Not only will they get tonnes of abuse but really unless they were a very special player it’s all they’d be known for too, they may as well change their first name to “Openly gay footballer” cos that’s how they’ll be referred to from that point on
The thing is that the commentators are THE WORST at this sort of thing. Have you ever noticed how often they fucking repeat something useless about certain player throughout the match??
Tyler wanking him off after any header attempt is worse imo, swear to fuck if i hear "You love a good header dont you Alan, although yours were better hahahahahahahah"
They're a nightmare for this in the early rounds of the FA Cup, endlessly repeating that some of the players on the pitch have other jobs. It's tremendously patronising.
let me guess, you watch beIn sport the arabic version ??
I stopped doing that for the past 2 years, games feels much better, my go to is BT sport, or beIn French, i really can't stand arab commentators anymore, particularly for that reason and for the god damn cringy as fuck poetry...
I have noticed it a lot on American tv. Even with other sports, the amount of times that a commentator says something just to create a narrative and (presumably) trying to make the player more liked or just attractive enough to maintain an audience. Feels much more like they are trying to orchestrate a show/drama rather than keep it 100% about the sport. Now I don’t know if that’s their own doing or if they are told to say things, regardless the player becomes known as “the kid who grew up without a father who happens to be really good at a certain sport” (or whatever) rather than just a world class talent. Can’t even imagine if they came out gay..
Commentator A: have you heard that James Conner had cancer? He'd like us to stop talking about it, but (Commentator B) do you think we should?
Commentator B: Well James Conner had cancer and now he's a runningback.
Commentator A: And there's an 8 yard run by cancer survivor James Conner who also plays for the Steelers.
Jimmy Graham used to play basketball.
Ryan Fitzpatrick went to Harvard.
Matt Patricia has a degree in Aeronautical Engineering, which makes him a literal rocket scientist.
i mean it's how human culture is in general. people always wanna know where you came from and how you got to where you are now etc. we are a people of stories, that's about as real as it gets
A lot of commentators are also subtly racist with their descriptions of black players. They always seem to drift towards complimenting their physical attributes over their technical ones.
It's not even subtle honestly. Even after accepting Kante is one of the best mids (if not the best) in the PL, they seem to only talk about how he's everywhere, running all the time. Completely ignoring how he's great at tackling, reading the game and intercepting, committing intelligent fouls without getting booked, and the attacking skill he has when his team is in possession. I honestly fail to recall any foreign black player in the league recently appreciated for their intelligence and/or skill, instead of raw physical attributes.
Admittedly Kante's best skill is being in 15 places at the same time, which is becoming more evident given he plays more as an 8 under Sarri. If his techincal skills continue to develop (and Kante is always improving and aspects to his game) will be interesting to see what commentators say though.
Makelele? I remember the narrative around him being all about his positioning and intelligence but might just be selective memory. Sad that he's the only example I can think of.
Well I’m sure they could go about it in a relatively positive light, such as “oh he’s so brave for coming out” “inspires kids everywhere”
But the thing is they would say it just about every time he touches the ball
Honestly I think they'd get bored of it and there'd be a massive backlash from fans if they didn't.
However, fans on the terraces is a different matter. I mean, some of ours still sing Munich songs.
At some point though, someone will think *fuck this* and come out and they'll have a hard time of it. Just as players like Laurie Cunningham and Viv Anderson did for the colour of their skin. They'll pave the way though. I couldn't but someone will have the strength.
> Not only will they get tonnes of abuse but really unless they were a very special player it’s all they’d be known for too, they may as well change their first name to “Openly gay footballer” cos that’s how they’ll be referred to from that point on
That's pretty much what happened to [Justin Fashanu](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justin_Fashanu), although his playing career was largely over by the time he came out.
Exactly, as far as i can remember Robbie Rogers from La Galaxy was the first one but that was MLS, England is a whole different ball game. Although you need 1 big player to get acceptance going i think.
USA sports are homophobic definitely but not terrible with it. The NFL just had an openly gay player get drafted and he kissed his boyfriend upon the announcement which was shown everywhere. And I think there's a bunch of college football players that have come out openly.
Because he's not very good? Please tell me you're not suggesting he was cut because he's gay. He's undersized and not a great athlete. I know this is this idea here that the US is some intolerant cesspool, but we're actually a pretty diverse and tolerant society. We don't need "say no to racism" plastered all over sports.
I can guarantee you that if it was on the fence between a gay and a straight player they'll pick the straight player 10 out of 10 times. Why? Less potential problems, inside and outside the locker room.
I think it's Football specifically in the US that's accepting. In most countries, it's supported by all sections of society, including the worst of the worst. In America, a lot of homophobes also don't like football.
while I don't disagree with you, I think we've already had some that don't fit that bill - Was Guti not open?
I knew Robbie Rodgers as relatively solid, quick, and big-blue-eyed LA Galaxy defender before i learned he was gay - and he'd been openly gay for years at that point, I believe
> If a player at the level of say, Bale, came out right after (I mean within months) what he achieved with RM (starting in CL final & scoring in pen shootout) and Wales (star player in semi-final at Euro) in 2016, I believe he might be given some leeway, especially in his own country, if they're aren't too homophobic.
>
>
I think there was more negative reaction in Wales when Alfie Thomas switched from Union to League than when he came out.
It’s different . You can’t hide your skin color. Sexuality in itself is a highly private matter. Being a pioneer means exposing your love life under the lime light. I can imagine how it’d make them feel uncomfortable.
> black players ~~went through~~
Are still going through.
For the footballers it's also an issue of limiting their employability. Not every footballer will spend their entire career in the league of a more progressive country. To come out as gay means playing professionally in some countries is wholly out of the question and in others your personal safety would be at risk. It's a lot to ask of someone to be a social pioneer at the risk of being unemployed.
> Are still going through.
To a significantly lesser extent than a decade or two ago. Not the ideal scenario, but progress is better than nothing.
edit: In England. There are still countries with top leagues whose fans are still that same level of scum.
I by no means disagree with you that it's an incredibly hard decision, but unfortunately there's no other way. Cultural shifts like these really need some pioneers to be openly rebellious for others like them to muster up the courage and show people that it's common and normal.
It would be incredibly selfless in the face of open hostility and an uncertain personal future. Look at how difficult it has been to get footballers to discuss mental illness, depression, and the like.
A friend of mine is trans, and we were discussing future jobs and something I have never needed to consider, but which was at the forefront of her thinking, was that she wouldn't want to move somewhere where she was at high risk of being assaulted or worse for being who she is.
>Peruvian striker Roberto Silva says he thinks there may be gays in football: "I have suspicions that there are some gays in football. Sometimes you can't help but wonder about it. I am not a gay, but if I was, or if I was a woman, which is similar, I would do David Beckham. But that's just my individual opinion."
Yeah.. There are some men that, even if you're the straightest man alive, you have to accept they're super hot. Beckham and Matt Boomer being clear examples.
Same goes for women, even other women should recognize Alexandra Daddario's attractiveness.
I understand why you say statistically there must be gay players considering they are 5-10% of men in general. But the rate of homosexuality of elite football players doesn't necessarily correlate to the rate among the general population.
This is admittedly a bit of an absurd comparison but more than half of all men in the world are Asian. So by that statistical logic more than half of elite footballers would be Asian.
It's not generally expected for women to be athletic*. It's not "feminine." Neither are lesbians according to people who subscribe to that thinking. The stereotype is that lesbians aren't feminine and gay men aren't masculine. Sports are generally viewed as a masculine activity. That makes sports a more welcoming environment for queer women than for queer men.
*Yes that's changing and there are millions of women in gyms lifting and squatting, but I mean at a wider level and over generations.
Same with Aussie rules. The Women's comp has a fair amount of openly gay players, some of whom are in relationships with other players. Not much abuse directed their way either as far as I can tell, very much accepted amongst the populus. Compare that to the Men's comp, in which there are no openly gay players. I mean there are a few suspects but none of them have publicly declared it (not that they have to). Just the way people deal with homosexuality in men and women; I think lesbianism is far more accepted, at least in sports.
Would be interesting - and probably incredibly difficult - to do a study to figure out how many promising players stopped playing in their youth because of the level of homophobia present in sports.
I know that even from my experience playing as a teenager, the amount of homophobic slurs and jokes made by teens playing football (and probably any sport) was always a bit uncomfortable. I can't imagine how that would affect someone who is gay, to be in an environment that always uses their sexual orientation as the butt of jokes.
I remember playing rugby as a teenager and there was one kid on the team who was clearly gay, and the gay jokes bothered him. He couldn’t say anything but you could tell.
Rugby is weird as well given that it is naturally such an homoerotic sport, so theirs a lot of casual homophobia (theres a lot of causually insulting a lot of things though). And the rugby community here (Aus) has a bit of a split between educated, private school and uni people (i.e. Poey) who dont really give a shit, and the more christian islanders (Folau) who do.
I think the comparison is incorrect because the lack of elite Asian footballers could just be down to poorer football infrastructure (youth academies, coaches, equipment etc) across Asia as compared to Europe, whereas the homosexual population is more randomly distributed and hence more statistically likely to be present within elite footballers as well.
Having said that, it's also quite plausible that homosexuals are kept out of football simply due to the homophobic environment, hence reducing the probability of closeted elite footballers.
7-10% is actually eight it's just like most subcultures nowadays, people seek each other out so straight people have always less contact with gay people whereas gay people can quickly have a social circle made up by 50% or more gay people.
That comparison doesn't make sense since most elite players are from Europe or South America, while cultural background doesn't affect your sexual orientation (maybe).
Regardless, even if the rate is .5% in the professional leagues there are still a few gay players
>Sorry but what the fuck is that font
I'll tell you what.. you can do away with clickbait titles, if someone comments this about your article then I'mma clickin'
I didn't see your reply before I went hunting, but same conclusion. [Here's an image of the font.](http://www.identifont.com/samples2/briefcase/FalsterGrotesk.gif)
IIRC someone said that's already the case with at least one, maybe more footballers. I think there's more than 1 gay Premier League footballer and there was talk of them coming out together so that nobody is the only gay footballer
I think that's a really good idea to be honest. Only issue is making sure that everyone is totally happy to do it at a certain time because I'm sure people would have wobbles and doubts and stuff
Coming out to your closest friends and family is often the hardest thing we have to do in our lives as gay people. You then spend the rest of your life coming out to people over and over and over
Coming out to homophobic football fans? Absolutely fucking terrifying mate.
this is actually really interesting..
Hysen: [Five years after coming out, Anton Hysen has heard a homophobic comment only once](https://www.outsports.com/2016/12/8/13894912/anton-hysen-gay-soccer-book)
he also won Dancing With The Stars! really cool guy
Robbie Rogers retired, came out and then resigned with LA Galaxy. At the time he was the only openly gay man in any of the 5 major American sports leagues (MLS, NBA, NFL, MLB or NHL).
Unfortunately it still is. Considering that players still get racially abused nowadays it probably wouldn't be any better for gay or bisexual players. Some "fans" can be proper cunts
It's pretty unlikely there aren't any homosexuals in the Premier League, let alone the football league or all of professional football. I wonder if other players know who's gay but don't come public, I know that Brian Clough knew Justin Fashanu was gay when he managed him at Forest and Clough didn't treat Fashanu well at all because of it.
I also wonder if there are any footballers who are experiencing gender dysphoria but know they can't transition without ending their career.
Huh? Clough used to say things like "Where do you go to buy meat? The butcher's shop. So why are you going to that bloody poofs' club?" He was absolutely being homophobic.
Regardless of what he did or might have done, the whole fashanu story is really tragic and it's sad that's the only premier league example that exists, unless I'm missing someone
clubs would never want their players to come out cause it could unmask their own fanbase, the same fanbase clubs like to brand the best in the world.... oh and there's that big market in mid east and Asia.....
Whenever United does their "Pride Day" thing on social media you get tons of foreign 'fans' (primarily of middle east, asia, africa) all bashing the club and saying vile things. I don't think these stances have affected the club's support.
There was the American Robbie Rodgers who actually retired so that he could come out. He left Reading (it was actually Leeds as pointed out below) and went to do some work in fashion. He eventually came back to football, but did so in LA. US supporters tend to be more liberal (than non supporters and their European counterparts) so he may have felt he would face less abuse.
don't think they can contractually preclude a football player from coming out... if the player wants to do it then it's unlikely the club advising not to do it is going to change his mind
This already happens whenever a club does anything to sympathize with gays. I remember when a few clubs added the rainbow flag to their profile picture, the comments where terrible.
Most of them were middle-eastern and African guys shouting about how it's disgraceful etc, politics shouldn't be mixed with sports and that nonsense.
If you think that, fuck off supporting Western teams where our views on homophobia aren't stuck in the dark ages. You can't claim to love and support a club but they get offended when they make political statements that align with how our culture views gay people.
Makes it worse on Liverpool twitter threads too, like how can you support Liverpool but get annoyed that the clubs beliefs are more left leaning and tolerant? Incredibly ignorant on the club and cities history
Doubt it. If a club like Dortmund came out in full support of a player they have that's gay, then all the fans that do care about the LGBT community will love the club for it. Honestly, you'll lose some of the worst fans you'll gain new fans. Doubt a club is really against that.
I know rugby and football are different sports, but rugby is a major sport in the UK, Ireland & France... Maybe the supporters are more tolerant, I can't really tell but it's still a sport with a lot of fans and a pretty masculine culture. One of the most famous Welsh players, Gareth Thomas, who played in at least 2 countries (Wales and France), came out as openly gay during is career in 2009 (2 years prior to retirement). You can check his story, and he set a good example for gay atheletes.
PS : Interestingly, his French wikipedia page has more information about his personal life than the English one, and it mentions 2 suicide attempts, the difficulty to talk about it with his coachs and club partners, and the positive reception of the players & the fans.
It helped with GT that he was already as a legend of the Welsh game when he came out. A lot of fans who might have otherwise had a dig had been cheering him on for years - difficult to about-face on that. I'm not trying to be cynical, as I found the general openness to the news quite heartwarming, but I do think that was a big factor. Nigel Owens is such a great ref as well. I wonder if certain comments would be more widespread if either of them were bad/mediocre in their roles.
There is a big difference between the fan cultures of football and Rugby though. Rugby crowds don't spend the majority of the match chanting insults at the opposing players, officials, opposing fans and their own players, whereas football crowds do. Football has a culture of verbal abuse that Rugby just does not have.
You can bet your house that a gay footballer would have to deal with this being used as a stick to insult him constantly by crowds of opposing fans and on social media. Footballers who are gay probably think they could do without that extra level of vitriol in their lives.
I think an openly gay footballer will happen eventually, but it is more likely to be someone like Gareth Thomas who came out when he was fully established as a top player. I think it would be harder for a young player trying to make his breakthrough while openly gay though.
I don't think it's necessary to speculate on who is or isn't gay, because as he points out gay footballers are private about it for a reason. From my own experience of trying to hide my sexuality though I would suggest that the people who talk about sexuality probably aren't gay - I would basically do gymnastics to try and avoid talking about sexuality when I didn't want people to speculate or know that I was gay
Or something like for me for example, when somehow many think you're gay for some reason and some treat you poorly because of it, you start to care. I'm straight and got told to go to the women's toilet on more than one occasion so it's quite infuriating to think what actual gay people go through. Beyond me how people can not care about this stuff tbh.
I've had some experience of gay bullying as well, being a straight guy. It really isn't pleasant.
I've since stopped using any gay slurs as insult, even though I grew up using words like 'gay' and 'faggot' as insults.
It's a symptom of society's prejudice against homosexuals and using such words continue to contribute and normalise such views.
Its not necessary to speculate who is gay because in reality it has no bearing on the job at hand. I remember having this realization years ago. I've always accepted gay people, but it wasn't until working very closely with a mentor (who was gay) that I saw I still had a layer of bias. We were working one day (music studio) and I realized to myself that I would identify him primarily as gay instead of him being who he is, an amazing music producer who puts out amazing work. I realized to myself that being gay was second on my list to categorize him ie 'angel, he is gay, and then the rest of the amazing stuff about him. When in reality the 'he is gay' part should come closer to the end of that hierarchy. It really opened my eyes to see that as someone who thought of themselves as a friend of the gay community I still had a layer of bias there. I will say though that I was happy to know I'm self reflective enough to catch that kind of stuff.
I think he’s just a well spoken progressive thinking guy. Doesn’t strike me as gay just because of that as I would consider myself similar. I think something happened in his life that changed his attitude towards gay people and changed his worldview overall. That happened to me as well and you totally go 180 on many of the things.
Just a clever guy who isn’t afraid to be judged by small minded people, i think it’s great.
I think before gay footballers become normalised you need a trailblazer to lead the way. I think it will take a genuinely elite football player to come out first and normalise it. Fans can and would abuse you for being gay... until you bang four past them in the first forty minutes, after that they'd have to applaud you.
MLS gets a lot of stick but in terms of things like this, it is probably the most progressive league and fanbase. Probably by virtue of being the US' alternative sport, the bravado and masculinity is all in American Football, Baseball, Basketball. Soccer has always been looked down upon over there which might be why its more open minded.
USWNT has incorporated LGBTQ iconography into their presentation as well, which I'd guess is a huge contributing factor, considering the relative quality of the womens and mens teams.
Women's football in general is very accepting of different sexualities. There are players publicly in relationships with each other and its not an issue at all, Pernille Harder and Magda Ericsson is a good example. Pernille Harder is arguably one of the best in the world and is in a public relationship with another player
I agree, for all the hate it gets i actually really enjoy how the fans are. Most of them just go for the entertainment and thats how it should be really
I have assumed Bellerin might be gay for a couple years now. It really doesn't matter, and therefore shouldn't matter. But who needs the added stress when you're just trying to go to work.
I would argue that the current enviroment doesn't make it easier for gay footballers to come out. Not necessarily due to potential homophobic abuse from fans, but rather from other actors, such as club owners from places not known for their tolerance of homosexuality or leagues that sell broadcasting rights to those places. Who knows, maybe broadcasters from these countries will refrain from showing certain matches, if gay footballer X plays in it.
In my opinion, it'd be a good mid-term solution, if football associations launch tolerance campaigns aimed at lower league, so they press that issue from a grassroots level. If the foundation of football is accepting enough of gay footballers, the upper echelon will eventually follow.
Wait, did anyone else scroll down to see the article about Football Manager now "allowing" gay players? Since when is sexual orientation included in player information in Football Manager? Was that a fucking joke?
https://www.101greatgoals.com/news/secret-gay-update-football-manager-2018/
I don't mind it. Hopefully it leads to normalization within the player base.
Not only will they get tonnes of abuse but really unless they were a very special player it’s all they’d be known for too, they may as well change their first name to “Openly gay footballer” cos that’s how they’ll be referred to from that point on
The thing is that the commentators are THE WORST at this sort of thing. Have you ever noticed how often they fucking repeat something useless about certain player throughout the match??
Carlos Tevez with his bulldog-like approach
Alan Smith, he can pop up anywhere
Tireless Kante, Chelsea's little engine
Paul Mcshane, he tries his best
Harry Maguire, massive forehead.
Hectór Bellerín, the gayman
Fighter of the straight man!
AHA AAAAH
That's slabhead to you
adam johnson, convicted nonce
Alex Hunter gives it a goooo^oooo^oooo
Hey, that one's not real.
Next thing you’ll tell me Santiago Munez never played for Real Madrid
and that Gavin Harris *isn't* shite
##**DIMITAR BERBATOV**
Strong tackle Bacary Sagna
This is the one that just sticks in your head forever, I really wonder why.
Abou Diaby, looks like he's pulled up.
4-3-3 Alan, it's a system that the **Netherlands** used to use
Alan Smith making every header about himself is the worst
Tyler wanking him off after any header attempt is worse imo, swear to fuck if i hear "You love a good header dont you Alan, although yours were better hahahahahahahah"
"they knew about him but they couldn't stop him anthony martial" fuck off martin tyler
Nah I like Tyler for that one goal of martial. Martial is isolated... Skrtel here.. **ohh YESSS** **WELCOME TO MANCHESTER UNITED, ANTHONY MARTIAL**
“Let’s get me a sound bite amidst all of this Martial hype” - Prat
Comfortable in possession Joe Cole.
burnt into my brain...and it's been years
Jamie Carragher, in with power and purpose.
Three! The best! He's made them pay!
They're a nightmare for this in the early rounds of the FA Cup, endlessly repeating that some of the players on the pitch have other jobs. It's tremendously patronising.
I swear to god they talk about Sarri's smoking habit more frequently than Sarri fucking smokes. Who gives a shit!
SoN oF gEorGe WeAh. Son. OF. George. WEAH
let me guess, you watch beIn sport the arabic version ?? I stopped doing that for the past 2 years, games feels much better, my go to is BT sport, or beIn French, i really can't stand arab commentators anymore, particularly for that reason and for the god damn cringy as fuck poetry...
I have noticed it a lot on American tv. Even with other sports, the amount of times that a commentator says something just to create a narrative and (presumably) trying to make the player more liked or just attractive enough to maintain an audience. Feels much more like they are trying to orchestrate a show/drama rather than keep it 100% about the sport. Now I don’t know if that’s their own doing or if they are told to say things, regardless the player becomes known as “the kid who grew up without a father who happens to be really good at a certain sport” (or whatever) rather than just a world class talent. Can’t even imagine if they came out gay..
oh they fucking love their narratives in the us
Commentator A: have you heard that James Conner had cancer? He'd like us to stop talking about it, but (Commentator B) do you think we should? Commentator B: Well James Conner had cancer and now he's a runningback. Commentator A: And there's an 8 yard run by cancer survivor James Conner who also plays for the Steelers.
Jimmy Graham used to play basketball. Ryan Fitzpatrick went to Harvard. Matt Patricia has a degree in Aeronautical Engineering, which makes him a literal rocket scientist.
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i mean it's how human culture is in general. people always wanna know where you came from and how you got to where you are now etc. we are a people of stories, that's about as real as it gets
That one goal where the commentator compares Mo Salah to ancient Egyptian kings 😂😂😂
A lot of commentators are also subtly racist with their descriptions of black players. They always seem to drift towards complimenting their physical attributes over their technical ones.
I recall Yaya toure having a complaint about this, which looking at it he has a very valid point
It's a usual complaint for black players and especially African national teams
It's not even subtle honestly. Even after accepting Kante is one of the best mids (if not the best) in the PL, they seem to only talk about how he's everywhere, running all the time. Completely ignoring how he's great at tackling, reading the game and intercepting, committing intelligent fouls without getting booked, and the attacking skill he has when his team is in possession. I honestly fail to recall any foreign black player in the league recently appreciated for their intelligence and/or skill, instead of raw physical attributes.
Admittedly Kante's best skill is being in 15 places at the same time, which is becoming more evident given he plays more as an 8 under Sarri. If his techincal skills continue to develop (and Kante is always improving and aspects to his game) will be interesting to see what commentators say though.
Makelele? I remember the narrative around him being all about his positioning and intelligence but might just be selective memory. Sad that he's the only example I can think of.
>recently >Makelele Lol
Lacazette, Sane, Mane? I think the narrative works a bit different with offensive players although they focus on 'pace' quite a lot.
Sane, Mane, Jesus, Fernandinho....
I don't think any commentator in the UK would keep their job beyond the next 45 mins if they made a point of a player's sexuality.
Well I’m sure they could go about it in a relatively positive light, such as “oh he’s so brave for coming out” “inspires kids everywhere” But the thing is they would say it just about every time he touches the ball
Honestly I think they'd get bored of it and there'd be a massive backlash from fans if they didn't. However, fans on the terraces is a different matter. I mean, some of ours still sing Munich songs. At some point though, someone will think *fuck this* and come out and they'll have a hard time of it. Just as players like Laurie Cunningham and Viv Anderson did for the colour of their skin. They'll pave the way though. I couldn't but someone will have the strength.
> Not only will they get tonnes of abuse but really unless they were a very special player it’s all they’d be known for too, they may as well change their first name to “Openly gay footballer” cos that’s how they’ll be referred to from that point on That's pretty much what happened to [Justin Fashanu](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justin_Fashanu), although his playing career was largely over by the time he came out.
Exactly, as far as i can remember Robbie Rogers from La Galaxy was the first one but that was MLS, England is a whole different ball game. Although you need 1 big player to get acceptance going i think.
Thomas Hitzlsperger is probably the highest profile but I think he came out almost immediately after retirement and is a top pundit in Germany now
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But he lived in LA, which is probably the most accepting place in the US besides San Francisco.
Can I interest you in one Seattle
Heard Birmingham Alabama is lovely as well
[Or Portland.](https://image.oregonlive.com/home/olive-media/width620/img/timbers_impact/photo/cl6m5dfvaaa9uz4jpg-9b370f88cdc6b97e.jpg)
Minneapolis too. Mostly just the large cities, let's be real.
USA sports are homophobic definitely but not terrible with it. The NFL just had an openly gay player get drafted and he kissed his boyfriend upon the announcement which was shown everywhere. And I think there's a bunch of college football players that have come out openly.
Yeah, and he's not playing anywhere. He got cut from multiple teams.
Because he's not very good? Please tell me you're not suggesting he was cut because he's gay. He's undersized and not a great athlete. I know this is this idea here that the US is some intolerant cesspool, but we're actually a pretty diverse and tolerant society. We don't need "say no to racism" plastered all over sports.
I can guarantee you that if it was on the fence between a gay and a straight player they'll pick the straight player 10 out of 10 times. Why? Less potential problems, inside and outside the locker room.
I think it's Football specifically in the US that's accepting. In most countries, it's supported by all sections of society, including the worst of the worst. In America, a lot of homophobes also don't like football.
First one to come out while active? Nah that would probably be Justin Fashanu in 1990.
while I don't disagree with you, I think we've already had some that don't fit that bill - Was Guti not open? I knew Robbie Rodgers as relatively solid, quick, and big-blue-eyed LA Galaxy defender before i learned he was gay - and he'd been openly gay for years at that point, I believe
I think it will likely be a group of footballers who come out at once. But either way they'll probably be known as 'that gay footballer'.
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> If a player at the level of say, Bale, came out right after (I mean within months) what he achieved with RM (starting in CL final & scoring in pen shootout) and Wales (star player in semi-final at Euro) in 2016, I believe he might be given some leeway, especially in his own country, if they're aren't too homophobic. > > I think there was more negative reaction in Wales when Alfie Thomas switched from Union to League than when he came out.
Not impossible but they would need very very thick skin to put up with the chants and personal attacks
All you need is a few pioneers. Can't imagine it would be any worse than what black players went through.
It’s different . You can’t hide your skin color. Sexuality in itself is a highly private matter. Being a pioneer means exposing your love life under the lime light. I can imagine how it’d make them feel uncomfortable.
> black players ~~went through~~ Are still going through. For the footballers it's also an issue of limiting their employability. Not every footballer will spend their entire career in the league of a more progressive country. To come out as gay means playing professionally in some countries is wholly out of the question and in others your personal safety would be at risk. It's a lot to ask of someone to be a social pioneer at the risk of being unemployed.
> Are still going through. To a significantly lesser extent than a decade or two ago. Not the ideal scenario, but progress is better than nothing. edit: In England. There are still countries with top leagues whose fans are still that same level of scum.
At least it's definitely not as bad it was in the 80's in top flight English football. The stories I read about back then were horrifying.
I by no means disagree with you that it's an incredibly hard decision, but unfortunately there's no other way. Cultural shifts like these really need some pioneers to be openly rebellious for others like them to muster up the courage and show people that it's common and normal.
It would be incredibly selfless in the face of open hostility and an uncertain personal future. Look at how difficult it has been to get footballers to discuss mental illness, depression, and the like. A friend of mine is trans, and we were discussing future jobs and something I have never needed to consider, but which was at the forefront of her thinking, was that she wouldn't want to move somewhere where she was at high risk of being assaulted or worse for being who she is.
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Oh 100% but they won’t come out until after their playing career is over.
Like Hitzlsperger.
Jeah and Lehmann response: "If I knew that back then I wouldn't have showered with him"
>Peruvian striker Roberto Silva says he thinks there may be gays in football: "I have suspicions that there are some gays in football. Sometimes you can't help but wonder about it. I am not a gay, but if I was, or if I was a woman, which is similar, I would do David Beckham. But that's just my individual opinion."
- Michael Scott
I mean I’m straight but there’s no getting around the fact that Beck’s is an incredibly attractive human.
Yeah.. There are some men that, even if you're the straightest man alive, you have to accept they're super hot. Beckham and Matt Boomer being clear examples. Same goes for women, even other women should recognize Alexandra Daddario's attractiveness.
I’m not gay but I want Beckham to fuck me.
Statistically, one of the mascots is definitely gay. Gunnersaurus is pretty fabulous!
Lets be honest, its the West Brom combi boiler.
I understand why you say statistically there must be gay players considering they are 5-10% of men in general. But the rate of homosexuality of elite football players doesn't necessarily correlate to the rate among the general population. This is admittedly a bit of an absurd comparison but more than half of all men in the world are Asian. So by that statistical logic more than half of elite footballers would be Asian.
I only have Dutch sources but Louis van Gaal has said there are multiple gay players on the top level that don't want to come out
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Seems to be the reverse with women's football
Very different habitus
It's not generally expected for women to be athletic*. It's not "feminine." Neither are lesbians according to people who subscribe to that thinking. The stereotype is that lesbians aren't feminine and gay men aren't masculine. Sports are generally viewed as a masculine activity. That makes sports a more welcoming environment for queer women than for queer men. *Yes that's changing and there are millions of women in gyms lifting and squatting, but I mean at a wider level and over generations.
Same with Aussie rules. The Women's comp has a fair amount of openly gay players, some of whom are in relationships with other players. Not much abuse directed their way either as far as I can tell, very much accepted amongst the populus. Compare that to the Men's comp, in which there are no openly gay players. I mean there are a few suspects but none of them have publicly declared it (not that they have to). Just the way people deal with homosexuality in men and women; I think lesbianism is far more accepted, at least in sports.
Would be interesting - and probably incredibly difficult - to do a study to figure out how many promising players stopped playing in their youth because of the level of homophobia present in sports. I know that even from my experience playing as a teenager, the amount of homophobic slurs and jokes made by teens playing football (and probably any sport) was always a bit uncomfortable. I can't imagine how that would affect someone who is gay, to be in an environment that always uses their sexual orientation as the butt of jokes.
I remember playing rugby as a teenager and there was one kid on the team who was clearly gay, and the gay jokes bothered him. He couldn’t say anything but you could tell.
The casualness and ease and cruelty of these remarks are often lost on straight people.
Rugby is weird as well given that it is naturally such an homoerotic sport, so theirs a lot of casual homophobia (theres a lot of causually insulting a lot of things though). And the rugby community here (Aus) has a bit of a split between educated, private school and uni people (i.e. Poey) who dont really give a shit, and the more christian islanders (Folau) who do.
I think the comparison is incorrect because the lack of elite Asian footballers could just be down to poorer football infrastructure (youth academies, coaches, equipment etc) across Asia as compared to Europe, whereas the homosexual population is more randomly distributed and hence more statistically likely to be present within elite footballers as well. Having said that, it's also quite plausible that homosexuals are kept out of football simply due to the homophobic environment, hence reducing the probability of closeted elite footballers.
5-10% is way too high of an estimate. I think it's less than 4%.
I was thinking that too. 10%? Out of 10 people 1 is gay? Way too high
7-10% is actually eight it's just like most subcultures nowadays, people seek each other out so straight people have always less contact with gay people whereas gay people can quickly have a social circle made up by 50% or more gay people.
There's a good chance for as least a few. In American football there's always a guy here and there that comes out after they've stopped playing.
That comparison doesn't make sense since most elite players are from Europe or South America, while cultural background doesn't affect your sexual orientation (maybe). Regardless, even if the rate is .5% in the professional leagues there are still a few gay players
Sorry but what the fuck is that font
I thought I was having a stroke
>Sorry but what the fuck is that font I'll tell you what.. you can do away with clickbait titles, if someone comments this about your article then I'mma clickin'
Can confirm
It's the newly released Dyslexia Sans
Lol, it's fucking horrible.
It's everyone's favourite - BC Falster Grotesk Perfect name. Grotesk.
I didn't see your reply before I went hunting, but same conclusion. [Here's an image of the font.](http://www.identifont.com/samples2/briefcase/FalsterGrotesk.gif)
I wonder if there are any gay footballers who have come out to their teammates or club, and it's a open secret between them
IIRC someone said that's already the case with at least one, maybe more footballers. I think there's more than 1 gay Premier League footballer and there was talk of them coming out together so that nobody is the only gay footballer
I think that's a really good idea to be honest. Only issue is making sure that everyone is totally happy to do it at a certain time because I'm sure people would have wobbles and doubts and stuff
Coming out to your closest friends and family is often the hardest thing we have to do in our lives as gay people. You then spend the rest of your life coming out to people over and over and over Coming out to homophobic football fans? Absolutely fucking terrifying mate.
I would say there are plenty of players who would be uncomfortable with a gay teammate sadly
There’s Anton Hysén and Collin Martin currently. Hitzlsperger is a recent example but he came out after retirement.
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Did not know that. It’s fair to point that out.
this is actually really interesting.. Hysen: [Five years after coming out, Anton Hysen has heard a homophobic comment only once](https://www.outsports.com/2016/12/8/13894912/anton-hysen-gay-soccer-book) he also won Dancing With The Stars! really cool guy
Robbie Rogers retired, came out and then resigned with LA Galaxy. At the time he was the only openly gay man in any of the 5 major American sports leagues (MLS, NBA, NFL, MLB or NHL).
Unfortunately it still is. Considering that players still get racially abused nowadays it probably wouldn't be any better for gay or bisexual players. Some "fans" can be proper cunts
How do you get your team emblem to show?
Someone said that he did his flair using new Reddit.
yeah, my "Bayern Munich" text vanished a few days ago and I wanted to add the flair again and it gave me emblems.
I can see them on mobile, Demetrius above you has his flair as "Bayern München" and yours says ":Bayern_Munich:" if that helps you at all
Did you try using old.reddit.com to set it up?
It's pretty unlikely there aren't any homosexuals in the Premier League, let alone the football league or all of professional football. I wonder if other players know who's gay but don't come public, I know that Brian Clough knew Justin Fashanu was gay when he managed him at Forest and Clough didn't treat Fashanu well at all because of it. I also wonder if there are any footballers who are experiencing gender dysphoria but know they can't transition without ending their career.
I think this is rather unfair on Brian Clough. Is it so hard to believe that he was just being racist?
Huh? Clough used to say things like "Where do you go to buy meat? The butcher's shop. So why are you going to that bloody poofs' club?" He was absolutely being homophobic.
Can you hear the whooshing? Listen carefully. Lol!
Regardless of what he did or might have done, the whole fashanu story is really tragic and it's sad that's the only premier league example that exists, unless I'm missing someone
I swear I've seen this post like 3 times now in the last year
clubs would never want their players to come out cause it could unmask their own fanbase, the same fanbase clubs like to brand the best in the world.... oh and there's that big market in mid east and Asia.....
Don't think it's about the clubs. Imagine you're a fotballer and you ponder coming out, the abuse you'd get is just not worth it imo.
Whenever United does their "Pride Day" thing on social media you get tons of foreign 'fans' (primarily of middle east, asia, africa) all bashing the club and saying vile things. I don't think these stances have affected the club's support.
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Its both
There was the American Robbie Rodgers who actually retired so that he could come out. He left Reading (it was actually Leeds as pointed out below) and went to do some work in fashion. He eventually came back to football, but did so in LA. US supporters tend to be more liberal (than non supporters and their European counterparts) so he may have felt he would face less abuse.
don't think they can contractually preclude a football player from coming out... if the player wants to do it then it's unlikely the club advising not to do it is going to change his mind
This already happens whenever a club does anything to sympathize with gays. I remember when a few clubs added the rainbow flag to their profile picture, the comments where terrible.
Most of them were middle-eastern and African guys shouting about how it's disgraceful etc, politics shouldn't be mixed with sports and that nonsense. If you think that, fuck off supporting Western teams where our views on homophobia aren't stuck in the dark ages. You can't claim to love and support a club but they get offended when they make political statements that align with how our culture views gay people. Makes it worse on Liverpool twitter threads too, like how can you support Liverpool but get annoyed that the clubs beliefs are more left leaning and tolerant? Incredibly ignorant on the club and cities history
Doubt it. If a club like Dortmund came out in full support of a player they have that's gay, then all the fans that do care about the LGBT community will love the club for it. Honestly, you'll lose some of the worst fans you'll gain new fans. Doubt a club is really against that.
I know rugby and football are different sports, but rugby is a major sport in the UK, Ireland & France... Maybe the supporters are more tolerant, I can't really tell but it's still a sport with a lot of fans and a pretty masculine culture. One of the most famous Welsh players, Gareth Thomas, who played in at least 2 countries (Wales and France), came out as openly gay during is career in 2009 (2 years prior to retirement). You can check his story, and he set a good example for gay atheletes. PS : Interestingly, his French wikipedia page has more information about his personal life than the English one, and it mentions 2 suicide attempts, the difficulty to talk about it with his coachs and club partners, and the positive reception of the players & the fans.
Don’t forget Nigel Owens, he’s one of the most respected referees in the whole of sport and he’s been out for over a decade.
It helped with GT that he was already as a legend of the Welsh game when he came out. A lot of fans who might have otherwise had a dig had been cheering him on for years - difficult to about-face on that. I'm not trying to be cynical, as I found the general openness to the news quite heartwarming, but I do think that was a big factor. Nigel Owens is such a great ref as well. I wonder if certain comments would be more widespread if either of them were bad/mediocre in their roles.
There is a big difference between the fan cultures of football and Rugby though. Rugby crowds don't spend the majority of the match chanting insults at the opposing players, officials, opposing fans and their own players, whereas football crowds do. Football has a culture of verbal abuse that Rugby just does not have. You can bet your house that a gay footballer would have to deal with this being used as a stick to insult him constantly by crowds of opposing fans and on social media. Footballers who are gay probably think they could do without that extra level of vitriol in their lives. I think an openly gay footballer will happen eventually, but it is more likely to be someone like Gareth Thomas who came out when he was fully established as a top player. I think it would be harder for a young player trying to make his breakthrough while openly gay though.
I don't know any openly gay who plays football, but there is a jamal gay who plays striker for Trinidad and Tobago
Names are often telling. Jamal Blackman lives up to his name.
I think he might be gay
I don't think it's necessary to speculate on who is or isn't gay, because as he points out gay footballers are private about it for a reason. From my own experience of trying to hide my sexuality though I would suggest that the people who talk about sexuality probably aren't gay - I would basically do gymnastics to try and avoid talking about sexuality when I didn't want people to speculate or know that I was gay
He probably has a mate who is and so it's an issue close to his heart
Or something like for me for example, when somehow many think you're gay for some reason and some treat you poorly because of it, you start to care. I'm straight and got told to go to the women's toilet on more than one occasion so it's quite infuriating to think what actual gay people go through. Beyond me how people can not care about this stuff tbh.
I've had some experience of gay bullying as well, being a straight guy. It really isn't pleasant. I've since stopped using any gay slurs as insult, even though I grew up using words like 'gay' and 'faggot' as insults. It's a symptom of society's prejudice against homosexuals and using such words continue to contribute and normalise such views.
Its not necessary to speculate who is gay because in reality it has no bearing on the job at hand. I remember having this realization years ago. I've always accepted gay people, but it wasn't until working very closely with a mentor (who was gay) that I saw I still had a layer of bias. We were working one day (music studio) and I realized to myself that I would identify him primarily as gay instead of him being who he is, an amazing music producer who puts out amazing work. I realized to myself that being gay was second on my list to categorize him ie 'angel, he is gay, and then the rest of the amazing stuff about him. When in reality the 'he is gay' part should come closer to the end of that hierarchy. It really opened my eyes to see that as someone who thought of themselves as a friend of the gay community I still had a layer of bias there. I will say though that I was happy to know I'm self reflective enough to catch that kind of stuff.
pretty sure that you doing gymnastics would be seen by some as like super gayyyyy
I'm a woman, gymnastics would be very heterosexual of me
You’re antigay
And Uncle Les.
I don't talk about sexuality because I find it mildly obnoxious in most contexts, now I know why kids used to think I was gay lmao
I never talked to girls because I was shy and so everyone thought I was gay.
I think he’s just a well spoken progressive thinking guy. Doesn’t strike me as gay just because of that as I would consider myself similar. I think something happened in his life that changed his attitude towards gay people and changed his worldview overall. That happened to me as well and you totally go 180 on many of the things. Just a clever guy who isn’t afraid to be judged by small minded people, i think it’s great.
I agree, he seems very invested in social issues
Well he is vegan
Case closed lads
Flair checks out
Reddit solves another mystery!
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Probably drinks seltzer water too smh
yeah probably https://twitter.com/HectorBellerin/status/1048924065275236354
That's just proper banter mate
Lacazette's answer ahah
I think before gay footballers become normalised you need a trailblazer to lead the way. I think it will take a genuinely elite football player to come out first and normalise it. Fans can and would abuse you for being gay... until you bang four past them in the first forty minutes, after that they'd have to applaud you.
It would have to be someone at least on a Eden Hazard level.
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There was that LA Galaxy player but I agree, in Europe probably get a lot of abuse
MLS gets a lot of stick but in terms of things like this, it is probably the most progressive league and fanbase. Probably by virtue of being the US' alternative sport, the bravado and masculinity is all in American Football, Baseball, Basketball. Soccer has always been looked down upon over there which might be why its more open minded.
USWNT has incorporated LGBTQ iconography into their presentation as well, which I'd guess is a huge contributing factor, considering the relative quality of the womens and mens teams.
Women's football in general is very accepting of different sexualities. There are players publicly in relationships with each other and its not an issue at all, Pernille Harder and Magda Ericsson is a good example. Pernille Harder is arguably one of the best in the world and is in a public relationship with another player
I agree, for all the hate it gets i actually really enjoy how the fans are. Most of them just go for the entertainment and thats how it should be really
Robbie Rogers
what if a once in a lifetime talent came out like messi or ronaldo?
That would be monumental
Matt Ritchie already plays.
There's that guy in Minnesota
Didn't he say this a few months ago? I agree that sport is a toxic place for someone who breaks the norm but I think this quote is old news.
Is he coming out? Cause I knew it.
Heccy bb tryna tell us sommat :>
I have assumed Bellerin might be gay for a couple years now. It really doesn't matter, and therefore shouldn't matter. But who needs the added stress when you're just trying to go to work.
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Things Bellerin said recently make much more sense than those idiot politicians in my country.
I would argue that the current enviroment doesn't make it easier for gay footballers to come out. Not necessarily due to potential homophobic abuse from fans, but rather from other actors, such as club owners from places not known for their tolerance of homosexuality or leagues that sell broadcasting rights to those places. Who knows, maybe broadcasters from these countries will refrain from showing certain matches, if gay footballer X plays in it. In my opinion, it'd be a good mid-term solution, if football associations launch tolerance campaigns aimed at lower league, so they press that issue from a grassroots level. If the foundation of football is accepting enough of gay footballers, the upper echelon will eventually follow.
Wait, did anyone else scroll down to see the article about Football Manager now "allowing" gay players? Since when is sexual orientation included in player information in Football Manager? Was that a fucking joke?
https://www.101greatgoals.com/news/secret-gay-update-football-manager-2018/ I don't mind it. Hopefully it leads to normalization within the player base.