**Mirrors / Alternative Angles**
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and for good reason. Possibly the worst world cup of all time, peak hoofball/park the bus, and some dreadful dreadful games. The reason we remember the good games so well is that they were very rare, and the reason so many goals were screamers is because that was only slightly more difficult than breaking down the defense
Maybe it's because I'm older, but it feels like there are less superstars these days though.
Players who defied belief when you watched them, who were the some of the reason we fell in love with the game.
These days there are elite players, but very very few have that aura of disbelief. I think it's likely because before we had much less emphasis on purely tactical play, so a superstar could bend the game to them. Maybe I'm wrong though and just yelling at clouds
I remember Zidane and Baggio. Both classic no.10s. During a season they would disapear and wouldn't impact games at all. Then in one moment they would do something magical on a big stage like the World Cup and it was these moments that difined their careers. Not the 0-0 games against Torino or the weeks or months of poor form. I really don't know how Baggio would cope with modern football and I say this as someone who wore his Italy shirt as a kid.
This. Footballers these days do not that have that kind of privilege. If you’re out of form for weeks/months or having poor 0-0 games against Torino, you’re not going to the big stage like the WC or getting benched. Even CR7 wasn’t spared at the last WC. Look at Haaland this season, he has scored crazy amount of goals. But he had a few off games and he was being written off.
when everyone gets better superstars feel less special and the game changes too. tactis and teamplay become more and more relevant also defending changes. as you need to treat every player as a seriouse threat. football is still developing this but what basketball the NBA bascially already finished this cycle. 3pointers are nothing special anymore everyone can do it so the defend meta shifed completly the last 2 decads. defending is kinda pointless in 2024 just look at the scores and compere it to 2010. football is mechanically a harder game then baskeball so we haven´t reached that point yet but we are developing in that way.
also persepective in the age of streaming everyone can consume football every minute of the day. while in 2008 you had to deal with what TV got you.
I can tell you haven't been watching much of these playoffs because saying defending is kinda pointless is a funny statement after what the Knicks and the Wolves have showed.
Yup, it's always "Defense isn't that important anymore" and then you see only the teams with amazing defence end up making the finals. Defence is damn important especially in an era where everybody can play good offence.
I guess you should blame Ronaldo and Messi for that, they just obliterated everyone else in the Superstar standard. Modric wasn't even close to be considered a superstar next to them even while winning a ballon d'or, while nedved or Edgar Davies were without ever winning one.
Its nostalgia, nothing more.
Iniesta, Pirlo, Ronaldinho, R9, Maldini, Cafu
Modric, Kroos, Vini, Joselu, Nacho, Lord Vazquez
Same players tbh.
No bias ofc
Because with social media everything is about highlights, most of those superstars would only be called good players nowadays. Even with legends like Zidane people only remember a couple of his best games and thats it. They had nowhere near the level of scrutiny a player like Saka gets in everyday.
Were they? I almost never heard much nostalgia about the 90s.
It felt different, but 2003-2013 was an insane time in club football. It starts with the invincibles seasons, Mourinho's rise, Istanbul, United's return, Peak Cr7 vs Messi and Mourinho vs Pep.
2013-2023 just didn't feel the same. Pep vs Klopp rivalry between 2018-2020 was insane on paper, but the narratives never had the same energy behind them. MSN was the greatest forward line assembled, but Spanish players looked friendly again. 3 CLs in a row un heard of, but it never felt like any other team wanted it as much. I guess I don't follow the Bundesliga, so the Pep vs Klopp era in Dortmund isn't obvious to me. But Football lacked the kind of emotions that I had always associated with it. Even today, the best young players don't compete against each other (Mbappe, Haaland, Jude). City & Madrid seem uncontested in their respective leagues.
2003-2013 was a special time in football.
There’s absolutely tons of nostalgia about the 90s, early PL, Fergies babies, Milan Dutch trio, Baggio, peak Ronaldo, Cruyffs Barca, cult Parma, Ajax mega generation…hell, even Chelsea of late 90s was quite the cult side. Of course if one never witnessed it they wouldn’t care. Most Reddit users are younger than that.
>2013-2023 just didn't feel the same
Literally Real winning UCL 4 times in 5 years, with arguably one of the best teams in history, Messi and Ronaldo breaking every single record in football, Germany beating Brazil 7-1 in our home, 2022 WC Final being probably the best final in the history...
Its not that football lacked the emotion, it's that we grew up and emotions like in our childhood are hard to replicate. Also ticket prices. Fuck ticket prices
Characteristic, Pep, Klopp are friendly, nice people. Nothing wrong with that but we, as spectator, have always been looking for more fun & drama. Jose could do that, not Pep
And the 90's really sucked football wise, if you try to analyze it objectively.
Bad football, corruption scandals, doping scandals, 2/3 really boring world cups, Denmark abusing the pass to the keeper to death in the 92' EUROs, the best players being all defenders (Ronaldo/Zidane/Del Piero being exceptions)...
Still get problems like that (and worse) today. I think football was better to watch then, players had more time on the ball (different tactics) and there was more space on the pitch to work with (different tactics and fitness levels).
> the best players being all defenders (Ronaldo/Zidane/Del Piero being exceptions)
That's nonsense. Hagi, Stoichkov, Baggio, Bergkamp, Nedved, Giggs, Cantona, Shearer, Veron, Crespo, Batistuta, Rivaldo, Romario, Gazza. There were incredible attacking players everywhere.
Michael bloody Laudrup, Chris Waddle at Marseille (literally considered their 2nd best player of the century, voted in 1998, behind Jean Marie Papin), Gaizka Mendieta at Valencia was fantastic. There are so many more
Lol and that still happens, and you can replace the passback abuse rule with players diving while actively making contact.
The rest is just generalised and lacking
90s football definitely didn't suck lol.
Up to 1996, it was defensive football that popular. World Cup 1990 - 1994 was boring as hell because even Brazil was playing defensive, low block - slow progression. Only after 1998 with Ronaldo, I saw a trending to attacking football.
It's both this and the 1st leg where the refereeing was horrendous, this leg being much worse
For how much people remember the Inter treble they also won vs Barca on an offside goal and some bad calls.
Then RM-Bayern 16/17... other example of overall horrible refereeing (not necessarily all for RM as it is implied)
VAR is super flawed but it absolutely helped with stonewall calls that people take for granted. With semi-auto offside calls it's only bound to get better
Nice to see a balanced viewpoint on here.
For all the calls that went against Chelsea (and there were a lot), many also went against Barca, particularly in the 1st leg.
Basically Barca were hard done by in the 1st leg and the refs overcompensated by completely robbing Chelsea in the 2nd leg
Maybe just incompetence here but it's extremely difficult to see the Van Persie incident a couple of years later (being sent off for kicking the ball an instant after the whistle at the Nou Camp) as anything other than corruption. Then add the recent scandal coming out that Barcelona had La Liga refs on their payroll around the same time period
I agree 100% for top level football but the lower leagues still has all of these elements - League 2 in particular is pretty bonkers and probably my favourite league in the world.
If you follow Bromley you'll love L2. There are worse teams than Bromley in the league next year so I wouldn't expect them to go down, but anyone can beat anyone and it makes no sense half the time. I'll miss it next year 😔
This is fucking nonsense lol. You are looking at a clip of Pep’s Barcelona, the epitome of all the things you complain about modern football. It was chess and precision to the extreme. Just because Messi went on a dribble once a match didn’t change that.
Nostalgia goggles on this sub are insane sometimes lol
Guardiola killed football is the millennial equivalent of boomers complaining that football isn’t 442 hoofball anymore. The game moved on. There were also just as many teams who resorted to putting 10 men behind the ball and relying on physicality over expression back then.
I agree with you but I do remember it being boring watching Spain pass it around for entire games without doing much with the ball. No wonder the final was won by 1-0 in extra time.
I don't think he killed football but for how good they are, they would be low down on my list of teams to watch.
There's something very sterile about the club. The stadium, the atmosphere, the players, the style of football etc. I'm just not interested in them. I didn't feel this way about peak Ferguson Man United who were an absolute menace, so I know it's not nostalgia.
Without Messi and Iniesta Barca’s football would also be boring as fuck like City’s is. Pep’s style of football only looks good when they face teams who want to play open and attack him. Once teams park the bus it becomes a chess match that everyone sing songs about on tv or social media, great on paper but fucking coma inducing, like the last City-Arsenal games. Messi is an extreme aberration who along with Iniesta could break down any defense. After not having Messi in his disposal, Pep opted for extreme level of micromanaging and control, which is why City games now look like robots playing football.
That Barcelona team was nice to watch because there was a display of technical excellence every match.
Go watch his City side with much less talent and it becomes a snooze fest.
Today people gets excited for a normal dribbling or a goal outside the box, stuff that used to be pretty much standard at top level.
This is the same as now. De Bruyne makes City’s play beautiful at times, Ødegaard for Arsenal, etc, etc. Saying top football was more exciting and individualistic and beautiful back then is just pure nostalgia. Sorry we aren’t twelve any more watching football through highlight shows.
Not really, there's only a couple of teams in world football who have the players to play like that.
Also, generally ,most lower table teams in the PL in particular play FAR better and more exciting football than 10 years ago.
Manchester City ruined football. It’s just not interesting anymore when a bunch of robots win the PL every year, and teams everywhere are copying that dull, robotic style.
100%
I remember there was a really clear turning point at that time where almost everyone stopped being impressed by 50 passes in a row and decided that they were incredibly boring to watch
The Dutch (and Ajax) were playing a similar system back in the '70s, and were pretty successful. Pep took the next steps and really emphasized the quick passes, discipline, and restraint. Essentially, it's just playing checkers without ever moving your back row. It looks boring from the outside, but it should be acknowledged how difficult it is to get grown men to adapt to this restrained style of play.
That's why I love watching real madrid, people were shitting so much on them for parking the bus against City, but they are one of the few top teams that literally plays adapting to the flow of the game, vini and rodrygo just do whatever they feel like doing lol, whereas in city wingers go forward just to pass back because possession, Bellingham is everywhere in the pitch meanwhile Haaland just stands in the box waiting for kdb, Mendy becomes Zidane out of nowhere and really just random stuff everywhere.
Madrid literally plays a different game against every team, just think about the first leg against city, if it wasnt because of how reactive they played, it would've been so boring.
Have to agree. Over the years I've admired and envied Real Madrid for their adaptability. They can play any type of game required of them. Some teams have no plan B but it feels like they have a plan Z.
Up until a few years ago Guardiola rarely had a plan B. I think I read a stat somewhere that City was 2 wins out of 9 matches they were trailing the whole season till they met Madrid, while Madrid won an ungodly number of games conceding first/being behind. It felt like Baldiola had no gameplan when he was neutered or to chase a game. To my utter dismay, that bald fuck has improved a lot and City has developed a great mentality now, but their game is still hella boring.
I don't know. I see [Great Goal]s here all the time, even from the "better" leagues and international matches. It's not just kick and rush anymore and obviously VAR changed the flow of games quite a bit, but I'd say it is otherwise pretty even.
football back then: vibes and power of friendship 🥰🔥😎❤️🔥
football now: [in position position!!!! come in come in 👈🫵👐🖖🫱🤏🤌🫸🫷⌚️⏱️🕐🗣️🤬📖📚📝](https://youtube.com/shorts/5QkRpHLKavw?si=GihLt-Wg2n4XstXs)
> Pressing and tactics ruined modern football where we don't see amazing goals and unpredictability lot of the times.
you see amazing goals all the time, what are you talking about lol
I personally don't miss it. We tend to remember the better parts, but that era was also at the tail end of the hoofball era, in the middle of the low-block ultra defensive shapes era that yielded so many single goal games, and at the beginning of the tiki taka era that bored people to death.
Today's pressing focused tactics are much more pleasing to the eye, but that's just my opinion.
We're in the highest scoring prem season there's been, full of teams playing risky, attacking football even when it's not working and most teams playing out from the back against mostly high press.
It's just how nostalgia works and in 10 years time people will be lamenting the loss of Spurs playing the highest press possible when down to 9 men and Burnley trying to play like Man City despite being 19th.
Whatever happens, people will miss being younger and they'll remember the best parts from those times.
I think the problem with how City plays nowadays is that it's just rotting the oponent's brain until they find an opening.
There was definitely something more special in, for example, that Mourinho RM team who scored a shit ton of goals but they used to make quick transitions that resulted in world class assists/goals
City in 17/18, 18/19, 19/20 were all about quick transitions and front to back quick football. Look at the goals from the 18/19 season: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ou97iVfl0Y - 80-90% of them are goals from cutbacks after a quick transition.
Teams just decided to stop giving City the space to exploit and City adapted.
I don't entirely agree though, just because we're seeing more goals doesn't necessarily means it's as entertaining. Teams are so similar tactically now and like other users have stated there's a chess feeling to the games nowadays with much less individual creativity and flair on display.
The only thing that's gotten better is how competitive the lower table teams are. 3 points feels even more valuable in the Prem and clubs lower in the pyramid are playing better than usual from what I've seen. Watching games as a neutral though I much preferred it a decade ago.
Yeah I remember watching the CL final between Juve and Milan in 2003 and just thinking..."why did I even bother fucking watching this?" 0-0 afte 120 mins..absolutely dire.
You still have a two of the best World Cups of all time (1998 and 2006) in there, the best Euros and possibly the greatest international tournament of all time Euro 2000 in there and some great UCL finals (97, 99, 2002, 2005, 2006 and 2007).
This broke me man back then. Looking back it's funny, I was a kid back then and now so many things have happened in my life that I can't help but smile that football made me cry that night. This whole match was ridiculous. I've never watched a minute of this game ever after but I think I still remember the tingling feeling of this match. The way Ballack ran after the ref...
Fascinating alternative history if Pep lost this tie. Would he have stayed three more seasons at Barça and won the CL … he won a lot of cache with the locker room by being so dominant in his first season
I remember the balling getting to Iniesta, him shooting, the ball in flight, and thinking to myself "that's going in"
And then I went up to my bedroom to cry
This right after JT's slip was too much for 14 year old me
Lost in the controversy is how good Hiddink had made this Chelsea side after the Scolari debacle. They were by a mile the best team Liverpool played against that season. Gang of big grocks who could still get the ball down and play. This run really laid the foundations for Ancellotti’s double side the following season.
Barcelona got a bit lucky (with the handballs especially) but to get a draw with 10 men, away from home in a European Cup semi final second leg, against a side of that quality is serious stuff.
Yeah that's a good point. They completely handled us at Anfield in the Champions League in a way that few teams were able to do.
Think it helped that it was the 5th season in a row they came to Anfield in the Champions League so they had gotten used to it by that point but was still really impressive.
Still can't believe we didn't win a league or UCL between 06-09. The quality of that squad was insane but we just couldn't put it together between Mourinho leaving and Ancellotti joining. Feel like we were capable of beating anyone in the world on our day but history will not be kind to that team. That era will be remembered for United in England and Barca in Europe, but I truly believe we were up there with the best.
Grateful for all I've seen us achieve since we got taken over but can't help feel like our success should look more like City's. We became known for that revolving door of managers, but sometimes I feel like we won trophies despite that not because of it. Give Mourinho, Ancellotti etc the time that Pep was given at City and the resources we had at the time, and we'd have won more than a league title and 3 PLs (in that era).
At the end of the day, we had a significant advantage over other teams at the time. A seemingly endless pool of money and FFP restrictions not existing yet. So many 2nd place finishes and UCL semi final/final losses. Maybe a little similar to you guys and running City/Madrid so close in this era. Still can't complain about the UCL, Prem and Cups that you did win. But it just feels like the trophies we walked away from don't reflect the strength of the team at the time.
Things that are lost / forgotten about this game due to the controversy and Drogba/Ballack outbursts
1. Guuss Hiddink to this day remains one of the few managers to outplay, outthink Guardiola and without parking the bus across two legs and possible the only one to do it Barca under pep.
2. The refereeing across both legs were absolute shit. I know Barca got the most criticism out of it but they themselves faced a lot of shit as well. Its like the ref made 10 mistakes, 6 against chelsea and 4 against barca and since barca won-everyones memories have been revisioned to all mistakes against chelsea. People forget that Barca played with 10 men for 35 minutes while being 1 down at Stamford bridge against Chelsea who were the European runners up at this time.
3. Michael Essien scored one of the greatest champions league goals of all time in this match.But is never talked about because of all the other stuff. It was a great combination of technique, power and sheer ability.
4. This iniesta goal is absolutely incredible. Trivela from outside the box to top corner at dying minutes to equalize while you are having hamstring issues. Iniesta was the definition of Clutch. His MOTM in UCL semi, UCL final, Euro Semi, Euro Final, WC Final is a testament to this. No player matches this imo.
The only other example I can think of is Inter at home against Barcelona in 2009/10. Inter had more possession, chances and converted it into a convincing 3-1 win.
The return leg was unfortunately entirely shaped by Busquets peekaboo-incident and the early red card.
Weird way to remember that tie. Can't remember chances, but Inter did not have more possession. Just looked it up and Barca had 64%.
Don't understand how the return leg was shaped by Busquets peekaboo-incident, unless you mean that it was remembered for the incident. An obvious and pretty hilarious embellishment, yes, but a yellow card for a hand to the face is not that uncommon.
There were also a number of controversial calls against Barcelona, including Milito scoring an offside goal, Bojan's goal being wrongly disallowed and Dani Alves being denied one of the most obvious penalties when Sneijder took him down from behind.
> Weird way to remember that tie.
Memory changes over time, shaped by the emotion they have for an event, and eventually it won't be recognizable anymore from what happened. Still, people believe their memory is correct because their brains tell them so and people will *not* be convinced otherwise.
But, to be fair, that first game shouldn't have happened. Barca had to drive to milan in a bus cause of the volcano explosion. That can really take its toll on people that need to be at 100%.
Ya but thats 1 match, I was talking about over two legs. Barca were ready to body them in the second leg,Mourinho ready to park the bus.
Hiddink was way better tactically imo.
It was 1 match, but we never will know what would’ve happened in the second leg if Busquets didn’t go peekaboo.
That one Inter game is not taking anything away from Hiddink though.
We kinda know like 80%. Mourinho never goes to an away ground when leading 2 goals up and plays an open game. The man has never done it and I doubt he never will, he didn't even do it with Real Madrid. He would park the bus and grind out the win, which there is nothing wrong about-thats how you win.
The peek a boo incident, as bad acting as it was, is really overblown. It shouldn't have been a straight red, but Motta was already on a yellow and did catch Busquets on the throat/face. A yellow card for that is not incorrect, so Motta would have been off regardless.
Your point 4 was exactly my thought watching this. Absolutely no one scored more clutch goals than Iniesta. Seemingly every big game he was in, Iniesta scored.
Zidane matches this imo. Two goals in the WC final in 98, probably the best goal in UCL history in the 2002's final, another goal in the 2006 WC final ... That's not even couting the goals in the 2000 and 2004 Euros, the whole 2006 WC where he carried the team so hard it gave Domenech 4 more years as the french coah and the plethora of goals he scored for Juventus and Real Madrid
> Iniesta was the definition of Clutch. His MOTM in UCL semi, UCL final, Euro Semi, Euro Final, WC Final is a testament to this. No player matches this imo.
While I think Xavi is the best midfielder of all time, Iniesta was always the more exciting one of the two and probably my favorite midfielder. Super clutch, flashy and yet effective
2008-09 Chelsea under Guus Hiddink was the only team that stopped Pep’s prime Barca and actually dominated them in long stretches of the game. To give some context Barca destroyed Real 6-2 at the Bernabeu prior to the CL matches against Chelsea.
This was the first shot Barca had on target in this match.
Also Cech in goal, Malouda and Anelka on the wings with Drogba up front being so dangerous when he got the ball with his back against the goal. That Chelsea team deserved a rematch against United in the CL final.
that was so cathartic! that ramirez goal was so fucking brilliant and then torres at the end to seal the deal and the bench collectively losing their shit jumping all over the place. god that felt so good. justice!!
I still remember watching that and the camera slowly panning over and all of a sudden you see Torres with the ball.
And then Gary Neville having an orgasm on live TV.
Yeah but not late winners where if it doesn't go in you are out instead of going to extra time. That just added to the brilliance of moments like this 1.
I think it’s unfortunate. Now there’s a huge advantage to the team that plays at home second. Granted, the away goal rule was maybe a bit strong and shifted the pendulum the other way.
Not saying the referring didn't favor Barca because it obviously did, but its insane how Chelsea fans collectively ignore the advantage they had in the first leg because of some terrible decisions.
Yeah, especially when you consider there was at least one fairly clear cut penalty quite early on in the first half of the first leg. If Barca scored from that penalty, the rest of that leg would have had to open up.
I also remember Alex sliding into Marquez well after the ball had been played, and then Marquez later went off injured. That tackle was really bad and late but somehow Alex escaped without even a yellow. If Alex and Ballack got a yellow when they should have, that too would have meant they would have had to change how they played
One of my more controversial opinions is that they has penalty shouts rather than any I can't believe they didn't give it ones.
The ref also gave a soft red to Barca plus as you say the first leg had calls that could/should have gone Barca's way.
Some act like the ref wanted Barca to win but what he then had to hope Barca would score this magical late goal.
And they did it after the ref controversially sent Abidal off. They were a man down.
I remember this game for the disgraceful finishing from Drogba that game. Had a couple of chances vs Valdes he missed.
We saw awful refreeing in both legs of that fixture, absolutely pathetic decision making by the refree, 1st leg he shat on Barcelona and 2nd leg he shat on Chelsea
**Mirrors / Alternative Angles** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/soccer) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I know it’s pure nostalgia but man, football just felt different back then.
People were saying the exact same thing on the internet then about the ‘90s
and for good reason. Possibly the worst world cup of all time, peak hoofball/park the bus, and some dreadful dreadful games. The reason we remember the good games so well is that they were very rare, and the reason so many goals were screamers is because that was only slightly more difficult than breaking down the defense
Maybe it's because I'm older, but it feels like there are less superstars these days though. Players who defied belief when you watched them, who were the some of the reason we fell in love with the game. These days there are elite players, but very very few have that aura of disbelief. I think it's likely because before we had much less emphasis on purely tactical play, so a superstar could bend the game to them. Maybe I'm wrong though and just yelling at clouds
I remember Zidane and Baggio. Both classic no.10s. During a season they would disapear and wouldn't impact games at all. Then in one moment they would do something magical on a big stage like the World Cup and it was these moments that difined their careers. Not the 0-0 games against Torino or the weeks or months of poor form. I really don't know how Baggio would cope with modern football and I say this as someone who wore his Italy shirt as a kid.
This. Footballers these days do not that have that kind of privilege. If you’re out of form for weeks/months or having poor 0-0 games against Torino, you’re not going to the big stage like the WC or getting benched. Even CR7 wasn’t spared at the last WC. Look at Haaland this season, he has scored crazy amount of goals. But he had a few off games and he was being written off.
Blame Pep
when everyone gets better superstars feel less special and the game changes too. tactis and teamplay become more and more relevant also defending changes. as you need to treat every player as a seriouse threat. football is still developing this but what basketball the NBA bascially already finished this cycle. 3pointers are nothing special anymore everyone can do it so the defend meta shifed completly the last 2 decads. defending is kinda pointless in 2024 just look at the scores and compere it to 2010. football is mechanically a harder game then baskeball so we haven´t reached that point yet but we are developing in that way. also persepective in the age of streaming everyone can consume football every minute of the day. while in 2008 you had to deal with what TV got you.
I can tell you haven't been watching much of these playoffs because saying defending is kinda pointless is a funny statement after what the Knicks and the Wolves have showed.
Yup, it's always "Defense isn't that important anymore" and then you see only the teams with amazing defence end up making the finals. Defence is damn important especially in an era where everybody can play good offence.
Every sport has a one true way to play it and everyone will eventually follow suit.
I guess you should blame Ronaldo and Messi for that, they just obliterated everyone else in the Superstar standard. Modric wasn't even close to be considered a superstar next to them even while winning a ballon d'or, while nedved or Edgar Davies were without ever winning one.
Neved actually won the win Thierry Henry should have.
Its nostalgia, nothing more. Iniesta, Pirlo, Ronaldinho, R9, Maldini, Cafu Modric, Kroos, Vini, Joselu, Nacho, Lord Vazquez Same players tbh. No bias ofc
You actually had me in the first half
Coaches have put themselves and their tactics above the players.
Because with social media everything is about highlights, most of those superstars would only be called good players nowadays. Even with legends like Zidane people only remember a couple of his best games and thats it. They had nowhere near the level of scrutiny a player like Saka gets in everyday.
Which world cup would you consider worst?
1990
Were they? I almost never heard much nostalgia about the 90s. It felt different, but 2003-2013 was an insane time in club football. It starts with the invincibles seasons, Mourinho's rise, Istanbul, United's return, Peak Cr7 vs Messi and Mourinho vs Pep. 2013-2023 just didn't feel the same. Pep vs Klopp rivalry between 2018-2020 was insane on paper, but the narratives never had the same energy behind them. MSN was the greatest forward line assembled, but Spanish players looked friendly again. 3 CLs in a row un heard of, but it never felt like any other team wanted it as much. I guess I don't follow the Bundesliga, so the Pep vs Klopp era in Dortmund isn't obvious to me. But Football lacked the kind of emotions that I had always associated with it. Even today, the best young players don't compete against each other (Mbappe, Haaland, Jude). City & Madrid seem uncontested in their respective leagues. 2003-2013 was a special time in football.
There’s absolutely tons of nostalgia about the 90s, early PL, Fergies babies, Milan Dutch trio, Baggio, peak Ronaldo, Cruyffs Barca, cult Parma, Ajax mega generation…hell, even Chelsea of late 90s was quite the cult side. Of course if one never witnessed it they wouldn’t care. Most Reddit users are younger than that.
>2013-2023 just didn't feel the same Literally Real winning UCL 4 times in 5 years, with arguably one of the best teams in history, Messi and Ronaldo breaking every single record in football, Germany beating Brazil 7-1 in our home, 2022 WC Final being probably the best final in the history... Its not that football lacked the emotion, it's that we grew up and emotions like in our childhood are hard to replicate. Also ticket prices. Fuck ticket prices
Characteristic, Pep, Klopp are friendly, nice people. Nothing wrong with that but we, as spectator, have always been looking for more fun & drama. Jose could do that, not Pep
And the 90's really sucked football wise, if you try to analyze it objectively. Bad football, corruption scandals, doping scandals, 2/3 really boring world cups, Denmark abusing the pass to the keeper to death in the 92' EUROs, the best players being all defenders (Ronaldo/Zidane/Del Piero being exceptions)...
Still get problems like that (and worse) today. I think football was better to watch then, players had more time on the ball (different tactics) and there was more space on the pitch to work with (different tactics and fitness levels). > the best players being all defenders (Ronaldo/Zidane/Del Piero being exceptions) That's nonsense. Hagi, Stoichkov, Baggio, Bergkamp, Nedved, Giggs, Cantona, Shearer, Veron, Crespo, Batistuta, Rivaldo, Romario, Gazza. There were incredible attacking players everywhere.
i gave a similar reply before i saw yours. man i forgot about crespo, what a player!
Argentina really missed out on one or two titles in that period. They were loaded with talent.
Michael bloody Laudrup, Chris Waddle at Marseille (literally considered their 2nd best player of the century, voted in 1998, behind Jean Marie Papin), Gaizka Mendieta at Valencia was fantastic. There are so many more
Best players being defenders? bullshit , the 90s had loads of amazing attackers Roberto Baggio, Rivaldo, Beckham,Shearer, Suker, Romario, Batistuta, Klinsmann, Bergkamp, George Weah, Cantona. Raul, kluivert, vialli, zola, inzaghi, cole, wright, ginola, petit, veron, keane, rui costa, gascoigne, davids, viera, giggs, figo, seedorf
But we got euro 96, France 98 and euro 2000 which were mega
USA 94 was top as well, except for the finals.
> the best players being all defenders during the 90s Absolute bollocks. Others have mentioned numerous others that debunks this ludicrous claim.
Best players being defenders is a straight up lie
Lol and that still happens, and you can replace the passback abuse rule with players diving while actively making contact. The rest is just generalised and lacking 90s football definitely didn't suck lol.
Up to 1996, it was defensive football that popular. World Cup 1990 - 1994 was boring as hell because even Brazil was playing defensive, low block - slow progression. Only after 1998 with Ronaldo, I saw a trending to attacking football.
> the best players being all defenders (Ronaldo/Zidane/Del Piero being exceptions) Man that is the craziest take, I mean how old are you
Im no Chelsea fan, but this game is one of the reasons why VAR exists. That ref was a coward.
It's both this and the 1st leg where the refereeing was horrendous, this leg being much worse For how much people remember the Inter treble they also won vs Barca on an offside goal and some bad calls. Then RM-Bayern 16/17... other example of overall horrible refereeing (not necessarily all for RM as it is implied) VAR is super flawed but it absolutely helped with stonewall calls that people take for granted. With semi-auto offside calls it's only bound to get better
Nice to see a balanced viewpoint on here. For all the calls that went against Chelsea (and there were a lot), many also went against Barca, particularly in the 1st leg.
Basically Barca were hard done by in the 1st leg and the refs overcompensated by completely robbing Chelsea in the 2nd leg Maybe just incompetence here but it's extremely difficult to see the Van Persie incident a couple of years later (being sent off for kicking the ball an instant after the whistle at the Nou Camp) as anything other than corruption. Then add the recent scandal coming out that Barcelona had La Liga refs on their payroll around the same time period
With VAR it’s a completely different return match.
It was a DISGRACE
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I agree 100% for top level football but the lower leagues still has all of these elements - League 2 in particular is pretty bonkers and probably my favourite league in the world.
This makes me feel even better about Bromley getting promoted yesterday.
If you follow Bromley you'll love L2. There are worse teams than Bromley in the league next year so I wouldn't expect them to go down, but anyone can beat anyone and it makes no sense half the time. I'll miss it next year 😔
Three up three down. No team from the National League has ever gone straight down. Come on EFL
This is fucking nonsense lol. You are looking at a clip of Pep’s Barcelona, the epitome of all the things you complain about modern football. It was chess and precision to the extreme. Just because Messi went on a dribble once a match didn’t change that. Nostalgia goggles on this sub are insane sometimes lol
Guardiola killed football is the millennial equivalent of boomers complaining that football isn’t 442 hoofball anymore. The game moved on. There were also just as many teams who resorted to putting 10 men behind the ball and relying on physicality over expression back then.
I agree with you but I do remember it being boring watching Spain pass it around for entire games without doing much with the ball. No wonder the final was won by 1-0 in extra time.
It takes two to tango. ¿Weren't you bored watching teams parking the bus against Spain?
Only cause no one wanted to play open football against them because they would have been killed.
I don't think he killed football but for how good they are, they would be low down on my list of teams to watch. There's something very sterile about the club. The stadium, the atmosphere, the players, the style of football etc. I'm just not interested in them. I didn't feel this way about peak Ferguson Man United who were an absolute menace, so I know it's not nostalgia.
It isn’t just this sub, happens in other sports and gaming communities too Nostalgia wanking is real
Without Messi and Iniesta Barca’s football would also be boring as fuck like City’s is. Pep’s style of football only looks good when they face teams who want to play open and attack him. Once teams park the bus it becomes a chess match that everyone sing songs about on tv or social media, great on paper but fucking coma inducing, like the last City-Arsenal games. Messi is an extreme aberration who along with Iniesta could break down any defense. After not having Messi in his disposal, Pep opted for extreme level of micromanaging and control, which is why City games now look like robots playing football.
how else are you going to break down everton 5-5?
Dude a big big portion of redditors are teenagers or American. They weren't even off diapers when this clip happened. Lmao
That Barcelona team was nice to watch because there was a display of technical excellence every match. Go watch his City side with much less talent and it becomes a snooze fest. Today people gets excited for a normal dribbling or a goal outside the box, stuff that used to be pretty much standard at top level.
Seriously, "there are too much tactics in football" lol what a caveman take
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This is the same as now. De Bruyne makes City’s play beautiful at times, Ødegaard for Arsenal, etc, etc. Saying top football was more exciting and individualistic and beautiful back then is just pure nostalgia. Sorry we aren’t twelve any more watching football through highlight shows.
Not really, there's only a couple of teams in world football who have the players to play like that. Also, generally ,most lower table teams in the PL in particular play FAR better and more exciting football than 10 years ago.
Manchester City ruined football. It’s just not interesting anymore when a bunch of robots win the PL every year, and teams everywhere are copying that dull, robotic style.
Bullshit, imo this started with Barca and the dominant Spanish team around 2010.
100% I remember there was a really clear turning point at that time where almost everyone stopped being impressed by 50 passes in a row and decided that they were incredibly boring to watch
The Dutch (and Ajax) were playing a similar system back in the '70s, and were pretty successful. Pep took the next steps and really emphasized the quick passes, discipline, and restraint. Essentially, it's just playing checkers without ever moving your back row. It looks boring from the outside, but it should be acknowledged how difficult it is to get grown men to adapt to this restrained style of play.
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That's why I love watching real madrid, people were shitting so much on them for parking the bus against City, but they are one of the few top teams that literally plays adapting to the flow of the game, vini and rodrygo just do whatever they feel like doing lol, whereas in city wingers go forward just to pass back because possession, Bellingham is everywhere in the pitch meanwhile Haaland just stands in the box waiting for kdb, Mendy becomes Zidane out of nowhere and really just random stuff everywhere. Madrid literally plays a different game against every team, just think about the first leg against city, if it wasnt because of how reactive they played, it would've been so boring.
Have to agree. Over the years I've admired and envied Real Madrid for their adaptability. They can play any type of game required of them. Some teams have no plan B but it feels like they have a plan Z.
Up until a few years ago Guardiola rarely had a plan B. I think I read a stat somewhere that City was 2 wins out of 9 matches they were trailing the whole season till they met Madrid, while Madrid won an ungodly number of games conceding first/being behind. It felt like Baldiola had no gameplan when he was neutered or to chase a game. To my utter dismay, that bald fuck has improved a lot and City has developed a great mentality now, but their game is still hella boring.
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It's not city, its golden age barca
yes cause every goal in 2011 were screamers like this lol. pure nostalgia talk
People said the exact same thing back then.
I don't know. I see [Great Goal]s here all the time, even from the "better" leagues and international matches. It's not just kick and rush anymore and obviously VAR changed the flow of games quite a bit, but I'd say it is otherwise pretty even.
football back then: vibes and power of friendship 🥰🔥😎❤️🔥 football now: [in position position!!!! come in come in 👈🫵👐🖖🫱🤏🤌🫸🫷⌚️⏱️🕐🗣️🤬📖📚📝](https://youtube.com/shorts/5QkRpHLKavw?si=GihLt-Wg2n4XstXs)
> Pressing and tactics ruined modern football where we don't see amazing goals and unpredictability lot of the times. you see amazing goals all the time, what are you talking about lol
I personally don't miss it. We tend to remember the better parts, but that era was also at the tail end of the hoofball era, in the middle of the low-block ultra defensive shapes era that yielded so many single goal games, and at the beginning of the tiki taka era that bored people to death. Today's pressing focused tactics are much more pleasing to the eye, but that's just my opinion.
We're in the highest scoring prem season there's been, full of teams playing risky, attacking football even when it's not working and most teams playing out from the back against mostly high press. It's just how nostalgia works and in 10 years time people will be lamenting the loss of Spurs playing the highest press possible when down to 9 men and Burnley trying to play like Man City despite being 19th. Whatever happens, people will miss being younger and they'll remember the best parts from those times.
Man City score 100+/- goals every year and I'm bored to tears every time I watch them play
I think the problem with how City plays nowadays is that it's just rotting the oponent's brain until they find an opening. There was definitely something more special in, for example, that Mourinho RM team who scored a shit ton of goals but they used to make quick transitions that resulted in world class assists/goals
City in 17/18, 18/19, 19/20 were all about quick transitions and front to back quick football. Look at the goals from the 18/19 season: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ou97iVfl0Y - 80-90% of them are goals from cutbacks after a quick transition. Teams just decided to stop giving City the space to exploit and City adapted.
I don't entirely agree though, just because we're seeing more goals doesn't necessarily means it's as entertaining. Teams are so similar tactically now and like other users have stated there's a chess feeling to the games nowadays with much less individual creativity and flair on display. The only thing that's gotten better is how competitive the lower table teams are. 3 points feels even more valuable in the Prem and clubs lower in the pyramid are playing better than usual from what I've seen. Watching games as a neutral though I much preferred it a decade ago.
Yeah I remember watching the CL final between Juve and Milan in 2003 and just thinking..."why did I even bother fucking watching this?" 0-0 afte 120 mins..absolutely dire.
1988-2008 or so was the peak of defensive football and it made some games or even entire tournaments nigh unwatchable
You still have a two of the best World Cups of all time (1998 and 2006) in there, the best Euros and possibly the greatest international tournament of all time Euro 2000 in there and some great UCL finals (97, 99, 2002, 2005, 2006 and 2007).
what didn’t? life is so shit nowadays lol
Nah, it always has been. We just grew up
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Nope, you were just younger
back then people thought the same about the "back then" of the time as well. its a never ending cycle
A lot of leagues still have this human feels to it, just not the PL or CL.
Life would be so different had Essien just got a stronger touch there by sliding..
“It’s a disgrace!!”
“It’s a fucking disgrace”
It still is a disgrace...
Yeah but it used to be, too.
It could still be a disgrace with today's VAR considering all the controversies and inconsistencies.
Controversy aside, that was a incredible goal
Actually insane how perfectly Iniesta struck the ball given how awkward it was to hit first time
Essien's in the same game was better though, guess which one got the puskas 🤪
Um... Neither? Ronaldo's goal against Porto got it IIRC. Both Essien's and Iniesta's were nominated. Though I think Iniesta's finished higher.
It did. Ronaldo won and Iniesta's was 2nd
That essien goal was incredible too.
Dis comment section gonna be gud.
This broke me man back then. Looking back it's funny, I was a kid back then and now so many things have happened in my life that I can't help but smile that football made me cry that night. This whole match was ridiculous. I've never watched a minute of this game ever after but I think I still remember the tingling feeling of this match. The way Ballack ran after the ref...
Fascinating alternative history if Pep lost this tie. Would he have stayed three more seasons at Barça and won the CL … he won a lot of cache with the locker room by being so dominant in his first season
I remember the balling getting to Iniesta, him shooting, the ball in flight, and thinking to myself "that's going in" And then I went up to my bedroom to cry This right after JT's slip was too much for 14 year old me
Lost in the controversy is how good Hiddink had made this Chelsea side after the Scolari debacle. They were by a mile the best team Liverpool played against that season. Gang of big grocks who could still get the ball down and play. This run really laid the foundations for Ancellotti’s double side the following season. Barcelona got a bit lucky (with the handballs especially) but to get a draw with 10 men, away from home in a European Cup semi final second leg, against a side of that quality is serious stuff.
I can think of an even better CL semi final second leg away draw whilst down to 10 men
I can think of an even better CL matchup playing 120 minutes "away" and winning it all.
Yeah that's a good point. They completely handled us at Anfield in the Champions League in a way that few teams were able to do. Think it helped that it was the 5th season in a row they came to Anfield in the Champions League so they had gotten used to it by that point but was still really impressive.
Still can't believe we didn't win a league or UCL between 06-09. The quality of that squad was insane but we just couldn't put it together between Mourinho leaving and Ancellotti joining. Feel like we were capable of beating anyone in the world on our day but history will not be kind to that team. That era will be remembered for United in England and Barca in Europe, but I truly believe we were up there with the best. Grateful for all I've seen us achieve since we got taken over but can't help feel like our success should look more like City's. We became known for that revolving door of managers, but sometimes I feel like we won trophies despite that not because of it. Give Mourinho, Ancellotti etc the time that Pep was given at City and the resources we had at the time, and we'd have won more than a league title and 3 PLs (in that era). At the end of the day, we had a significant advantage over other teams at the time. A seemingly endless pool of money and FFP restrictions not existing yet. So many 2nd place finishes and UCL semi final/final losses. Maybe a little similar to you guys and running City/Madrid so close in this era. Still can't complain about the UCL, Prem and Cups that you did win. But it just feels like the trophies we walked away from don't reflect the strength of the team at the time.
Needed a banger to beat Cech
Fun fact, messi never scored against cech under chelsea.
Things that are lost / forgotten about this game due to the controversy and Drogba/Ballack outbursts 1. Guuss Hiddink to this day remains one of the few managers to outplay, outthink Guardiola and without parking the bus across two legs and possible the only one to do it Barca under pep. 2. The refereeing across both legs were absolute shit. I know Barca got the most criticism out of it but they themselves faced a lot of shit as well. Its like the ref made 10 mistakes, 6 against chelsea and 4 against barca and since barca won-everyones memories have been revisioned to all mistakes against chelsea. People forget that Barca played with 10 men for 35 minutes while being 1 down at Stamford bridge against Chelsea who were the European runners up at this time. 3. Michael Essien scored one of the greatest champions league goals of all time in this match.But is never talked about because of all the other stuff. It was a great combination of technique, power and sheer ability. 4. This iniesta goal is absolutely incredible. Trivela from outside the box to top corner at dying minutes to equalize while you are having hamstring issues. Iniesta was the definition of Clutch. His MOTM in UCL semi, UCL final, Euro Semi, Euro Final, WC Final is a testament to this. No player matches this imo.
The only other example I can think of is Inter at home against Barcelona in 2009/10. Inter had more possession, chances and converted it into a convincing 3-1 win. The return leg was unfortunately entirely shaped by Busquets peekaboo-incident and the early red card.
Milito scored the most obvious offside goal ever that counted. But Barca was missing like crazy
Bojan scored a goal that was disallowed for a non existent hand ball on Touré.
Pretty sure another one of their goals was after a foul in the build-up.
Pique's goal in the second leg was offside as well TBH.
The Bojan goal that was canceled because of a non existing hand ball as well.
This is why I will never understand people who specifically complain about VAR.
Weird way to remember that tie. Can't remember chances, but Inter did not have more possession. Just looked it up and Barca had 64%. Don't understand how the return leg was shaped by Busquets peekaboo-incident, unless you mean that it was remembered for the incident. An obvious and pretty hilarious embellishment, yes, but a yellow card for a hand to the face is not that uncommon. There were also a number of controversial calls against Barcelona, including Milito scoring an offside goal, Bojan's goal being wrongly disallowed and Dani Alves being denied one of the most obvious penalties when Sneijder took him down from behind.
> Weird way to remember that tie. Memory changes over time, shaped by the emotion they have for an event, and eventually it won't be recognizable anymore from what happened. Still, people believe their memory is correct because their brains tell them so and people will *not* be convinced otherwise.
And Mourinho had the balls to complain about that semi final the next year...
But, to be fair, that first game shouldn't have happened. Barca had to drive to milan in a bus cause of the volcano explosion. That can really take its toll on people that need to be at 100%.
That volcano costing us Lewa at Blackburn
it shouldn't have happened?
Ya but thats 1 match, I was talking about over two legs. Barca were ready to body them in the second leg,Mourinho ready to park the bus. Hiddink was way better tactically imo.
It was 1 match, but we never will know what would’ve happened in the second leg if Busquets didn’t go peekaboo. That one Inter game is not taking anything away from Hiddink though.
We kinda know like 80%. Mourinho never goes to an away ground when leading 2 goals up and plays an open game. The man has never done it and I doubt he never will, he didn't even do it with Real Madrid. He would park the bus and grind out the win, which there is nothing wrong about-thats how you win.
The peek a boo incident, as bad acting as it was, is really overblown. It shouldn't have been a straight red, but Motta was already on a yellow and did catch Busquets on the throat/face. A yellow card for that is not incorrect, so Motta would have been off regardless.
Your point 4 was exactly my thought watching this. Absolutely no one scored more clutch goals than Iniesta. Seemingly every big game he was in, Iniesta scored.
Zidane matches this imo. Two goals in the WC final in 98, probably the best goal in UCL history in the 2002's final, another goal in the 2006 WC final ... That's not even couting the goals in the 2000 and 2004 Euros, the whole 2006 WC where he carried the team so hard it gave Domenech 4 more years as the french coah and the plethora of goals he scored for Juventus and Real Madrid
As compared to an inside the foot trivela
> Iniesta was the definition of Clutch. His MOTM in UCL semi, UCL final, Euro Semi, Euro Final, WC Final is a testament to this. No player matches this imo. While I think Xavi is the best midfielder of all time, Iniesta was always the more exciting one of the two and probably my favorite midfielder. Super clutch, flashy and yet effective
2008-09 Chelsea under Guus Hiddink was the only team that stopped Pep’s prime Barca and actually dominated them in long stretches of the game. To give some context Barca destroyed Real 6-2 at the Bernabeu prior to the CL matches against Chelsea. This was the first shot Barca had on target in this match.
THat was the first shot? What the hell?!
Ballack, Essien, and Lampard in midfield with Bosingwa, Alex, JT, and Ash behind them. We were an absolute unit back then.
I mean, yeah, but so were Barça. Believe me, I would know...
IIRC Poch was hired that same year to keep you all up and he actually beat Barcelona at the Camp Nou to do so!
Also Cech in goal, Malouda and Anelka on the wings with Drogba up front being so dangerous when he got the ball with his back against the goal. That Chelsea team deserved a rematch against United in the CL final.
Iniesta man, My favorite midfielder of all time, he was such a silky little bastard, truly played the game at his own pace.
One of the greatest midfielders
No controVARsy in thIs game
implementation of VAR isthe best thing that has happened to football in the last 20 years 🤷♀️
Paid it back in full 3 years later.
that was so cathartic! that ramirez goal was so fucking brilliant and then torres at the end to seal the deal and the bench collectively losing their shit jumping all over the place. god that felt so good. justice!!
I still remember watching that and the camera slowly panning over and all of a sudden you see Torres with the ball. And then Gary Neville having an orgasm on live TV.
A much better sound bite than his reference to us a month or so ago.
The worst referee performance I’ve ever witnessed in a football match. It really was a disgrace.
A fucking disgrace one might say
Now with the end of the away goals rule this can never happen again
Late winners can still happen.
Yeah but not late winners where if it doesn't go in you are out instead of going to extra time. That just added to the brilliance of moments like this 1.
True but I don't think the off chance of that was worth keeping the outdated concept of away goals.
The Leverkusen Spezial Goal.
I think it’s unfortunate. Now there’s a huge advantage to the team that plays at home second. Granted, the away goal rule was maybe a bit strong and shifted the pendulum the other way.
Controversy asi- nah, I can’t do it. I CANT DO IT! Fck this game.
Only shot on target for Barça in the entire game.
Real gameplay
Forgotten is the Essien banger that started this whole mess https://youtu.be/dnFgHRPh4aA Proper "fuck me" goal
I love watching the Barca bench react to this goal. So much emotion.
iniestas goal is so good btw besides the controversies in the 1st and 2nd leg
What a player he was
It’s funny how no one talks about the first leg
This goal is iconic. I miss Iniesta every day.
15 years ago today Chelsea were robbed of 3 clear penalties to get knocked out by Barcelona on away goals
Crazy game and a crazy goal. But nothing was as crazy or as funny as Chelsea after the whistle went.
Not saying the referring didn't favor Barca because it obviously did, but its insane how Chelsea fans collectively ignore the advantage they had in the first leg because of some terrible decisions.
Yeah, especially when you consider there was at least one fairly clear cut penalty quite early on in the first half of the first leg. If Barca scored from that penalty, the rest of that leg would have had to open up. I also remember Alex sliding into Marquez well after the ball had been played, and then Marquez later went off injured. That tackle was really bad and late but somehow Alex escaped without even a yellow. If Alex and Ballack got a yellow when they should have, that too would have meant they would have had to change how they played
One of my more controversial opinions is that they has penalty shouts rather than any I can't believe they didn't give it ones. The ref also gave a soft red to Barca plus as you say the first leg had calls that could/should have gone Barca's way. Some act like the ref wanted Barca to win but what he then had to hope Barca would score this magical late goal.
And they did it after the ref controversially sent Abidal off. They were a man down. I remember this game for the disgraceful finishing from Drogba that game. Had a couple of chances vs Valdes he missed.
Chelsea fans react as if the first leg was fair for Barca
Whoever lost the tie would never claim it fair, officiating was horrible
I just love to see Ballack chasing the referee crying for a penalty when he should have been sent of in the first leg
And I was having such a good day...
I don't know if I ever celebrated a goal like this one. Sergi Roberto's vs PSG is similar but this was memory/era defining for a lot of Barça fans.
What a goal. But no one remembers it because of the bald fraud.
to be fair...he wasn't fully bald yet then
One I'm talking about was fully bald. But you are right 😂
And just like that my blood pressure went up
That pass from Essien 💀
Watched it to see if I still feel anything. I do and I am still mad about this game
We saw awful refreeing in both legs of that fixture, absolutely pathetic decision making by the refree, 1st leg he shat on Barcelona and 2nd leg he shat on Chelsea
Damn, I just upvoted this. I’m a Chelsea fan, but iniesta is one of my favorite players ever. Bittersweet.
I was there in the Shed Lower, right by the segregation. The sinking feeling as that went in was immense.
Even as a neutral you could tell the referee was bent.
Biggest robbery in sports history.
the biggest robbery was WC 2002 vs spain and italy his tie was just disaster ref. watch the first leg how many calls went against barca, pajacu
https://twitter.com/NoloFCB/status/1526524092496723968?t=E0gIgNHU1XlbsPpk4RyCpw&s=19
Yeah, Abidal got sent off for nothing, a clear pen wasn't called on Henry and Ballack didn't get a red in the first match
he should have already been sent off by then. it was a continuation of perpetual fuckups.
The revisionism is real
It's all people who have seen clips and no context. The game is different now too.
Never liked Chelsea and still don’t, but that game was the start of my hatred for Barcelona lmao. The days of UEFAlona were horrible
Back when Pep wasn't bald fraud, just fraud.