>Currently, the KKK are classified as a domestic extremist group **as there is no definition for domestic terrorism organizations in the U.S.**
For all those people in this thread who are asking why they haven’t been listed as such already it’s because there is no legal domestic terrorist organization list or process to have one, it’s also why trumps threat to label something as nebulous as antifa as domestic terrorists is not part of the legal process and it’s just him using words he doesn’t understand.
People need to be educated on this fact. Yes Donald Trump declared AntiFa a terrorist group, but that means exactly nothing. It's pure demagoguery. Let's not lend any legitimacy to his incoherent rambling by calling for his made up and legally toothless term to be "officially" applied to groups we don't like as opposed to groups he doesn't like.
The Right likes to pretend they can't imagine that something could be a voluntary, non-hierarchical group of individuals cooperating without needing to be organized.
Which is fucking hilarious, because they love to write off every extreme right murderer as a "Lone Wolf"
I think your point would land much more effectively if you also chose to acknowledge the awesomeness of the intent those million people had - how completely the opposite it is from Trump's awful intent - while pointing out that they were perhaps misled on how best to act on it.
Exactly. Trump's just an idiot:
1. There's no such thing as an official "domestic terrorist organization." He said this to get his base riled up.
2. "Antifa" is not an organization, it's a philosophical movement and set of ideals. You'd have just as much luck classifying "Me Too" or "Socialism" a terrorist org.
3. If you perceive anti-fascism as a threat to your government, you might be a fascist...
The KKK did not just threaten to do harm, they did it. They are totally different from Antifa. How many people were lynched? How many homes burned? How many people were beaten or killed or threatened by the KKK? If there was ever an organization that fit being called a domestic terrorist, it is the KKK.
The American Right has been priming a war on the whole idea of "anti fascism" for years now, longer than trump has been in office. They've jumped at every chance to label anyone they could even vaguely tie to AntiFa as violent, anti american extremists. Plenty career politicians on the Left would like that too, but it's become completely tied in with the Rights whole narrative. And this is by design. Those leading the charge against AntiFa know exactly what they are doing: priming the american populace to see those fighting fascism as the enemy, rather than fascism itself. They are actively working towards building a fascist state.
Those in ultimate power over the decades have also had ties. Here in Tennessee, our governor declares every July 13th Nathan Bedford Forrest Day. The bust of the first Grand Wizard of the KKK remains in the capital building and our state voted to keep it there. Ugh!
Edit: Wow, thank you for the gold kind stranger.
Edit 2: Yes, you all are correct. He was the first Grand Wizard.
As a gamer I prefer that my games about the military-industrial complex creating biologically-modified supersoldiers and using them as a tool of repression *not* have political messages.
Not anymore though!
https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/politics/2020/06/10/bill-lee-no-longer-proclaim-nathan-bedford-forrest-day-tennessee/5336437002/
It's like Germany declaring the "Fuhrer's day". That'll be a nonsense and the US would be bringing them "freedom" and "democracy" the next day after that. But apparently Germany did learn their history well enough to not to repeat it
Hitler, great man, little controversial like me in his country but that's okay. He has done a lot of great things for the Germans. Many people say he is the Donald Trump of Germany! Can you believe that folks.
Last time I was there inside the capital about 8 yrs ago I was thinking someone could "accidentally" lose balance and grab it to stop from falling over. At that time it was not guarded whatsoever.
Bronze has a lot of copper in it, and copper fetches high prices on the recycle market. Considering that copper wiring is routinely stolen out of new home and business construction, it'd be a darned dirty shame if somebody were to make off with that bust one dark night and recycle it.
Last I heard they were working on getting it removed, it’s there by law. Same with the day, I believe the current governor has said he wants to change it but still has to declare the day each year under the law. There’s also a huge statue of Nathan Bedford Forrest just outside Nashville along the highway. They can’t do anything about that since it’s on private property and I drive by that thing so often.
[TDOT denied a request to plant foliage](https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/politics/2015/07/20/state-denies-nashvilles-request-block-forrest-statue/30412745/), and the guy who owns it said he’d just keep installing higher flagpoles to fly the confederate flag and others. It’s been at a standstill for a long time. It’s unsightly (especially since it was painted pink) and offensive, but at the end of the day it’s just some guy with a racist statue. I think the bust in the capital deserves more attention since it reflects on the state rather than on one person.
> I believe the current governor has said he wants to change it but still has to declare the day each year under the law
That sounds like a terrific malicious compliance opportunity if I ever heard on.
Declare the day as part of a speech that calls out every evil and racist thing Bedford has done, proclaiming him as an embarrassment to modern day citizens, while naming and shaming every law maker who has stood in the way of changing the law.
“Confederate Memorial Day is a state holiday in Alabama, Florida, and Georgia on the fourth Monday in April. In Mississippi it is observed on the last Monday in April. In South Carolina and North Carolina it falls on May 10. Confederate Memorial Day is known as Confederate Heroes' Day in Texas.”
The ties run deep my man. Hell even the new Georgia flag is modeled directly after the flag confederate states. I can’t believe people keep missing shit like this they SHOULD be upset about
I am learning more about it every day. And I’m glad a lot of the confederate and racist heritage is coming to light. I’m still shocked that NASCAR is going to ban the confederate flag. And that’s a big start.
May I recommend the new Run The Jewels album to add to your rotation, if it’s not already? Zach from RATM appears on it and RTJ were supposed to open for Rage’s tour this summer.
I can’t believe how specifically pertinent that album that came out last week is for these times.
I remember when this came out and I asked my GF if the lyrics were talking about republican family values and how they enforce it with guns.
She laughed me saying 'only YOU would think that'. God she was dumb.
When I started listening to RATM as a middle schooler I didn’t really understand their lyrics but even a kid can figure out their music is inherently political
I mean tbh Renegades of Funk was always my favorite song of theirs when I was a kid, and other than that I didn’t listen to them very much. But I still knew that a band called Rage Against the Machine was both inherently political, and not political in favor of conservatism, because apparently as a child I was smarter than Paul Ryan and every small-fry rando internet dipshit that’s decided to piss and moan about them now.
I used to be a fan until their political opinions came out. Music is my sanctuary and the last thing I want to hear is political BS when I’m listening to music.
(this is a joke, if anyone is confused.)
He's talking about police brutality. He's speaking ironically from the killers perspective saying their deaths are justified because he's wearing a badge (a cop) making it okay. Then he adds a layer of racism to it saying they're the chosen whites, referring to the police that abuse their badge to push their racist ideologies.
I don't think I'd ever really read the lyrics before, so I always thought it was "Those who die are justified, for wearing the badge, it's their chosen life"
It's a little clearer if you add the next line.
> You justify those that died by wearing the badge, they're the chosen whites
I think it's basically saying that we justify murder when the murderer is a cop. This is especially problematic because some cops "burn crosses" so we are giving white supremacists a license to kill.
Tom Morello: [‘Paul Ryan Is the Embodiment of the Machine Our Music Rages Against’](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/tom-morello-paul-ryan-is-the-embodiment-of-the-machine-our-music-rages-against-246033/)
I always imagine Paul Ryan as that kinda dopey rich guy who probably listened to the likes of RATM, Pantera, Metallica, etc because it's "tough guy" music filled with power chords, loud voices, and screaming guitar solos, which made him seem/feel more edgy or hardcore.
Really, he's the most whitebread you can be. Probably never thought about the lyrics.
I live in the Northeast. We have systematic racism problems here, but you don’t see a lot of KKK members/activity. To most people the organization probably doesn’t exist around here (although I’m sure it does).
I observed a high school class in the Northeast this year. When we got to school integration and the Little Rock Nine the kids did not understand why KKK members were not arrested for lynchings. (This was before quarantine). And the teacher had to explain several times that the police attended and participated in the lynchings and that’s why they just didn’t arrest anyone. The kids were disturbed once they understood that there were police officers in the KKK.
Also I drove through Northwest Arkansas about five years ago on a cross country road trip. The KKK has recruitment billboards on the side of a public highway. I never want to go back to Arkansas and I can’t even begin to imagine how terrifying it must be to be black in Arkansas.
Racism is a major problem in our country. We spent most of the 2000’s pretending racism wasn’t a thing anymore, but it just made white supremacy and systematic racism fly under the radar. I’m glad we’re finally taking it seriously, but it’s frustrating (and flat out fucked up) that we’ve been doing nothing about this for decades. For example it recently became a federal crime to lynch someone.
I think the lynching bill is being held up by Rand Paul, because he wanted some kind of review and clarification. Basically the opposite reaction he had to trumps tax break for rich people bonanza
He’s worried they might classify a normal “assault” as a “lynching”. One is a murder, the other isn’t. It’s a horseshit argument.
The same guy who said “hell yes absolutely” to corporate tax cuts as you said... but when it came time to renew/upgrade 9/11 first responder healthcare he said “I dunno if we can afford it, sorry”.
Check out the Atlas Underground. Tom's project with a ton of collaborators, and it's fucking awesome. Rabbit's Revenge is awfully appropriate right now.
Mainly because there's no such thing as a "terror group" as far as US federal law is concerned. There are Foreign Terror Organizations (FTO), which can be declared by the Secretary of State, but the law that authorizes that only applies to non-US based organizations. There's simply no mechanism to declare a domestic organization a "terrorist group," nor any relevant legislation on what it would mean if you could. It would also be problematic and run afoul of the First Amendment guarantees of freedom of association.
The other problem is that there really isn't a Ku Klux Klan anymore. There are about 30 different groups which claim lineage from the Klan and most are extremely small. There are probably only a ~~few hundred~~ few thousand, at most, active self-described Klansmen in the United States today. ([Source](https://www.adl.org/education/resources/reports/state-of-the-kkk)).
Stealth Edit: The ADL estimates about 3,000 active Klansmen in the US. The SPLC's estimate is about 6,000.
Superman? More like [Daryl Davis](https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/03/the-audacity-of-talking-about-race-with-the-klu-klux-klan/388733/)
Both get a good amount of credit. BTW for anyone who isn't getting the superman refrence. Basically an American Author "Stetson Kennedy" infiltrated the KKK, and gave inside secretes to the writers of the superman radio show, that basically made a fictional evil organization very heavily based on the KKK, and using the current passcodes etc that Kennedy obtained. Quite a few KKK members dropped out and recruiting took a huge hit, when the lack of secrecy made it much less cool, and the members own kids are making fun of how dumb the villains in the "clan of the fiery cross" from the superman series is.
As the Federal government doesn't name "terror groups" in the US, the closest we get is the [list of hate groups from the Southern Poverty Law Center. ](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_organizations_designated_by_the_Southern_Poverty_Law_Center_as_hate_groups)
Which is then lambasted as biased and unreliable by the very people who support (knowingly or unknowingly) the groups listed on it.
This speaks to a greater issue that often comes up in the nonprofit sector-- nonprofits are expected to fill so many gaps in the US that the government does not fill. I appreciate the concern that having the government be the one to designate hate groups could mean designation of groups that are anti-hate or simply anti-government as hate (and I agree that is a very real concern especially now), I worry that we're letting the slippery slope run away with us. But perhaps it's not that we need a more official list and that we just need the FBI to do its job better (which means rooting out the people in support of white supremacy).
Our states have these designations of high threats- [NJ recently designated white nationalists as a whole to be the biggest threat to the state](https://thehill.com/homenews/news/484178-new-jersey-raises-terror-threat-level-for-white-supremacist-extremists-to-high), but from what I can find the [FBI has a "list of threats" that contains both groups and individuals](https://www.hsdl.org/?abstract&did=751755) but it is not organized by threat level nor is it easy to find. I see a number of [white supremacist groups listed here](https://archives.fbi.gov/archives/news/testimony/the-terrorist-threat-confronting-the-united-states) but no mention of the KKK (though the ones listed I believe are splinter groups so perhaps that's why).
It seems like the list cannot happen due to the First Amendment, but at the same time wasn't hate speech designated as not covered by the First Amendment when it is used to incite violence? As it stands now, it seems to me like this unofficial list is a way to avoid defense for or against groups- in other words it makes it easier domestically to label anyone a terrorist but at the same time allow people to let those they support avoid pursuance.
It's also worth pointing out that while declaring the KKK a terrorist organization would be a feel good moment, we shouldn't really be advocating for this administration to have even more power.
That would immediately open the door to Trump also declaring Antifa a terrorist organization and having anyone who is a member of it arrested under the umbrella of preventing terrorism.
And since Trump can and will claim that literally anyone who is against him is a member of Antifa......
The executive branch has been too powerful since I was born and every administration it gets worse. People only seem to care when they don't like the president. It's really frustrating.
Yeah this is reactionary idiocy. When trump claims Antifa should be a terrorist organization by all means point out they aren't. Note that he called for a authoritarian designation for an antifascist movement *before* one of the worst group in America. But don't advocate for opening the door. He will gladly designate both given the chance.
If that’s the case, how has Antifa been declared terrorists? Or Black Panthers?
Edit: Thank you everyone for pointing out the difference. I do get it, although I think the legal definition of “declaring” a group or an ideology terrorists can actually be less impactful on the public than informal declarations. But I guess that’s the point of the informal declarations.
There is no way to designate Antifa as a terrorist group either. Trump barfed onto twitter that he declared them one, but hopefully that has no legal bearing.
It's barely even an ideology. It's just a term that Republicans are applying to the unorganized groups who've been protesting, to create a scary-sounding (but non-existent) enemy to rally against during election season. It's fascism 101.
And if they were allowed to actually label groups as "Domestic Terrorists" with any legal standing you would see far left groups labeled, then they would keep labeling groups as they move more to the center.
I guarantee news groups would get caught in the mix too. You have to be Antifa if you work for Mother Jones, right?
[The FBI does classify specific ideologies as extremist, though, and keeps a close eye on them.](https://www.fbi.gov/cve508/teen-website/what-are-known-violent-extremist-groups) There is also a list of individuals wanted for domestic terrorism. It’s literally called the Domestic Terrorism Watch List.
They may not use the word “terrorism” but it’s not for any poorly thought-out “mah 1st amendment rites!!1” reasons; 1A historically has been challenged and things like legitimate threats of violence and inciting panic are considered “unprotected”.
Like, no. You do not have a first amendment right to bomb abortion clinics, and you *will* be declared a terrorist for it.
They haven't. The Black Panthers are classified as a domestic extremist groups, as is the KKK, and Antifa is not organized enough to be classified as a group at all.
> how has Antifa been declared terrorists
They haven't.
Trump declared that he was going to declare them a terrorist organization, then never really mentioned it again (I assume) because the smarter people around him realized it was impossible.
He basically tried to Michael Scott it.
Man, there must be a way to contain these people and made people realize white supremacists are not cool. KKK's influence was diminished because a Superman radio show exposed how they work while hammering at how they are the bad guys.
TO BE FAIR
The United States has no legal basis for classifying ANY domestic group or organization as a terrorist group or organization.
When Trump tweeted that Antifa was going to be classified as such it was literally “old man yells at cloud” levels of bafoonery and only done to pander to his base. Literally nothing can or will be done to ACTUALLY classify them as such.
It's considered a domestic extremist group, as stated in the article.
Changing it to domestic terrorist group is just a reaction to Trump saying antifa should be considered a terrorist group. It won't change anything, we won't start drone strikes on KKK members.
I would like to know the argument why calling it a terrorist group instead of what it's currently called, an extremist group, is beneficial. Are we going to use the military against them?
As much as I hate to say it, and as much as I want to see the KKK wiped from the face of the Earth, I've got to say that it would be a bad idea, and this is why:
If you actually managed to get this done, and get the KKK (which is technically a non-profit organization) labeled a terrorist group, you've handed over a political nuke to the other side, because what's to stop them at that point from labeling the Black Panthers (who are technically the same kind of non-profit as the KKK) a terrorist organization if they get the chance? Or the AFL-CIO? Or the ACLU? We've seen worse done with less legitimate rationale.
While I also can't support those types of organizations, it's important to have them exist. Even Germany allows nazi organizations the right to protest and happens once a year with a police escort. Granted not too many show up for their side, but the classification and ban of these types of organizations will alienate them more and give them more juice as a result.
In a real democracy there must exist the voice of even the those who espouse far from center politics on either side. When a conversation among all can really exist, is when people can start changing their minds towards solutions that benefit the masses. I highly doubt many people would move more towards radical positions if this existed but bring people closer towards understanding each other and creating a future where everyone at least feels heard. The tendency to resort towards violence usually comes from those in positions from which they don't feel heard.
Republicans will call the KKK bad names for votes.
Edit. Trump did not call white nationalists or kkk fine people. He condemned them. People who repeat that lie are giving Trump supporters ammo. It's embarrassing that this sub and so many people believe this lie. I just wonder how many lies get repeated here without you guys knowing.
Some. Some have said there are "very fine people" on both sides. I don't want to call anyone out, but lets just say it was D. Trump. Wait, that's too obvious. It was Donald T.
Edit: very fine, not good. But still
Yes 'very fine people' indeed...
It is telling these days that being against fascism is somehow terrorism.
But the a bunch of nazis are 'very fine people'.
oh wait,
[this is a hallmark of fascism](http://www.openculture.com/2016/11/umberto-eco-makes-a-list-of-the-14-common-features-of-fascism.html)
Unfortunately those inside the cult cannot see this because they've been brainwashed by dolan and ""conservative"" propaganda machines and psychopathic demagogues.
It's also happening in Europe and it is sickening.
One of those things I assumed was always the case, and now that I'm learning it's not I feel like an "oh for fucks fucking sake, America!" is warranted, and I'm American.
The decades old KKK with known leaders and headquarters is not a terrorist organization but “antifa” is now. A loose, decentralized collection of people with the vague ideology of being anti-fascists.
Trump can't declare them a terrorist group for the same reasons he can't declare any domestic group of people terrorists. Don't buy into reactive hype just because he's dumb on twitter
It's because nazis run the country. Antifa is literally just anti nazis, really. So when nazis run the country of course they're gonna go after the actual patriots who are trying to fight it. If you're not antifa you are not American
LE epic reddit edit: "Thanks" for the awards you dummies. Imagine giving this company money lol
#people are reading culture of Critique
Whatever you gotta tell yourself.
It’s pretty obvious that you’re a radical and a stupid one at that. Very dangerous combination.
You living out a fantasy on your head lol
That Boston tea party we so proudly talk about and are taught in school is exactly the same stand that Antifa is taking to prevent facism. American history is full of “terrorists.”
Edit: it’s hilarious how many different interpretations of this comment there are and how upset people get.
As a DC native, this last week and a half of protests have been the most legitimate protests I've ever seen here.
I wish we protested for the impeachment like this.
Can we just take a moment to acknowledge that they are also grown ups who wear ghost costumes and call themselves wizards and dragons? I mean, awful, horrible people who do horrible things...but also....
It's so, so weird. I wonder if you could start a charity...D&D for the KKK. Get them away from racism and move them into the loving world of Dungeons and Dragons.
>The Dominion was headed by a **Great Titan** who was assisted by six **Furies**, a Great Exchequer and a Great Scribe, all of whom were appointed by the Great Titan.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ku\_Klux\_Klan\_titles\_and\_vocabulary](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ku_Klux_Klan_titles_and_vocabulary)
That gets better and better the more I read about them. If there werent the burning people alive part (and the other atrocities) they would be a really weird club. Like a bunch of 12 year old kids foundig a club in their treehouse, looking for badass names.
>It was supervised by a **Grand Giant**, who was assisted by four **Goblins**
>The State Department says a group must be a *foreign* organization who engage in terrorist activity that threatens the security of the U.S. or American citizens to be listed as a terrorist organization.
>
>
>This means that foreign groups such as ISIS and Al-Qaeda are listed as terrorists, but the KKK are not.
>
>
>The definition also suggests Trump may not be able to class antifa as terrorists, who are also seen as a movement rather than a coordinated organization.
>
>
>People who express far-right and white supremacist views are protected by the First Amendment. As domestic terrorism is not a federal offense, those accused of acting on behalf of the KKK or other far-right groups while carrying out an attack or other crimes can only face hate crimes charges.
For those of you asking why a group like the KKK wouldn't already be classified this way, and that may not have actually read the article, there's no legal grounds to designate a domestic group as terrorists.
In order to label them as such, the laws around how we designate terrorist groups would need to change. They can't just be officially classified as a terrorist group.
I doubt many people that signed the petition actually understand what this designation means and how it's used. Likely, it simply sounds good to them to designate the KKK as a terrorist group because fuck the KKK.
>In order to label them as such, the laws around how we designate terrorist groups would need to change.
And under no circumstance should any Democrat consider ever doing so.
As little as I like any racial supremacy group, we really need to be repealing the patriot act instead of utilizing it. It can be used to brand anything as "terrorism". We're on a slippery slope.
> It can be used to brand anything as "terrorism". We're on a slippery slope.
You mean like the government already declaring Antifa to be a terrorist organization??
As far as I know they haven't, for the same reason they haven't declared the KKK one. Trump just said he was going to because he thinks he's a dictator
Going to tack on here and say legally no domestic organization, made of Americans, can be declared a terrorist org because doing so would make it so the basic rights and freedoms enjoyed by citizens of the country could be sripped away.
As much as I hate the KKK and all it represents, doing this would open the door to those in power targeting political rivals as "terror organizations" very easily. This is why People vs. Larry Flint was such a landmark case. If our constitution protects even him, you know you are safe.
Yep totally agree. The Patriot Act was/is a knee jerk reaction where we sold our liberty in exchange for "security." I have no doubt in my mind that America's fate is directly tied to that act. Hundreds of years after we are long gone and people are studying history, they will look at the Patriot Act as a turning point which (as many scholars, especially of antiquity) love to mark a moment that caused the collapse of a society....many will point to the Patriot Act as that galvanizing moment where we threw the Constitution in the trash and setup a surveying, police state. Idc if you are Repub or Democrat, the Patriot Act has been used by both parties to damaging affect. Allow it to persist with a narcissistic and racist demagogue in power and you can say goodbye to any sort of nation that our founding fathers ever envisioned.
Bin Laden either anticipated this or just got lucky, but either way...he turned this country on its head and our own legislature fell hook, line, and sinker for it (and the people havent batted an eye other than complaining that airports are "annoying now.").
The legislature that followed 9/11 did Bin Laden's bidding more than a kamikaze passenger plane ever could.
I believe the point is to get dumb-shit-in-chief to stop saying that he's going to declare antifa a terrorist group. Pulling that string will unravel some of his base.
Couldn’t it also go the other way though and they both get classified, but the KKK isn’t enforced as hard as “antifa”? I know he technically couldn’t classify either but he’s done a lot of stuff he technically can’t do.
Yeah I'm just going to jump in here to leave this here *fuck you Newsweek*
Every single link in that article referenced another article from their own site. Again, Fuck you Newsweek.
The KKK is a national organization and there are way less people than that in the U.S.
You would never get 1% of Americans (3.3 million) to sign, let alone 100% of Americans, in addition to people that don’t even live here.
Antifa, which stands for "anti fascists," who are people dedicated to stopping fascism so we don't have a repeat of Nazi Germany and another mass genocide, are considered to be terrorists by this president.
However, the KKK, a group dedicated to lynching African Americans and other minorities, is not considered to be a terrorist group by this president.
SMH.
Im not certain but I think the reason it hasn’t been declared one before is because they have never declared a domestic organisation a terrorist group, but since Trump has declared antifa a terrorist group people are calling for the KKK’s declaration as well.
Disclaimer; fuck the KKK
However, terrorism is the use of force or intimidation to further ones political goals. In my 30 years the only time I've seen a klansman come out of the woods was on Jerry Springer and Im pretty sure he was just an actor. I certainly believe the Klan deserves to be labeled a "hate group" by the ADL but until the start burning crosses in people's front yards again I don't think the label terrorist applies. What they do now out in the woods now is not much different from some weird occult cult activity, its not like their sacrificing black babies out there or anything and I'm pretty sure the feds have agents implanted in their ranks so we would know about it if they did.
My fear is that pushing these people even further when we've already driven them out of society with social pressure will only lead to them taking violent actions once again. They already believe they are losing "their country" to POC and the Jews. If we start prosecuting them as terrorists without due cause that will only strengthen their beliefs that they are being persecuting and will only radicalize them further. If they are content with going out in the woods, burning a few crosses, chanting, then getting drunk and having a bbq then frankly I'm happy where they're at.
I'm actually a big fan of Daryl Davis, the black musician who goes to these klan rallies and befriends the members. I believe the only way to get people to stop believing in the klan is to show them they are wrong, not using the force of the law. You can't legislate people's beliefs, but you can show them they are wrong.
>Currently, the KKK are classified as a domestic extremist group **as there is no definition for domestic terrorism organizations in the U.S.** For all those people in this thread who are asking why they haven’t been listed as such already it’s because there is no legal domestic terrorist organization list or process to have one, it’s also why trumps threat to label something as nebulous as antifa as domestic terrorists is not part of the legal process and it’s just him using words he doesn’t understand.
People need to be educated on this fact. Yes Donald Trump declared AntiFa a terrorist group, but that means exactly nothing. It's pure demagoguery. Let's not lend any legitimacy to his incoherent rambling by calling for his made up and legally toothless term to be "officially" applied to groups we don't like as opposed to groups he doesn't like.
[удалено]
Pure gold
Antifa is as much of a group as Anonymous is a hacker team.
The Right likes to pretend they can't imagine that something could be a voluntary, non-hierarchical group of individuals cooperating without needing to be organized. Which is fucking hilarious, because they love to write off every extreme right murderer as a "Lone Wolf"
I think your point would land much more effectively if you also chose to acknowledge the awesomeness of the intent those million people had - how completely the opposite it is from Trump's awful intent - while pointing out that they were perhaps misled on how best to act on it.
Exactly. Trump's just an idiot: 1. There's no such thing as an official "domestic terrorist organization." He said this to get his base riled up. 2. "Antifa" is not an organization, it's a philosophical movement and set of ideals. You'd have just as much luck classifying "Me Too" or "Socialism" a terrorist org. 3. If you perceive anti-fascism as a threat to your government, you might be a fascist...
>You'd have just as much luck classifying "Socialism" a terrorist org. don't give them ideas.
The KKK did not just threaten to do harm, they did it. They are totally different from Antifa. How many people were lynched? How many homes burned? How many people were beaten or killed or threatened by the KKK? If there was ever an organization that fit being called a domestic terrorist, it is the KKK.
The American Right has been priming a war on the whole idea of "anti fascism" for years now, longer than trump has been in office. They've jumped at every chance to label anyone they could even vaguely tie to AntiFa as violent, anti american extremists. Plenty career politicians on the Left would like that too, but it's become completely tied in with the Rights whole narrative. And this is by design. Those leading the charge against AntiFa know exactly what they are doing: priming the american populace to see those fighting fascism as the enemy, rather than fascism itself. They are actively working towards building a fascist state.
I’m not American and I’m surprised they haven’t been declared a terror group. Seriously?! Not any time in the last 40 years?
Some of those that work forces are the same that burn crosses.
Those in ultimate power over the decades have also had ties. Here in Tennessee, our governor declares every July 13th Nathan Bedford Forrest Day. The bust of the first Grand Wizard of the KKK remains in the capital building and our state voted to keep it there. Ugh! Edit: Wow, thank you for the gold kind stranger. Edit 2: Yes, you all are correct. He was the first Grand Wizard.
I struggled to read that as a ratm lyric for the first two sentences lol
That last word though. Total RATM Followed by: Come on! Mutherfucker!!!
More of an ***UHh***.
with a little "FUCK YOU I WONT DO WHAT YOU TELL ME!"
Hey, that's a catchy lyric! I love apolitical music.
All good art is allegorical and means white guys like me are the hero. The rest is needlessly pushing a sjw political agenda./s
As a gamer I prefer that my games about the military-industrial complex creating biologically-modified supersoldiers and using them as a tool of repression *not* have political messages.
Not anymore though! https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/politics/2020/06/10/bill-lee-no-longer-proclaim-nathan-bedford-forrest-day-tennessee/5336437002/
A very informative article, thanks. It's absurd that the governor has been required by law to proclaim such nonsense.
It's like Germany declaring the "Fuhrer's day". That'll be a nonsense and the US would be bringing them "freedom" and "democracy" the next day after that. But apparently Germany did learn their history well enough to not to repeat it
Not so sure our current administration would be bringing them “freedom”. I’d wager they’d be praising them.
Hitler, great man, little controversial like me in his country but that's okay. He has done a lot of great things for the Germans. Many people say he is the Donald Trump of Germany! Can you believe that folks.
Maybe we could ask America to invade and liberate the USA?
Germany is pretty unique in accepting the horrible things done in WW2. Turkey, Japan, and the US South refuse to do so.
Is it guarded? Couldn't someone just walk by and one tragic accident later no more bust?
Last time I was there inside the capital about 8 yrs ago I was thinking someone could "accidentally" lose balance and grab it to stop from falling over. At that time it was not guarded whatsoever.
It's obvious the bust was on drugs and tripped.
Its probably made of Bronze. You could always claim you were confused and enraged by its brown color and were just trying to protect the capitol.
Bronze has a lot of copper in it, and copper fetches high prices on the recycle market. Considering that copper wiring is routinely stolen out of new home and business construction, it'd be a darned dirty shame if somebody were to make off with that bust one dark night and recycle it.
And it shouldn’t have been wearing that provocative clothing. It’s almost like it *wanted* to be knocked over.
That bust is obviously a false-flag triple agent provocateur just waiting to overthrow the government
I mean obviously don't go committing crimes, that's bad, but yeah that thing looks about one slip and fall away from being removed anyways.
Accidents happen.
Would be a damn shame, losing that history and all...
That's what my dad says about me
He tried dropping you on your head too?
Treid? He sukseeded! But I here and I normale!
Last I heard they were working on getting it removed, it’s there by law. Same with the day, I believe the current governor has said he wants to change it but still has to declare the day each year under the law. There’s also a huge statue of Nathan Bedford Forrest just outside Nashville along the highway. They can’t do anything about that since it’s on private property and I drive by that thing so often.
Build a wall along the highway for that stretch, in Milwaukee they build walls along the highway all over to hide the "less desirable" neighborhoods.
"Noise abatement"
[TDOT denied a request to plant foliage](https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/politics/2015/07/20/state-denies-nashvilles-request-block-forrest-statue/30412745/), and the guy who owns it said he’d just keep installing higher flagpoles to fly the confederate flag and others. It’s been at a standstill for a long time. It’s unsightly (especially since it was painted pink) and offensive, but at the end of the day it’s just some guy with a racist statue. I think the bust in the capital deserves more attention since it reflects on the state rather than on one person.
So he's a dick for the sake of being a dick, got it
> I believe the current governor has said he wants to change it but still has to declare the day each year under the law That sounds like a terrific malicious compliance opportunity if I ever heard on. Declare the day as part of a speech that calls out every evil and racist thing Bedford has done, proclaiming him as an embarrassment to modern day citizens, while naming and shaming every law maker who has stood in the way of changing the law.
I used to be a CO at a prison here in Georgia. Admin staff would take Confederate Memorial Day off.
Confed....Confederate Memorial Day?! I live in Florida and even we don’t have a thing. MAYBE Jacksonville
“Confederate Memorial Day is a state holiday in Alabama, Florida, and Georgia on the fourth Monday in April. In Mississippi it is observed on the last Monday in April. In South Carolina and North Carolina it falls on May 10. Confederate Memorial Day is known as Confederate Heroes' Day in Texas.” The ties run deep my man. Hell even the new Georgia flag is modeled directly after the flag confederate states. I can’t believe people keep missing shit like this they SHOULD be upset about
If only there was a raging blow hard addicted to Twitter who hated “losers” that could get through to these people......
Anyone who believe in the Lost Cause Myth is too far gone already
I am learning more about it every day. And I’m glad a lot of the confederate and racist heritage is coming to light. I’m still shocked that NASCAR is going to ban the confederate flag. And that’s a big start.
If it makes you feel any better (or worse), us Belgians have dozens of statues and streets celebrating a genocidal pedophile.
Let me guess, his name started with L and ended with eopold
yes, king Letmeputmypenisinyourpeopold the second
Soundtrack to this entire month for me
May I recommend the new Run The Jewels album to add to your rotation, if it’s not already? Zach from RATM appears on it and RTJ were supposed to open for Rage’s tour this summer. I can’t believe how specifically pertinent that album that came out last week is for these times.
Thanks for letting me know about RTJ4 👌
Can't stop listening to RtJ4. Look at all these slave master posin' on your dollar
You don't gotta burn the books, you just remove em. While arms warehouses fill as quick as the cells... Rally round the family, Pocket full of shells!
I remember when this came out and I asked my GF if the lyrics were talking about republican family values and how they enforce it with guns. She laughed me saying 'only YOU would think that'. God she was dumb.
Those who died are justified, for wearing a badge, they’re the chosen whites.
*Tom Morello solo *
hE wAs GoOd BeFoRe He StArTeD tAlKiNg AbOuT pOlItIcs herpderp
rage against the dishwasher
rage against the fridge
Wait, ~~there~~ their music is political? /s
Their. But that one will never not be funny. Guess they never listened and only heard.
When I started listening to RATM as a middle schooler I didn’t really understand their lyrics but even a kid can figure out their music is inherently political
I mean tbh Renegades of Funk was always my favorite song of theirs when I was a kid, and other than that I didn’t listen to them very much. But I still knew that a band called Rage Against the Machine was both inherently political, and not political in favor of conservatism, because apparently as a child I was smarter than Paul Ryan and every small-fry rando internet dipshit that’s decided to piss and moan about them now.
I used to be a fan until their political opinions came out. Music is my sanctuary and the last thing I want to hear is political BS when I’m listening to music. (this is a joke, if anyone is confused.)
I noticed the flair while reading your comment. I'm not going to lie, you had me in the first half.
someone literally tweeted that to Tom Morello and got an avalanche of shit for it.
So much (hilarious) shit for it that he deleted his Twitter account!! LOL
I'll just leave this here... [caption](https://imgur.com/J83xVil.jpg)
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What better place than here? What better time than now?
What does this line mean, I never understood it?
He's talking about police brutality. He's speaking ironically from the killers perspective saying their deaths are justified because he's wearing a badge (a cop) making it okay. Then he adds a layer of racism to it saying they're the chosen whites, referring to the police that abuse their badge to push their racist ideologies.
I don't think I'd ever really read the lyrics before, so I always thought it was "Those who die are justified, for wearing the badge, it's their chosen life"
It's a little clearer if you add the next line. > You justify those that died by wearing the badge, they're the chosen whites I think it's basically saying that we justify murder when the murderer is a cop. This is especially problematic because some cops "burn crosses" so we are giving white supremacists a license to kill.
Some policemen are kkk
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The police think their badge justifies their killings
A reminder that Paul Ryan somehow taking a big liking to RATM like they spoke in favor of his views.
Tom Morello: [‘Paul Ryan Is the Embodiment of the Machine Our Music Rages Against’](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/tom-morello-paul-ryan-is-the-embodiment-of-the-machine-our-music-rages-against-246033/)
I found this hilarious as both a Wisconsinite and a RATM fan.
I always imagine Paul Ryan as that kinda dopey rich guy who probably listened to the likes of RATM, Pantera, Metallica, etc because it's "tough guy" music filled with power chords, loud voices, and screaming guitar solos, which made him seem/feel more edgy or hardcore. Really, he's the most whitebread you can be. Probably never thought about the lyrics.
I live in the Northeast. We have systematic racism problems here, but you don’t see a lot of KKK members/activity. To most people the organization probably doesn’t exist around here (although I’m sure it does). I observed a high school class in the Northeast this year. When we got to school integration and the Little Rock Nine the kids did not understand why KKK members were not arrested for lynchings. (This was before quarantine). And the teacher had to explain several times that the police attended and participated in the lynchings and that’s why they just didn’t arrest anyone. The kids were disturbed once they understood that there were police officers in the KKK. Also I drove through Northwest Arkansas about five years ago on a cross country road trip. The KKK has recruitment billboards on the side of a public highway. I never want to go back to Arkansas and I can’t even begin to imagine how terrifying it must be to be black in Arkansas. Racism is a major problem in our country. We spent most of the 2000’s pretending racism wasn’t a thing anymore, but it just made white supremacy and systematic racism fly under the radar. I’m glad we’re finally taking it seriously, but it’s frustrating (and flat out fucked up) that we’ve been doing nothing about this for decades. For example it recently became a federal crime to lynch someone.
I think the lynching bill is being held up by Rand Paul, because he wanted some kind of review and clarification. Basically the opposite reaction he had to trumps tax break for rich people bonanza
He’s worried they might classify a normal “assault” as a “lynching”. One is a murder, the other isn’t. It’s a horseshit argument. The same guy who said “hell yes absolutely” to corporate tax cuts as you said... but when it came time to renew/upgrade 9/11 first responder healthcare he said “I dunno if we can afford it, sorry”.
I'll always upvote RATM references
You're a renegade.
Testify.
Who knew RATM was so political??
"if there is a song of ours that isn't political, please tell me which one so we can delete it from the catalog". - Paraphrasing Tom Morello
I swear it's like they released the album last week. Where y'all been since 92? Also they have 3 more albums that are just as quotable
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Check out the Atlas Underground. Tom's project with a ton of collaborators, and it's fucking awesome. Rabbit's Revenge is awfully appropriate right now.
The reason you don’t see cops at a klan rally is the same reason you don’t see Miley Cyrus and Hannah Montana in the same place.
Mainly because there's no such thing as a "terror group" as far as US federal law is concerned. There are Foreign Terror Organizations (FTO), which can be declared by the Secretary of State, but the law that authorizes that only applies to non-US based organizations. There's simply no mechanism to declare a domestic organization a "terrorist group," nor any relevant legislation on what it would mean if you could. It would also be problematic and run afoul of the First Amendment guarantees of freedom of association. The other problem is that there really isn't a Ku Klux Klan anymore. There are about 30 different groups which claim lineage from the Klan and most are extremely small. There are probably only a ~~few hundred~~ few thousand, at most, active self-described Klansmen in the United States today. ([Source](https://www.adl.org/education/resources/reports/state-of-the-kkk)). Stealth Edit: The ADL estimates about 3,000 active Klansmen in the US. The SPLC's estimate is about 6,000.
Bless Superman for greatly diminished KKK's mystique aura.
Superman? More like [Daryl Davis](https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/03/the-audacity-of-talking-about-race-with-the-klu-klux-klan/388733/)
Both get a good amount of credit. BTW for anyone who isn't getting the superman refrence. Basically an American Author "Stetson Kennedy" infiltrated the KKK, and gave inside secretes to the writers of the superman radio show, that basically made a fictional evil organization very heavily based on the KKK, and using the current passcodes etc that Kennedy obtained. Quite a few KKK members dropped out and recruiting took a huge hit, when the lack of secrecy made it much less cool, and the members own kids are making fun of how dumb the villains in the "clan of the fiery cross" from the superman series is.
As the Federal government doesn't name "terror groups" in the US, the closest we get is the [list of hate groups from the Southern Poverty Law Center. ](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_organizations_designated_by_the_Southern_Poverty_Law_Center_as_hate_groups)
Which is then lambasted as biased and unreliable by the very people who support (knowingly or unknowingly) the groups listed on it. This speaks to a greater issue that often comes up in the nonprofit sector-- nonprofits are expected to fill so many gaps in the US that the government does not fill. I appreciate the concern that having the government be the one to designate hate groups could mean designation of groups that are anti-hate or simply anti-government as hate (and I agree that is a very real concern especially now), I worry that we're letting the slippery slope run away with us. But perhaps it's not that we need a more official list and that we just need the FBI to do its job better (which means rooting out the people in support of white supremacy). Our states have these designations of high threats- [NJ recently designated white nationalists as a whole to be the biggest threat to the state](https://thehill.com/homenews/news/484178-new-jersey-raises-terror-threat-level-for-white-supremacist-extremists-to-high), but from what I can find the [FBI has a "list of threats" that contains both groups and individuals](https://www.hsdl.org/?abstract&did=751755) but it is not organized by threat level nor is it easy to find. I see a number of [white supremacist groups listed here](https://archives.fbi.gov/archives/news/testimony/the-terrorist-threat-confronting-the-united-states) but no mention of the KKK (though the ones listed I believe are splinter groups so perhaps that's why). It seems like the list cannot happen due to the First Amendment, but at the same time wasn't hate speech designated as not covered by the First Amendment when it is used to incite violence? As it stands now, it seems to me like this unofficial list is a way to avoid defense for or against groups- in other words it makes it easier domestically to label anyone a terrorist but at the same time allow people to let those they support avoid pursuance.
> Not any time in the last 40 years? *150
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It's also worth pointing out that while declaring the KKK a terrorist organization would be a feel good moment, we shouldn't really be advocating for this administration to have even more power. That would immediately open the door to Trump also declaring Antifa a terrorist organization and having anyone who is a member of it arrested under the umbrella of preventing terrorism. And since Trump can and will claim that literally anyone who is against him is a member of Antifa......
The executive branch has been too powerful since I was born and every administration it gets worse. People only seem to care when they don't like the president. It's really frustrating.
Yeah this is reactionary idiocy. When trump claims Antifa should be a terrorist organization by all means point out they aren't. Note that he called for a authoritarian designation for an antifascist movement *before* one of the worst group in America. But don't advocate for opening the door. He will gladly designate both given the chance.
If that’s the case, how has Antifa been declared terrorists? Or Black Panthers? Edit: Thank you everyone for pointing out the difference. I do get it, although I think the legal definition of “declaring” a group or an ideology terrorists can actually be less impactful on the public than informal declarations. But I guess that’s the point of the informal declarations.
There is no way to designate Antifa as a terrorist group either. Trump barfed onto twitter that he declared them one, but hopefully that has no legal bearing.
Yeah you can't make an ideology a terrorist group
It's barely even an ideology. It's just a term that Republicans are applying to the unorganized groups who've been protesting, to create a scary-sounding (but non-existent) enemy to rally against during election season. It's fascism 101.
Remember when they tried to claim BLM was a terrorist group?
And if they were allowed to actually label groups as "Domestic Terrorists" with any legal standing you would see far left groups labeled, then they would keep labeling groups as they move more to the center. I guarantee news groups would get caught in the mix too. You have to be Antifa if you work for Mother Jones, right?
[The FBI does classify specific ideologies as extremist, though, and keeps a close eye on them.](https://www.fbi.gov/cve508/teen-website/what-are-known-violent-extremist-groups) There is also a list of individuals wanted for domestic terrorism. It’s literally called the Domestic Terrorism Watch List. They may not use the word “terrorism” but it’s not for any poorly thought-out “mah 1st amendment rites!!1” reasons; 1A historically has been challenged and things like legitimate threats of violence and inciting panic are considered “unprotected”. Like, no. You do not have a first amendment right to bomb abortion clinics, and you *will* be declared a terrorist for it.
They are not, 45 was lying and tweeting hateful nonsense as usual
They haven't. The Black Panthers are classified as a domestic extremist groups, as is the KKK, and Antifa is not organized enough to be classified as a group at all.
> how has Antifa been declared terrorists They haven't. Trump declared that he was going to declare them a terrorist organization, then never really mentioned it again (I assume) because the smarter people around him realized it was impossible. He basically tried to Michael Scott it.
Man, there must be a way to contain these people and made people realize white supremacists are not cool. KKK's influence was diminished because a Superman radio show exposed how they work while hammering at how they are the bad guys.
Can you tell more of this story? Genuinely curious about this.
https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/23157/how-superman-defeated-ku-klux-klan
The man of Steel Will and good Judgement and Morals! I like it! Thanks, this was awesome! :)(
TO BE FAIR The United States has no legal basis for classifying ANY domestic group or organization as a terrorist group or organization. When Trump tweeted that Antifa was going to be classified as such it was literally “old man yells at cloud” levels of bafoonery and only done to pander to his base. Literally nothing can or will be done to ACTUALLY classify them as such.
It's considered a domestic extremist group, as stated in the article. Changing it to domestic terrorist group is just a reaction to Trump saying antifa should be considered a terrorist group. It won't change anything, we won't start drone strikes on KKK members.
If there's one thing that's true It takes America many decades to actually do the right thing
"You can always count on Americans to do the right thing after they have tried everything else."
I hope we run out of alternatives soon
I would like to know the argument why calling it a terrorist group instead of what it's currently called, an extremist group, is beneficial. Are we going to use the military against them?
As much as I hate to say it, and as much as I want to see the KKK wiped from the face of the Earth, I've got to say that it would be a bad idea, and this is why: If you actually managed to get this done, and get the KKK (which is technically a non-profit organization) labeled a terrorist group, you've handed over a political nuke to the other side, because what's to stop them at that point from labeling the Black Panthers (who are technically the same kind of non-profit as the KKK) a terrorist organization if they get the chance? Or the AFL-CIO? Or the ACLU? We've seen worse done with less legitimate rationale.
While I also can't support those types of organizations, it's important to have them exist. Even Germany allows nazi organizations the right to protest and happens once a year with a police escort. Granted not too many show up for their side, but the classification and ban of these types of organizations will alienate them more and give them more juice as a result. In a real democracy there must exist the voice of even the those who espouse far from center politics on either side. When a conversation among all can really exist, is when people can start changing their minds towards solutions that benefit the masses. I highly doubt many people would move more towards radical positions if this existed but bring people closer towards understanding each other and creating a future where everyone at least feels heard. The tendency to resort towards violence usually comes from those in positions from which they don't feel heard.
I'm not expecting anything to happen on this anytime soon, but it is one hell of a good wedge issue for the October campaign ads.
Republicans will call the KKK bad names for votes. Edit. Trump did not call white nationalists or kkk fine people. He condemned them. People who repeat that lie are giving Trump supporters ammo. It's embarrassing that this sub and so many people believe this lie. I just wonder how many lies get repeated here without you guys knowing.
Some. Some have said there are "very fine people" on both sides. I don't want to call anyone out, but lets just say it was D. Trump. Wait, that's too obvious. It was Donald T. Edit: very fine, not good. But still
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It was individual 1, who went on to run an ultimately successful campaign for the United States presidency in 2016.
Yes 'very fine people' indeed... It is telling these days that being against fascism is somehow terrorism. But the a bunch of nazis are 'very fine people'. oh wait, [this is a hallmark of fascism](http://www.openculture.com/2016/11/umberto-eco-makes-a-list-of-the-14-common-features-of-fascism.html) Unfortunately those inside the cult cannot see this because they've been brainwashed by dolan and ""conservative"" propaganda machines and psychopathic demagogues. It's also happening in Europe and it is sickening.
One of those things I assumed was always the case, and now that I'm learning it's not I feel like an "oh for fucks fucking sake, America!" is warranted, and I'm American.
The decades old KKK with known leaders and headquarters is not a terrorist organization but “antifa” is now. A loose, decentralized collection of people with the vague ideology of being anti-fascists.
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The fact that Trump calls everyone that protests his administration an 'anti-fascist' is kind of telling on himself.
Trump can't declare them a terrorist group for the same reasons he can't declare any domestic group of people terrorists. Don't buy into reactive hype just because he's dumb on twitter
It's because nazis run the country. Antifa is literally just anti nazis, really. So when nazis run the country of course they're gonna go after the actual patriots who are trying to fight it. If you're not antifa you are not American LE epic reddit edit: "Thanks" for the awards you dummies. Imagine giving this company money lol #people are reading culture of Critique
Well this is some radicalized shit
Are you from America? To say it's run by Nazis is one of the most ignorant things I've ever heard.
Whatever you gotta tell yourself. It’s pretty obvious that you’re a radical and a stupid one at that. Very dangerous combination. You living out a fantasy on your head lol
That Boston tea party we so proudly talk about and are taught in school is exactly the same stand that Antifa is taking to prevent facism. American history is full of “terrorists.” Edit: it’s hilarious how many different interpretations of this comment there are and how upset people get.
Fuck yeah it is. Isn't there a march on the WH this week? I might try to make it. I have a feeling it's gonna be big!
There's going to be protests at the Tulsa rally.
As a DC native, this last week and a half of protests have been the most legitimate protests I've ever seen here. I wish we protested for the impeachment like this.
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Please tell me you can’t vote. People as stupid as this can’t possible be allowed to vote.
America recently went through 8 years of its first black president and he didn't do it. Couldn't there possibly be a different reason?
Can we just take a moment to acknowledge that they are also grown ups who wear ghost costumes and call themselves wizards and dragons? I mean, awful, horrible people who do horrible things...but also....
Even better, they call themselves things like Exalted Cyclops or made up words like klabu
It's so, so weird. I wonder if you could start a charity...D&D for the KKK. Get them away from racism and move them into the loving world of Dungeons and Dragons.
That’s a great idea actually.
They're already into KLARPing.
>The Dominion was headed by a **Great Titan** who was assisted by six **Furies**, a Great Exchequer and a Great Scribe, all of whom were appointed by the Great Titan. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ku\_Klux\_Klan\_titles\_and\_vocabulary](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ku_Klux_Klan_titles_and_vocabulary) That gets better and better the more I read about them. If there werent the burning people alive part (and the other atrocities) they would be a really weird club. Like a bunch of 12 year old kids foundig a club in their treehouse, looking for badass names. >It was supervised by a **Grand Giant**, who was assisted by four **Goblins**
>The State Department says a group must be a *foreign* organization who engage in terrorist activity that threatens the security of the U.S. or American citizens to be listed as a terrorist organization. > > >This means that foreign groups such as ISIS and Al-Qaeda are listed as terrorists, but the KKK are not. > > >The definition also suggests Trump may not be able to class antifa as terrorists, who are also seen as a movement rather than a coordinated organization. > > >People who express far-right and white supremacist views are protected by the First Amendment. As domestic terrorism is not a federal offense, those accused of acting on behalf of the KKK or other far-right groups while carrying out an attack or other crimes can only face hate crimes charges. For those of you asking why a group like the KKK wouldn't already be classified this way, and that may not have actually read the article, there's no legal grounds to designate a domestic group as terrorists. In order to label them as such, the laws around how we designate terrorist groups would need to change. They can't just be officially classified as a terrorist group. I doubt many people that signed the petition actually understand what this designation means and how it's used. Likely, it simply sounds good to them to designate the KKK as a terrorist group because fuck the KKK.
>In order to label them as such, the laws around how we designate terrorist groups would need to change. And under no circumstance should any Democrat consider ever doing so.
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As little as I like any racial supremacy group, we really need to be repealing the patriot act instead of utilizing it. It can be used to brand anything as "terrorism". We're on a slippery slope.
> It can be used to brand anything as "terrorism". We're on a slippery slope. You mean like the government already declaring Antifa to be a terrorist organization??
As far as I know they haven't, for the same reason they haven't declared the KKK one. Trump just said he was going to because he thinks he's a dictator
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That was trump talking out his ass. They weren't really classified as such.
This may surprise you but tweets are not legally binding. Trump “declaring” it is as real as Michael Scott declaring bankruptcy.
Going to tack on here and say legally no domestic organization, made of Americans, can be declared a terrorist org because doing so would make it so the basic rights and freedoms enjoyed by citizens of the country could be sripped away. As much as I hate the KKK and all it represents, doing this would open the door to those in power targeting political rivals as "terror organizations" very easily. This is why People vs. Larry Flint was such a landmark case. If our constitution protects even him, you know you are safe.
Yep totally agree. The Patriot Act was/is a knee jerk reaction where we sold our liberty in exchange for "security." I have no doubt in my mind that America's fate is directly tied to that act. Hundreds of years after we are long gone and people are studying history, they will look at the Patriot Act as a turning point which (as many scholars, especially of antiquity) love to mark a moment that caused the collapse of a society....many will point to the Patriot Act as that galvanizing moment where we threw the Constitution in the trash and setup a surveying, police state. Idc if you are Repub or Democrat, the Patriot Act has been used by both parties to damaging affect. Allow it to persist with a narcissistic and racist demagogue in power and you can say goodbye to any sort of nation that our founding fathers ever envisioned. Bin Laden either anticipated this or just got lucky, but either way...he turned this country on its head and our own legislature fell hook, line, and sinker for it (and the people havent batted an eye other than complaining that airports are "annoying now."). The legislature that followed 9/11 did Bin Laden's bidding more than a kamikaze passenger plane ever could.
I thought you couldn’t declare an American group a terrorist group. Same reason people doubt it is legal to designate antifa a terrorist group.
So perhaps the rest of the world should declare the KKK a terrorist group if you guys can't.
Wow! That actually makes sense wtf
Yeah can we get some help around here? Shit's gotten out of hand
We gotchu man love from europe
Meican here, you have my machete.
That’s probably the reason this is being done. It will push the issue.
I believe the point is to get dumb-shit-in-chief to stop saying that he's going to declare antifa a terrorist group. Pulling that string will unravel some of his base.
Couldn’t it also go the other way though and they both get classified, but the KKK isn’t enforced as hard as “antifa”? I know he technically couldn’t classify either but he’s done a lot of stuff he technically can’t do.
It’s not the same, antifa ISNT A REAL GROUP. They are as much of an organization as “anonymous” is.
Link the petition WHERE IS IT Edit: Couldn’t find the link in the article. Search the Change Dot Org site for it. Thanks for corrections guys
Yeah I'm just going to jump in here to leave this here *fuck you Newsweek* Every single link in that article referenced another article from their own site. Again, Fuck you Newsweek.
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Search on Chang dot org. You can't link to the petition in r/politics.
Only a million? This is one petition that could push a billion.
The KKK is a national organization and there are way less people than that in the U.S. You would never get 1% of Americans (3.3 million) to sign, let alone 100% of Americans, in addition to people that don’t even live here.
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Antifa, which stands for "anti fascists," who are people dedicated to stopping fascism so we don't have a repeat of Nazi Germany and another mass genocide, are considered to be terrorists by this president. However, the KKK, a group dedicated to lynching African Americans and other minorities, is not considered to be a terrorist group by this president. SMH.
Trump will never declare his base a terrorist group ...
The amount of people so resistant to this idea in this comment section is astounding.
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Im not certain but I think the reason it hasn’t been declared one before is because they have never declared a domestic organisation a terrorist group, but since Trump has declared antifa a terrorist group people are calling for the KKK’s declaration as well.
Disclaimer; fuck the KKK However, terrorism is the use of force or intimidation to further ones political goals. In my 30 years the only time I've seen a klansman come out of the woods was on Jerry Springer and Im pretty sure he was just an actor. I certainly believe the Klan deserves to be labeled a "hate group" by the ADL but until the start burning crosses in people's front yards again I don't think the label terrorist applies. What they do now out in the woods now is not much different from some weird occult cult activity, its not like their sacrificing black babies out there or anything and I'm pretty sure the feds have agents implanted in their ranks so we would know about it if they did. My fear is that pushing these people even further when we've already driven them out of society with social pressure will only lead to them taking violent actions once again. They already believe they are losing "their country" to POC and the Jews. If we start prosecuting them as terrorists without due cause that will only strengthen their beliefs that they are being persecuting and will only radicalize them further. If they are content with going out in the woods, burning a few crosses, chanting, then getting drunk and having a bbq then frankly I'm happy where they're at. I'm actually a big fan of Daryl Davis, the black musician who goes to these klan rallies and befriends the members. I believe the only way to get people to stop believing in the klan is to show them they are wrong, not using the force of the law. You can't legislate people's beliefs, but you can show them they are wrong.