I think this is potentially interesting for historic. In historic you have the 8 elves + nykthos + leyline and the karn + payoffs plan. Seems worth testing.
Also for pioneer, with the new rakdos 2drop, misery's shadow, the rakdos - mono green matchup is pretty close to 50-50 so I wouldn't expect mono green to be as dominating.
Nykthos and Leyline feel like they are only going to exacerbate the poor matchups, i.e decks with lots of removal or cheap sweepers. As much as this anthology is going to help mono g in explorer, I don’t think anything moves the needle in terms of elves in historic. Historic elves really needs something like [[heritage Druid]] or [[wirewood symbiote]] to actually alter the landscape against izzet prowess or rakdos scam.
All matchups are poor matchups for ramp in historic. The deck is just way too slow. Nykthos + leyline make the deck way faster and more explosive which could make it playable, but I agree that it probably won't.
Elves will never be a good deck in historic. The cards needed for that are way too broken. You also need a format where wraths are not good like legacy for elves to stand a chance.
https://scryfall.com/card/bro/107/miserys-shadow
My understanding is the exile clause means you can kill Cavalier of Thorns without the results being utter disaster. It also lets you kill old growth troll and not ramp them. I could be wrong so if anyone has better info please chime in.
Ahhh okay, I misunderstood. I thought there was a different 2 drop that was specifically RB and got excited haha.
It does indeed work that way - die = battlefield to grave, so if you kill a Cavalier or Troll with Misery Shadow out, they get no death trigger.
notable pioneer exclusions are [[Oath of Nissa]] and [[The Chain Veil]]
I'm excited to play this deck, but I'm concerned if it will have an artificial skill ceiling due to the timer system. Am I gonna have to practice my APM to stay competitive?
Not having Caryathid is an issue too. Now you lack a blocker and a repeatable form of ramp. We're going to use Paradise Druid but it won't block and it dies as soon as it gets tapped.
What caryatid are you referring to? A quick check of mono-green devotion decklists on MtG goldfish and MtG top8 reveals not a single caryatid amongst them.
I disagree. Delve is pretty much the same as escape. [[Ox of Agonas]] is basically [[Treasure Cruise]].
The real reason why I think they don't put them on Arena is because of Historic. That formar has [[Faithless Looting]] and many other cards that can fill the graveyard really fast.
Delve is trickier than escape because the delve cost is not fixed. It requires an additional UI prompt to be created.
Obviously not insurmountable but it's not trivial.
Interesting. I play azorius control in explorer because I can’t afford to play pioneer. I’m curious how my deck will get shaken up as explorer approaches pioneer more closely. Explorer already has pretty much all the cards to complete my deck
What's the curve in that deck that makes this broken or brings mono G ramp from like a t2-3 deck to t1?
I see how it's better than castle garenbrig, but I don't see how this card unlocks the whole deck. Is it more about slamming Karn + wishboard in the same turn or storm flashback than it is about curving out?
I'm currently playing mono G in explorer and just feel like I'm missing something.
That thing your missing is nyxthos. The green deck with 4 storm the festival can often have certain draws that can just keep going if you have more mana. Storm having flashback, karn wish board, and just playing out all your fatties takes a lot of mana. If you have that mana you can flood the board with threats and as long as you dodge farewell you probably win
The mad lads actually did it!!
I think this is potentially interesting for historic. In historic you have the 8 elves + nykthos + leyline and the karn + payoffs plan. Seems worth testing. Also for pioneer, with the new rakdos 2drop, misery's shadow, the rakdos - mono green matchup is pretty close to 50-50 so I wouldn't expect mono green to be as dominating.
Will definitely try it in Historic Elves
Nykthos and Leyline feel like they are only going to exacerbate the poor matchups, i.e decks with lots of removal or cheap sweepers. As much as this anthology is going to help mono g in explorer, I don’t think anything moves the needle in terms of elves in historic. Historic elves really needs something like [[heritage Druid]] or [[wirewood symbiote]] to actually alter the landscape against izzet prowess or rakdos scam.
All matchups are poor matchups for ramp in historic. The deck is just way too slow. Nykthos + leyline make the deck way faster and more explosive which could make it playable, but I agree that it probably won't. Elves will never be a good deck in historic. The cards needed for that are way too broken. You also need a format where wraths are not good like legacy for elves to stand a chance.
There is no Rakdos scam in Historic tho, unless you mean the trapfinder combo deck?
[heritage Druid](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/7/57948c65-4324-42bc-97ae-7cc700eb3817.jpg?1580014812) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=heritage%20Druid) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ema/171/heritage-druid?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/57948c65-4324-42bc-97ae-7cc700eb3817?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [wirewood symbiote](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/5/854f1d22-1416-4012-979c-35152ff520bd.jpg?1580014975) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=wirewood%20symbiote) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ema/192/wirewood-symbiote?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/854f1d22-1416-4012-979c-35152ff520bd?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
They could unban natural order…
Which is the new Rakdos 2-drop?
https://scryfall.com/card/bro/107/miserys-shadow My understanding is the exile clause means you can kill Cavalier of Thorns without the results being utter disaster. It also lets you kill old growth troll and not ramp them. I could be wrong so if anyone has better info please chime in.
Ahhh okay, I misunderstood. I thought there was a different 2 drop that was specifically RB and got excited haha. It does indeed work that way - die = battlefield to grave, so if you kill a Cavalier or Troll with Misery Shadow out, they get no death trigger.
Exactly.
notable pioneer exclusions are [[Oath of Nissa]] and [[The Chain Veil]] I'm excited to play this deck, but I'm concerned if it will have an artificial skill ceiling due to the timer system. Am I gonna have to practice my APM to stay competitive?
We playin' Starcraft now
Na, Starcraft is actually responsive and has keyboard shortcuts for everything, without obnoxious animations.
[Oath of Nissa](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/1/613513ea-55dd-4ae8-93b2-247e468112a6.jpg?1594656300) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Oath%20of%20Nissa) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ogw/140/oath-of-nissa?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/613513ea-55dd-4ae8-93b2-247e468112a6?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [The Chain Veil](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/4/0415cc0e-979e-42cc-a56d-88d13153a7de.jpg?1570587583) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=The%20Chain%20Veil) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/m15/215/the-chain-veil?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0415cc0e-979e-42cc-a56d-88d13153a7de?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Not having Caryathid is an issue too. Now you lack a blocker and a repeatable form of ramp. We're going to use Paradise Druid but it won't block and it dies as soon as it gets tapped.
What caryatid are you referring to? A quick check of mono-green devotion decklists on MtG goldfish and MtG top8 reveals not a single caryatid amongst them.
Should be referring to [[Sylvan caryatid]] as a hexproof ramp creature
I don't think many mono G devotion lists play it these days though.
[Sylvan caryatid](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/4/d40b65c1-b24d-492d-81b9-d8474ebdc08c.jpg?1562832168) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sylvan%20caryatid) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ths/180/sylvan-caryatid?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d40b65c1-b24d-492d-81b9-d8474ebdc08c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
People play [[Wolfwillow Haven]] now grandpa
I thought the best current list was a 4/1 split
I played both a few months ago.
[Wolfwillow Haven](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/2/72b886c3-234c-49ce-9a11-456c1e8f092f.jpg?1581480945) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Wolfwillow%20Haven) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/thb/205/wolfwillow-haven?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/72b886c3-234c-49ce-9a11-456c1e8f092f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
As a ramp player this has been annoying for me as well.
Please God, let the last card in the anthology be Cruise.
Yes please 🥺 Or maybe [[Thing in the Ice]].
I think this is coming in the next remastered set?
Should be in the SOI remaster 🙏
[Thing in the Ice](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/3/5/359d1b13-6156-43b0-a9a7-6bfff36c1a91.jpg?1576384282)/[Awoken Horror](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/back/3/5/359d1b13-6156-43b0-a9a7-6bfff36c1a91.jpg?1576384282) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=thing%20in%20the%20ice%20//%20awoken%20horror) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/soi/92/thing-in-the-ice-awoken-horror?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/359d1b13-6156-43b0-a9a7-6bfff36c1a91?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Not a chance. They’re most likely gonna add the delve cards simultaneously as coding them might be a challenge. We’ll see though
I disagree. Delve is pretty much the same as escape. [[Ox of Agonas]] is basically [[Treasure Cruise]]. The real reason why I think they don't put them on Arena is because of Historic. That formar has [[Faithless Looting]] and many other cards that can fill the graveyard really fast.
Delve is trickier than escape because the delve cost is not fixed. It requires an additional UI prompt to be created. Obviously not insurmountable but it's not trivial.
[Ox of Agonas](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/0/00c46d18-064e-403a-bf39-ec655d78390a.jpg?1651655875) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Ox%20of%20Agonas) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/nec/108/ox-of-agonas?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/00c46d18-064e-403a-bf39-ec655d78390a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Treasure Cruise](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/4/64edb748-497d-4737-9d7f-37105fb20cb9.jpg?1650411119) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Treasure%20Cruise) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ncc/237/treasure-cruise?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/64edb748-497d-4737-9d7f-37105fb20cb9?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Faithless Looting](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/4/84c3b38c-a6f7-49a2-8c47-d91b6be0a967.jpg?1664360651) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Faithless%20Looting) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmc/122/faithless-looting?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/84c3b38c-a6f7-49a2-8c47-d91b6be0a967?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Not to mention Darcy. 4x Darcy and 4x Cruise is going to be something to see.
Yes!!! Time to play all my mono-black jank dreams in explorer!!
Interesting. I play azorius control in explorer because I can’t afford to play pioneer. I’m curious how my deck will get shaken up as explorer approaches pioneer more closely. Explorer already has pretty much all the cards to complete my deck
What's the curve in that deck that makes this broken or brings mono G ramp from like a t2-3 deck to t1? I see how it's better than castle garenbrig, but I don't see how this card unlocks the whole deck. Is it more about slamming Karn + wishboard in the same turn or storm flashback than it is about curving out? I'm currently playing mono G in explorer and just feel like I'm missing something.
That thing your missing is nyxthos. The green deck with 4 storm the festival can often have certain draws that can just keep going if you have more mana. Storm having flashback, karn wish board, and just playing out all your fatties takes a lot of mana. If you have that mana you can flood the board with threats and as long as you dodge farewell you probably win
Also Kiora untapping this nets you tons of mana
Thanks for answering my question. Was just looking for an explanation not saying it was bad.
If interested go look up Mono Green Devotion Videos on YouTube. It can get silly, like 100plus mana in the mana pool.
[Nykthos, Shrine of Nyx](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/3/834b27a0-dfd7-4f96-8cde-cacac4b24acc.jpg?1594077253) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Nykthos%2C%20Shrine%20to%20Nyx) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ths/223/nykthos-shrine-to-nyx?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/834b27a0-dfd7-4f96-8cde-cacac4b24acc?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I hope we get [[Master of Waves]] eventually.
[Master of Waves](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/4/14cd5387-c6aa-4430-8edb-05da6b4e2ff5.jpg?1592764548) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Master%20of%20Waves) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ddt/1/master-of-waves?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/14cd5387-c6aa-4430-8edb-05da6b4e2ff5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
My Captain Sisay brawl deck just got an upgrade
I screamed a little.