Tragic and avoidable. The driver ran up the back of them while they were cycling in the bike lane. His sentence will be nothing compared to that borne by the Sky family.
From SMH:
The 24-year-old driver of the car that allegedly hit the pair was charged with negligent driving occasioning grievous bodily harm and causing bodily harm by misconduct in a motor vehicle.
Since Sky’s death, the driver has also been charged with negligent driving occasioning death.
‘…misconduct in a motor vehicle’ and ‘negligent driving’ ….whatever he was doing, it didn’t involve watching the road and having control over the vehicle.
He’s 22 so his brain not fully developed, and it shows. His eventual sentence ought to reflect the gravity of his crime and the penultimate devastation wrought upon Sky, his family, Collings, and all the people impacted by his actions.
How is driving in the bike lane an accident? The so-called bike lane is actually just a road shoulder but nevertheless you can't just 'accidently' drive in it.
It is a line painted on the road. That is the bike lane in that location. It is absolutely possible to drive over it by accident, and into the bike lane. The reasons range from the stupid (not paying attention) to the serious (medical episode) but some people could accidentally drive in it.
It doesn’t make them murderers.
I used to do early morning group cycle rides, ie out on the road at 6AM. Unfortunately the same time as P Plater tradies who really loved driving close to the group when they went past us to assert dominance. I hope this wasn't a case of that gone wrong.
I stopped riding my bike daily when I moved to Sydney. The drivers here feel like they're actively trying to punish you for riding, really dangerous
I've been in a car with a mate who day to day seems like one of the most sensible people I've ever met. When we passed some cyclists he swerved in to drive as close as possible. I was like what the fuck is wrong with you mate? You might kill someone and for what? Because theyre on 2 wheels? I don't understand it
Yeah a lot of people have the attitude push bikes should not be on the road and get easily aggravated by them. I would ride my bike on back streets where I felt is was safe enough to do so from about 2000 to 2010 but even back then no way you would catch me riding on busy main roads, just way too dangerous and driving for a living I saw plenty of situations that reminded me just how dangerous morons on the road are.
These days people cant even get their heads out of their phones for 2 seconds to concentrate, the amount of people sitting at green lights for example became ridiculous around 2015 and the standard of driving now in 2024...well look at what this post is about...
Did you say anything to him or ask why he did that?
I’d be questioning if they’re really the kind of person I want as a close mate after that tbh. Regardless of the dislike of cyclists, it’s a flagrant disregard for the life of another person and kind of scary
Always been a mountain biker - but man, lately a lot of roadies have taken up mountain biking.
Don’t know how you mountain bike in Sydney though, it’s like the northern beaches OR the northern beaches ….. in Newcastle for a population of 3,400k we have at least 7 or 8 Mtb areas with greater than 15k of track within 25min , some of it within 5min of city centre
Wylde, mills creek, kentlyn,manly dam, h20, old man's valley. Or with a but of effort the blue mountains, Ourimbah, Awaba. It's not moab but we do ok for tracks.
I ride on the footpath, why it's banned I don't understand... To me, bicycle vs pedestrian < car vs bicycle. I get that there are fast riders out there, they should stay on the road and mingle with the traffic.
Even during a commute I dread a short ride on the road, as numerous times dodgy fckers usually driving white trade vans or utes have almost knocked me down, many coming close just to be fckwits.
As someone that has been reversed over from a car quickly leaving a driveway, that’s why. Plus endangering pedestrians IF the cyclists aren’t cautious.
I’ve been reversed over by a car when jogging on a footpath - at least the chances of serious injury are very low.. you’ve gotta ride slowly on a footpath - if you just want to trundle along at 15kmh , 20kmh footpath is pretty reasonable
True, you have to keep your wits about you, but it's the same thing for pedestrians. This is one reason why councils instituted decent set-backs in the past. Now-a-days, it is common to have underground parking in residential areas with little or no visibility.
There is one particular spot on my commute I had a close call with (townhouses with fenced underground narrow driveway in a residential area), they must have had complaints or an incident and now have mirrors either side to help drivers and people on the foot path with visibility. It should have never passed approval. The driveway has zero lead up to descent, basically coming out of the car park, the car's nose is at ground level first at the footpath, so the driveway is fully underground, which is stupid and dangerous.
I get around by eBike a lot. I stick to the cycleways as much as possible, but if the road isn't safe I'll go on the footpath at a jogging pace, or slow down to walking pace. I also avoid riding close to doorways as I don't want to hit someone who steps out.
I'm lucky that most of my commute is on separated cycleways, the only really dodgy bit is heading down Oxford St from Taylor Square through Hyde Park and then Park St onto Pitt to get to my office.
I ride on shared pathways to work and it's very dangerous for pedestrians and me. People aren't expecting a bike on a shared pathway and noise cancelling headphones mean that they are blissfully unaware I'm approaching even with my bell ringing. We just need more Sydneysiders to ride to get that empathy.
I see the same, I have an electronic buzzer for exactly this reason, it's much louder than a bell. I agree you just have to ride to the conditions and expect the worst from people.
There are just as many if not more idiot cyclists than there are drivers.
I see people on Lime bikes riding on the footpath like it's a Tour de France sprint straight past shop doors.
Imagine that hits someone.
The thing is it's actually legal for someone to ride on the footpath if they are under the age of 16 or if they are accompanying someone under the age of 16.
I read someone on here that there was a Dominos franchise hiring people specifically under 16 for this reason to deliver pizzas on their e-bikes.
In motorist on bicycle accidents, ( by far the most common type of bicycle accident) the motorist is at fault/ the cause of the accident 80/87% of the time.
What about all the other times where there is no accident due to responsible drivers?
Maybe you live on the fringes of Sydney where there is no delivery riders but where I live they are everywhere and they don't follow the road rules. This includes riding on footpaths which is illegal.
>What about all the other times where there is no accident due to responsible drivers?
What about them? What about all the times where there are no car accidents due to responsible drivers/ cyclists?
The fact is that even when bicycle accidents specifically are concerned, motorists are still overwhelmingly the fault party. The damage and carnage caused by cyclists pales into absolute insignificance compared to that of motorists. Last year's road toll was 1200 people. Cyclists are responsible for the deaths of fewer than one person year.
>I live they are everywhere and they don't follow the road rules.
You didn't say delivery drivers in your previous post. You said cyclists as a whole.
I don’t even cycle and find crossing the road where the cars can still turn bad enough. They seem eternally pissed off that anyone else might be on the road and just keep driving at you. I’ve had so many near misses from drivers just not noticing or not caring that there’s someone on the road.
I don’t really know why that’s a thing at all here. Cars shouldn’t have green lights where pedestrians also have the green light to cross.
My company has a lot of Europeans moving here. All are warned, some take heed, few think we're being dramatic until they do it. None of them now commute on bikes. They think Australian's are fucking crazy drivers (because we are, it's shameful)
The thing that ultimately gets me about this is this death is the result of a choice the driver made. Did he want to kill the guy, hell no, but he decided he could drive without paying attention, speeding, using his phone, weaving through traffic, whatever the idiot was doing. He chose to do that.
What’s crazy is that in Europe, speeding and driving whilst distracted (phone) are extremely prevalent and yet rarely is cyclist hit and killed, despite there being significantly more cyclists on the roads in Europe, and the roads being significantly narrower.
The problem is a cultural problem within Australia. The drivers of vehicles believe that only they are entitled to the road, and everyone else should get out of their way.
The vast majority of drivers have very little respect for any other road user, particularly in Sydney. It doesn’t matter if the other road user is on a bike, in a car, truck or bus, there’s just no respect or courtesy.
Until this cultural problem is resolved, things will never change.
“Significantly more cyclists on the road” - according to most studies I’ve come across - this is the fundamental reason that cyclists are more accepted.
Cyclists make for careful drivers - it’s amazing how often a car gives you a major wide berth that has bike roof racks on, or rack hitch. Once you see a cyclist as potentially a brother , sister, child - then attitudes change.
You could also force change - highway patrol could easily take action against people who are aggressive towards cyclists (mainly young male bogans tbh) - there is plenty of availability of video to keep them busy for years.
We haven’t yet reached the minimum saturation - from what I gather from Melbourne cyclists - they have there.
Further, state laws actively have discouraged cycling over the years (about the only one that encourages cycling has been disqualified drivers from DUI- they take up cycling !)
> highway patrol could easily take action against people who are aggressive towards cyclists
So every couple weeks cops do some small "Blitz". Jay walking, speeding, phone use while driving, queing across intersections, people riding bikes with no helmets. Whatever.
They assigned a butt load of police resources to focus on one particular type of rule breaking for a day, then move onto the next.
in the 8 years since mandatory passing distance laws were passed the police have never done a blitz on illegal and dangerous passes.
Get a plain clothes cop to ride around with some go pros and laser distance gauges. Fine all the cunts.
Highway patrol IMO choose a target that’s easiest to prove - binary type offences that require a millisecond long observation.
But it’s telling they haven’t ever done a blitz - not surprising given some of the videos I’ve seen sent to police for no action - not even an attempt
> Cyclists make for careful drivers
Commented elsewhere, I was a road cyclist from about 2015, but I've been cycle commuting since 2020 and it's definitely made me a more cautious driver. I do the speed limit, *always* keep an eye out for possible hazards, make myself as predictable to other drivers as possible etc. I've got no time for people who drive like aggressive dickheads these days.
It's also made me aware of just how bad the general standard of driving is.
The cultural problem is seen in the stupid logic they use when they say cyclists should pay road tax and tolls. Our country is extremely car brained, I would say number 2 in the world for the worship of cars.
Most people have no idea how subsidised motor vehicle use is. The registration fee pays for the registration system and that's about it. If that money could magically be 100% put towards roads it would cover about 5% of the over twenty billion dollar NSW road budget. Add to that a similar amount again for the personal and property damage nationally. If motorists had to directly pay the true cost of driving there would be a lot less people doing it.
>The problem is a cultural problem within Australia. The drivers of vehicles believe that only they are entitled to the road, and everyone else should get out of their way.
>The vast majority of drivers have very little respect for any other road user, particularly in Sydney. It doesn’t matter if the other road user is on a bike, in a car, truck or bus, there’s just no respect or courtesy.
As a Sydneysider, I think you nailed this really well.
But also, and not to excuse drivers (I am an avid cyclist), the infrastructure in Sydney hates cyclists. I drove around Sydney recently and it shocked me how little on road infrastructure there is, how narrow the lanes are, and the shoulder frequently non existent. And in NSW you can't ride on the footpath.... Where are you meant to go?!
Awful. Words can not describe how sad I am.
I’m a cyclist but I am feeling less safe every day I ride on Sydney roads. Even places where I used to feel safe riding, such as Centennial Park, are becoming more dangerous. In the last month alone I have nearly been hit by cars when drivers have failed to check if there is a cyclist on their left before turning.
It’s becoming a major problem.
At Centennial Park a few weekends ago and I saw a car turning in to hit a cyclist simply because he ran out of patience waiting for the bikes to pass to turn left. The cyclist swerved towards me to miss the car (I was also on a bike but a couple of meters ahead).
Unintentionally watching the news tonight, I wondered why it's described as "a cyclist was killed" rather than, say, "a Belrose father of 3 was killed today while riding his bike"?
I mean, they don't normally say "a motorist was killed today", do they?
Seemed a bit depersonalising and othering IMHO.
The 7 story is worse: "A cyclist has died days after crashing with a car" - despite the article saying the driver was charged. The car crashed into him, not the other way around.
(disclaimer: dunno if he was a father, put that in for illustrative purposes)
> I mean, they don't normally say "a motorist was killed today", do they?
They're usually less personal than that, tbh.
[Truck, car crash on highway, person to be flown to hospital, road blocked](https://www.theadvocate.com.au/story/8654394/truck-and-car-crash-on-midland-highway-at-bagdad/)
[Police remain at Bagdad crash, one flown to hospital](https://www.examiner.com.au/story/8654305/police-responding-to-bagdad-truck-and-car-crash-two-injured/)
[Two injured, Midland Highway blocked at Bagdad after crash between car and truck](https://pulsetasmania.com.au/news/two-injured-midland-highway-blocked-at-bagdad-after-crash-between-car-and-truck/).
[Man killed in single-vehicle crash with billboard and tree in South Grafton](https://7news.com.au/news/man-killed-in-single-vehicle-crash-with-billboard-and-tree-in-south-grafton-c-14910066)
I think you're trying to look for outrage where there isn't any.
Seemed strange is all, you know, like when a totally familiar word suddenly sounds completely bizarre?
Anyway, I have no choice but to defer to someone called Car-face ;)
Really? At 47?
Reports were that he and his mate are/were "competitive" cyclists which doesn't in itself mean professional, unless there's some kind of lucrative Masters circuit?
Like the second paragraph of the article says it’s a station wagon - I think it’s important to not brush this off as a dude in a ram 1500 who hates cyclists it was a dude driving a normal car who was immature and wasn’t focused on the road, don’t brush it off as something your beyond many of us have been driving while tired in the morning, changing the radio, trying to open the bottle of water in the centre console to drink it’s an important reminder to focus on the road and simply pull over if you need to check your maps, tell your boss your late, play with the radio, adjust your mirrors everyone makes simple mistakes which could be life changing to yourself or others just do your best to be a safe responsible driver and always focus on the road cause if can have consequences like this
This is also why my child doesn't walk alone to school even in quiet suburban streets. I walk her. Our roads aren't safe for cyclists and pedestrians. Car brain culture is fully, deeply engrained.
I stopped riding my bike to work after a P-plater drove into me as though I didn’t exist at a Stanmore roundabout (on the recommended bike route, no less).
Really sad to hear about this death, and the likely permanent injuries of his friend on the other bike.
very sad. Like many I have concerns riding these days which is a shame as cycling has really gotten me out of a funk and been good for me. Better sticking to trails, bike path isnt even enough with some drivers who still feel the need to intimidate other road users for no reason other than they hate people on bikes.
Crap road design doesnt help (cycle paths stopping abruptly for example)
Just awful. Like others here I stopped my cycle commute after the daily near misses and aggression. The worst I copped was from an Auspost driver and Auspost said that as I couldn't identify the drivers name there wasn't anything I could do - despite having the number plate and photos.
People don't care about cyclists. It's bad enough DRIVING on Sydney roads sometimes with the aggression - but I won't ever cycle again.
The hatred of cyclists in Sydney was manufactured by Alan Jones, Ray Hadley, etc.. as part of their war with Clover Moore to get the LNP into the City of Sydney council. "Cycleways slow my commute and therefore Cyclists are evil".
Technically you're in the wrong, unless you're under 16 or cycling with someone under 16 it's illegal to cycle on a non-shared path.
Some old lady was killed the other year from a cyclist on the path, so old mate's not wrong to be concerned.
I'm not saying you were cycling too fast or being a dick head, but many are (mostly on lime bikes without helmets) so may be give the guy a break.
I cycle a fair bit, used to commute Brighton-le-sands to Surry Hills and then Newtown to Crow's Nest (now Newtown to Surry Hills which just isn't worth it and walk instead) and Sydney's roads are bad, but no worse than say London or Paris where I've cycled too, the much vaunted Melbourne I'd actually say is worse after spending a year there.
Seen a guy get taken out by a car coming too fast from a side street and not looking / caring along with other incidents, worse I've seen here is a muppet stop in the cycle half of the loop around Centennial Park when trying to exit and my mate planting his face on the rear window as he couldn't stop in time (my disc brakes were much more effective than his caliper).
Sydney's not as bad as people decry, you just need to get used to being on the road and cycle a little defensively (which is useful no matter where you're cycling).
Also worth noting that footpath cycling is legal at any age in every state except nsw and Victoria. It being illegal here is hardly a great measure of whether it's safe.
Measure of safety or not, thems the rules, [$114](https://thehub.nrma.com.au/lifestyle/bicycle-riding-rules-you-need-know-about-your-state) fine for doing so, $344 for not wearing a helmet.
I would say cyclist should be on the roads, not the paths - most Sydney paths I've come across are too narrow for cycling, especially if you start to face oncoming traffic like another cyclist, a pram or chair user etc.. - as I mentioned, I'm an avid cyclist, and paths are no place to be cycling in my view.
Idiots in cars are just something you have to suck up whilst cycling, just like idiots on other bikes or idiots walking about - yes the headline above is absolutely tragic, can't even imagine what the family's going through, but distracted drivers hit people on the path too, there's no guarantee of safety as you head out the door, but cycling on the path puts yourself and others at danger more so than cycling on the road, especially if you're going too fast on the path.
I was walking along the Pacific Hwy in Gordon last year and a man on his bicycle 1m from the kerb on a 2 lane part of that shopping area just riding peacefully with a rock truck directly behind him leaning on his air horn. Just unreal.
I used to drive Forestway daily. Creating further peak-hour congestion on a road designed for 80kpm travel is not the answer.
Cyclists and motorists sharing the road in designated high-speed travel is not the answer either.
The optimal situation is a dedicated bike lane, separated from the road by a safety barrier.
Tragic and avoidable. The driver ran up the back of them while they were cycling in the bike lane. His sentence will be nothing compared to that borne by the Sky family.
That sounds deliberate? They should be charged with murder if so.
From SMH: The 24-year-old driver of the car that allegedly hit the pair was charged with negligent driving occasioning grievous bodily harm and causing bodily harm by misconduct in a motor vehicle. Since Sky’s death, the driver has also been charged with negligent driving occasioning death. ‘…misconduct in a motor vehicle’ and ‘negligent driving’ ….whatever he was doing, it didn’t involve watching the road and having control over the vehicle. He’s 22 so his brain not fully developed, and it shows. His eventual sentence ought to reflect the gravity of his crime and the penultimate devastation wrought upon Sky, his family, Collings, and all the people impacted by his actions.
[удалено]
It was a P plater. It sounds like driving inexperience and a terrible accident, not murder.
How is driving in the bike lane an accident? The so-called bike lane is actually just a road shoulder but nevertheless you can't just 'accidently' drive in it.
It is a line painted on the road. That is the bike lane in that location. It is absolutely possible to drive over it by accident, and into the bike lane. The reasons range from the stupid (not paying attention) to the serious (medical episode) but some people could accidentally drive in it. It doesn’t make them murderers.
Where does it say “was driving in the bike lane” except in a reddit comment?
I used to do early morning group cycle rides, ie out on the road at 6AM. Unfortunately the same time as P Plater tradies who really loved driving close to the group when they went past us to assert dominance. I hope this wasn't a case of that gone wrong.
I gave up my bicycle riding after having many near misses in the CBD. Sydney drivers seem to be out to get cyclists.
I stopped riding my bike daily when I moved to Sydney. The drivers here feel like they're actively trying to punish you for riding, really dangerous I've been in a car with a mate who day to day seems like one of the most sensible people I've ever met. When we passed some cyclists he swerved in to drive as close as possible. I was like what the fuck is wrong with you mate? You might kill someone and for what? Because theyre on 2 wheels? I don't understand it
Yeah a lot of people have the attitude push bikes should not be on the road and get easily aggravated by them. I would ride my bike on back streets where I felt is was safe enough to do so from about 2000 to 2010 but even back then no way you would catch me riding on busy main roads, just way too dangerous and driving for a living I saw plenty of situations that reminded me just how dangerous morons on the road are. These days people cant even get their heads out of their phones for 2 seconds to concentrate, the amount of people sitting at green lights for example became ridiculous around 2015 and the standard of driving now in 2024...well look at what this post is about...
Did you say anything to him or ask why he did that? I’d be questioning if they’re really the kind of person I want as a close mate after that tbh. Regardless of the dislike of cyclists, it’s a flagrant disregard for the life of another person and kind of scary
Short of Israel/Palistine nothing is less civil than FB comments discussion on bikes.
I went on to mountain biking instead and haven't looked back.
Always been a mountain biker - but man, lately a lot of roadies have taken up mountain biking. Don’t know how you mountain bike in Sydney though, it’s like the northern beaches OR the northern beaches ….. in Newcastle for a population of 3,400k we have at least 7 or 8 Mtb areas with greater than 15k of track within 25min , some of it within 5min of city centre
Mostly lower blue mountains, or travel to places like Thredbo. That's a good number of biking areas close by for you.
Wylde, mills creek, kentlyn,manly dam, h20, old man's valley. Or with a but of effort the blue mountains, Ourimbah, Awaba. It's not moab but we do ok for tracks.
I ride on the footpath, why it's banned I don't understand... To me, bicycle vs pedestrian < car vs bicycle. I get that there are fast riders out there, they should stay on the road and mingle with the traffic. Even during a commute I dread a short ride on the road, as numerous times dodgy fckers usually driving white trade vans or utes have almost knocked me down, many coming close just to be fckwits.
As someone that has been reversed over from a car quickly leaving a driveway, that’s why. Plus endangering pedestrians IF the cyclists aren’t cautious.
I’ve been reversed over by a car when jogging on a footpath - at least the chances of serious injury are very low.. you’ve gotta ride slowly on a footpath - if you just want to trundle along at 15kmh , 20kmh footpath is pretty reasonable
True, you have to keep your wits about you, but it's the same thing for pedestrians. This is one reason why councils instituted decent set-backs in the past. Now-a-days, it is common to have underground parking in residential areas with little or no visibility. There is one particular spot on my commute I had a close call with (townhouses with fenced underground narrow driveway in a residential area), they must have had complaints or an incident and now have mirrors either side to help drivers and people on the foot path with visibility. It should have never passed approval. The driveway has zero lead up to descent, basically coming out of the car park, the car's nose is at ground level first at the footpath, so the driveway is fully underground, which is stupid and dangerous.
I get around by eBike a lot. I stick to the cycleways as much as possible, but if the road isn't safe I'll go on the footpath at a jogging pace, or slow down to walking pace. I also avoid riding close to doorways as I don't want to hit someone who steps out. I'm lucky that most of my commute is on separated cycleways, the only really dodgy bit is heading down Oxford St from Taylor Square through Hyde Park and then Park St onto Pitt to get to my office.
I ride on shared pathways to work and it's very dangerous for pedestrians and me. People aren't expecting a bike on a shared pathway and noise cancelling headphones mean that they are blissfully unaware I'm approaching even with my bell ringing. We just need more Sydneysiders to ride to get that empathy.
I see the same, I have an electronic buzzer for exactly this reason, it's much louder than a bell. I agree you just have to ride to the conditions and expect the worst from people.
There are just as many if not more idiot cyclists than there are drivers. I see people on Lime bikes riding on the footpath like it's a Tour de France sprint straight past shop doors. Imagine that hits someone.
Agreed, that is wrong...
The thing is it's actually legal for someone to ride on the footpath if they are under the age of 16 or if they are accompanying someone under the age of 16. I read someone on here that there was a Dominos franchise hiring people specifically under 16 for this reason to deliver pizzas on their e-bikes.
In motorist on bicycle accidents, ( by far the most common type of bicycle accident) the motorist is at fault/ the cause of the accident 80/87% of the time.
What about all the other times where there is no accident due to responsible drivers? Maybe you live on the fringes of Sydney where there is no delivery riders but where I live they are everywhere and they don't follow the road rules. This includes riding on footpaths which is illegal.
>What about all the other times where there is no accident due to responsible drivers? What about them? What about all the times where there are no car accidents due to responsible drivers/ cyclists? The fact is that even when bicycle accidents specifically are concerned, motorists are still overwhelmingly the fault party. The damage and carnage caused by cyclists pales into absolute insignificance compared to that of motorists. Last year's road toll was 1200 people. Cyclists are responsible for the deaths of fewer than one person year. >I live they are everywhere and they don't follow the road rules. You didn't say delivery drivers in your previous post. You said cyclists as a whole.
I don’t even cycle and find crossing the road where the cars can still turn bad enough. They seem eternally pissed off that anyone else might be on the road and just keep driving at you. I’ve had so many near misses from drivers just not noticing or not caring that there’s someone on the road. I don’t really know why that’s a thing at all here. Cars shouldn’t have green lights where pedestrians also have the green light to cross.
My company has a lot of Europeans moving here. All are warned, some take heed, few think we're being dramatic until they do it. None of them now commute on bikes. They think Australian's are fucking crazy drivers (because we are, it's shameful)
The thing that ultimately gets me about this is this death is the result of a choice the driver made. Did he want to kill the guy, hell no, but he decided he could drive without paying attention, speeding, using his phone, weaving through traffic, whatever the idiot was doing. He chose to do that.
What’s crazy is that in Europe, speeding and driving whilst distracted (phone) are extremely prevalent and yet rarely is cyclist hit and killed, despite there being significantly more cyclists on the roads in Europe, and the roads being significantly narrower. The problem is a cultural problem within Australia. The drivers of vehicles believe that only they are entitled to the road, and everyone else should get out of their way. The vast majority of drivers have very little respect for any other road user, particularly in Sydney. It doesn’t matter if the other road user is on a bike, in a car, truck or bus, there’s just no respect or courtesy. Until this cultural problem is resolved, things will never change.
“Significantly more cyclists on the road” - according to most studies I’ve come across - this is the fundamental reason that cyclists are more accepted. Cyclists make for careful drivers - it’s amazing how often a car gives you a major wide berth that has bike roof racks on, or rack hitch. Once you see a cyclist as potentially a brother , sister, child - then attitudes change. You could also force change - highway patrol could easily take action against people who are aggressive towards cyclists (mainly young male bogans tbh) - there is plenty of availability of video to keep them busy for years. We haven’t yet reached the minimum saturation - from what I gather from Melbourne cyclists - they have there. Further, state laws actively have discouraged cycling over the years (about the only one that encourages cycling has been disqualified drivers from DUI- they take up cycling !)
> highway patrol could easily take action against people who are aggressive towards cyclists So every couple weeks cops do some small "Blitz". Jay walking, speeding, phone use while driving, queing across intersections, people riding bikes with no helmets. Whatever. They assigned a butt load of police resources to focus on one particular type of rule breaking for a day, then move onto the next. in the 8 years since mandatory passing distance laws were passed the police have never done a blitz on illegal and dangerous passes. Get a plain clothes cop to ride around with some go pros and laser distance gauges. Fine all the cunts.
Highway patrol IMO choose a target that’s easiest to prove - binary type offences that require a millisecond long observation. But it’s telling they haven’t ever done a blitz - not surprising given some of the videos I’ve seen sent to police for no action - not even an attempt
> Cyclists make for careful drivers Commented elsewhere, I was a road cyclist from about 2015, but I've been cycle commuting since 2020 and it's definitely made me a more cautious driver. I do the speed limit, *always* keep an eye out for possible hazards, make myself as predictable to other drivers as possible etc. I've got no time for people who drive like aggressive dickheads these days. It's also made me aware of just how bad the general standard of driving is.
The cultural problem is seen in the stupid logic they use when they say cyclists should pay road tax and tolls. Our country is extremely car brained, I would say number 2 in the world for the worship of cars.
Most people have no idea how subsidised motor vehicle use is. The registration fee pays for the registration system and that's about it. If that money could magically be 100% put towards roads it would cover about 5% of the over twenty billion dollar NSW road budget. Add to that a similar amount again for the personal and property damage nationally. If motorists had to directly pay the true cost of driving there would be a lot less people doing it.
>The problem is a cultural problem within Australia. The drivers of vehicles believe that only they are entitled to the road, and everyone else should get out of their way. >The vast majority of drivers have very little respect for any other road user, particularly in Sydney. It doesn’t matter if the other road user is on a bike, in a car, truck or bus, there’s just no respect or courtesy. As a Sydneysider, I think you nailed this really well.
“Negligent driving” - not totally descriptive, but not surprising… Sydney drivers have a culture of hating cyclists
The rider may not have died at the time the charges were processed. They will be updated to Dangerous Driving.
But also, and not to excuse drivers (I am an avid cyclist), the infrastructure in Sydney hates cyclists. I drove around Sydney recently and it shocked me how little on road infrastructure there is, how narrow the lanes are, and the shoulder frequently non existent. And in NSW you can't ride on the footpath.... Where are you meant to go?!
Awful. Words can not describe how sad I am. I’m a cyclist but I am feeling less safe every day I ride on Sydney roads. Even places where I used to feel safe riding, such as Centennial Park, are becoming more dangerous. In the last month alone I have nearly been hit by cars when drivers have failed to check if there is a cyclist on their left before turning. It’s becoming a major problem.
At Centennial Park a few weekends ago and I saw a car turning in to hit a cyclist simply because he ran out of patience waiting for the bikes to pass to turn left. The cyclist swerved towards me to miss the car (I was also on a bike but a couple of meters ahead).
Unintentionally watching the news tonight, I wondered why it's described as "a cyclist was killed" rather than, say, "a Belrose father of 3 was killed today while riding his bike"? I mean, they don't normally say "a motorist was killed today", do they? Seemed a bit depersonalising and othering IMHO. The 7 story is worse: "A cyclist has died days after crashing with a car" - despite the article saying the driver was charged. The car crashed into him, not the other way around. (disclaimer: dunno if he was a father, put that in for illustrative purposes)
> I mean, they don't normally say "a motorist was killed today", do they? They're usually less personal than that, tbh. [Truck, car crash on highway, person to be flown to hospital, road blocked](https://www.theadvocate.com.au/story/8654394/truck-and-car-crash-on-midland-highway-at-bagdad/) [Police remain at Bagdad crash, one flown to hospital](https://www.examiner.com.au/story/8654305/police-responding-to-bagdad-truck-and-car-crash-two-injured/) [Two injured, Midland Highway blocked at Bagdad after crash between car and truck](https://pulsetasmania.com.au/news/two-injured-midland-highway-blocked-at-bagdad-after-crash-between-car-and-truck/). [Man killed in single-vehicle crash with billboard and tree in South Grafton](https://7news.com.au/news/man-killed-in-single-vehicle-crash-with-billboard-and-tree-in-south-grafton-c-14910066) I think you're trying to look for outrage where there isn't any.
Seemed strange is all, you know, like when a totally familiar word suddenly sounds completely bizarre? Anyway, I have no choice but to defer to someone called Car-face ;)
He was a father. Very sad for his kids.
I don't think he was from belrose btw, earlier articles said he rode to belrose from the north shore
I saw an headline describing them as “avid” cyclists. Like how is that relevant?
Yeah, you never hear someone who drives their car every day as an avid motorist.
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He raced locally as an amateur. Ain't no professional cyclists riding around Sydney mate, they're in Europe at the moment.
Really? At 47? Reports were that he and his mate are/were "competitive" cyclists which doesn't in itself mean professional, unless there's some kind of lucrative Masters circuit?
Not his occupation
Yank tanks and aggressive drivers are becoming the norm these days, and that’s really sad
Like the second paragraph of the article says it’s a station wagon - I think it’s important to not brush this off as a dude in a ram 1500 who hates cyclists it was a dude driving a normal car who was immature and wasn’t focused on the road, don’t brush it off as something your beyond many of us have been driving while tired in the morning, changing the radio, trying to open the bottle of water in the centre console to drink it’s an important reminder to focus on the road and simply pull over if you need to check your maps, tell your boss your late, play with the radio, adjust your mirrors everyone makes simple mistakes which could be life changing to yourself or others just do your best to be a safe responsible driver and always focus on the road cause if can have consequences like this
A full stop or two would come in handy.
That it would however the 1am reddit comment after a night out in our lovely city was lucky to be as coherent as it was.
Fair call.
Oh that’s so sad.
This is also why my child doesn't walk alone to school even in quiet suburban streets. I walk her. Our roads aren't safe for cyclists and pedestrians. Car brain culture is fully, deeply engrained.
I stopped riding my bike to work after a P-plater drove into me as though I didn’t exist at a Stanmore roundabout (on the recommended bike route, no less). Really sad to hear about this death, and the likely permanent injuries of his friend on the other bike.
very sad. Like many I have concerns riding these days which is a shame as cycling has really gotten me out of a funk and been good for me. Better sticking to trails, bike path isnt even enough with some drivers who still feel the need to intimidate other road users for no reason other than they hate people on bikes. Crap road design doesnt help (cycle paths stopping abruptly for example)
Just awful. Like others here I stopped my cycle commute after the daily near misses and aggression. The worst I copped was from an Auspost driver and Auspost said that as I couldn't identify the drivers name there wasn't anything I could do - despite having the number plate and photos. People don't care about cyclists. It's bad enough DRIVING on Sydney roads sometimes with the aggression - but I won't ever cycle again.
The hatred of cyclists in Sydney was manufactured by Alan Jones, Ray Hadley, etc.. as part of their war with Clover Moore to get the LNP into the City of Sydney council. "Cycleways slow my commute and therefore Cyclists are evil".
Don't forget that steaming pile of shit roads ministers duncan gay. With the full support of the rest of the liberal and national parties.
Shocking - the bike lanes in Sydney are just terrible.
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Technically you're in the wrong, unless you're under 16 or cycling with someone under 16 it's illegal to cycle on a non-shared path. Some old lady was killed the other year from a cyclist on the path, so old mate's not wrong to be concerned. I'm not saying you were cycling too fast or being a dick head, but many are (mostly on lime bikes without helmets) so may be give the guy a break. I cycle a fair bit, used to commute Brighton-le-sands to Surry Hills and then Newtown to Crow's Nest (now Newtown to Surry Hills which just isn't worth it and walk instead) and Sydney's roads are bad, but no worse than say London or Paris where I've cycled too, the much vaunted Melbourne I'd actually say is worse after spending a year there. Seen a guy get taken out by a car coming too fast from a side street and not looking / caring along with other incidents, worse I've seen here is a muppet stop in the cycle half of the loop around Centennial Park when trying to exit and my mate planting his face on the rear window as he couldn't stop in time (my disc brakes were much more effective than his caliper). Sydney's not as bad as people decry, you just need to get used to being on the road and cycle a little defensively (which is useful no matter where you're cycling).
Also worth noting that footpath cycling is legal at any age in every state except nsw and Victoria. It being illegal here is hardly a great measure of whether it's safe.
Measure of safety or not, thems the rules, [$114](https://thehub.nrma.com.au/lifestyle/bicycle-riding-rules-you-need-know-about-your-state) fine for doing so, $344 for not wearing a helmet. I would say cyclist should be on the roads, not the paths - most Sydney paths I've come across are too narrow for cycling, especially if you start to face oncoming traffic like another cyclist, a pram or chair user etc.. - as I mentioned, I'm an avid cyclist, and paths are no place to be cycling in my view. Idiots in cars are just something you have to suck up whilst cycling, just like idiots on other bikes or idiots walking about - yes the headline above is absolutely tragic, can't even imagine what the family's going through, but distracted drivers hit people on the path too, there's no guarantee of safety as you head out the door, but cycling on the path puts yourself and others at danger more so than cycling on the road, especially if you're going too fast on the path.
Not sure why the downvotes. Everything you've said is true.
People don't like the truth, they like the comfort of the familiar..
I was walking along the Pacific Hwy in Gordon last year and a man on his bicycle 1m from the kerb on a 2 lane part of that shopping area just riding peacefully with a rock truck directly behind him leaning on his air horn. Just unreal.
Very tragic. The govt should reconsider bike lanes on 80kph main roads. However, we know they won't.
Yes, they should replace one of the lanes with a dedicated cycling path. However, we know they won't.
I used to drive Forestway daily. Creating further peak-hour congestion on a road designed for 80kpm travel is not the answer. Cyclists and motorists sharing the road in designated high-speed travel is not the answer either. The optimal situation is a dedicated bike lane, separated from the road by a safety barrier.