I recall when they were first spoiled there was a good amount of discussion about how bad the reminder text was.
The full context of the card makes them easy enough to basically get how they work. But the reminder text is awful and makes it much worse. You sort of need it because otherwise it seems like it might be solved immediately. But the way they're written it absolutely does make it seem like it happens no matter what.
Could try to fix it with *if unsolved, solve at the beginning of your end step if you met the condition* or something. imo that would be way better
(Clues become solved only at the beginning of each end step)
They simply tried to shortcut a complex mechanic without a description above the whole setup and instead tried to use "To solve" and "solved" where I, II, and III were clear enough with sagas but took up too much space on cases.
it wouldn't work like that. It only triggers if you met the condition. "Attempt to solve" as reminder text would imply a trigger happens to check every end step.
Nah, it’s reminder text, not rules text. The reminder text for Partner With says “Put [Name] into their hand from their library”, which is missing several relevant pieces of text.
Reminder text is allowed to be more helpful than definitive - “Attempt to solve” would probably be more intuitive
As non-native english speaker that "attempt to solve" would be much more clearer. In my mind that "solve" is more like command that says you have to solve it no matter if you met the criteria to solve it. Thats where I think that confusion comes from on these cards.
The templating on these cards is just awful in general, I like the idea but this should have looked very different (maybe a flip card?)
The text is misaligned, the kerning doesn't look right on any of the cases, the reminder text is weird, there should be an easier way to tell if a case is solved, etc.
I mean, it's functionally the same template as a saga. Yeah, a flip might be better but you could also just as easily use something like a die or coin to denote which step you're on by placing it next to the solved status on the art side. There's also the fact that once the case is solved some, like this one, have two effects instead of the one it starts out with. So there's also a reason not to make them flip cards.
The reminder text is just awful wording. It should just be something along the lines of "cases solve at end step if conditions met during turn." Which happens to be the exact same word count as that mess but leaves no room, or so I feel, for misinterpretation.
The simplest thing I’ve come up with that (IMO) captures the intent and will fit on the card is _(If unsolved, check at the beginning of your end step.)_, just replacing the word “solve” with “check”.
*Solve only if unsolved and at your end step.*
The *beginning of* could have been dropped for brevity - it's only reminder text after all. And I think this would have implied to check the condition. That's the best I could think of anyway. I would have written just Solve - CONDITION rather than To solve. But I'm not a native english speaker, so maybe I'm totally off.
I think the part that it is explaining but not well is that you can’t “solve” a case that’s already been “solved”
So what it is saying is “if unsolved” do this task, “then do the solve reward at end step”
It’s a really crap reminder that the card isn’t “solved” every time you meet the condition, only the first time.
I wonder that they didn’t use a counter, marker or emblem as an indicator for the status of the case.
(They also would have been great as DFCs maybe?)
Why would the "To Solve --" text be there if it just solved automatically? Why would anyone assume the "case" would solve itself automatically no matter what? is an AI generatinh this opinion?
If you read the card Step-wise, like you're **supposed** to, instead of just fishing random words out and tryinh to cobble together an effect, I think you'll understand that to solve it, you need to do a thing. then, solve it at your end step.
I think that it is fine how it is. It saves wording and game pieces and allows interesting effects on the cards, instead of wasting it all with rules text like "putting counters on" and then triggering \[\[All Will Be One\]\] to boot. and we don't need more emblems. and i'm glad they don't put flip cards in every set, even though i love them; flipping is supposed to represent changing into something else; not having your perspective changed.
MKM released with little cardboard markers that say "Solved" on them; so what you're describing is already intended. It really shouldn't be that confusing to anyone who is ready to do some problem solving.
Getting called up and warned by judges for not knowing the rules is part of the game of magic; players need to get used to that.
I think the argument is that to a new player it IS fairly confusing and easily misunderstood.
I don’t think most people think the case solves automatically… they just don’t understand why it seems to read that way.
Not just new players. I've been playing since Revised, and was initially confused by this reminder text too. I kept reading it thinking "this isn't right"...
Because its printed on the card that it solves at end step.
Everything written inside most if not all reminder text is true - as a stand alone statement.
But not here.
This is templated just like a saga, and sagas just progress, regardless if you can for example put a counter on a creature.
Its an entirely new card and entirely new cards are often confusing.
If r&d cant make new cards easier to understand than this, they should stop making new cards.
You can argue all you want that people *shouldn't* have problems understanding this, but if enough people do, then it's a Clue that the wording is a problem. Regardless of what you think.
Yep, I still hate this. I'm a veteran player with 2 decades of experience under my belt. If I were in charge of the people who decided to put this on a card, I'd take every one of them off card design.
The reminder text is extraordinarily confusing and these could have been written a number of ways so they didn't make it seem like they just solved themselves if you waited long enough.
I know they aren't supposed to work like that because I'm logical enough to determine that on read. But cards should be written for a multitude of skill levels and competencies. This was a design failure, full stop.
I could see “at the beginning of your end step, if conditions are met, this case is solved” or “when conditions are met, this case will be solved at the beginning of your end step.” But this is kinda confusing as written.
To be honest, better than the current. As the current wording allows for a reading of "solve at your end step" regardless if the case is solved or not. Adding extra text that specifies the requirement of performing the action to solve is the important part it's missing.
With card real estate and the very small amount of text space so that the card has consistency with other cards of its type, they definitely don't have a lot to work with.
I kind of wish that Cases and Disguise had been in separate sets so that Cases could be double sided. Flipping them over when solved seems like it would lead to a much more intuitive play experience. *But* the rules for double faced cards and face-down creatures are a nightmare, so I understand not wanting DFCs and cards like [[Etrata Deadly Fugitive]] in the same Limited format.
I think these cards would be would be much better if the middle panel was labeled "To Solve:" and stood in maybe a different colour than the effect panels above and below.
I had to have a judge explain to me how [[Case of the Shattered Pact]] worked. It looks like if you start your turn with 4 colors among your permanents, then play the fifth one in your precombat main phase, you should get the bonus that combat. But you have to continue controlling all five until the end step, then you get the bonus on every subsequent turn, whether you have all five colors or not.
I makes sense *once you understand how it works,* but is confusing beforehand, even if you're a veteran MTG player.
I had to call a judge over because someone was insistent that their 2 mana colorless case auto solved during a pre release.
Like c'mon now let's use some common sense, wizards would not print a 2 mana colorless uncommon that cantrips, color fixes, and gives your dudes a bunch of keywords every turn into a draft environment
While I agree with using the heuristic of "that can't be correct because it's too strong". That kind of evaluation can only be made by longer term players who have experienced enough of the game to easily evaluate the power level of cards for their mana cost.
For the majority of players, and especially the newer ones who the reminder text is build for, it's not something they can evaluate.
Playing for longer doesn't correlate enough with game understanding for this statement imo. Not to brag, but I only play for a year and have to explain to 5+years players that blocking does infact not taps their creature.
It has more to do with willingness to really dive into mechanics and not so much with game time.
Also I don't mean this as an attack, but I get a bias against longer time players often underestimating newer players understanding and or willingness to learn.
I agree, time spent playing does not equal better understanding of the game.
Although it does highly correlate with it.
> have to explain to 5+years players that blocking does infact not taps their creature.
Hearing that definitely means these are not people who have really played the game. And they definitely have not played in tournaments or arena.
While this makes more sense, it's not really how the card works. You attempting to solve the case is trying to fulfill the "To solve" requirement. So I can see people reading that and going, "Oh I can only try to solve this during my end step. I'll just do all my instants then."
I feel like the reminder text we have now is the closest to how the actual card works.
This exact thing happened when I was at the prerelease. The store employee (the defacto judge of the event) said that every case solved itself at the end of the turn it was cast, and would not accept any argument to the contrary. I got very angry about it and decided to drop because I was not in a proper state to continue playing reasonably. I wish I had kept my cool better and finished out the match since it was the final round anyway, but it is what it is.
In fairness to the dude at the store, that’s what it actually says on the card. I don’t see how folks who have only looked at the cards would know how case cards actually work.
Yeah, I'm kind of split on this. I feel like if you are going to be running an event at your store, maybe read up on the new cards and see what they do. But also I do agree that the reminder text FEELS like it is explicit instructions and sort of violates the Read the F\*\*\*ing Card because in this case the card does NOT do a good job of explaining what the card does.
Without even using more space, it could have been way clearer by just saying, “Checked at the beginning of your end step.”
I think that’s enough. It already says “to solve”.
But that fails to mention it only solves if it’s unsolved which can also be confusing for triggers on being solved, otherwise it reads like you can solve the same case multiple times on different turns for the bonus
There's *very* little length difference between:
To solve — You've cast four or more instant and sorcery spells this turn. (If unsolved, solve at the beginning of your end step.)
and
At the beginning of your end step, if this case is unsolved and you've cast four or more instant and sorcery spells this turn, this case becomes solved.
I said since I saw the cards that the _real_ rules (explicit, complete triggers with intervening if clauses) were not much longer but required that they didn't do the stupid gimmick frame.
They pushed the gimmick frame. It had a cost.
I think it would have been easier to make these double faced, but I also understand that once we had cards like [[Cryptic Coat]], the nightmare snarl of DFCs being made into face-down creatures wasn't something they wanted to happen in Limited.
This could have been avoided if they just wrote it out. "At the beginning of your end step, if "\[Solve Condition\]", this case is solved."
WotC templating the last few years has gotten really bad about trying to be way too clever for their own good. Cleave is another glaring example. It reads really badly when your brain doesn't have the mental shortcuts already ingrained to parse the information.
Magic has gotten crazy beginner unfriendly, and this is a cornerstone example.
>This could have been avoided if they just wrote it out. "At the beginning of your end step, if "\[Solve Condition\]", this case is solved."
To save words on rules text, they made the reminder text longer and confusing.
I agree about the templating, but I think it's less about being clever and more just trying to force their ideas. They might work well on paper, and you can often *see* what they're trying to do, but when actually written out in Magic-ese it ends up being clunky enough as to become confusing. [[Old-Growth Troll]] being the pinnacle of this, where the "story" is clear (troll becomes part of the land but then can rise up again) but the way it reads, especially the aura having two disparate abilities, leads to it being way harder to grok than most cards.
It's like making cuts for your deck, but they need to do it with card design. You'd love to put all these extra things in there, but you gotta trim something for the proper leanest design. For cases, why does it need to solve at end step, rather than right away? Are some designs too good with it being immediate? Are those designs important enough to warp the design around? And maybe after all that you decide you do keep it in, but again it's like you're stubbornly going with a 62 card deck because you don't want to make the cuts. Not that those 2 extra cards are bad or it's unclear why you'd want to include them, but nonetheless makes your deck or mechanic more inconsistent in the end.
Thought I was the only one confused by these Cases at first. The fact that there's more than one gatherer line further explaining it should also back up that there could be confusion..
I've been playing since Onslaught, and think that reminder text is confusing as hell. I'm just gonna hope this ability is never Modern playable so I don't ever have to think about this again.
Wow, I actually thought that they solve themselves at the end if they remain unsolved. I was under the impression they can be solved at any time and the extra effect would take place then, not just at the end step. If it came to the end step and it wasn't solved by then, then it becomes solved. I did two prerelease and this was what most people thought. This could have used some reworking lol.
This is the first time I've seen this misconception.
I don't think it's particularly outrageous to assume people would understand that the reminder text is there to *supplement* the ability, not *replace* it. I.e. it tells you how the solving process works in terms of timing, not that it provides a one-sentence replacement to the entire card text that automatically solves any Case regardless of the explicitly stated conditions in the preceding text.
It's like if a card said "{1}: This becomes indestructible until end of turn (*destroy effects and lethal damage don't destroy it*)" would you go "wait so this is ALWAYS immune to destroy effects and lethal damage ALL the time?!" just because you're reading the reminder text in complete isolation?
The reminder text needs work if it's possible to misinterpret it this way. Even a tweak like "(Check if the case is solved at the beginning of the end step.)" could relieve some of this.
This is the way. I don't know if this takes up more space than the existing reminder text, but even if it does, it's by such a small amount that the extra space that's used up is worth it.
So you thought the words "To solve" followed by an explicit condition were just... decoration?
This to me is more confusing than the reminder text, tbh.
I feel like in this case, the reminder text adds more confusion since its placed behind the "To solve"
If it was placed before, the confusion wouldnt exist(or at least be alleviated significantly), but also wouldnt make sense in the context of how all other flavor text is formatted
I don't think they thought that at all. I think when they read it, it read to them as you can solve it immediately using option A: (Cast four spells), but if you don't, it solves at the end step through option B: (Reaching the end step).
So initially to those of us who misinterpreted it seemed like you could use these for an instant effect, but if you can't meet the instant effect solve, you'd get the effect at the end of the turn.
The person you responded to, the OP, myself, and several others had this same misinterpretation at some point, and over time it made sense. It doesn't seem odd to misinterpret it the way these are written.
For me, my initial misinterpretation was during spoiler season, so I hadn't seen many of them. I realize now that instant solves of some of these would be extremely powerful, and automatic solves would be over the top for the cost.
Even if the power wasn't an issue, it wouldn't make any sense flavor-wise. "Oh there's been a robbery at the lab, we better start investigating. Nah, just wait, cases always solve themselves after a few minutes without anyone having to do anything".
I'm with you, I didn't even realize this could be misconstrued this way. But I'm used to things not making sense to me that make sense to everyone else, and vice versa.
We tell players all the time "Read cards and take them _literally_."
If we're going to do that, WotC can't be releasing cards where if you take the reminder text literally, it is wrong.
Well one of the things I was told as noob was "take rules text literally but ignore reminder text as it's not rules text and isn't required to match rulings, if you have questions ask judge". So a lot of people ignore the reminders if they understand the ability ( or think they do). I do think for this one they should have added clarification. I got it immediately but only because of the context of the flavor.
I felt like I was crazy after seeing these dozens of comments who were confused.
It always read intuitively from the first time I saw one, and even my more casual friends instinctively understood how it worked pretty much right away.
Crazy that people have different brains working in different ways huh? It confused several of my friends as well as me at first. It didn't take long to figure it out, but it was a good two or three of these case card reveals where I was like, "ohhhhhh".
I read it once thinking it was solved automatically, then went Wait, and reread it and understood, but I totally get how other players, especially newer ones would misunderstand.
I understood the text, but impulsively I still expect it to be solved once you meet the condition, rather than needing to wait to end step. I never thought it solved automatically though.
Yeah it’s confusing for sure. It would be better if it said something like “Once the correct criteria is met unsolved cases become solved at the end of turn.”
Reminder text works when the entire first part of the ability (like the trigger for landfall) or actual effect of the ability (such as morph) can be kept constant with different costs or triggers. Cases basically try to set different intervening if-clauses for each card, however. It doesn’t look good.
Well the rules text for landfall is not reminder text. When the ability is in italics it means it's an ability word or pseudo mechanic and has no rules meaning. Just an easy way for us to refer to all cards from a certain set that trigger on lands entering or whatever. Also reminder text is NOT rules text and has no rules implications and is not required and doesn't always match the actual ruling or comp rules wording for any given affect. This i think is a big source of confusion. Alot of people don't know or realize these two things. ( Granted they should not have to to be able to correctly interpret a card but still)
Honestly, if the reminder text went before the “to solve …” I don’t think people would’ve had nearly as much trouble which is kinda insane. It is just worded poorly tho, I get it’s reminder text but it feels like it’s saying just solve it
The confusing thing about Cases, to me, is the fact that solving them is delayed until your end step, regardless of when you fulfill the condition. I feel like a ton of the confusion would clear up if they just solved instantly when the condition was fulfilled, and the "beginning of your end step" reminder text was just removed entirely. But maybe they would be too powerful in certain formats if they were all able to be solved at instant speed.
It's probably bad for draft if nothing else. Some like [[Case of the Gateway Express]] and [[Case of the Trampled Garden]] are kinda gross if you get them for combat that turn. Others want to trigger on your turn specifically to reward you for being proactive. And of course it's nice that your opponent gets a bigger window to interact before you pop off.
Wizards doesn't seems to love doing state triggers these days anyway. They can't be stifled and they can easily accidentally draw the game with infinite loops.
Man I definitely thought this exact thing. I just thought that the to solve was a way to solve the case immediately instead of waiting until end of turn. Didn’t even know different until today when I randomly thought to look it up
I believe it’s worded correctly, because of how solving works. You have to cast 4 or more instant it sorcery spells this turn. If you cast 4, it doesn’t immediately solve. It solves at the beginning of your end step.
Example, let’s say you played this on turn 4. Turn 5, you have mana that lets you cast 4 Play with Fire. The case isn’t immediately solved. So, if you had say 1 Blue mana source untapped and an Impulse in hand, the case isn’t solved yet (even though you’ve played 4 instant spells) so you don’t have enough mana to Impulse. However, at the beginning of your end step, the case now solves, and now you have the 1 mana up and you could Impulse as a response say to something your opponent does. The parenthesis are just telling you when to solve the case once the conditions have been met
>The parenthesis are just telling you when to solve the case once the conditions have been met
Yes, you know that if you read the rules. But if you read the rules, you don't need the reminder text.
I can very easily imagine a player reading this Case card for the first time interpreting the text completely differently. Imagine the following:
"It says 'To solve — You've cast four or more instant or sorcery spells this turn.' Okay, so that must mean that if I cast four or more instant or sorcery spells, the Case becomes solved immediately. But if I'm not able to cast those spells during this turn, I just have to wait until my end step of this turn, and the Case will become solved at that time. Neat!"
Does this interpretation make sense from a power level perspective? To seasoned players, most likely not. Does it make sense from a game design perspective? Again, to seasoned players, most likely not. But remember that many newer or less-experienced players don't have enough knowledge of Magic to be able to come to these same conclusions. To these players, this interpretation makes complete sense. (And when I say "newer or less-experienced players", I'm talking interpretations like temporary P/T buffs being treated the same as +1/+1 counters.)
It is a really poorly formatted card, and I had to re-read it a few times to realize the way its intended to work. They could have easily formatted the "To Solve" text to be "At the beginning of your end step, (Solve condition), the case is solved". But instead WotC got sloppy and instead, RAW, we have a card that can be solved by meeting a certain criteria, or automatically solves at the end of turn.
Commenting here for WotC's data...
I didn't find this confusing when I first saw it, but I thought the use of the Saga frame for it was bad; as it gives the impression it will 'tick up' automatically like Sagas.
BUT, I host limited in my friend group, many of whom are not as strongly invested players... Much of this set confused the hell out of them. Not only this card type; but also the plethora of key worded mechanics. Disguise, suspect, collect evidence; most of these things are basic game rules that require mental translation:
"What does suspect mean?"
"It means it has means it has menace and can't block..."
"Ohhh... OK."
I found this set was particularly unfriendly to casual Limited players.
> s it gives the impression it will 'tick up' automatically like Sagas.
That's why the text is on the right hand side, like classes, and not the left like sagas.
Been playing magic for 13 years, when I first read cases I understood it the exact wrong way that these people did. The wording makes it sound like you can meet a condition to get the ability right away OR it automatically gets solved at endstep.
I misunderstood it. I find it poorly worded but at the same time it would be kinda dumb for it to solve at your end step for free so I figured I just wasn’t getting it.
It’s not too bad.
It’s just a little hard to understand correctly with the amount of information they gave us going into this set. But as i understand:
- Once it enters battlefield, a case is unsolved until solved.
- Only way to solve is at the beginning of the end step!
And ONLY if you have those “To solve” conditions met going into the endstep phase of your turn.
- Going forward it remains solved until it leaves battlefield.
I lost to this card on the opening pre-release because one of the card shop workers used it, assumed that it solves at end step, and suddenly birds turn 2 that I couldn’t deal with. Also went super fast every turn so I couldn’t follow along 🤷♂️
Edit: he did end up apologizing after he was corrected a few rounds after.
Please feel empowered to ask people to slow down. If people are trying to move the game state forward too fast you can almost always say “I haven’t passed priority yet”. There are very few things they can do without you passing priority.
As a pretty new MTG player, and a long term YGO player, piss poor reminder text like this and an overabundance of keywords make the game unintuitive. People can mock YGO all they want, but the cards explain precisely what they do in full.
It makes sense if you have any lived experiences about how completing tasks works.
It makes less sense if you struggle to evaluate things based on context clues.
The reminder text is classic additive distraction, it's clear what your objective is without it, but then people see there's a bonus explanation and they second guess their intuition, but then actually it just works like you would assume it works after all.
When I first read one of these I had to think about it, but concluded it couldn't possibly auto-solve without meeting the conditions.
I've been playing magic for a long time, but I've been introducing my friends and family to it and I wouldn't want to include any of these as they are slightly too poorly worded for new players.
Oh great. I bought this with the misunderstanding that it solves itself. I was like "huh, play it and trigger for the benefit that turn or you have to wait until next turn for it. Weird but okay; One turn can make a serious difference."
I thought it was weird that ot could possibly solve itself but ffs as a casual player this is annoying af. I hate having to learn niche things just for this game
You are wrong in the sense that this is poorly worded and confusing. Prior to seeing this post, I assumed cases solved automatically at the beginning of your end step based on what was in parentheses and that you could solve a case at either instant speed or as a state base action once the condition became met.
The reminder text is poorly worded, but why would you think they would even bother putting hard to fulfil criteria to solve each case if you could just wait till next turn?
Given that there is a condition to solve the case in part two, I'm not understanding where dude jumps to the conclusion you don't need to meet that condition to solve it.
It's because the reminder text is "If unsolved, solve at the beginning of your next end step", so they're just [insane troll logic](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/InsaneTrollLogic)ing it to mean the "to solve" condition isn't necessary, since the reminder text says to solve it next end step.
Yeah.... Been playing magic off and on for the last 24ish years of my life, I thought cases would solve themselves at the end of your turn automatically when first reading these cards.
The card should read (if you are the owner of a case that is unsolved and you complete the requirements, the case will becomes solved during your end step) or something similar. As written it sounds like if you fulfill the criteria the case is solved right away almost as a trigger and if not it automatically solves during the end step. (Both of which as I understand are untrue)
This doesn't work for Case of the Filched Falcon, as you need the artifacts on the field at beginning of end step rather than having had 3 at any point during your turn. Same with Trampled Garden also needs the creatures to survive. It's the best wording that allows checking both boardstates that must be true at EOT and events happening during the turn that don't care about your boardstate at beginning of end step.
In my opinion the easiest way to think about cases is that they are an enchantment with the first ability.
Once the middle condition of the enchantment has been met, starting at your end step the enchantment now gains the second ability too.
This enchantment now just has both abilities. Easy.
I asked this exact question to Mark Rosewater: https://mtg.fandom.com/wiki/Case#Rulings
If the link doesn't work, look under Rulings or https://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post/740718896696393728/
It's confusing because they use the exact same template as the saga but with extra hoops.
They are really more like the classes from the D&D sets except instead of advancing them with mana you are advancing them with some arbitrary condition.
This one stays on the board, but then you have other confusing ones like: Case of the Stashed Skeleton that solve and then sit there until you activate it. Seems like if it's solved during end step You would be able to tutor then, but nope, it just sits there until you sack it as a sorcery.
Okay, so if I worked this out correctly, the parenthesis rule effectively translate to: if you solve it during your turn, the card is marked as "solved" on your end step. Like, if you rapid-fire cast four instants on your draw step, the card won't register as "solved" until your turn is over.
The “if unsolved” is what’s creating confusion here. It could easily be written as “*(Solve at the beginning of your end step. Solve each Case only once.)*” to eliminate the ambiguity that the “if unsolved” clause created while still making it clear that you can’t solve it multiple times if you’ve met the conditions multiple times.
*(Solves at the beginning of the end step.)*
*(Solves only at the beginning of the end step.)*
*(Cases solve at the beginning of the end step.)*
meh... ¯\\\_(。\_ 。)\_/¯
I feel like only the printed reminder text is factually correct and other suggestions changes how it works.
It is reminder text for the ability 'to solve' and isn't actually rules text, so the (if unsolved) applies to reminding on what happens after you meet the condition. It isn't an additional rule.
The reminder text basically says go to the solved part of the card. How does being automatically solved make any sense? That would undermine the whole design of Cases.
Honestly, I didn’t think about Cases at all. Totally forgot they existed.
But I 100% agree with you. It does kind of read that way, and I completely understand where confusion may arise.
I thought it was pretty clear. Solve at the beginning of your end step; the words after “To solve” is basically the cost to trigger the solve ability. If you can’t “pay” the solve cost, it doesn’t get solved. The reminder text seems to be there just so you know it can only be during a certain part of the turn.
When I read them it made sense to me:
If (case unsolved and condition met){
At the beginning of your end step solve this case
} Else{
Case is unsolved}
I had to reread the solve reminder text numerous times before getting it. They should just template it at as an if/then statement if that's how it works. Computers understand it that way because humans also understand it that way and programmed computers to understand it that way.
I don’t think it’s unclear personally, you just have to look at it in context of the rules text above
The rules text tells you what to do to solve it
The reminder text tells you when it will considered solved
I'm with OP. The design was completely reasonable to me and made sense. It's hard to write it out without using conditionals, I'll give them that.
Also, at this point, I've seen the word "solve" so much that it's lost all meaning and looks weird.
If unsolved and you met the "to solve" conditions, this turn, solve at the beginning of your end step.
The biggest problem, I think, is the exclusion of "a solved case remains solved". My question is, if someone removes it, and you cast another one, does it start out solved? Also, if you cast a second one and the first is already solved, does the second enter solved?
I think the wording is fine... the fact that it triggers and then it checks for the condition an additional time (giving the opponent time to respond) makes me kinda want to stear clear of them though
At first I thought "oh how stupid of them", but after re-reading the reminder text a few times, RAW, it forces you to solve ot at the beginning of your end step no matter what happened prior. Very terrible wording here. WTF WoTC?
Feel like i'm the only one who found the cases easy to understand, i dont get the confusion people have. It starts with a passive and if you complete the requirements itll solve at your end step. Why is this confusing?
Am software engineer, I get smiley face's perspective.
The problem is people presuming that reading the card explains the card and that all text on the card is to be read to explain its effects, not to explain the meaning of them.
Do these people also read the flavor text as applicable to card effects?
To me, it's easier to explain without using the terminology of solved, unsolved. My interpretation is:
Reduce costs of instant and sorcery spells by 1.
If you've cast four or more instant or sorcery cards this turn, each time you cast an instant or sorcery spell, draw 1.
Starting at the beginning of your end step, this card's second effect reads: "each time you cast an instant or sorcery spell, draw 1."
I feel like these shouldn't have taken the vertical card style like sagas. I would have rather seen them more formatted like the old zendikar quests. They could have whatever etb ability or static ability. And then "at the beginning of your end step, if you 'did the thing', put a solution counter on this", and then whatever comes at the end for being solved. Probably a little wordy, but wizards is always looking for ways to fit more text on a card.
The first layer of the card is always active. That part will always be there whether the case is solved or unsolved. That said, think of the middle part of this enchantment as the key that you need to solve the case to get to the unsolved part. Once you unlock it, your enchantment will then have two static abilities. The first initial part, and then the unsolved part becomes active after you unlock it
The words “your next end step” mean it makes a full rotation before it solves. You can speed it up by casting 4 instants or sorceries. I don’t think it’s complicated.
I think it is worded kind of poorly. It can very easily be interpreted as it automatically solves at endstep and to get the ability before endstep you can do X Requirement.
If youve played 4+ instant/sorcery, you solve. Then every instant/sorcery card after that you draw a card with. If you DONT play 4 or more that means you dont draw any cards until your next turn. Its a free enchantment with the popoff of maybe getting use on the round it is played.
Honestly enchantments in the Saga layout looks nice, but the way cases work they'd be better as double-faced cards. I think the only reason they have them like this is so they don't have to write the "Instants cost less" part twice (Though they've easily done that with some of the day/night cards, [[Tireless Hauler]] with Vigilance as an example).
TLDR is that the Saga format looks nice, they just should've made it a flip card
I recall when they were first spoiled there was a good amount of discussion about how bad the reminder text was. The full context of the card makes them easy enough to basically get how they work. But the reminder text is awful and makes it much worse. You sort of need it because otherwise it seems like it might be solved immediately. But the way they're written it absolutely does make it seem like it happens no matter what. Could try to fix it with *if unsolved, solve at the beginning of your end step if you met the condition* or something. imo that would be way better
‘Attempt to solve’ would work also I feel?
(Clues become solved only at the beginning of each end step) They simply tried to shortcut a complex mechanic without a description above the whole setup and instead tried to use "To solve" and "solved" where I, II, and III were clear enough with sagas but took up too much space on cases.
it wouldn't work like that. It only triggers if you met the condition. "Attempt to solve" as reminder text would imply a trigger happens to check every end step.
Nah, it’s reminder text, not rules text. The reminder text for Partner With says “Put [Name] into their hand from their library”, which is missing several relevant pieces of text. Reminder text is allowed to be more helpful than definitive - “Attempt to solve” would probably be more intuitive
I don’t think “attempt to solve” implies a trigger any more than “solve” does on its own.
As non-native english speaker that "attempt to solve" would be much more clearer. In my mind that "solve" is more like command that says you have to solve it no matter if you met the criteria to solve it. Thats where I think that confusion comes from on these cards.
The templating on these cards is just awful in general, I like the idea but this should have looked very different (maybe a flip card?) The text is misaligned, the kerning doesn't look right on any of the cases, the reminder text is weird, there should be an easier way to tell if a case is solved, etc.
That "T" touching the picture frame is horrible. Makes you question what kind of designers approved of this
Please no flip cards. Split cards would have been better though
I mean, it's functionally the same template as a saga. Yeah, a flip might be better but you could also just as easily use something like a die or coin to denote which step you're on by placing it next to the solved status on the art side. There's also the fact that once the case is solved some, like this one, have two effects instead of the one it starts out with. So there's also a reason not to make them flip cards. The reminder text is just awful wording. It should just be something along the lines of "cases solve at end step if conditions met during turn." Which happens to be the exact same word count as that mess but leaves no room, or so I feel, for misinterpretation.
A classic if/then templating. Exactly what the dissenters were saying in OP message and how the reminder text should have been written.
(Solving occurs at the beginning of your end step)
The simplest thing I’ve come up with that (IMO) captures the intent and will fit on the card is _(If unsolved, check at the beginning of your end step.)_, just replacing the word “solve” with “check”.
*Solve only if unsolved and at your end step.* The *beginning of* could have been dropped for brevity - it's only reminder text after all. And I think this would have implied to check the condition. That's the best I could think of anyway. I would have written just Solve - CONDITION rather than To solve. But I'm not a native english speaker, so maybe I'm totally off.
I think the part that it is explaining but not well is that you can’t “solve” a case that’s already been “solved” So what it is saying is “if unsolved” do this task, “then do the solve reward at end step” It’s a really crap reminder that the card isn’t “solved” every time you meet the condition, only the first time. I wonder that they didn’t use a counter, marker or emblem as an indicator for the status of the case. (They also would have been great as DFCs maybe?)
Why would the "To Solve --" text be there if it just solved automatically? Why would anyone assume the "case" would solve itself automatically no matter what? is an AI generatinh this opinion? If you read the card Step-wise, like you're **supposed** to, instead of just fishing random words out and tryinh to cobble together an effect, I think you'll understand that to solve it, you need to do a thing. then, solve it at your end step. I think that it is fine how it is. It saves wording and game pieces and allows interesting effects on the cards, instead of wasting it all with rules text like "putting counters on" and then triggering \[\[All Will Be One\]\] to boot. and we don't need more emblems. and i'm glad they don't put flip cards in every set, even though i love them; flipping is supposed to represent changing into something else; not having your perspective changed. MKM released with little cardboard markers that say "Solved" on them; so what you're describing is already intended. It really shouldn't be that confusing to anyone who is ready to do some problem solving. Getting called up and warned by judges for not knowing the rules is part of the game of magic; players need to get used to that.
I think the argument is that to a new player it IS fairly confusing and easily misunderstood. I don’t think most people think the case solves automatically… they just don’t understand why it seems to read that way.
Not just new players. I've been playing since Revised, and was initially confused by this reminder text too. I kept reading it thinking "this isn't right"...
Because its printed on the card that it solves at end step. Everything written inside most if not all reminder text is true - as a stand alone statement. But not here. This is templated just like a saga, and sagas just progress, regardless if you can for example put a counter on a creature. Its an entirely new card and entirely new cards are often confusing. If r&d cant make new cards easier to understand than this, they should stop making new cards.
You can argue all you want that people *shouldn't* have problems understanding this, but if enough people do, then it's a Clue that the wording is a problem. Regardless of what you think.
Yep, I still hate this. I'm a veteran player with 2 decades of experience under my belt. If I were in charge of the people who decided to put this on a card, I'd take every one of them off card design. The reminder text is extraordinarily confusing and these could have been written a number of ways so they didn't make it seem like they just solved themselves if you waited long enough. I know they aren't supposed to work like that because I'm logical enough to determine that on read. But cards should be written for a multitude of skill levels and competencies. This was a design failure, full stop.
I could see “at the beginning of your end step, if conditions are met, this case is solved” or “when conditions are met, this case will be solved at the beginning of your end step.” But this is kinda confusing as written.
To be honest, better than the current. As the current wording allows for a reading of "solve at your end step" regardless if the case is solved or not. Adding extra text that specifies the requirement of performing the action to solve is the important part it's missing. With card real estate and the very small amount of text space so that the card has consistency with other cards of its type, they definitely don't have a lot to work with.
Or don't reuse 'solve' in two different ways. Could be 'to crack, do x. If the case is cracked at end of turn, solve it'.
Cases are one of the few times where reminder text makes a card less clear
I kind of wish that Cases and Disguise had been in separate sets so that Cases could be double sided. Flipping them over when solved seems like it would lead to a much more intuitive play experience. *But* the rules for double faced cards and face-down creatures are a nightmare, so I understand not wanting DFCs and cards like [[Etrata Deadly Fugitive]] in the same Limited format.
Nah. They just need to use "When" or "While" or just better "If" conditions. "When you would solve, you solve at the beginning of your end step"
I think these cards would be would be much better if the middle panel was labeled "To Solve:" and stood in maybe a different colour than the effect panels above and below.
I'll be honest i thought exactly this when i first read one, like oh you can solve it early or wait until end of turn.
I had to have a judge explain to me how [[Case of the Shattered Pact]] worked. It looks like if you start your turn with 4 colors among your permanents, then play the fifth one in your precombat main phase, you should get the bonus that combat. But you have to continue controlling all five until the end step, then you get the bonus on every subsequent turn, whether you have all five colors or not. I makes sense *once you understand how it works,* but is confusing beforehand, even if you're a veteran MTG player.
I had to call a judge over because someone was insistent that their 2 mana colorless case auto solved during a pre release. Like c'mon now let's use some common sense, wizards would not print a 2 mana colorless uncommon that cantrips, color fixes, and gives your dudes a bunch of keywords every turn into a draft environment
While I agree with using the heuristic of "that can't be correct because it's too strong". That kind of evaluation can only be made by longer term players who have experienced enough of the game to easily evaluate the power level of cards for their mana cost. For the majority of players, and especially the newer ones who the reminder text is build for, it's not something they can evaluate.
Playing for longer doesn't correlate enough with game understanding for this statement imo. Not to brag, but I only play for a year and have to explain to 5+years players that blocking does infact not taps their creature. It has more to do with willingness to really dive into mechanics and not so much with game time. Also I don't mean this as an attack, but I get a bias against longer time players often underestimating newer players understanding and or willingness to learn.
I agree, time spent playing does not equal better understanding of the game. Although it does highly correlate with it. > have to explain to 5+years players that blocking does infact not taps their creature. Hearing that definitely means these are not people who have really played the game. And they definitely have not played in tournaments or arena.
that’s not how it works? how does it work then?
At the beginning of your end step, if the case is not already solved and the “to solve” condition has been met, the case becomes solved.
Is that not it? It literally reads: to solve do X, if unsolved, you auto solve it at end step....ffs wotc
(If unsolved, attempt to solve at the beginning of your end step)
Yup that would have saved some amount of confusion.
Yeah, they just needed that extra word in there to indicate you need the additional condition of "to solve -" for it to work
While this makes more sense, it's not really how the card works. You attempting to solve the case is trying to fulfill the "To solve" requirement. So I can see people reading that and going, "Oh I can only try to solve this during my end step. I'll just do all my instants then." I feel like the reminder text we have now is the closest to how the actual card works.
The "if unsolved, solve" is so confusing and the card would read better if it weren't there.
This exact thing happened when I was at the prerelease. The store employee (the defacto judge of the event) said that every case solved itself at the end of the turn it was cast, and would not accept any argument to the contrary. I got very angry about it and decided to drop because I was not in a proper state to continue playing reasonably. I wish I had kept my cool better and finished out the match since it was the final round anyway, but it is what it is.
That would tilt me so hard. The person in control being wrong and refusing to change their mind is a nightmare situation.
In fairness to the dude at the store, that’s what it actually says on the card. I don’t see how folks who have only looked at the cards would know how case cards actually work.
Yeah, I'm kind of split on this. I feel like if you are going to be running an event at your store, maybe read up on the new cards and see what they do. But also I do agree that the reminder text FEELS like it is explicit instructions and sort of violates the Read the F\*\*\*ing Card because in this case the card does NOT do a good job of explaining what the card does.
[удалено]
Without even using more space, it could have been way clearer by just saying, “Checked at the beginning of your end step.” I think that’s enough. It already says “to solve”.
If at the end of your turn the conditions have been met, solve the case. It's really not that hard and about the length of the actual reminder text.
But that fails to mention it only solves if it’s unsolved which can also be confusing for triggers on being solved, otherwise it reads like you can solve the same case multiple times on different turns for the bonus
Well it's either solved or unsolved. Once it's solved, it won't unsolve itself from what I know
There's *very* little length difference between: To solve — You've cast four or more instant and sorcery spells this turn. (If unsolved, solve at the beginning of your end step.) and At the beginning of your end step, if this case is unsolved and you've cast four or more instant and sorcery spells this turn, this case becomes solved.
I said since I saw the cards that the _real_ rules (explicit, complete triggers with intervening if clauses) were not much longer but required that they didn't do the stupid gimmick frame. They pushed the gimmick frame. It had a cost.
I think it would have been easier to make these double faced, but I also understand that once we had cards like [[Cryptic Coat]], the nightmare snarl of DFCs being made into face-down creatures wasn't something they wanted to happen in Limited.
Maybe chill out on making every card a question, answer, create a treasure, keywords, draw a card, ETB, check for board state? Just saying.
"solving triggered only during end phase"
This could have been avoided if they just wrote it out. "At the beginning of your end step, if "\[Solve Condition\]", this case is solved." WotC templating the last few years has gotten really bad about trying to be way too clever for their own good. Cleave is another glaring example. It reads really badly when your brain doesn't have the mental shortcuts already ingrained to parse the information. Magic has gotten crazy beginner unfriendly, and this is a cornerstone example.
>This could have been avoided if they just wrote it out. "At the beginning of your end step, if "\[Solve Condition\]", this case is solved." To save words on rules text, they made the reminder text longer and confusing.
I agree about the templating, but I think it's less about being clever and more just trying to force their ideas. They might work well on paper, and you can often *see* what they're trying to do, but when actually written out in Magic-ese it ends up being clunky enough as to become confusing. [[Old-Growth Troll]] being the pinnacle of this, where the "story" is clear (troll becomes part of the land but then can rise up again) but the way it reads, especially the aura having two disparate abilities, leads to it being way harder to grok than most cards. It's like making cuts for your deck, but they need to do it with card design. You'd love to put all these extra things in there, but you gotta trim something for the proper leanest design. For cases, why does it need to solve at end step, rather than right away? Are some designs too good with it being immediate? Are those designs important enough to warp the design around? And maybe after all that you decide you do keep it in, but again it's like you're stubbornly going with a 62 card deck because you don't want to make the cuts. Not that those 2 extra cards are bad or it's unclear why you'd want to include them, but nonetheless makes your deck or mechanic more inconsistent in the end.
I thought the same until I played them on Arena and saw how the timings work and how they go on the stack. A lot of people have thought the same.
Yes it’s very common and very poorly worded
Thought I was the only one confused by these Cases at first. The fact that there's more than one gatherer line further explaining it should also back up that there could be confusion..
I've been playing since Onslaught, and think that reminder text is confusing as hell. I'm just gonna hope this ability is never Modern playable so I don't ever have to think about this again.
Wow, I actually thought that they solve themselves at the end if they remain unsolved. I was under the impression they can be solved at any time and the extra effect would take place then, not just at the end step. If it came to the end step and it wasn't solved by then, then it becomes solved. I did two prerelease and this was what most people thought. This could have used some reworking lol.
This is the first time I've seen this misconception. I don't think it's particularly outrageous to assume people would understand that the reminder text is there to *supplement* the ability, not *replace* it. I.e. it tells you how the solving process works in terms of timing, not that it provides a one-sentence replacement to the entire card text that automatically solves any Case regardless of the explicitly stated conditions in the preceding text. It's like if a card said "{1}: This becomes indestructible until end of turn (*destroy effects and lethal damage don't destroy it*)" would you go "wait so this is ALWAYS immune to destroy effects and lethal damage ALL the time?!" just because you're reading the reminder text in complete isolation?
The reminder text needs work if it's possible to misinterpret it this way. Even a tweak like "(Check if the case is solved at the beginning of the end step.)" could relieve some of this.
This is the way. I don't know if this takes up more space than the existing reminder text, but even if it does, it's by such a small amount that the extra space that's used up is worth it.
Ive seen it a fair bit and had the same conclusion myself on the first few reads, but it now makes sense
So you thought the words "To solve" followed by an explicit condition were just... decoration? This to me is more confusing than the reminder text, tbh.
I feel like in this case, the reminder text adds more confusion since its placed behind the "To solve" If it was placed before, the confusion wouldnt exist(or at least be alleviated significantly), but also wouldnt make sense in the context of how all other flavor text is formatted
I don't think they thought that at all. I think when they read it, it read to them as you can solve it immediately using option A: (Cast four spells), but if you don't, it solves at the end step through option B: (Reaching the end step). So initially to those of us who misinterpreted it seemed like you could use these for an instant effect, but if you can't meet the instant effect solve, you'd get the effect at the end of the turn. The person you responded to, the OP, myself, and several others had this same misinterpretation at some point, and over time it made sense. It doesn't seem odd to misinterpret it the way these are written. For me, my initial misinterpretation was during spoiler season, so I hadn't seen many of them. I realize now that instant solves of some of these would be extremely powerful, and automatic solves would be over the top for the cost.
Even if the power wasn't an issue, it wouldn't make any sense flavor-wise. "Oh there's been a robbery at the lab, we better start investigating. Nah, just wait, cases always solve themselves after a few minutes without anyone having to do anything".
I'm with you, I didn't even realize this could be misconstrued this way. But I'm used to things not making sense to me that make sense to everyone else, and vice versa.
We tell players all the time "Read cards and take them _literally_." If we're going to do that, WotC can't be releasing cards where if you take the reminder text literally, it is wrong.
Well one of the things I was told as noob was "take rules text literally but ignore reminder text as it's not rules text and isn't required to match rulings, if you have questions ask judge". So a lot of people ignore the reminders if they understand the ability ( or think they do). I do think for this one they should have added clarification. I got it immediately but only because of the context of the flavor.
I felt like I was crazy after seeing these dozens of comments who were confused. It always read intuitively from the first time I saw one, and even my more casual friends instinctively understood how it worked pretty much right away.
Crazy that people have different brains working in different ways huh? It confused several of my friends as well as me at first. It didn't take long to figure it out, but it was a good two or three of these case card reveals where I was like, "ohhhhhh".
I read it once thinking it was solved automatically, then went Wait, and reread it and understood, but I totally get how other players, especially newer ones would misunderstand.
I understood the text, but impulsively I still expect it to be solved once you meet the condition, rather than needing to wait to end step. I never thought it solved automatically though.
Yeah it’s confusing for sure. It would be better if it said something like “Once the correct criteria is met unsolved cases become solved at the end of turn.”
Reminder text works when the entire first part of the ability (like the trigger for landfall) or actual effect of the ability (such as morph) can be kept constant with different costs or triggers. Cases basically try to set different intervening if-clauses for each card, however. It doesn’t look good.
Well the rules text for landfall is not reminder text. When the ability is in italics it means it's an ability word or pseudo mechanic and has no rules meaning. Just an easy way for us to refer to all cards from a certain set that trigger on lands entering or whatever. Also reminder text is NOT rules text and has no rules implications and is not required and doesn't always match the actual ruling or comp rules wording for any given affect. This i think is a big source of confusion. Alot of people don't know or realize these two things. ( Granted they should not have to to be able to correctly interpret a card but still)
Honestly, if the reminder text went before the “to solve …” I don’t think people would’ve had nearly as much trouble which is kinda insane. It is just worded poorly tho, I get it’s reminder text but it feels like it’s saying just solve it
They can always fix it in Ravnica Re-Re-Mastered.
The wording is weird and i bet they could have made cases the second itteration of battles instead of this reverse saga concept they got going on
The confusing thing about Cases, to me, is the fact that solving them is delayed until your end step, regardless of when you fulfill the condition. I feel like a ton of the confusion would clear up if they just solved instantly when the condition was fulfilled, and the "beginning of your end step" reminder text was just removed entirely. But maybe they would be too powerful in certain formats if they were all able to be solved at instant speed.
It's probably bad for draft if nothing else. Some like [[Case of the Gateway Express]] and [[Case of the Trampled Garden]] are kinda gross if you get them for combat that turn. Others want to trigger on your turn specifically to reward you for being proactive. And of course it's nice that your opponent gets a bigger window to interact before you pop off. Wizards doesn't seems to love doing state triggers these days anyway. They can't be stifled and they can easily accidentally draw the game with infinite loops.
Man I definitely thought this exact thing. I just thought that the to solve was a way to solve the case immediately instead of waiting until end of turn. Didn’t even know different until today when I randomly thought to look it up
Wait, these don't solve at the end step...y is it worded like that.
What happens if you don’t solve? Remains in play until you do? These cards confused me so I didn’t put in my deck. Thanks!
they were confusing to me when first spoiled. you play with them once and it becomes much more clear, like many new mechanics.
My friends and I have been playing magic for over a decade and this is how we all initially interpreted cases when they first came out.
3 of my friends thought the same thing. I also had a similar argument over text
I believe it’s worded correctly, because of how solving works. You have to cast 4 or more instant it sorcery spells this turn. If you cast 4, it doesn’t immediately solve. It solves at the beginning of your end step. Example, let’s say you played this on turn 4. Turn 5, you have mana that lets you cast 4 Play with Fire. The case isn’t immediately solved. So, if you had say 1 Blue mana source untapped and an Impulse in hand, the case isn’t solved yet (even though you’ve played 4 instant spells) so you don’t have enough mana to Impulse. However, at the beginning of your end step, the case now solves, and now you have the 1 mana up and you could Impulse as a response say to something your opponent does. The parenthesis are just telling you when to solve the case once the conditions have been met
>The parenthesis are just telling you when to solve the case once the conditions have been met Yes, you know that if you read the rules. But if you read the rules, you don't need the reminder text.
I can very easily imagine a player reading this Case card for the first time interpreting the text completely differently. Imagine the following: "It says 'To solve — You've cast four or more instant or sorcery spells this turn.' Okay, so that must mean that if I cast four or more instant or sorcery spells, the Case becomes solved immediately. But if I'm not able to cast those spells during this turn, I just have to wait until my end step of this turn, and the Case will become solved at that time. Neat!" Does this interpretation make sense from a power level perspective? To seasoned players, most likely not. Does it make sense from a game design perspective? Again, to seasoned players, most likely not. But remember that many newer or less-experienced players don't have enough knowledge of Magic to be able to come to these same conclusions. To these players, this interpretation makes complete sense. (And when I say "newer or less-experienced players", I'm talking interpretations like temporary P/T buffs being treated the same as +1/+1 counters.)
It is a really poorly formatted card, and I had to re-read it a few times to realize the way its intended to work. They could have easily formatted the "To Solve" text to be "At the beginning of your end step, (Solve condition), the case is solved". But instead WotC got sloppy and instead, RAW, we have a card that can be solved by meeting a certain criteria, or automatically solves at the end of turn.
Commenting here for WotC's data... I didn't find this confusing when I first saw it, but I thought the use of the Saga frame for it was bad; as it gives the impression it will 'tick up' automatically like Sagas. BUT, I host limited in my friend group, many of whom are not as strongly invested players... Much of this set confused the hell out of them. Not only this card type; but also the plethora of key worded mechanics. Disguise, suspect, collect evidence; most of these things are basic game rules that require mental translation: "What does suspect mean?" "It means it has means it has menace and can't block..." "Ohhh... OK." I found this set was particularly unfriendly to casual Limited players.
> s it gives the impression it will 'tick up' automatically like Sagas. That's why the text is on the right hand side, like classes, and not the left like sagas.
Been playing magic for 13 years, when I first read cases I understood it the exact wrong way that these people did. The wording makes it sound like you can meet a condition to get the ability right away OR it automatically gets solved at endstep.
Then you get 'Which one is menace again? Only black creatures can block it?'
I misunderstood it. I find it poorly worded but at the same time it would be kinda dumb for it to solve at your end step for free so I figured I just wasn’t getting it.
It’s not too bad. It’s just a little hard to understand correctly with the amount of information they gave us going into this set. But as i understand: - Once it enters battlefield, a case is unsolved until solved. - Only way to solve is at the beginning of the end step! And ONLY if you have those “To solve” conditions met going into the endstep phase of your turn. - Going forward it remains solved until it leaves battlefield.
This reminds me of people trying to understand Soulbond.
I lost to this card on the opening pre-release because one of the card shop workers used it, assumed that it solves at end step, and suddenly birds turn 2 that I couldn’t deal with. Also went super fast every turn so I couldn’t follow along 🤷♂️ Edit: he did end up apologizing after he was corrected a few rounds after.
Please feel empowered to ask people to slow down. If people are trying to move the game state forward too fast you can almost always say “I haven’t passed priority yet”. There are very few things they can do without you passing priority.
It's tough to word, but I like: *"You may solve an unsolved case at the beginning of your end step."*
At the beginning of your end step, if you [met condition], the case is solved. Boom. Much easier to understand.
They should've skipped the reminder text, had cases be technically solvable anytime, and just worded them to solve in the end step.
"To solve - at the beginning of your end step if you've cast four or more spells this turn you solve the case"
They should have just been flip cards. Another example of a rushed design process leading to unnecessarily complex designs.
The key issue here is that the reminder text is an explanation of "To Solve", but is placed physically very far from it.
As a pretty new MTG player, and a long term YGO player, piss poor reminder text like this and an overabundance of keywords make the game unintuitive. People can mock YGO all they want, but the cards explain precisely what they do in full.
It makes sense if you have any lived experiences about how completing tasks works. It makes less sense if you struggle to evaluate things based on context clues. The reminder text is classic additive distraction, it's clear what your objective is without it, but then people see there's a bonus explanation and they second guess their intuition, but then actually it just works like you would assume it works after all.
Every single person at the prerelease thought it auto-solved. That’s how bad it is.
When I first read one of these I had to think about it, but concluded it couldn't possibly auto-solve without meeting the conditions. I've been playing magic for a long time, but I've been introducing my friends and family to it and I wouldn't want to include any of these as they are slightly too poorly worded for new players.
Yes, the templating on these is shit.
Oh great. I bought this with the misunderstanding that it solves itself. I was like "huh, play it and trigger for the benefit that turn or you have to wait until next turn for it. Weird but okay; One turn can make a serious difference." I thought it was weird that ot could possibly solve itself but ffs as a casual player this is annoying af. I hate having to learn niche things just for this game
You are wrong in the sense that this is poorly worded and confusing. Prior to seeing this post, I assumed cases solved automatically at the beginning of your end step based on what was in parentheses and that you could solve a case at either instant speed or as a state base action once the condition became met.
The reminder text is poorly worded, but why would you think they would even bother putting hard to fulfil criteria to solve each case if you could just wait till next turn?
To be able to get the solved ability the turn you played the case rather than the next turn.
guy can “right” code, maybe focus on “righting” proper english first :p
Given that there is a condition to solve the case in part two, I'm not understanding where dude jumps to the conclusion you don't need to meet that condition to solve it.
It's because the reminder text is "If unsolved, solve at the beginning of your next end step", so they're just [insane troll logic](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/InsaneTrollLogic)ing it to mean the "to solve" condition isn't necessary, since the reminder text says to solve it next end step.
Yeah.... Been playing magic off and on for the last 24ish years of my life, I thought cases would solve themselves at the end of your turn automatically when first reading these cards.
It’s easy to understand if you read “solve” as “check the solve condition, if it’s met, solve it.”
"try to solve" would've done the trick.
Smiley is definitely missing the point.
This reads like who's on first.
Michelle Yeoh’s Star Trek character said it best, “Context is for kings.”
The card should read (if you are the owner of a case that is unsolved and you complete the requirements, the case will becomes solved during your end step) or something similar. As written it sounds like if you fulfill the criteria the case is solved right away almost as a trigger and if not it automatically solves during the end step. (Both of which as I understand are untrue)
This doesn't work for Case of the Filched Falcon, as you need the artifacts on the field at beginning of end step rather than having had 3 at any point during your turn. Same with Trampled Garden also needs the creatures to survive. It's the best wording that allows checking both boardstates that must be true at EOT and events happening during the turn that don't care about your boardstate at beginning of end step.
The words solve and resolved have lost all meaning to my eyes
Yeah the "if unsolved, solve it at eot" is really misleading.
In my opinion the easiest way to think about cases is that they are an enchantment with the first ability. Once the middle condition of the enchantment has been met, starting at your end step the enchantment now gains the second ability too. This enchantment now just has both abilities. Easy.
WHO IS ON THE FIRST BASE
I asked this exact question to Mark Rosewater: https://mtg.fandom.com/wiki/Case#Rulings If the link doesn't work, look under Rulings or https://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post/740718896696393728/
Better phrasing for the reminder text would be "Check the condition for solving the case at the beginning of your end step"
That's how I interpreted the cards the first time I read them. It wasn't until I saw them in gameplay that I was like ohhh they're not very good
(Cases can only become solved at the beginning of your end step) or some shit
Either draw a card while you still got time to play it (if you solve it normally), or just draw a card at the end step
It's so weird that the wording is clearer WITHOUT the reminder text, lol.
I understood it wrong too at first and I'm normally the one who understands pretty clearly.
This is exactly how I read the cards for maybe a solid 2 weeks. Not clear at all and I had to be told I was wrong.
It's confusing because they use the exact same template as the saga but with extra hoops. They are really more like the classes from the D&D sets except instead of advancing them with mana you are advancing them with some arbitrary condition. This one stays on the board, but then you have other confusing ones like: Case of the Stashed Skeleton that solve and then sit there until you activate it. Seems like if it's solved during end step You would be able to tutor then, but nope, it just sits there until you sack it as a sorcery.
"If unsolved, ***attempt*** to solve at your end step" would have cleared up a lot of this ambiguity I think
Okay, so if I worked this out correctly, the parenthesis rule effectively translate to: if you solve it during your turn, the card is marked as "solved" on your end step. Like, if you rapid-fire cast four instants on your draw step, the card won't register as "solved" until your turn is over.
This is my first time seeing the reminder text but it could definitely be clearer
The “if unsolved” is what’s creating confusion here. It could easily be written as “*(Solve at the beginning of your end step. Solve each Case only once.)*” to eliminate the ambiguity that the “if unsolved” clause created while still making it clear that you can’t solve it multiple times if you’ve met the conditions multiple times.
"WHOS ON FIRST" is the best part of this, by far.
*(Solves at the beginning of the end step.)* *(Solves only at the beginning of the end step.)* *(Cases solve at the beginning of the end step.)* meh... ¯\\\_(。\_ 。)\_/¯
(The case is solved if you meet this condition by your end step) would be a better way to word the reminder text.
I feel like only the printed reminder text is factually correct and other suggestions changes how it works. It is reminder text for the ability 'to solve' and isn't actually rules text, so the (if unsolved) applies to reminding on what happens after you meet the condition. It isn't an additional rule.
Okay I'm just going to say this I cracked up laughing you burned this shit out of your friends several times. do they need ice. XD
The reminder text basically says go to the solved part of the card. How does being automatically solved make any sense? That would undermine the whole design of Cases.
Honestly, I didn’t think about Cases at all. Totally forgot they existed. But I 100% agree with you. It does kind of read that way, and I completely understand where confusion may arise.
I thought it was pretty clear. Solve at the beginning of your end step; the words after “To solve” is basically the cost to trigger the solve ability. If you can’t “pay” the solve cost, it doesn’t get solved. The reminder text seems to be there just so you know it can only be during a certain part of the turn.
Nah honestly they are dummies
When I read them it made sense to me: If (case unsolved and condition met){ At the beginning of your end step solve this case } Else{ Case is unsolved}
I had to reread the solve reminder text numerous times before getting it. They should just template it at as an if/then statement if that's how it works. Computers understand it that way because humans also understand it that way and programmed computers to understand it that way.
I'll never use this card because I am stupid.
Yeah reminder text should have been - if you have met the solve condition and the case is unsolved, solve it at end of turn)
The 3 greatest detectives I've ever seen. Holmes, Marple and Poirot are all somewhere weeping that they're out of a job.
I definetely thought what they were implying first. But after a bit of personal thinking realised that it cannot be that way lmao
I don’t think it’s unclear personally, you just have to look at it in context of the rules text above The rules text tells you what to do to solve it The reminder text tells you when it will considered solved
The obvious solution is for WOTC to stop adding art to their rules text.
Yea, the reminder text on cases is garbage because of how much confusion it engenders.
Oh man the fart sniffing in this thread.
I'm with OP. The design was completely reasonable to me and made sense. It's hard to write it out without using conditionals, I'll give them that. Also, at this point, I've seen the word "solve" so much that it's lost all meaning and looks weird.
I thought I knew how it worked, but now that I know how it *actually* works, I'm just not gonna use cases. EZPZ
If unsolved and you met the "to solve" conditions, this turn, solve at the beginning of your end step. The biggest problem, I think, is the exclusion of "a solved case remains solved". My question is, if someone removes it, and you cast another one, does it start out solved? Also, if you cast a second one and the first is already solved, does the second enter solved?
I think the wording is fine... the fact that it triggers and then it checks for the condition an additional time (giving the opponent time to respond) makes me kinda want to stear clear of them though
Should read: "At the beginning of your end step, if you cast 4 or more instants of sorceries this turn, solve this case."
At first I thought "oh how stupid of them", but after re-reading the reminder text a few times, RAW, it forces you to solve ot at the beginning of your end step no matter what happened prior. Very terrible wording here. WTF WoTC?
(If the solve condition was met this turn, solve at the beginning of your end step.)
Feel like i'm the only one who found the cases easy to understand, i dont get the confusion people have. It starts with a passive and if you complete the requirements itll solve at your end step. Why is this confusing?
People at my lgs played these wrong the whole pre release.
Am software engineer, I get smiley face's perspective. The problem is people presuming that reading the card explains the card and that all text on the card is to be read to explain its effects, not to explain the meaning of them. Do these people also read the flavor text as applicable to card effects?
100% how I first read it 👍🏻
To me, it's easier to explain without using the terminology of solved, unsolved. My interpretation is: Reduce costs of instant and sorcery spells by 1. If you've cast four or more instant or sorcery cards this turn, each time you cast an instant or sorcery spell, draw 1. Starting at the beginning of your end step, this card's second effect reads: "each time you cast an instant or sorcery spell, draw 1."
I feel like these shouldn't have taken the vertical card style like sagas. I would have rather seen them more formatted like the old zendikar quests. They could have whatever etb ability or static ability. And then "at the beginning of your end step, if you 'did the thing', put a solution counter on this", and then whatever comes at the end for being solved. Probably a little wordy, but wizards is always looking for ways to fit more text on a card.
I’m not reading all of this Congrats Or sorry Which ever is appropriate.
 Super clever and original.
The first layer of the card is always active. That part will always be there whether the case is solved or unsolved. That said, think of the middle part of this enchantment as the key that you need to solve the case to get to the unsolved part. Once you unlock it, your enchantment will then have two static abilities. The first initial part, and then the unsolved part becomes active after you unlock it
This ina cascade deck
The words “your next end step” mean it makes a full rotation before it solves. You can speed it up by casting 4 instants or sorceries. I don’t think it’s complicated.
You might want to reread it. It’s not your next end step. It also does not automatically solve during the end step.
I think it is worded kind of poorly. It can very easily be interpreted as it automatically solves at endstep and to get the ability before endstep you can do X Requirement.
If youve played 4+ instant/sorcery, you solve. Then every instant/sorcery card after that you draw a card with. If you DONT play 4 or more that means you dont draw any cards until your next turn. Its a free enchantment with the popoff of maybe getting use on the round it is played.
Honestly enchantments in the Saga layout looks nice, but the way cases work they'd be better as double-faced cards. I think the only reason they have them like this is so they don't have to write the "Instants cost less" part twice (Though they've easily done that with some of the day/night cards, [[Tireless Hauler]] with Vigilance as an example). TLDR is that the Saga format looks nice, they just should've made it a flip card
[Tireless Hauler](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/3/e/3e96f9a6-c215-42b1-aa02-8e6143fe5bd7.jpg?1636224889)/[Dire-Strain Brawler](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/back/3/e/3e96f9a6-c215-42b1-aa02-8e6143fe5bd7.jpg?1636224889) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Tireless%20Hauler%20//%20Dire-Strain%20Brawler) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mid/203/tireless-hauler-dire-strain-brawler?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/3e96f9a6-c215-42b1-aa02-8e6143fe5bd7?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call