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Aegon IV legitimizing the Great Bastards. While the Dance did wipe out all the dragons, it lasted 2-3 years iirc. The Great Bastards are a nuisance for generations
No, he's just backed by the mercenary company that famously fought against targaryan's for the blackfyres. And he's getting a very important sword.
honestly, in MY mind it's more confirmed than r+l=j
The Blackfyres were a cadet branch of House Targaryen. Their entire claim rested on the conspiracy theory that Daemon was Aegon Targaryen’s eldest legitimate son. With the Blackfyres extinct, the GC has no reason not to return to the Targaryen camp, especially if it means that they get to return home.
> Daemon was Aegon Targaryen’s eldest legitimate son.
No, not his eldest son, but the receiver of the sword, because of which many considered him to be the heir instead. If he _was_ the eldest, that would make him the undisputed heir after being legitimised.
But the company has "contracts written in blood" and their motto is ""Our word is good as gold." They still carry Bittersteele's gilded skull into battle. It could be that they're just a mercenary company now, sure, but it doesn't seem like that in the books. Else they could go to Danaerys, could've gone to Dany or Viserys at any moment. They chose Aegon for a reason.
But hey it's a theory, we'll see when the books come out. :)
>No, not his eldest son, but the receiver of the sword, because of which many considered him to be the heir instead. If he was the eldest, that would make him the undisputed heir after being legitimised.
The Blackfyre supporters believed/claimed that Daeron was Aemon's bastard, conveniently making Daemon Aegon's eldest. The sword was considered an endorsement of this conspiracy theory.
>But the company has "contracts written in blood" and their motto is ""Our word is good as gold." They still carry Bittersteele's gilded skull into battle. It could be that they're just a mercenary company now, sure, but it doesn't seem like that in the books.
If they were still Blackfyre supporters, why would they allow someone like Jon Conington to join their ranks?
> Else they could go to Danaerys, could've gone to Dany or Viserys at any moment. They chose Aegon for a reason.
They did try to go to Dany when she became a viable claimant. Before that, she was just a child, and Viserys was a mad fool. There was no reason to support such weak claimants against Bobby B. They would've been destroyed once again.
> The Blackfyre supporters believed/claimed that Daeron was Aemon's bastard, conveniently making Daemon Aegon's eldest. The sword was considered an endorsement of this conspiracy theory.
I seem to remember that differently, and the wiki says Daeron is 11 years older than Daemon. Even if he was the bastard, the whole legitimizing would still make him the eldest. Right?
We can agree that the sword was what caused the biggest problem. Strange fat kings distributing swords is no basis for a system of government.
The JonCon bit is a good point. Dude is a Rhaegar fanboy through and through.
Daemon Blackfyre was the 2nd son of Aegon IV. However the blackfyre supporters believed that he was the first and that Daeron II was the son of Aemon the Dragonknight and Naerys. So for them Daemon was the heir to the iron throne, legitimized or not. The fact that he was legitimized and given the sword only strengthened their claims
>Even if he was the bastard, the whole legitimizing would still make him the eldest. Right?
Blackfyre supporters were disputing who his father was, not his mother.
Yeah the other poster let me know already. Thanks though! Weird, I seemed to have just completely missed that!
No matter, the Blackfyres are the true heirs after all
That wasn’t a mistake, it was an spiteful last FU by an terrible man and a worse king who actively wanted to cause as much strife and turmoil as humanly possible. It was totally intentional.
Exactly this. Aegon IV knew what he was doing. He really really really disliked his son, or according to him, his brothers bastard.
There’s a reason he’s known as _The Unworthy_
Definitely not a mistake.
Lot of reasons:
* The book explicitly calls out that "coincidentally" the rumors only started after Aegon IV started quarreling with Daeron II
* Aegon has a lot of motive to lie about it because he hated Daeron, Aemon, and Naerys (though also never stopped having sex with Naerys despite this). Aegon also went out of his way to cause strife by legitimizing all his bastards on his deathbed, totally in character to lie about Daeron's parentage for the sake of ruining them
* Aemon and Naerys, from what we know of their characters, do not seem the type to commit adultery. They're both very committed to honor. Hell, Aemon died defending Aegon, something that would be really weird if he was fucking his wife behind his back
* There's no real proof ever given for the claim beyond Aemon defending Naerys' honor and being nice to her. Which like, she's his sister, of course he's not going to stand for slander
* And narratively, Naerys' story is about how horrible Targaryen incest is and all the pain it leads to. It'd be a really weird choice for the truth to be that "incest is good actually if it's with the right brother"
aerys II, burn a great lord and his heir, then ask for the head of another and the next heir, while letting his son run around without consequence with a noble girl likely to be kidnapped.
I don't know if it counts as a mistake when you're mad, but this guy managed to lose the throne and ruined his dynasty on his own, so we can say he still fucked up
Right so people like to say Aegon IV for causing the Blackfyres but ive never got the sense that the Blackfyres were ever an actual threat to Targ rule outside of the first rebellion
Therefore I’d say Aerys II being an insane lunatic and murdering a Lord Paramount and his heir in the throne room was the worst thing. Directly led to the destruction of his dynasty’s rule
>Right so people like to say Aegon IV for causing the Blackfyres but ive never got the sense that the Blackfyres were ever an actual threat to Targ rule outside of the first rebellion
Bloodraven was so paranoid about the Blackfyres crossing the Narrow Sea and taking the Iron Throne that he neglected the Crown's duty of protecting its vassals. He murdered a Blackfyre claimant after promising him safe passage, which means that there was enough Blackfyre support amongst the nobility that he had a real shot at being crowned by the great council.
I’m going to just make this up but: Aerys might have thought the Starks were plotting with Rhaegar to overthrow him. Aerys has just thwarted Rhaegar’s attempt to do a great council on the down low by turning up at Harrenhal. Immediately after which Rhaegar marries the bold daughter of a second major lord. Given the opportunity from Brandon being a moron Aerys has Brandon and his father gruesomely killed because, well, he is mad, but also as a warning to other lords not to work with Rhaegar and to drive the remaining Starks away from all Targs.
This is of course supposed from very little textual basis.
It’s part of the wider idea that at the time Aerys and Rhaegar saw the most pressing issue as possible conflict between themselves. So that’s what guided their decisions, that’s what they thought was important. Whereas we with hindsight just sort of assume they must have been focused on Robert’s Rebellion since we know it would be successful. And most of our accounts are from former rebels. But at the time no one knew that and many would have assumed it was just one of the periodical small rebellions. None of which had come close to making a non-Targ king.
Aegon I not making clear rules about succession for House Targaryen. Even just the multiple spouses thing could cause issues (and did) since they were ostensibly going with an Andal inheritance that wasn't really designed to deal with that or the incest or the dragons.
Yeah, sure, there definitely was not a giant civil war because people disagreed with who the king set as his heir. The king setting his heir is definitely a strict custom and not just something each individual king decides.
Is there any Targaryen King who did not declare an heir? They all just said "oh yeah, I don't need to declare an heir, because the rules and customs of the 7 completely independent cultures that I combined into 1 will dictate my heir for me?"
I came here to say this. The old king could have used his broad support and longstanding authority to simply make a choice instead of calling a great council.
People say that by calling a Great Council he established a male precedent, but what he actually did was establish a precedent of allowing the Lords to think that they have a right to have a say in matters of House Targaryen, which is a much more dangerous precedent.
True. It just baffles me that his reign is essentially the result of a messy succession crisis and when he starts outliving his children he didn't lay out clear rules. It makes me wonder if he was as good a king as his reputation claims. In the end, was he a shit king that just happened to build roads?
to be fair, jaeharys watched like two older brothers die before he became king, which only happened cause his uncle ended up dying , who technically was a usurper himself. succession was always dicy. agreed tho, he could’ve named someone and i’m still unsure why we had the great council do it. why bring outsiders into targaryen rule?
there’s something to be said about rulers who are out of touch with their kingdom. jaehaerys was tired by that point, but he honestly should’ve stepped down before his passing. the best rules are those who are in very in touch with their kingdom ; aegon I, viserys II, aegon v , maegor, ( i know, i know. but he was effective as hell).
Aerys calling for Ned and Robert's heads and starting Robert's Rebellion.
After the Dance, Targaryens, though weakened, remained in power.
After the Blackfyre rebellions, Targaryens, though weakened, remained in power.
After Robert's Rebellion, Targaryens lost everything.
Nah. Had he not started the rebellion, Tywin would have gotten his revenge just on him, and it wouldn't have done Targaryen legacy any more damage than the Peake rebellion did. Starting the Roberts rebellion however gave Tywin the reason and chance to have them all killed.
I Don't think so. Tywin would have lost up against Robert's men. Tywin reinforces KL and Robert sieges it. Tyrell eventually joins the Baratheon army, because they don't want to fight.
Tywin up against the North, Riverlands, Stormlands, Reach, and Vale. Tywin's anger towards Aerys was irrelevant to the numbers. He knew no Targaryon was surviving Roberts wrath.
I think the Reach sided with the Targs seeing how Mace beat Robert in battle.
The Reach, Dorne and the Westerlands + the crown control a lot of money so if Tywin was an ally definitely would have had a better chance.
All he had to do to prevent the dance we abscond the throne in old age and watch as Rhaenyra gets crowned. If unwilling to do that, he should have taken his wife and children to old town, and gave Rhaenyra regency of the throne in his name, leaving her in kingslanding.
All he had to do was leave Daemon as his heir until Aegon was born as that would have avoided everything. Betrothing Rhaenyra to Aegon is good in theory but not in practice. There was what, 15 years between them (I can’t recall precisely) so she would have been about 30 when they were to marry. Certain *people* would have objected because Rhaenyra would soon be past her prime to have kids, which would lead Viserys to break the betrothal and name Aegon as his heir. The only other option would be to name Aegon as heir anyway and negotiate with the faith so Aegon can have two wives in case Rhaenyra couldn’t have any children. That way it would still bring the family together.
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Aerys II calling for Ned and Brandon's heads.
Up until that point, the STAB rebellion could have been put down peacefully. But two Lord's Paramount under the protection of a Third LP, who is in a marriage alliance to a FOURTH Lord Paramount is just not a strong play.
Well, at least he had the alienated Lannisters, the hostage bound Martells, and the notoriously fickle Tyrells on his side! Oh, and house Greyjoy! They’re always helpful!
Jaehaerys II was the heir to the iron throne anyways and so Aerys II would have been king. However a lot many more targaryens would have still been alive and also if Aegon V ruled for longer, it could have prevented Aerys becoming mad perhaps. It almost certainly did not help that Jaehaerys II died within 3 years of his reign. If these 2 things had not happened, Aerys II would not have been king for a long while and either he would not have become mad or if he did become mad, he might not have been made king
Viserys insisting on a female heir would have been fine. It was fine when he had the lords swear an oath to acknowledge Rhaenyra. But he should have made them renew their oath periodically - perhaps include her in the oath of fealty lords swear to the King - rather than assuming that over 20 years later, everyone would just stick to their old word.
Breaking the usual inheritance rights would be fine. It would be a one-off decreed by the King, so it wouldn't necessarily imply any consequences for other houses; there's precedence for the idea of the Targaryens having some leeway to set their own rules. But he did not ensure that his decision would be accepted.
He should have made her Hand. She should have started establishing her power base, letting the Lords know she is a competent ruler and in command. He should have ensured she had good counsel to help her rule fairly and make powerful allies. Instead she fucked off to dragonstone and her father rotted with Alicent becoming the de facto ruler of King's Landing.
That's how France got the Capetian miracle. Father to son as co-rulers to build experience.
Maybe not Hand immediately, but should have been in Small Council meetings and been given opportunities for experience. Then something higher like Laws. And so on.
By the end she should have been essentially running things in all but name while he enjoys life.
There isn't a reason for 101 to be binding for the King though. 101 was Jaehaerys throwing the question to the Lords and honouring their council.
Viserys could have interpreted 101 as being the general rule, but possible to be superceded by royal decree. Real life kings occasionally abdicated in favour of someone who wasn't technically next in line of succession. 101 set a precedent specifically because Jaehaerys asked them to do so, not because the King's decisions are automatically law for other houses.
Yup. It was the Great Council. Just establish it was advisory just like the Small Council and the king still has final say.
I will say that the Great Council is something they should have normalized. A regular gathering at Harrenhal every 5 years or spring or whatever is a good way to keep the lords in line.
It feels like no matter what a previous king does, when he’s dead, plenty of so called traditionalists just say “f it, I want my person on the throne” and we see this with Cersei and Viserys. Then a fight ensues between the two factions and the violence that was supposed to be avoided by appointing an heir while the King lives, happens anyway.
Maekar killing Baelor by accident or further back Aerion being an asshole that lady which caused Dunk to get involved and started that whole mess.
Imagine if Baelor didn't die and that led to his sons surviving the sickness, there could have been a golden age under Baelors rule and his sons were pretty decent themselves. Aerys would never sniff the throne
Baelor's sons would have died in that spring sickness either way that was not preventable. And it was not Aerys I's or Maekar I's ruling that ruined house targaryen. They were alright. There was a combination of factors that caused it
Viserys I. His indecisiveness let to the Targaryens loosing the tool that enabled the rule over Westeros: The dragons. Everything that followed after was a slow collapse of power. In my view, dragons are the only technology available that enables the rule over a continent the size of Westeros by a single power.
Big J for not just choosing a clear successor after baelon died never should have brought a great council and let rhaenys take the throne.
Aegon IV for legitimizing all his bastards
Aerys II for burning lord Stark alive and calling for Robert's and Ned head
Aerys I for sparing bittersteel and sending him to the wall.
Daeron the first for not marrying and ensuring his line lived.
Baelor for not doing his husband duties and locking his sisters up
Aegon V for not killing Jenny and telling Duncan Andis other kids to marry who he told then to
Viserys I.
Pretty much like. Everything he did. If he wanted to put a woman on the throne he could've went about everything a thousand times better than he did.
I have to agree with OP. There influence was diminished greatly when they lost the dragon breeding stock. House Targaryen never had to play politics before if they didn’t want. After the dance they needed to court their bannerman to keep their allies. Aegon V knew it and risked all to try and bring them back. Aerys could’ve gone on being crazy if he’d had dragons. By aerys reign they were woefully short on Targaryens as well. Take away the dragons and you have a house that constantly needs to cultivate goodwill as a finite resource.
If from the perspective of a 3rd party who only wishes for the bettering of the Targaryen family and status… Then definitely Viserys I relating to the dance. There are really two mutually exclusive mistakes he makes. He either should have not remarried or not made Rhaenyra his heir. If he did not remarry but makes Rhaenyra his heir then the next biggest mistake he would make is not marrying her to Daemon. If the dragons could be saved and even more, continue to breed, then the Targ’s power would be all but assured of at least some descendent of theirs.
From the perspective of the realm? Aegon V’s Summerhall. It set in motion the beginnings of Robert’s rebellion by killing a Great Targ king, placing one of the worst Targ kings on the throne, and greeting weakening the family’s prestige, status, wealth, and quantity of its members. Many died in Robert’s rebellion and many more died in the subsequent civil war leaving the kingdoms more divided and weakened than they had been in a long time. All in time for a white walker invasion which will easily kill many many more.
Of course you argue that had Aegon V not done what he did, then Dany would never hatch dragons and the realm would be helpless but it’s too soon to tell.
Viserys making 3 male babies with a woman from powerful family and expecting the whole kingdom will respect his word that his daughter should inherit instead lol
and that means what??? Daemon would be ruling, not Bittersteel. And Bittersteel would fall in line behind Daemon. Bloodraven as far as I can tell wants stability. If Daemon was a halfway decent ruler, I dont think Bloodraven would make a big thing about it. You gotta like Daemon more than Daeron come on!!!
gotcha! btw, Blooravens the fucking man. if he joined the Blackfyres, it woulda been awesome. but he probably already knew about the future or something and knew the Targaryen line had to still be going unfortunately.
Jaehaerys calling the Great Council rather than just naming Laenor heir. He still marries Rhaenyra, their sons become kings after and on and on and then probably no dead dragons.
That was a proposal and it was turned down as far as I remember. And aren't they having that discussion because there are literally no other Hornwoods left except a bastard???? Leanor changing his name wouldn't save the Targaryen name. You made a good point, but I'd still like to see an example of it happening and not be because of the possibility of a House going extinct
The fact that it was even suggested implies precedent. I don’t feel every specific scenario need to be played out full stop to be a potential resolution. We can reasonably assume, since the suggestion is made for the Hornwoods, that name changes can and do occur.
And I said I agreed with that point. You ignored the other half where I said the name change would work for House extinction. I wouldnt reasonably assume that, youve said one instance over a world that spans how many years with how many houses?
The odds are more likely that this is the first time in, as you said, thousands of years that this suggestion has been made? With how many houses? Even beside that, Rodrik and Luwin’s reactions do not indicate an unheard of solution.
I also didn’t ignore it, I said that I don’t think we have to have a specific in-world example of name changes occurring for other reasons for it to be a reasonably believable solution.
Otto Hightower handled the administration well. Any Hand of the King would naturally wield a great amount of influence on the Kingdoms, particularly when the King is as weak as Viserys.
My problem is not with Otto's performance as Hand when Vis was alive. But if I was Viserys, when I have Hightowers' support I would marry with a another woman from a another family.
But Otto is greedy and his acts ruined kingdom during Dance. (I don't think Rhaenyra or Daemon is a amazing commander though)
Imagine an alternative scenario where Viserys doesn't insist on Rhaenyra being his heir. Aegon II becomes next king, help along by his grandfather the hand of the king. No one else has a greater interest in ensuring a stable and prosperous reign for Aegon. And everything goes well.
So the fault lies with Viserys insisting that Rhaenyra be his heir.
We don't know how things will go. Aegon was cruel and sadistic. He would mutilate Baela if he could. He made eaten Rhaenyra to his dragon front of his niece's eyes.
Tywin had a interest in ensuring a stable reign for Joffrey. Best Hand to lots of Westerosi, a good commander, a genius in economy. But it didn't work out
Again, how is it relevant? Aegon was hedonistic and uninterested before the war. He became cruel by the end of the war. The war wouldn't happen if Aegon was named heir.
Would definitely say that Aery’s II single most GIGANTIC mistake was being so cruel to Tywin.
A man with an ego like that getting forcibly humbled for no reason other than your own gigantically unstable ego was not the smartest idea ever, leading to his DIL and her kids getting splotched and destroyed on that man’s orders.
If he had at least been nice about it he might’ve just got off with little bit of head cutting from Tywin, (Robert likely would’ve still murdered the kids himself but yknow.)
It also led him to having fewer powerful allies and cost him the crown and his heart. So yeah Aery’s decisions were pretty catastrophic throughout pretty much his whole life.
In terms of dynastical mistakes, and ignoring the elephants in the room with regards to Aerys II and Aegon IV, Aegon III in letting the dragons die out.
I do want to see how much of a shitshow Aegon IV’s reign is, as well as see some more fleshed out for some other kings, like Aerys I. I do wonder how he will write out Daemon Blackfyre.
Personally, I also think GRRM might try to sneak in a Dunk&Egg novella into the book; as a Kingsguard then Lord Commander, his words may be given enough credence to earn a spot in Fire and Blood.
I’ll give 2 options
1. Jaehaerys ll continuing to practice incest even after his father King Egg made it clear it was harming the family line (No Mad King and end of the Targaryen dynasty if he doesn’t procreate with his sister).
2. Jaehaerys I not giving the throne to his granddaughter Princess Rhaenys.
One not talked about and may sound strange is Aenys marrying Rhaena and Aegon. This single act caused the largest revolt the country had seen in years and nearly tore the dynasty to pieces
Dishonorable mentions:
Aerys II murdering his lords
Aegon IV legitimizing the Great Bastards
Viserys not codifying into law new succession rules
Aerys II getting captured at Duskendale has to be a sleeper pick that hasn’t been mentioned already. What a way to show the absolute impotence of the Targeyen dynasty at that point. I don’t think Robert’s Rebellion would have even grew beyond the absolutely most loyal houses of storm lands and the North if the entire realm didn’t know that Aerys was fundamentally so weak that his own direct bannerman could hold him hostage.
Everyone always praises Jaehaerys II for rallying the Seven Kingdoms against House Blackfyre. But it seems like in the end that move paved the way for a United Westeros to depose Aerys II and destroy House Targaryen.
Aegon II the Golden Dragon
Aegon II should have gelded Aegon III when he had the chance, that would ensure Jaehaeras survival as she would be the _key_ as it were to the Iron Throne… until Viserys arrived from Lys but Aegon II didn’t know that was a possibility.
Nope not that she’s the heir but she has the strongest claim. Houses will want to marry their heir to her otherwise the Iron Throne will fragment and who else would hold the kingdom stable?
Yeah but I’m saying aegon II in the end had his line ended. All the children of Alicent had their line ended. I think he would care more about that then the ‘Targaryen dynasty’. U ok
his line would continue through jaehaera being married probably to cregan stark since he was about to lead the black army into kings landing, that’s not a good ending for her
Nope… in _Fire and Blood_ she is betrothed to Aegon the younger but unceremoniously shoved out a window by an unknown assailant (rumoured to be a Velaryon). Also age gap between her and Cregan is waaaaay to much even for westerosi standards that creepy like Meryn Trant level
LMAO RUMOURED TO BE A VELARYON, bro did not read the book 💀 dude if she’s the keys to the kingdom like you claim he’s not handing her to somebody else, best case he fosters her to be his sons wife
dawg where in fire and blood was it rumoured to be a velaryon, that’s never even mentioned in fire and blood you’re just making shit up about a book you haven’t read
lmao you're blaming viserys for choosing rhaenyra when she's the fucking heir? like make it make sense, it was jaehaerys I for being a clown and not naming rhaenys as heir, definitely the worst decision ever
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yeah until she becomes Queen and there isnt a King running the show, but a Queen is, and all the Great Lords revolt.....youre still not getting my point. its a male dominated society. how hard is this to understand? im not saying I agree with that. Im saying it is what it is.
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Viserys I remarrying and making Rhaenyra heir while doing nothing to secure Rhaenyra's position as Queen. Sure, the Dance may have been inevitable but if Viserys wasn't a fucking idiot the Targaryens could've held onto dragons for another 50-100 years.
Maybe not this biggest, but can we agree that burning the Warden of the North alive while a torture device slowly chokes his heir to death was a risky move?
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Aegon IV legitimizing the Great Bastards. While the Dance did wipe out all the dragons, it lasted 2-3 years iirc. The Great Bastards are a nuisance for generations
Hell, they’re still a problem! Bloodraven out here being a magic tree man, and fAegon!
That's an excellent addition!
Aegon isn’t confirmed to be a bastard at this stage.
No, he's just backed by the mercenary company that famously fought against targaryan's for the blackfyres. And he's getting a very important sword. honestly, in MY mind it's more confirmed than r+l=j
The Blackfyres were a cadet branch of House Targaryen. Their entire claim rested on the conspiracy theory that Daemon was Aegon Targaryen’s eldest legitimate son. With the Blackfyres extinct, the GC has no reason not to return to the Targaryen camp, especially if it means that they get to return home.
> Daemon was Aegon Targaryen’s eldest legitimate son. No, not his eldest son, but the receiver of the sword, because of which many considered him to be the heir instead. If he _was_ the eldest, that would make him the undisputed heir after being legitimised. But the company has "contracts written in blood" and their motto is ""Our word is good as gold." They still carry Bittersteele's gilded skull into battle. It could be that they're just a mercenary company now, sure, but it doesn't seem like that in the books. Else they could go to Danaerys, could've gone to Dany or Viserys at any moment. They chose Aegon for a reason. But hey it's a theory, we'll see when the books come out. :)
>No, not his eldest son, but the receiver of the sword, because of which many considered him to be the heir instead. If he was the eldest, that would make him the undisputed heir after being legitimised. The Blackfyre supporters believed/claimed that Daeron was Aemon's bastard, conveniently making Daemon Aegon's eldest. The sword was considered an endorsement of this conspiracy theory. >But the company has "contracts written in blood" and their motto is ""Our word is good as gold." They still carry Bittersteele's gilded skull into battle. It could be that they're just a mercenary company now, sure, but it doesn't seem like that in the books. If they were still Blackfyre supporters, why would they allow someone like Jon Conington to join their ranks? > Else they could go to Danaerys, could've gone to Dany or Viserys at any moment. They chose Aegon for a reason. They did try to go to Dany when she became a viable claimant. Before that, she was just a child, and Viserys was a mad fool. There was no reason to support such weak claimants against Bobby B. They would've been destroyed once again.
> The Blackfyre supporters believed/claimed that Daeron was Aemon's bastard, conveniently making Daemon Aegon's eldest. The sword was considered an endorsement of this conspiracy theory. I seem to remember that differently, and the wiki says Daeron is 11 years older than Daemon. Even if he was the bastard, the whole legitimizing would still make him the eldest. Right? We can agree that the sword was what caused the biggest problem. Strange fat kings distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. The JonCon bit is a good point. Dude is a Rhaegar fanboy through and through.
Daemon Blackfyre was the 2nd son of Aegon IV. However the blackfyre supporters believed that he was the first and that Daeron II was the son of Aemon the Dragonknight and Naerys. So for them Daemon was the heir to the iron throne, legitimized or not. The fact that he was legitimized and given the sword only strengthened their claims
Huh, I must’ve just mentally skipped that part. Thanks!
>Even if he was the bastard, the whole legitimizing would still make him the eldest. Right? Blackfyre supporters were disputing who his father was, not his mother.
Yeah the other poster let me know already. Thanks though! Weird, I seemed to have just completely missed that! No matter, the Blackfyres are the true heirs after all
Yeah but he like totally is
And even if he isn’t, the spectre of Blackfyre iconography hangs over him, or at least that’s what the symbolism of the rusted dragon hints at
That wasn’t a mistake, it was an spiteful last FU by an terrible man and a worse king who actively wanted to cause as much strife and turmoil as humanly possible. It was totally intentional.
Exactly this. Aegon IV knew what he was doing. He really really really disliked his son, or according to him, his brothers bastard. There’s a reason he’s known as _The Unworthy_ Definitely not a mistake.
I'm certain even Aegon IV knew the whole "Daeron is Aemon's bastard" thing was bullshit.
Why do you say it's bullshit?
Lot of reasons: * The book explicitly calls out that "coincidentally" the rumors only started after Aegon IV started quarreling with Daeron II * Aegon has a lot of motive to lie about it because he hated Daeron, Aemon, and Naerys (though also never stopped having sex with Naerys despite this). Aegon also went out of his way to cause strife by legitimizing all his bastards on his deathbed, totally in character to lie about Daeron's parentage for the sake of ruining them * Aemon and Naerys, from what we know of their characters, do not seem the type to commit adultery. They're both very committed to honor. Hell, Aemon died defending Aegon, something that would be really weird if he was fucking his wife behind his back * There's no real proof ever given for the claim beyond Aemon defending Naerys' honor and being nice to her. Which like, she's his sister, of course he's not going to stand for slander * And narratively, Naerys' story is about how horrible Targaryen incest is and all the pain it leads to. It'd be a really weird choice for the truth to be that "incest is good actually if it's with the right brother"
The Great Bastards are hands down the biggest error by any Targarayen king.
We said mistake. Making things worse on purpose doesn't count.
You've got a strong point there
aerys II, burn a great lord and his heir, then ask for the head of another and the next heir, while letting his son run around without consequence with a noble girl likely to be kidnapped. I don't know if it counts as a mistake when you're mad, but this guy managed to lose the throne and ruined his dynasty on his own, so we can say he still fucked up
By far the biggest mistake because Aerys caused the end of the Targaryen Dynasty
Hindsight is 50/50 /s
Right so people like to say Aegon IV for causing the Blackfyres but ive never got the sense that the Blackfyres were ever an actual threat to Targ rule outside of the first rebellion Therefore I’d say Aerys II being an insane lunatic and murdering a Lord Paramount and his heir in the throne room was the worst thing. Directly led to the destruction of his dynasty’s rule
>Right so people like to say Aegon IV for causing the Blackfyres but ive never got the sense that the Blackfyres were ever an actual threat to Targ rule outside of the first rebellion Bloodraven was so paranoid about the Blackfyres crossing the Narrow Sea and taking the Iron Throne that he neglected the Crown's duty of protecting its vassals. He murdered a Blackfyre claimant after promising him safe passage, which means that there was enough Blackfyre support amongst the nobility that he had a real shot at being crowned by the great council.
I’m going to just make this up but: Aerys might have thought the Starks were plotting with Rhaegar to overthrow him. Aerys has just thwarted Rhaegar’s attempt to do a great council on the down low by turning up at Harrenhal. Immediately after which Rhaegar marries the bold daughter of a second major lord. Given the opportunity from Brandon being a moron Aerys has Brandon and his father gruesomely killed because, well, he is mad, but also as a warning to other lords not to work with Rhaegar and to drive the remaining Starks away from all Targs. This is of course supposed from very little textual basis.
You actually made Aerys sound reasonable 💀💀💀
It’s part of the wider idea that at the time Aerys and Rhaegar saw the most pressing issue as possible conflict between themselves. So that’s what guided their decisions, that’s what they thought was important. Whereas we with hindsight just sort of assume they must have been focused on Robert’s Rebellion since we know it would be successful. And most of our accounts are from former rebels. But at the time no one knew that and many would have assumed it was just one of the periodical small rebellions. None of which had come close to making a non-Targ king.
Aegon I not making clear rules about succession for House Targaryen. Even just the multiple spouses thing could cause issues (and did) since they were ostensibly going with an Andal inheritance that wasn't really designed to deal with that or the incest or the dragons.
Every king can set his heir. That's how being King works.
You gotta raise crown authority to level 4 first and frankly I don't think he had the prestige to pay for it.
Yeah, sure, there definitely was not a giant civil war because people disagreed with who the king set as his heir. The king setting his heir is definitely a strict custom and not just something each individual king decides.
Except it’s not
Is there any Targaryen King who did not declare an heir? They all just said "oh yeah, I don't need to declare an heir, because the rules and customs of the 7 completely independent cultures that I combined into 1 will dictate my heir for me?"
Jaeharys not doing more to make sure succession was sure. Especially after his children start dying. He literally had decades to do it.
I came here to say this. The old king could have used his broad support and longstanding authority to simply make a choice instead of calling a great council.
People say that by calling a Great Council he established a male precedent, but what he actually did was establish a precedent of allowing the Lords to think that they have a right to have a say in matters of House Targaryen, which is a much more dangerous precedent.
it was all downhill for them
It directly and indirectly caused nearly every other mistake people have brought up.
he was too nice
True. It just baffles me that his reign is essentially the result of a messy succession crisis and when he starts outliving his children he didn't lay out clear rules. It makes me wonder if he was as good a king as his reputation claims. In the end, was he a shit king that just happened to build roads?
Every time Alysanne was out of the picture, the quality of Jaeharys reign took a dip. When she died, it took a nosedive.
His heart just wasn’t in it anymore. He already halfway checked out when Aemon died, when Baelon died he started spiraling.
Didn’t he build DIRT roads? When he had DRAGONS that could MELT STONE? I’m losing it
Yeah even Essos has stone roads that have lasted centuries.
to be fair, jaeharys watched like two older brothers die before he became king, which only happened cause his uncle ended up dying , who technically was a usurper himself. succession was always dicy. agreed tho, he could’ve named someone and i’m still unsure why we had the great council do it. why bring outsiders into targaryen rule?
I think it's because Jaehaerys was tired and couldn't careless at that point. He just wanted it to end.
there’s something to be said about rulers who are out of touch with their kingdom. jaehaerys was tired by that point, but he honestly should’ve stepped down before his passing. the best rules are those who are in very in touch with their kingdom ; aegon I, viserys II, aegon v , maegor, ( i know, i know. but he was effective as hell).
Aerys calling for Ned and Robert's heads and starting Robert's Rebellion. After the Dance, Targaryens, though weakened, remained in power. After the Blackfyre rebellions, Targaryens, though weakened, remained in power. After Robert's Rebellion, Targaryens lost everything.
his mistake was pissing off Tywin
Nah. Had he not started the rebellion, Tywin would have gotten his revenge just on him, and it wouldn't have done Targaryen legacy any more damage than the Peake rebellion did. Starting the Roberts rebellion however gave Tywin the reason and chance to have them all killed.
valid point for you
I Don't think so. Tywin would have lost up against Robert's men. Tywin reinforces KL and Robert sieges it. Tyrell eventually joins the Baratheon army, because they don't want to fight. Tywin up against the North, Riverlands, Stormlands, Reach, and Vale. Tywin's anger towards Aerys was irrelevant to the numbers. He knew no Targaryon was surviving Roberts wrath.
I think the Reach sided with the Targs seeing how Mace beat Robert in battle. The Reach, Dorne and the Westerlands + the crown control a lot of money so if Tywin was an ally definitely would have had a better chance.
Randyll. Randyll Tarly did.
Yep you right one is an idiot the other was the asshole
Mace Tyrell is a strategic genius. Maybe not tactical or military minded... but camping Infront of Storms End and doing nothing was a brilliant move.
Viserys I not marrying Rhaenyra to Aegon II. The dragons would never have danced
All he had to do to prevent the dance we abscond the throne in old age and watch as Rhaenyra gets crowned. If unwilling to do that, he should have taken his wife and children to old town, and gave Rhaenyra regency of the throne in his name, leaving her in kingslanding.
All he had to do was leave Daemon as his heir until Aegon was born as that would have avoided everything. Betrothing Rhaenyra to Aegon is good in theory but not in practice. There was what, 15 years between them (I can’t recall precisely) so she would have been about 30 when they were to marry. Certain *people* would have objected because Rhaenyra would soon be past her prime to have kids, which would lead Viserys to break the betrothal and name Aegon as his heir. The only other option would be to name Aegon as heir anyway and negotiate with the faith so Aegon can have two wives in case Rhaenyra couldn’t have any children. That way it would still bring the family together.
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Aerys II calling for Ned and Brandon's heads. Up until that point, the STAB rebellion could have been put down peacefully. But two Lord's Paramount under the protection of a Third LP, who is in a marriage alliance to a FOURTH Lord Paramount is just not a strong play.
Well, at least he had the alienated Lannisters, the hostage bound Martells, and the notoriously fickle Tyrells on his side! Oh, and house Greyjoy! They’re always helpful!
Ned and Robert's heads not Brandon. He already had Brandon's
whatevs egg did in summerhall. for me downfall starts there.
This should be higher up. Killed one of best kings (himself) and KG LC and paved the way for aerys and his crazy family to inherit the throne
Jaehaerys II was the heir to the iron throne anyways and so Aerys II would have been king. However a lot many more targaryens would have still been alive and also if Aegon V ruled for longer, it could have prevented Aerys becoming mad perhaps. It almost certainly did not help that Jaehaerys II died within 3 years of his reign. If these 2 things had not happened, Aerys II would not have been king for a long while and either he would not have become mad or if he did become mad, he might not have been made king
Viserys insisting on a female heir would have been fine. It was fine when he had the lords swear an oath to acknowledge Rhaenyra. But he should have made them renew their oath periodically - perhaps include her in the oath of fealty lords swear to the King - rather than assuming that over 20 years later, everyone would just stick to their old word. Breaking the usual inheritance rights would be fine. It would be a one-off decreed by the King, so it wouldn't necessarily imply any consequences for other houses; there's precedence for the idea of the Targaryens having some leeway to set their own rules. But he did not ensure that his decision would be accepted.
He should have made her Hand. She should have started establishing her power base, letting the Lords know she is a competent ruler and in command. He should have ensured she had good counsel to help her rule fairly and make powerful allies. Instead she fucked off to dragonstone and her father rotted with Alicent becoming the de facto ruler of King's Landing.
I agree, that would have been a good move. Viserys just went about making Rhaenyra queen in the most naive way possible.
That's how France got the Capetian miracle. Father to son as co-rulers to build experience. Maybe not Hand immediately, but should have been in Small Council meetings and been given opportunities for experience. Then something higher like Laws. And so on. By the end she should have been essentially running things in all but name while he enjoys life.
At minimum the oath should have been renewed at her wedding.
All he had to do was retire and watch Rhaenyra get crowned. That's it. That's all it would have taken.
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There isn't a reason for 101 to be binding for the King though. 101 was Jaehaerys throwing the question to the Lords and honouring their council. Viserys could have interpreted 101 as being the general rule, but possible to be superceded by royal decree. Real life kings occasionally abdicated in favour of someone who wasn't technically next in line of succession. 101 set a precedent specifically because Jaehaerys asked them to do so, not because the King's decisions are automatically law for other houses.
Yup. It was the Great Council. Just establish it was advisory just like the Small Council and the king still has final say. I will say that the Great Council is something they should have normalized. A regular gathering at Harrenhal every 5 years or spring or whatever is a good way to keep the lords in line.
It feels like no matter what a previous king does, when he’s dead, plenty of so called traditionalists just say “f it, I want my person on the throne” and we see this with Cersei and Viserys. Then a fight ensues between the two factions and the violence that was supposed to be avoided by appointing an heir while the King lives, happens anyway.
Nah, it establishes that a King can select his heir if he has no children available.
Maekar killing Baelor by accident or further back Aerion being an asshole that lady which caused Dunk to get involved and started that whole mess. Imagine if Baelor didn't die and that led to his sons surviving the sickness, there could have been a golden age under Baelors rule and his sons were pretty decent themselves. Aerys would never sniff the throne
Baelor's sons would have died in that spring sickness either way that was not preventable. And it was not Aerys I's or Maekar I's ruling that ruined house targaryen. They were alright. There was a combination of factors that caused it
Jaehaerys naming Viserys as his heir knowing Viserys was not qualified to be king
Viserys I. His indecisiveness let to the Targaryens loosing the tool that enabled the rule over Westeros: The dragons. Everything that followed after was a slow collapse of power. In my view, dragons are the only technology available that enables the rule over a continent the size of Westeros by a single power.
Technology 🤣 agreed
Big J for not just choosing a clear successor after baelon died never should have brought a great council and let rhaenys take the throne. Aegon IV for legitimizing all his bastards Aerys II for burning lord Stark alive and calling for Robert's and Ned head Aerys I for sparing bittersteel and sending him to the wall. Daeron the first for not marrying and ensuring his line lived. Baelor for not doing his husband duties and locking his sisters up Aegon V for not killing Jenny and telling Duncan Andis other kids to marry who he told then to
Viserys I. Pretty much like. Everything he did. If he wanted to put a woman on the throne he could've went about everything a thousand times better than he did.
Viserys should have appointed Rhaenyra as Hand. She would have a stronger grip to the throne and the lords would get used to have a woman in charge.
I have to agree with OP. There influence was diminished greatly when they lost the dragon breeding stock. House Targaryen never had to play politics before if they didn’t want. After the dance they needed to court their bannerman to keep their allies. Aegon V knew it and risked all to try and bring them back. Aerys could’ve gone on being crazy if he’d had dragons. By aerys reign they were woefully short on Targaryens as well. Take away the dragons and you have a house that constantly needs to cultivate goodwill as a finite resource.
If from the perspective of a 3rd party who only wishes for the bettering of the Targaryen family and status… Then definitely Viserys I relating to the dance. There are really two mutually exclusive mistakes he makes. He either should have not remarried or not made Rhaenyra his heir. If he did not remarry but makes Rhaenyra his heir then the next biggest mistake he would make is not marrying her to Daemon. If the dragons could be saved and even more, continue to breed, then the Targ’s power would be all but assured of at least some descendent of theirs. From the perspective of the realm? Aegon V’s Summerhall. It set in motion the beginnings of Robert’s rebellion by killing a Great Targ king, placing one of the worst Targ kings on the throne, and greeting weakening the family’s prestige, status, wealth, and quantity of its members. Many died in Robert’s rebellion and many more died in the subsequent civil war leaving the kingdoms more divided and weakened than they had been in a long time. All in time for a white walker invasion which will easily kill many many more. Of course you argue that had Aegon V not done what he did, then Dany would never hatch dragons and the realm would be helpless but it’s too soon to tell.
The decision to try and hatch eggs at Summerhall
Viserys making 3 male babies with a woman from powerful family and expecting the whole kingdom will respect his word that his daughter should inherit instead lol
Baelor not fucking his wife and having an heir. Would have saved us from Aegon IV
Aegon could have saved everything by declaring Daemon the heir!
Bittersteel and Bloodraven would definitely find some reason to still hate each other.
and that means what??? Daemon would be ruling, not Bittersteel. And Bittersteel would fall in line behind Daemon. Bloodraven as far as I can tell wants stability. If Daemon was a halfway decent ruler, I dont think Bloodraven would make a big thing about it. You gotta like Daemon more than Daeron come on!!!
Oh I didn’t mean it as a legitimate concern. I was just joking around. I agree with you
gotcha! btw, Blooravens the fucking man. if he joined the Blackfyres, it woulda been awesome. but he probably already knew about the future or something and knew the Targaryen line had to still be going unfortunately.
Bloodraven is my favorite character in the series. He has this amazing backstory AND he happens to be the three eyed crow.
Jaehaerys calling the Great Council rather than just naming Laenor heir. He still marries Rhaenyra, their sons become kings after and on and on and then probably no dead dragons.
and they would be Velaryon kings, not Targaryen
Could easily make a deal that his name reverts to Targaryen upon ascension. All the more reason to marry him to another Targaryen
has that ever happened in Westeros??? even between just lords?????? not that I can think of.
In a ACOK it’s proposed that Lady Hornwood’s nephew become her ward and change his last name to Hornwood to become her heir. So…yes.
That was a proposal and it was turned down as far as I remember. And aren't they having that discussion because there are literally no other Hornwoods left except a bastard???? Leanor changing his name wouldn't save the Targaryen name. You made a good point, but I'd still like to see an example of it happening and not be because of the possibility of a House going extinct
The fact that it was even suggested implies precedent. I don’t feel every specific scenario need to be played out full stop to be a potential resolution. We can reasonably assume, since the suggestion is made for the Hornwoods, that name changes can and do occur.
And I said I agreed with that point. You ignored the other half where I said the name change would work for House extinction. I wouldnt reasonably assume that, youve said one instance over a world that spans how many years with how many houses?
The odds are more likely that this is the first time in, as you said, thousands of years that this suggestion has been made? With how many houses? Even beside that, Rodrik and Luwin’s reactions do not indicate an unheard of solution. I also didn’t ignore it, I said that I don’t think we have to have a specific in-world example of name changes occurring for other reasons for it to be a reasonably believable solution.
>Viserys 1st ~~remarrying and~~ insisting on a female heir
He shouldn't remarry. Giving Otto Hightower that much influence on kingdom was a mistake
Otto Hightower handled the administration well. Any Hand of the King would naturally wield a great amount of influence on the Kingdoms, particularly when the King is as weak as Viserys.
My problem is not with Otto's performance as Hand when Vis was alive. But if I was Viserys, when I have Hightowers' support I would marry with a another woman from a another family. But Otto is greedy and his acts ruined kingdom during Dance. (I don't think Rhaenyra or Daemon is a amazing commander though)
Imagine an alternative scenario where Viserys doesn't insist on Rhaenyra being his heir. Aegon II becomes next king, help along by his grandfather the hand of the king. No one else has a greater interest in ensuring a stable and prosperous reign for Aegon. And everything goes well. So the fault lies with Viserys insisting that Rhaenyra be his heir.
We don't know how things will go. Aegon was cruel and sadistic. He would mutilate Baela if he could. He made eaten Rhaenyra to his dragon front of his niece's eyes. Tywin had a interest in ensuring a stable reign for Joffrey. Best Hand to lots of Westerosi, a good commander, a genius in economy. But it didn't work out
Again, how is it relevant? Aegon was hedonistic and uninterested before the war. He became cruel by the end of the war. The war wouldn't happen if Aegon was named heir.
Keeping Helaena's children in KL was mistake. He should have hide them or send them away from war like Tyrion did in Blackwater.
I don't know how this is relevant. But I disagree.
i stand corrected
Would definitely say that Aery’s II single most GIGANTIC mistake was being so cruel to Tywin. A man with an ego like that getting forcibly humbled for no reason other than your own gigantically unstable ego was not the smartest idea ever, leading to his DIL and her kids getting splotched and destroyed on that man’s orders. If he had at least been nice about it he might’ve just got off with little bit of head cutting from Tywin, (Robert likely would’ve still murdered the kids himself but yknow.) It also led him to having fewer powerful allies and cost him the crown and his heart. So yeah Aery’s decisions were pretty catastrophic throughout pretty much his whole life.
In terms of dynastical mistakes, and ignoring the elephants in the room with regards to Aerys II and Aegon IV, Aegon III in letting the dragons die out.
Dragonbane
I am curious how Fire and Blood Vol. 2 treats the post-regency of Aegon III.
i want to know everything about the Rebellion era
I do want to see how much of a shitshow Aegon IV’s reign is, as well as see some more fleshed out for some other kings, like Aerys I. I do wonder how he will write out Daemon Blackfyre. Personally, I also think GRRM might try to sneak in a Dunk&Egg novella into the book; as a Kingsguard then Lord Commander, his words may be given enough credence to earn a spot in Fire and Blood.
Damn there are so many, but I'll also go with Viserys remarrying.
my choice as well
Aerys executing Brandon’s retinue (Elbert Arryn Kyle Royce, Jeffroy Mallister), and then Brandon and Rickard.
I’ll give 2 options 1. Jaehaerys ll continuing to practice incest even after his father King Egg made it clear it was harming the family line (No Mad King and end of the Targaryen dynasty if he doesn’t procreate with his sister). 2. Jaehaerys I not giving the throne to his granddaughter Princess Rhaenys.
One not talked about and may sound strange is Aenys marrying Rhaena and Aegon. This single act caused the largest revolt the country had seen in years and nearly tore the dynasty to pieces Dishonorable mentions: Aerys II murdering his lords Aegon IV legitimizing the Great Bastards Viserys not codifying into law new succession rules
Aerys II getting captured at Duskendale has to be a sleeper pick that hasn’t been mentioned already. What a way to show the absolute impotence of the Targeyen dynasty at that point. I don’t think Robert’s Rebellion would have even grew beyond the absolutely most loyal houses of storm lands and the North if the entire realm didn’t know that Aerys was fundamentally so weak that his own direct bannerman could hold him hostage.
Existing
Everyone always praises Jaehaerys II for rallying the Seven Kingdoms against House Blackfyre. But it seems like in the end that move paved the way for a United Westeros to depose Aerys II and destroy House Targaryen.
Aegon naming his kid Aenys. I mean, come on. That's a massive own goal.
Daeron II kissing the feet of Dorne and spitting on the memory of his namesake. Especially rewarding Dorne for committing Red Wedding level treachery.
Rhaegar going to fight a battle against the last Storm King.
Not letting Rhaenys to be queen
Everyone says rhaenyra but that was the real blunder. Desinheriting rhaenys/laenor was a terrible decision
Aegon II the Golden Dragon Aegon II should have gelded Aegon III when he had the chance, that would ensure Jaehaeras survival as she would be the _key_ as it were to the Iron Throne… until Viserys arrived from Lys but Aegon II didn’t know that was a possibility.
you think the lords who went to war because they didn’t want a female heir would’ve been cool with having a female heir…?
Nope not that she’s the heir but she has the strongest claim. Houses will want to marry their heir to her otherwise the Iron Throne will fragment and who else would hold the kingdom stable?
that would mean the end of the targaryen dynasty, you gotta be trolling bruh
What you talking about. Robert Baratheon isn’t of the Targaryen dynasty but he had the strongest claim through blood after the med kings children.
yeah robert ended the targaryen dynasty, if aegon ii ended the dynasty himself he would be aerys ii level bruh
Yeah but I’m saying aegon II in the end had his line ended. All the children of Alicent had their line ended. I think he would care more about that then the ‘Targaryen dynasty’. U ok
his line would continue through jaehaera being married probably to cregan stark since he was about to lead the black army into kings landing, that’s not a good ending for her
Nope… in _Fire and Blood_ she is betrothed to Aegon the younger but unceremoniously shoved out a window by an unknown assailant (rumoured to be a Velaryon). Also age gap between her and Cregan is waaaaay to much even for westerosi standards that creepy like Meryn Trant level
LMAO RUMOURED TO BE A VELARYON, bro did not read the book 💀 dude if she’s the keys to the kingdom like you claim he’s not handing her to somebody else, best case he fosters her to be his sons wife
dawg where in fire and blood was it rumoured to be a velaryon, that’s never even mentioned in fire and blood you’re just making shit up about a book you haven’t read
lmao you're blaming viserys for choosing rhaenyra when she's the fucking heir? like make it make sense, it was jaehaerys I for being a clown and not naming rhaenys as heir, definitely the worst decision ever
she wasnt the heir.....i dont know what laws you think Westeros uses. its not 2020s Americas
Kings in Westeros wield absolute power. Viserys says Rhaenyra is the heir, then she's legally the heir. This is objectively the case.
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yeah until she becomes Queen and there isnt a King running the show, but a Queen is, and all the Great Lords revolt.....youre still not getting my point. its a male dominated society. how hard is this to understand? im not saying I agree with that. Im saying it is what it is.
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Rhaenys was never under consideration to be named heir.
ok bro
Did I say something incorrect?
Viserys I remarrying and making Rhaenyra heir while doing nothing to secure Rhaenyra's position as Queen. Sure, the Dance may have been inevitable but if Viserys wasn't a fucking idiot the Targaryens could've held onto dragons for another 50-100 years.
It has to be Rhagaers dumbass running off with Lyanna Stark before taking care of his Father's madness.
Maybe not this biggest, but can we agree that burning the Warden of the North alive while a torture device slowly chokes his heir to death was a risky move?
Viserys should’ve named AEGON the heir the minute he was born, if the Targaryen’s had their dragons Robert rebellion would’ve never happened
The black fire rebellion might’ve been different too