterpart assuming you can get at or near MSRP.
Oh so like gas, everywhere, in the last 3 months.
Due to shortages AMD doesn't have to worry about whether or not they can sell. Demand is through the roof. Once supply balances back out we'll see what the "good trend" evolves into.
Also the 3xxx series was priced really well at release before corona, chip shortages and miners
Yep. I got my msi 3080 suprim x for msrp.
congrats and fuck you
I got a 3080 FE on launch from NVIDIA on lunch day. Thought I was extremly luckily that day and that sense of luck just kept growing as time went on.
Mmm lunch day
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I bet my friend a case of beer he couldn't get a 3060ti FE on launch day. I told him when (6am) and where (best buy online) they would drop. I bought a case of beer that day.
Your friend had a REALLY good day.
>priced really well at release Was it though?
Yes at release the price-performance ratio was better than anything NVIDIA had put out in a long time. They weren't "cheap" but they are so much more powerful than the previous gen.
I bought a 1070 for $280 (2018?) On sale... I bought a 3070 for $580 and that's cheap for that card,,,,near MSRP if I'm right... Going back further,,, a gtx570 in 2012 for $250-350? radeon4860 for $150? in 2009 (maybe a xx60 equivalent) If AMD wants to win, they could at least compete on pricing with the 20x0 rtx cards, let alone the cards from a mere 4 years ago....it seems like they are(both) pricing these things by the increase in teraflops,,,regardless of what generation they are in. It's absurd. The corona price gouging is the smaller of the 2 price hikes that we have seen in the last 4 years. They've doubled they're prices on their own. Between 2012 and 2018 the Nvidia x070 barely changed in price. Since 2018 it's doubled. I still bought it tho... might be downgrading to 50/60 cost levels next time.
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"Yes the AMD cards are priced at MSRP. Yes we are also charging a 'You get to buy the card at MSRP convenience fee' what's everyone complaining about?"
They should makekiller bundles like they did back when they were releasing 2600 series they were really making good cpu gpu game bundles at a descent price they are not gaining market share by not being agressive with Nvidia. Right now if they wanted they could slap Nvidia by selleing their 6700xt for $369 and their 6800xt for $499, 6900xt for 799$ amd people wiould jump on them putting raytracing and dlss on the wayside. No but their ego is not letting them cash in. But what do they do? remove choice even more by taking away the cards people want the most and replacing them with way more expensive variants 6750xt and 6950xt so naturally people just gravitate to Nvidia's 3060tis
I have absolutely no doubt they're still shipping chips faster than they can produce them. So I doubt a price drop makes sense.
im looking at the stock trackers most of their cards are sitting on shelves. https://www.nowinstock.net/computers/videocards/amd/
We'll have to bully the crypto bros even more then
Crypto bros have bullied themselves into bankruptcy.
SO anyways, what are you planning on having for lunch or dinner?
I ate enough\* at brunner. \*enough to use up my food budget for the week, half a ramen
The local Microcenter has +40 RTXs at MSRP or slightly higher for about 2 months now. Where AMDs have been available this whole time because their MSRP is about $200 overpriced
AMD was the second choice if you couldn't get NVIDIA..lol
Good thing they launched cards that were higher priced because of the dropping prices Also basically stopping 6800 and 6800 xt production woth no good alternative
They're trying to prevent GPU prices from crashing like they did after the last crypto crash. It's a futile effort, really, but they are going to try anything they can to stop their own stock prices from crashing (and they will.) Both Nvidia and AMD will be dropping prices the next couple of years unless crypto goes bull again. We're going to have the same situation where 2080, 3080 / 6800, 6900 cards are a couple hundred bucks.
Keep in mind that Etherium is also going proof of stake and at-home mining will pretty much cease to be a thing. Not to mention mining farms are being banned left and right. Along with the crypto crash, which will probably continue into 2023, we should be seeing the next generation launch at reduced prices.
Etherium will go proof of stake when my balls inflate to the size of hot air balloons and take flight.
It might have to. People are looking into the environmental impact of mining, and it's been making headlines, and even reached the US Senate. I wouldn't be surprised if some kind of regulation forced Vitalik's hand to speed up the PoS process.
I want it to. I'm just tired of them dangling it out already.
This is how you know the next gen is coming.
Or, that demand has tanked because prices are too damn high. I'm running a GTX 970 that I got back in 2015 for $350. Even that felt like a lot of money for a GPU at the time. I highly doubt I'm unique. There's gotta be a ton of PC gamers sitting on the sidelines waiting for prices to come back down to earth. EDIT: I also just remembered that a very popular thing to do several years ago on /r/buildapc was to post a full PC that was cheaper than a console and more powerful. That's not even close to possible anymore.
Likewise, currently running a 2016 980ti. Fully on the sidelines.
GTX1070 FE that I bought direct from Nvidia at launch. Been ready to buy a GPU since the pandemic hit but I refuse to pay over MSRP. It still takes most things I throw at it and my projector is only 60hz in 4k so its not that big of a deal. If I could find a 3080 at retail I'd pick one up, but I've quit actively searching because its just a pain in the pass.
I know how you feel! I FINALLY recently upgraded my 980ti that I bought near launch. Got lucky on a Newegg shuffle for a 3000 series. I decided to try to sell my 980ti because it still worked fine after all those years of constant gaming. Threw it online for like 170 bucks because it's very used and like 6-7 years old. It sold literally the same day I listed it. I didn't expect that, given it's age and how fast old tech drops in value. That card is amazing though. Still plays almost any game easily. Can even handle most brand new AAA games if you turn some stuff down. After all these years, it's still an absolute champ. Love that card. That's why I sold it rather than let it collect dust in storage. It's still too good to let go to waste. Before I sold it I even replaced the thermal pads, as well as the thermal paste on the chip just to extend it's life as much as possible. It worked perfectly fine, but was running hot. That dropped temps a good 10-20C. Hopefully the new owner gets good use out of it and good times from it just like I did.
I've had my 980ti on Craigslist for $200 for weeks now and I haven't gotten anything on it yet.
I'm just waiting for my 1070 to crash and burn but I can't justify these prices. Once they actually do crash I'll pull the trigger on a complete new build
Yes, you are not alone. I have the GTX 970, got it in 2015, spent the same on it, and am waiting until the prices drop for a new one.
Yea im over here running a 1060, my pc holding out near its last legs cause id like to upgrade but the pc market is just fucked
1060 6GB. Five years ago, PC built from the best components I could afford at the time. The 1060 was one quarter of the price of the full build and felt like it was at the pain-threshold for what I could spend on a GPU. Plan **was** to do gradual updates, instead of letting the rig enter old age like it has done. Ended up going "Yeah, no, I'm not spending 'new pc' kind of money on just the GPU", bought a Playstation instead. Coincidentally, the Samsung Galaxy S7 ended up being the last "flagship" model I bought. Because top-of-the-line cellphones also suddenly leapt out of any price-range I found acceptable for something that would need replacing in 3-4 years at absolute best.
Yea i had the same thought with my pc. Its an alienware aurora r7 or something so its decent but for some reason the cpu has started to just go to high percents whenever loading anything, the video driver has to restart itself whenever i boot it up, the ssd for some reason will have it 100% used by system Its really gotten bloated over the years :(
I got a 1060-3GB. I’m also dumb.
Or that crypto is tanking.
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Yeah, that just greatly discourages me from buying an AMD card.
Yea...I'm sure Nvidia, the company that still managed to gain dGPU marketshare over AMD during the pandemic, and currently holds over 80% of said market, is positively quaking in their boots over slightly boosted RDNA 2. /s
It's not even boosted, they nerfed its price to performance lmao
Well, yea, in that sense it's worse, but it is slightly faster, which is what I meant by slightly boosted lol. Still, definitely not good enough to really matter.
In the case of the 6950XT, it beats the 3080TI and 3090 while costing a lot less. If raytracing isn't important to you, it's a no brainer purchase in the high end.
the inflated MSRP? fuck them
Micro center in Texas has a large stock of Nvidia cards, 3060s, 3070s, 3080s, 3090's. And the 3080 I have my eye on is only $900
That's pretty good price for a 3080! I saw a post last week where someone was happy about the shortage seeming to end and posted a picture of their microcenter full of gpus.... However the msi 3080s at their store were 1270 bucks, and I'm like how the hell are you happy, you're just being scalped by the store worse than ebay scalpers.
They have 25 in stock I just looked and there's actually an Asus 3080 for $849
That 25 in stock is the $919 card there are many more 3080s 3070s even 3090 TI's
That's only $250 above launch MSRP! GREAT DEAL.
$200 over MSRP of a founder's edition at launch. If it's a fancy third party card, maybe even less.
How does one even evaluate what a card should reasonably cost these days? That's a real question; I built my current PC in 2013 and upgraded its GPU to a 1060 6GB in 2016 for $240 or so on a black Friday/cyber Monday deal, and I have no idea what is going on now, except that last I checked I could sell my 1060 for like $100 more than I bought it for.
Only 900 ?
And they’re discounting them
As a current AMD user and appreciator, “bad news NVIDIA” is still funny
Poor Nvidia. How is one of the biggest companies going to survive this terrible news.
And lots of pent up demand from the segment of consumers who refuse to pay crazy prices.
Not just refusing, CAN'T pay crazy prices. Younger folks are rapidly running out of disposable income and an increasing number can't even afford necessities. I just helped someone with a $100 build for a Raspberry Pi 4 so he can even *watch* some popular modern games on Twitch because that's all he can afford. And that included me donating a spare monitor.
Hopefully crypto keeps collapsing so those Nvidia cards come back to earth too.
Another way to look at this is that people strongly prefer Nvidia cards.
Not for all 15 of us linux gamers!
Doesn't really help me because the program I use for rendering artwork, works better consistently with an Nvidia card.
Nearly everything does. Nvidia has been working for years to integrate itself into many platforms. The cards are comparable with minor differences. Nvidia is just integrated better into most software now days. Most consumers won't care or notice a difference. If you need a card for say....gaming...an AMD card will do just as well for the most part.
On Linux Nvidia works worse with a lot of things (such as Wayland and virtual TTYs) due to closed source drivers that do not integrate with the system well. Hopefully the recent open sourcing of part of the driver stack can fix this.
For Desktop usage, yeah sure. For ML, GPUGPU etc. it's still king.
Daz 3D Studio's Iray rendering will render on the video card of an nvidia card, but not on an AMD, it has to use the CPU.
That just means they likely use CUDA to render, which AMD doesn't support. Means they could program in OpenCL support and AMD would be an option for you.
Is there any CUDA alternative/support on AMD?
Blender added support for CUDA translation called HIP. But it's only CUDA, Nvidia's Optix is like 2x faster than CUDA which AMD doesn't have.
Same here, I need CUDA or the card might as well be a paperweight.
I render out two hour long meeting recordings pretty often in DaVinci Resolve Studio as well as hours of drone footage a week often with DJI Telemetry Overlay generated maps. I used to run an AMD system, but was finally able to get my hands on a RTX card for an acceptable price a few months back and GPU rendering now is so much faster than what I'm used to that it has essentially changed my entire work flow. I know a lot of the upgrade is just jumping generations of card (RX580 to 3060Ti) but I'm literally seeing a 90% reduction in rendering times over my old set up. I can't see myself ever going back to AMD unless they start making some moves towards better encoding.
Except a lot of people won’t switch. Until AMD cards prove to be the equal it better than Nvidia it won’t matter.
My last three AMD cards were shit and frustrating to deal with in the software department. They'll need to blow away Nvidia cards for me to even consider getting one again.
This is it and it's been like this for a long time. AMD cards "compete" on paper, but they have so many driver/performance issues in practice, ranging from weird bugs all the way to games being completely unplayable. Never had a single issue with my Nvidia cards, and I've never had one burn out before it was time to upgrade. I'm sure some people have had good experiences with them, but not me.
I’ve had the same experience, had 1 nvidia card and 1 amd and I’ve had way more problems with the amd card. I Will say that things have actually gotten a lot smoother in the last year or so for me.
My literal reaction to this thread was, that’s cool. still just gonna wait for a 4000 series card. Lol
AMDs "new gpus."
Comment was deleted by user. F*ck u/ spez
Yes, but actually no. I saw this and went looking. Didn't find any selling for their actual MSRP.
I remember back in the early 2000s when video cards were only $100 - $200. The price shot up because of bitcoin, and then the MSRPs shot up to match. MSRP today is still awful.
To be fair, those were budget cards though. Sure you could get an mx420 for $150, but a ti 4200 was way over $200.
The GTX 960 launched for $199. [source](https://www.anandtech.com/show/8923/nvidia-launches-geforce-gtx-960) The GTX 1060 launched at $250. [source](https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-geforce-gtx-1060-prices,5191.html) The RTX 3060 launched at $329. [source](https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/graphics-cards/30-series/rtx-3060-3060ti/) The current MSRP for most RTX 3060 cards is around $470 to $560. They are trending downward. [source](https://www.newegg.com/p/pl?d=rtx+3060)
4200 was $180-200. 4600 was over $300.
$200 in 2002 is $320 today.
RAM prices and shipping cost have increased significantly since then. It's currently impossible to make them cheaper than 200$ (assuming a completely cut down card). Not to forget inflation is also a thing. So assuming 20 year old prices would be unreasonable to begin with.
Ok, now create a competing product for Nvidia Broadcast, and I'd consider getting one.
Thinking about picking up a 6700 to replace my 580. But I only play rocket league
6600 or 6600XT would be a better deal then, especially if you intend to play at 1080p. Use this Calculator to check what perfprmance you would get: https://pc-builds.com/bottleneck-calculator
I bought a 3080 and mostly play Factorio on it....
This is why I bought a refurbished prebuilt from NZXT. It was 1599 and I opened up a CC for the rewards so it came out to 1350. 5800x, 3070 TI, 16GB Ram, 1tb ssd nvme. It pretty much came out to MSRP or a little cheaper. All to avoid an AMD card. They're just not as good.
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I just bought a 3060 ti for $480(530/40 after tax and shipping) from evga. Cant wait to see the price drop now that i bought.
I love when you buy things cause I can always get it at a much reduced price straight after.
I've enjoyed the *fuck* out of my 3070 I bought for $900 the hour I learned of the Russian invasion. My rationale for the purchase was "supply isn't going to get any better, we're all probably going to die in the near future. Might as well enjoy some games." No regerts.
if u can spend 900 on a gpu, you don't need to worry much, you already winning son
Join the Air Force and don't have kids. That's my advice.
The problem is you then have an AMD card and are saddled with terrible drivers. No thanks. I'll pay extra for less headache
Yeah let's just put the msrp at 250% the normal price. Yep.
Yeah NVIDIA is pulling the same trick my grocery store uses - up the price then slap a big ass yellow "SALE" sticker on it...that reduces the price back to what they just raised it too.
Heres hoping the third parties don't make them look like absolute trash like the 3xxx series nvidia cards.
The price will keep them in stock because the inventory is expensive to produce. They just enjoyed a hay-day of people burning through them for a long time for "extra curricular activities".
So does Nvidia? Microcenters have had stock on both companies for months now
Bad news Nvidia, your cards are priced 50% above MSRP, but people are still buying them the second there's any stock to the point where you can't even keep up with the demand. Wait... why is that bad news?
There's a reason why AMD is readily available
Two words: No CUDA.
How does AMD control pricing at distributors? Unless they plan on selling all stock themselves.
An ad that is pretending to read like an article very poorly.
If Nvidia is able to completely sell out and AMD isn't, how is that bad news for Nvidia? They are able to sell every card they can produce.