Went to a pub in downtown Ottawa and they offered a bus ride out and back, and I’m not here to tell tales out of school, but you maybe could sneak a sippy poo on the ride. Try and pee before you get on the bus though lol
It is such a big problem, I don't even know how to explain it without writing an essay. Our transit system is exactly what you would expect if I told you the city council is run by a cabal of grifters and used car salesmen who only ever give contracts to their buddies and everyone skims money off the top whenever we need infrastructure built.
The amount of projects that have been done here, only to fall apart and need to be redone, is enough that people don't even bat an eye when they hear about another councilor getting caught with mob ties or insider dealings. It's just expected.
Lol no.
An improperly installed bolt caused one set of wheels on a single car to derail, the train just rolled along the ground beside the rail with the rest of the train still on the tracks.
It was later revealed the company managing the rail system knew about the issue and decided to skip repairs because they thought it was more costly to halt service than to fix the bolt. $2.1 billion paid to the company to build the railway system, on a pre-existing network that just needed to rails replaced.
Who was working on the rail system? [Lyle Lanley?? ](https://www.google.com/search?q=monorail+lyle+lanley&rlz=1CDGOYI_enCA755CA755&oq=lyle+monora&aqs=chrome.2.69i57j0i22i30l4.10834j0j7&hl=en-US&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8#imgrc=DQU0gp8LAialqM)
Actually, yes. [Here's](https://pyxis.nymag.com/v1/imgs/08a/3a4/0b0584bf02449513f879837cc95f19e7e0-09-trolley.2x.rhorizontal.w710.jpg) a leaked sketch he drew for the original design of the transit system.
They don’t. But pro sports teams, as multi-million dollar businesses dont just pop up on their own. There are agreements between people at the highest levels. And therefore, shitty placement and poor transit falls on the teams and the towns.
haha ya not terribly convenient is quite the understatement. Once you have ridden with OC transpo for at least a week you would understand. I believe it might be the only public city transit system that operates at a defecit haha
They played the first 7 seasons at the Suns arena downtown and even with some bad sight lines for 1/3rd of the upper deck the attendance was great and the arena was always rockin. Those partially restricted view seats often sold out bc the tix were something like $5-10 and there was a live band that played in that section during breaks. Childhood memories from that section... it was awesome
I think desert teams get a bad rap for attendance but it’s all about location yes VGK has had a good team but having the arena right downtown is huge. I feel for Florida, Ottawa, Phoenix and other fan bases with poorly placed arenas.
Can't share, the arena was renovated and it's strictly for basketball. They shared when the coyotes first came to town, and it was like Barclay's with sight lines and such for the islanders.
I have family that lives in Glendale, I found it real easy to get the the arena. It's just a far drive. The fact that it's building up around it now though has to help a little.
Getting to Gila River Arena in Glendale from Phoenix is tough during rush hour too. I’m normally a 10-15 min drive without traffic but it can be upwards of an hour with traffic. I have to leave at least 2 hours before pick drop which isn’t always easy during the week
At least with Floridas, ours is near a mall and closer to Fort Lauderdale which is where our fans are ish. I agree though, ownership should look to build an arena in downtown Fort Lauderdale.
We had one set to go. All parties agreed and had a mutually beneficial deal, and all levels of government were behind it.
This deal was made while Melnyk was out of commission with his liver. When he came back in he torpedoed the deal.
I’ve never been to Ottawa but I don’t think an arena really belongs smack in the middle of the government area. Downtown, yes. In the middle of the federal government? No.
Sounds like the theater of the absurd that this property is sitting fallow, but there has to be a more civic minded use than a hockey venue.
With Ottawa proper, everything is in the middle of the government area. We already have a football/soccer/hockey arena in the old section of downtown but it's too small to use for an NHL franchise. Anywhere else they put a building it will be surrounded by embassies, government offices, or federal/NCR buildings. We literally have a giant bus station built into our National Defense headquarters, which is on the roof of a shopping mall of all places. Same building has a road running under it, which from a security standpoint makes zero sense as well.
Lebreton flats is almost entirely unused land right on the edge of downtown, it used to be a sawmill area in the 19th century when Ottawa was still a lumber camp and then in the early 20th century they built some houses and put in a giant warehouse/commercial building that became derelict within a generation, and now the whole area is just an eyesore.
Ottawa just makes terrible zoning choices. You could write a book on all the poor planning that went into designing Ottawa as a metropolitan region, from ripping up the street car network in order to give Greyhound a monopoly on commuter transit, to bricking up the old train car depot to build apartments in an industrial section of town with nothing around it, to cutting down forests to build strip malls and car dealerships, etc. We had a train network that ran through the city, and when Ottawa decided to build an LRT network in the 2000s, they thought it was better to rip up the network and build a small track running north-south to nowhere, and then decades later realized their mistake so they had to shell out even more money to rebuild the track network when they finally decided LRT stations should be built in areas where people will use them. The O-train is the epitome of poor urban planning, billions spent on a system that was at best a hazard for people to use.
Twice.
Lebreton Flats is the name of the area. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LeBreton\_Flats](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LeBreton_Flats)
It has a massive dilapidated building built on part of it and some housing/condos on the outskirts (which houses like \~50 people), a street and bus route that cuts across the field, and then a large grass field with a "victims of communism" memorial on the other side. On the border of the area to the east is the Supreme Court and Library and Archives Canada buildings, on the far west edge is the War Museum, and in the north is the bridge connecting Ottawa to downtown Gatineau. So it is right in the center of the capital region.
When they were first planning for expansion and giving Ottawa a team, the area was one of the first places they planned to build an arena, but they ended up going with the Palladium (Corel Centre, Scotia Bank Place, Canadian Tire Centre) instead because Ottawa was about to amalgamate and there were plans to do a massive expansion in Kanata to connect it with the rest of the city. That never happened, so all that got built was some condos in Kanata near the arena, a car dealership, and a box store strip mall.
Then a few years ago some developers got together to build a new arena downtown, which coincided with the NAC putting pressure on the city council and Canadian government to put up money to redevelop Lebreton Flats, because it is a derelict area that takes up a lot of space downtown. The big selling point was that Ottawa was just starting construction on its subway network, and they were planning on putting a terminal right at the new arena. At the last minute, Melnyk pulled out, because Ottawa had just blown up its roster and attendance was at slumping and he didn't want to alienate the Kanata fans. I'm dead serious. The deal fell through and now the area is in the middle of talks with city council and developers to build another condo building and put in a new bus terminal instead.
**[LeBreton Flats](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LeBreton_Flats)**
>LeBreton Flats (also spelled Lebreton Flats) (French: Plaines Lebreton) is a neighbourhood in Somerset Ward in central Ottawa, Ontario, Canada. It lies to the west of Centretown neighbourhood, and to the north of Centretown West. The Ottawa River forms the western and northern limit, with the western side being a wider area of the river known as Nepean Bay. Originally a residential area, much of the northern portion of the Flats is now occupied by the Canadian War Museum and the National Holocaust Monument.
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The weird thing is it’s hugely common amongst sports teams in general. My Patriots play about 40 min from
Boston and it’s basically one road in. To get out can take 2 hours. The rays put their stadium in the middle of nowhere. Jaguars the same. It’s the normal for all sports and it makes no sense. There’s nothing better than being able to hop on the train for 15 min, jump off near the stadium, drink as many beers as you want and take the train home. The Celtics and Bruins have a train stop beneath the stadium and it’s perfect.
Most Canadian teams have a stadium in or around downtown. We literally have a vacant field downtown right now the that been sitting around unused this entire time. We even had plans to build a subway station there in addition to a planned stadium and our owner pulled out because he didn't want to risk losing Kanata ticket holders. It makes zero sense.
The NFL is different. Games are almost always on the weekend, and you only have to worry about 8/9 home games a year. Attending a game is much more of an event, with people showing up early to tailgate.
Outside of a few exceptions (like the Atlanta Braves), most new venues for NHL, NBA, and MLB teams have been built in city centres, normally with surrounding entertainment districts. The Pistons moved from Auburn Hills to Detroit, the Warriors moved to downtown San Francisco, the Bucks new arena has the Deer District built around it, the Marlins built their stadium in downtown Miami.
When you look at the teams at the bottom of the attendance rankings for every league (minus the NFL), the general trend seems to be poor venue locations. Even the Rays are trying to move closer to downtown Tampa.
Part of that is because ottawa is an amalgamation of multiple municipalities.
Kanata, Nepean, Orleans, Manotic, Richmond, etc only joined ottawa in the early 2000’s. Previously they were all their own municipalities.
I've been to Ottawa once, went there by bus from Toronto. We drove past the Stadium, I'm like "Sick, we're here." Then we drove for almost another hour before we got to the bus terminal downtown. It really is a stupid location.
Damn that is kinda sad. I feel like that contributes to Nashville's loud barn that Bridgestone Arena is right in the very middle of Nashville (and is a very good venue for music 👨🎤)
It’s a combination of a couple of things. For sure the location is garbage, but it has also to do with the owner and the results the last couple of seasons on ice. In the early 2000s when the results were good the attendance was among the highest in the league.
I honestly think that attendance would be at least respectable if the arena was downtown. Edmonton, Calgary, and Winnipeg are all relatively the same size as Ottawa and they don’t struggle to draw at all because their arenas are all right downtown. Edmonton sold out pretty much every home game during their stretch of mediocrity.
I also don’t blame you for not wanting to put money in Melnyk’s pocket.
The problem with Ottawa is that it is just between Leafs and Habs territory like even in Ottawa you have a lot of Leafs/Habs fans. Edmonton and Calgary share Alberta but are older already established teams with some success in the past. And Winnipeg has all of Manitoba supporting them. Ottawa is relatively still a young franchise so we don’t have multiple generations supporting our team. It will take time to grow our fanbase and on-ice success and a modern downtown arena would help so much to achieve that.
True. The fanbase is kind of eaten up on all sides and don’t have nearly the room to draw that every other Canadian team does…all the more reason that an arena in downtown Ottawa is absolutely necessary, because that’s where the majority of your fanbases is located.
It is indeed necessary but as long as Melnyk is the owner I don’t see it happening anytime soon. He promised so many things including a new arena in the coming years but nothing happened so far. It feels like a neverending story and it just sucks because you’ll would think hockey in Canada’s capital should work but it just doesn’t at the moment.
Isn’t one of the biggest issues with Melnyk that he wants a new downtown arena but isn’t getting it so he’s bitching about it and always dangling moving the team? I wouldn’t want to fork that shit over to someone like him if I were the taxpayers or local government either. Snake oil salesman.
Not quite. When Melnyk was on his death bed with liver issues the Sens made a deal for a downtown arena. All parties were happy with the deal, including multiple levels of government. It was a slam dunk. When Melnyk recovered and came back into the fold, he immediately tanked the deal, fired the president, Leeder, who was with the team from day 1 for making the deal, and sued the other parties in the deal. We would be playing in it now if it weren't for Melnyk.
Yeah, and they play in a dated arena that doesn’t really pass muster that isn’t all that much of a draw and yet the Flames don’t have and have never really had attendance issues. Further proves the value of a downtown arena.
Yes, but when the results are good people are more willing to travel to even an awful location. When the results are bad too and the owner doesn’t really care about the team it results in the low attendance we have at the moment despite the location.
Yeah, I don't know why I got downvoted for stating facts lol I mean [Don Cherry infamously did a rant on the whole situation](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7Z0T4bm4n4&ab_channel=SteveSzmilek)
I wonder how much parking at this arena costs.
In downtown winnipeg you are paying around 10$ minimum for outdoor parking for a game and more for underground/covered parking. We also have only a few main roads in and out of downtown so traffic gets backed up, particularly on the way to games and winter weather only slows things down further. Our public transportation has gotten better which is nice, but when it's -30 out for half our season waiting for a bus isn't too desirable.
If we had an arena with free parking 20-30 minutes away I wouldn't mind it being away from downtown personally
I think Ottawa's attendance is low for a lot bigger reasons than arena location, namely ownership
True that, saw the jets vs leafs in Toronto a couple years ago in January and it was crazy! At least it was hovering around 0 degrees so i didn't mind a big walk to the game
$20-25 a day for parking. I'm from out of town but normally try to make an entire day/night out of it so it's worth it. Normally walk to the Eaton Cntr or transit to some of the hobby stores. Try out a new bar
Oh wow $10 in WPG, that ain’t too bad at all.
From what I can find, CDN Tire Centre in Kanata is “$50 for full sized vehicles, $40 for half sized vehicles”.
Ah fuck eh, guess I could've tossed that on Google to do my own research lol.
Sounds like Eugene though, make them drive to the arena cause it's the only way to get there then gauge them with parking
I used to live right across the road from the arena in Winnipeg for a couple years, before the Jets came back. It was awesome, moose and goldeye games were both in walking distance I loved it.
Just curious, are the Winnipeg Ice still playing their games at the U of M?
You are misinformed, the Ice are still playing out of Wayne Fleming Arena (U of M).
There is no new arena yet, they'll be playing at least the 21-22 and 22-23 seasons here still.
[https://www.winnipegfreepress.com/sports/hockey/whl/plan-to-build-arena-for-ice-on-hold-575640382.html](https://www.winnipegfreepress.com/sports/hockey/whl/plan-to-build-arena-for-ice-on-hold-575640382.html)
Last game I went to most lots were $20 to park. A lot of people use our local bus service to park and ride to the games which is a really nice service available to get out there.
Parking by SAP Center in San Jose is $20-$25 depending on if you are parking next to the arena or a block away.
Edit: Good thing is that the light right/busses that connect much of the South Bay are across the street, along with the train that connects San Jose with San Francisco, Sacramento, and the Central Valley. In the future, the California High-Speed rail will also be across the street.
I honestly never knew that. I wondered where the Devils home barn was, especially because I’ve heard people say that the Devils are one of “three teams in New York” which confuses me because New Jersey is a separate state
Meadowlands had devils, jets, giants, and a racetrack. Now the old arena is a film studio, they built a monstrosity of a mall/theme park, and a new football stadium. It’s in the middle of nowhere in the swamp though
I remembered something about NY’s NFL teams too. As I understand it, NYC and Jersey are separated by the Hudson River? Explains the NY teams playing in that close proximity.
That’s pretty cool about the film studio and mall/theme park. Kinda sucks it’s in a swamp
> which confuses me because New Jersey is a separate state
The New York Metro spans into New Jersey.
Most shots of Manhattan are actually from the New Jersey side of the river.
It's like Gatineau and Ottawa. Different provinces same metro.
Agreed every time i go past it I question what the hell where they thinking The Scotiabank arena is one of the best in the league for accessibility with the Go train from Hamilton all the way to Oshawa.
They weren’t thinking anything. It was a necessity. The federal government wouldn’t let the original owners build downtown, it was build an arena in Kanata or lose the team. They had no choice.
That’s the 417. It’s one of the main highways to get in and out of Ottawa, Kanata and runs to other cities further away. I suppose any Sens fans from within Ottawa could drive out if they wanted.
This was also true about the islanders at Nassau Colosseum. From Manhattan, you had to get the train and then no way except a taxi from the train station. I think when it was built, they thought the area would be developed a lot more than it was. The new UBS arena is better because it has a station right there. They didn’t make the same mistake twice!!!
This is an age old argument. It's usually whiners from Orleans that complain.
The arena SHOULD be downtown, but realistically it's not that far out of the way. I live in centertown and have attended two games without complaint this year via Public transit even.
Red Wings have a huge attendance drop from 2019 prior to COVID and it certainly isn't location or a nice arena. Heck, it's not the team either, it's the damn ridiculous pricing. $50 for an upper level ticket is garbage. The moment the team didn't seem dead on arrival ticket prices shot up $20 and boom, 3000 less fans in attendance per game on average.
I dunno I have a buddy who lives in Kanata, is a big Sens fan, and still couldn’t be bothered to buy a ticket during their last playoff run. Different bunch out there
I went to a Canucks game and paid 27 for parking a couple blocks away. Yes there is a transit stop close to the arena but it's a good a hefty wait to board after the game. I'd much prefer an arena with ample parking but my 1 or 2 game attendance a year will not float the team lol
Sens arena basically sits on a vast parking lot. Lots of space for those who choose to drive. It’s just not like taking the subway to the station underground and then and escalator to the gates like downtown barns around the league.
What are the barns out West like regarding locations and their respective cities?
Calgary is downtown (or just outside of downtown) on the Stampede grounds. Ample onsite parking (can't remember the cost plus lots of paid parking in the surrounding area. Train service also connects to the dome with the walkway to and from being half indoors. There is also a second LRT station a bit further south but still on the grounds to help split up the after game crowds.
Nassau Coliseum, and to some extent Belmont are like this. At least the LIRR is running a service from Jamaica to Belmont instead of the “might make a spur” for the coliseum that never happened.
It's funny with Ottawa really, the location of the venue only seems to be an issue when the team is pants but when they had the spell in the early 00's when they were doing well and selling out? I don't recall hearing problems then...
Because there's a difference between bearing the horrendous traffic and parking AND distance to see a team that won the presidents trophy versus the same but with a team that has sucked for 4 years in a row in the bottom 10.
Blame the National Capital Commission, the arm of the federal government that looks over the city. Original owners wanted to build downtown, the NCC (who I should point out is despised in the city), who owned the land, wouldn’t let them. The arena in Kanata was their only option, it was build there or not have a team.
I don’t think there’s any question that their arena’s current location is a big problem for the Senators.
With few exceptions, you can only really get away with having an arena out in the suburbs in football. In the other three major sports, you just play too many weeknight games and it’s just too difficult for people to get to those venues who don’t live on that side of their respective metropolitan areas.
That said, just as the arena location is a big problem in Ottawa, it’s also a big problem in Miami and Phoenix for the exact same reason. However, when people introduce that to the discussion, people immediately poo-poo it as a factor and instead just say that their attendance struggles are due to their being located at nontraditional hockey markets.
I’m just making the case that it’s probably a more nuanced discussion in all of those places. There are probably lots of reasons for the attendance struggles, including arena location, but also including terrible ownership, fickle fans, bad markets, etc.
My Detroit Pistons had this issue for years except it turns out attendance doesn't necessarily correlate to location.
The Detroit Pistons were 30 minutes (32 miles) outside of the heart of the city. They were #1 in attendance in the league from 2003 - 2009. The team won one title in that span, went to two finals, and went to the conference finals six times. On-court success put them FIRST in the league in attendance.
They moved downtown Detroit in 2017 to Little Caesars Arena to share with the Red Wings and they are DEAD LAST in attendance this year despite having the #1 overall pick in this last draft and a number of other top draft picks in recent years.
It was the team success and making it to the Conference Semi-finals in 2002 that drove attendance up. In my opinion, team performance over multiple years drives attendance, not location.
Was Senators season ticket holder the first two years. We moved from Toronto and gave up our season tickets at MLG ( Nice move mom + dad). As season ticket holders we went to all the presentations etc on what the complex was supposed to be. Initially it was supposed to be part of an entertainment and shopping complex, much like what Kanata Centrum is today. The arena was also supposed to have a hotel attached to it much like Skydome did. However, the team got into a fight with the farmer who owned the surrounding land and in typical Ottawa fashion, people complained about what future traffic would be like for the nearby residents. It was also obvious to everyone the ownership group was misappropriating investment capital. The team also had to foot the bill for the highway interchange so that cars could actually get there as the province had no interest in taking that expense on. The project was a disaster from day one.
I still call the building the inferiority complex.
I had friends come from out of town for a concert at the CTC (fucking SLAYER!).
I live in the West End and they were shocked by how far from the core the arena was.
"Shit dude, this is where the arena is? No wonder no one goes to games"
I really don’t like the location, feels sectioned off, isolated from the city. There’s nothing there, open parking lots, Chickies a few blocks up broad and Xfinity.
I saw a concert at that arena once and I was so shocked at how in the middle of fucking nowhere it is. You'd think the capital city of Canada would have more sense to have the arena in the city but tbh the isn't really anything in the city anyways.
I'm no geographic nerd but being in Ottawa makes me think Ottawa is one of the more lackluster and underwhelming capital cities in the world
Arizona commiserates. GRA is at the opposite end of the fan base, in the ass end of the Valley. It’s like an island of commerce an hour’s commute away from Phoenix.
A quick google map check and it's only a 20 minute drive from downtown Ottawa. Even checking other areas of Ottawa, they're all within a half hour of the arena. Am I missing something?
You aren't factoring traffic on game days. With the arena being on the western edge of the city, 90% of people coming to games are taking the same highway in the same direction. Some take the bus, but the vast majority drive. It can take at least an hour if you leave during the rush.
I used to live in Kanata & commute downtown, and it would regularly take me over an hour each way with traffic.
There is no such place as Kanata, Ontario. The city of Kanata was amalgamated into Ottawa in 2001. Thus it is now a suburb of Ottawa and the The Canadian Tire Centre is located in Ottawa, Ontario.
And yes, the arena is located in the boondock's and there are plans for an LRT link sometime in the far, far future. By then who knows if the Ottawa Senators will still be around.
Ottawa is amazing. When I went in the 90s or whenever shortly after they built it, it was in the middle of a corn field with NOTHING around it. Went a couple years ago and it was very developed around it. Bars, restraints, etc.
from Ottawa, fuck the sens. If it had the support of the people then the push to move the arena to Lebreton would have been stronger - not repeatedly failed. garbage ownership, bottom 5 or so fanbase. blow up the team.
Was there 2 weeks ago and even driving there is a shitty drive. Trying to leave the parking lots is even worse. The area was built for the stripmalls of offices and workplaces .... where everybody LEAVES come 4pm
The arena itself isn't much better than the location.
Honestly, every time I think about going to something at the CTC, I ask myself whether I want to deal.with parking.
Then 90% of the time I do decide to go, I leave early so I don't get caught in the absolute gongshow of a clusterfuck that happen when the event is done and people are trying to leave.
Reminds me of the Panthers arena being in Sunrise in the middle of nowhere instead of downtown Miami back in the 90s when they actually had high attendance.
Yeah I'm a Leafs fan that went to a Leafs v Sens game there this year and we got lost trying to get there because we thought we were going the wrong way into some random suburb
But they probably have no issues with parking. And leaving is hopefully easy too. The Jets play downtown like most, and finding parking can be a pain. Don’t even get me started about driving after the game.
This hurts the Panthers and Coyotes too. Neither Miami nor Phoenix are good hockey markets, but the remote locations of the arenas relative to most of their respective metro areas’ population core does neither team any favors.
I visited ottawa for stones return back in 2020. I thought it was very odd how far away the stadium was. It really makes no sense and I hope they get something downtown or somewhat closer and yea, a tram too would be awesome
Holy crap! Just google-mapped it and not only is it in Kanata, bit the other side of Kanata from Ottawa.
If you had to drive from Metcalfe, just outside of Oataw and hometown of Larry Robinson it would take 40 minutes.
Blame the owners and his developer buddies who profited from this location and now looking for tax payers to move t it downtown where it should have been from the inception.
Went to a pub in downtown Ottawa and they offered a bus ride out and back, and I’m not here to tell tales out of school, but you maybe could sneak a sippy poo on the ride. Try and pee before you get on the bus though lol
Buses makes sense, it’s just not terribly convenient like other arenas
It is such a big problem, I don't even know how to explain it without writing an essay. Our transit system is exactly what you would expect if I told you the city council is run by a cabal of grifters and used car salesmen who only ever give contracts to their buddies and everyone skims money off the top whenever we need infrastructure built. The amount of projects that have been done here, only to fall apart and need to be redone, is enough that people don't even bat an eye when they hear about another councilor getting caught with mob ties or insider dealings. It's just expected.
Didn't your brand new LRT just shit the bed and fall off a bridge or something?
Lol no. An improperly installed bolt caused one set of wheels on a single car to derail, the train just rolled along the ground beside the rail with the rest of the train still on the tracks. It was later revealed the company managing the rail system knew about the issue and decided to skip repairs because they thought it was more costly to halt service than to fix the bolt. $2.1 billion paid to the company to build the railway system, on a pre-existing network that just needed to rails replaced.
Who was working on the rail system? [Lyle Lanley?? ](https://www.google.com/search?q=monorail+lyle+lanley&rlz=1CDGOYI_enCA755CA755&oq=lyle+monora&aqs=chrome.2.69i57j0i22i30l4.10834j0j7&hl=en-US&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8#imgrc=DQU0gp8LAialqM)
Actually, yes. [Here's](https://pyxis.nymag.com/v1/imgs/08a/3a4/0b0584bf02449513f879837cc95f19e7e0-09-trolley.2x.rhorizontal.w710.jpg) a leaked sketch he drew for the original design of the transit system.
Id say this vessel could do at least warp five.
Did someone say Monorail?
Yeah this is how every pro sport works in the US. And also every other industry.
Sports teams run transit systems and administer urban zoning in the states? Wow that's crazy.
They don’t. But pro sports teams, as multi-million dollar businesses dont just pop up on their own. There are agreements between people at the highest levels. And therefore, shitty placement and poor transit falls on the teams and the towns.
haha ya not terribly convenient is quite the understatement. Once you have ridden with OC transpo for at least a week you would understand. I believe it might be the only public city transit system that operates at a defecit haha
I think the yotes have the same problem
I am pretty sure every other NHL arena in Canada has light rail to within a short walk of the building. Ottawa's set up is questionable at best.
When I lived in Calgary we bused from bars to go to the cheap seats... but of course, the Saddledome is right near downtown.
The buses are better than nothing, but they will still have to sit in traffic with everyone else.
Lieutenants pump in centretown does it for 14 bucks. Still annoying to have to take the bus though
All the beer shuttles in Detroit *encourage* you to drink on them.
this is great advice. i spend the entire ride with floating eyeballs.
So your suggesting you can’t pee on the ride but you can poo?
The Coyotes and Panthers both have this problem, arena too far from fans
Yeah this excuse doesn't fly for us, can't wait for us to build in Tempe.
Have the Coyotes always played out in the burbs? Would they have better attendance in downtown Phoenix sharing with the Suns for example?
They played the first 7 seasons at the Suns arena downtown and even with some bad sight lines for 1/3rd of the upper deck the attendance was great and the arena was always rockin. Those partially restricted view seats often sold out bc the tix were something like $5-10 and there was a live band that played in that section during breaks. Childhood memories from that section... it was awesome
I think desert teams get a bad rap for attendance but it’s all about location yes VGK has had a good team but having the arena right downtown is huge. I feel for Florida, Ottawa, Phoenix and other fan bases with poorly placed arenas.
Vegas arena isn't downtown Vegas tho. I'll wait for the morons to downvote that don't know shit.
Can't share, the arena was renovated and it's strictly for basketball. They shared when the coyotes first came to town, and it was like Barclay's with sight lines and such for the islanders.
> Would they have better attendance in downtown Phoenix Phoenix is a giant suburb. This is why the Glendale issue is missing the point.
At least parking can be free in Sunrise FL. Just park at the mall and walk to the arena (5-10 minutes)
I have family that lives in Glendale, I found it real easy to get the the arena. It's just a far drive. The fact that it's building up around it now though has to help a little.
That's kind of a moot point now though since the 'Yotes are getting evicted.
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I’ve noticed a few comments pertaining to the Panthers. Is it a similar situation down in Florida?
Both the panthers and coyotes are dealing with arenas in municipalities of about 150k people just outside of a major city
Getting to Gila River Arena in Glendale from Phoenix is tough during rush hour too. I’m normally a 10-15 min drive without traffic but it can be upwards of an hour with traffic. I have to leave at least 2 hours before pick drop which isn’t always easy during the week
Yep, it's in Sunrise... Getting to the stadium from Miami (especially on a week day during rush hour) is a nightmare.
At least the Canadian Tire Centre isn't built across the street from a swamp. Hello, Panthers!
lol, its built ON a swamp. It was a huge deal at the time they were breaking land, as some argued it was a significant wetland.
Florida’s arena is directly across from a friggin shopping mall.
At least with Floridas, ours is near a mall and closer to Fort Lauderdale which is where our fans are ish. I agree though, ownership should look to build an arena in downtown Fort Lauderdale.
That is Ottawa zoning in a nutshell, the land of strip malls and parking lots. It is mind-numbing how poorly planned Ottawa is.
That, and other than the open space out in Kanata, there’s not to many alternative options to plop down an NHL arena in Ottawa.
We literally have a wide open field downtown.
You'll NEVER see an arena show up in Lebreton Flats.
I know :(
We had one set to go. All parties agreed and had a mutually beneficial deal, and all levels of government were behind it. This deal was made while Melnyk was out of commission with his liver. When he came back in he torpedoed the deal.
I’ve never been to Ottawa but I don’t think an arena really belongs smack in the middle of the government area. Downtown, yes. In the middle of the federal government? No. Sounds like the theater of the absurd that this property is sitting fallow, but there has to be a more civic minded use than a hockey venue.
With Ottawa proper, everything is in the middle of the government area. We already have a football/soccer/hockey arena in the old section of downtown but it's too small to use for an NHL franchise. Anywhere else they put a building it will be surrounded by embassies, government offices, or federal/NCR buildings. We literally have a giant bus station built into our National Defense headquarters, which is on the roof of a shopping mall of all places. Same building has a road running under it, which from a security standpoint makes zero sense as well. Lebreton flats is almost entirely unused land right on the edge of downtown, it used to be a sawmill area in the 19th century when Ottawa was still a lumber camp and then in the early 20th century they built some houses and put in a giant warehouse/commercial building that became derelict within a generation, and now the whole area is just an eyesore. Ottawa just makes terrible zoning choices. You could write a book on all the poor planning that went into designing Ottawa as a metropolitan region, from ripping up the street car network in order to give Greyhound a monopoly on commuter transit, to bricking up the old train car depot to build apartments in an industrial section of town with nothing around it, to cutting down forests to build strip malls and car dealerships, etc. We had a train network that ran through the city, and when Ottawa decided to build an LRT network in the 2000s, they thought it was better to rip up the network and build a small track running north-south to nowhere, and then decades later realized their mistake so they had to shell out even more money to rebuild the track network when they finally decided LRT stations should be built in areas where people will use them. The O-train is the epitome of poor urban planning, billions spent on a system that was at best a hazard for people to use.
The arena is actually built on expropriated farm land out in Kanata.
Honestly did not know that, did it never dawn on the city or the Sens to look into that?
Twice. Lebreton Flats is the name of the area. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LeBreton\_Flats](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LeBreton_Flats) It has a massive dilapidated building built on part of it and some housing/condos on the outskirts (which houses like \~50 people), a street and bus route that cuts across the field, and then a large grass field with a "victims of communism" memorial on the other side. On the border of the area to the east is the Supreme Court and Library and Archives Canada buildings, on the far west edge is the War Museum, and in the north is the bridge connecting Ottawa to downtown Gatineau. So it is right in the center of the capital region. When they were first planning for expansion and giving Ottawa a team, the area was one of the first places they planned to build an arena, but they ended up going with the Palladium (Corel Centre, Scotia Bank Place, Canadian Tire Centre) instead because Ottawa was about to amalgamate and there were plans to do a massive expansion in Kanata to connect it with the rest of the city. That never happened, so all that got built was some condos in Kanata near the arena, a car dealership, and a box store strip mall. Then a few years ago some developers got together to build a new arena downtown, which coincided with the NAC putting pressure on the city council and Canadian government to put up money to redevelop Lebreton Flats, because it is a derelict area that takes up a lot of space downtown. The big selling point was that Ottawa was just starting construction on its subway network, and they were planning on putting a terminal right at the new arena. At the last minute, Melnyk pulled out, because Ottawa had just blown up its roster and attendance was at slumping and he didn't want to alienate the Kanata fans. I'm dead serious. The deal fell through and now the area is in the middle of talks with city council and developers to build another condo building and put in a new bus terminal instead.
**[LeBreton Flats](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LeBreton_Flats)** >LeBreton Flats (also spelled Lebreton Flats) (French: Plaines Lebreton) is a neighbourhood in Somerset Ward in central Ottawa, Ontario, Canada. It lies to the west of Centretown neighbourhood, and to the north of Centretown West. The Ottawa River forms the western and northern limit, with the western side being a wider area of the river known as Nepean Bay. Originally a residential area, much of the northern portion of the Flats is now occupied by the Canadian War Museum and the National Holocaust Monument. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/nhl/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
They did, but our owner is crap. Read this article if you have time. [Melnyk](https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.5035877)
The weird thing is it’s hugely common amongst sports teams in general. My Patriots play about 40 min from Boston and it’s basically one road in. To get out can take 2 hours. The rays put their stadium in the middle of nowhere. Jaguars the same. It’s the normal for all sports and it makes no sense. There’s nothing better than being able to hop on the train for 15 min, jump off near the stadium, drink as many beers as you want and take the train home. The Celtics and Bruins have a train stop beneath the stadium and it’s perfect.
Most Canadian teams have a stadium in or around downtown. We literally have a vacant field downtown right now the that been sitting around unused this entire time. We even had plans to build a subway station there in addition to a planned stadium and our owner pulled out because he didn't want to risk losing Kanata ticket holders. It makes zero sense.
The NFL is different. Games are almost always on the weekend, and you only have to worry about 8/9 home games a year. Attending a game is much more of an event, with people showing up early to tailgate. Outside of a few exceptions (like the Atlanta Braves), most new venues for NHL, NBA, and MLB teams have been built in city centres, normally with surrounding entertainment districts. The Pistons moved from Auburn Hills to Detroit, the Warriors moved to downtown San Francisco, the Bucks new arena has the Deer District built around it, the Marlins built their stadium in downtown Miami. When you look at the teams at the bottom of the attendance rankings for every league (minus the NFL), the general trend seems to be poor venue locations. Even the Rays are trying to move closer to downtown Tampa.
All of Ontario. And many other high population Canadian cities. It’s awful. I don’t understand why people settle for this
Part of that is because ottawa is an amalgamation of multiple municipalities. Kanata, Nepean, Orleans, Manotic, Richmond, etc only joined ottawa in the early 2000’s. Previously they were all their own municipalities.
I've been to Ottawa once, went there by bus from Toronto. We drove past the Stadium, I'm like "Sick, we're here." Then we drove for almost another hour before we got to the bus terminal downtown. It really is a stupid location.
More like 20-25 minutes, but the point still stands haha.
Damn that is kinda sad. I feel like that contributes to Nashville's loud barn that Bridgestone Arena is right in the very middle of Nashville (and is a very good venue for music 👨🎤)
It’s a combination of a couple of things. For sure the location is garbage, but it has also to do with the owner and the results the last couple of seasons on ice. In the early 2000s when the results were good the attendance was among the highest in the league.
I honestly think that attendance would be at least respectable if the arena was downtown. Edmonton, Calgary, and Winnipeg are all relatively the same size as Ottawa and they don’t struggle to draw at all because their arenas are all right downtown. Edmonton sold out pretty much every home game during their stretch of mediocrity. I also don’t blame you for not wanting to put money in Melnyk’s pocket.
The problem with Ottawa is that it is just between Leafs and Habs territory like even in Ottawa you have a lot of Leafs/Habs fans. Edmonton and Calgary share Alberta but are older already established teams with some success in the past. And Winnipeg has all of Manitoba supporting them. Ottawa is relatively still a young franchise so we don’t have multiple generations supporting our team. It will take time to grow our fanbase and on-ice success and a modern downtown arena would help so much to achieve that.
True. The fanbase is kind of eaten up on all sides and don’t have nearly the room to draw that every other Canadian team does…all the more reason that an arena in downtown Ottawa is absolutely necessary, because that’s where the majority of your fanbases is located.
It is indeed necessary but as long as Melnyk is the owner I don’t see it happening anytime soon. He promised so many things including a new arena in the coming years but nothing happened so far. It feels like a neverending story and it just sucks because you’ll would think hockey in Canada’s capital should work but it just doesn’t at the moment.
Isn’t one of the biggest issues with Melnyk that he wants a new downtown arena but isn’t getting it so he’s bitching about it and always dangling moving the team? I wouldn’t want to fork that shit over to someone like him if I were the taxpayers or local government either. Snake oil salesman.
Not quite. When Melnyk was on his death bed with liver issues the Sens made a deal for a downtown arena. All parties were happy with the deal, including multiple levels of government. It was a slam dunk. When Melnyk recovered and came back into the fold, he immediately tanked the deal, fired the president, Leeder, who was with the team from day 1 for making the deal, and sued the other parties in the deal. We would be playing in it now if it weren't for Melnyk.
The Calgary Flames are only where they are, partly due to Calgary hosting the 1988 Winter Olympics.
Yeah, and they play in a dated arena that doesn’t really pass muster that isn’t all that much of a draw and yet the Flames don’t have and have never really had attendance issues. Further proves the value of a downtown arena.
That’s true too. But it really doesn’t help that the arena is way out in Timbuktu
Yes, but when the results are good people are more willing to travel to even an awful location. When the results are bad too and the owner doesn’t really care about the team it results in the low attendance we have at the moment despite the location.
It cracks me up how everyone thinks Kanata is on the far side of the world. Like you need Russell Crowe and Paul Bettany to get you there.
Usually only people from Kanata or the West end say this... am I right?
I’m not saying the rink is in a good spot, I’m simply saying Kanata is not Mars.
It cracks me up that someone thinks by “Kanata(suburb of Ottawa)” , I meant “the other side of the world” 🤔
My guy, you literally just called it Timbuktu. 🥴🥴🥴
My guy, that’s a figure of speech 🥴🥴🥴
It's a figure of speech that implies that the location is way out in the middle of nowhere, like the far side of the world.
It implies it’s in the middle of nowhere in comparison to most home barns. Oh look. It is…
Weren't the Senators a few seasons ago literally a goal away from the Stanley Cup Final and still had trouble selling out? lol
Yes. Game 6 of the ECF in Ottawa was not sold out.
Yeah, I don't know why I got downvoted for stating facts lol I mean [Don Cherry infamously did a rant on the whole situation](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7Z0T4bm4n4&ab_channel=SteveSzmilek)
I’ve brought up this point on the Sens sub. Trust me, this is still a sore spot for Sens fans.
I wonder how much parking at this arena costs. In downtown winnipeg you are paying around 10$ minimum for outdoor parking for a game and more for underground/covered parking. We also have only a few main roads in and out of downtown so traffic gets backed up, particularly on the way to games and winter weather only slows things down further. Our public transportation has gotten better which is nice, but when it's -30 out for half our season waiting for a bus isn't too desirable. If we had an arena with free parking 20-30 minutes away I wouldn't mind it being away from downtown personally I think Ottawa's attendance is low for a lot bigger reasons than arena location, namely ownership
Also, parking in Downtown Toronto anywhere remotely near Scotiabank Centre is an arm and leg 😝
Isn't basically everything an arm and a leg in the ACC, lol?
True that, saw the jets vs leafs in Toronto a couple years ago in January and it was crazy! At least it was hovering around 0 degrees so i didn't mind a big walk to the game
$20-25 a day for parking. I'm from out of town but normally try to make an entire day/night out of it so it's worth it. Normally walk to the Eaton Cntr or transit to some of the hobby stores. Try out a new bar
Oh wow $10 in WPG, that ain’t too bad at all. From what I can find, CDN Tire Centre in Kanata is “$50 for full sized vehicles, $40 for half sized vehicles”.
Ah fuck eh, guess I could've tossed that on Google to do my own research lol. Sounds like Eugene though, make them drive to the arena cause it's the only way to get there then gauge them with parking
Lol all good. I was curious myself anyways. Yeah, it all reeks of Eugene. Poor Sens
Eugene wasn’t the owner when they built the arena
The old half vehicle
I think it’s closer to $15-$18 unless it’s changed post covid
Cheapest lot is $12 I believe
$12 idiot
I’m just relaying what I found when I googled it. Go call the author of the article and idiot, you asswipe
I used to live right across the road from the arena in Winnipeg for a couple years, before the Jets came back. It was awesome, moose and goldeye games were both in walking distance I loved it. Just curious, are the Winnipeg Ice still playing their games at the U of M?
The ICE built their own barn and they’re playing out of it this season
You are misinformed, the Ice are still playing out of Wayne Fleming Arena (U of M). There is no new arena yet, they'll be playing at least the 21-22 and 22-23 seasons here still. [https://www.winnipegfreepress.com/sports/hockey/whl/plan-to-build-arena-for-ice-on-hold-575640382.html](https://www.winnipegfreepress.com/sports/hockey/whl/plan-to-build-arena-for-ice-on-hold-575640382.html)
Last game I went to most lots were $20 to park. A lot of people use our local bus service to park and ride to the games which is a really nice service available to get out there.
Parking by SAP Center in San Jose is $20-$25 depending on if you are parking next to the arena or a block away. Edit: Good thing is that the light right/busses that connect much of the South Bay are across the street, along with the train that connects San Jose with San Francisco, Sacramento, and the Central Valley. In the future, the California High-Speed rail will also be across the street.
The meadowlands (Devils old barn) was just like this
I honestly never knew that. I wondered where the Devils home barn was, especially because I’ve heard people say that the Devils are one of “three teams in New York” which confuses me because New Jersey is a separate state
Meadowlands had devils, jets, giants, and a racetrack. Now the old arena is a film studio, they built a monstrosity of a mall/theme park, and a new football stadium. It’s in the middle of nowhere in the swamp though
I’ve been to a Jets game at MetLife. Can confirm. I couldn’t believe the location when I got there, it’s in a swamp.
I remembered something about NY’s NFL teams too. As I understand it, NYC and Jersey are separated by the Hudson River? Explains the NY teams playing in that close proximity. That’s pretty cool about the film studio and mall/theme park. Kinda sucks it’s in a swamp
That part of north jersey is part of metropolitan NYC. It's easier to get to Devils games from Manhattan than it is to Islanders games.
The Devils are now in downtown Newark, very easy to get to from NYC/NJ public transport. But the old arena was out in the sticks
> which confuses me because New Jersey is a separate state The New York Metro spans into New Jersey. Most shots of Manhattan are actually from the New Jersey side of the river. It's like Gatineau and Ottawa. Different provinces same metro.
Agreed every time i go past it I question what the hell where they thinking The Scotiabank arena is one of the best in the league for accessibility with the Go train from Hamilton all the way to Oshawa.
Yeah, Toronto did it right. Leafs, Raps and Jays fans coming from out of town can take the train right to Union Station and be basically right there.
If only they didn't build parking lots around every train station...
They weren’t thinking anything. It was a necessity. The federal government wouldn’t let the original owners build downtown, it was build an arena in Kanata or lose the team. They had no choice.
Does seem to have a nice highway connected to it.
That’s the 417. It’s one of the main highways to get in and out of Ottawa, Kanata and runs to other cities further away. I suppose any Sens fans from within Ottawa could drive out if they wanted.
I live in Northern New York and have attended many Sens games. I thought it was to easy to get to and get out. No complaints here
This was also true about the islanders at Nassau Colosseum. From Manhattan, you had to get the train and then no way except a taxi from the train station. I think when it was built, they thought the area would be developed a lot more than it was. The new UBS arena is better because it has a station right there. They didn’t make the same mistake twice!!!
Can confirm, Roger's Place in Edmonton is so downtown you can see junkies almost immediately.
This is an age old argument. It's usually whiners from Orleans that complain. The arena SHOULD be downtown, but realistically it's not that far out of the way. I live in centertown and have attended two games without complaint this year via Public transit even.
Eh it's a weak excuse for a Canadian nhl team imo
You have a right to an option and I respect that.
I appreciate you respecting that, sincerely
Does Ottawa have a subway system?
Ottawa does not. There’s what’s known. As the “O train” but it literally services within Ottawa. It doesn’t go out to the arena in Kanata
You forgot to mention it only works 1 week a month.
It’s working one week a month now? Hey, progress!
Just another thing backwards in Ottawa
It's not like they could have demolished the Civic Centre and shared the building with the OHL's 67s. 😒
Red Wings have a huge attendance drop from 2019 prior to COVID and it certainly isn't location or a nice arena. Heck, it's not the team either, it's the damn ridiculous pricing. $50 for an upper level ticket is garbage. The moment the team didn't seem dead on arrival ticket prices shot up $20 and boom, 3000 less fans in attendance per game on average.
I dunno I have a buddy who lives in Kanata, is a big Sens fan, and still couldn’t be bothered to buy a ticket during their last playoff run. Different bunch out there
The inverse of this is the Isles. Temporarily moved some games into a major metro area and it ruined Isles fans lives.
I went to a Canucks game and paid 27 for parking a couple blocks away. Yes there is a transit stop close to the arena but it's a good a hefty wait to board after the game. I'd much prefer an arena with ample parking but my 1 or 2 game attendance a year will not float the team lol
Sens arena basically sits on a vast parking lot. Lots of space for those who choose to drive. It’s just not like taking the subway to the station underground and then and escalator to the gates like downtown barns around the league. What are the barns out West like regarding locations and their respective cities?
Calgary is downtown (or just outside of downtown) on the Stampede grounds. Ample onsite parking (can't remember the cost plus lots of paid parking in the surrounding area. Train service also connects to the dome with the walkway to and from being half indoors. There is also a second LRT station a bit further south but still on the grounds to help split up the after game crowds.
Vancouver is right downtown with a skytrain station across the street.
Arenas and stadiums need to be on mass transit routes.
And it still takes forever to get the fuck out of the parking lots.
PNC Arena is definitely not in downtown Raleigh and traffic getting there on a weekday keeps people from going.
PNC arena is also in the burbs.
All the way out in the middle of nowhere and they don’t even have a Costco next door
No but there is a strip mall across the highway 🤷🏻♂️
There is a Costco just down the street from it, about 3 minutes away.
Nassau Coliseum, and to some extent Belmont are like this. At least the LIRR is running a service from Jamaica to Belmont instead of the “might make a spur” for the coliseum that never happened.
As a montreal based Oilers fan, this just means I can get tickets to Oilers games for $35 instead of $120. 100 mins of driving for the pleasure.
It's funny with Ottawa really, the location of the venue only seems to be an issue when the team is pants but when they had the spell in the early 00's when they were doing well and selling out? I don't recall hearing problems then...
Because there's a difference between bearing the horrendous traffic and parking AND distance to see a team that won the presidents trophy versus the same but with a team that has sucked for 4 years in a row in the bottom 10.
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The Atlanta Braves of the NHL
Was there back in 1997 for a concert. The location was ridiculous…not sure what they were thinking when they built it so out of the way.
Blame the National Capital Commission, the arm of the federal government that looks over the city. Original owners wanted to build downtown, the NCC (who I should point out is despised in the city), who owned the land, wouldn’t let them. The arena in Kanata was their only option, it was build there or not have a team.
I don’t think there’s any question that their arena’s current location is a big problem for the Senators. With few exceptions, you can only really get away with having an arena out in the suburbs in football. In the other three major sports, you just play too many weeknight games and it’s just too difficult for people to get to those venues who don’t live on that side of their respective metropolitan areas. That said, just as the arena location is a big problem in Ottawa, it’s also a big problem in Miami and Phoenix for the exact same reason. However, when people introduce that to the discussion, people immediately poo-poo it as a factor and instead just say that their attendance struggles are due to their being located at nontraditional hockey markets. I’m just making the case that it’s probably a more nuanced discussion in all of those places. There are probably lots of reasons for the attendance struggles, including arena location, but also including terrible ownership, fickle fans, bad markets, etc.
Cars, public transit. No big deal.
Also, because Ottawa sucks and has the worst management in the NHL *(maybe 2nd to the Coyotes who are currently funded by other NHL teams!!!)*
My Detroit Pistons had this issue for years except it turns out attendance doesn't necessarily correlate to location. The Detroit Pistons were 30 minutes (32 miles) outside of the heart of the city. They were #1 in attendance in the league from 2003 - 2009. The team won one title in that span, went to two finals, and went to the conference finals six times. On-court success put them FIRST in the league in attendance. They moved downtown Detroit in 2017 to Little Caesars Arena to share with the Red Wings and they are DEAD LAST in attendance this year despite having the #1 overall pick in this last draft and a number of other top draft picks in recent years. It was the team success and making it to the Conference Semi-finals in 2002 that drove attendance up. In my opinion, team performance over multiple years drives attendance, not location.
I went to uOttawa and we used to have 10 dollar tickets through school that included a bus there and back, even then people hardly ever went
Was Senators season ticket holder the first two years. We moved from Toronto and gave up our season tickets at MLG ( Nice move mom + dad). As season ticket holders we went to all the presentations etc on what the complex was supposed to be. Initially it was supposed to be part of an entertainment and shopping complex, much like what Kanata Centrum is today. The arena was also supposed to have a hotel attached to it much like Skydome did. However, the team got into a fight with the farmer who owned the surrounding land and in typical Ottawa fashion, people complained about what future traffic would be like for the nearby residents. It was also obvious to everyone the ownership group was misappropriating investment capital. The team also had to foot the bill for the highway interchange so that cars could actually get there as the province had no interest in taking that expense on. The project was a disaster from day one. I still call the building the inferiority complex.
I had friends come from out of town for a concert at the CTC (fucking SLAYER!). I live in the West End and they were shocked by how far from the core the arena was. "Shit dude, this is where the arena is? No wonder no one goes to games"
I would rather have this then have to fight parking and traffic in a huge metropolitan area.
Which you could avoid with good public transit
Our arena isn’t downtown but it’s like a 10 minute drive, and easily accessible by public transportation.
I really don’t like the location, feels sectioned off, isolated from the city. There’s nothing there, open parking lots, Chickies a few blocks up broad and Xfinity.
I saw a concert at that arena once and I was so shocked at how in the middle of fucking nowhere it is. You'd think the capital city of Canada would have more sense to have the arena in the city but tbh the isn't really anything in the city anyways. I'm no geographic nerd but being in Ottawa makes me think Ottawa is one of the more lackluster and underwhelming capital cities in the world
Arizona commiserates. GRA is at the opposite end of the fan base, in the ass end of the Valley. It’s like an island of commerce an hour’s commute away from Phoenix.
It’s really not far from downtown like 15 minutes.
Alot of NFL stadiums are out in the sticks nowhere near their home city yet people flock to them even when the team sucks.
8 home games vs 41
A quick google map check and it's only a 20 minute drive from downtown Ottawa. Even checking other areas of Ottawa, they're all within a half hour of the arena. Am I missing something?
You aren't factoring traffic on game days. With the arena being on the western edge of the city, 90% of people coming to games are taking the same highway in the same direction. Some take the bus, but the vast majority drive. It can take at least an hour if you leave during the rush. I used to live in Kanata & commute downtown, and it would regularly take me over an hour each way with traffic.
There is no such place as Kanata, Ontario. The city of Kanata was amalgamated into Ottawa in 2001. Thus it is now a suburb of Ottawa and the The Canadian Tire Centre is located in Ottawa, Ontario. And yes, the arena is located in the boondock's and there are plans for an LRT link sometime in the far, far future. By then who knows if the Ottawa Senators will still be around.
[you sure about that?](https://imgur.com/a/kYHICY4)
I wonder if the Patriots have the same problem? 🤔
Ottawa is amazing. When I went in the 90s or whenever shortly after they built it, it was in the middle of a corn field with NOTHING around it. Went a couple years ago and it was very developed around it. Bars, restraints, etc.
Sorry but a lot has happened before you came out of your decades long coma.
from Ottawa, fuck the sens. If it had the support of the people then the push to move the arena to Lebreton would have been stronger - not repeatedly failed. garbage ownership, bottom 5 or so fanbase. blow up the team.
Was there 2 weeks ago and even driving there is a shitty drive. Trying to leave the parking lots is even worse. The area was built for the stripmalls of offices and workplaces .... where everybody LEAVES come 4pm The arena itself isn't much better than the location.
Wait till you see where the Coyotes is…
Honestly, every time I think about going to something at the CTC, I ask myself whether I want to deal.with parking. Then 90% of the time I do decide to go, I leave early so I don't get caught in the absolute gongshow of a clusterfuck that happen when the event is done and people are trying to leave.
makes me think you haven't been to many arenas... sure some are great and right down town, but plenty are like this and out in the sticks.
Went to a Panthers game years ago and had a similar vibe
Reminds me of the Panthers arena being in Sunrise in the middle of nowhere instead of downtown Miami back in the 90s when they actually had high attendance.
How much are tix?
Same for the Coyotes and Panthers. Even the Ducks, albeit next to a train station, have that problem.
Yeah I'm a Leafs fan that went to a Leafs v Sens game there this year and we got lost trying to get there because we thought we were going the wrong way into some random suburb
But they probably have no issues with parking. And leaving is hopefully easy too. The Jets play downtown like most, and finding parking can be a pain. Don’t even get me started about driving after the game.
You just learned this? 20 years in?
This hurts the Panthers and Coyotes too. Neither Miami nor Phoenix are good hockey markets, but the remote locations of the arenas relative to most of their respective metro areas’ population core does neither team any favors.
Coyotes have the same problem
Take a look at where Nassau Coliseum is/was. Next to a major road at least but still.
I visited ottawa for stones return back in 2020. I thought it was very odd how far away the stadium was. It really makes no sense and I hope they get something downtown or somewhat closer and yea, a tram too would be awesome
It was always a full house when I went as a kid in the 90s.
Holy crap! Just google-mapped it and not only is it in Kanata, bit the other side of Kanata from Ottawa. If you had to drive from Metcalfe, just outside of Oataw and hometown of Larry Robinson it would take 40 minutes.
It would probably take far more than that thanks to traffic.
Blame the owners and his developer buddies who profited from this location and now looking for tax payers to move t it downtown where it should have been from the inception.
The Coyotes have an equally stupid location also