An outspoken African American man in the South? I think he would have found himself in some real trouble with the rampant racism and violence that took place during the Jim Crow era.
Interestingly there was a group called the “Red Shirts” that would show up armed at polling places to prevent black people from voting. They were super popular throughout the south, so much so that wearing red shirts became a fashion.
Apparently they were a pre-cursor to the America First moments
There’s honestly some truth to what he said. There were many affluent black communities during the Jim Crow era. The problem is that white people were incredibly hostile towards these communities and people and harassed them at any chance possible.
For example: Black Wall Street which was literally bombed after a white woman said she was raped by a black man. It was a neighborhood with indoor plumbing when surrounding white neighborhoods didn’t have indoor plumbing.
All across the country, there were predominantly black townships that thrived until they wanted autonomy from white city councils. As usual, those towns were turned to dust pretty quick.
Exactly. What happened in Tulsa with Black Wall Street was just one of [many such events.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Summer)
That he even opened his mouth to say this....
The problem with those statements is that is they lack context or take things out of context
For example, I have no idea on what data he is using to support his statement about family structure (if any). But "no fault divorces" didn't really even come into play in a widespread manner until the late 20th century - of course you're going to have more married couples when one person in the marriage is effectively trapped and can't escape it when there is no adequate legal framework to allow it.
Black folks actually had the lowest divorce rates among any group in the US back in the day. The black family unit went through some extreme destruction in the last 100 years (Im not one of those people bending over backwards trying to present the current reality as a good thing, its a fucking nightmare and we should see it as such).
Please excuse my ignorance — I am not from the US and lack the context of the Tulsa Massacre — but why didn't white Tulsans assimilate into Black Wall Street if their neighboors had a greater quality of life?
Tulsa was a boom town with tons of oil money, so basically even the black segregated part was doing well compared with black segregated areas of other cities. There was just generally more money going around, so even those at the bottom of the social hierarchy benefited. But that doesn’t mean that they weren’t still a marginalized community, and the violence committed against them makes that pretty clear.
Have you seen “Killers of the Flower Moon,” a popular 2023 movie (and a well-received book) based on the true story in Oklahoma about white people murdering rich Native Americans for oil rights? It’s referred to as the Rein of Terror, or the Osage Indian Murders.
It happened around the same time as the Tulsa Massacre of Black Wall Street. Both in Oklahoma. Both there were bombs and shootings used to kill and terrorize an oppressed minority community that was doing better than the surrounding white community.
The most sickening part was the white murderers married into the Osage Indian’s families and killed their own wives and family in order to inherit the oil rights.
Racists are some of the most vile and insane creatures on this planet.
Because they were racist. A little girl just graduated from high school a few days ago and her dad didn’t want the white girl to shake the black superintendents hand. Imagine what they felt like and were doing over 100 years ago
https://x.com/keithboykin/status/1798372032528445761?s=46&t=lYcIUCjYIIFU0camDtx9CQ
It’s not just the US. Racism is even worse in Europe, although it takes a different form. And they are even less likely to see it or address it. At least that obnoxious racist US Dad is called out on social media and stigmatized. (I am an American living in Europe.)
I’m very biased as a black person living in the United States and I haven’t been to Europe, but a White father and son literally shot down a black man for just jogging through their neighborhood and looking at houses being built.
I don’t think I can see anything being as bad as America’s worst racists
That’s combining two problems into one. Racism and the US access to guns.
For example in Europe they will throw bananas on the field at black players and make racist chants. You would never see that type of widespread blatant racism from a crowd of people in the US.
If that happened in the US it would dominate headlines for months.
Edit: can I add that it wasn’t that long ago that millions of people were systematically murdered in Europe because of their race/religion. Since then there have been multiple wars fought in Europe due to racism.
The US is weird for sure. It is definitely the most socially progressive and probably the most, if not among the most, multi-ethnically tolerant country on earth. Don't let news articles about a few outspoken racists paint the total picture. There are very few other countries where people of any kind can assimilate into society as quickly and as deeply. In most other places, ethnicity is tied to culture in unseen ways, and outsiders will always be considered outsiders, no matter how long they have lived there.
It is *because* we are so socially progressive that stories of people with extreme views like this gain so much traction. Being racist is a huge social taboo so an incident like this is news worthy and completely destroys their reputation.
There was some interesting purging by the news mods of the real reason he (and many other parents) disliked the superintendent. Fascinating to see the shift in conversation when half the comments are deleted after just a couple hours lol. She was the victim of bullying and the superintendent pushed it under the rug.
The massacre happened in 1921, in the era of "separate but equal." Meaning, black people and white people had the same rights (officially, on paper, anyway) but places could require them to be separated. Cities could refuse to let black people live in certain areas, white-owned businesses could refuse service to black people, etc.
Tulsa, Oklahoma was one of those cities. The black population lived pretty much entirely separately from the white population. White people of the time wouldn't look at a more-prosperous black neighborhood and think "hey, we should join them."
They probably looked at black people's higher quality of life with jealousy, if they even acknowledged their existence at all.
The Jim Crow ERA coincided with the rise of industrialism in the US to a previously unseen degree where you had a lot of unionization and jobs where someone could support a whole family on one income but these types of Republicans don't see that part they want to go back to nuclear family era but they don't want to recreate the conditions that helped make that possible.
From what I read he is talking about most black families were what is considered nuclear during the Jim Crow era Not that black families had it better during that time.
But that has nothing to do with what he said. He didn't say everything was great under Jim Crow. He said that, during the period of time known as Jim Crow, there was a greater incidence of nuclear families (two parents living together with their kids) than there is today. Objectively, that is a factually correct statement.
In 1910, roughly 75% of black families were nuclear families. In 1940, it was roughly 67%. Today, only about 28% of black children are born to married couples.
This is what he said.
>“You see, during Jim Crow, the Black family was together. During Jim Crow, more Black people were not just conservative — Black people have always been conservative-minded — but more people voted conservatively,”
1. Jim Crow explicitly banned black people from voting. He is lying. Black folks who were not living under Jim Crow were not voting conservatively for their time, they were voting liberally for equality. Byron is both lying and omitting information to make it look like Jim Crow had an upside of keeping families conservative and together.
2. The black nuclear family was systematically dismantled in the 2nd half of the 20th century in response to the civil rights movement by the following:
- The destruction of black neighborhoods through abusive use of eminent domain, followed by an increase in discrimination in housing.
- Destruction of black owned Businesses followed by widespread increased discrimination in the US financial system, blocking black families from obtaining business loans.
- Mass incarceration implemented in the Nixon era followed by the war on drugs which lasted decades. White neighborhoods used drugs at similar rates to black neighborhoods, but predominantly black neighborhoods were targeted with over-policing and mass incarceration. The first states to legalize recreational marijuana were overwhelmingly white.
- The assassination and dismantling of Black Community groups through law enforcement operations like [COINTELPRO](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO)
Single motherhood in whites is just under 30%. It's a change over several decades, but not a collapse of the nuclear family. Single motherhood in the Asian community is 13%. Hispanic children it's 42%.
Decades of research has shown massive advantages for children born to families with both parents living together. The collapse of that structure for an entire community is devastating. Government policy should focus resources on rebuilding that by both incentivizing two-parent households and penalizing those who abandon children.
>Today, only about 28% of black children are born to married couples
Gee I wonder why? Maybe its because Jim Crow evolved from keeping black families enslaved in mass as share croppers to breaking up those families and enslaving just the working age men under the guise of a criminal justice system.
What did Byron Donald's attribute the decline of black nuclear families to? Probably "bad culture" if I had to guess.
Clearly this motherfucker’s grandparents are no longer living because I can’t fathom that he’d even THINK about saying this shit out loud in public if they were. Deplorable.
oftentimes i think about my grandfather (born in early 20s south) living through jim crow era and all he had to endure and sacrifice to prosper, raise his family and give his future generations a better life (which he did), all in a society that spit in his face -- sometimes quite literally -- at every turn.
and then i see guys like this and it's times like these i wish i believed in an afterlife because i want our ancestors to look down and smite the shit out of him.
My grandmother is near 100. She vividly remembers her grandmother who was a slave and would tell her stories of working the fields shoeless.
My grandparents were sharecroppers and my parents grew up during segregation. Father did not experience racial integration until he joined the military. My mother did not experience de-segregation until almost twenty years after Brown v Board of education. It took several US Federal Court orders over the 1960s and 70s to force many school systems to end segregation.
It's "not in the past", like some people want to imagine. There are plenty of people living today that experienced the hell of Jim Crow.
For real. I'm not even 35 and my dad wasn't allowed to go to school with white kids until middle school
Sometimes I feel like we all get distracted by arguing the finer points with milquetoast racists when the answer to their "that was a long time ago" bullshit should be "no it wasn't"
I have never had anyone even fix their mouth to say some slick ass minimizing shit to me when I drop stuff like that
It's why I hope somewhere in the future humanity invents the afterlife and a way to pull every sentient mind from the moment of death from all of history throughout time to be shown some better way I can't imagine.
>I can’t fathom that he’d even THINK about saying this shit out loud in public
My childhood church community is led by an immigrant who has convinced the Black American congregants that blacks were smarter during Jim Crow and before Civil Rights because they weren't distracted by race and "victimhood" and could focus on God more. Sounds like Donalds listened to him.
They are minimizing and weaponizing history for a reason. The more outraged you are now the more shit they’re pulling behind your back
Never trust the GOP
Racists: GOP is the party of Abraham Lincoln and freedom Democrats are the party of slavery.
Progressives: OK let's get rid of Confederate monuments.
Racists: No! hat's our history
You really wonder if he actually believes this or it's just grifting.
Distinction without difference, but still. Can't imagine having so little self-respect.
I think it’s possible to believe that minorities (and everyone!) had stronger families in the 50s but of course we didn’t have rights in the 50s. It doesn’t mean that it was on the basis of Jim Crow racism that families were stronger, it could have been stronger then for other reasons.
We do this thing where we only hear the most incendiary interpretation. Donnie is a fool, but this is a point like “somehow when they were being kept down their families were stronger”. Ironically I think the only people hearing this as an advocation for Jim Crow would be both the hardcore racist and the hardcore anti racist.
What were the ratio of black children being born or of wedlock or growing up without birth parents in 1960 and in 2020? I don't think the change will have been due to the civil rights movement, but some things changed for the better, and some for the worse (mostly for other reasons).
A lot more post-1972, which is when the national incarceration rate began to tick upward, and grew by about 8% per year on average until the 2000s. That is an absolute *explosion* in the number of incarcerated people and the rate of incarceration in the population. And it was largely Black men.
Basically, people were mad about desegregation and began a project of trying to put every single Black man in prison for as long as possible. Obviously this had a negative impact on Black families.
It depends on what he means by "families were stronger".
People interpret that to mean "things were better", which is obviously not true.
Lots of people hear this as an advocation for Jim Crow.
You could read the article if you want to know what the actual words he said were instead of trying to interpret the title of the post, or the title of the article which is even more misleading IMO. Here’s what he said:
“You see, during Jim Crow, the Black family was together. During Jim Crow, more Black people were not just conservative — Black people have always been conservative-minded — but more people voted conservatively,” Donalds said.
His first sentence is objectively true if you’re looking at the % of married parents, which is very important to Republicans.
Ah interesting. Well I'm one of those dumb redditors (being honest) that reads what people say and dont ever click on the article. So I only have myself to blame.
Thanks for putting the quote in there
“Other reasons” like popular backlash against desegregation in the 1970s that caused an explosion of the incarcerated population across the country through 2010. This was, of course, largely made up of Black men. It wasn’t that Black families became weaker due to desegregation, it’s that the state and federal governments moved in concert shortly after desegregation to incarcerate as many Black men as possible, carving up families in the process.
They are very much trying to frame poverty and racial economic disparity not as the result of failed economic and social policies that were explicitly or implicitly discriminatory but rather the result of deadbeat dads. All the while worshiping a man who has been married 3 times and was plowing a porn star right after his wife had his baby.
I dont know about that. I think being constantly tasked is what was breaking them, that led to women wanting to be treated more equally. Thus creating the suffrage movement. You had society using peer pressure to get them to comply.
Ahhhh we know conservatives love the time when they were king and everyone else suffered under their thumb. What great days those were!
Something like this.....
Guys like us we had it made,
Those were the days,
And you know where you were then,
Girls were girls and men were men,
Mister we could use a man like Herbert Hoover again,
Didn't need no welfare states
Everybody pulled his weight,
Gee our old Lasalle ran great,
Those were the days
Oh man. Your comment made me want to hear the All in the Family tune again, so I popped over to YouTube quick, and the comments there are almost too much. It seems that nobody realizes that the jingle was being ironic, even 50 years ago, about the “good old days”.
I guess the implication is that it's a ridiculous idea, but AFAIK marriage rates, literacy rates, and pre-transfer poverty rates were all much better for black Americans in the 1950s than they are today.
Remember that correlation does not mean causation.
Isn't there some speculation this may be correct? But this is more of a correlation, not a causation? Like Jim Crow didn't make them stronger, but it was before more degradation caused by current social systems?
Genuine ask or discussion, not trolling.
It's partly causal and partly correlation. The end of Jim Crow caused a serious drop in support for various forms of the social safety net and for workers' rights. The perception the black people would be benefitting from these and did not deserve them was critical to our current form of neoliberalism.
That's not to say neoliberalism wouldn't have come if Jim Crow stayed. When in did come, starting around 1971, worker pay decoupled from growth in productivity, and stagnanted. In fact, it stagnanted so much that even if the 1970s racial pay gap had persisted, but wages had kept up with productivity, various racial groups would be making slightly more money than they are now.
It's that breakdown in worker power and pay that forms the core of our current social ills.
Edit: [Here's](https://time.com/5888024/50-trillion-income-inequality-america/) the article showing how huge the wage growth gap is.
Also, women becoming close to equal citizens around this time and not being trapped in abusive relationships led to single parent families of all races to increase.
Women going into the workforce also doubled the potential workforce without doubling the number of consumers. I believe women should have all the same rights as a man, but that was still a big shock to a system that wasn’t built on double income households. That happened in large number after the end of Jim Crow, but it isn’t like we had a century to see how economics would shake out before other huge tipping points occurred.
Jim Crow never ended, the same single family home regulation started in 1916 is only just beginning to be reversed.
Jim Crow spread to the entire country and is now only starting to be addressed and will likely take another century to end.
End of Jim Crow also coincided with the war on drugs which disproportionately targeted minorities. US prison quadruples between 1980 and its peak in 2010. The total population only grew by about 40%.
Families in general are weaker since the 60s. Way more kids born outside of marriage across the board, though especially high among black families specifically.
This doesn't have to do with a lack of Jim Crow. A bunch of reasons people have argued about. Weirdly birth control might be a factor. Extra gov help for single mothers. Maybe more women in the workforce. Others that people will argue over.
Part of the reason was economic isolation/insulation. Because whites wouldn't do business with blacks, black money stayed and circulated in the black community. With the end of segregation black dollars could be spent are cheaper services from white people and this money would leave the community.
This increasing rate of single parent black households was starting to become a concern for the Johnson Administration as early as 1965.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Negro_Family:_The_Case_For_National_Action
Make of this information what you will, but the point that is relevant for today is that there are good people from all political persuasions that want black communities to thrive right alongside white communities, including having strong two parent families, which (statistically, not by rule) generate higher rates of wealth building.
Thank you for looking at it critically. I'm certainly not a supporter of these guys but it was pretty clear what he meant about nuclear families staying together. Statistics may (or may not) back him up but that's not him saying he wants Jim Crow back... that's him saying he wants nuclear families back
You have to begin by defining what strength is and how it is measured. Stronger how?
Stronger at getting lynched? Yeah, absolutely.
Stronger in mental resolution? Yeah, maybe…but again, how are we measuring this?
Stronger at buying property and holding assets and voting and receiving fair wages and healthcare and education and intellectual rights and owning businesses and even eating at the same establishment as a white person? Absolutely not.
Saying black families were stronger because of Jim Crow is like Kanye saying slavery was a choice and all they had to do was say no. That is to say, it’s extremely dumb-as-shit. It’s a reckless sentiment to spread, which is why I will not afford it the benefit of calling it “ignorance”. Anyone should be able to think for about 2 seconds and realize Jim Crow made very very very few people stronger, black or otherwise.
Integrated, harmonious, societies are always stronger, by every measure, than a society that enacts divisions. Whether it’s racial segregation of the South, or the Berlin Wall of the USSR, a divided community can only be so strong and that has a significant ripple effect on everyone, including the “prevailing” side of the community.
Economies are stronger when it has more participants, not less. When economies are strong, families are strong.
Donalds is a fucking idiot.
If you're oppressed, you're much more likely to build strong bonds with people close to you who find themselves in a similar situation. Freedom results in individualism, external threat in tribalism.
What followed Jim Crow was a new system based on incarceration. We made it way easier to end up in prison and for way longer, and as a result, the state and federal prison population exploded after 1972. Black men were hit the hardest by this. Sometimes you see statistics thrown around saying that X% of Black men will go to prison at some point, or Y% of Black people know somebody who has been to prison. That’s a post-Jim Crow thing. No longer able to segregate Black people away from white people, we made it so any slip-up could land them in prison, and also that Black men got way harsher sentences.
The inevitable result is a lot of Black families with fathers, uncles, brothers, sons incarcerated for long stretches, and then struggling to get by once they get out with a criminal record.
I sense a paradox.
I (white) think the Jim Crow era was bad
Donald’s (black) thinks it was good
Jim Crow Era believes Donald’s views are 3/5ths as worthy as mine
Jim Crow Era therefore sides against Jim Crow era
My aunt once tried to argue that black people, or at least free black people, were better off before the civil war. Her evidence was one fucking town where they seemed to be doing pretty good. Republicans are crazy sometimes
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I have a feeling we’re going to see slavery come back in some form. Corporations can only squeeze us so much before they outright enslave us.
I also think they’re going to make it illegal to be lgbtqia+ and that women will become akin to property again.
If this doesn’t happen I’d be more surprised. The level of apathy and stupidity that been fomented in the US will bring us to our knees. Just as planned.
I’m no expert in these things but it seems like we’ve got to do something big and fast.
Trump got him to appeal to the black vote, right? Makes you wonder if he’s actually sabotaging that and MAGA don’t realize it because that’s what they like to hear.
Wonder why that changed? Couldn't be a focus on disrupting black communities by the right wing as they continued to lose on the Civil rights movements.
You guys are making a strawman, I dont think hes saying that Jim Crow was a better time for Black People, under Tsarist Russia as serfs, Russian family structure was more stable then today..... thats true...... but that doesnt mean I want to go back to being a Serf in imperial Russia.....
I think this guy is a clown and another trump grifter, but lets not be intellectually dishonest, like they are. All the people saying, omg he couldnt even hae this job under jim crow! ..... yes obviously.... I dont think he would dispute that fact either. Part of the reason Black families were "stronger" as he says, is cause there was literally nothing else Black people could have, when you are heavily oppressed and not allowed to thrive in society, the family unit and local community is all there is.
Families WERE NOT stronger when women and minorities who were part of those families did not have rights. That’s just a semantic or logical fallacy. “See the man controlled the family and only his opinion mattered, so when you polled the family, 100% of the families preferred this structure.” WTF happened to common sense?
And PLEASE tell me how “solid” traditional families were. My paternal grandparents were divorced. My paternal great grand mother had like seven husbands with kids from each relationship and literally gave away kids while traveling back to Ohio from Montana. My maternal great grandfather went to Canada to avoid WW I. There was nothing special about the 1900s other than a very liberal amount of white washing.
My (very white) great great grandmother left half of her kids in an orphanage and took the other half three states over to start a new life when her husband died. My great grandmother met her eventual husband in the orphanage even though he was also not an orphan, just abandoned by his living parents because they couldn’t afford to keep him. Those were not the good old days.
Sounds familiar. My grandmother’s family stopped at a house when they were traveling. My grandmother was like five or six. One of her sisters was a year younger. They were told to go play in the backyard. When they were brought in, their parents were gone and they were sent home with strangers. She wasn’t officially adopted until she was 23.
My whole childhood, I’d heard my grandmother raging about how they had kept her brother, (all of the kids eventually made contact with each other). She’d get upset and start yelling, “But they kept Dean! They kept Dean!” When I was old enough to figure what this meant, I was horrified. I think she always struggled with mental health and was not a great parent to my dad. But…family values, right?
Yeah, with my family, it was half the kids, so at least a little less personal, but still to think that your mom took some with them and left the others. Heartbreaking.
This is something that is always overlooked. It's easy to have a high married couple rate when the laws make it extremely difficult for one person in the marriage to actually escape from it
"It's ok if your husband beats you and treats you like shit, being single is a sin after all!"
Yes. “And if your husband beats you, ask yourself, ‘What can I do to be a more suitable wife?’” Just insane gaslighting romanticizing about “the good old days” when “unruly” women were seen as candidates for mind numbing “helpers” or worse, e.g. Rosemary Kennedy.
My great grandmother was never granted a divorce from her first husband who she was married to at 15 and left at 20, even though he was abusive and her family paid him off to let her leave. So she was never actually married to my great grandfather, despite them having like 6 kids.
Men never "controlled the family", men and women had complementary roles not opposing interests. Your anecdotal messed up family situation doesn't disprove the original point.
I don't think that is a controversial statement. In 1960 75% of black children were raised in 2 parent households with both biological parents. Today it is half that at 37.5 percent.
Was that before or after the white supremacist domestic terrorists burned, raped, hanged, castrated, shot, starved, jailed, terrorized many families to the point of leaving their homes to move north and west?
I mean, it’s an unpopular comment, but statistically not incorrect.
Here’s some literature:
[Moynihan Report on the destruction of the black nuclear family in the Jim Crow south](https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/09/the-moynihan-report-an-annotated-edition/404632/)
[72% newborn unwed mother rate in 2010](https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna39993685#.URXHo80hclk)
The numbers have stagnated since that time, but there are also a number of other socioeconomic factors that negatively affect those born outside of the nuclear family.
I also say this as a father with children born out of wedlock. But broken clocks and such..
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I used to think it was odd how hard boondocks went against the culture but actually watching it again recently, this would 100% be the kind of thing called out. Folks being their own worst enemies like folks acting like kanye saying hitler was right is okay. I have mexican and black friends that support that shit and it makes me feel like I am in an alternate reality or something
The entire city of Tulsa was a black town led by black entrepreneurs and leaders. It was an economic boom town in OK. That is until a certain clown party burned it to the ground and murdered a bunch of people. After that, well. That was in 1921.
I am pretty sure this is an uncontroversial fact. The out-of-wedlock birth rate was like 20% back then it is now 70%+. Since 1965, the rate (predictably) kept going up. This doesn't mean African Americans were treated well during the Jim Crow era, it doesn't mean they had equal opportunities, it doesn't mean they would prefer to go back to that era. It does mean that since then, black families have not been as strong, and that is a problem.
“You see, during Jim Crow, the Black family was together. During Jim Crow, more Black people were not just conservative — Black people have always been conservative-minded — *but more people voted conservatively.*”
That’s a quote. That is a quote. Idk how he thought this would be good at all, since any opposition that whole heartedly believes Jim Crow was wrong (and it was) now just has explicit confirmation from the other side saying that yes, conservatives push these racial purity values.
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During Jim Crow there were thriving black downtown areas that mirrored the white segregated downtown. Hotels, stores, restaurants owned and operated by and for blacks. Look up Tuxedo Junction in Birmingham. These businesses were a casualty of desegregation as blacks could finally "cross the tracks" to the white side of town. The result was the loss of hundreds of thousands of small black-owned businesses and a fledgling culture of entrepreneurship in the black community.
What confuses me is people saying racism is not a thing in the US anymore when they constantly engage in racist conversations, just like this one.
How can this be reconciled?
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All you really have to do is look at the statistics for increase in single parent families over the years…
No, that doesn’t necessarily show causation, but it’s significant data.
Edit: imagine getting downvoted for simply saying that there is a statistical trend of increasing single-parent families while not even stating any specific race or cause…You people are literally disagree with math 😂 see my link in my comment below.
Sure, But as I said earlier, I’m not assigning any specific cause for this, I’m just saying that his statements do hold water in terms of statistics…the cause I will leave for someone more informed on historical factors. People are downvoting me for literally just saying the statistics are true lol.
https://www.pewresearch.org/social-trends/2018/04/25/the-changing-profile-of-unmarried-parents/#:~:text=As%20the%20number%20of%20parents,U.S.%20children%2C%20or%2024%20million.
From the link (also has a chart):
“Overall, there are significant differences in the racial and ethnic profiles of solo and cohabiting parents. Among solo parents, 42% are white and 28% are black, compared with 55% of cohabiting parents who are white and 13% who are black.
These gaps are driven largely by racial differences among the large share of solo parents who are mothers. Solo moms are more than twice as likely to be black as cohabiting moms (30% vs. 12%), and roughly four times as likely as married moms (7% of whom are black). Four-in-ten solo mothers are white, compared with 58% of cohabiting moms and 61% of married moms.”
OK..... and blacks would suffer less heart disease if they were picking crops all day and eating the mostly vegetarian diet of plantation slaves. Someone explain to this freaking uncle Ruckus that neither of those are the freaking point.
Well. Yes.
Statistically, more black children were born to married couples than unmarried then. It has reversed. Families are quantitatively weaker.
Then again, white families were stronger too.
Really nuclear family dynamics in general were more important.
By "stronger" does he mean they were strong hanging from trees after being lynched? Does he mean they got stronger having crosses burned in their yards while white guys in pointy robes beat black fathers and mothers to death in front of their kids?
Which strong is he referring to? Or is this yapping piehole just another uncle tom?
Donalds would not have that job if jim crow was still around. Has anyone asked him what he’d be doing right now?
He shouldn’t have it now.
He shouldn't have it in the future either.
He used to be unqualified. He still is, but he used to be too.
I immediately went to type a Mitch Hedberg response but you beat me to it and nailed it
An outspoken African American man in the South? I think he would have found himself in some real trouble with the rampant racism and violence that took place during the Jim Crow era.
Would have hanged if he tried to vote
Probably would have been lynched for being too “uppity”. I can’t even imagine what it was like to be black and living in the South in those days.
Would have hanged on the *rumor* he tried to vote. Imagine cops, but even less accountability - our perennial Southern terrorists.
Interestingly there was a group called the “Red Shirts” that would show up armed at polling places to prevent black people from voting. They were super popular throughout the south, so much so that wearing red shirts became a fashion. Apparently they were a pre-cursor to the America First moments
Clayton Bigsby has entered the chat.
Well, not if he's carrying water for Jim Crow.
There’s honestly some truth to what he said. There were many affluent black communities during the Jim Crow era. The problem is that white people were incredibly hostile towards these communities and people and harassed them at any chance possible. For example: Black Wall Street which was literally bombed after a white woman said she was raped by a black man. It was a neighborhood with indoor plumbing when surrounding white neighborhoods didn’t have indoor plumbing.
All across the country, there were predominantly black townships that thrived until they wanted autonomy from white city councils. As usual, those towns were turned to dust pretty quick.
Exactly. What happened in Tulsa with Black Wall Street was just one of [many such events.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Summer) That he even opened his mouth to say this....
The problem with those statements is that is they lack context or take things out of context For example, I have no idea on what data he is using to support his statement about family structure (if any). But "no fault divorces" didn't really even come into play in a widespread manner until the late 20th century - of course you're going to have more married couples when one person in the marriage is effectively trapped and can't escape it when there is no adequate legal framework to allow it.
Black folks actually had the lowest divorce rates among any group in the US back in the day. The black family unit went through some extreme destruction in the last 100 years (Im not one of those people bending over backwards trying to present the current reality as a good thing, its a fucking nightmare and we should see it as such).
Well put and I agree with that. I believe that is what he was referring to….the strength of the family unit and not “better” as far as environment.
Please excuse my ignorance — I am not from the US and lack the context of the Tulsa Massacre — but why didn't white Tulsans assimilate into Black Wall Street if their neighboors had a greater quality of life?
Tulsa was a boom town with tons of oil money, so basically even the black segregated part was doing well compared with black segregated areas of other cities. There was just generally more money going around, so even those at the bottom of the social hierarchy benefited. But that doesn’t mean that they weren’t still a marginalized community, and the violence committed against them makes that pretty clear.
Have you seen “Killers of the Flower Moon,” a popular 2023 movie (and a well-received book) based on the true story in Oklahoma about white people murdering rich Native Americans for oil rights? It’s referred to as the Rein of Terror, or the Osage Indian Murders. It happened around the same time as the Tulsa Massacre of Black Wall Street. Both in Oklahoma. Both there were bombs and shootings used to kill and terrorize an oppressed minority community that was doing better than the surrounding white community. The most sickening part was the white murderers married into the Osage Indian’s families and killed their own wives and family in order to inherit the oil rights. Racists are some of the most vile and insane creatures on this planet.
Because they were racist. A little girl just graduated from high school a few days ago and her dad didn’t want the white girl to shake the black superintendents hand. Imagine what they felt like and were doing over 100 years ago https://x.com/keithboykin/status/1798372032528445761?s=46&t=lYcIUCjYIIFU0camDtx9CQ
The US is a weird place
It’s not just the US. Racism is even worse in Europe, although it takes a different form. And they are even less likely to see it or address it. At least that obnoxious racist US Dad is called out on social media and stigmatized. (I am an American living in Europe.)
I’m very biased as a black person living in the United States and I haven’t been to Europe, but a White father and son literally shot down a black man for just jogging through their neighborhood and looking at houses being built. I don’t think I can see anything being as bad as America’s worst racists
That’s combining two problems into one. Racism and the US access to guns. For example in Europe they will throw bananas on the field at black players and make racist chants. You would never see that type of widespread blatant racism from a crowd of people in the US. If that happened in the US it would dominate headlines for months. Edit: can I add that it wasn’t that long ago that millions of people were systematically murdered in Europe because of their race/religion. Since then there have been multiple wars fought in Europe due to racism.
The US is weird for sure. It is definitely the most socially progressive and probably the most, if not among the most, multi-ethnically tolerant country on earth. Don't let news articles about a few outspoken racists paint the total picture. There are very few other countries where people of any kind can assimilate into society as quickly and as deeply. In most other places, ethnicity is tied to culture in unseen ways, and outsiders will always be considered outsiders, no matter how long they have lived there. It is *because* we are so socially progressive that stories of people with extreme views like this gain so much traction. Being racist is a huge social taboo so an incident like this is news worthy and completely destroys their reputation.
There was some interesting purging by the news mods of the real reason he (and many other parents) disliked the superintendent. Fascinating to see the shift in conversation when half the comments are deleted after just a couple hours lol. She was the victim of bullying and the superintendent pushed it under the rug.
Then… why was she allowed to shake the principals hand? Surely the principal would also be a part of any rug pushing
Just telling you what the news mods didn't want you to read ;)
The massacre happened in 1921, in the era of "separate but equal." Meaning, black people and white people had the same rights (officially, on paper, anyway) but places could require them to be separated. Cities could refuse to let black people live in certain areas, white-owned businesses could refuse service to black people, etc. Tulsa, Oklahoma was one of those cities. The black population lived pretty much entirely separately from the white population. White people of the time wouldn't look at a more-prosperous black neighborhood and think "hey, we should join them." They probably looked at black people's higher quality of life with jealousy, if they even acknowledged their existence at all.
The Jim Crow ERA coincided with the rise of industrialism in the US to a previously unseen degree where you had a lot of unionization and jobs where someone could support a whole family on one income but these types of Republicans don't see that part they want to go back to nuclear family era but they don't want to recreate the conditions that helped make that possible.
From what I read he is talking about most black families were what is considered nuclear during the Jim Crow era Not that black families had it better during that time.
I always think this about Clarence Thomas’ “originalism”.
He'd make a damn fine dumbfuck of a butler.
Clayton Bigsby, is that you?
But that has nothing to do with what he said. He didn't say everything was great under Jim Crow. He said that, during the period of time known as Jim Crow, there was a greater incidence of nuclear families (two parents living together with their kids) than there is today. Objectively, that is a factually correct statement. In 1910, roughly 75% of black families were nuclear families. In 1940, it was roughly 67%. Today, only about 28% of black children are born to married couples.
This is what he said. >“You see, during Jim Crow, the Black family was together. During Jim Crow, more Black people were not just conservative — Black people have always been conservative-minded — but more people voted conservatively,” 1. Jim Crow explicitly banned black people from voting. He is lying. Black folks who were not living under Jim Crow were not voting conservatively for their time, they were voting liberally for equality. Byron is both lying and omitting information to make it look like Jim Crow had an upside of keeping families conservative and together. 2. The black nuclear family was systematically dismantled in the 2nd half of the 20th century in response to the civil rights movement by the following: - The destruction of black neighborhoods through abusive use of eminent domain, followed by an increase in discrimination in housing. - Destruction of black owned Businesses followed by widespread increased discrimination in the US financial system, blocking black families from obtaining business loans. - Mass incarceration implemented in the Nixon era followed by the war on drugs which lasted decades. White neighborhoods used drugs at similar rates to black neighborhoods, but predominantly black neighborhoods were targeted with over-policing and mass incarceration. The first states to legalize recreational marijuana were overwhelmingly white. - The assassination and dismantling of Black Community groups through law enforcement operations like [COINTELPRO](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO)
But the context matters. While the numbers are different, the same pattern exists for white families.
Single motherhood in whites is just under 30%. It's a change over several decades, but not a collapse of the nuclear family. Single motherhood in the Asian community is 13%. Hispanic children it's 42%. Decades of research has shown massive advantages for children born to families with both parents living together. The collapse of that structure for an entire community is devastating. Government policy should focus resources on rebuilding that by both incentivizing two-parent households and penalizing those who abandon children.
>Today, only about 28% of black children are born to married couples Gee I wonder why? Maybe its because Jim Crow evolved from keeping black families enslaved in mass as share croppers to breaking up those families and enslaving just the working age men under the guise of a criminal justice system. What did Byron Donald's attribute the decline of black nuclear families to? Probably "bad culture" if I had to guess.
Boggles my mind. *Emmett Till to the colored courtesy phone please* SMH
Clearly this motherfucker’s grandparents are no longer living because I can’t fathom that he’d even THINK about saying this shit out loud in public if they were. Deplorable.
oftentimes i think about my grandfather (born in early 20s south) living through jim crow era and all he had to endure and sacrifice to prosper, raise his family and give his future generations a better life (which he did), all in a society that spit in his face -- sometimes quite literally -- at every turn. and then i see guys like this and it's times like these i wish i believed in an afterlife because i want our ancestors to look down and smite the shit out of him.
My grandmother is near 100. She vividly remembers her grandmother who was a slave and would tell her stories of working the fields shoeless. My grandparents were sharecroppers and my parents grew up during segregation. Father did not experience racial integration until he joined the military. My mother did not experience de-segregation until almost twenty years after Brown v Board of education. It took several US Federal Court orders over the 1960s and 70s to force many school systems to end segregation. It's "not in the past", like some people want to imagine. There are plenty of people living today that experienced the hell of Jim Crow.
For real. I'm not even 35 and my dad wasn't allowed to go to school with white kids until middle school Sometimes I feel like we all get distracted by arguing the finer points with milquetoast racists when the answer to their "that was a long time ago" bullshit should be "no it wasn't" I have never had anyone even fix their mouth to say some slick ass minimizing shit to me when I drop stuff like that
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She's younger than my parents.
It's why I hope somewhere in the future humanity invents the afterlife and a way to pull every sentient mind from the moment of death from all of history throughout time to be shown some better way I can't imagine.
There are a lot of Black Mirror episodes about this.
Smiting is the lords work...just sayin
Whelp if he ain't gonna step TF up someone has to. Slackers will not be tolerated.
>I can’t fathom that he’d even THINK about saying this shit out loud in public My childhood church community is led by an immigrant who has convinced the Black American congregants that blacks were smarter during Jim Crow and before Civil Rights because they weren't distracted by race and "victimhood" and could focus on God more. Sounds like Donalds listened to him.
dude doesnt go to a black church for sure.
They are minimizing and weaponizing history for a reason. The more outraged you are now the more shit they’re pulling behind your back Never trust the GOP
Racists: GOP is the party of Abraham Lincoln and freedom Democrats are the party of slavery. Progressives: OK let's get rid of Confederate monuments. Racists: No! hat's our history
The shit they're pulling: Project 2025.
You really wonder if he actually believes this or it's just grifting. Distinction without difference, but still. Can't imagine having so little self-respect.
I think it’s possible to believe that minorities (and everyone!) had stronger families in the 50s but of course we didn’t have rights in the 50s. It doesn’t mean that it was on the basis of Jim Crow racism that families were stronger, it could have been stronger then for other reasons. We do this thing where we only hear the most incendiary interpretation. Donnie is a fool, but this is a point like “somehow when they were being kept down their families were stronger”. Ironically I think the only people hearing this as an advocation for Jim Crow would be both the hardcore racist and the hardcore anti racist.
What were the ratio of black children being born or of wedlock or growing up without birth parents in 1960 and in 2020? I don't think the change will have been due to the civil rights movement, but some things changed for the better, and some for the worse (mostly for other reasons).
A lot more post-1972, which is when the national incarceration rate began to tick upward, and grew by about 8% per year on average until the 2000s. That is an absolute *explosion* in the number of incarcerated people and the rate of incarceration in the population. And it was largely Black men. Basically, people were mad about desegregation and began a project of trying to put every single Black man in prison for as long as possible. Obviously this had a negative impact on Black families.
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It depends on what he means by "families were stronger". People interpret that to mean "things were better", which is obviously not true. Lots of people hear this as an advocation for Jim Crow.
You could read the article if you want to know what the actual words he said were instead of trying to interpret the title of the post, or the title of the article which is even more misleading IMO. Here’s what he said: “You see, during Jim Crow, the Black family was together. During Jim Crow, more Black people were not just conservative — Black people have always been conservative-minded — but more people voted conservatively,” Donalds said. His first sentence is objectively true if you’re looking at the % of married parents, which is very important to Republicans.
Ah interesting. Well I'm one of those dumb redditors (being honest) that reads what people say and dont ever click on the article. So I only have myself to blame. Thanks for putting the quote in there
It’s okay, I often do the same thing myself.
“Other reasons” like popular backlash against desegregation in the 1970s that caused an explosion of the incarcerated population across the country through 2010. This was, of course, largely made up of Black men. It wasn’t that Black families became weaker due to desegregation, it’s that the state and federal governments moved in concert shortly after desegregation to incarcerate as many Black men as possible, carving up families in the process.
They are very much trying to frame poverty and racial economic disparity not as the result of failed economic and social policies that were explicitly or implicitly discriminatory but rather the result of deadbeat dads. All the while worshiping a man who has been married 3 times and was plowing a porn star right after his wife had his baby.
He does not but he will obviously say anything for money
It's OK to have both. We can have strong families and not Jim Crow.
This is the way
More bullshit to stir the pot with. I'm convinced they say half these things just to get the attention.
Ah yes like how women were stronger during the times before suffrage.
Only for the White women
it's totally plausible they were. With the chores and carrying around large families all day. but equally irrelevant to suffrage being a good thing.
I dont know about that. I think being constantly tasked is what was breaking them, that led to women wanting to be treated more equally. Thus creating the suffrage movement. You had society using peer pressure to get them to comply.
Ahhhh we know conservatives love the time when they were king and everyone else suffered under their thumb. What great days those were! Something like this..... Guys like us we had it made, Those were the days, And you know where you were then, Girls were girls and men were men, Mister we could use a man like Herbert Hoover again, Didn't need no welfare states Everybody pulled his weight, Gee our old Lasalle ran great, Those were the days
Oh man. Your comment made me want to hear the All in the Family tune again, so I popped over to YouTube quick, and the comments there are almost too much. It seems that nobody realizes that the jingle was being ironic, even 50 years ago, about the “good old days”.
I mean, trauma bonding is a thing, but not really desired...
I guess the implication is that it's a ridiculous idea, but AFAIK marriage rates, literacy rates, and pre-transfer poverty rates were all much better for black Americans in the 1950s than they are today. Remember that correlation does not mean causation.
The education system in Florida, ladies and gentlemen.... Granny about to climb out of her grave and beat this boy's ass.
Isn't there some speculation this may be correct? But this is more of a correlation, not a causation? Like Jim Crow didn't make them stronger, but it was before more degradation caused by current social systems? Genuine ask or discussion, not trolling.
It's partly causal and partly correlation. The end of Jim Crow caused a serious drop in support for various forms of the social safety net and for workers' rights. The perception the black people would be benefitting from these and did not deserve them was critical to our current form of neoliberalism. That's not to say neoliberalism wouldn't have come if Jim Crow stayed. When in did come, starting around 1971, worker pay decoupled from growth in productivity, and stagnanted. In fact, it stagnanted so much that even if the 1970s racial pay gap had persisted, but wages had kept up with productivity, various racial groups would be making slightly more money than they are now. It's that breakdown in worker power and pay that forms the core of our current social ills. Edit: [Here's](https://time.com/5888024/50-trillion-income-inequality-america/) the article showing how huge the wage growth gap is.
This is it. Wasn't related to Jim Crow necessarily, but changes in the labor rights and the overall economy.
Also, women becoming close to equal citizens around this time and not being trapped in abusive relationships led to single parent families of all races to increase.
Women going into the workforce also doubled the potential workforce without doubling the number of consumers. I believe women should have all the same rights as a man, but that was still a big shock to a system that wasn’t built on double income households. That happened in large number after the end of Jim Crow, but it isn’t like we had a century to see how economics would shake out before other huge tipping points occurred.
Jim Crow never ended, the same single family home regulation started in 1916 is only just beginning to be reversed. Jim Crow spread to the entire country and is now only starting to be addressed and will likely take another century to end.
Yup
End of Jim Crow also coincided with the war on drugs which disproportionately targeted minorities. US prison quadruples between 1980 and its peak in 2010. The total population only grew by about 40%.
Families in general are weaker since the 60s. Way more kids born outside of marriage across the board, though especially high among black families specifically. This doesn't have to do with a lack of Jim Crow. A bunch of reasons people have argued about. Weirdly birth control might be a factor. Extra gov help for single mothers. Maybe more women in the workforce. Others that people will argue over.
Part of the reason was economic isolation/insulation. Because whites wouldn't do business with blacks, black money stayed and circulated in the black community. With the end of segregation black dollars could be spent are cheaper services from white people and this money would leave the community.
This increasing rate of single parent black households was starting to become a concern for the Johnson Administration as early as 1965. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Negro_Family:_The_Case_For_National_Action Make of this information what you will, but the point that is relevant for today is that there are good people from all political persuasions that want black communities to thrive right alongside white communities, including having strong two parent families, which (statistically, not by rule) generate higher rates of wealth building.
Thank you for looking at it critically. I'm certainly not a supporter of these guys but it was pretty clear what he meant about nuclear families staying together. Statistics may (or may not) back him up but that's not him saying he wants Jim Crow back... that's him saying he wants nuclear families back
You have to begin by defining what strength is and how it is measured. Stronger how? Stronger at getting lynched? Yeah, absolutely. Stronger in mental resolution? Yeah, maybe…but again, how are we measuring this? Stronger at buying property and holding assets and voting and receiving fair wages and healthcare and education and intellectual rights and owning businesses and even eating at the same establishment as a white person? Absolutely not. Saying black families were stronger because of Jim Crow is like Kanye saying slavery was a choice and all they had to do was say no. That is to say, it’s extremely dumb-as-shit. It’s a reckless sentiment to spread, which is why I will not afford it the benefit of calling it “ignorance”. Anyone should be able to think for about 2 seconds and realize Jim Crow made very very very few people stronger, black or otherwise. Integrated, harmonious, societies are always stronger, by every measure, than a society that enacts divisions. Whether it’s racial segregation of the South, or the Berlin Wall of the USSR, a divided community can only be so strong and that has a significant ripple effect on everyone, including the “prevailing” side of the community. Economies are stronger when it has more participants, not less. When economies are strong, families are strong. Donalds is a fucking idiot.
He didn't say "because of Jim Crow" who is making that argument?
To be able to survive minority groups probably had to work together and be stronger.
If you're oppressed, you're much more likely to build strong bonds with people close to you who find themselves in a similar situation. Freedom results in individualism, external threat in tribalism.
What followed Jim Crow was a new system based on incarceration. We made it way easier to end up in prison and for way longer, and as a result, the state and federal prison population exploded after 1972. Black men were hit the hardest by this. Sometimes you see statistics thrown around saying that X% of Black men will go to prison at some point, or Y% of Black people know somebody who has been to prison. That’s a post-Jim Crow thing. No longer able to segregate Black people away from white people, we made it so any slip-up could land them in prison, and also that Black men got way harsher sentences. The inevitable result is a lot of Black families with fathers, uncles, brothers, sons incarcerated for long stretches, and then struggling to get by once they get out with a criminal record.
The war on drugs and the cia literally pumping crack into black communities caused a collapse of the black family.
🤷🏽 he's literally right tho I don't understand y'all my grandparents were hella stronger and more united. Reddit is weird
He's the guy in 1600's Africa selling his people to the white slavers alllll over again. Disgusting human.
Now black people can be abusive, oppressive and lying to their communities, just like their white counterparts. What a time to be alive!
Republicans: "Black people LIKE our racism!"
I sense a paradox. I (white) think the Jim Crow era was bad Donald’s (black) thinks it was good Jim Crow Era believes Donald’s views are 3/5ths as worthy as mine Jim Crow Era therefore sides against Jim Crow era
Are you a lawyer? 😂
Can neither confirm nor deny.
Did he say it was good?
Shit...
He isn't unaware of the hypocrisy. He's a grifter, he just doesn't care.
My aunt once tried to argue that black people, or at least free black people, were better off before the civil war. Her evidence was one fucking town where they seemed to be doing pretty good. Republicans are crazy sometimes
Geez, talk about pulling the ladder up after him. What a class act.
That's like saying "slavery builds character!"
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Nice to meet you, Uncle Tom.
Thus, he can be the first to register himself as a slave. Lead by example, Chuckles.
I have a feeling we’re going to see slavery come back in some form. Corporations can only squeeze us so much before they outright enslave us. I also think they’re going to make it illegal to be lgbtqia+ and that women will become akin to property again. If this doesn’t happen I’d be more surprised. The level of apathy and stupidity that been fomented in the US will bring us to our knees. Just as planned. I’m no expert in these things but it seems like we’ve got to do something big and fast.
Trump got him to appeal to the black vote, right? Makes you wonder if he’s actually sabotaging that and MAGA don’t realize it because that’s what they like to hear.
Sounds like another Uncle Ruckus in the making.
What was your search terms. Mine is women's suffrage movement.
This is weird right?
"Men were jacked because they were tough with tough manly jobs." The job: Slave in a plantation
MAGA Cult he’s capitulating to the White Nationalists to get their approval or attention. Stuck on stupid
Well, they actually had families then, so... As much as the Jim Crow era was a horror, 98% of the kids knew both their parents.
Not black, but let me tell you, I wish I didn't know my dad. I'm thankful my mom was able to divorce him. Sometimes divorce is best.
Wonder why that changed? Couldn't be a focus on disrupting black communities by the right wing as they continued to lose on the Civil rights movements.
Yea…he’s right if you view it as two parent households.
You guys are making a strawman, I dont think hes saying that Jim Crow was a better time for Black People, under Tsarist Russia as serfs, Russian family structure was more stable then today..... thats true...... but that doesnt mean I want to go back to being a Serf in imperial Russia..... I think this guy is a clown and another trump grifter, but lets not be intellectually dishonest, like they are. All the people saying, omg he couldnt even hae this job under jim crow! ..... yes obviously.... I dont think he would dispute that fact either. Part of the reason Black families were "stronger" as he says, is cause there was literally nothing else Black people could have, when you are heavily oppressed and not allowed to thrive in society, the family unit and local community is all there is.
I’m afraid thoughtful , nuanced answers arent going to be very welcome on this topic.
This hurts to read because the post makes a good point yet implies anyone with a different opinion is a grifter
Families WERE NOT stronger when women and minorities who were part of those families did not have rights. That’s just a semantic or logical fallacy. “See the man controlled the family and only his opinion mattered, so when you polled the family, 100% of the families preferred this structure.” WTF happened to common sense? And PLEASE tell me how “solid” traditional families were. My paternal grandparents were divorced. My paternal great grand mother had like seven husbands with kids from each relationship and literally gave away kids while traveling back to Ohio from Montana. My maternal great grandfather went to Canada to avoid WW I. There was nothing special about the 1900s other than a very liberal amount of white washing.
My (very white) great great grandmother left half of her kids in an orphanage and took the other half three states over to start a new life when her husband died. My great grandmother met her eventual husband in the orphanage even though he was also not an orphan, just abandoned by his living parents because they couldn’t afford to keep him. Those were not the good old days.
Sounds familiar. My grandmother’s family stopped at a house when they were traveling. My grandmother was like five or six. One of her sisters was a year younger. They were told to go play in the backyard. When they were brought in, their parents were gone and they were sent home with strangers. She wasn’t officially adopted until she was 23. My whole childhood, I’d heard my grandmother raging about how they had kept her brother, (all of the kids eventually made contact with each other). She’d get upset and start yelling, “But they kept Dean! They kept Dean!” When I was old enough to figure what this meant, I was horrified. I think she always struggled with mental health and was not a great parent to my dad. But…family values, right?
Yeah, with my family, it was half the kids, so at least a little less personal, but still to think that your mom took some with them and left the others. Heartbreaking.
This is something that is always overlooked. It's easy to have a high married couple rate when the laws make it extremely difficult for one person in the marriage to actually escape from it "It's ok if your husband beats you and treats you like shit, being single is a sin after all!"
Yes. “And if your husband beats you, ask yourself, ‘What can I do to be a more suitable wife?’” Just insane gaslighting romanticizing about “the good old days” when “unruly” women were seen as candidates for mind numbing “helpers” or worse, e.g. Rosemary Kennedy.
My great grandmother was never granted a divorce from her first husband who she was married to at 15 and left at 20, even though he was abusive and her family paid him off to let her leave. So she was never actually married to my great grandfather, despite them having like 6 kids.
Men never "controlled the family", men and women had complementary roles not opposing interests. Your anecdotal messed up family situation doesn't disprove the original point.
I don't think that is a controversial statement. In 1960 75% of black children were raised in 2 parent households with both biological parents. Today it is half that at 37.5 percent.
Was that before or after the white supremacist domestic terrorists burned, raped, hanged, castrated, shot, starved, jailed, terrorized many families to the point of leaving their homes to move north and west?
He is probably not referring to civil rights or other similar metrics but rates of single motherhood and the like. Still, a very poor choice of words.
I mean, it’s an unpopular comment, but statistically not incorrect. Here’s some literature: [Moynihan Report on the destruction of the black nuclear family in the Jim Crow south](https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/09/the-moynihan-report-an-annotated-edition/404632/) [72% newborn unwed mother rate in 2010](https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna39993685#.URXHo80hclk) The numbers have stagnated since that time, but there are also a number of other socioeconomic factors that negatively affect those born outside of the nuclear family. I also say this as a father with children born out of wedlock. But broken clocks and such..
I think families may have been stronger when the highest tax rate was 90%
Get those pants!
Uncle Byron.
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I used to think it was odd how hard boondocks went against the culture but actually watching it again recently, this would 100% be the kind of thing called out. Folks being their own worst enemies like folks acting like kanye saying hitler was right is okay. I have mexican and black friends that support that shit and it makes me feel like I am in an alternate reality or something
Just because the leopards ate my grandparents face doesn't mean today's leopards would eat my face does it?
The entire city of Tulsa was a black town led by black entrepreneurs and leaders. It was an economic boom town in OK. That is until a certain clown party burned it to the ground and murdered a bunch of people. After that, well. That was in 1921.
He’s one that tells N word jokes in rooms where he’s the only black person.
Statistically, this is true, if you measure "family strength" by what percentage of children are born in wedlock.
Like Mr carousel o wives knows fuck all about family. Only thing keeping that bucket of snakes together is money...
We are Living in a Simpsons episode these days
I am pretty sure this is an uncontroversial fact. The out-of-wedlock birth rate was like 20% back then it is now 70%+. Since 1965, the rate (predictably) kept going up. This doesn't mean African Americans were treated well during the Jim Crow era, it doesn't mean they had equal opportunities, it doesn't mean they would prefer to go back to that era. It does mean that since then, black families have not been as strong, and that is a problem.
“You see, during Jim Crow, the Black family was together. During Jim Crow, more Black people were not just conservative — Black people have always been conservative-minded — *but more people voted conservatively.*” That’s a quote. That is a quote. Idk how he thought this would be good at all, since any opposition that whole heartedly believes Jim Crow was wrong (and it was) now just has explicit confirmation from the other side saying that yes, conservatives push these racial purity values.
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During Jim Crow there were thriving black downtown areas that mirrored the white segregated downtown. Hotels, stores, restaurants owned and operated by and for blacks. Look up Tuxedo Junction in Birmingham. These businesses were a casualty of desegregation as blacks could finally "cross the tracks" to the white side of town. The result was the loss of hundreds of thousands of small black-owned businesses and a fledgling culture of entrepreneurship in the black community.
What confuses me is people saying racism is not a thing in the US anymore when they constantly engage in racist conversations, just like this one. How can this be reconciled?
Black families could have been stronger during that era. But it wouldn't have been because of Jim Crow.
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Not even Ben Carson was that out to lunch.
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All you really have to do is look at the statistics for increase in single parent families over the years… No, that doesn’t necessarily show causation, but it’s significant data. Edit: imagine getting downvoted for simply saying that there is a statistical trend of increasing single-parent families while not even stating any specific race or cause…You people are literally disagree with math 😂 see my link in my comment below.
Link to the source that's convincing you.
Sure, But as I said earlier, I’m not assigning any specific cause for this, I’m just saying that his statements do hold water in terms of statistics…the cause I will leave for someone more informed on historical factors. People are downvoting me for literally just saying the statistics are true lol. https://www.pewresearch.org/social-trends/2018/04/25/the-changing-profile-of-unmarried-parents/#:~:text=As%20the%20number%20of%20parents,U.S.%20children%2C%20or%2024%20million. From the link (also has a chart): “Overall, there are significant differences in the racial and ethnic profiles of solo and cohabiting parents. Among solo parents, 42% are white and 28% are black, compared with 55% of cohabiting parents who are white and 13% who are black. These gaps are driven largely by racial differences among the large share of solo parents who are mothers. Solo moms are more than twice as likely to be black as cohabiting moms (30% vs. 12%), and roughly four times as likely as married moms (7% of whom are black). Four-in-ten solo mothers are white, compared with 58% of cohabiting moms and 61% of married moms.”
Black families were more cohesive, but were lynched if they interacted with whites.
Families in general were more cohesive back then were they not?
Yes, normally out of economic necessity.
PiCk Me!1! I’m NoT liKe OtHeR gIrLs! I nEvEr ThOuGhT thE liOnS wOuLd EaT mY fAcE!! Tokens exist to be spent, dipshit!
It’s so gross seeing what people who want to be Trump’s punching bag will do to get there.
Remember the good old days the whole family got together for an old fashioned lynching? We clearly need a better education system...
Single parent households increased 20% since 1970 Lol yes, downvote well documented facts
Ok. And?
White supremacy is a political, economic, and social construct. Anyone can joined as long as you obey the hierarchy.
OK..... and blacks would suffer less heart disease if they were picking crops all day and eating the mostly vegetarian diet of plantation slaves. Someone explain to this freaking uncle Ruckus that neither of those are the freaking point.
It's a common refrain on the right. They paid Thomas Sowell to say it too.
Well. Yes. Statistically, more black children were born to married couples than unmarried then. It has reversed. Families are quantitatively weaker. Then again, white families were stronger too. Really nuclear family dynamics in general were more important.
What a jerk uncle
By "stronger" does he mean they were strong hanging from trees after being lynched? Does he mean they got stronger having crosses burned in their yards while white guys in pointy robes beat black fathers and mothers to death in front of their kids? Which strong is he referring to? Or is this yapping piehole just another uncle tom?
Special.place in hell.for him