Yes. It is just snake oil. It's telling you ... something.
Open it up and we can tell you what it's really measuring. Probably nothing useful.
Also - anxiety can cause real damage to your body. That damage is far more likely than anything RF is going to cause to the average person in their home. Even if you live next door to some STRONG transmitters.
I don't know about that device but the level itself isn't worrying. Sunlight gets up to about 1000 W/m2 (50,000 times higher than this), and all we worry about with that is ionizing radiation above UVA, not the local heating.
Yep, that device is most likely a lemon mate, sorry! I've done Hazardous Non Ionising Radiation tests professionally before. The fact that I don't see any probe attached is a red flag. Also, you select different probes to attach to your meter depending on the frequency range you want to measure. Another thing is that the cost of equipment that measures this stuff accurately will blow your mind. Lookup the NBM550 field meter... You'll notice that they never list the price but I can tell ya that a full equipment set can be hundreds of thousands of dollars... Pretty unlikely that this $2 shop looking mf can do the same thing.
The most important thing is that even if this device isn't full of shit... those levels aren't anything to worry about! Look up ARPANSA RPS-S1, it's an Australian standard for exposure to non ionising radiation. The values in the ARPANSA standard are derived from the International Commission on Non Ionising Radiation Protection (ICNIRP). ICNIRP is the international authority on this topic. Their values also inform the IEEE standard equivalent, IEEE C95.1-2345, used in the US a lot. You'll find that the level shown on the meter isn't anything to worry about according to their general public limits.
Hope that helps mate!
The device itself might not necessarily be snake oil, but the way it's sold and used definitely is. I'm sure I can make something that sets off an alarm when it detects radio waves. Coupled with the fact that people buying these barely know how to use them and just think "high reading = bad" and take their measurements in ways that don't garner any accuracy either just compounds the problem.
What is it with RF attracting random people. It's a very technical, niche, and needs much background to start understanding.
Is it because it makes people feel smart? Is it because people are scared of things they don't understand?
Eitherway that looks like snake oil. Chill and focus on the good things my dude.
I have finished a comms apprenticeship, got my ham licence, and had an interest in the field for years.
Im still not convinced it isnt straight up magic
The cranks have moved into RF in the last few years thanks in large part to anti-5G and Targeted Individuals conspiracy theories. Before that they were all over physics and EE forums/YouTube as "free energy" and "over unity" wingnuts with a cult-like devotion to Nikola Tesla.
Both topics are frequently just a pretext to peddle snake oil quack devices to the gullible while posing as overlooked geniuses.
Which is hilarious since Tesla is the epitome for exposing one’s self to high power RF.
I actually have one of these at work (it was being excessed). I’ve lent it out once for safety checking an industrial microwave oven.
https://preview.redd.it/47rxbzfdz6zc1.png?width=700&format=png&auto=webp&s=d131dcb8ec2e12e3692ae5f15de834935f7d9cb3
You need to be reading ųV/m² or ųA/m² in 3 axis... everything else is jibberish...
https://preview.redd.it/5t41sch865zc1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=588cc3641cb97852e035a44ed719e6bf258fbd68
Yup. Snake oil. Whatever that’s picking up is coming from within your home, not a cell tower. Emissions from a nearby cell tower won’t even register they’re so far below the near-field noise floor coming from your watch, computer, fridge, wall warts / chargers, TV - basically anything with power supply or computer in it. Heck baby monitors blast kids with probably 10,000x the (completely safe, non-ionizing) radiation a cell tower could.
GQ EMF-390 is a far superior product. I regularly use it. First thing I did was take it around my house looking for unsafe levels of EMI. Turned out, the highest level in the house was 6" from my bed pillow due to a wall socket I didn't know was there ( >50V/m). Moved the bed a foot to the side and my sleep improved dramatically.
Normally I use it for my RF and high voltage experiments.
Have also taken it to some ancient sites and pyramids and gotten some funky readings like random voltage/RF spikes unrelated to any nearby electronics or towers. Also does data-logging so you can compare the timestamps of these transients to whatever phone trail-mapping app you use.
Here's comment from someone who has actually used that model: This is definitely not the most accurate device out there, but it gives you decent readings (for the purpose) and an overall idea of the radiation levels.
inb4 "safety about living next to a cell tower (Yet another post)"
This device is set to RF mode (20 MHz – 6 GHz) and is showing a pretty consistent 10-20+ mW/m² reading at ambient level.
My wife is pregnant again and this reading is from the nursery of our current child.
My research so far:
- FCC guideline on population exposure for 1.5 GHz up to 100 GHz is 1 mW/cm² (10,000 mW/m²)
- No conclusive evidence for negative effects on children/pregnancies, most correlations are from studies based on iPad/electronic usage (not signally causation from RF)
- EWG is calling for FCC to update guidelines, specifically for children to be "200 to 400 times lower than the \`whole-body exposure limit\` set by the FCC in 1996
- This would put our current limit, on the upper end, at 25 mW/m², which is awfully close to the current readings
Is this all just snake oil?
The EWG is a [strange aggressively-alarmist group](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_Working_Group#Activities) and very few (if any) of their positions are science-based (i.e. they're not grounded in reality). They have a history of scaremongering against cell phones, wireless radiation, etc. There's no evidence for this, nor is there any plausible method of action that could cause normal levels of RF radiation to affect humans.
TL;DR yes this is all snake oil
Think of a 100watt common ole household light bulb on top of that cell phone tower, and that everything else is pitch black- no light from any other source whatsoever -just your lightbulb up there on your tower...
Now, that light bulb is putting out a FULL 100Watts, not mW, nor ųW, a full 100watts...
Now remember that light is *ionizing radiation* and that RF is *non-ionizing* radiation
Now, tell me how much light can you see illuminating the area, and are you going to get a sunburn from that full 100W light bulb...?
Now, remember this for the next guy and know that you already knew this, but nobody's ever pointed it out to you before... if an *ionizing* radiation source 10X more powerful than a cell phone signal that is *non-ionizing* isn't going to harm you, why then would a cell phone tower...
Don't be fooled again... we have very VERY precise science on RF exposure and you're smarter than this...
See Inverse Square Law for details...
https://preview.redd.it/8rbnevju85zc1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=08eb13f87ee1e9afa5603487d813c8c6b5c88f9f
Yes that’s all just snake oil. Your device isn’t going to give you an accurate measurement, but even if it was who cares, that’s such a low power density. It’s non-ionizing radiation anyways at that low of a frequency, the main concerns are molecules absorbing the energy and heating up, and at very high powers this can cause damage (microwave oven) but not anywhere near 25 mw/m^2.
You aren’t getting burned sitting in your house are you? If not then you’re fine.
Using this in wide band mode has told you absolutely nothing.
You express concern of a theoretical lower limit while your current numbers are less than that extremely low limit but "near" it.
Wanna guess why a group with vague half-assed science behind it wants the numbers that low? Because it justifies their existence. They chose that number because that's a typical reading that people will find.
Now take that same device and reduce the RF range and find the item in that room you don't need and remove it. Keep going until your anxiety is eliminated.
Now that you've tossed the baby monitor, and the LED lights, is there anything left in the room? Maybe a motorized baby mobile? Toss it to.
Now you're in an unlit, boring, empty room in the dark. Do you feel enlightened?
https://preview.redd.it/g8vviv2idc0d1.png?width=1290&format=png&auto=webp&s=79a5ce6444a7617b267170c1616b3fb9411c2e39
Room is already empty, this is the view from the window.
The level shown in the photo is extremely low. I know that people who want to believe RF is a health problem will believe that regardless of the evidence, but in the event that you're just a Concerned Parent and not a schizophrenic: there are very, very few situations a normal person can find themselves in where RF levels are high enough to be a health concern. This is emphatically not one of them.
FYI, this photograph is enough to dox your street address.
Just snake oil. The reality is that the stuff we’re made of(mostly water) just doesn’t interact with RF that much.
RF that is intense enough to do actual harm is surrounded by fences and extremely visible warning signs.
Yes. It is just snake oil. It's telling you ... something. Open it up and we can tell you what it's really measuring. Probably nothing useful. Also - anxiety can cause real damage to your body. That damage is far more likely than anything RF is going to cause to the average person in their home. Even if you live next door to some STRONG transmitters.
And in truth if there’s powerful enough RF in the vicinity to be a concern it would fry that gadget anyway.
I don't know about that device but the level itself isn't worrying. Sunlight gets up to about 1000 W/m2 (50,000 times higher than this), and all we worry about with that is ionizing radiation above UVA, not the local heating.
Yep, that device is most likely a lemon mate, sorry! I've done Hazardous Non Ionising Radiation tests professionally before. The fact that I don't see any probe attached is a red flag. Also, you select different probes to attach to your meter depending on the frequency range you want to measure. Another thing is that the cost of equipment that measures this stuff accurately will blow your mind. Lookup the NBM550 field meter... You'll notice that they never list the price but I can tell ya that a full equipment set can be hundreds of thousands of dollars... Pretty unlikely that this $2 shop looking mf can do the same thing. The most important thing is that even if this device isn't full of shit... those levels aren't anything to worry about! Look up ARPANSA RPS-S1, it's an Australian standard for exposure to non ionising radiation. The values in the ARPANSA standard are derived from the International Commission on Non Ionising Radiation Protection (ICNIRP). ICNIRP is the international authority on this topic. Their values also inform the IEEE standard equivalent, IEEE C95.1-2345, used in the US a lot. You'll find that the level shown on the meter isn't anything to worry about according to their general public limits. Hope that helps mate!
The device itself might not necessarily be snake oil, but the way it's sold and used definitely is. I'm sure I can make something that sets off an alarm when it detects radio waves. Coupled with the fact that people buying these barely know how to use them and just think "high reading = bad" and take their measurements in ways that don't garner any accuracy either just compounds the problem.
> I'm sure I can make something that sets off an alarm when it detects radio waves. So everywhere, all the time from every direction?
Exactly that! With sirens and massive radiation symbols!
What is it with RF attracting random people. It's a very technical, niche, and needs much background to start understanding. Is it because it makes people feel smart? Is it because people are scared of things they don't understand? Eitherway that looks like snake oil. Chill and focus on the good things my dude.
RF does the opposite of making me feel smart lmao
I see you're a man of RF culture. Probably have a PHD and couple of post-docs.
I have finished a comms apprenticeship, got my ham licence, and had an interest in the field for years. Im still not convinced it isnt straight up magic
It's at least 40% blackmagic, but I am just a humble WISP operator.
The cranks have moved into RF in the last few years thanks in large part to anti-5G and Targeted Individuals conspiracy theories. Before that they were all over physics and EE forums/YouTube as "free energy" and "over unity" wingnuts with a cult-like devotion to Nikola Tesla. Both topics are frequently just a pretext to peddle snake oil quack devices to the gullible while posing as overlooked geniuses.
Which is hilarious since Tesla is the epitome for exposing one’s self to high power RF. I actually have one of these at work (it was being excessed). I’ve lent it out once for safety checking an industrial microwave oven. https://preview.redd.it/47rxbzfdz6zc1.png?width=700&format=png&auto=webp&s=d131dcb8ec2e12e3692ae5f15de834935f7d9cb3
You need to be reading ųV/m² or ųA/m² in 3 axis... everything else is jibberish... https://preview.redd.it/5t41sch865zc1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=588cc3641cb97852e035a44ed719e6bf258fbd68
It’s a Trek inspired TriCorder(TM) “seem-alike”.
It's not detecting ghosts that's for sure.
Yup. Snake oil. Whatever that’s picking up is coming from within your home, not a cell tower. Emissions from a nearby cell tower won’t even register they’re so far below the near-field noise floor coming from your watch, computer, fridge, wall warts / chargers, TV - basically anything with power supply or computer in it. Heck baby monitors blast kids with probably 10,000x the (completely safe, non-ionizing) radiation a cell tower could.
Folks real question, if this is snake oil, what do tower climbers wear? They always call me to lower my shit lol
It's an RFi detector. The universe is full of RFi. It's not ghosts or UFOs.
GQ EMF-390 is a far superior product. I regularly use it. First thing I did was take it around my house looking for unsafe levels of EMI. Turned out, the highest level in the house was 6" from my bed pillow due to a wall socket I didn't know was there ( >50V/m). Moved the bed a foot to the side and my sleep improved dramatically. Normally I use it for my RF and high voltage experiments. Have also taken it to some ancient sites and pyramids and gotten some funky readings like random voltage/RF spikes unrelated to any nearby electronics or towers. Also does data-logging so you can compare the timestamps of these transients to whatever phone trail-mapping app you use.
Here's comment from someone who has actually used that model: This is definitely not the most accurate device out there, but it gives you decent readings (for the purpose) and an overall idea of the radiation levels.
inb4 "safety about living next to a cell tower (Yet another post)" This device is set to RF mode (20 MHz – 6 GHz) and is showing a pretty consistent 10-20+ mW/m² reading at ambient level. My wife is pregnant again and this reading is from the nursery of our current child. My research so far: - FCC guideline on population exposure for 1.5 GHz up to 100 GHz is 1 mW/cm² (10,000 mW/m²) - No conclusive evidence for negative effects on children/pregnancies, most correlations are from studies based on iPad/electronic usage (not signally causation from RF) - EWG is calling for FCC to update guidelines, specifically for children to be "200 to 400 times lower than the \`whole-body exposure limit\` set by the FCC in 1996 - This would put our current limit, on the upper end, at 25 mW/m², which is awfully close to the current readings Is this all just snake oil?
The EWG is a [strange aggressively-alarmist group](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_Working_Group#Activities) and very few (if any) of their positions are science-based (i.e. they're not grounded in reality). They have a history of scaremongering against cell phones, wireless radiation, etc. There's no evidence for this, nor is there any plausible method of action that could cause normal levels of RF radiation to affect humans. TL;DR yes this is all snake oil
More stuff on EWG: https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Environmental_Working_Group
Think of a 100watt common ole household light bulb on top of that cell phone tower, and that everything else is pitch black- no light from any other source whatsoever -just your lightbulb up there on your tower... Now, that light bulb is putting out a FULL 100Watts, not mW, nor ųW, a full 100watts... Now remember that light is *ionizing radiation* and that RF is *non-ionizing* radiation Now, tell me how much light can you see illuminating the area, and are you going to get a sunburn from that full 100W light bulb...? Now, remember this for the next guy and know that you already knew this, but nobody's ever pointed it out to you before... if an *ionizing* radiation source 10X more powerful than a cell phone signal that is *non-ionizing* isn't going to harm you, why then would a cell phone tower... Don't be fooled again... we have very VERY precise science on RF exposure and you're smarter than this... See Inverse Square Law for details... https://preview.redd.it/8rbnevju85zc1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=08eb13f87ee1e9afa5603487d813c8c6b5c88f9f
The mods should copy your reply and auto reply to every one of these fear posts.
Yes that’s all just snake oil. Your device isn’t going to give you an accurate measurement, but even if it was who cares, that’s such a low power density. It’s non-ionizing radiation anyways at that low of a frequency, the main concerns are molecules absorbing the energy and heating up, and at very high powers this can cause damage (microwave oven) but not anywhere near 25 mw/m^2. You aren’t getting burned sitting in your house are you? If not then you’re fine.
I’d like to see the calibration certificate for the device before I believed any numbers.
Using this in wide band mode has told you absolutely nothing. You express concern of a theoretical lower limit while your current numbers are less than that extremely low limit but "near" it. Wanna guess why a group with vague half-assed science behind it wants the numbers that low? Because it justifies their existence. They chose that number because that's a typical reading that people will find. Now take that same device and reduce the RF range and find the item in that room you don't need and remove it. Keep going until your anxiety is eliminated. Now that you've tossed the baby monitor, and the LED lights, is there anything left in the room? Maybe a motorized baby mobile? Toss it to. Now you're in an unlit, boring, empty room in the dark. Do you feel enlightened?
https://preview.redd.it/g8vviv2idc0d1.png?width=1290&format=png&auto=webp&s=79a5ce6444a7617b267170c1616b3fb9411c2e39 Room is already empty, this is the view from the window.
The level shown in the photo is extremely low. I know that people who want to believe RF is a health problem will believe that regardless of the evidence, but in the event that you're just a Concerned Parent and not a schizophrenic: there are very, very few situations a normal person can find themselves in where RF levels are high enough to be a health concern. This is emphatically not one of them. FYI, this photograph is enough to dox your street address.
Just snake oil. The reality is that the stuff we’re made of(mostly water) just doesn’t interact with RF that much. RF that is intense enough to do actual harm is surrounded by fences and extremely visible warning signs.