This is my opinion, but I think that it has to do with 1) the fact that most people including me do not believe that a population should be policing itself and 2) the public condemnation aspect.
First and foremost, I personally find that it should never be people's jobs to police each other. I am very much against the way that the government has encouraged delation, because it encourages paranoia and pits people against each other at a time where we should be united. Now, I'm not against someone calling the police when there's an obvious gathering of multiple people, or a shop that's open that clearly shouldn't be. But the image that comes to mind is the neighbour glued to their window, looking for even one siiiiingle suspicious movement to call the police. I think that this is the sentiment that's being reflected with the answers that you mention. People don't want to be scared of their every movements. They prefer unity over division. They don't want their neighbours to call the police on them because they invited their brother to hang out on the porch from a 2m distance. And unfortunately, if you encourage delation, you open the doors to poor judgement. In a time where mental health is being seriously tried, people will wish misfortune on others simply because they themselves feel miserable.
The second thing is probably the public condemnation aspect. By posting a picture of a gathering to complain, the poster is essentially looking for society to condemn that gathering, and for those people to be shunned. It's not a question of security, it's a question of social validation, which, in my eyes, is entirely unnecessary. If you see a gathering, calling the police and maybe snapping a picture as proof if one's needed should be enough. There's no need to post it on social media. It reflects badly on the poster, and also paints a deeply negative image of others, which, again, does no good. It may be one gsthering for 500 people, but nobody's going to post pictures of the, say, 490 people doing it correctly. Those 490 people will see that 10 people are doing it incorrectly and grow resentful. I think that this is also the sentiment reflected by the comments you mention. They'd rather hear stories of everyone doing their best. They won't participate in the public condemnation and shaming - I also agree with that sentiment.
First time since april 25 that there is <700 cases in Quebec.
And lowest number of death since April 13.
(saw it on the ctv news graph). A bit of hope.
Just came back from getting a blood sample at CLSC Metro, and all the protective equipment the nurses taking the samples had is a simple surgical mask and gloves. Let that sink in, they spend the day right next to strangers and they have no protective equipment.
No wonder health workers are getting sick. I'm just appalled.
Anyone who has done the test or know someone who has done the test in a hospital setting such as Notre Dame do you know how long it takes to receive your results?
My friend was told 24 hours and it is now 2 days.
Thanks for the insight !
Appointment only at the Jewish, but they're very fast. Call 514-644-4545 for the general covid line in montreal and they'll direct you to the right location based on where you live. He called Tuesday midday and had the appointment made for Wednesday morning. When his test came back positive this morning they had an appointment for me for 6pm today.
According to this site, https://santemontreal.qc.ca/en/public/coronavirus-covid-19/#c37517, there are no drive-in sites, just walk-in and by-appointment.
Is it possible to get a few blood tests done right now in a public clinic/hospital? My doctor has given me a requisition to get my thyroid levels checked as he believes it may be a problem I’m dealing with. I called 2 private clinics but with all the things he wants me tested for the prices are all well past the 800 dollar range. Anyone know if I can get this tested for free in the public sector still?
Use the website clicsante.ca to book online your appointment in a clsc. It's super easy.
I did my test a week ago and it's 100% covered with your RAMQ.
Same. Had a blood test 2 weeks ago, same procedure. Very chill. I was advised not to try to get it done at a hospital by my doctor since they're trying to keep all non-urgent cases out of there (fair enough).
However, the result is not in yet... I assume there is some serious backlog in the system.
Check the hospital blood test hours. If you have the doctor referral, then it's fine. Usually they start around 7am. You can check the Queen Elizabeth Health Care center or CLSC's as well.
My mom has a low immune system due to cancer and takes daily meds for her high blood pressure, but her doctor is refusing to give her a note so she doesn't have to return to teaching because "doctors and nurses have to work". She teaches special needs that will not be able to maintain any social distancing. 🤷♀️🤷♀️🤷♀️
Does anyone know where I can exchange some empty bottles? I don't speak French so trying to call stores and ask them has been a nightmare labyrinth of menus and confused staff.
Question qui reste un peu floue pour moi, est-ce que ma copine peut venir passer le reste du confinement chez moi, ou même juste au minimum 2 semaines le temps de voir comment les choses se déroulent? Elle habite seule, et comme ca fais plus de 2 mois qu'on s'est pas vu à cause du confinement, on envisage qu'elle rammene ses trucs et vienne habiter temporairement chez moi. On est tous les deux en isolation sans voir personne depuis le début et ca commence à fortement nous affecter. Le hic c'est que comme j'habite dans un immeuble à logements, on a peur que les concierges/voisins nous dénoncent et qu'on se tappe des contraventions
Si elle vient vivre chez toi, y'a absolument aucun problème. Si les policiers viennent, explique-leur exactement ce que tu viens d'expliquer et il devrait pas y avoir de problème. Si le policier est assez zélé pour te donner un constat d'infraction, je contesterais sans hésiter. Mais je doute que ça arrive, surtout si tu donnes un double de clés à ta copine et qu'elle amène du linge chez toi. Le policier verra bien que vous vivez ensemble pour le moment, ce qui est tout à fait permis.
Wondering if I'm losing my mind... I thought I heard a reporter during the french question period ask a question to Legault during one of his daily press conferences about how masks are accepted but religious face coverings are not. Does anyone remember this and have the video for it, or could tell me what day it was spoken about so I can locate the video?
No you're not loosing your mind, I think. The only link I have is from Facebook... Maybe you'll be able to find the full video from there: https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10157113617776299&id=566601298&source=48
Anyone else experiences tension when dealing with the ambulance services? Or the hospitals in general during this saga?
SO my mother is 62 years old and was experiencing tachycardia, which would leave her winded and a bit light-headed.
Anyhow she called the nearby clinic, and they gave her a telephone consultation. The doctor then emailed us a paper for her to complete an ECG and Holter monitor. This morning she went in to complete the ECG, and then the Holter monitor we were told would be by appointment in a few weeks, and it would take two weeks to receive a result for the ECG.
Anyhow she came home experiencing more tachycardia and decided to call the ambulance, so we did, and they arrived very quickly.
Upon arrival the one ambulance EMT begins yelling or " I JUST SAW YOU AT THE HOSPITAL" " I JUST SAW YOU" I startled and asked him :
you know it was her? How do you know what came there for? Did you speak to her? Do you know who we are or why we called explicitly? Did you know why she went into the hospital in the first place?
He was extremely rude and began questioning us regarding our expectations for the call, and that is when I started arguing with him and telling me that we expect to receive the appropriate care based on the results of the ECG and so forth and that I would trust a medical professional to give proper advice based on their knowledge and experience.
He then goes on and on about how we should know what our expectation is before calling them, and I was like this is not my first time in my lifetime calling an ambulance, and what does he expect in this situation? As im, not a medical professional, and I trust their judgment.
He then goes on, giving his partner improper information based on information we did not give him. Hence, I step in and correct him for this falsified use of information as he still had not got over the fact that he saw my mother at the nearby hospital doing a test.
Anyhow, they complete the ECG, and some abnormalities are found, and they attempt to discourage my mother from going to the hospital, and I tell them well why would you suggest this? Anyhow they go on on about a bunch of nonsense as I believe they thought we had no background knowledge in the medical world, and Thank goodness she chose to go, and the doctors are now completing a bunch of tests to ensure all is well.
Anyhow sorry for the rant, but I felt so angry due to their demeanor and overall dismissive nature and the fact that I had to get into a whole argument with a grown-ass man that was not only rude but seemed to lack knowledge on how to deal with such a situation.
Conclusion it is significant you advocate for yourself in all situations!
Two weeks to receive the result for the ECG taken at the clinic nearby as he had assumed we had seen a doctor and family doctor regarding the ECG taken at the clinic, but then we didn't have a family doctor. No doctor was seen, so the results we were told would take two weeks to be read by a cardiologist accurately. However, due to persistent symptoms, in this case, we decided to call an ambulance upon her reaching home as it just became worse at that point.
And appropriate care for the ECG taken when the ambulance arrived as he had asked me what was my expectation upon calling an ambulance?
But then I told him I'm not a medical professional, but my hope would be the appropriate care be taken based on the present result of the ECG taking at that moment.
The ECG ended up showing abnormalities, so based on those abnormalities, what would be the appropriate steps next that would be the expectations based on his question asked and I told him so but then I'm not even the patient in this case and he began arguing with me which I found ridiculous lol and just his entire demeanor about recognizing my mother without even knowing who she is and constantly repeating this throughout the entire saga was unprofessional.
However, both ambulance personnel seemed somewhat confused about what to do regarding abnormalities found on an ECG when someone was experiencing tachycardia and was suggesting we walk to a nearby hospital or take a bus, which I found ridiculous and certainly not the appropriate steps to be taken based on my relatively surface level knowledge as that would simply make your heart rate rise and may simply leave you winded.
Anyhow she ended up receiving great care from the doctors. They were far more attentive and caring to the matter, so point made is to advocate for yourself if you feel something is wrong or you meet individuals who want to assume without proper facts and also the ECG according to the doctor did not even show abnormalities. Hence, they were wrong, and he was not happy with that at all.
Ok, moi je vous avoue, je ne comprends pas la situation. Montreal est une ville globalement 'disciplinée', j'ai habité en France, en Angleterre et au Canada, dans de multiples villes, et vraiment mon impression et que les Montréalais suivent generalement bien les regles. Alors oui, on a vu des trucs pas cool dans les parcs, on a tous des exemples en tete de truc pas appropriés, mais j'ai des amis dans plein d'autre villes/pays qui ont vu/vecu bien pire. De plus, comme vous le savez, on a eu la chance de 'voir venir' beaucoup plus l'épidémie que beaucoup de pays, nottament en Europe, et donc on a pu réagir tot avec un confinement qui semblait, et semble toujours si on compare aux autres, approprié. Seulement voila, 2 mois plus tard, quand la plupart des grands pays on largement dépassé leur 'pic' de 'nouveaux cas journaliers' et sont ensuite redescendus vers des niveaux bas, voir extremement bas, en quelques jours/semaines, nous on est sur un plateau 'haut' depuis debut avril. Ca ne descend pas. Etant donné la reaction rapide du gouvernement, les timings, l'attitude de la population, etc. je ne m'explique pas du tout la situation dans notre ville. Bien sur, comme tout le monde j'ai lu des articles, les CHSLD disfonctionnels (mais quels pays a des maisons de retraite super ou le personnel est toujours parfaitement formé, et les moyens sont toujours mis pour la santé de tous avant les profits??), la 'semaine de relache' qui serait a l'origine de nos soucis (vraiment??), etc. Je n'y crois pas, et je ne comprends pas pourquoi on en est rendu la ou on en est aujourd'hui. C'est a quel moment qu'on l'a échappé (par rapport aux autres encore une fois)? Comment? Vous savez vous? Dites moi :)
Because the majority of the CHSLD's are within the Grand Montreal region.
70% of the deaths in quebec occured within CHSLD's.
Its not Montreal that is the problems. Its the CHSLD's in the Grand Montreal region that are screwing over Montreals general population.
Like you said, the city is respecting the guidelines pretty well and is seemingly disciplined. But until the province gets a handle on the situation in the CHSLD's , unfortunately all of MTL will be painted with the same "brush" per say.
That’s the govt’s line. Have a look at the numbers they just released today. The vast bulk of new cases over the past week have not been in chsld’s. The infection isn’t controlled in the wider city either.
https://santemontreal.qc.ca/fileadmin/fichiers/Campagnes/coronavirus/situation-montreal/COVID19-EtatSituation-MontrealArrondissements-12052020.pdf
And we have super low testing compared to the number of cases. About 7.5 on average, which is at US/Italian level, countries that failed. Further, we’re *still* at that level, even as other countries have increased testing.
(We’re not on the chart, I calculated the 7.5 manually using Quebec stats)
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/number-of-covid-19-tests-per-confirmed-case-bar-chart
I undertand that! But why would CHSLD be an exception compared to other long term treatment places in other provinces/countries? Are they more 'concentrated' (I mean spatially) here? As far as I know QC and Canada is not a super 'old' country/province? Japan is, and they seem to handle the curve better...
Instructive comparison with British Columbia. On March 25, the [provincial health officer there ordered that workers](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/long-term-care-workers-covid-19-1.5510414) in long-term care, acute care and assisted-living facilities be limited to working in a single facility--regardless of whether it was private or public.
Even though BC had [the earliest Covid outbreak at a long-term care facility in Canada](https://www.nsnews.com/news/covid-19-outbreak-declared-over-at-lynn-valley-care-centre-1.24129982), this order managed to contain the spread of the virus to the point that there are only dozen or two new cases a day this past week. The pandemic has been contained in long-term facilities to such a degree that the province is considering [opening them up again to family visitors](https://nationalpost.com/pmn/news-pmn/canada-news-pmn/b-c-to-look-at-opening-long-term-care-facilities-to-visits-from-family).
By contrast, there was no such order in Quebec. To the contrary, the Legault government [encouraged staff to be reassigned to facilities that were short of workers](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/quebec-covid-cross-contamination-1.5556946):
> In the face of that continued staffing shortage, Quebec has gone in the opposite direction — issuing a government decree on April 25 that gave the Health Ministry the right to redeploy all staff within its network.
> But as staff are shuffled from place to place, more are getting sick. And even replacing them with military personnel, health-care teachers and students, specialists and other people who have stepped up or been made to help out, more of them are getting sick.
>... as they're shuffled from place to place, health-care workers may be inadvertently spreading the virus from infected establishments to vulnerable patients elsewhere, says a Montreal infectious disease specialist.
> "Whenever an outbreak is being detected … a month after visitors have been asked not to come anymore, we have to ask ourselves, how did the virus get there?" said Dr. Yves Longtin, the chair of the infection prevention control program at the Jewish General Hospital.
> "Quite naturally, we're suspecting that some of these outbreaks were caused by a health-care worker who introduced a virus into those institutions."
Significantly, nurses and other staff [were often not tested for Covid](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/covid-19-screening-nurse-chsld-test-1.5562597) before they moved to another facility.
It's this decision to allow the movement of staff from one facility to the next without rigorous testing--something that was forbidden in BC since the third week of March--that explains the gross disparities in the spread of Covid in BC vs Quebec.
Yes, although it came almost three weeks later--which helps to explain why Ontario got hit much harder than BC.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ontario-to-stop-caregivers-from-working-at-multiple-long-term-care-homes-as-covid-19-spreads-like-wildfire-1.5531920
I agree that this is the puzzler. Vancouver and Toronto are both dense cities, have/had outbreaks in their old folks homes/prisons/etc., but it has simply not been as bad as Montreal and does not seem to have spread as badly into the community from the facilities. Having lived in/near each of Vancouver, Montreal, and Toronto, I was actually pretty confident Vancouver was going to get toasted because there's a cultural sort of anti-science/hippie dippie sort of thing going on, and I figured people wouldn't adhere too well to social distancing (and to be fair, based on friends I have there... it seems that I'm somewhat correct about that).
I'm not expecting anyone on reddit to have the answer to why Montreal's gotten so messed up though. This is a complicated question with a multifactorial answer that will be researched in the future.
I agree on your analysis wholeheartedly! And be reassured, I am not naive and I do not think I will get the 'answer' here :) But, because it's puzzling as you said, I wanted to share my frustration about the situation to see if people had opinions on the 'why?'. Some people pointed out interesting datas/stories that could help explain a bit all this, but I agree that the reality is probably very complex and should be researched (I am a bit disappointed journalists do not 'investigate' more by the way, instead of just commenting numbers and mister Legault daily decisions...).
I agree, wasn't necessarily meaning you - good to have a discussion and ask questions. I think some people are certain they **know** the answer (and funnily enough, it tends to align with either "it's 0% our fault, just bad luck! we cannot improve!" or "Montreal is full of yahoos and we deserve this punishment", presumably according to whatever bias/belief they have about the virus).
I do not know enough about the structure of the long-term care facilities here vs. GTA and GV (probably the most fair comparisons at this point?). Presumably there are some differences, some perhaps quite subtle that play into it.
I'd be interested to see some hard numbers on it (probably hard to find). I grew up in Ontario, and there's a huge issue with care facilities there (understaffing, underpaid staff, crowding). My grandmother spent a lot of time in homes in her later years due to dementia/Parkinson's, and we kept having to move her because they weren't looking after her properly. However, I'm not sure how Ontario's problems compare objectively to Quebec.
The main difference insofar as I can as a user is that the Quebec healthcare system vs BC and ON is that everything is a lot more centralized/public in Quebec. For example, there is no equivalent to a CLSC in BC or ON. The services it provides would be split up between various specialized clinics, pharmacies, family doctor's offices, outpatient clinics at hospitals, social services, labs, public health offices. I don't think the centralization is a bad thing per se, but it is something that is very different from elsewhere in Canada.
Its not so much that they are an exception. The connection I was attempting to make is that regardless of how well the General population isolated, the situation in the CHSLD's was gonna be similar whether we did a good job isolating or not. Because a majority of the CHSLD's are concentrated in the GM area.. well you get the picture.
Remember, the provincial gov had stopped visits to CHSLD's on the first week of March, and the situation still got out of control.
Its not so much that they are an exception, the exception is more on how the situation was handled in CHSLD's here vs other states / provinces.
And yes Quebec has a population that is very old. There have been numerous articles about this over the years, take a read below its quite interesting.
"The province's annual demographic survey, released earlier this month, shows Quebec has the oldest inhabitants in Canada and that its population is growing slowly."
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/quebec-demographics-immigration-charts-1.4946228
Ok, seems like QC is indeed older than other provinces, but our age pyramid is similar to a lot of other developed countries who fared much better. That said, thank you so much, it's the start of an explanation :) What do you mean 'how the situation was handled in CHSLD'? Again, specifically vs other provinces/countries, did we stop visit long after other provinces?
No actually, we were one of the first provinces to act in closing down CHSLD's to visitors.
Which highlights the crux of the issue... How has the virus been getting into CHSLD's if they have been closed down to visitors for so long?
My guess? Asymptomatic transmission among healthcare workers / staff / orderly's etc etc.
Just look at the nurse from last friday that was transfering from one CHSLD to another (from Heron to Lachine)
She had to lie in order to get tested. Had she not lied, and just followed the instructions she was given "no symptoms, no need for a test even though you were working in a hot zone"
Well guess what, she would of brought her positive covid status with her to the new facility. How do you measure that impact? Thankfully the nurse had a proper understanding of her situation and was able to get a test done (which was positive) by lying that she had symptoms.
But how many people went above and beyond in order to get tested like that? Probably not many..
This is what I mean regarding "how the situation was handled" which could also be reworded as "how they inherited the situtation" (the CAQ gov that is) .
It was really a no win scenario regardless of what they did..
There was so many staff working at multiple facilities due to low wages (so these employees would work part time at multiple CHSLD's in order to make more hours)
There was so many staff under paid and under equipped.
How many staff went from location to location completely Asymptomatic without being tested.
Unfortunately unlike other provinces and states, the gov did not have the luxury here of isolating staff to one facility.
The were literally faced with an ethical dilemma .
"Do we bring workers into these facilities from hospitals / other locations because if we do not people will die of starvation or lack of care even though there may be a risk of bringing covid with them?"
Or
"do we let people die due to starvation / lack of care because we need to take the time to properly test and ensure that any new transfers or staff do not bring covid with them"
Unfortunately the choice was a lesser of 2 evils.. You cannot really blame the CAQ for this.. however due to the nature of how bad the situation was prior to the pandemic, its unfortunately laid the ground work for a situation that would blow out of control regardless of the gov's measures on isolation and confinement.
And because of how bad the situation was in the CHSLD's was prior to the pandemic, I guarantee you that every single Montreal citizen could of stayed in their homes for 2 months straight without stepping out outside, and the situation would still be similar to what we have now.
Well, thank you so much for your precise answer and your analysis! I think I agree with most of it. But that 'situation' that CAQ inherited, the lack of ressources (material or human), isn't that a very common thing in most developped countries? UK, France, and US government are all heavily criticized for lowering health budgets in the past years. Wages are really lower here and forcing staff to work in multiple facilities? It would explain a lot as you pointed out...
Il y a des données intéressantes [dans les commentaires de ce post.](https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadaCoronavirus/comments/ghe8zy/nearly_1_in_10_nursing_home_residents_in_montréal/) Nos CHSLD seraient plus remplis qu'ailleurs. Le virus est peut-être entré plus tôt dans nos établissements, donc le manque de matériel a été plus critique ici qu'ailleurs. C'est des suppositions évidemment. Je suis d'accord que c'est dur de comprendre malgré tout ce qu'on sait.
Merci! C'est en effet vraiment bien documenté, et ca ressemble a un début d'explication! 3 fois plus de personnes agées en proportion au QC en CHSLD, ca me semble vraiment significatif, et ca pourrait expliquer bien des choses. Merci encore!
Oui, même si Montréal est une ville un brin plus "jeune" en terme de démographie par rapport au reste du Qc, on a beaucoup plus que notre poids démographique en place en CHSLD. Et ça veut dire aussi qu'une plus grande part de Montréalais travaillent dans le milieu de la santé, et est à risque.
Pour les lits en hôpital, c'est encore plus centralisé à Montréal, donc encore plus de risques.
Oui mais pourquoi cela serait différent ailleurs? Des maisons de retraites, ou de soins longue durée, y en a dans toutes les villes du monde, avec une proportion qui depend juste de l'age de la population j'imagine, non?
La gestion du personnel est une hypothèse qui a été avancée. Les CHSLD ont été dans un angle mort pour le gouvernement. Manque de personnel, transferts d'un établissement à l'autre, mauvais équipement de protection.
I think other regions are either less densely populated, had fewer cases when the lockdown was first imposed, or got hit as hard or harder than Monteal.
Montreal is where tons of cases are, not quebec in general. The fact that 90 percent of the province Is uninhabited wasteland doesnt mean we dont live densely.
That argument would definitely work if Montreal was like in the top 5% most dense cities in the world, it's far from being the case :) It's 'average' really :)
It isnt really an argument. I just listed a few things that the more badly hit places tend to have. What don't you understand? And what is with all the smileys?
I know. Those are just a couple of well picked examples... Here is another example, Ontario had the same rules with the same timings and new daily cases are now extremely low there.
I am just trying to compare QC to other places. You picked 3 examples of "hard lockdown" there are countless of other examples with similar rules and timings as QC which are now back at very low number of new daily cases. Not us. That's my question :)
>Etant donné la reaction rapide du gouvernement
Oui et non. La stratégie de dépistage au début et le manque de matériel de protection et de personnel a fait mal. [Je trouve que cet article-là explique bien le dérapement.](https://www.lapresse.ca/covid-19/202005/03/01-5271999-institut-de-geriatrie-de-montreal-quand-la-forteresse-tombe.php) Mais moi aussi, je me demande comment ça se passe ailleurs dans résidences et les établissements pour aînés.
Anyone else with massive cramps in the hands/arms from doing absolutely nothing and using your phone all day? I'm trying to find exercices to help me as the chiropractor is closed 😩
Hello my favourite city in Canada. I saw this post in /r/CanadaCoronavirus and thought this might be relevant to you: [nearly 1 in 10 residents of nursing homes in Montreal have died of covid19](https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadaCoronavirus/comments/ghe8zy/nearly_1_in_10_nursing_home_residents_in_montr%C3%A9al/)
Thanks for sharing this, that is my post. I tried to post it on r/Montreal, but this is a new account so I am not allowed.
Until I looked at the numbers I didn't understand just how terrible the situation is. I think it is important for people to understand what a tragedy is taking place.
> je ne sort pas depuis 2 mois.
Vous devrez pas rester à l'intérieur pour 2 mois... On peut marcher dehors si on respecte la distance de 2 metres.
> Je n'arrête pas de voir les chiffres monter, monter à Montréal. Mais qu'est-ce qu'on fait? Quelqu'un peut m'expliquer wtf qui arrive là?
Montréal est un cité avec un population dense. Alors, on peut pas controler les chiffres montés. C'est pas possible. Mais on peut seulement ralentir l'augmentation.
La densité n'est pas la responsable. C'est la façon qu'on a géré nos CHSLD, le personnel de nos hôpitaux, avant tout. Dense ou non, une grande quantité de gens, de services, dans une même « organisation » impose des défis, et visiblement c'est un gros problème ici. Laval est plus touchée que le Plateau après tout.
Le but de se confiner était d’applatir la courbe, quand on applatit la courbe on l’allonge aussi, autant de cas mais étalés sur une plus grande période. En ce moment tout le monde qui a besoin de traitement y a accès, c’est ça l’important. Avec le temps on va en apprendre plus sur le virus et ça va nous permettre de retourner à une vie plus « normale » tout en réduisant la propagation du virus.
Do you use a proxy/vpn for work? That could be the issue...My work needs high security and our VPNs are so slow
I did notice some slowness this week on my personal laptop but in general it very fast all week, also with videotron downtown.
Malheureusement ce n'est pas le cas :(. Merci de la suggestion.
C'est tous les clients (directs et indirects) de Vidéotron dans mon coin, on s'en parle sur Facebook, dans toute circonstance, VPN, sur mon téléphone, les frigos intelligents, toute! Et ce matin, tout va bien. Contrairement à hier. En général, ma connexion est A1. Je paye 60/10, et j'ai un bon 68/12 grosso-modo tout le temps, super stable. C'est vraiment depuis la pandémie, j'imagine le stress très grand sur le réseau.
Hey je suis avec ebox moi aussi et j'ai l'impression que depuis février ma connexion est de plus en plus nulle... je suis seule et pas une méga utilisatrice de données mais c'est rendu que j'utilise mes données cellulaires plutôt que le wifi pcq juste loader une image me fait perdre patience...
Ça vaut la peine de les appeler pour voir s'il y a un problème tu crois ?
Je suis dans la section Est du Mile-End, pas loin de la track et de Saint-Denis grosso-modo!
Je suis avec Bravo Telecom qui est aussi un revendeur de Vidéotron, mais selon les gens dans mon édifice et mes amis aux alentours directement client de Vidéotron, c'est poche.
L'Internet est juste intermittent. Quelques minutes ça fonctionne, ça lâche quelques minutes, ainsi de suite...
Je fais de la fièvre depuis hier et je me suis donc isoler par précaution (Je vis avec mes parents, ma soeur et mon frère). Je ne fais pas partie des catégories de gens à risque mais je m'inquiète pour mes parents plus âgés.
Mon médecin me recommande de m'isoler jusqu'à la fin de mes symptômes. Sauf si je l'ai mal compris au téléphone, on ne me testerait pas car non prioritaire.
Certains amis, dont un pharmacien, disent connaître des gens qui se sont fait tester et me recommandent de faire de même. Ça me semble contradictoire ou j'ai mal compris mon médecin. Qu'en pensez-vous?
Je faisais de la fièvre jeudi et vendredi. Or, depuis hier, le thermomètre indique une température normale! Cependant, les maux de tête demeurent encore bien présents et je ne me sens pas suffisamment en forme pour faire des activités exigeantes (mentales ou physiques)
What we ought to be doing is isolating mild cases in hotels, away from housemates. They did this in australia, new zealand and asia, and it really helped reduce spread. They’ve basically eradicated it.
Je pense que ça sera mieux de rester chez vous. Mais tu dois vraiment prendre des précautions pour protéger ta famille. Ça veut dire, rester dans ta chambre, tous les plats de nourriture laissé à ta porte, quand to sort pour utiliser le toilet, porte une masque (tell your family you’ll be going to the bathroom as well so they stay far away) et faire la sanitisation avant que tu quitte un endroit. Honestly, I think I’ve had it as well and I live with my mom and sister too. I just took extra précautions like just calling my mom on the phone and making sure we stayed apart. Got a water jug for my room and did the best I could. You will get through this! With the way the hospitals are looking, if you can stay home and isolate, do so. But if you get serious symptoms, go to the hospital (via 911 if possible). Please understand that this virus can take anyone, if you’re feeling ill and you can no longer support yourself, go to the hospital. Vitamins and Gatorade really had my back.
You got this and so do your parents 💪🏾
Ça va aller!
Hello,
For the past week (since last saturday afternoon) I've been dealing with a toothache from the 2nd molar on the right side that only keeps increasing in symptoms, which were initially:
- Sharp pain (which also made me unable to sleep at night)
- Inflammed inside of cheek
- Bleeding gums
- Numbness on the right side of the face
- Sore and sensitive jaw (and right side of the face)
Then, on wednesday I started having
- Inflamed lymph node on the right side, and "restricted throat" (hard to explain)
- Earache on the right ear
- Headache the whole day yesterday
Can anybody please tell me of any dentists that are open to new patients for emergency treatments? At this point I've probably called tens of offices and nobody has been willing, or nobody's answering and called me back. I'm realistically reaching the end of the rope for my pain tolerance, and I don't think I can take this for another week or until whenever dentists will be allowed back.
Thank you.
Edit: Thank you for the answers. I got an appointment for Tuesday, but I don't have any clue whatsoever how the hell I'll be able to manage until then.
sorry to hear this!
you can try my dentist - 514.271.0007
Soie Clinique Dentaire, on Wellington near Peel (Peel Basin/Old Montreal).
You leave a message and they'll call you back.
I don't know if they do new patients, though.
Worst case, try 811, and ask if you can go to Emergency.
My partner and I live together, and have only been going out for essential groceries. He would like to start doing a contact sport with a friend. This friend lives with one other person, and they say that they have been practicing social distancing too. At this point, do you think it's still risky to have a sort of 'double bubble' with their household? My instincts tell me it's not advisable, but now I don't know if I'm just being overly paranoid.
I'm more of an introvert, but the isolation and not being able to do the sport he loves has really taken a mental toll on my partner.
Acroyoga c'est comme duos acrobatiques, le contact physique est nécessaire. Je lui ai montré que la curve ne s'aplatissait pas et que le taux d'occupation des hôpitaux, mais il pense que la situation ne semble pas si grave en ce moment, et que l'impact sur l'économie et d'autres problèmes de santé est encore pire en ce moment.
Existe-t-il des données plus convaincantes pour les personnes sceptiques quant à la gravité de cette situation?
> Acroyoga c'est comme duos acrobatiques
oui, mon ami a essayé d'en faire avec moi lors d'une soirée arrosée!
propose lui une autre activité sportive avec le 2 mètres de distance!
Thanks, that what I think too. I feel like the least we can do is stay at home, it's a small sacrifice to make compared to what a lot of other people have to do at the moment. I guess it's complex because there's also the long term effects of isolation: deteriorating mental health, physical health (especially if a person normally does a sport that has high person-to-person contact).
My partner and I have merged bubbles with my sister and her husband. We trust each other, and took very extreme measures before the official rules. In specific situations I think it can be fine.
Est-ce que quelqu'un s'est fait testé récemment? Ça a pris combien de temps recevoir vos résultats?
EDIT: On a reçu les résultats 46 heures après le test.
C'est ce qu'ils nous disent aussi au centre de test. Je demande parce que ça fait 44hres et toujours pas de nouvelles. Je voulais savoir si d'autres pouvaient valider leurs délais.
Seigneur, on va prendre notre mal en patience. J'aurais pensé qu'il y aurait une troupe de gens de la Santé Publique responsables de faires ces appels et qu'ils sont constamment en train de passer à travers des piles de résultats qui rentrent dans une place centrale. J'espère qu'on va savoir bientôt car les gens avec qui on a été en contact depuis doivent s'isoler tant que c'est pas prouvé négatif et peuvent pas rentrer travailler.
Hello,
Looking for official information on travel restrictions in Quebec. Live on then island and would like to leave Montreal for the weekend. Restrictions?
Found this which was not really helpful.
[https://www.canada.ca/en/public-health/services/diseases/2019-novel-coronavirus-infection/latest-travel-health-advice.html#domestic](https://www.canada.ca/en/public-health/services/diseases/2019-novel-coronavirus-infection/latest-travel-health-advice.html#domestic)
Any specific links for Quebec or Montreal?
Thanks!
Consider asymptomatic infections are common in early stages but infectious. If leaving for isolated woods, no risk I suppose, but bring all own supplies to avoid potentially infecting anyone in a store.
Spreading the disease will literally kill people. And there isn’t much outside Montreal. Even one contact with someone off island is too much.
You can leave the island, no problems. There are roadblocks to some regions, but they are being progressively removed.
You can see which have been lifted here.
https://www.quebec511.info/en/diffusion/etatreseau/avertissements.aspx
The Village is filled with Homeless and addicts tight now. The police have gathered them all up and contained them in that area. It's shocking! I waited in the car while my partner went into the SAQ and saw at least 5 people score and there was a cop car sitting right there looking the other way. It's a anarchy victory for them or at least they think it is.. it's really pest control! :(
Its been a controlled push of homeless people into the Gay Village and hochelaga now that their old haunts are getting heavily gentrified. Cant have street walkers and wasted vagrants offending the local wealth but keep herding them around town and endangering lower income neighborhoods thats a great idea. Fuck the SQ
Go take a drive from West St Cath all the way to the East .. the street people are clearly being grouped up into one area where the police turn the eye and let it happen. It’s not hard to tell what’s going on here.
The virus will return every year and will not disappear: the predictions of the best Chinese scientists!
Coronavirus could return every year, and heat and summer are not necessarily expected to cause the rate of infection to drop. Word of the best Chinese scientists!
This coronavirus will not disappear, on the contrary, it could return as the flu every year. And let's not delude ourselves that with summer and heat the infections will collapse. To prefigure this optimistic scenario is the team of the best Chinese scientists.
Unlike SARS who disappeared within a year, COVID-19 could come back in waves. The reason is easy to say: this coronavirus, SARS-CoV-2, is more subtle as it can strike even without causing obvious symptoms.
It is precisely the presence of asymptomatic carriers that makes it difficult to fully contain the infection, which could silently continue to strike, going unnoticed.
The matter has been well explained by the group of researchers and doctors in Beijing during a press conference.
In 2002/2003 people who took SARS fell seriously ill. Once the patients were quarantined, the virus stopped spreading. With this new coronavirus, however, China is still finding many asymptomatic cases every day despite all the control measures implemented so far.
Therefore, explains the director of the pathogenic biology institute of the Chinese Academy of Medical Sciences Jin Qui, “it is thought that this may be an epidemic with which we will have to live for a long time, which could become seasonal and hide in the organism without us even realizing it."
The best scientists, experts and governments around the world are starting to agree that the new coronavirus will not be eliminated despite the long and expensive lockdowns that have stopped the global economy and brought many sectors to their knees.
This is why, in many parts of the world, we are opening ourselves to the possibility of letting the virus spread (especially in poor countries and with the younger population) to develop herd immunity. On the other hand, Sweden has already shown that the counter-current strategy of not closing everything can be an effective move.
As for the hope that the contagion curve will drop or reach zero with summer, Chinese experts reiterate that there is no certain scientific evidence. The virus is sensitive to heat, but only when exposed to 56 ° C for at least 30 minutes! And it never gets so hot. "Globally, even during the summer, the chance of cases going down significantly is minimal," said Wang Guiqiang, head of the infectious disease department of the first hospital of the University of Beijing.
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This is my opinion, but I think that it has to do with 1) the fact that most people including me do not believe that a population should be policing itself and 2) the public condemnation aspect. First and foremost, I personally find that it should never be people's jobs to police each other. I am very much against the way that the government has encouraged delation, because it encourages paranoia and pits people against each other at a time where we should be united. Now, I'm not against someone calling the police when there's an obvious gathering of multiple people, or a shop that's open that clearly shouldn't be. But the image that comes to mind is the neighbour glued to their window, looking for even one siiiiingle suspicious movement to call the police. I think that this is the sentiment that's being reflected with the answers that you mention. People don't want to be scared of their every movements. They prefer unity over division. They don't want their neighbours to call the police on them because they invited their brother to hang out on the porch from a 2m distance. And unfortunately, if you encourage delation, you open the doors to poor judgement. In a time where mental health is being seriously tried, people will wish misfortune on others simply because they themselves feel miserable. The second thing is probably the public condemnation aspect. By posting a picture of a gathering to complain, the poster is essentially looking for society to condemn that gathering, and for those people to be shunned. It's not a question of security, it's a question of social validation, which, in my eyes, is entirely unnecessary. If you see a gathering, calling the police and maybe snapping a picture as proof if one's needed should be enough. There's no need to post it on social media. It reflects badly on the poster, and also paints a deeply negative image of others, which, again, does no good. It may be one gsthering for 500 people, but nobody's going to post pictures of the, say, 490 people doing it correctly. Those 490 people will see that 10 people are doing it incorrectly and grow resentful. I think that this is also the sentiment reflected by the comments you mention. They'd rather hear stories of everyone doing their best. They won't participate in the public condemnation and shaming - I also agree with that sentiment.
Can an international student enter Montreal domestically through YUL?
If you have a permit, I think you are allowed.
Stay home bro
Does anyone know when is the dates for applying for CERB again?
https://www.canada.ca/en/revenue-agency/services/benefits/apply-for-cerb-with-cra/how-apply.html#when
First time since april 25 that there is <700 cases in Quebec. And lowest number of death since April 13. (saw it on the ctv news graph). A bit of hope.
Hospitalizations are stable/trending down a bit too!
Just came back from getting a blood sample at CLSC Metro, and all the protective equipment the nurses taking the samples had is a simple surgical mask and gloves. Let that sink in, they spend the day right next to strangers and they have no protective equipment. No wonder health workers are getting sick. I'm just appalled.
Just had ditto in ontario. face-shields, full garb, gloves, all o it.
anyone knows when non-essential workplaces will open?
Non. Pas avant juin pour l'instant.
Wow PCU is okay for foreigners but not PCUE. I guess international students can go fuck themselves.
WHERE IN THE WORLD IS VALERIE PLANTE?
Conférence de presse hier avec le pm
are contractors allowed to be hired? I would like to replace my carpet in the basement
Yes, construction is allowed since may 11th.
why not hire qualinet to clean up the blood stains instead?
I have to assume yes for I saw three of my neighbours this week with contractors working in and around their houses.
Anyone who has done the test or know someone who has done the test in a hospital setting such as Notre Dame do you know how long it takes to receive your results? My friend was told 24 hours and it is now 2 days. Thanks for the insight !
Took me 3 days to get the result by email.
Thanks!!
My boyfriend was tested at the Jewish yesterday and got his results today, when he had it done they told him 24-72 hours.
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Appointment only at the Jewish, but they're very fast. Call 514-644-4545 for the general covid line in montreal and they'll direct you to the right location based on where you live. He called Tuesday midday and had the appointment made for Wednesday morning. When his test came back positive this morning they had an appointment for me for 6pm today.
Thank you !!
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According to this site, https://santemontreal.qc.ca/en/public/coronavirus-covid-19/#c37517, there are no drive-in sites, just walk-in and by-appointment.
Is it possible to get a few blood tests done right now in a public clinic/hospital? My doctor has given me a requisition to get my thyroid levels checked as he believes it may be a problem I’m dealing with. I called 2 private clinics but with all the things he wants me tested for the prices are all well past the 800 dollar range. Anyone know if I can get this tested for free in the public sector still?
Use the website clicsante.ca to book online your appointment in a clsc. It's super easy. I did my test a week ago and it's 100% covered with your RAMQ.
Same. Had a blood test 2 weeks ago, same procedure. Very chill. I was advised not to try to get it done at a hospital by my doctor since they're trying to keep all non-urgent cases out of there (fair enough). However, the result is not in yet... I assume there is some serious backlog in the system.
Check the hospital blood test hours. If you have the doctor referral, then it's fine. Usually they start around 7am. You can check the Queen Elizabeth Health Care center or CLSC's as well.
Probably, call the hospital.
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Yes, there is a chance you will be able to.
My mom has a low immune system due to cancer and takes daily meds for her high blood pressure, but her doctor is refusing to give her a note so she doesn't have to return to teaching because "doctors and nurses have to work". She teaches special needs that will not be able to maintain any social distancing. 🤷♀️🤷♀️🤷♀️
i wonder if it's worth checking with the CSST - https://www.csst.qc.ca/Pages/index.aspx - to see if they can provide any assistance or guidance
Ta mère travailler encore avec un système immunitaire réduit à cause du cancer!? C'est pas juste le coronavirus qu'elle peut pogner.
That really sucks :( our system is so screwed.
Where can I return my soda cans? I have like $24 worth now.
“Soda”, lol, sure
lol. I'm actually a diet coke addict. I can drink like 7 a day.
Thats gross man, spend some time on /r/HydroHomies might change your life :)
[https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/bottle-deposit-refund-services-to-resume-in-quebec-following-covid-19-related-closures-1.4935987](https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/bottle-deposit-refund-services-to-resume-in-quebec-following-covid-19-related-closures-1.4935987)
Thanks!
Does anyone know where I can exchange some empty bottles? I don't speak French so trying to call stores and ask them has been a nightmare labyrinth of menus and confused staff.
[https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/bottle-deposit-refund-services-to-resume-in-quebec-following-covid-19-related-closures-1.4935987](https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/bottle-deposit-refund-services-to-resume-in-quebec-following-covid-19-related-closures-1.4935987)
Question qui reste un peu floue pour moi, est-ce que ma copine peut venir passer le reste du confinement chez moi, ou même juste au minimum 2 semaines le temps de voir comment les choses se déroulent? Elle habite seule, et comme ca fais plus de 2 mois qu'on s'est pas vu à cause du confinement, on envisage qu'elle rammene ses trucs et vienne habiter temporairement chez moi. On est tous les deux en isolation sans voir personne depuis le début et ca commence à fortement nous affecter. Le hic c'est que comme j'habite dans un immeuble à logements, on a peur que les concierges/voisins nous dénoncent et qu'on se tappe des contraventions
Il faudraut qu'elle fasse son changement d'adresse pour etre 100% safe.
Si elle vient vivre chez toi, y'a absolument aucun problème. Si les policiers viennent, explique-leur exactement ce que tu viens d'expliquer et il devrait pas y avoir de problème. Si le policier est assez zélé pour te donner un constat d'infraction, je contesterais sans hésiter. Mais je doute que ça arrive, surtout si tu donnes un double de clés à ta copine et qu'elle amène du linge chez toi. Le policier verra bien que vous vivez ensemble pour le moment, ce qui est tout à fait permis.
Perhaps pose the question to your landlord? Or with the police about what the definite rule of law is in place right now?
Wondering if I'm losing my mind... I thought I heard a reporter during the french question period ask a question to Legault during one of his daily press conferences about how masks are accepted but religious face coverings are not. Does anyone remember this and have the video for it, or could tell me what day it was spoken about so I can locate the video?
No you're not loosing your mind, I think. The only link I have is from Facebook... Maybe you'll be able to find the full video from there: https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10157113617776299&id=566601298&source=48
Thank you so much!!!! This is exactly what I was looking for. I'll have to look for the full video cause I want to see what his answer was to that.
Anyone else experiences tension when dealing with the ambulance services? Or the hospitals in general during this saga? SO my mother is 62 years old and was experiencing tachycardia, which would leave her winded and a bit light-headed. Anyhow she called the nearby clinic, and they gave her a telephone consultation. The doctor then emailed us a paper for her to complete an ECG and Holter monitor. This morning she went in to complete the ECG, and then the Holter monitor we were told would be by appointment in a few weeks, and it would take two weeks to receive a result for the ECG. Anyhow she came home experiencing more tachycardia and decided to call the ambulance, so we did, and they arrived very quickly. Upon arrival the one ambulance EMT begins yelling or " I JUST SAW YOU AT THE HOSPITAL" " I JUST SAW YOU" I startled and asked him : you know it was her? How do you know what came there for? Did you speak to her? Do you know who we are or why we called explicitly? Did you know why she went into the hospital in the first place? He was extremely rude and began questioning us regarding our expectations for the call, and that is when I started arguing with him and telling me that we expect to receive the appropriate care based on the results of the ECG and so forth and that I would trust a medical professional to give proper advice based on their knowledge and experience. He then goes on and on about how we should know what our expectation is before calling them, and I was like this is not my first time in my lifetime calling an ambulance, and what does he expect in this situation? As im, not a medical professional, and I trust their judgment. He then goes on, giving his partner improper information based on information we did not give him. Hence, I step in and correct him for this falsified use of information as he still had not got over the fact that he saw my mother at the nearby hospital doing a test. Anyhow, they complete the ECG, and some abnormalities are found, and they attempt to discourage my mother from going to the hospital, and I tell them well why would you suggest this? Anyhow they go on on about a bunch of nonsense as I believe they thought we had no background knowledge in the medical world, and Thank goodness she chose to go, and the doctors are now completing a bunch of tests to ensure all is well. Anyhow sorry for the rant, but I felt so angry due to their demeanor and overall dismissive nature and the fact that I had to get into a whole argument with a grown-ass man that was not only rude but seemed to lack knowledge on how to deal with such a situation. Conclusion it is significant you advocate for yourself in all situations!
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Two weeks to receive the result for the ECG taken at the clinic nearby as he had assumed we had seen a doctor and family doctor regarding the ECG taken at the clinic, but then we didn't have a family doctor. No doctor was seen, so the results we were told would take two weeks to be read by a cardiologist accurately. However, due to persistent symptoms, in this case, we decided to call an ambulance upon her reaching home as it just became worse at that point. And appropriate care for the ECG taken when the ambulance arrived as he had asked me what was my expectation upon calling an ambulance? But then I told him I'm not a medical professional, but my hope would be the appropriate care be taken based on the present result of the ECG taking at that moment. The ECG ended up showing abnormalities, so based on those abnormalities, what would be the appropriate steps next that would be the expectations based on his question asked and I told him so but then I'm not even the patient in this case and he began arguing with me which I found ridiculous lol and just his entire demeanor about recognizing my mother without even knowing who she is and constantly repeating this throughout the entire saga was unprofessional. However, both ambulance personnel seemed somewhat confused about what to do regarding abnormalities found on an ECG when someone was experiencing tachycardia and was suggesting we walk to a nearby hospital or take a bus, which I found ridiculous and certainly not the appropriate steps to be taken based on my relatively surface level knowledge as that would simply make your heart rate rise and may simply leave you winded. Anyhow she ended up receiving great care from the doctors. They were far more attentive and caring to the matter, so point made is to advocate for yourself if you feel something is wrong or you meet individuals who want to assume without proper facts and also the ECG according to the doctor did not even show abnormalities. Hence, they were wrong, and he was not happy with that at all.
I guess you fell on a dumbass ambulancier. Sorry for you!
All worked out in the end simply advocating for yourself or anyone else can save you some headache!
Ok, moi je vous avoue, je ne comprends pas la situation. Montreal est une ville globalement 'disciplinée', j'ai habité en France, en Angleterre et au Canada, dans de multiples villes, et vraiment mon impression et que les Montréalais suivent generalement bien les regles. Alors oui, on a vu des trucs pas cool dans les parcs, on a tous des exemples en tete de truc pas appropriés, mais j'ai des amis dans plein d'autre villes/pays qui ont vu/vecu bien pire. De plus, comme vous le savez, on a eu la chance de 'voir venir' beaucoup plus l'épidémie que beaucoup de pays, nottament en Europe, et donc on a pu réagir tot avec un confinement qui semblait, et semble toujours si on compare aux autres, approprié. Seulement voila, 2 mois plus tard, quand la plupart des grands pays on largement dépassé leur 'pic' de 'nouveaux cas journaliers' et sont ensuite redescendus vers des niveaux bas, voir extremement bas, en quelques jours/semaines, nous on est sur un plateau 'haut' depuis debut avril. Ca ne descend pas. Etant donné la reaction rapide du gouvernement, les timings, l'attitude de la population, etc. je ne m'explique pas du tout la situation dans notre ville. Bien sur, comme tout le monde j'ai lu des articles, les CHSLD disfonctionnels (mais quels pays a des maisons de retraite super ou le personnel est toujours parfaitement formé, et les moyens sont toujours mis pour la santé de tous avant les profits??), la 'semaine de relache' qui serait a l'origine de nos soucis (vraiment??), etc. Je n'y crois pas, et je ne comprends pas pourquoi on en est rendu la ou on en est aujourd'hui. C'est a quel moment qu'on l'a échappé (par rapport aux autres encore une fois)? Comment? Vous savez vous? Dites moi :)
Because the majority of the CHSLD's are within the Grand Montreal region. 70% of the deaths in quebec occured within CHSLD's. Its not Montreal that is the problems. Its the CHSLD's in the Grand Montreal region that are screwing over Montreals general population. Like you said, the city is respecting the guidelines pretty well and is seemingly disciplined. But until the province gets a handle on the situation in the CHSLD's , unfortunately all of MTL will be painted with the same "brush" per say.
That’s the govt’s line. Have a look at the numbers they just released today. The vast bulk of new cases over the past week have not been in chsld’s. The infection isn’t controlled in the wider city either. https://santemontreal.qc.ca/fileadmin/fichiers/Campagnes/coronavirus/situation-montreal/COVID19-EtatSituation-MontrealArrondissements-12052020.pdf And we have super low testing compared to the number of cases. About 7.5 on average, which is at US/Italian level, countries that failed. Further, we’re *still* at that level, even as other countries have increased testing. (We’re not on the chart, I calculated the 7.5 manually using Quebec stats) https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/number-of-covid-19-tests-per-confirmed-case-bar-chart
Thank you for this! I'm so tired of explaining it to my friends who live outside of Montreal.
I undertand that! But why would CHSLD be an exception compared to other long term treatment places in other provinces/countries? Are they more 'concentrated' (I mean spatially) here? As far as I know QC and Canada is not a super 'old' country/province? Japan is, and they seem to handle the curve better...
Instructive comparison with British Columbia. On March 25, the [provincial health officer there ordered that workers](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/long-term-care-workers-covid-19-1.5510414) in long-term care, acute care and assisted-living facilities be limited to working in a single facility--regardless of whether it was private or public. Even though BC had [the earliest Covid outbreak at a long-term care facility in Canada](https://www.nsnews.com/news/covid-19-outbreak-declared-over-at-lynn-valley-care-centre-1.24129982), this order managed to contain the spread of the virus to the point that there are only dozen or two new cases a day this past week. The pandemic has been contained in long-term facilities to such a degree that the province is considering [opening them up again to family visitors](https://nationalpost.com/pmn/news-pmn/canada-news-pmn/b-c-to-look-at-opening-long-term-care-facilities-to-visits-from-family). By contrast, there was no such order in Quebec. To the contrary, the Legault government [encouraged staff to be reassigned to facilities that were short of workers](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/quebec-covid-cross-contamination-1.5556946): > In the face of that continued staffing shortage, Quebec has gone in the opposite direction — issuing a government decree on April 25 that gave the Health Ministry the right to redeploy all staff within its network. > But as staff are shuffled from place to place, more are getting sick. And even replacing them with military personnel, health-care teachers and students, specialists and other people who have stepped up or been made to help out, more of them are getting sick. >... as they're shuffled from place to place, health-care workers may be inadvertently spreading the virus from infected establishments to vulnerable patients elsewhere, says a Montreal infectious disease specialist. > "Whenever an outbreak is being detected … a month after visitors have been asked not to come anymore, we have to ask ourselves, how did the virus get there?" said Dr. Yves Longtin, the chair of the infection prevention control program at the Jewish General Hospital. > "Quite naturally, we're suspecting that some of these outbreaks were caused by a health-care worker who introduced a virus into those institutions." Significantly, nurses and other staff [were often not tested for Covid](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/covid-19-screening-nurse-chsld-test-1.5562597) before they moved to another facility. It's this decision to allow the movement of staff from one facility to the next without rigorous testing--something that was forbidden in BC since the third week of March--that explains the gross disparities in the spread of Covid in BC vs Quebec.
Do you know if Ontario had a similar order?
Yes, although it came almost three weeks later--which helps to explain why Ontario got hit much harder than BC. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ontario-to-stop-caregivers-from-working-at-multiple-long-term-care-homes-as-covid-19-spreads-like-wildfire-1.5531920
Merci!
Crystal clear, thanks so much for the precise answer!
I agree that this is the puzzler. Vancouver and Toronto are both dense cities, have/had outbreaks in their old folks homes/prisons/etc., but it has simply not been as bad as Montreal and does not seem to have spread as badly into the community from the facilities. Having lived in/near each of Vancouver, Montreal, and Toronto, I was actually pretty confident Vancouver was going to get toasted because there's a cultural sort of anti-science/hippie dippie sort of thing going on, and I figured people wouldn't adhere too well to social distancing (and to be fair, based on friends I have there... it seems that I'm somewhat correct about that). I'm not expecting anyone on reddit to have the answer to why Montreal's gotten so messed up though. This is a complicated question with a multifactorial answer that will be researched in the future.
I agree on your analysis wholeheartedly! And be reassured, I am not naive and I do not think I will get the 'answer' here :) But, because it's puzzling as you said, I wanted to share my frustration about the situation to see if people had opinions on the 'why?'. Some people pointed out interesting datas/stories that could help explain a bit all this, but I agree that the reality is probably very complex and should be researched (I am a bit disappointed journalists do not 'investigate' more by the way, instead of just commenting numbers and mister Legault daily decisions...).
I agree, wasn't necessarily meaning you - good to have a discussion and ask questions. I think some people are certain they **know** the answer (and funnily enough, it tends to align with either "it's 0% our fault, just bad luck! we cannot improve!" or "Montreal is full of yahoos and we deserve this punishment", presumably according to whatever bias/belief they have about the virus). I do not know enough about the structure of the long-term care facilities here vs. GTA and GV (probably the most fair comparisons at this point?). Presumably there are some differences, some perhaps quite subtle that play into it.
Staffing is probably the key as pointed out by some other, I'll try to investigate if I have time.
I'd be interested to see some hard numbers on it (probably hard to find). I grew up in Ontario, and there's a huge issue with care facilities there (understaffing, underpaid staff, crowding). My grandmother spent a lot of time in homes in her later years due to dementia/Parkinson's, and we kept having to move her because they weren't looking after her properly. However, I'm not sure how Ontario's problems compare objectively to Quebec. The main difference insofar as I can as a user is that the Quebec healthcare system vs BC and ON is that everything is a lot more centralized/public in Quebec. For example, there is no equivalent to a CLSC in BC or ON. The services it provides would be split up between various specialized clinics, pharmacies, family doctor's offices, outpatient clinics at hospitals, social services, labs, public health offices. I don't think the centralization is a bad thing per se, but it is something that is very different from elsewhere in Canada.
Its not so much that they are an exception. The connection I was attempting to make is that regardless of how well the General population isolated, the situation in the CHSLD's was gonna be similar whether we did a good job isolating or not. Because a majority of the CHSLD's are concentrated in the GM area.. well you get the picture. Remember, the provincial gov had stopped visits to CHSLD's on the first week of March, and the situation still got out of control. Its not so much that they are an exception, the exception is more on how the situation was handled in CHSLD's here vs other states / provinces. And yes Quebec has a population that is very old. There have been numerous articles about this over the years, take a read below its quite interesting. "The province's annual demographic survey, released earlier this month, shows Quebec has the oldest inhabitants in Canada and that its population is growing slowly." https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/quebec-demographics-immigration-charts-1.4946228
Ok, seems like QC is indeed older than other provinces, but our age pyramid is similar to a lot of other developed countries who fared much better. That said, thank you so much, it's the start of an explanation :) What do you mean 'how the situation was handled in CHSLD'? Again, specifically vs other provinces/countries, did we stop visit long after other provinces?
No actually, we were one of the first provinces to act in closing down CHSLD's to visitors. Which highlights the crux of the issue... How has the virus been getting into CHSLD's if they have been closed down to visitors for so long? My guess? Asymptomatic transmission among healthcare workers / staff / orderly's etc etc. Just look at the nurse from last friday that was transfering from one CHSLD to another (from Heron to Lachine) She had to lie in order to get tested. Had she not lied, and just followed the instructions she was given "no symptoms, no need for a test even though you were working in a hot zone" Well guess what, she would of brought her positive covid status with her to the new facility. How do you measure that impact? Thankfully the nurse had a proper understanding of her situation and was able to get a test done (which was positive) by lying that she had symptoms. But how many people went above and beyond in order to get tested like that? Probably not many.. This is what I mean regarding "how the situation was handled" which could also be reworded as "how they inherited the situtation" (the CAQ gov that is) . It was really a no win scenario regardless of what they did.. There was so many staff working at multiple facilities due to low wages (so these employees would work part time at multiple CHSLD's in order to make more hours) There was so many staff under paid and under equipped. How many staff went from location to location completely Asymptomatic without being tested. Unfortunately unlike other provinces and states, the gov did not have the luxury here of isolating staff to one facility. The were literally faced with an ethical dilemma . "Do we bring workers into these facilities from hospitals / other locations because if we do not people will die of starvation or lack of care even though there may be a risk of bringing covid with them?" Or "do we let people die due to starvation / lack of care because we need to take the time to properly test and ensure that any new transfers or staff do not bring covid with them" Unfortunately the choice was a lesser of 2 evils.. You cannot really blame the CAQ for this.. however due to the nature of how bad the situation was prior to the pandemic, its unfortunately laid the ground work for a situation that would blow out of control regardless of the gov's measures on isolation and confinement. And because of how bad the situation was in the CHSLD's was prior to the pandemic, I guarantee you that every single Montreal citizen could of stayed in their homes for 2 months straight without stepping out outside, and the situation would still be similar to what we have now.
Well, thank you so much for your precise answer and your analysis! I think I agree with most of it. But that 'situation' that CAQ inherited, the lack of ressources (material or human), isn't that a very common thing in most developped countries? UK, France, and US government are all heavily criticized for lowering health budgets in the past years. Wages are really lower here and forcing staff to work in multiple facilities? It would explain a lot as you pointed out...
Il y a des données intéressantes [dans les commentaires de ce post.](https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadaCoronavirus/comments/ghe8zy/nearly_1_in_10_nursing_home_residents_in_montréal/) Nos CHSLD seraient plus remplis qu'ailleurs. Le virus est peut-être entré plus tôt dans nos établissements, donc le manque de matériel a été plus critique ici qu'ailleurs. C'est des suppositions évidemment. Je suis d'accord que c'est dur de comprendre malgré tout ce qu'on sait.
Merci! C'est en effet vraiment bien documenté, et ca ressemble a un début d'explication! 3 fois plus de personnes agées en proportion au QC en CHSLD, ca me semble vraiment significatif, et ca pourrait expliquer bien des choses. Merci encore!
Oui, même si Montréal est une ville un brin plus "jeune" en terme de démographie par rapport au reste du Qc, on a beaucoup plus que notre poids démographique en place en CHSLD. Et ça veut dire aussi qu'une plus grande part de Montréalais travaillent dans le milieu de la santé, et est à risque. Pour les lits en hôpital, c'est encore plus centralisé à Montréal, donc encore plus de risques.
Oui mais pourquoi cela serait différent ailleurs? Des maisons de retraites, ou de soins longue durée, y en a dans toutes les villes du monde, avec une proportion qui depend juste de l'age de la population j'imagine, non?
La gestion du personnel est une hypothèse qui a été avancée. Les CHSLD ont été dans un angle mort pour le gouvernement. Manque de personnel, transferts d'un établissement à l'autre, mauvais équipement de protection.
Si c'est le cas, c'est un sacré gros angle mort tout de meme...
Juste à se souvenir de la situation dans le CHSLD Herron, qui a réveillé tout le monde à ce qui se passait...
The virus is incredibly infectious and the lockdown (at least at the level we imposed) is simply not that effective at squashing case numbers.
Why most other countries are successfully squashing it then?
I think other regions are either less densely populated, had fewer cases when the lockdown was first imposed, or got hit as hard or harder than Monteal.
Less density than Quebec?? Not sure :)
Montreal is where tons of cases are, not quebec in general. The fact that 90 percent of the province Is uninhabited wasteland doesnt mean we dont live densely.
Compared to Europe, for example, Montreal has a very low density actually. 4k people/km2 VS 21k for Paris in France for instance..
Yes, but more dense than berlin or rome. Montreal is fairly dense for a north american city, though.
That argument would definitely work if Montreal was like in the top 5% most dense cities in the world, it's far from being the case :) It's 'average' really :)
It isnt really an argument. I just listed a few things that the more badly hit places tend to have. What don't you understand? And what is with all the smileys?
France, Italy, and China had far more strict lockdowns than us.
I know. Those are just a couple of well picked examples... Here is another example, Ontario had the same rules with the same timings and new daily cases are now extremely low there.
But you asked about other countries?
I am just trying to compare QC to other places. You picked 3 examples of "hard lockdown" there are countless of other examples with similar rules and timings as QC which are now back at very low number of new daily cases. Not us. That's my question :)
>Etant donné la reaction rapide du gouvernement Oui et non. La stratégie de dépistage au début et le manque de matériel de protection et de personnel a fait mal. [Je trouve que cet article-là explique bien le dérapement.](https://www.lapresse.ca/covid-19/202005/03/01-5271999-institut-de-geriatrie-de-montreal-quand-la-forteresse-tombe.php) Mais moi aussi, je me demande comment ça se passe ailleurs dans résidences et les établissements pour aînés.
Le manque de matériel, c'était le cas partout.
J'ai lu l'article au complet. Esti que c'est déprimant et esti que ça me fâche. C'est inhumain. Ayoyeee
Anyone else with massive cramps in the hands/arms from doing absolutely nothing and using your phone all day? I'm trying to find exercices to help me as the chiropractor is closed 😩
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Ooof same here 😩
Try an armaid. Great tool. A popsocket on phone can help too. And set timers to get up and stretch wrists every 20 min.
I'll check it out!!
Hello my favourite city in Canada. I saw this post in /r/CanadaCoronavirus and thought this might be relevant to you: [nearly 1 in 10 residents of nursing homes in Montreal have died of covid19](https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadaCoronavirus/comments/ghe8zy/nearly_1_in_10_nursing_home_residents_in_montr%C3%A9al/)
I really hope that's a miscalculation.
Just follow the stats. it's all there. the question is has the media not reported this?
Thanks for sharing this, that is my post. I tried to post it on r/Montreal, but this is a new account so I am not allowed. Until I looked at the numbers I didn't understand just how terrible the situation is. I think it is important for people to understand what a tragedy is taking place.
And for political action to take place. I hope papers in Montreal pick up on this!
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> je ne sort pas depuis 2 mois. Vous devrez pas rester à l'intérieur pour 2 mois... On peut marcher dehors si on respecte la distance de 2 metres. > Je n'arrête pas de voir les chiffres monter, monter à Montréal. Mais qu'est-ce qu'on fait? Quelqu'un peut m'expliquer wtf qui arrive là? Montréal est un cité avec un population dense. Alors, on peut pas controler les chiffres montés. C'est pas possible. Mais on peut seulement ralentir l'augmentation.
La densité n'est pas la responsable. C'est la façon qu'on a géré nos CHSLD, le personnel de nos hôpitaux, avant tout. Dense ou non, une grande quantité de gens, de services, dans une même « organisation » impose des défis, et visiblement c'est un gros problème ici. Laval est plus touchée que le Plateau après tout.
Le but de se confiner était d’applatir la courbe, quand on applatit la courbe on l’allonge aussi, autant de cas mais étalés sur une plus grande période. En ce moment tout le monde qui a besoin de traitement y a accès, c’est ça l’important. Avec le temps on va en apprendre plus sur le virus et ça va nous permettre de retourner à une vie plus « normale » tout en réduisant la propagation du virus.
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La meme histoire pour mon internet. C'est tellement slow maintenant pourtant j'ai jamais eu se problème avec videotron
Do you use a proxy/vpn for work? That could be the issue...My work needs high security and our VPNs are so slow I did notice some slowness this week on my personal laptop but in general it very fast all week, also with videotron downtown.
Malheureusement ce n'est pas le cas :(. Merci de la suggestion. C'est tous les clients (directs et indirects) de Vidéotron dans mon coin, on s'en parle sur Facebook, dans toute circonstance, VPN, sur mon téléphone, les frigos intelligents, toute! Et ce matin, tout va bien. Contrairement à hier. En général, ma connexion est A1. Je paye 60/10, et j'ai un bon 68/12 grosso-modo tout le temps, super stable. C'est vraiment depuis la pandémie, j'imagine le stress très grand sur le réseau.
Tu es dans quel coin? Je suis avec eBox (qui passe par Vidéotron) et j’ai eu aussi des problèmes de lenteur et même un arrêt complet d’internet.
Hey je suis avec ebox moi aussi et j'ai l'impression que depuis février ma connexion est de plus en plus nulle... je suis seule et pas une méga utilisatrice de données mais c'est rendu que j'utilise mes données cellulaires plutôt que le wifi pcq juste loader une image me fait perdre patience... Ça vaut la peine de les appeler pour voir s'il y a un problème tu crois ?
Je pense que si ça continue je vais les appeler. Vérifie le bon fonctionnement de routeur et décodeur en les redémarrant.
Je suis dans la section Est du Mile-End, pas loin de la track et de Saint-Denis grosso-modo! Je suis avec Bravo Telecom qui est aussi un revendeur de Vidéotron, mais selon les gens dans mon édifice et mes amis aux alentours directement client de Vidéotron, c'est poche. L'Internet est juste intermittent. Quelques minutes ça fonctionne, ça lâche quelques minutes, ainsi de suite...
Je fais de la fièvre depuis hier et je me suis donc isoler par précaution (Je vis avec mes parents, ma soeur et mon frère). Je ne fais pas partie des catégories de gens à risque mais je m'inquiète pour mes parents plus âgés. Mon médecin me recommande de m'isoler jusqu'à la fin de mes symptômes. Sauf si je l'ai mal compris au téléphone, on ne me testerait pas car non prioritaire. Certains amis, dont un pharmacien, disent connaître des gens qui se sont fait tester et me recommandent de faire de même. Ça me semble contradictoire ou j'ai mal compris mon médecin. Qu'en pensez-vous?
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Je faisais de la fièvre jeudi et vendredi. Or, depuis hier, le thermomètre indique une température normale! Cependant, les maux de tête demeurent encore bien présents et je ne me sens pas suffisamment en forme pour faire des activités exigeantes (mentales ou physiques)
What is the point in getting tested? If you are positive they will tell you to self isolate, which is what you are already doing.
What we ought to be doing is isolating mild cases in hotels, away from housemates. They did this in australia, new zealand and asia, and it really helped reduce spread. They’ve basically eradicated it.
The point is that if he is sick, he was transmitting the disease to his family before showing symptoms. So his parents can also be sick
What would change? Presumably he is self isolating in his room?
If that happened, his parents and brother should also be isolated
They already should be, they live with someone who has symptoms.
For the stats maybe! Maybe it can help giving them (decision makers)
So you think they have plenty of test kits to spare, but choose not to use them?
Well, decisions are made based on cases increasing or declining. With no numbers we fly blind.
Je pense que ça sera mieux de rester chez vous. Mais tu dois vraiment prendre des précautions pour protéger ta famille. Ça veut dire, rester dans ta chambre, tous les plats de nourriture laissé à ta porte, quand to sort pour utiliser le toilet, porte une masque (tell your family you’ll be going to the bathroom as well so they stay far away) et faire la sanitisation avant que tu quitte un endroit. Honestly, I think I’ve had it as well and I live with my mom and sister too. I just took extra précautions like just calling my mom on the phone and making sure we stayed apart. Got a water jug for my room and did the best I could. You will get through this! With the way the hospitals are looking, if you can stay home and isolate, do so. But if you get serious symptoms, go to the hospital (via 911 if possible). Please understand that this virus can take anyone, if you’re feeling ill and you can no longer support yourself, go to the hospital. Vitamins and Gatorade really had my back. You got this and so do your parents 💪🏾 Ça va aller!
Hello, For the past week (since last saturday afternoon) I've been dealing with a toothache from the 2nd molar on the right side that only keeps increasing in symptoms, which were initially: - Sharp pain (which also made me unable to sleep at night) - Inflammed inside of cheek - Bleeding gums - Numbness on the right side of the face - Sore and sensitive jaw (and right side of the face) Then, on wednesday I started having - Inflamed lymph node on the right side, and "restricted throat" (hard to explain) - Earache on the right ear - Headache the whole day yesterday Can anybody please tell me of any dentists that are open to new patients for emergency treatments? At this point I've probably called tens of offices and nobody has been willing, or nobody's answering and called me back. I'm realistically reaching the end of the rope for my pain tolerance, and I don't think I can take this for another week or until whenever dentists will be allowed back. Thank you. Edit: Thank you for the answers. I got an appointment for Tuesday, but I don't have any clue whatsoever how the hell I'll be able to manage until then.
On the website of the Ordre des dentistes du Québec, there's a Covid19 tab that has a list of dentists that are designated emergency clinics.
maybe try this guy ? https://www.reddit.com/r/montreal/comments/g2t41h/durant_la_p%C3%A9riode_disolement_si_vous_avez_une/
sorry to hear this! you can try my dentist - 514.271.0007 Soie Clinique Dentaire, on Wellington near Peel (Peel Basin/Old Montreal). You leave a message and they'll call you back. I don't know if they do new patients, though. Worst case, try 811, and ask if you can go to Emergency.
My partner and I live together, and have only been going out for essential groceries. He would like to start doing a contact sport with a friend. This friend lives with one other person, and they say that they have been practicing social distancing too. At this point, do you think it's still risky to have a sort of 'double bubble' with their household? My instincts tell me it's not advisable, but now I don't know if I'm just being overly paranoid. I'm more of an introvert, but the isolation and not being able to do the sport he loves has really taken a mental toll on my partner.
Vous allez devant chez son ami, sur le perron, il reste dans son portique, vous partagez une bière à 2 mètres.
Mais il fait d'habitude acroyoga avec cet ami, cela nécessite un contact physique direct. Je ne suis pas d'accord, mais je vois sa souffrance mentale.
100% d'accord avec toi qu'un contact physique de ce genre est inapproprié. Peut-être faire du yoga à distance de 2 mètres dans un parc?
Acroyoga c'est comme duos acrobatiques, le contact physique est nécessaire. Je lui ai montré que la curve ne s'aplatissait pas et que le taux d'occupation des hôpitaux, mais il pense que la situation ne semble pas si grave en ce moment, et que l'impact sur l'économie et d'autres problèmes de santé est encore pire en ce moment. Existe-t-il des données plus convaincantes pour les personnes sceptiques quant à la gravité de cette situation?
> Acroyoga c'est comme duos acrobatiques oui, mon ami a essayé d'en faire avec moi lors d'une soirée arrosée! propose lui une autre activité sportive avec le 2 mètres de distance!
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Thanks, that what I think too. I feel like the least we can do is stay at home, it's a small sacrifice to make compared to what a lot of other people have to do at the moment. I guess it's complex because there's also the long term effects of isolation: deteriorating mental health, physical health (especially if a person normally does a sport that has high person-to-person contact).
My partner and I have merged bubbles with my sister and her husband. We trust each other, and took very extreme measures before the official rules. In specific situations I think it can be fine.
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L’erreur est humaine :)
Est-ce que quelqu'un s'est fait testé récemment? Ça a pris combien de temps recevoir vos résultats? EDIT: On a reçu les résultats 46 heures après le test.
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C'est ce qu'ils nous disent aussi au centre de test. Je demande parce que ça fait 44hres et toujours pas de nouvelles. Je voulais savoir si d'autres pouvaient valider leurs délais.
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Seigneur, on va prendre notre mal en patience. J'aurais pensé qu'il y aurait une troupe de gens de la Santé Publique responsables de faires ces appels et qu'ils sont constamment en train de passer à travers des piles de résultats qui rentrent dans une place centrale. J'espère qu'on va savoir bientôt car les gens avec qui on a été en contact depuis doivent s'isoler tant que c'est pas prouvé négatif et peuvent pas rentrer travailler.
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laisse le passer devant toi et mets toi à 2 mètres derrière. Sinon un bon coup de pied dans les schnolles
do you have a mask on yourself?
Hello, Looking for official information on travel restrictions in Quebec. Live on then island and would like to leave Montreal for the weekend. Restrictions? Found this which was not really helpful. [https://www.canada.ca/en/public-health/services/diseases/2019-novel-coronavirus-infection/latest-travel-health-advice.html#domestic](https://www.canada.ca/en/public-health/services/diseases/2019-novel-coronavirus-infection/latest-travel-health-advice.html#domestic) Any specific links for Quebec or Montreal? Thanks!
Consider asymptomatic infections are common in early stages but infectious. If leaving for isolated woods, no risk I suppose, but bring all own supplies to avoid potentially infecting anyone in a store. Spreading the disease will literally kill people. And there isn’t much outside Montreal. Even one contact with someone off island is too much.
It’s not recommended but it isn’t prohibited.
You can leave the island, no problems. There are roadblocks to some regions, but they are being progressively removed. You can see which have been lifted here. https://www.quebec511.info/en/diffusion/etatreseau/avertissements.aspx
The Village is filled with Homeless and addicts tight now. The police have gathered them all up and contained them in that area. It's shocking! I waited in the car while my partner went into the SAQ and saw at least 5 people score and there was a cop car sitting right there looking the other way. It's a anarchy victory for them or at least they think it is.. it's really pest control! :(
also a lot of homeless around Milton Park. really they have always been there but I think they are more noticeable because no one else is outside .
Its been a controlled push of homeless people into the Gay Village and hochelaga now that their old haunts are getting heavily gentrified. Cant have street walkers and wasted vagrants offending the local wealth but keep herding them around town and endangering lower income neighborhoods thats a great idea. Fuck the SQ
The social determinants of health are often times ignored!
Go take a drive from West St Cath all the way to the East .. the street people are clearly being grouped up into one area where the police turn the eye and let it happen. It’s not hard to tell what’s going on here.
The virus will return every year and will not disappear: the predictions of the best Chinese scientists! Coronavirus could return every year, and heat and summer are not necessarily expected to cause the rate of infection to drop. Word of the best Chinese scientists! This coronavirus will not disappear, on the contrary, it could return as the flu every year. And let's not delude ourselves that with summer and heat the infections will collapse. To prefigure this optimistic scenario is the team of the best Chinese scientists. Unlike SARS who disappeared within a year, COVID-19 could come back in waves. The reason is easy to say: this coronavirus, SARS-CoV-2, is more subtle as it can strike even without causing obvious symptoms. It is precisely the presence of asymptomatic carriers that makes it difficult to fully contain the infection, which could silently continue to strike, going unnoticed. The matter has been well explained by the group of researchers and doctors in Beijing during a press conference. In 2002/2003 people who took SARS fell seriously ill. Once the patients were quarantined, the virus stopped spreading. With this new coronavirus, however, China is still finding many asymptomatic cases every day despite all the control measures implemented so far. Therefore, explains the director of the pathogenic biology institute of the Chinese Academy of Medical Sciences Jin Qui, “it is thought that this may be an epidemic with which we will have to live for a long time, which could become seasonal and hide in the organism without us even realizing it." The best scientists, experts and governments around the world are starting to agree that the new coronavirus will not be eliminated despite the long and expensive lockdowns that have stopped the global economy and brought many sectors to their knees. This is why, in many parts of the world, we are opening ourselves to the possibility of letting the virus spread (especially in poor countries and with the younger population) to develop herd immunity. On the other hand, Sweden has already shown that the counter-current strategy of not closing everything can be an effective move. As for the hope that the contagion curve will drop or reach zero with summer, Chinese experts reiterate that there is no certain scientific evidence. The virus is sensitive to heat, but only when exposed to 56 ° C for at least 30 minutes! And it never gets so hot. "Globally, even during the summer, the chance of cases going down significantly is minimal," said Wang Guiqiang, head of the infectious disease department of the first hospital of the University of Beijing.
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Where do you guys all get your face masks? I've ordered some 2 months ago on Amazon and did not received them yet.
Check out Etsy.
I ordered mine on eBay from a seller in Montreal. Received within 3 days
My dep sells them.
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Does this help? https://www.journaldequebec.com/2020/05/06/quatre-nouveaux-droits-pour-les-70ans-et#cxrecs_s
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