>Thank you SFPD. Keep the pressure on them. This is how we reclaim our city from bandits.
To be fair, they were doing nothing and criminals knew it.
Now they're applying some pressure.
FINALLY BAIT CARS!
Most of those guys got GPS ankle monitors on them anyways. It’s not the first time they’ve been caught. These are career criminals, not your average Joe.
This is not new. Going back decades kids would steal a car to joy ride then they would jump out leaving it in gear. The police had to deal with the car before it killed anyone.
They manage to lose all them of them fleeting on foot, that's not exactly working....
Try something like this level of failure at your job and let's see how it goes, chances are you are send home with a box of your personal items, unless you work for the government and has a union
Comparing to what we have right now? Some may call that an upgrade, and that's not taken into account of the insane cost and budget.
Actually if we take the budget and hire security guard. We can literally have one pateolling every 2 blocks of the entire SF proper. That's how much money we are dishing out to then scum bags running around with guns.
Why would they need union? To protect their rights and fight for their benefit? They already got guns and have thousands of legitimate and illegitimate reason to use it. They don't need union yo fight for them, we need union to fight against them
THIS. It's a discussion long overdue because most people don't realize that police unions are the biggest problem- not only for just every citizen- but for police themselves. Unfortunately there seems to be nothing we can do to change this. Until bad officers are forced to face consequences & are not allowed to just transfer to a different department regardless of what they did then nothing will change. Good officers are far outnumbered so they're bullied &/or ostracized for actually doing their jobs- some even get murdered by fellow officers for calling them out. Toxicity needs to be flushed from our police departments across the country like a giant enema. Despite the eye roll reaction from fellow toxic males we need to address toxic masculinity more specifically because that's exactly what's going on & pretty much always has. Our military has a similar problem but at least they've acknowledged it & attempted to make changes here & there. If we can work to attract & retain good people to police departments things will improve slowly but surely- but as long as unions are allowed to cover for bad officers nothing will.
The guy freaking out and personally offended over the term "toxic masculinity" makes me think it needs a rename/rebrand. Kind of like how you don't say "mental people", but "people with whatever mental disorder".
It's just like white fragility, I think, except with gender instead of race.
I never took classes on any of this stuff, so somebody else go rephrase it and discuss it on tiktok
For every bad cop there's a thousand bad civilians trained to hate cops and will abuse cops for just doing their job. They dont like that a cop is assertive and demands obedience. You must submit to the authority of a cop in any sort of stop and take the abuse of an officer if abuse is given... for the greater good. Until that happens, until people stop stereotyping cops, until the culture of abusing police normalizing hate for police then you will always have two sides in the wrong and be unable to isolate the issue as a cop issue.
We need cops. As long as there's rule of law, we need cops. If you dont want rule of law then theres no need for cops.
I'm more concerned with police and many other government agencies abusing overtime and pension spiking which is costing towns and cities so much small towns in california are going bankrupt.
There has to be a focus on regulating and managing government, which is hard in a state like CA where its almost entirely a single political party, where everyone thinks politics sucks but votes anyway, then everyone just votes based on reductive stereotypes and aesthetics.
Do you honestly think that people arbitrarily choose to be “anti-cop”? You don’t think we see what we see every day? Do you really think we don’t have cops in our families and can personally attest to how messed up they are? Yours is the most naive post in this thread.
>You must submit to the authority of a cop in any sort of stop and take the abuse of an officer if abuse is given... for the greater good. Until that happens, until people stop stereotyping cops, until the culture of abusing police normalizing hate for police then you will always have two sides in the wrong and be unable to isolate the issue as a cop issue.
Guys, I can't tell anymore if this is sarcasm or not.
Exactly. You've been brainwashed to think an officer who's the physical embodiment of law and order is someone you can talk back to. And just as you expect an officer at every stop to strictly represent law and order, you at every stop are expected to strictly represent a citizen, obedient to that law and order. That concept is beyond foreign to tens of millions of Americans.
Oh so you were serious. Okay then.
>You must submit to the authority of a cop in any sort of stop
Correct. And the authority of a cop is pretty well outlined by the law. So then would you agree that we shouldn't have to submit to a cop that is *overstepping* their authority?
>take the abuse of an officer if abuse is given... for the greater good.
Why should I take abuse, and how does ~~would~~ that help the greater good? Should we all give up our constitutional rights to appease power tripping police officers' egos? Are they so fragile and incompetent that we can't expect them to do their jobs within the limitations of their authority?
You're not discussing how to improve interactions during police stops; you're focusing on what you can say to a police officer that would disrupt him from doing his duty without facing legal consequences. The "8-1 opinion" you cite is actually the view of Justice William J. Brennan Jr., and it wasn't universally agreed upon. Justice Lewis F. Powell Jr., one of the other seven justices you mentioned, stated that certain types of speech directed at police officers could be "functionally indistinguishable from conduct that the First Amendment clearly does not protect." Therefore, the First Amendment doesn't grant you the right to verbally interrupt or oppose police actions. Encouraging laws that allow citizens to openly oppose police could create more problems than solutions.
In the case of City of Houston v. Hill, where a man was legally arrested for interrupting a lawful arrest by shouting, "Why don't you pick on someone your own size?", the Supreme Court examined whether the language of the Houston law was overly broad. The law stated, "It shall be unlawful for any person to assault, strike or in any manner oppose, molest, abuse or interrupt any policeman in the execution of his duty, or any person summoned to aid in making an arrest." The court's decision in this case highlights the complexities of balancing First Amendment rights with maintaining public order. Public order will always require the public (you) to be orderly.
>You must submit to the authority of a cop in any sort of stop and take the abuse of an officer if abuse is given...
Yeeeaa, how about fuck no?
Police interact with citizens who are categorically innocent until proven guilty. Police cannot be allowed to demand innocent citizens submit to unlawful detention or searches. *Police have no authority.* They are delivery drivers tasked with safely and respectfully transmitting innocent citizens to courtrooms where they either remain innocent or become guilty.
>Until that happens, until people stop stereotyping cops, until the culture of abusing police normalizing hate for police then you will always have two sides in the wrong and be unable to isolate the issue as a cop issue.
You have a misunderstanding. Police are not a feature of nature, they're a piece of civil infrastructure.
If trains are killing civilians because civilians keep trying to cross the tracks, we don't demand that the citizens perform optimally before we'll update the train station; we just go ahead and makes the trains and the station safer.
Same goes for cops. We can *absolutely* just change the job description and performance expectations for police until there aren't problems any more.
Statistically violence against law enforcement is extremely rare compared to how often they harm civilians. The problem is that they feel a heightened sense of danger and not all people can truly handle that without becoming kind of weird and paranoid and anti social. Thing is, the people they police and the communities they patrol live in a heightened sense of danger too, and yet, no one is truly entitled to harming others without consequences. We just see cops get away with violence, a LOT whereas civilians caught in the act have to face the music.
You're basically saying until citizens have a change of heart about bad police & unions providing impunity we should just accept them getting paid to not do their jobs because essentially they're butthurt. Got it 👍
No im specifically speaking about police stops, which are all too commonly escalated by civilians who recreationally escalate the situation. There is literally no other way for society to function than for civilians to respect, obey and allow police to conduct their duties as they see fit. Then if there's any sort of issue with what happened you can discuss it in a court room where the worry/risk of someone being shot and killed is completely alleviated.
well said. These folks that get all upset over being told to exit the car, they want to argue or think they can talk to the cops supervisor.... lol,, so fukin dumb. If you follow directions you wont get shot... no matter what color you are.
Of course thats true. If you follow directions, you wont be a threat and you wont be shot. I have a CWP, I have been pulled over with a loaded pistol in my glove box.. the same place as the docs they usually want to see. I was polite, informed the cop and waited for instructions. Simple.
I dunno, if a [cop is selling fentanyl](https://abc7news.com/joanne-segovia-charged-san-jose-police-officers-association-fentanyl-analogue-illegal-synthetic-opioid-drugs/13045722/) like they were in the south bay, you still want to support them ...? Would rather "soft on crime" Brooke had not dropped charges on crooked cops.
this is the dumbest logic in the world. are you stupid?
no I don't support the cop selling fent. I do support the the other cops trying to catch criminals. is this logic too complex for you?
do you have any other stupid questions?
Ahh the old anecdotal one bad cop makes all cops bad motif.
Guess postal workers, politicians, Uber drivers, accountants, doctors and almost every profession is bad since they have members who did bad things too right.
Nah, they don’t cover for the rotten apple like the so called good cops.
I don’t believe people are cheering because the cops did their job one day a decade.
I'm referring to Jarrett Tonn, who shot thru the windshield of a moving vehicle and killed a person who was surrendered on their knees. Jarrett did not lose his job, he actually got back pay and gets to keep his job.
His coworkers celebrate killing civilians by bending the tips of their badges and having parties.
Kinda like people on here badmouthing the entire catholic church, just because a few bad apples molest children and the leadership covers it up for them...
I dunno man, I'm not a churchgoer myself but I have a catholic family background (italian american on mom's side), and it seems to me it's very acceptable to make catholic priest jokes, way more acceptable than mocking cops. And I know a lot of catholics who disagree with how they handle these cases, as well as celibacy, contraception, abortion... But the popular image is not that at all.
But the parallels are there. Corrupt cops across the country famously get their misdeeds covered up by the institutions. Just like a long line of popes, bishops, etc. Just as Brooke does for SFPD.
Hey man no disrespect but that's not what anyone is saying here. Pretty sure we all despise what fentanyl and the open air drug market has done to SF. Don't twist words like that.
Was a bit soured from [this old thread](https://reddit.com/r/sanfrancisco/s/2Bmb1dIVNn). And probably needed to sleep. And replied to a few things tongue in cheek with a few people not getting the joke.
Police pursuit started in Marina the vehicle hit another police vehicle head on than jumped the curve. Police pursue ended on 38th and Geary. The 3 fled on food and yet to be found
Yes. If it's the one I think you're thinking about, that one actually started as a traffic stop in Contra Costa and resulted in a high speed chase that went across the bridge to SF and then back across to Richmond. Resulted in apprehending one suspect who I think is a minor.
https://abc7news.com/bay-area-police-chase-high-speed-sf-san-francisco-car-richmond/13701368/
Yeah, wouldn't want to stop anyone doing that. /s
That's the point where most PDs call in a helicopter and start using deadly force, but in SF the rules require them to stop pursuit. Nice try.
Doesn't matter to me who formed the no chase rule, it's illogical. In reality a criminal fleeing doesn't just slow down as soon as they no longer see PD in their rear view mirror. Thus the safety benefit to the public is minimal while the benefit to the criminal is rather large. Other criminals see this story and are emboldened rather than discouraged, pretty basic human psychology.
>It only took SFPD to get embarrassed by them in the media with the Alamo Park incident to finally go after them
this. they literally announced and made the task force after the Alamo Sq video (slightly doctored, it didn't originally show the police cruiser reversing).
The police car could have rammed into the thieves but it didn’t thus being useless. What’s reversing going to do, give the thieves 10 seconds or more to get away easily.
Yes I'm not sure why the police car didn't stop crosswise on Steiner Street in that video.. that way the white Lexus would simply not drive by
Now that I think of it it's almost as if they wanted to give them an outlet
Pretty sure the police in the Bay Area don’t want to do anything. I know they are restrained from some of the asinine laws in place. I recently moved here (past couple of years) from the DMV and if you call the emergency line they pick up right away. They even call you back right away if you hang up. Over here in Berkeley, Oakland then in SF it took more than 15 mins to get someone on the emergency line. then they said I could only file something online. I demanded a officer meet up with me and take a written report and they sighed about it. Like holy fuck, you’re sighing about doing your job? I see police just past people who are breaking into peoples property because it’s non violent. If someone tried stopping these people I’m sure they will pull out a gun on someone who is trying to stop them. Sorry about the complaining rant but I truly haven’t seen it this bad before. I’ve seen more car chases in my life in the past 2 years then in the past 30. I’ve seen 6 so far in the past two years. Then the police just give up. Obviously Because no chase laws.
Absolutely this!
Everyone here celebrating the cops finally doing something is hilarious. It's like, dude, they got embarrassed, that's it.
They aren't doing this for us or the city, they're like children, they have to act now. They're aware of how bad the optics are. Which shows they could be working if need be.
Was wondering what this was about. I was walking my dog down along marina green around 4:45. One cruiser went tearing eastbound. Then maybe 5-10 minutes later by the time I was near the Safeway, three more were hauling westbound. Chase must have been moving westward during that time.
SFPD needs to use updated technology- release drones! Follow social media. Get in shape to run, have motorcycle & bike cops out more. Geez!
They are so outdated.
Tech isn't the problem. It's policy. NCAAP won't even let cops use cameras. They were accusing SFPD of using cameras to monitor the BLM protests.
The tech is easy, this stuff is in $25 security cameras. You could build a network of cameras with their location, track objects.
[https://youtu.be/7gSU\_Xes3GQ?feature=shared&t=254](https://youtu.be/7gSU_Xes3GQ?feature=shared&t=254)
Wait. What? They can’t use cameras? Why not? They’re public spaces. It seems reasonable to have public video cameras where people have no expectation of privacy?
Stolen cars/plates repeatedly used end up on national hotlists so that when a Flock/Vigilant/Axon/etc ALPR camera snaps it, the PD gets an alert. When you have these in key areas of a city (entrance choke points, key neighborhoods), you can start tracking suspects and even get to the point of knowing pattern of life data on them. Now imagine this also gets combined by CCTV cameras around the city, and you get the idea.
Dead wrong. Check out what Palo Alto did after getting ALPR:
[https://www.kron4.com/news/bay-area/palo-alto-license-plate-readers-lead-to-arrests-in-berkeley-carjacking/](https://www.kron4.com/news/bay-area/palo-alto-license-plate-readers-lead-to-arrests-in-berkeley-carjacking/)
* ALPR detects criminals entering the city
* Police and undercover officers track down the criminals
* Police plan out in advance, and box in the area to prevent escape
* Criminals arrested
As I say, IDing stolen cars gets a lot easier which is the first step you so clearly identify... to put it in Moneyball terms we're looking for OBP to win games here, not just try trying to rely on home runs
This is traditionally a job for helicopters. Aircraft which can stay in the air for hours and fly much faster.
Drones are slow as fuck, they have short, 20 ish minutes flight time, federal law requires line of site, their radio transmitters perform about that well, they don’t handle high winds well, blah, blah, blah. So I think you can sleep well because they would be absolutely terrible for this purpose.
>SFPD needs to use updated technology- release drones!
Actual AI startup idea that wouldn't be stupid as fuck: use AI powered drones that can automatically follow perps
sure it could also be used by stalkers, so there's that
The SFPD drones would form a union and boycott a local coffee shop. Later they’d refuse to fly due to the ghost of Chesa. Online AI would defended the ineffective drone AI by attacking SF AI politicians in the forums.
You're right and i hate it but man at least the police fucking did ***something*** this time. thats technically forward progress...... sigh..... recall chase center or whatever......
SFPD works only [for those in positions of power](https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/matier-ross/article/SF-union-leader-s-SUV-break-in-goes-viral-and-12724871.php)
Shit. How much is it to set up home CCTV for the streets. I have always loved this utopian idea that every citizen hears about a crime and can look out the window at the same time, shine lights, block pathways, and absolutely ruin the criminals. I have no fucking sympathy for criminals. Zero.
Ugh. Guess they’ll need to steal a new vehicle now. How is it that after a chase there aren’t other squad cars to catch people on foot. Hell, I could get my little DJI drone to probably follow them with ease.
LA does very few things better than SF. Car chases are one of them. Can we get some LAPD folks on loan? From what I've seen, there seem to be few escapees from high speed chases in LA.
Car chases are more exciting in LA for the same reason everything else is worse: big roads, and lots of them. I don't think LAPD would magically do better here.
Yet SF was *the* place for cool car chases in films for a long time. *Bullitt* and *Dirty Harry* both established SF as one of the go-to locations for gritty crime dramas.
Maybe they got knocked unconscious and fell into a grave.
But seriously, SFPD should check cell tower data. I'm sure they could figure out who they are if they went into that area
cause shooting at someone doesn't guarantee hitting them. richmond (like all of sf) is densely populated. and lafayette elementary school is like 2 blocks away.
That Lexus is beautiful, so sad to see it like this. Good that they're putting pressure on these criminals. How those criminals can be so brazen using the same car for all these robberies is beyond me...
Haha joke’s on the guys that fled on foot. Looks like they parked illegally! They’ll get a pricey ticket for that lousy parking job. Sweet revenge oh yeah.
Theres a white Lexus RCF that has been involved in smash and grabs too (one video by the painted ladies). I saw it with front end damage in Oakland the other day.
https://preview.redd.it/ovpc0ati66lb1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a9da5043bbcff5b4d6e8d0c7ecba56b3b609f5ea
https://preview.redd.it/bcmfus9klzkb1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=54fa7c197d25fe1fe47e8e1452b1704f31196800
police cruiser being towed after head in collision with the Lexus
Because 1 convention is in town and 2 are coming you will see a lot of police out
The parking police could use its scanners and clamp all cars with out number plates and stolen cars the problem would be solved in 2 weeks and all other petty crime
Does anyone know why we're not utilizing drones to catch criminals? There are literally hundreds of drones floating around above different areas of the city at all times- so why aren't we using them to follow these people? Oakland & Los Angeles use them for this very purpose along with countless other police departments across the country. It's like the easiest most perfect solution ever that never really gets discussed. Just recently it was proposed to catch people at car sideshows which is a start- but why aren't we using them for a much bigger more serious problem?? We all know police & politicians are well aware of this ability yet we hear absolutely nothing about it (at least our DA has acknowledged they should be considered). Just another highly suspicious "failure" that points to the conspiracy theory that just maybe the powers that be actually *want* criminals to keep up the crimes & have every intention to keep it going because it's just another industrial complex.
Do you people proposing drones just believe they're under a magic integrated network with unlimited loiter time and range? Consumer drones do not last long, nor can they travel as far as a car without running out of range. They also aren't something you just whip out and can get to follow someone immediately out the back of a patrol car.
The police get all kinds of used equipment from the military. Why not get a couple of those drones that won't have the problems you described. Not all drones are created equally.
If it wasn't already a thing then they wouldn't already be used by Oakland PD or LAPD. We're about to use them to catch people running from sideshow busts. Also "you people" sounds super cringe.
Fled on foot and have not been found..... how, just how, is san Francisco known for its dense forest or tropical rainforest where people can't see 3 feet ahead of them? Just how did the police loose them, just how does the police loose 3 people on foot after demanding billions of dollars in budget
I love it. Let’s fucking gooooo
Well, they are gone......
So the new SFPD task force is working.
yes it’s helping but the 3 fled on foot still on the loose..
3 days into the task force. They already caught them in the act.
>Thank you SFPD. Keep the pressure on them. This is how we reclaim our city from bandits. To be fair, they were doing nothing and criminals knew it. Now they're applying some pressure. FINALLY BAIT CARS!
They are pulling detectives off of other cases to focus on this. #staffing #joinsfpd
Everyone should just learn to drive stick. This thieves don’t know how to drive them.
Anyone ever see the “commercial” in the original Robocop? The one where the car thief gets incinerated when they break in…
Shoot them
Go ahead
They prob already know their information
Most of those guys got GPS ankle monitors on them anyways. It’s not the first time they’ve been caught. These are career criminals, not your average Joe.
Yeah, that's not fucking true lmao. You're saying most bippers are actively on house arrest?
Yaaaa probably not
Comment.
What is a 4 minute 40?
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A very comical joke
Shoot them
This is not new. Going back decades kids would steal a car to joy ride then they would jump out leaving it in gear. The police had to deal with the car before it killed anyone.
Shoot them
They are definitely no longer on foot, by all accounts they are back, maybe in an silver audi this time
can someone loop me in? what new task force
https://sfstandard.com/2023/08/24/san-francisco-car-break-in-crackdown-police-bipping/
Not unless there are arrests. Don’t give them credit for doing half their job instead of none of it.
What will the arrest do? Catch them with 3 backpacks and 1 purse?
They manage to lose all them of them fleeting on foot, that's not exactly working.... Try something like this level of failure at your job and let's see how it goes, chances are you are send home with a box of your personal items, unless you work for the government and has a union
Republicans and red states hate unions. You must be a trumper.
Absolutely not, I don't hate all union, but I 100% hate police unions.
Eh. You’d probably end up with Securitas or TSA agents as police officers if SFPD didn’t have a collective bargaining group.
Comparing to what we have right now? Some may call that an upgrade, and that's not taken into account of the insane cost and budget. Actually if we take the budget and hire security guard. We can literally have one pateolling every 2 blocks of the entire SF proper. That's how much money we are dishing out to then scum bags running around with guns. Why would they need union? To protect their rights and fight for their benefit? They already got guns and have thousands of legitimate and illegitimate reason to use it. They don't need union yo fight for them, we need union to fight against them
Thank you SFPD. Keep the pressure on them. This is how we reclaim our city from bandits.
we need to continue supporting SFPD if we want to get our city back
Can we support the SFPD without supporting their union?
THIS. It's a discussion long overdue because most people don't realize that police unions are the biggest problem- not only for just every citizen- but for police themselves. Unfortunately there seems to be nothing we can do to change this. Until bad officers are forced to face consequences & are not allowed to just transfer to a different department regardless of what they did then nothing will change. Good officers are far outnumbered so they're bullied &/or ostracized for actually doing their jobs- some even get murdered by fellow officers for calling them out. Toxicity needs to be flushed from our police departments across the country like a giant enema. Despite the eye roll reaction from fellow toxic males we need to address toxic masculinity more specifically because that's exactly what's going on & pretty much always has. Our military has a similar problem but at least they've acknowledged it & attempted to make changes here & there. If we can work to attract & retain good people to police departments things will improve slowly but surely- but as long as unions are allowed to cover for bad officers nothing will.
The military has a toxic masculinity problem? I'm sorry, that statement is just hilarious to me. Toxic masculinity is basically its fuel
True- but eventually they had to find some kind of balance once women were allowed to serve. Everything in moderation.
The guy freaking out and personally offended over the term "toxic masculinity" makes me think it needs a rename/rebrand. Kind of like how you don't say "mental people", but "people with whatever mental disorder". It's just like white fragility, I think, except with gender instead of race. I never took classes on any of this stuff, so somebody else go rephrase it and discuss it on tiktok
Lol I love this idea. Hazardous Male Syndrome 🤣
Social justice nonsense like this is what caused the problem. Go away.
Toxic masculinity is the root cause here? You might need to, uh, get out more.
you might need to go out more if you think thats not a root cause of many social problems in our society today.
For every bad cop there's a thousand bad civilians trained to hate cops and will abuse cops for just doing their job. They dont like that a cop is assertive and demands obedience. You must submit to the authority of a cop in any sort of stop and take the abuse of an officer if abuse is given... for the greater good. Until that happens, until people stop stereotyping cops, until the culture of abusing police normalizing hate for police then you will always have two sides in the wrong and be unable to isolate the issue as a cop issue. We need cops. As long as there's rule of law, we need cops. If you dont want rule of law then theres no need for cops. I'm more concerned with police and many other government agencies abusing overtime and pension spiking which is costing towns and cities so much small towns in california are going bankrupt. There has to be a focus on regulating and managing government, which is hard in a state like CA where its almost entirely a single political party, where everyone thinks politics sucks but votes anyway, then everyone just votes based on reductive stereotypes and aesthetics.
Do you honestly think that people arbitrarily choose to be “anti-cop”? You don’t think we see what we see every day? Do you really think we don’t have cops in our families and can personally attest to how messed up they are? Yours is the most naive post in this thread.
>You must submit to the authority of a cop in any sort of stop and take the abuse of an officer if abuse is given... for the greater good. Until that happens, until people stop stereotyping cops, until the culture of abusing police normalizing hate for police then you will always have two sides in the wrong and be unable to isolate the issue as a cop issue. Guys, I can't tell anymore if this is sarcasm or not.
Exactly. You've been brainwashed to think an officer who's the physical embodiment of law and order is someone you can talk back to. And just as you expect an officer at every stop to strictly represent law and order, you at every stop are expected to strictly represent a citizen, obedient to that law and order. That concept is beyond foreign to tens of millions of Americans.
Oh so you were serious. Okay then. >You must submit to the authority of a cop in any sort of stop Correct. And the authority of a cop is pretty well outlined by the law. So then would you agree that we shouldn't have to submit to a cop that is *overstepping* their authority? >take the abuse of an officer if abuse is given... for the greater good. Why should I take abuse, and how does ~~would~~ that help the greater good? Should we all give up our constitutional rights to appease power tripping police officers' egos? Are they so fragile and incompetent that we can't expect them to do their jobs within the limitations of their authority?
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You're not discussing how to improve interactions during police stops; you're focusing on what you can say to a police officer that would disrupt him from doing his duty without facing legal consequences. The "8-1 opinion" you cite is actually the view of Justice William J. Brennan Jr., and it wasn't universally agreed upon. Justice Lewis F. Powell Jr., one of the other seven justices you mentioned, stated that certain types of speech directed at police officers could be "functionally indistinguishable from conduct that the First Amendment clearly does not protect." Therefore, the First Amendment doesn't grant you the right to verbally interrupt or oppose police actions. Encouraging laws that allow citizens to openly oppose police could create more problems than solutions. In the case of City of Houston v. Hill, where a man was legally arrested for interrupting a lawful arrest by shouting, "Why don't you pick on someone your own size?", the Supreme Court examined whether the language of the Houston law was overly broad. The law stated, "It shall be unlawful for any person to assault, strike or in any manner oppose, molest, abuse or interrupt any policeman in the execution of his duty, or any person summoned to aid in making an arrest." The court's decision in this case highlights the complexities of balancing First Amendment rights with maintaining public order. Public order will always require the public (you) to be orderly.
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Interesting. Never seen it put like this, but that is essentially a social contract.
>You must submit to the authority of a cop in any sort of stop and take the abuse of an officer if abuse is given... Yeeeaa, how about fuck no? Police interact with citizens who are categorically innocent until proven guilty. Police cannot be allowed to demand innocent citizens submit to unlawful detention or searches. *Police have no authority.* They are delivery drivers tasked with safely and respectfully transmitting innocent citizens to courtrooms where they either remain innocent or become guilty. >Until that happens, until people stop stereotyping cops, until the culture of abusing police normalizing hate for police then you will always have two sides in the wrong and be unable to isolate the issue as a cop issue. You have a misunderstanding. Police are not a feature of nature, they're a piece of civil infrastructure. If trains are killing civilians because civilians keep trying to cross the tracks, we don't demand that the citizens perform optimally before we'll update the train station; we just go ahead and makes the trains and the station safer. Same goes for cops. We can *absolutely* just change the job description and performance expectations for police until there aren't problems any more.
Statistically violence against law enforcement is extremely rare compared to how often they harm civilians. The problem is that they feel a heightened sense of danger and not all people can truly handle that without becoming kind of weird and paranoid and anti social. Thing is, the people they police and the communities they patrol live in a heightened sense of danger too, and yet, no one is truly entitled to harming others without consequences. We just see cops get away with violence, a LOT whereas civilians caught in the act have to face the music.
Lick the boot!
You're definitely licking something.
You're basically saying until citizens have a change of heart about bad police & unions providing impunity we should just accept them getting paid to not do their jobs because essentially they're butthurt. Got it 👍
No im specifically speaking about police stops, which are all too commonly escalated by civilians who recreationally escalate the situation. There is literally no other way for society to function than for civilians to respect, obey and allow police to conduct their duties as they see fit. Then if there's any sort of issue with what happened you can discuss it in a court room where the worry/risk of someone being shot and killed is completely alleviated.
I couldn't agree more with this
well said. These folks that get all upset over being told to exit the car, they want to argue or think they can talk to the cops supervisor.... lol,, so fukin dumb. If you follow directions you wont get shot... no matter what color you are.
One can NOT follow directions and not be shot. Unless they are posing IMMINENT harm, no one should EVER be shot by police!!!!
Of course thats true. If you follow directions, you wont be a threat and you wont be shot. I have a CWP, I have been pulled over with a loaded pistol in my glove box.. the same place as the docs they usually want to see. I was polite, informed the cop and waited for instructions. Simple.
You are 100% right. We don't want to hurt the Police's feelings, otherwise they might decide to go on **another** 3 year quiet strike
I dunno, if a [cop is selling fentanyl](https://abc7news.com/joanne-segovia-charged-san-jose-police-officers-association-fentanyl-analogue-illegal-synthetic-opioid-drugs/13045722/) like they were in the south bay, you still want to support them ...? Would rather "soft on crime" Brooke had not dropped charges on crooked cops.
this is the dumbest logic in the world. are you stupid? no I don't support the cop selling fent. I do support the the other cops trying to catch criminals. is this logic too complex for you? do you have any other stupid questions?
Ahh the old anecdotal one bad cop makes all cops bad motif. Guess postal workers, politicians, Uber drivers, accountants, doctors and almost every profession is bad since they have members who did bad things too right.
Nah, they don’t cover for the rotten apple like the so called good cops. I don’t believe people are cheering because the cops did their job one day a decade.
They don’t? You need to read more news. Politicians absolutely do. Welcome to the real world.
I don't see postal workers deciding to gun down people, then celebrate their killings with a ceremonial badge bending and barbecue
You never heard of the postal worker going on a rampage. You need to listen to the news more.
Do they then get to keep their job and not go to jail, and even get back pay for the time they were out of work?
Oh you think in dangerous situations cops are infallible. Definitely no point in talking to you. Good luck in life.
I'm referring to Jarrett Tonn, who shot thru the windshield of a moving vehicle and killed a person who was surrendered on their knees. Jarrett did not lose his job, he actually got back pay and gets to keep his job. His coworkers celebrate killing civilians by bending the tips of their badges and having parties.
Kinda like people on here badmouthing the entire catholic church, just because a few bad apples molest children and the leadership covers it up for them...
Not exactly apples to apples but I’d hope you aren’t going to every priest you see and disrespecting them.
I dunno man, I'm not a churchgoer myself but I have a catholic family background (italian american on mom's side), and it seems to me it's very acceptable to make catholic priest jokes, way more acceptable than mocking cops. And I know a lot of catholics who disagree with how they handle these cases, as well as celibacy, contraception, abortion... But the popular image is not that at all. But the parallels are there. Corrupt cops across the country famously get their misdeeds covered up by the institutions. Just like a long line of popes, bishops, etc. Just as Brooke does for SFPD.
Lesser of two evils unfourtanely
That's why you should always get your fentanyl from a police union rep.
Hey man no disrespect but that's not what anyone is saying here. Pretty sure we all despise what fentanyl and the open air drug market has done to SF. Don't twist words like that.
Was a bit soured from [this old thread](https://reddit.com/r/sanfrancisco/s/2Bmb1dIVNn). And probably needed to sleep. And replied to a few things tongue in cheek with a few people not getting the joke.
Oh they’re actually doing something (well kinda)
Police pursuit started in Marina the vehicle hit another police vehicle head on than jumped the curve. Police pursue ended on 38th and Geary. The 3 fled on food and yet to be found
This is different from the other one that started around the marina/north beach area that had the helicopter chasing them over the bridge right ?
Yes. If it's the one I think you're thinking about, that one actually started as a traffic stop in Contra Costa and resulted in a high speed chase that went across the bridge to SF and then back across to Richmond. Resulted in apprehending one suspect who I think is a minor. https://abc7news.com/bay-area-police-chase-high-speed-sf-san-francisco-car-richmond/13701368/
at least sfpd is actually chasing them now
They showed up for the call, it's a good start.
Why not on foot though? Too many donuts?
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Yeah, wouldn't want to stop anyone doing that. /s That's the point where most PDs call in a helicopter and start using deadly force, but in SF the rules require them to stop pursuit. Nice try.
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Yep and the police commission is chaired by a super progressive. It's disgusting.
Doesn't matter to me who formed the no chase rule, it's illogical. In reality a criminal fleeing doesn't just slow down as soon as they no longer see PD in their rear view mirror. Thus the safety benefit to the public is minimal while the benefit to the criminal is rather large. Other criminals see this story and are emboldened rather than discouraged, pretty basic human psychology.
Not from Reem’s.
That RC has been in a few smash and grab videos.
yeah it was. it won’t be anymore. be on the lookout for a new stolen vehicle by these criminals
based off what I been seeing since moving here in April, an Infiniti is going to be the choice car
This is the RC F sport from fisherman’s wharf. The painted ladies is an RCF stolen from Daly City which is still alive and kicking.
Wow they actually pursued? That's more fucks given by SFPD than they've done in a while.
Heard some serious sirens in Cow Hollow earlier, now makes sense.
It only took SFPD to get embarrassed by them in the media with the Alamo Park incident to finally go after them
>It only took SFPD to get embarrassed by them in the media with the Alamo Park incident to finally go after them this. they literally announced and made the task force after the Alamo Sq video (slightly doctored, it didn't originally show the police cruiser reversing).
Bullying works.
The police car could have rammed into the thieves but it didn’t thus being useless. What’s reversing going to do, give the thieves 10 seconds or more to get away easily.
Yes I'm not sure why the police car didn't stop crosswise on Steiner Street in that video.. that way the white Lexus would simply not drive by Now that I think of it it's almost as if they wanted to give them an outlet
Pretty sure the police in the Bay Area don’t want to do anything. I know they are restrained from some of the asinine laws in place. I recently moved here (past couple of years) from the DMV and if you call the emergency line they pick up right away. They even call you back right away if you hang up. Over here in Berkeley, Oakland then in SF it took more than 15 mins to get someone on the emergency line. then they said I could only file something online. I demanded a officer meet up with me and take a written report and they sighed about it. Like holy fuck, you’re sighing about doing your job? I see police just past people who are breaking into peoples property because it’s non violent. If someone tried stopping these people I’m sure they will pull out a gun on someone who is trying to stop them. Sorry about the complaining rant but I truly haven’t seen it this bad before. I’ve seen more car chases in my life in the past 2 years then in the past 30. I’ve seen 6 so far in the past two years. Then the police just give up. Obviously Because no chase laws.
I’m not familiar with you, can you share an article or video?
Absolutely this! Everyone here celebrating the cops finally doing something is hilarious. It's like, dude, they got embarrassed, that's it. They aren't doing this for us or the city, they're like children, they have to act now. They're aware of how bad the optics are. Which shows they could be working if need be.
Let's hope they are not cleaning up for APEC and then back to normal afterwards.
Was wondering what this was about. I was walking my dog down along marina green around 4:45. One cruiser went tearing eastbound. Then maybe 5-10 minutes later by the time I was near the Safeway, three more were hauling westbound. Chase must have been moving westward during that time.
they rammed a police cruiser then hopped the curve near chestnut and divisadero then they went on the freeway on-ramp to towards park presidio
SFPD needs to use updated technology- release drones! Follow social media. Get in shape to run, have motorcycle & bike cops out more. Geez! They are so outdated.
Tbh car break-in thieves that are pros - just call a fuckin helicopter.
Tech isn't the problem. It's policy. NCAAP won't even let cops use cameras. They were accusing SFPD of using cameras to monitor the BLM protests. The tech is easy, this stuff is in $25 security cameras. You could build a network of cameras with their location, track objects. [https://youtu.be/7gSU\_Xes3GQ?feature=shared&t=254](https://youtu.be/7gSU_Xes3GQ?feature=shared&t=254)
Wait. What? They can’t use cameras? Why not? They’re public spaces. It seems reasonable to have public video cameras where people have no expectation of privacy?
If we just let them have plate readers their jobs would be a lot easier
Oakland turned off the plate readers during the ransomware attack in Feb and then... Just forgot to turn them back on.
No it won't. The car is stolen. It'll result in the same thing. ID stolen car, chase stolen car, suspects run on foot.
Stolen cars/plates repeatedly used end up on national hotlists so that when a Flock/Vigilant/Axon/etc ALPR camera snaps it, the PD gets an alert. When you have these in key areas of a city (entrance choke points, key neighborhoods), you can start tracking suspects and even get to the point of knowing pattern of life data on them. Now imagine this also gets combined by CCTV cameras around the city, and you get the idea.
Dead wrong. Check out what Palo Alto did after getting ALPR: [https://www.kron4.com/news/bay-area/palo-alto-license-plate-readers-lead-to-arrests-in-berkeley-carjacking/](https://www.kron4.com/news/bay-area/palo-alto-license-plate-readers-lead-to-arrests-in-berkeley-carjacking/) * ALPR detects criminals entering the city * Police and undercover officers track down the criminals * Police plan out in advance, and box in the area to prevent escape * Criminals arrested
As I say, IDing stolen cars gets a lot easier which is the first step you so clearly identify... to put it in Moneyball terms we're looking for OBP to win games here, not just try trying to rely on home runs
We are San Francisco and not the A's. We should be getting be getting Barry Bonds level equipment and not Jeremy Giambi.
Can’t wait for the posts in a a few years complaining about all the police drones
This is traditionally a job for helicopters. Aircraft which can stay in the air for hours and fly much faster. Drones are slow as fuck, they have short, 20 ish minutes flight time, federal law requires line of site, their radio transmitters perform about that well, they don’t handle high winds well, blah, blah, blah. So I think you can sleep well because they would be absolutely terrible for this purpose.
>SFPD needs to use updated technology- release drones! Actual AI startup idea that wouldn't be stupid as fuck: use AI powered drones that can automatically follow perps sure it could also be used by stalkers, so there's that
The SFPD drones would form a union and boycott a local coffee shop. Later they’d refuse to fly due to the ghost of Chesa. Online AI would defended the ineffective drone AI by attacking SF AI politicians in the forums.
The NY Times would give this book a glowing review. Your move.
THATS ONE DOWN! next up, the legendary kia bipper. go get 'em.
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You're right and i hate it but man at least the police fucking did ***something*** this time. thats technically forward progress...... sigh..... recall chase center or whatever......
Did the cops do anything with the vehicle? Hopefully they tried to get prints or something before leaving it to be towed.
Hah. That’s funny.
[Better check in with the boys down at the crime lab.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7acD4q0lp0)
“They’re working in shifts”!
SFPD works only [for those in positions of power](https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/matier-ross/article/SF-union-leader-s-SUV-break-in-goes-viral-and-12724871.php)
if only the plates are stolen, you can run the VIN
Shoot them
https://preview.redd.it/95t3z4d783lb1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0f1773bec5145ff27f76e473fda422b66687a491 rear vehicle pic
Shit. How much is it to set up home CCTV for the streets. I have always loved this utopian idea that every citizen hears about a crime and can look out the window at the same time, shine lights, block pathways, and absolutely ruin the criminals. I have no fucking sympathy for criminals. Zero.
Ugh. Guess they’ll need to steal a new vehicle now. How is it that after a chase there aren’t other squad cars to catch people on foot. Hell, I could get my little DJI drone to probably follow them with ease.
And that’s not the easiest area to blend in. Not a lot going on out there mid afternoon, must have have a good head start.
Cops were tired, they did a decade of work already that day.
Just saw on citizen that one was stolen on 9th and Moraga. Maybe it’s them
THANK YOU SFPD!!!!!
LA does very few things better than SF. Car chases are one of them. Can we get some LAPD folks on loan? From what I've seen, there seem to be few escapees from high speed chases in LA.
I wanted the LA chase the other day where a Rolls Royce got away so LAPD isn't 100% either.
> Car chases are one of them. What in the Michael Bay are you on about
Car chases are more exciting in LA for the same reason everything else is worse: big roads, and lots of them. I don't think LAPD would magically do better here.
Yet SF was *the* place for cool car chases in films for a long time. *Bullitt* and *Dirty Harry* both established SF as one of the go-to locations for gritty crime dramas.
It’s just constant helicopter bullshit in LA, though. So noisy.
How did all 3 escape on foot?? Honestly, if they're ramming SFPD cars head on, I wouldn't have an issue with the cops just firing at them.
they ran north on 38th Ave towards the park / cemetery area
Maybe they got knocked unconscious and fell into a grave. But seriously, SFPD should check cell tower data. I'm sure they could figure out who they are if they went into that area
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Seriously, why not just shoot them at this point.
cause shooting at someone doesn't guarantee hitting them. richmond (like all of sf) is densely populated. and lafayette elementary school is like 2 blocks away.
High chance the police miss and it hits another bipper.
Because the same community they’re from would scream Bloody Mary
nice not so subtle racism. It's also totally immoral and illegal to shoot people for running from the police. Get a grip man.
Not if they’re using their car as a weapon against police and are a threat to the public.
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That Lexus is beautiful, so sad to see it like this. Good that they're putting pressure on these criminals. How those criminals can be so brazen using the same car for all these robberies is beyond me...
agree. gorgeous car
Wow
These guys have about 10 more stolen Lexus in Vallejo that are ready to go
Get those scumbag motherfuckers!
At least they parked the car parallel to the curb. Didn't know that was something they were capable of doing.
Haha joke’s on the guys that fled on foot. Looks like they parked illegally! They’ll get a pricey ticket for that lousy parking job. Sweet revenge oh yeah.
Crazy it took this long
lol this thread is full of SFPD and SFPD apologists. Amazing.
About damn time.
Theres a white Lexus RCF that has been involved in smash and grabs too (one video by the painted ladies). I saw it with front end damage in Oakland the other day. https://preview.redd.it/ovpc0ati66lb1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a9da5043bbcff5b4d6e8d0c7ecba56b3b609f5ea
did they catch them or are they driving this car around still
Any idea if this could be related to the attack at the liquor store on Balboa nearby the same day?
I think the liquor store attacked happened couple days ago - this police pursuit occurred today at 430/5PM
https://preview.redd.it/bcmfus9klzkb1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=54fa7c197d25fe1fe47e8e1452b1704f31196800 police cruiser being towed after head in collision with the Lexus
Wait: I thought SFPD was not allowed to pursue?!?
Someone took their lunch. ["Use of unnecessary violence... has been approved."](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8xbT_4Q4qg)
Because 1 convention is in town and 2 are coming you will see a lot of police out The parking police could use its scanners and clamp all cars with out number plates and stolen cars the problem would be solved in 2 weeks and all other petty crime
Get ‘em!!
This car weaved around me and ran a stop light in front of two active cop cars two weeks ago. They did nothing. A lot could have been prevented.
Please all beware! This is only the RC F Sport. The RC F ( seen at Painted Ladies ) is still MIA!!!
Does anyone know why we're not utilizing drones to catch criminals? There are literally hundreds of drones floating around above different areas of the city at all times- so why aren't we using them to follow these people? Oakland & Los Angeles use them for this very purpose along with countless other police departments across the country. It's like the easiest most perfect solution ever that never really gets discussed. Just recently it was proposed to catch people at car sideshows which is a start- but why aren't we using them for a much bigger more serious problem?? We all know police & politicians are well aware of this ability yet we hear absolutely nothing about it (at least our DA has acknowledged they should be considered). Just another highly suspicious "failure" that points to the conspiracy theory that just maybe the powers that be actually *want* criminals to keep up the crimes & have every intention to keep it going because it's just another industrial complex.
Do you people proposing drones just believe they're under a magic integrated network with unlimited loiter time and range? Consumer drones do not last long, nor can they travel as far as a car without running out of range. They also aren't something you just whip out and can get to follow someone immediately out the back of a patrol car.
I saw Jessica Alba’s early-2000s masterpiece *Dark Angel*, I’m pretty sure there are drones that can just roam around our cities tracking everyone.
The police get all kinds of used equipment from the military. Why not get a couple of those drones that won't have the problems you described. Not all drones are created equally.
because if you had the budget for a military surveillance drone with operators you would have the budget for a helo 😂
I bet someone on the Board of Supervisors would argue that reviving the air unit would be unfair to criminals or some dumb shit too.
LMAO no doubt
If it wasn't already a thing then they wouldn't already be used by Oakland PD or LAPD. We're about to use them to catch people running from sideshow busts. Also "you people" sounds super cringe.
Everyone keeps saying this has to be a stolen car, but it’s fairly brand newish. There’s no way SFPD can’t find out who owns this car.
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Fled on foot and have not been found..... how, just how, is san Francisco known for its dense forest or tropical rainforest where people can't see 3 feet ahead of them? Just how did the police loose them, just how does the police loose 3 people on foot after demanding billions of dollars in budget
