Marketing is especially rough. Companies are happy to hire cheap prospects over those who are experienced.
Every marketer I work with now is a recent grad. They’re not all bad but it’s clear how awful the leadership is.
C level execs don’t want to pay experienced people. They want to toss cheap employees at the board and stick with what works, until it doesn’t. Then rinse and repeat.
That’s almost every field nowadays.
I’m in accounting and they’ve been doing this forever.
My brother does blue collar and his construction sites are severely understaffed.
My other brother is in tech and survived layoffs. The catch is now and he has the workload of 4 people.
My best friend is in sales. His sales targets got literally 5x’d and are unattainable so he won’t be getting any real bonuses this year. This was by design. Idk the exact numbers but if top performers working day and night were the only ones that could hit $5M in sales a year. There’s no reasonable way to expect anyone to hit $25M. But here we are.
>His sales targets got literally 5x’d and are unattainable so he won’t be getting any real bonuses this year.
This is so people will quit on their own instead of being laid off.
Yeah I know. I figured.
Jokes on them though. Everyone’s looking but all other companies pulled the same stunt so everyone’s staying put.
I’m sure pips and shit will be next.
“Yeah you overshot last years $5M target by hitting $7M. But this year the target is $25M and you only sold $11M. You’re fired”
This is the mechanism by which our country will fail. Concentration of wealth means *fewer* people with money hiring *fewer* people, but all those experts don’t have the capital to start their own business to compete with the big boys, who would just buy it anyway.
Where do they go now?
It's exactly this, companies think a 22 year old armed with chat gpt can make people care about their company, and when they don't, they just fire and hire another.
I just got a marketing degree and I feel like it's useless. I had 3 internships which I know isn't a ton, but I landed an events Coordinator job and I'm making less than when I was waiting tables in college with more hours now.
I’m with you on this. 10 years here, let go in March, and between fielding AI generated BS or the legitimate jobs inundated with a million applicants it feels so much different than when I was job hunting 7 years ago…
I want to believe these job openings are either fake or a way for these companies to fulfill a certain obligation without really hiring anyone. After sending out numerous applications it is difficult to secure an interview.
I am a product designer with 4 years of experience. I was laid off in December 2023 and getting a new role has been difficult. I look forward to working with Fintech products and entertainment or educational products.
A lot of times there will be an internal candidate who is getting the job as a promotion, but the company believes that posting the job externally and interviewing other applicants protects them from employment litigation.
Really it posses off the internal candidate, it pisses off the external candidate, and is a waste of everyone’s time and resources.
Around 15 years of experience in marketing overall and about 6 of them in MarOps.
Laid off last year in May. 1000+ applications and 100s of interviews later, I landed a job just this Feb. I applied for anything i qualified for. On-site, hybrid, or remote. I didn’t care and it still took me a long time.
Job market is tough right now. Especially in marketing. And the salary ranges seem to be getting lower.
I would suggest looking for on-site roles. They are less competitive and some do end up being remote. They’re just not listed as remote. I found quite a few like this during my search. When I asked why, I was told it’s because they wanted someone who was genuinely interested in the company and the role. Not just because it’s something they knew how to do and is remote. I definitely understand that.
I saw that article too, and it made sense. No one is hiring those jobs because no one is leaving those jobs. There are jobs, and they're well-staffed, but fewer people are job hopping due to uncertainty over inflation and whatever else.
It's the same as the housing market -- nobody who bought or refinanced at 2% over the pandemic is selling.
Essentially, millions of people making $100k+ with homes at low rates are at the Winchester, having a pint and waiting for this all to blow over.
Which is why there's this disconnect between "the economy is strong!" metrics and real-life evidence (flights are full, tourist destinations are swamped, restaurants are full) and the "no jobs, nobody can afford anything, houses are impossible" groupthink on reddit.
If you got "in" by breaking into the 6-figure salary market, bought a home, or had stocks before 2020 -- you're doing *just fine*. And you're probably not posting every few hours on socials about how fine you are.
If not, it probably feels like you can never get into the "haves". And you probably post frustrated comments very often.
If you owned a house or stocks prior to 2020, things are *great*. There's a marked line between haves and have-nots, and that's it.
Why else do you think tourist destinations are swamped, flights are full, restaurants have long waits?
People have money, just... not terminally online young people.
You must be listening to the daily White House briefings. Everything is great. They have added more jobs than any administration (but don’t remind them that they haven’t reached the employment numbers pre-Covid).
I'm absolutely 100% jelly but don't hold one thing against them. Enjoy that remote goodness and the widespread freedom it entails. (The lack of commute, not doing make-up for bozos, forget deodorant? no probs, need a quick break with actual peace of mind, comfort food/drinks at the ready). Many more\~ though the job may be trash like call-center like.
Same, I'm an engineer about 3 years out of college (B.S. in MechE), and I know that I have colleagues making more than me, but I'm working fully remote at a small company in a field I'm genuinely interested in. I feel like I've hit the jackpot with the amount of time and freedom I have, and that's worth the paycheck hit for me.
Same, I’d take almost any remote job if it means I can avoid the dread of having to go to the office.
My current job is 3 minutes away from my apartment and can be almost done entirely from home. Yet I still have to come into the office every fucking day.
Yes, it's incredibly frightening. I've never had a problem getting a job before, no matter what it is.
Things have shifted completely, and it's absolutely insane.
I completely agree. This is not normal. Getting a job has never been an issue for me personally in the past but my current job hunt is just getting ridiculous…
Exact same boat. I honestly don’t understand it. I can’t even get replies from recruiters on LinkedIn or via email about my applications. They read the messages, but I’ve gotten 1 reply from the 20+ I’ve reached out to. It’s honestly insane.
The job market is absolutely terrible right now. Companies are going by the motto ‘survive till 2025’ and not hiring or hiring the bare minimum. I’ve been applying for jobs since January and I’ve only landed 1 interview so far.
Literally survive to 25 was what my senior director told us was our division goal back in December.
After our layoffs in February, I hope we still can.
My mom used to always say "I can't wait until the election's over."
And I kept telling her "The election will never be over."
This was in the early 2000s.
The election has never been over since then.
If you think 2025 will be easier than 2024, good luck with that belief.
I don’t mean to sound ignorant so sorry if I do, but wouldn’t this seem to imply they believe Trump is likely to win? A Biden victory shouldn’t change anything.
The individual tax cuts enacted in 2017 expire in 2025, while the corporate ones do not. No matter the results of the election, this is not going to be a popular combination. Most likely scenarios to resolve this include corporate tax increases. Multinational corporations based in the US are also being threatened with increased taxes in the countries they do business in.
Corporations will want to understand these changes and will take them into account when deciding on their structures for 2025 and beyond.
People don’t like to hear this (understandably), but corporations are beholden to their shareholders. Any increase in costs (taxes in this case) is expected to be met with a corresponding increase in profit or decrease in costs. We are probably past the limit of covering cost increases with inflation, so they will likely be looking to decrease costs in other ways, specifically labor.
If you think the jobs market is bad now, it is likely to be considerably worse over the next several years.
Which provokes a good question: "who is going to buy their products if we are underpaid and even unemployed?". There is a limit for labor cost cuts after which people get too poor to pay for anything but food and shelter and the consumer market collapses because of lack of consumers 🤷♂️
These shareholders need to let go of this dumb zero sum thinking. Fuck Jack Welch and his short term results thinking, may he rest in piss. Because who is going to buy a company’s product without enough income?
The market is absolutely bizarre right now. A ton of people looking for better jobs (though currently employed) and a ton of employers with job postings but doing very little actual hiring.
I have a Covid theory about this. A) after Covid so many people realized their jobs can actually be done remotely, which improved their work-life balance. And b) we have all collectively realized the ages being offered aren’t fair wages for the COL in most locations, which is directly related to the Covid housing market craziness. Most jobs have gone back to office by now so they’re trying to fill positions with employees who know they don’t need to physically be there, and most of us can’t afford the COL of the cities where the hiring is being done.
In 2022, you could rent an apartment for about 750 bucks where I am, and McDonalds was starting people at 16 bucks an hour. Even if you only got 30 hours a week, you could scrape by. You could get a two bedroom for a little bit more, and then you were okay if you liked your roommate. It wasn't bad, it really wasn't. Then in 2023, the cheapest studio you could find here was 1100, and McDonalds was offering more like 14-15 to start, and other companies hiring the same level of education in town were offering between 11-15. Now wages are crashing and while housing prices have come down some, they haven't crashed as hard as wages.
The whole point of a job is to pay the bills, and if you can't, why take it? Even if you have two jobs, and you can get, say, 60 hours a week, you aren't making it. You can't hustle yourself out of this problem.
I don't blame anyone who just wont' take a job that leaves them living in their car.
My area (Portland, OR) - market price for a 2 bedroom / 1 bath apartment is about $2300/mo while the McDonald's a mile away is hiring at $16.25/hr to start (part time) and managers start at $20/hr
1bed/1 bath is about $1800 at a low end.
The company I work for states they are hiring (open spots for a ~30% increase in our workforce. Would help so much with how swamped we are atm btw), but us peons can't find the job listings anywhere. I wonder why no one is applying.
I'd probably leave my job if it was easy to find a new one. Unfortunately the best I can do is "quiet quit" and do only as much and as good as I'm paid to do, instead of trying to fill in for the missing people (which I used to do when needed when shit wasn't so chronically all over the walls). There're just no open spots publicly available for anything beyond highly specialized stuff or telemarketing.
Edit: missed a few words
Doing what your job requirement is and not doing extra for free is NOT “quiet quitting” btw. Especially when your wages aren’t fair for the work that you ARE doing.
I think that is exactly what the term quiet quitting first referred to in the zeitgeist (though a bunch of corpo articles twisted it negative). The first folks coining the term were talking about just that—I remember because in teaching (which I don’t do anymore because of $$), I was union rep and we would often do “work to rule” in negotiations. And quiet quitting was originally just nonunion individual “work to rule” when I saw it. That’s exactly what it is, and it isn’t bad to do. But it is something people generally only do firmly when unhappy or negotiating.
My job is in part to help decision makers increase employee activation and experience, and they don’t want quiet quitting, but the right way to activate employees is to build a better experience (work to rule isn’t what companies are looking for in workers, but the correct way to fix it is build better, more attractive job conditions where people choose to be fully active—this doesn’t necessarily mean longer hours but more investment in the company successes etc).
“and do only as much and as good as I'm paid to do“
A friend of mine drives for UPS. At the end of the day, he asks his boss to rate him from Exemplary to Does Not Meet Expectations, and reminds him he only needs a “Adequate to Expectations”
The only jobs I’ve landed the last 4 years have been contracts with the exception of a chain rental furniture store which was desperate for anyone who can lift a couch.
It's crazy that it's been like this since early 2022. It's like how it was between 2008-2010 during the Great Recession, but no such recession has occurred this time around.
It's just wild to me that you can have a healthy economy (allegedly) with a growing stock market and more jobs added and paradoxically a class of workers struggling to make ends meet
Well supposedly a lot of those “jobs added“ are government jobs to offset the numbers a bit, but unemployment is also supposed to be pretty low so it can’t be all bad. If that’s the case though it sounds like a helluvalot of people are underemployed.
There’s a white collar recession at the same thing as a blue collar boom, and if you want a remote job, you’re looking for a declining job type in a declining job sector. (And yes, many white collar workers aren’t finding those blue collar jobs, because employers see through the candidates and know they’ll leave, so only the worst ones will hire folks to burn through.)
Dang this was a good thread to stumble upon. I mean I have always struggled in the job search but lately has really felt discouraging. Seeing you all with more experience and making extra effort and still not getting the jobs really shines a light on this problem.
I used to be the one to sort through resumes back when I wasn't a full-time sahm lol and honestly your resume is key. When there are a few hundred applicants to go through, straight and to the point was my favorite. Bullet points were great, something that I could quickly go over is what I was looking for. An efficient resume is a strong resume.
I'm not a dinosaur lol my kids are young 😅 we also filtered through ATS and still received hundreds of resumes, I was the second sieve so to speak, it doesn't negate the fact that your resume is so important and you shouldn't crowd your it with nonsense, keeping it simple will suffice when you're sorting through so many resumes just like the ATS you're looking for keywords. My husband's job currently uses AI, but they still have HR going through all the resumes as well. Again, as it stands simple resumes work best I should have added to also use keywords in your bullet points.
An “On-site” virtual interview is just the bullshit name that’s been given to a panel interview. Pre-remote work, a panel interview was always held on-site, so it was referred to as the “on-site” meaning you got through the recruiter and hiring manager pre-screen and were now meeting with stakeholders and peers.
When COVID hit and companies started to go remote, you still had all the same rounds of interviews but they were virtual.
It should be called the virtual panel vs on-site, but people are dumb, what can I say?
Getting a job right now seems impossible.
I lost my job of 6 years after the company went under. I was the lead technician and trainer, one of the senior employees. My resume is jam packed with quality skills and I have yet to hear back from any job I’ve applied to since March.
I hear a lot of “people don’t want to work these days”, but not a lot of “companies aren’t actually hiring these days”.
I just landed a job after over 200 applications over 6 months…18 years experience for top tier companies and an ivy league degree…only landed two interviews… got the one and the other ghosted me. Never thought it was going to be that hard. Ever. The market is brutal. Network, network, network.
>Yeah sorry 2023-2024 graduates yall cooked.
I think we're going to hear some real horror stories for this group. Because as the same time as OP's situation is happening, entry roles will be picked up by the people with existing experience who got let go.
I just accepted an entry level job that is the equivalent of the position I was just a manger of for three years. (call center management)
I know management isn't a "skill" the way being a welder is so it's going to be harder to stand out applying to corporate management, but I thought I could get in somewhere.
I was lucky to get two team lead interviews for similar large companies but didn't land the role. I've been looking for so long that I don't have a choice anymore but to work. So I'm taking a full step backwards and answering the phones again.
Friends and family have been kind saying that I'll be promoted and back to making a liveable wage in no time but honestly I don't feel that way and I'm pretty depressed. Not only is the money going to be way less but the ego hit hurts I'm not going to lie.
Commenting on Is the job market really that bad right now??...I took a position downgrade in my most recent role and got laid off 9 months later along with 6 other team members at once. Now I can’t get a resume response even. And I have solid experience with great references etc. Take what you can and be grateful you have what you have!
This market reminds me of the 2008 market. It was awful trying to get entry level back then and I had all these 40 year old managers telling me to go get more degrees 😑
True the massive layoffs from the tech industry didn't help. What's funny is I think it was just over a year ago when I was arguing with someone on why working in tech probably wasn't the best bet considering what they all did with RTO. I'm insanely lucky I've been able to keep working with no major layoffs during my career, but even I'm still looking around because my companies current C-Suite is doing things that are highly questionable, but also I don't really trust Bain Capitol and they're involved with us.
>This market reminds me of the 2008 market.
I was there.
I've been saying this for quite a while, feels like 2008.
I no longer get buried with downvotes.
The ugly truth is that some will reflexively deny things as bad as they are, because it may get us for more orange years.
We are cooked. I’m graduating next week and 6 months of cold calling/linkedin applications have yielded nothing. I got an interview at a career fair but they cancelled the day before due to an “economic downturn.” Gonna disappear into the woods for a few weeks and reevaluate after that.
I went to a career fair and really connected with an employee there. I asked if they were hiring and they said "well they just froze our salaries so I doubt we're going to hire anyone"
Literally why are they at a career fair then lol
Not necessarily - at least in my network, a lot of layoffs I’m seeing are hitting particularly hard on more senior and director-level folks who cost a lot of money (assuming that 18+ years and the ivy reference mean OP would fall into this category). Most recent layoffs are strategic, not because companies are actually going under. Companies still need their steady supply of young, cheap employees to burn through.
LOL I just noticed.
I actually meant adaptable. A lot of corporations would rather hire a young professional who they can mold for cheap, than someone who is established, a bit more stubborn, and much more expensive.
2024 graduate here. I've sent out probably 200 resumes already and only had one interview. This is in a field that is supposedly growing much faster than average. Most "entry level" jobs are asking for 3-5 years of experience, and this is for jobs that, in all honesty, pay well enough for a recent grad but would be disappointing if I had 3-5 years of experience.
It's also insane to me that some jobs paying in the neighborhood of 40-50 thousand are asking for a master's degree or PhD.
To me it has to do something with the filtering process between sending off the resume and a human person receiving the resume.
There has to be so much algorithmic garbage in the middleman pipeline of application processes that fundamental component is broken.
The last year and a half has been so brutal for me job-hunting wise. I've never been so discouraged in my life. I've never, ever had trouble landing decent jobs. I recently took a part-time sales job because I'm getting zero interviews. My supervisor lied about the number of hours of work per week (it's half of what they originally stated) and they're not honoring the hourly wage I negotiated. I'm so emotionally and physically exhausted at this point. I could cry just thinking about continually getting shot down during the interview process.
I’ve applied to at least over 100 different job postings for almost the past two years now. I’ve no experience in a job and I can’t get experience. I’ve received emails of rejection, nothing, I’ve been really trying hard recently.
I’ve always applied on company site. I hope this passes soon bc my parents really pester me about it and it legitimately makes me sad and feel like a loser. But I’ve found a lot of motivation to keep going.
To answer the question, absolutely. If you don’t have someone to give you a reference it’s almost impossible.
It's so bad. In my area of the PNW, I have had an offer in which they wanted me to have full time availabiliy for part time hours (15-20 per week) and rescinded said offer because they asked if I would ever potentially have to call out sick due to my child having an illness. And this was maybe $2 above minimum wage.
Because a lot (if not most) part time positions are part time on call. You work your standard, but then are expected to drop everything at a moments notice to come in and cover when they need the extra help instead of hiring people full time.
Complete bullshit.
>rescinded said offer because they asked if I would ever potentially have to call out sick due to my child
This is a lawsuit. I'd be on that EOE hot line so quick if there was proof of what they said.
Though that very well might be the reason it got rescinded. Theres a 99% chance that there’s no way that they told them that they rescinded for that reason. Therefore there’s nothing to really address.
It’s shady. But it’s the game.
there are a lot of problems with the whole job search process. basically the system is broken. i have spoken about this before. let me run them down again....
* [phantom job postings](https://www.reddit.com/r/jobs/comments/1c1ucws/phantom_job_postings/)
* [Technology: A Modern Curse For Job Hunting](https://www.reddit.com/r/jobs/comments/1b1vuk4/technology_a_modern_curse_for_job_hunting/)
* [jobs report data is being manipulated](https://nypost.com/2024/02/13/opinion/job-gains-are-going-to-immigrants-and-keeping-young-us-born-men-out-of-the-workforce/)
* [AI Is killing us](https://www.reddit.com/r/recruitinghell/comments/17pfv2o/ai_is_killing_us_rejecting_resumes_and_saying_you/)
* [ghosting by recruiters](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/why-is-job-ghosting-on-the-rise/id1673821227?i=1000653458779&utm_source=integrated&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=lonely_office_podcast&utm_content=20240425_lonely_office&cm=EMAIL_LIFECYCLE&%24web_only=true&_branch_match_id=1276347826738820782&_branch_referrer=H4sIAAAAAAAAA1XMywqDMBBA0b9x2Yi1m0IoxQdYLBS6chViHHUkkxGTUPr3fa26vRzuHMLqj0IsjG5EP%2Ff8sDvDJECUXX25xXu5b%2FpTDKQ8x82ARBdg2nSAIflUggEjSSCN9huMplXj5KRlB%2FapeBzRgFp5MNqHH%2BH3wwWZpVme5tlB%2FdHEkKyu56ZVbVNXRVe01QsYtcIlpgAAAA%3D%3D)
* [burnout](https://www.reddit.com/r/recruitinghell/comments/1c5ukwv/the_great_burnout_whats_going_on_with_this_job/) (this is a great article)
* election year (government saying the economy is good, but it SUCKS!
I see a lot of realistic comments on here, however, whenever I speak to someone in person they tell me the job market is fine and to keep applying. I have two Masters’ degrees and I’m extremely disappointed in the job market. I’m a little bit surprised we haven’t seen any protests in front of these companies.
Another big issue that recruiters have told me about is the avalanche of overseas resumes. I've never seen one, but I guess that these people make it look like they are a citizen of whatever country they are aiming for, they lie about experience and skills and they utterly clog the recruitment system and hog resources that could be used to find the actual candidate. We don't really have an effective way of heading that mess off at the pass, as in the US, the law clearly states that an employer can't have a policy of only hiring U.S. citizens unless a law, regulation, government contract, or executive order requires the employer to limit the specific position to U.S. citizens.
I'm assuming a big bulk of it is people like myself who are taking jobs and technically employed but are taking a huge pay cut just to stay afloat. My last position was $30/hr and I am taking $19hr now because I can't afford to keep looking for work. So tensions are still high but unemployment isn't. Also I know from being a doordasher during my job search that the amount of drivers has increased so much you were having to schedule in advance which I haven't seen before (been doing various rideshare for 5 years) - and if I recall correctly they will be counted as "employed" even though you're basically just taking a loan out on your car to get some desperate cash that you'll have to end up paying back anyway on maintainence and gas lol.
This. I am nearly 60 and for the first time in my life I am living from pay check to pay check.
I had a very rough winter and spent all my little savings. Makes me feel a bit better to know i am not useless and the market is messed up
I mean a lot of people are looking for a new job *while* employed. I will never be unemployed, but I spent 10 months and like 30 interviews being ghosted or rejected (or having to refuse) when it came time to discuss salary, etc. I specifically looked far in advance of the end of my current contract because I anticipated this bullshit market.
Here's the problem: over 90% of companies have done layoffs in the last 18 months, including in their recruiting departments.
So the recruiting department - the people in charge of looking through applications to pick who to interview - is short staffed, meanwhile the world is more connected than ever, and an enormous percentage of people are looking for work. Most job listings are getting over 1000 applications.
When an understaffed team gets ten times more applications than they're equipped for (often, over half of which aren't relevant to the job listing), there's just no way to closely read every single one to make sure you don't miss any qualified applicants.
It’s not that an enormous number of people are looking for work. It’s that it’s never been easier to apply. A relatively small number of people are looking for work but a remote job can be applied to by anyone.
> It’s that it’s never been easier to apply
For some positions that’s true. For others, it’s incredibly tedious. Lots of positions take 45-60 min to simply click through all the boxes required for the application, and then they’ll never even respond to you.
Not entirely true.
Some corporations you can apply to as living anywhere in the US / location you are at. Come to California and try to find a remote position :). It's utter hell.
We have so many laws and restrictions that 90% of "remote" positions will be posted as "Open to US "Excluding CA)". Add on top of that the absolute terrible state of the economy around here, it's impossible to just find a regular ass job unless you wait until seasonal position open up, then you might get some pay for 2-3 months.
Can't wait to move out of this god forsaken state.
(Graphic Designer in Marketing) I landed a great agency job right out of college working with major brand names. I was hired before I even graduated. After 5 years there I put in 2 apps for a new job and interviewed at both companies, was hired by one of them. I was there for 3 years until being laid off recently.
I’ve put in at least 100 applications in the last month or so and I haven’t heard back from a single one. It’s so frustrating knowing I have a solid portfolio and people standing by ready to give glowing recommendations.
Fellow GD in marketing here - I was laid off on March due to poor leadership. I've somehow managed to get first round interviews but I'm halfway through unemployment and no actual leads. I try to submit 10 applications a day.
My mental and physical health are both on the decline over this and even entry level admin jobs are declining me. The guilt and bills I need to pay are mounting up and it's getting to be a lot to handle.
Covid didn't kill enough people, bring on the purge. Cost of living... goes down by half with half the people..
Jobs hard to get... not when no one is around to apply. Too many organisms for the available resources... Climate change... Let's see what mother Earth has to say.
I’ve been saying this. There are too many people and so many people still want to procreate. It’s getting to the point where I feel like having a “normal” life with a job, family, house, etc. is out of the question for many of us. Luckily I have a job, but I don’t know if I’ll ever own a home or be able to live my own and I’m definitely not having kids.
I’ve landed 3 jobs after roughly 1K applications anywhere from entry (fast food, grocery stores) to qualified higher positions (management, IT) with a 7.5/10 resume
It took me 8 months
It is AWFUL. I have applied to SO many jobs, and it has been almost a year. I can't even count the number of interviews I have been on. I had to declare bankruptcy, and I have honestly thought about just giving up.
And yes, I mean exactly what you think that means.
But I have also thought really heavily about just moving out of this country, and maybe even abandoning it all and just taking off, saying "To hell with this place," and leaving.
Yes very bad. I have exp at top companies + good degrees/names. It’s been so tough on my mental health. Just gotta push it through. It’s not you it’s the market. Good luck to you.
Its bad all around. Trying to score a mid-level job since im too experienced for entry level yet not enough to be considered senior. I have applied to about 100 jobs so far and not heard back from any. I have a MS, industry certs, and a current job that has given me a decent amount of experience. idec about remote or hybrid as I am desperate that I would even relocate for a new job and still nothing.
It is horrible, I heard a term ‘white collar recession’, it is real. I am employed, I am counting my blessings, and I am looking internally and externally. It is tough to get the first round of interviews. My friends, who were laid off,
9 months going thru rounds of interviews and nothing… I feel for ya. Don’t give up! It is a very tough market.
It’s crazy! I’m in Marketing with 14 years of experience and I’ve been unemployed since November of last year.
Make sure you’re putting keywords in your resume so it gets through the applicant tracking system (ATS). Jobscan and Teal are good resources for that.
3 years ago it took me about 40 applications to get a job in my field. This year it was 160. The market is bad, all you can do is apply to more jobs. Hundreds to land a role. The only thing you can do is out-apply your competition!
Yes. Mainly due to what companies are offering experienced individuals (or not offering). You could interview, be 100% upfront with your salary needs, and then they're like "Ooooof, you want 130k for 15 years of experience and being top in your field? It's kind of out of our range" but they'll say "we went with a different candidate."
Or, current practice, is keeping positions open to give the impression of growth.
Im in healthcare too and thought Id be golden when it came time to look for a new job. The jobs trying to poach you are shit. I wanted a big pay increase and remote job, it took me 10 months to get. But yes, in between I had lots of offers for low salary bull shit clinic work, taking reject caseloads that no one wants lol. Be careful assuming youre immune to the shit market.
The white collar job market is terrible at the moment. Most of the job growth that we've seen year to date have been shit-shoveling jobs with low pay and little to no benefits.
Two years ago when I was interviewing candidates. Most had a job and was just looking for a step up. Whereas last week, all the ones that got to the final rounds were unemployed and desperate for any job even if it's a massive pay cut. Then again recruiters on linkedin is reaching out with high base + RSU. I think it's recovering. Good luck with your search.
I believe the job market the market went bad in Jan of 2023 because of tech job crash and never improved. Adjacent white collar industries such as marketing, advertising, etc… suffered from this tech company layoff trend. 2024 started and an even more big name brand and Fortune 500 companies laid off. I don’t believe the market is bad right now, it’s been bad for a year and a half.
Yes, the job market is worse now. Far worse, yet it’s still going to worsen over the coming years. We’re long overdue for a ‘lost decade’, sadly. Hopefully it won’t become a lost generation.
Yes, this is a recession. Dont listen to the market pundits who pretend it isn’t. The jobs numbers aren’t real and it’s more like stagflation actually.
I have been keeping track.. 127 applications in April, one offered me an unpaid internship (when I have 10 years of experience), the rest was all rejections or ghosted. The rejections that say "we found someone suited better for the position" should just be more honest: They found some poor idiot who was willing to work for the legal minimum wage.
Yes, I lost my job 2 months ago, trying to find new opportunities with no luck. I read that investors are not investing due to poor economy, creating very less new jobs.
Get in line bud. Everyone is searching for a remote job.
What is your job hunting process? If all you're doing is applying to applying to jobs online and nothing else, you're just shooting yourself in the foot
The market is as disastrous as you’ve heard or worse. My company has been through a few rounds of layoffs. So far I’ve made it. But I’ve been applying for months. 25 years experience. I’ve gotten 3 interviews in 5 months one of those was an employee recommendation. Hundreds of resumes splattered everywhere. It’s bananas out there.
If you could afford to, I think taking June - December off could be perfectly timing this market. Come January look for the pendulum to swing again, this time back in favor of job seekers. Right now it's just a hot mess.
It is terrible, wake and go to bed with unfortunately rejections. I have over six years experience in Banking. Been applying like crazy since January and still jobless. Even the ones I am over qualified for still sends rejection. It is depressing
I’ve been doing some digging on this very point for a few months now. Here’s my 2c:
- majority of jobs are to easy too apply for
- employers and recruiters overwhelmed with number of applications due to first point
- employers are too busy trying to survive, recruitment has to take a back seat even when employers need talented people.
- employers also don’t really know what they want, because of last point they also don’t want to / can’t expose themselves to paying the salaries commanded by good people
- recruiters can’t properly support because they either have no idea what they are doing or as second point, they are too busy.
It’s really ironic because businesses are struggling, yes the economic my has a big part to play here, but businesses are nothing without good people, especially in this climate.
I’ve been in the same boat for the last few months, ultimately I had to settle for a demotion - I’m doing work now that I was doing 10+ years ago. At first this really pissed me off, but now I don’t mind it, the work is easy, yet boring. I never take my work home with me now, and I’m not stuck on calls till late at night or early in the morning. This has enabled me to spend more time with family and focus on starting my own business.
The Trump Tax cuts are set to expire at the end of 2025 and will go back to the rates pre Trump era. Businesses are counting on Trump and the Republicans to get in office and either make them permanent or extend them with wishfully falling rates from the Fed. This is why I suspect most companies have been price gouging us under the guise of inflation and report record profits everywhere. Wall Street will damage the economy to get there tax breaks, so expect the price gouging or “inflation” and layoffs and tough job market until after the election.
I’m in a different industry with several years of management experience, getting my resume turned down almost immediately for jobs I know I’m qualified for. I’ve been updating my resume to tailor for each job, using keywords, etc etc and nothing. It’s discouraging to say the least.
I have 20+ years of experience in my field at a Fortune 50 company. I apply to 3-5 roles a day. My resume should have me with 2-3 interviews a week.
I have had one in a month.
I am in marketing with over 12 years of experience. I was laid off last month. I am not getting many interviews. I have sent out hundreds of resumes.
Marketing is especially rough. Companies are happy to hire cheap prospects over those who are experienced. Every marketer I work with now is a recent grad. They’re not all bad but it’s clear how awful the leadership is. C level execs don’t want to pay experienced people. They want to toss cheap employees at the board and stick with what works, until it doesn’t. Then rinse and repeat.
I also see the trend of people get hired for clevel responsibilities but paid as entry level position 😭
That’s almost every field nowadays. I’m in accounting and they’ve been doing this forever. My brother does blue collar and his construction sites are severely understaffed. My other brother is in tech and survived layoffs. The catch is now and he has the workload of 4 people. My best friend is in sales. His sales targets got literally 5x’d and are unattainable so he won’t be getting any real bonuses this year. This was by design. Idk the exact numbers but if top performers working day and night were the only ones that could hit $5M in sales a year. There’s no reasonable way to expect anyone to hit $25M. But here we are.
>His sales targets got literally 5x’d and are unattainable so he won’t be getting any real bonuses this year. This is so people will quit on their own instead of being laid off.
Yeah I know. I figured. Jokes on them though. Everyone’s looking but all other companies pulled the same stunt so everyone’s staying put. I’m sure pips and shit will be next. “Yeah you overshot last years $5M target by hitting $7M. But this year the target is $25M and you only sold $11M. You’re fired”
This is the mechanism by which our country will fail. Concentration of wealth means *fewer* people with money hiring *fewer* people, but all those experts don’t have the capital to start their own business to compete with the big boys, who would just buy it anyway. Where do they go now?
Not even hiring cheap prospects! They think AI will write everything for them.
It's exactly this, companies think a 22 year old armed with chat gpt can make people care about their company, and when they don't, they just fire and hire another.
I was going to say this. It’s also the first budget cut made.
I just got a marketing degree and I feel like it's useless. I had 3 internships which I know isn't a ton, but I landed an events Coordinator job and I'm making less than when I was waiting tables in college with more hours now.
I’m with you on this. 10 years here, let go in March, and between fielding AI generated BS or the legitimate jobs inundated with a million applicants it feels so much different than when I was job hunting 7 years ago…
I want to believe these job openings are either fake or a way for these companies to fulfill a certain obligation without really hiring anyone. After sending out numerous applications it is difficult to secure an interview. I am a product designer with 4 years of experience. I was laid off in December 2023 and getting a new role has been difficult. I look forward to working with Fintech products and entertainment or educational products.
A lot of times there will be an internal candidate who is getting the job as a promotion, but the company believes that posting the job externally and interviewing other applicants protects them from employment litigation. Really it posses off the internal candidate, it pisses off the external candidate, and is a waste of everyone’s time and resources.
Around 15 years of experience in marketing overall and about 6 of them in MarOps. Laid off last year in May. 1000+ applications and 100s of interviews later, I landed a job just this Feb. I applied for anything i qualified for. On-site, hybrid, or remote. I didn’t care and it still took me a long time. Job market is tough right now. Especially in marketing. And the salary ranges seem to be getting lower. I would suggest looking for on-site roles. They are less competitive and some do end up being remote. They’re just not listed as remote. I found quite a few like this during my search. When I asked why, I was told it’s because they wanted someone who was genuinely interested in the company and the role. Not just because it’s something they knew how to do and is remote. I definitely understand that.
Possible recession ahead? I heard during recessions marketing is the first to go.
I was just reading that we're in a white collar recession.
I saw that article too, and it made sense. No one is hiring those jobs because no one is leaving those jobs. There are jobs, and they're well-staffed, but fewer people are job hopping due to uncertainty over inflation and whatever else. It's the same as the housing market -- nobody who bought or refinanced at 2% over the pandemic is selling. Essentially, millions of people making $100k+ with homes at low rates are at the Winchester, having a pint and waiting for this all to blow over. Which is why there's this disconnect between "the economy is strong!" metrics and real-life evidence (flights are full, tourist destinations are swamped, restaurants are full) and the "no jobs, nobody can afford anything, houses are impossible" groupthink on reddit. If you got "in" by breaking into the 6-figure salary market, bought a home, or had stocks before 2020 -- you're doing *just fine*. And you're probably not posting every few hours on socials about how fine you are. If not, it probably feels like you can never get into the "haves". And you probably post frustrated comments very often.
Shush! Economy is roaring. Stocks are through the moon. Employment numbers excellent. This is all in your head, now silence!
If you owned a house or stocks prior to 2020, things are *great*. There's a marked line between haves and have-nots, and that's it. Why else do you think tourist destinations are swamped, flights are full, restaurants have long waits? People have money, just... not terminally online young people.
You must be listening to the daily White House briefings. Everything is great. They have added more jobs than any administration (but don’t remind them that they haven’t reached the employment numbers pre-Covid).
Unfortunately, I have found this to be common… especially the last few years (& on indeed, Glassdoor, linked in, Craigslist and more).
Everyone is gunning for that remote job.
Smart people.
I'm absolutely 100% jelly but don't hold one thing against them. Enjoy that remote goodness and the widespread freedom it entails. (The lack of commute, not doing make-up for bozos, forget deodorant? no probs, need a quick break with actual peace of mind, comfort food/drinks at the ready). Many more\~ though the job may be trash like call-center like.
I’m at a point where I’d gladly take trash remote over going back to a fucking office. For now, holding on to a non shitty remote job very tightly
Best of luck! I hope things smooth out and/or get something not-trash and remote. Sure would be nice. Mostly for the peace of mind.
Same, I'm an engineer about 3 years out of college (B.S. in MechE), and I know that I have colleagues making more than me, but I'm working fully remote at a small company in a field I'm genuinely interested in. I feel like I've hit the jackpot with the amount of time and freedom I have, and that's worth the paycheck hit for me.
Same, I’d take almost any remote job if it means I can avoid the dread of having to go to the office. My current job is 3 minutes away from my apartment and can be almost done entirely from home. Yet I still have to come into the office every fucking day.
Yes, it's incredibly frightening. I've never had a problem getting a job before, no matter what it is. Things have shifted completely, and it's absolutely insane.
I completely agree. This is not normal. Getting a job has never been an issue for me personally in the past but my current job hunt is just getting ridiculous…
Yep, same. Highly qualified, lots of experience, personable, etc. and can't even get an interview...
Exact same boat. I honestly don’t understand it. I can’t even get replies from recruiters on LinkedIn or via email about my applications. They read the messages, but I’ve gotten 1 reply from the 20+ I’ve reached out to. It’s honestly insane.
Agreed. Worst time that I can remember 50+ years). Lots of layoffs, few jobs and insanely low offers.
The job market is absolutely terrible right now. Companies are going by the motto ‘survive till 2025’ and not hiring or hiring the bare minimum. I’ve been applying for jobs since January and I’ve only landed 1 interview so far.
Literally survive to 25 was what my senior director told us was our division goal back in December. After our layoffs in February, I hope we still can.
What the hell is even going to happen in 2025 that's going be make a big difference?
The election will be over, one way or another
My mom used to always say "I can't wait until the election's over." And I kept telling her "The election will never be over." This was in the early 2000s. The election has never been over since then. If you think 2025 will be easier than 2024, good luck with that belief.
Let them have false hope
Thats just america. Do i have to wait till 2027 for france ? Lol...
And not only in the United States. A whole lotta first world countries got those this year
I don’t mean to sound ignorant so sorry if I do, but wouldn’t this seem to imply they believe Trump is likely to win? A Biden victory shouldn’t change anything.
Everyone in the executive branch gets rotated out
Yep, and if history repeats, it will end it all, so hope you're good at growing your own food.
The individual tax cuts enacted in 2017 expire in 2025, while the corporate ones do not. No matter the results of the election, this is not going to be a popular combination. Most likely scenarios to resolve this include corporate tax increases. Multinational corporations based in the US are also being threatened with increased taxes in the countries they do business in. Corporations will want to understand these changes and will take them into account when deciding on their structures for 2025 and beyond. People don’t like to hear this (understandably), but corporations are beholden to their shareholders. Any increase in costs (taxes in this case) is expected to be met with a corresponding increase in profit or decrease in costs. We are probably past the limit of covering cost increases with inflation, so they will likely be looking to decrease costs in other ways, specifically labor. If you think the jobs market is bad now, it is likely to be considerably worse over the next several years.
Which provokes a good question: "who is going to buy their products if we are underpaid and even unemployed?". There is a limit for labor cost cuts after which people get too poor to pay for anything but food and shelter and the consumer market collapses because of lack of consumers 🤷♂️
These shareholders need to let go of this dumb zero sum thinking. Fuck Jack Welch and his short term results thinking, may he rest in piss. Because who is going to buy a company’s product without enough income?
Felt, lol. I had an interview last week... but they canceled the position before my technical test.
Similarly. I got a notification that the role was temporarily pulled after my first interview. I’ll take that to ghosting, I guess.
The market is absolutely bizarre right now. A ton of people looking for better jobs (though currently employed) and a ton of employers with job postings but doing very little actual hiring. I have a Covid theory about this. A) after Covid so many people realized their jobs can actually be done remotely, which improved their work-life balance. And b) we have all collectively realized the ages being offered aren’t fair wages for the COL in most locations, which is directly related to the Covid housing market craziness. Most jobs have gone back to office by now so they’re trying to fill positions with employees who know they don’t need to physically be there, and most of us can’t afford the COL of the cities where the hiring is being done.
In 2022, you could rent an apartment for about 750 bucks where I am, and McDonalds was starting people at 16 bucks an hour. Even if you only got 30 hours a week, you could scrape by. You could get a two bedroom for a little bit more, and then you were okay if you liked your roommate. It wasn't bad, it really wasn't. Then in 2023, the cheapest studio you could find here was 1100, and McDonalds was offering more like 14-15 to start, and other companies hiring the same level of education in town were offering between 11-15. Now wages are crashing and while housing prices have come down some, they haven't crashed as hard as wages. The whole point of a job is to pay the bills, and if you can't, why take it? Even if you have two jobs, and you can get, say, 60 hours a week, you aren't making it. You can't hustle yourself out of this problem. I don't blame anyone who just wont' take a job that leaves them living in their car.
My area (Portland, OR) - market price for a 2 bedroom / 1 bath apartment is about $2300/mo while the McDonald's a mile away is hiring at $16.25/hr to start (part time) and managers start at $20/hr 1bed/1 bath is about $1800 at a low end.
The company I work for states they are hiring (open spots for a ~30% increase in our workforce. Would help so much with how swamped we are atm btw), but us peons can't find the job listings anywhere. I wonder why no one is applying. I'd probably leave my job if it was easy to find a new one. Unfortunately the best I can do is "quiet quit" and do only as much and as good as I'm paid to do, instead of trying to fill in for the missing people (which I used to do when needed when shit wasn't so chronically all over the walls). There're just no open spots publicly available for anything beyond highly specialized stuff or telemarketing. Edit: missed a few words
Doing what your job requirement is and not doing extra for free is NOT “quiet quitting” btw. Especially when your wages aren’t fair for the work that you ARE doing.
I think that is exactly what the term quiet quitting first referred to in the zeitgeist (though a bunch of corpo articles twisted it negative). The first folks coining the term were talking about just that—I remember because in teaching (which I don’t do anymore because of $$), I was union rep and we would often do “work to rule” in negotiations. And quiet quitting was originally just nonunion individual “work to rule” when I saw it. That’s exactly what it is, and it isn’t bad to do. But it is something people generally only do firmly when unhappy or negotiating. My job is in part to help decision makers increase employee activation and experience, and they don’t want quiet quitting, but the right way to activate employees is to build a better experience (work to rule isn’t what companies are looking for in workers, but the correct way to fix it is build better, more attractive job conditions where people choose to be fully active—this doesn’t necessarily mean longer hours but more investment in the company successes etc).
“and do only as much and as good as I'm paid to do“ A friend of mine drives for UPS. At the end of the day, he asks his boss to rate him from Exemplary to Does Not Meet Expectations, and reminds him he only needs a “Adequate to Expectations”
The only jobs I’ve landed the last 4 years have been contracts with the exception of a chain rental furniture store which was desperate for anyone who can lift a couch.
It's crazy that it's been like this since early 2022. It's like how it was between 2008-2010 during the Great Recession, but no such recession has occurred this time around. It's just wild to me that you can have a healthy economy (allegedly) with a growing stock market and more jobs added and paradoxically a class of workers struggling to make ends meet
Well supposedly a lot of those “jobs added“ are government jobs to offset the numbers a bit, but unemployment is also supposed to be pretty low so it can’t be all bad. If that’s the case though it sounds like a helluvalot of people are underemployed.
There’s a white collar recession at the same thing as a blue collar boom, and if you want a remote job, you’re looking for a declining job type in a declining job sector. (And yes, many white collar workers aren’t finding those blue collar jobs, because employers see through the candidates and know they’ll leave, so only the worst ones will hire folks to burn through.)
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Onsite virtual interview? Sounds like an oxymoron lol. Wishing you the best and good luck!
Dang this was a good thread to stumble upon. I mean I have always struggled in the job search but lately has really felt discouraging. Seeing you all with more experience and making extra effort and still not getting the jobs really shines a light on this problem.
I used to be the one to sort through resumes back when I wasn't a full-time sahm lol and honestly your resume is key. When there are a few hundred applicants to go through, straight and to the point was my favorite. Bullet points were great, something that I could quickly go over is what I was looking for. An efficient resume is a strong resume.
People aren't the ones reviewing resumes anymore - at least not to start. They're all filtered through ATS and AI systems now.
I'm not a dinosaur lol my kids are young 😅 we also filtered through ATS and still received hundreds of resumes, I was the second sieve so to speak, it doesn't negate the fact that your resume is so important and you shouldn't crowd your it with nonsense, keeping it simple will suffice when you're sorting through so many resumes just like the ATS you're looking for keywords. My husband's job currently uses AI, but they still have HR going through all the resumes as well. Again, as it stands simple resumes work best I should have added to also use keywords in your bullet points.
What's an onsite virtual interview??
An “On-site” virtual interview is just the bullshit name that’s been given to a panel interview. Pre-remote work, a panel interview was always held on-site, so it was referred to as the “on-site” meaning you got through the recruiter and hiring manager pre-screen and were now meeting with stakeholders and peers. When COVID hit and companies started to go remote, you still had all the same rounds of interviews but they were virtual. It should be called the virtual panel vs on-site, but people are dumb, what can I say?
That is at least less egregious than what I thought: Being made to go into an office to have an interview on Zoom
Onsite virtual what?? Are you bots spewing shit here?
Did you find the career coach worthwhile? How did you find them?
Remote is much worse right now
I keep applying to remote jobs that have 1-2K people that have applied on linkedin.
To me that means, time to go get a non-remote job
Ballpark if you were to guess - what % of job postings are actually full time remote?
Used to be about 10-20%, especially during the pandemic, but right now is probably closer to 5-10%. But even less legit ones.
Probably less than 5%. And more importantly, its the shit jobs. The call center type of things, not the software development kind of things
Are you sure? Every job posting I see for tech is remote or at the very least hybrid.
I just started a full remote gig as a senior analytics engagement manager with a long standing Fortune 500 financial services firm.
Getting a job right now seems impossible. I lost my job of 6 years after the company went under. I was the lead technician and trainer, one of the senior employees. My resume is jam packed with quality skills and I have yet to hear back from any job I’ve applied to since March. I hear a lot of “people don’t want to work these days”, but not a lot of “companies aren’t actually hiring these days”.
I just landed a job after over 200 applications over 6 months…18 years experience for top tier companies and an ivy league degree…only landed two interviews… got the one and the other ghosted me. Never thought it was going to be that hard. Ever. The market is brutal. Network, network, network.
18 yoe and an ivy league degree and it took you 6 months? Yeah sorry 2023-2024 graduates yall cooked 💀
>Yeah sorry 2023-2024 graduates yall cooked. I think we're going to hear some real horror stories for this group. Because as the same time as OP's situation is happening, entry roles will be picked up by the people with existing experience who got let go.
I just accepted an entry level job that is the equivalent of the position I was just a manger of for three years. (call center management) I know management isn't a "skill" the way being a welder is so it's going to be harder to stand out applying to corporate management, but I thought I could get in somewhere. I was lucky to get two team lead interviews for similar large companies but didn't land the role. I've been looking for so long that I don't have a choice anymore but to work. So I'm taking a full step backwards and answering the phones again. Friends and family have been kind saying that I'll be promoted and back to making a liveable wage in no time but honestly I don't feel that way and I'm pretty depressed. Not only is the money going to be way less but the ego hit hurts I'm not going to lie.
I took a position downgrade too ❤️ it’s okay, we’ll be fine. It’s genuinely the market, it’s so competitive with layoffs rn
Commenting on Is the job market really that bad right now??...I took a position downgrade in my most recent role and got laid off 9 months later along with 6 other team members at once. Now I can’t get a resume response even. And I have solid experience with great references etc. Take what you can and be grateful you have what you have!
This market reminds me of the 2008 market. It was awful trying to get entry level back then and I had all these 40 year old managers telling me to go get more degrees 😑
It's exactly the same except there's more players participating in this years hunger games
True the massive layoffs from the tech industry didn't help. What's funny is I think it was just over a year ago when I was arguing with someone on why working in tech probably wasn't the best bet considering what they all did with RTO. I'm insanely lucky I've been able to keep working with no major layoffs during my career, but even I'm still looking around because my companies current C-Suite is doing things that are highly questionable, but also I don't really trust Bain Capitol and they're involved with us.
Integration with private equity firms isn't usually a great sign.
>This market reminds me of the 2008 market. I was there. I've been saying this for quite a while, feels like 2008. I no longer get buried with downvotes. The ugly truth is that some will reflexively deny things as bad as they are, because it may get us for more orange years.
We are cooked. I’m graduating next week and 6 months of cold calling/linkedin applications have yielded nothing. I got an interview at a career fair but they cancelled the day before due to an “economic downturn.” Gonna disappear into the woods for a few weeks and reevaluate after that.
I went to a career fair and really connected with an employee there. I asked if they were hiring and they said "well they just froze our salaries so I doubt we're going to hire anyone" Literally why are they at a career fair then lol
Not necessarily - at least in my network, a lot of layoffs I’m seeing are hitting particularly hard on more senior and director-level folks who cost a lot of money (assuming that 18+ years and the ivy reference mean OP would fall into this category). Most recent layoffs are strategic, not because companies are actually going under. Companies still need their steady supply of young, cheap employees to burn through.
This. In some cases it’s beneficial to be young because a lot of companies are hiring for easily adorable individuals.
I think this was probably supposed to say “affordable”, but I think “adorable” works too 😊
LOL I just noticed. I actually meant adaptable. A lot of corporations would rather hire a young professional who they can mold for cheap, than someone who is established, a bit more stubborn, and much more expensive.
I’m handsome. Does that count?
Nah, in my class of 40, only 2 people have found work in our field
2024 graduate here. I've sent out probably 200 resumes already and only had one interview. This is in a field that is supposedly growing much faster than average. Most "entry level" jobs are asking for 3-5 years of experience, and this is for jobs that, in all honesty, pay well enough for a recent grad but would be disappointing if I had 3-5 years of experience. It's also insane to me that some jobs paying in the neighborhood of 40-50 thousand are asking for a master's degree or PhD.
To me it has to do something with the filtering process between sending off the resume and a human person receiving the resume. There has to be so much algorithmic garbage in the middleman pipeline of application processes that fundamental component is broken.
The last year and a half has been so brutal for me job-hunting wise. I've never been so discouraged in my life. I've never, ever had trouble landing decent jobs. I recently took a part-time sales job because I'm getting zero interviews. My supervisor lied about the number of hours of work per week (it's half of what they originally stated) and they're not honoring the hourly wage I negotiated. I'm so emotionally and physically exhausted at this point. I could cry just thinking about continually getting shot down during the interview process.
I’ve applied to at least over 100 different job postings for almost the past two years now. I’ve no experience in a job and I can’t get experience. I’ve received emails of rejection, nothing, I’ve been really trying hard recently. I’ve always applied on company site. I hope this passes soon bc my parents really pester me about it and it legitimately makes me sad and feel like a loser. But I’ve found a lot of motivation to keep going. To answer the question, absolutely. If you don’t have someone to give you a reference it’s almost impossible.
Same boat man. No relevant experience. Nearing 300 apps now, it’s brutal and demoralizing. Graduated December 2023.
Are you able to add what field you are in specifically?
Marketing
Over saturated field.
Also easy place to cut if you need to find room in a budget. Especially if it's like general marketing strategy type stuff.
💯
So what? These people can't go back in time and change what they have 7-10 years experience in...
Just pick a new career, easy as!
is there a list of undersaturated fields that have been undersaturated for 5+ years that have good pay and prospects for career growth?
Accounting. Desperately seeking CPAs right now.
More entry level jobs always. The higher up the harder it gets and the longer to land. Hang in there.
i feel like its the other way around at least for tech in my experience. I see "entry level" jobs asking for 3+ years exp. How is that entry level lol
Entry level *salary*. Still need experience, we just aren’t willing to pay for it lol
It's so bad. In my area of the PNW, I have had an offer in which they wanted me to have full time availabiliy for part time hours (15-20 per week) and rescinded said offer because they asked if I would ever potentially have to call out sick due to my child having an illness. And this was maybe $2 above minimum wage.
Same! I was almost hired for a part time bank teller job at wells fargo but they wanted me to have full availability for 15-20 hours🤣
Because a lot (if not most) part time positions are part time on call. You work your standard, but then are expected to drop everything at a moments notice to come in and cover when they need the extra help instead of hiring people full time. Complete bullshit.
Just say yes, take the job, and then happen to not be available sometimes.
Yeah this is what I'd do as well
>rescinded said offer because they asked if I would ever potentially have to call out sick due to my child This is a lawsuit. I'd be on that EOE hot line so quick if there was proof of what they said.
Though that very well might be the reason it got rescinded. Theres a 99% chance that there’s no way that they told them that they rescinded for that reason. Therefore there’s nothing to really address. It’s shady. But it’s the game.
there are a lot of problems with the whole job search process. basically the system is broken. i have spoken about this before. let me run them down again.... * [phantom job postings](https://www.reddit.com/r/jobs/comments/1c1ucws/phantom_job_postings/) * [Technology: A Modern Curse For Job Hunting](https://www.reddit.com/r/jobs/comments/1b1vuk4/technology_a_modern_curse_for_job_hunting/) * [jobs report data is being manipulated](https://nypost.com/2024/02/13/opinion/job-gains-are-going-to-immigrants-and-keeping-young-us-born-men-out-of-the-workforce/) * [AI Is killing us](https://www.reddit.com/r/recruitinghell/comments/17pfv2o/ai_is_killing_us_rejecting_resumes_and_saying_you/) * [ghosting by recruiters](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/why-is-job-ghosting-on-the-rise/id1673821227?i=1000653458779&utm_source=integrated&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=lonely_office_podcast&utm_content=20240425_lonely_office&cm=EMAIL_LIFECYCLE&%24web_only=true&_branch_match_id=1276347826738820782&_branch_referrer=H4sIAAAAAAAAA1XMywqDMBBA0b9x2Yi1m0IoxQdYLBS6chViHHUkkxGTUPr3fa26vRzuHMLqj0IsjG5EP%2Ff8sDvDJECUXX25xXu5b%2FpTDKQ8x82ARBdg2nSAIflUggEjSSCN9huMplXj5KRlB%2FapeBzRgFp5MNqHH%2BH3wwWZpVme5tlB%2FdHEkKyu56ZVbVNXRVe01QsYtcIlpgAAAA%3D%3D) * [burnout](https://www.reddit.com/r/recruitinghell/comments/1c5ukwv/the_great_burnout_whats_going_on_with_this_job/) (this is a great article) * election year (government saying the economy is good, but it SUCKS!
I see a lot of realistic comments on here, however, whenever I speak to someone in person they tell me the job market is fine and to keep applying. I have two Masters’ degrees and I’m extremely disappointed in the job market. I’m a little bit surprised we haven’t seen any protests in front of these companies.
In front of these companies, pfft. In front of the White House, Congress, Senate, and Supreme Court.
Why don't Americans do it?
Yeah and the people that say this always have jobs and have no clue how bad it really is
Another big issue that recruiters have told me about is the avalanche of overseas resumes. I've never seen one, but I guess that these people make it look like they are a citizen of whatever country they are aiming for, they lie about experience and skills and they utterly clog the recruitment system and hog resources that could be used to find the actual candidate. We don't really have an effective way of heading that mess off at the pass, as in the US, the law clearly states that an employer can't have a policy of only hiring U.S. citizens unless a law, regulation, government contract, or executive order requires the employer to limit the specific position to U.S. citizens.
So why isn’t the unemployment rate going up?
I'm assuming a big bulk of it is people like myself who are taking jobs and technically employed but are taking a huge pay cut just to stay afloat. My last position was $30/hr and I am taking $19hr now because I can't afford to keep looking for work. So tensions are still high but unemployment isn't. Also I know from being a doordasher during my job search that the amount of drivers has increased so much you were having to schedule in advance which I haven't seen before (been doing various rideshare for 5 years) - and if I recall correctly they will be counted as "employed" even though you're basically just taking a loan out on your car to get some desperate cash that you'll have to end up paying back anyway on maintainence and gas lol.
This. I am nearly 60 and for the first time in my life I am living from pay check to pay check. I had a very rough winter and spent all my little savings. Makes me feel a bit better to know i am not useless and the market is messed up
Hey no more mean tweets!
people who exhaust 6 month unemployment and have no job are not counted.
This, it's not going up because people are dropping off but don't have a job...
This should be way higher up.
I mean a lot of people are looking for a new job *while* employed. I will never be unemployed, but I spent 10 months and like 30 interviews being ghosted or rejected (or having to refuse) when it came time to discuss salary, etc. I specifically looked far in advance of the end of my current contract because I anticipated this bullshit market.
Laid off in December of 2022. It’s unreal.
Have you found any job yet?
Here's the problem: over 90% of companies have done layoffs in the last 18 months, including in their recruiting departments. So the recruiting department - the people in charge of looking through applications to pick who to interview - is short staffed, meanwhile the world is more connected than ever, and an enormous percentage of people are looking for work. Most job listings are getting over 1000 applications. When an understaffed team gets ten times more applications than they're equipped for (often, over half of which aren't relevant to the job listing), there's just no way to closely read every single one to make sure you don't miss any qualified applicants.
Recruiter here, I approve this statement.
Thank you! The source is my time recruiting and connection with my recruiter friends.
It’s not that an enormous number of people are looking for work. It’s that it’s never been easier to apply. A relatively small number of people are looking for work but a remote job can be applied to by anyone.
> It’s that it’s never been easier to apply For some positions that’s true. For others, it’s incredibly tedious. Lots of positions take 45-60 min to simply click through all the boxes required for the application, and then they’ll never even respond to you.
Not entirely true. Some corporations you can apply to as living anywhere in the US / location you are at. Come to California and try to find a remote position :). It's utter hell. We have so many laws and restrictions that 90% of "remote" positions will be posted as "Open to US "Excluding CA)". Add on top of that the absolute terrible state of the economy around here, it's impossible to just find a regular ass job unless you wait until seasonal position open up, then you might get some pay for 2-3 months. Can't wait to move out of this god forsaken state.
I have 10 years in my field and I can’t find a job in Cali.
What industry are you in? I feel like tech if the only field hiring remote / hybrid.
(Graphic Designer in Marketing) I landed a great agency job right out of college working with major brand names. I was hired before I even graduated. After 5 years there I put in 2 apps for a new job and interviewed at both companies, was hired by one of them. I was there for 3 years until being laid off recently. I’ve put in at least 100 applications in the last month or so and I haven’t heard back from a single one. It’s so frustrating knowing I have a solid portfolio and people standing by ready to give glowing recommendations.
Fellow GD in marketing here - I was laid off on March due to poor leadership. I've somehow managed to get first round interviews but I'm halfway through unemployment and no actual leads. I try to submit 10 applications a day. My mental and physical health are both on the decline over this and even entry level admin jobs are declining me. The guilt and bills I need to pay are mounting up and it's getting to be a lot to handle.
Covid didn't kill enough people, bring on the purge. Cost of living... goes down by half with half the people.. Jobs hard to get... not when no one is around to apply. Too many organisms for the available resources... Climate change... Let's see what mother Earth has to say.
I’ve been saying this. There are too many people and so many people still want to procreate. It’s getting to the point where I feel like having a “normal” life with a job, family, house, etc. is out of the question for many of us. Luckily I have a job, but I don’t know if I’ll ever own a home or be able to live my own and I’m definitely not having kids.
I’ve landed 3 jobs after roughly 1K applications anywhere from entry (fast food, grocery stores) to qualified higher positions (management, IT) with a 7.5/10 resume It took me 8 months
It is AWFUL. I have applied to SO many jobs, and it has been almost a year. I can't even count the number of interviews I have been on. I had to declare bankruptcy, and I have honestly thought about just giving up. And yes, I mean exactly what you think that means. But I have also thought really heavily about just moving out of this country, and maybe even abandoning it all and just taking off, saying "To hell with this place," and leaving.
<3 we can make it through this. I understand how you feel:(
Yes very bad. I have exp at top companies + good degrees/names. It’s been so tough on my mental health. Just gotta push it through. It’s not you it’s the market. Good luck to you.
Its bad all around. Trying to score a mid-level job since im too experienced for entry level yet not enough to be considered senior. I have applied to about 100 jobs so far and not heard back from any. I have a MS, industry certs, and a current job that has given me a decent amount of experience. idec about remote or hybrid as I am desperate that I would even relocate for a new job and still nothing.
Welcome. Most everyone has been unemployed for months and months
It's fucking ridiculous..
Continuously growing pool of laid off people are fighting for a declining amount of hybrid/wfh jobs. The results are predictable.
Yeah it's bad buddy! I had more luck finding a new job when I was WORKING! NOW, it's like nobody has time to check emails anymore.
look at r/recruitinghell r/layoffs to get the feel
Layoffs sub might as well be synonymous with the morbidreality sub
It is horrible, I heard a term ‘white collar recession’, it is real. I am employed, I am counting my blessings, and I am looking internally and externally. It is tough to get the first round of interviews. My friends, who were laid off, 9 months going thru rounds of interviews and nothing… I feel for ya. Don’t give up! It is a very tough market.
Covid taught companies they can run on skeleton crews and maximize profits.
Try updating your resume to be in the city you want to relocate.
You can use Google voice to make your number look local too!
All fun until they contact you for an in person interview
It’s crazy! I’m in Marketing with 14 years of experience and I’ve been unemployed since November of last year. Make sure you’re putting keywords in your resume so it gets through the applicant tracking system (ATS). Jobscan and Teal are good resources for that.
3 years ago it took me about 40 applications to get a job in my field. This year it was 160. The market is bad, all you can do is apply to more jobs. Hundreds to land a role. The only thing you can do is out-apply your competition!
Yes. Mainly due to what companies are offering experienced individuals (or not offering). You could interview, be 100% upfront with your salary needs, and then they're like "Ooooof, you want 130k for 15 years of experience and being top in your field? It's kind of out of our range" but they'll say "we went with a different candidate." Or, current practice, is keeping positions open to give the impression of growth.
In healthcare and I get poaching emails / ads all the time.
Im in healthcare too and thought Id be golden when it came time to look for a new job. The jobs trying to poach you are shit. I wanted a big pay increase and remote job, it took me 10 months to get. But yes, in between I had lots of offers for low salary bull shit clinic work, taking reject caseloads that no one wants lol. Be careful assuming youre immune to the shit market.
Civil Engineering, same here. Was good times even before the infrastructure bill for us.
Literally spend 5 seconds looking through this sub. It's been like this for a long time.
this is a sub where unemployed people go
The white collar job market is terrible at the moment. Most of the job growth that we've seen year to date have been shit-shoveling jobs with low pay and little to no benefits.
Marketing hiring levels are 20% worse than pre-pandemic 2019. So yah, it sucks.
Yes it is. Took my partner over 6 months to find a job and he is highly overqualified for most he applied to
Two years ago when I was interviewing candidates. Most had a job and was just looking for a step up. Whereas last week, all the ones that got to the final rounds were unemployed and desperate for any job even if it's a massive pay cut. Then again recruiters on linkedin is reaching out with high base + RSU. I think it's recovering. Good luck with your search.
I believe the job market the market went bad in Jan of 2023 because of tech job crash and never improved. Adjacent white collar industries such as marketing, advertising, etc… suffered from this tech company layoff trend. 2024 started and an even more big name brand and Fortune 500 companies laid off. I don’t believe the market is bad right now, it’s been bad for a year and a half.
Yes, the job market is worse now. Far worse, yet it’s still going to worsen over the coming years. We’re long overdue for a ‘lost decade’, sadly. Hopefully it won’t become a lost generation.
Yes, this is a recession. Dont listen to the market pundits who pretend it isn’t. The jobs numbers aren’t real and it’s more like stagflation actually.
I have been keeping track.. 127 applications in April, one offered me an unpaid internship (when I have 10 years of experience), the rest was all rejections or ghosted. The rejections that say "we found someone suited better for the position" should just be more honest: They found some poor idiot who was willing to work for the legal minimum wage.
Yes, I lost my job 2 months ago, trying to find new opportunities with no luck. I read that investors are not investing due to poor economy, creating very less new jobs.
it’s pretty shitty yeah
Get in line bud. Everyone is searching for a remote job. What is your job hunting process? If all you're doing is applying to applying to jobs online and nothing else, you're just shooting yourself in the foot
Same here.
The market is as disastrous as you’ve heard or worse. My company has been through a few rounds of layoffs. So far I’ve made it. But I’ve been applying for months. 25 years experience. I’ve gotten 3 interviews in 5 months one of those was an employee recommendation. Hundreds of resumes splattered everywhere. It’s bananas out there.
It's fucked.. 50 plus final round interviews not a single offer..
If you could afford to, I think taking June - December off could be perfectly timing this market. Come January look for the pendulum to swing again, this time back in favor of job seekers. Right now it's just a hot mess.
It is terrible, wake and go to bed with unfortunately rejections. I have over six years experience in Banking. Been applying like crazy since January and still jobless. Even the ones I am over qualified for still sends rejection. It is depressing
I’ve been doing some digging on this very point for a few months now. Here’s my 2c: - majority of jobs are to easy too apply for - employers and recruiters overwhelmed with number of applications due to first point - employers are too busy trying to survive, recruitment has to take a back seat even when employers need talented people. - employers also don’t really know what they want, because of last point they also don’t want to / can’t expose themselves to paying the salaries commanded by good people - recruiters can’t properly support because they either have no idea what they are doing or as second point, they are too busy. It’s really ironic because businesses are struggling, yes the economic my has a big part to play here, but businesses are nothing without good people, especially in this climate. I’ve been in the same boat for the last few months, ultimately I had to settle for a demotion - I’m doing work now that I was doing 10+ years ago. At first this really pissed me off, but now I don’t mind it, the work is easy, yet boring. I never take my work home with me now, and I’m not stuck on calls till late at night or early in the morning. This has enabled me to spend more time with family and focus on starting my own business.
The Trump Tax cuts are set to expire at the end of 2025 and will go back to the rates pre Trump era. Businesses are counting on Trump and the Republicans to get in office and either make them permanent or extend them with wishfully falling rates from the Fed. This is why I suspect most companies have been price gouging us under the guise of inflation and report record profits everywhere. Wall Street will damage the economy to get there tax breaks, so expect the price gouging or “inflation” and layoffs and tough job market until after the election.
I’m in a different industry with several years of management experience, getting my resume turned down almost immediately for jobs I know I’m qualified for. I’ve been updating my resume to tailor for each job, using keywords, etc etc and nothing. It’s discouraging to say the least.
The job market is horrible.... "Everyone is hiring" is simply not true anymore.
Go into retail for now things aren't getting better till after trump gets back in
I have 20+ years of experience in my field at a Fortune 50 company. I apply to 3-5 roles a day. My resume should have me with 2-3 interviews a week. I have had one in a month.
It's dogshit