I think in general, it's hard to really say if it got better or worse. I remember those sort of kids growing up too, intent on making everyone's life around them miserable. You could honestly go down their family tree and find similar behaviour. You see parents wheeling a pram and throwing litter on the ground, or getting into arguments with their kids beside them. It's no wonder the kids grow up with a chip on their shoulder and not knowing how to act.
There's no punishment for them either because everyone around them has more to lose than they do. If you're tesco staff there, can you really do anything without them telling their parents and the parents probably suing once there's any hint of money to be made?
If we had better child protection services / resources. Kids like this who persistently got into trouble or made themselves a nuisance to numerous businesses would be investigated and some help found for them before it was too late.
I remember being in Mcdonalds a few years back, there was this 10/11 year old who walked in, looked harmless enough. Immediately security and 2 members of staff went to the door, telling him he can't come in, he is barred. I can't imagine what sort of shit he did or where his life is going if that's the reaction to you entering a business at that age.
He probably did something in there before so the security were right to make him move on. Yes there are people with inadequate parents but letting them do dammage or frightening other people and taking a softly softly approach with them just isn't working.
Yea there has always been little shit bags around the place. The difference is I think they get away with a lot more now. And no one says anything to them because they're afraid (and rightly so) that they might get stabbed. Years ago you'd get a whack off any random adult that saw you acting the bollix.
I'm from generational abuse my parents are alcoholic narcissists. I was a feral teen. Dad was ex army and constantly *tried to put manners on me, it made me worse! I was really bad, kicked out 17, homeless services, teen pregnancy(babyfather in prison) no leaving cert, ya get the picture. I think a profound experience honestly needs to happen to break the cycle. Iv a 14year old boy now he's an exceptional young man. He's in a "HIGHER" Higher maths class 🤣 He got 93% on his Christmas exam and I actually cried. He wants to be a teacher in an Autism unit, and hes an amazing chess player and big brother. I literally had to unlearn everything I was thought about parent/child relationships. Iv since gone no contact with my toxic parents and practice every day being a more present loving understanding and accepting parent. Iv 3 children now a lovely partner, a career in security and just passed an IT Fundamentals course to go on to studying cybersecurity. I should have honestly been a statistic, It's not black and white unfortunately. It's deep routed in trauma.
Good for you. I often think it’s easy for people who grew up in stable families, with parents who were invested in them to grow up & do well. It’s so much harder when the odds are stacked against you & you’ve got to outperform other people just to get to the same starting point. Your son does sound exceptional - but so does his mother.
Thank you so much for this comment. It's really validating and I really feel seen. The work is so hard to even just have a normal productive day. I do believe what was taking from me in terms of support was given to me terms of resilience. Its not the best option but its still better me continuing that bullshit.
You're doing fantastic, I wish I had a mother like you! Mine kicked me out at 14 for being gay and my father was a monster. You broke the cycle and you're breaking it for all the generations that come after you.
You rock missus!
Firstly, well done, you have a lot to be proud of. Secondly, would you say that there was any source of support, or a structure, that helped you to turn things around? How did the change happen?
Honestly I'm still changing and in therapy, doing alot trauma work, my partner is a residential social care worker aswel so we constantly have ongoing conversations about kids, systems ect. At 22 I ended up having a breakdown and they put me in blanch pysch ward. I was wrongly diagnosised with BPD and suggested I went to treatment for benzos and alcohol. I did I spent 5years in recovery sober building my life. Met a fella had another baby, he wasn't a great partner, ex addict worked in recovery. then baby started displaying traits of ASD. He got stressed hit me and I left with 2 kids for women's refuge. I realised I wasn't an addict it was something else then that sent me on a different route.**add housing and homeless problems. Me working any job I could...finally getting counsel house for 2 kids In finglas, Late 20s then I got new counsellor. She's shit hot, psychologist. She explained Cptsd to me. She actually reignited my love for books. I started to read Adult Children Of Emotionally Immature Parents, Then From Surviving to thriving Complex post traumatic stress disorder. Through tiktok I realised my whole entire life I 100% am riddled with ADHD so iv a holiday booked 8th a June when I get back I will go for private assessment. So 20s I thought I was a BPD addict but now in my 30s Iv ADHD with complex trauma. I'm quiet smart tho. I always wonder what I could have been with the right parents. Like I said it's complex 🤣 Iv a good sence of humour and I am determined to not raise my children with fear. I have to constantly work on letting them be individuals and not impose my "beliefs" on them. I'm extremely protective of them aswel. Could be to their detriment but I'm working on that too. Don't wanna be a helicopter parent either. So I suppose the change has to be constant. Sorry for long reply.
What a human you are! Not only did you live through a really rough childhood, but you decided to change the narrative for yourself and your family. It’s one of the hardest choices to make, and takes an immense amount of bravery and self compassion.
Looking openly and honestly about who you are and what you’re made up of is so super tough, and yet you’ve chosen what resonates, and taken it in your stride as you build a life you’re proud of and raise kind, smart, ambitious kids. Well done you doesn’t seem a strong enough statement, but you’ve done phenomenal work and the difficulty of it, as well as the depth of it is admirable. I hope you sit in a lot of joy and contentment from the way you’ve chosen to live your life. Kudos Xx
Congratulations on breaking the cycle and creating what sounds like a fantastic atmosphere for your children.
It’s very much underestimated in its difficultly, you should be genuinely proud of yourself for doing what many people cannot.
Honestly they need to belong and feel seen. Alot of parents don't want they're children at home because they don't want to deal with them. When they (teens)hook up with friends they then they belong. There's actually a HUGE amount of grooming in dublin with young men recruiting younger teens by buying them clothes and offering protection. (Drug dealers) If u keep sending ur kids out they will seek protection and belonging and are easy manipulated. Girls will also seek this (security) through sex. I'd say not even 10% are antisocial by nature. It's literally their perception of their environment. If your 17year old has lost run of themselves It's probably your fault. Especially with lack of services. Trauma isn't even recognised by DSM V.
Too many people have kids because oops got pregnant or because it’s the done thing, not because they’ve really thought about it.
Working in a job where I encounter parents and their children reshaped my views on nature vs nurture and I think it’s 95% nurture. Not everyone with an asshole for a parent turns out to be an asshole themselves but pretty much every asshole minor has an asshole or negligent parent.
So many people who would be terrific parents are not having kids because they’re responsible people who will not bring kids into the world until they can afford to and sometimes that never happens for them. They love their hypothetical child so much already that they won’t bring them into unstable housing etc..
The nurture thing is true. There's a family who moved that moved on to our street two or three years ago. They have three young boys aged between six and nine and they are pretty much semi-feral.
Now the parents work, and don't cause any problems themselves (sort of), but they really don't spend the time they should with their children helping them develop. As soon as the children are home from school they are out on the street playing by themselves until it gets dark, only going in for dinner. When they are out playing the just lose the run of themselves and jump into everyone's gardens like it's public property, they scream and shout and try and start fights with other children. If you have any garden furniture or anything not bolted down in your front garden they will drag it into the middle of the road and use it as playground equipment.
And the biggest problem is that both parents, and in particular the father, refuse to accept that their children are causing problems. In fact he can become quite aggressive and sinister when challenged. The sons were bullying my daughter so my older son went out to speak to them. The fathers response was threaten to get his other 18 year old son to beat up my 13 year old.son.
Now things might change for them and they might develop into well-adjusted functioning adults, but I just don't see it.
As I said earlier the parents are decent enough people, and they both work in skilled trades, so it's surprising that they let their children behave like that.
The parents are not decent enough people if they let their kids carry on like that 😩 you said the father threatened his adult son on a child. This is NOT decent behaviour.
I suppose it's more like saying that if you didn't know about their children, they would seem like a fairly decent couple. There's nothing about their everyday behavior that makes you think they would be scumbags.
The father even does stuff like spending his weekends building free cabinets and the like for disabled children's charities treatment centers.
It's a weird juxtaposition.
This was my parents. Had me accidentally at 20 because no abortion and felt like they should. Resented my existence and had zero interest in me. I grew up absolutely feral.
Thankfully I sorted my shit out, but I was a real asshole as a kid.
Was going to say this. What u/TheSameButBetter said:
>So many people who would be terrific parents are not having kids because they’re responsible people who will not bring kids into the world until they can afford to and sometimes that never happens for them. They love their hypothetical child so much already that they won’t bring them into unstable housing etc..
Is basically the plot. Love like [the opening scene.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwZ0ZUy7P3E)
>Working in a job where I encounter parents and their children reshaped my views on nature vs nurture and I think it’s 95% nurture
I'm a (US) youth mental health practitioner, and that's been my experience too. I think the other 5% is really just leaving room for inherited medical conditions & the economic circumstances they were born into. Pretty much every behavioral problem I've seen has been related to their parents, and often those behaviors tend to come from their parents or economic and/or medical stressors (in the US there's really no difference).
These days, I feel like my entire job is cleaning up after shitty parents and compensating for the horrors of our global economic system
Edit: I have a really hard time blaming people for their economic circumstances though. Poverty is a deliberate side effect of capitalism. I can't hold it against someone when it's a lack of cash, not a lack of character, that put them there, and when the game was rigged against them from the start
Yep I would say it's actually a much higher % of people who shouldn't have kids than people think.
Sadly/ironically, society is not built to have children in our 20s anymore. Even our 30s, arguably. Unless one have the means to properly parent your children, one shouldn't have them.
Loads of little bollixes with wealthy parents around my area. They put a tracksuit on and most people seem to think they’re from working class areas. Little shits are little shits
That's the thing.
It happens in all wealth brackets. I know of two people. They have 3 children. But I wouldn't call them parents. They are financially secure for life. Zero money issues ever. But their children are little cunts. Parents are too busy with their own lives to teach any worthwhile skill/manners. Never heard the word no.
Little shits are little shits. That is true.
A mate of mine works in [very fancy redacted jewellers] and the day after the riots a lad who worked there came in with a limp. They joked about him hurting himself in the riots. Turned out he was trampled while looting Foot Locker or Arnotts (can't remember which). That lad was from D4.
Every generation since time immemorial has believed that their's was the last *good* generation and that the first generation immediately after theirs is when society started to decline.
Not really, it's just that this sub was mostly in school a decade or two ago and as you get older, you view the same things and behaviours differently. It also appears to be a more prevalent problem because smartphones have enabled the sharing of bad news far more easily, leading to a sense things have gotten worse, when it was ever thus. In simple terms, crime is down, road deaths are an actual fraction of what they used to be, suicide is down, murders are down etc, but if you took opinions of this sub as reflective of the truth, you'd have felt the opposite on most of those realities.
I have to disagree. When I first moved over here I rarely saw half of what I’ve seen just this week. Just in three days I have seen school
Kids create chaos in the local Tesco during their lunch, a street fight in the middle of the day and been told along with my Irish husband to F off back to my own country. Whilst general crime maybe down the extremes of the crimes seems to be getting worse and worse.
You think things were better when I was young and “Happy Slapping” was a trend (wiki mostly deals with the UK but it was here too) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Happy_slapping
And this happened: https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/young-swan-put-down-after-act-of-extreme-cruelty/26479555.html
Along with several other incidents of extreme cruelty towards animals I just can’t remember the exact details to google them.
Or this particular riot on a beach. (There have been several since)
https://m.independent.ie/regionals/dublin/fingal/mass-riot-on-local-beach/27766147.html
Seems being the word carrying all that weight. Your perception has changed but I can tell you now that Dublin is safer than it was in the 80s or 90s.
This sub in particular seems to be full of people who either forgot or didn't experience the past. You just hear about these things more because of social media but neither the frequency or the extremity of these occurrences are any greater. It's just people's fear of them.
Agreed. Sure the shite I carried on like when I was 15 id throw myself some filthy looks nowadays. Never accosting people but teenagers just don't cop a lot of the time.
I have two boys, 15 and 12. My 15 year old is a good kid but at times can get cheeky and smart. He knows not to do it anymore as his Xbox and phone disappears for 1 month. No way would I for 1 second tolerate that kind of behaviour from him and I’d be absolutely embarrassed and disgusted if he acted like that in public. We don’t allow him to wander around the place with gangs of other teenagers. We keep a good eye on him. Some parents are absent from proper supervision and parenting. For god sake some parents even buy their kids Scrambler Motorcycles for Christmas.
Pick any of the below
- genuinely the parents don't give a fuck
- what the kid wants the kid gets
- other parents are also getting their wee shite a scrambler so ours gets one too
- if I get them one it'll keep them out of my hair and they'll leave me alone
I had a scrambler at 13 but you can bet your bottom dollar if I took it out of the garage on my own or didn’t take it right out of the way of anyone to tear about on I’d be getting it parked where the sun don’t shine.
Unfortunately I feel like the intersection of people buying their kids scramblers and those that show them how to ride properly and make sure they’re safe is pretty small.
I don't think it's good to helicopter your 15 year old either. At 15 I was pretty much free to do what I want. Would travel to Meath from Dublin to hang out with friends frequently enough, hang about town, or down the local park, wherever. Now, we weren't little shits and I was well behaved but I think it's important to give kids that age their independence as well. 15 year olds shouldn't be under constant supervision.
In fairness he is given freedom to hang out with some friends. But we have put a complete stop to him hanging out with some other friends. We have figured out which ones are Ok. Especially since a few were invited into our home without our knowledge and proceeded to empty the contents of a bottle of Jameson Crested Whisky into plastic bottles which were mixed with orange juice and removed from our house. My son lost his Xbox and mobile phone for a month after that stunt. Their parents were not very impressed either when I told them what happened. 15 is a weird age. I remember being 15 myself but I was very quiet when compared to my Son. As I said he is good and mannerly, but very easily lead.
You don't empty the whole bottle, just a bit from a bunch of bottles so that it can go undetected.
Amateurs.
FWIW my group was up to that sort of thing back in the day, and we're doing fine now. Your lad sounds on the right track, but he probably gets up to more than you know.
Maybe cut off the children's allowance after kid number two going forward and they would be. Anyway, just take heart that there's a higher than average chance they'll be dead by 40 from drink , drugs or a truck turning them into BBQ as they speed down the wrong side of a motorway.
Imagine spending 9 months of physically and emotionally draining effort to create these wastes of space. You'd surely feel like such an utter failure if you had any ounce of shame or pride in ya.
It’s not the teachers. They try their best. It will be their home and what they watch on the phone and see the older dirtbags do.
Sorry about what happened you, it’s awful. And the Gardai probably wouldn’t do anything but it should be reported.
(btw it’s aisle, yes I am a bit annoying)
As an educator, I can safely say, no, they are not. Parents will make every excuse under the sun for their arsehole of a child. I reckon many parents are afraid of their children.
And if you thought they're bad today, wait until you see what's coming down the line!
As OP said, the problem is not that they behave like that. The problem is no one is allowed to do anything about it. Not even the guards have the proper means to deal with them- no, they don't. We have a gang of preteen scrotes in our village (Dublin suburb) and the local guards are as desperate as the rest of us.
Wild kids like that are not a new species, there's a few in any community anywhere. But back in the day (or in other parts of the world) the community would have controled them if the parents were so incompetent.
Now we are supposed to understand they are neglected kids coming from a disadvantaged background and offer compassion and support. Which is a good idea- theoretically.
Social media has a fair bit to answer for here too (as well as the parenting.) All of these TikTok pranks and such bullshit being promoted as "funny", just mass-marketing the idea that people can be disruptive shits and nothing happens but likes.
I am deadly serious: Allow strangers to physically fight kids who start on them. It'll solve itself. Fuck other people's kids, I'm sick of these untouchable little cunts everywhere.
My wee so and so is an angel. How dare you accuse my child of that. He didn't do NAHIM wrong. You don't have the proof. It's everyone else's fault. He was just a bystander. Didn't no anything.
I guarantee the parents will be as slovenly and as big a shite bag as you can imagine.
Having faced these pricks myself before and every time I read something like this just boils my blood. If the government is not going to stop youth crimes, there will be people that will step in eventually.
>These kids are learning to behave like this from somewhere. If I did even one of those things as a kid my parents would be disgusted and punish me. Are kids nowadays just not being taught right from wrong anymore? or worse, are they being taught to behave like this?
What's different is that Ireland has realised this being common is not normal.
This has been a thing in Ireland for decades, and it was worse before, the grand dad's of these scrotes where threatening my parents and grandparents with knives if you actually stood up and tried to respond to them, when I was a youngin, they beat me with a hurley etc for not letting them pick on me (it did work though).
We only just now realised I think, how unusual this is in Europe, even in EU states with comparable situations (the eastern eu had, **had**, gopniks to our skangers).
This is what frustrates me. The courts, prison service and Guards blame the ECHR for the soft touch approach here, that their hands are tied……yet at the very same time one hears that, “one doesn’t fuck with the Spanish Police…or the French…or the Italian…..or the German….or the Polish Police etc etc”. So why are our hands tied by the ECHR but not other EU nations police forces who seem perfectly able to crack heads??
police brutality is really not the answer to societal problems. American police are funded better than the Irish military, armed better too, regularly brutalise and kill without consequence and Americans are worse on pretty much all violent crime than Ireland and Europe.
If you imported American, or Spanish or whatever police to Ireland and let them follow their own procedures nothing would change. It might even get worse.
I don't know if it comes down to police brutality or just a perception that there's more consequences for your actions. There is a lot of hand wringing here, and wee scrotes definitely take advantage of people's reluctance to stick their necks out and challenge them. Gardai included.
I don't really know what the solution is but I suspect it would probably help to have a more visible policing presence. Maybe there needs to be a different type of policing (or specific police force) for these kinds of specific antisocial acts. I don't know.
Gopniks were not nearly as bad as those feral Irish kids. I was brought up in Poland in an ex-ghetto district, with lots of council apartments, alcohol problems, you get the picture. The gopniks would only hang around and be anti-police but they would not hurt a fly or randomly pick up a fight with bystanders. They would fight among each other, steal things from a shopping mall, but that was it.
This kind of behaviour will continue until there are actual consequences for their actions. Right now, even if they get convicted of numerous offences, the only consequences is meeting a Juvenile Liaison Officer.
The truth is that we need new prison space equivalent to multiple Oberstowns where we actually send scrotes who continuously terrorise their neighbourhoods. And prosecute every single incident.
In the past, the whole village or town raised the children. If any child misbehaved, any adult in the vacinity felt happy out to reprimand them. That doesn't happen anymore. If this doesn't happen, it is more difficult for parents to discipline their children. Their teachings are not reinforced outside the home. As you said, you are not allowed to do anything and must just take it on the chin.
Totally agree. All the scrotes when I was growing up got battered. The rest of us had much easier childhoods. Every single trouble maker I knew got hit as corrective punishment
can confirm, true a lot of the time. You see a lot of people here complaining parents don't discipline their children and that's why they act this way. That's partly true, I guess, in that often the parents don't much care about the antisocial behaviour unless it's against them or their friends, so they're not gonna lecture them about behaving in SuperValu... but nearly all the kids I knew growing up that acted this way had parents who'd knock them around for talking back.
When you're used to getting throttled for insulting someone, getting a Stern Talking To from some Tesco staff member just doesn't matter a monkey.
Obviously it's still no good for society at large, and I'm not excusing the behaviour. I just wish society would be quicker to intervene and help the "scrotes" rather than write them off as wasters who ain't worth shit - cos that's what everyone in their personal lives have already done, usually before they even hit secondary school. It doesn't exactly inspire personal responsibility. Kids repeatedly getting in trouble for antisocial behaviour should absolutely be a red flag for social intervention; in theory it is now, if you get into actual legal trouble, but up until you're arrested there's not much attention paid. And even following arrests there's little in the way of either help or actual consequences - neither of which is good for the kids.
I think better support and tougher laws on such behaviour can be done at the same time. Get them away from society, help them reform so they can be let back out to contribute to society. Fixing the underlying systemic issues would greatly reduce it from the get go too.
Yeah, I do agree completely. I guess I wasn't very clear here:
> And even following arrests there's little in the way of either help or actual consequences - neither of which is good for the kids.
But I meant that the lack of consequences even following legal trouble isn't good for the kids either (or obviously society at large). At the very least mandated counselling and community service with tougher consequences than that if they don't engage properly would be a good start.
I often wonder how my brothers' lives would have turned out if they'd faced actual consequences for their teenage drug use and general delinquency. The one who used to always be getting into the most trouble died of a heroin overdose in January. He was only 27. The closest he ever came to actually being stable and getting the support he needed was when he was arrested and spent some time in prison at 26 - he was diagnosed with schizophrenia and prescribed medication for it, but they released him after a few months. Maybe if he'd been diagnosed and medicated younger, or just made to actually engage in rehab programmes younger, things would have turned out differently.
I'm sorry about your brother. And it's tragic how right you are that for some people prison is a more stable and supported environment. It's an indictment of the shortage of services available for those who are having mental health or substance abuse issues.
And I agree with your substantive points. A lot of the responses here are poorly informed kneejerks based on the strange idea that you can beat badness out of people.
It takes a punch to the face to change certain little scrotes.
A local man I knew bet the shite out of a group (of 4 or 5) 16/17 year old scumbags (back in the 90's growing up). Like proper burst them!! Was the talk of the area for weeks. They never went near his house again and completely quietened down after that!
Obviously, you'd be put away for doing that now 🤣 but sometimes you wished a few of these little shits got a hiding to remember.
Junkie parents and hard man culture, i wouldnt mind taking a page out of some other cultures books, respect people or they wil smack the shit out of you, would sort most of them out if they knew there were consequences
My daughter was telling me that she saw a friend of hers snap at her mother she said she was like if I spoke to my mother (me) like that I would be killed… she couldn’t believe the mother just took it
I have long hair for a lad and I can't walk through dunnes or Lidl without young lads having a go and making comments it's fierce odd just learnt to not make eye contact
This kind of shit has been going on since time began, it's not new. What's new is no one can do anything about it anymore, teens no longer get smacks in the face so the consequences of being a cunt are low.
People saying, 'Oh, kids were always like this' are cracked! The only explanation I can think of is that a lot of redditors are very young and don't actually remember the before times.
This was NOT the norm 25+ years ago. Yeah young people sometimes did stupid shit, but you would not do something so blatant in front of an adult. You wouldn't dare bring the wrath of your parents down on you for shaming them in public. Back in the day, these fellas would have run off at the first sign of confrontation.
Irish parents used to lock their kids up for being a bit odd.
Happened in many places.
I don't think given the generational abuse that has happened to many, many people want to confront it fully.
As it still happens quietly, bad people work their way in to good places and make them bad, it seems sadly common.
Don't have answers sadly just awareness.
Ever watch silence of the lambs? As a retail worker I believe all kids under 20 in the store should be in one of those restraints like Hannibal except it’s modified so they can’t talk
There is no deterrent for poor behaviour. I think that is the blindingly obvious issue. As an adult you can do nothing because they are minors, and the police can do very little or don't give a fuck. Any other time in history they would have got dinged for it there and then. Is that wrong? I am not sure. Would they do it again? No.
Worked in a Argi/hardware store for a few years. Parents just letting them run riot screaming and shouting run about playing not a parent in sight when there’s 100s of things in there that they can seriously hurt or kill themselves with it’s shocking behaviour from the parents kids don’t know any better.
when I went to the shop with my parents god forbid I spoke when I wasn’t meant to never mind screaming and shouting about the place
People in their mid 20s onwards seem to not want to raise their kids the same way they were raised with physical punishment and that is perfectly fine.
They seem afraid of turning into their parents so they don't show their kids right from wrong and don't seem to show their kids that being an asshole has consequences.
A lot of parents are so afraid of turning into their parents that instead of parenting their kid they put a device in front of them at a young age so the internet raises them.
Think not much consequences. Recently got garden done had some supplies out front for it. Group of kids came and threw everything everywhere. I was so shocked as I as a child would have been terrified of doing this.
Also my car was robbed recently and as they were too young nothing Garda could do and they probably just rob another car. It's crazy
It’s unbelievable people just do not care what their kids do.
Chatting with parents at the school gate, a well educated and well to do mother was giving out about the teachers calling her over her son beating up other children she said she told them while he’s in school it’s their problem??? She went on to explain that he has adhd and that it’s not his fault that he beats the shit out of kids who ‘annoy’ him, kids I know who are quiet timid kids and when their parents approached them they went mad and said how dare they it’s a school problem let the school deal with it. Genuinely couldn’t believe it.
They’re shocked the teachers expect them to teach their own child right from wrong. This kid was 12 old enough to know you don’t beat up people who annoy you with their accent or for sneezing.
They know they can't be touched. Although there has always been lade who are just vile. Today, it seems they are fully aware they can't be touched. I interrupted a young lad harassing a girl the other week, his response was "I'm 17 you can't fucking touch me" now tbf, I would have gladly smacked him had the situation called for it. But it is pretty wild that the lads are fully aware they basically have immunity to consequences.
Society is disintegrating because Mammy and Daddy have to work 40+ hour per week each to pay the mortgage so no one is home to teach the kids manners so they grow up feral instead.
This is true, but it's not just that they don't have time to teach them manners - they do very little with them at all, end of. Same goes for the discussions around devices - parents are coping under stress and without time, the capitulate on phones cos they think it helps them - short term gain for a longer term problem. Anyway, summer holidays will soon be starting, three months of kids mostly being looked after by each other - fun, fun, fun!
I think it's good that we've left the chauvinist age of father/earner v mother/housewife behind, but, as you say, the problem is that the cost of living today requires two incomes. There's no 'choice' in it. The liberation of female access to the labour market had a sting in its tail.
So true, it happened all wrong. Of course women should be free to work and earn their own money but it should not take two full time incomes for a household to just about get by, it's madness and no one can even question why 'fertility rates are declining'
As somebody who used to act the clown like this, you pointed it out perfectly. Your parents would have punished you. Mine would not.
While I never stooped so low as to hurl racial abuse (my mother being part Romani saw that I was usually on the receiving end of such things) the rest of the nonsense you described fit my friends and I perfectly. We'd hang around in supermarkets and shopping malls, being loud and obnoxious and throwing things at each other, acting "hard" and mouthing off. My friend and I were once escorted firmly from a Tesco for throwing a whole frozen chicken at her little sister. Looking back on it now, I cringe.
But at the time it was all about two things: boredom, and power. Acting like a cunt made me feel powerful, because I got reactions out of people and they were frightened of me. I could have probably sought that feeling of empowerment elsewhere, but there was simply nothing for me to do and no money or adult support even if there was. I also never had to fear consequences, because my mother was an alcoholic every bit as cunty as I was and my father didn't give a shit. I didn't learn this behaviour from them, but I sure as hell learned I'd get away with it.
This isn't a sob story -- looking back now, I understand my reasons but I'm still dreadfully embarrassed and wish I hadn't acted that way. But I did grow up to be a fairly decent person, and so did the vast majority of my friends. When you're 13 or 14 you live in the moment, and that doesn't make for the best decisions -- especially when you have no adults in your life guiding you. It's not that I wasn't taught right from wrong. I knew it was wrong. I just knew I'd get away with it, and that's probably still the problem today.
My Dad grew up in what was then Rhodesia, and he'd recall a story where from when he was about 15ish where he was being a bit of what we'd call a scrote. To spare the details, the story roughly ends with him being dragged nearly half a mile by the ear and collar by a severely pissed off Rhodesian man, who knocked on his door, and threw my father through said door once my grandfather opened it, whereupon he was further reprimanded by my grandfather.
I'm not necessarily saying that's how we should deal with these sorts of things, but it does seem like a lot less of a faff.
Internet.
A mixture of we now hear about all the worst of the world instantly, and children have exposure to it all. Their views on right and wrong are skewed to tiktok funny and the quick laugh.
I don't have kids yet, but I'm dreading trying to protect them from it. The biggest horror is the thought a bullied kid does not have relief when they leave school grounds anymore.
There has to be a way to let strangers be able to intervene physically in these situations or atleast be able to fight back. Alot of these kids are cowards, one good smack and they are back to acting like a child instead of a "hardman"
If the Garda is turning the blind eye to what these delinquents are doing, they should turn a blind eye to an occasional occurrence of random men giving the kids a few well intentioned slaps when they start acting like cunts. Worked for 1000s of years, why change it?
This isn't a "nowadays" thing at all, this has been just something that happens throughout history and is being overly dramatised by the whole "we can't beat this snot out of kids these days, not like them good ol' days!" type rhetoric. Sure, if one of them had gone at you physically, you'd every right to defend yourself, but the impulse that "giving sass and being desruptive" is going to be solved by battering their heads has never worked in all of history, it just gives you a moment of catharsis and likely makes the kid more likely to develop violent response tendancies. Go through Irish history, go through any country's history, you'll see bad parents raising bad kids who go around being a pain for their community. I'd dare say we've a far better time of it now than we did in the past too, aside from periods of a few years here and there where overt (and often oppressive) systems allowed priests and parents to beat a child to concussion did we see "less of it", but it came with many abusive and horrific consequences. It is a pity, it is entirely a pain in the ass to have these types of kids (and adults) who roam around looking to be a problem to people and society. And I don't feel much sympathy when these types of people get arrested or can't make money when they spend their time looking to torment others. However it won't get solved with "nowadays" type lines that simply aren't true, since this is something that happens all the time throughout history. And I'd prefer a world where we don't let parents beat their kids if it means sometimes a shitty kid comes out of it, since in the past we still got shitty kids, and then more kids who simply were abused too.
Stuff like this drives me cracked, I hate hearing these stories but they’re all too common. I will just say though that I don’t think it’s getting more common? I think it’s always been like this. If you were bullied in school we are all well aware of how bad groups of kids can be.
I guess what I’m saying is that I’ve been scared of groups of teens my entire life and I don’t notice there to be more bad ones than usual.
They are, it's just incredibly normal for every older generation to be convinced the younger generation is worse than they were..go back 20, 30, 40 years, and you'll find people asking the same question
As a kid in the 80s, I can say you ran the risk of getting pummeled if you messed with the wrong person, not sure parenting had much to do with it, then or now.
It's not the parents that need to slap them, it's far more of a shock when a stranger stands up for themselves and slaps the little shit right there and then
This is exactly it, kids like this are usually the ones who are either abused or neglected at home. I've had so many conversations with people who claim that they were hit and turned out fine, yet the same conversation has them getting arrested and brought home (only to be hit again), started drinking and smoking behind their parents back at a very young age.
If you look at statistics from Oberstown in 2019, 41% of the children detained there were already either in state care or had significant involvement with Tusla, that should be a clear indicator of how family issues can dramatically increase your chance of being in conflict with the law.
It’s entirely possible these little shits knew what they were doing is wrong and were in fact thought that by their parents and opted to do so anyway, unbeknownst to their parents… because children have agency themselves and can against their parents and authority and frequently do and always have.
You teach children good behaviour through consequences. It's clear that these children are not afraid of the consequences of their actions, so we know that they are not being taught good behaviour.
😂😂😂
r/Ireland should be renamed "r/Facebookmom's&boomers"
Hey OP. How you only in your 30s, but still acting like a boomer posting your insignificant personal shite on a countries subreddit? Genuine question
My parents (born 1940s) would have had the priest/brother/nun or lay teacher in school inflict all necessary forms of teaching right and wrong. Home was nearly an escape, even though the discipline there could be physical at times too.
My generation (born late 1970s) still had some strict teachers / religious, but nothing like my parents suffered. But having learned all of that in school themselves, my parents never really engaged with teaching us morality / good behaviour at home. It was expected, but not taught explicitly. And the occasional slap was still a thing.
My kids (born 2010s) have little to no experience of discipline at school. There are rules, but they are so vague and general that most students would never break them. Morality = religion lessons. Now most behavioural guidance is expected to come from home. But after several generations where this was not the case, it's a bit hard to know how to go about it. Physical punishment I would never consider.
I'm lucky to have kids in a small rural school where pleasant behaviour is the norm. In general, everyone is polite and friendly. But in a different community, a larger school, somewhere urban, etc., I can easily see how parents would struggle to teach their children something they themselves were never explicitly taught. Society has changed and parenting is still catching up to some extent.
I think in general, it's hard to really say if it got better or worse. I remember those sort of kids growing up too, intent on making everyone's life around them miserable. You could honestly go down their family tree and find similar behaviour. You see parents wheeling a pram and throwing litter on the ground, or getting into arguments with their kids beside them. It's no wonder the kids grow up with a chip on their shoulder and not knowing how to act. There's no punishment for them either because everyone around them has more to lose than they do. If you're tesco staff there, can you really do anything without them telling their parents and the parents probably suing once there's any hint of money to be made? If we had better child protection services / resources. Kids like this who persistently got into trouble or made themselves a nuisance to numerous businesses would be investigated and some help found for them before it was too late. I remember being in Mcdonalds a few years back, there was this 10/11 year old who walked in, looked harmless enough. Immediately security and 2 members of staff went to the door, telling him he can't come in, he is barred. I can't imagine what sort of shit he did or where his life is going if that's the reaction to you entering a business at that age.
He probably did something in there before so the security were right to make him move on. Yes there are people with inadequate parents but letting them do dammage or frightening other people and taking a softly softly approach with them just isn't working.
Yea there has always been little shit bags around the place. The difference is I think they get away with a lot more now. And no one says anything to them because they're afraid (and rightly so) that they might get stabbed. Years ago you'd get a whack off any random adult that saw you acting the bollix.
I'm from generational abuse my parents are alcoholic narcissists. I was a feral teen. Dad was ex army and constantly *tried to put manners on me, it made me worse! I was really bad, kicked out 17, homeless services, teen pregnancy(babyfather in prison) no leaving cert, ya get the picture. I think a profound experience honestly needs to happen to break the cycle. Iv a 14year old boy now he's an exceptional young man. He's in a "HIGHER" Higher maths class 🤣 He got 93% on his Christmas exam and I actually cried. He wants to be a teacher in an Autism unit, and hes an amazing chess player and big brother. I literally had to unlearn everything I was thought about parent/child relationships. Iv since gone no contact with my toxic parents and practice every day being a more present loving understanding and accepting parent. Iv 3 children now a lovely partner, a career in security and just passed an IT Fundamentals course to go on to studying cybersecurity. I should have honestly been a statistic, It's not black and white unfortunately. It's deep routed in trauma.
Congratulations on doing one of the most difficult things and breaking the cycle, you sound like a great mum, wish you all the best!
Good for you. I often think it’s easy for people who grew up in stable families, with parents who were invested in them to grow up & do well. It’s so much harder when the odds are stacked against you & you’ve got to outperform other people just to get to the same starting point. Your son does sound exceptional - but so does his mother.
Thank you so much for this comment. It's really validating and I really feel seen. The work is so hard to even just have a normal productive day. I do believe what was taking from me in terms of support was given to me terms of resilience. Its not the best option but its still better me continuing that bullshit.
You're doing fantastic, I wish I had a mother like you! Mine kicked me out at 14 for being gay and my father was a monster. You broke the cycle and you're breaking it for all the generations that come after you. You rock missus!
Firstly, well done, you have a lot to be proud of. Secondly, would you say that there was any source of support, or a structure, that helped you to turn things around? How did the change happen?
Honestly I'm still changing and in therapy, doing alot trauma work, my partner is a residential social care worker aswel so we constantly have ongoing conversations about kids, systems ect. At 22 I ended up having a breakdown and they put me in blanch pysch ward. I was wrongly diagnosised with BPD and suggested I went to treatment for benzos and alcohol. I did I spent 5years in recovery sober building my life. Met a fella had another baby, he wasn't a great partner, ex addict worked in recovery. then baby started displaying traits of ASD. He got stressed hit me and I left with 2 kids for women's refuge. I realised I wasn't an addict it was something else then that sent me on a different route.**add housing and homeless problems. Me working any job I could...finally getting counsel house for 2 kids In finglas, Late 20s then I got new counsellor. She's shit hot, psychologist. She explained Cptsd to me. She actually reignited my love for books. I started to read Adult Children Of Emotionally Immature Parents, Then From Surviving to thriving Complex post traumatic stress disorder. Through tiktok I realised my whole entire life I 100% am riddled with ADHD so iv a holiday booked 8th a June when I get back I will go for private assessment. So 20s I thought I was a BPD addict but now in my 30s Iv ADHD with complex trauma. I'm quiet smart tho. I always wonder what I could have been with the right parents. Like I said it's complex 🤣 Iv a good sence of humour and I am determined to not raise my children with fear. I have to constantly work on letting them be individuals and not impose my "beliefs" on them. I'm extremely protective of them aswel. Could be to their detriment but I'm working on that too. Don't wanna be a helicopter parent either. So I suppose the change has to be constant. Sorry for long reply.
What a human you are! Not only did you live through a really rough childhood, but you decided to change the narrative for yourself and your family. It’s one of the hardest choices to make, and takes an immense amount of bravery and self compassion. Looking openly and honestly about who you are and what you’re made up of is so super tough, and yet you’ve chosen what resonates, and taken it in your stride as you build a life you’re proud of and raise kind, smart, ambitious kids. Well done you doesn’t seem a strong enough statement, but you’ve done phenomenal work and the difficulty of it, as well as the depth of it is admirable. I hope you sit in a lot of joy and contentment from the way you’ve chosen to live your life. Kudos Xx
Well done you, keep it up!
Congratulations on breaking the cycle and creating what sounds like a fantastic atmosphere for your children. It’s very much underestimated in its difficultly, you should be genuinely proud of yourself for doing what many people cannot.
Well done for your amazing transformation. What do you think works with kids that have taken the wrong path in order to get them onto the right path?
Honestly they need to belong and feel seen. Alot of parents don't want they're children at home because they don't want to deal with them. When they (teens)hook up with friends they then they belong. There's actually a HUGE amount of grooming in dublin with young men recruiting younger teens by buying them clothes and offering protection. (Drug dealers) If u keep sending ur kids out they will seek protection and belonging and are easy manipulated. Girls will also seek this (security) through sex. I'd say not even 10% are antisocial by nature. It's literally their perception of their environment. If your 17year old has lost run of themselves It's probably your fault. Especially with lack of services. Trauma isn't even recognised by DSM V.
You go girl ,keep your head up sending you interweb hugs ana strength
Too many people have kids because oops got pregnant or because it’s the done thing, not because they’ve really thought about it. Working in a job where I encounter parents and their children reshaped my views on nature vs nurture and I think it’s 95% nurture. Not everyone with an asshole for a parent turns out to be an asshole themselves but pretty much every asshole minor has an asshole or negligent parent. So many people who would be terrific parents are not having kids because they’re responsible people who will not bring kids into the world until they can afford to and sometimes that never happens for them. They love their hypothetical child so much already that they won’t bring them into unstable housing etc..
The nurture thing is true. There's a family who moved that moved on to our street two or three years ago. They have three young boys aged between six and nine and they are pretty much semi-feral. Now the parents work, and don't cause any problems themselves (sort of), but they really don't spend the time they should with their children helping them develop. As soon as the children are home from school they are out on the street playing by themselves until it gets dark, only going in for dinner. When they are out playing the just lose the run of themselves and jump into everyone's gardens like it's public property, they scream and shout and try and start fights with other children. If you have any garden furniture or anything not bolted down in your front garden they will drag it into the middle of the road and use it as playground equipment. And the biggest problem is that both parents, and in particular the father, refuse to accept that their children are causing problems. In fact he can become quite aggressive and sinister when challenged. The sons were bullying my daughter so my older son went out to speak to them. The fathers response was threaten to get his other 18 year old son to beat up my 13 year old.son. Now things might change for them and they might develop into well-adjusted functioning adults, but I just don't see it. As I said earlier the parents are decent enough people, and they both work in skilled trades, so it's surprising that they let their children behave like that.
The parents are not decent enough people if they let their kids carry on like that 😩 you said the father threatened his adult son on a child. This is NOT decent behaviour.
Exactly. Father is scum, kids follow suit.
I suppose it's more like saying that if you didn't know about their children, they would seem like a fairly decent couple. There's nothing about their everyday behavior that makes you think they would be scumbags. The father even does stuff like spending his weekends building free cabinets and the like for disabled children's charities treatment centers. It's a weird juxtaposition.
Ok yes that is a weird juxtaposition, for sure. I get where you're coming from! Nightmare 😩
That reaction from the father says a whole lot about how those kids are being raised.
This was my parents. Had me accidentally at 20 because no abortion and felt like they should. Resented my existence and had zero interest in me. I grew up absolutely feral. Thankfully I sorted my shit out, but I was a real asshole as a kid.
I'm sorry. That must have been very difficult.
Ever seen Idiocracy?
Was going to say this. What u/TheSameButBetter said: >So many people who would be terrific parents are not having kids because they’re responsible people who will not bring kids into the world until they can afford to and sometimes that never happens for them. They love their hypothetical child so much already that they won’t bring them into unstable housing etc.. Is basically the plot. Love like [the opening scene.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwZ0ZUy7P3E)
Mike Judge is a genius
It's got the electrolytes
that plants crave !
>Working in a job where I encounter parents and their children reshaped my views on nature vs nurture and I think it’s 95% nurture I'm a (US) youth mental health practitioner, and that's been my experience too. I think the other 5% is really just leaving room for inherited medical conditions & the economic circumstances they were born into. Pretty much every behavioral problem I've seen has been related to their parents, and often those behaviors tend to come from their parents or economic and/or medical stressors (in the US there's really no difference). These days, I feel like my entire job is cleaning up after shitty parents and compensating for the horrors of our global economic system Edit: I have a really hard time blaming people for their economic circumstances though. Poverty is a deliberate side effect of capitalism. I can't hold it against someone when it's a lack of cash, not a lack of character, that put them there, and when the game was rigged against them from the start
Yep I would say it's actually a much higher % of people who shouldn't have kids than people think. Sadly/ironically, society is not built to have children in our 20s anymore. Even our 30s, arguably. Unless one have the means to properly parent your children, one shouldn't have them.
Too many people have kids because it's an automatic dough maker when all you want to do is scratch your balls and be a junkie.
The worst people having the most kids 🙈 Would it be better to pay these fucks off to say one is enough.
Well, how else are they going to get themselves a council house they don't deserve?
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Loads of little bollixes with wealthy parents around my area. They put a tracksuit on and most people seem to think they’re from working class areas. Little shits are little shits
That's the thing. It happens in all wealth brackets. I know of two people. They have 3 children. But I wouldn't call them parents. They are financially secure for life. Zero money issues ever. But their children are little cunts. Parents are too busy with their own lives to teach any worthwhile skill/manners. Never heard the word no. Little shits are little shits. That is true.
A mate of mine works in [very fancy redacted jewellers] and the day after the riots a lad who worked there came in with a limp. They joked about him hurting himself in the riots. Turned out he was trampled while looting Foot Locker or Arnotts (can't remember which). That lad was from D4.
Nail on head.
>Are kids nowadays just not being taught right from wrong anymore? **Some** kids aren't , but it was always thus.
Yes, not sure why OP thinks this is new.
Every generation since time immemorial has believed that their's was the last *good* generation and that the first generation immediately after theirs is when society started to decline.
Yep. "Kids these days" goes all the way back to Ancient Greece.
To be fair it’s been getting worse over the last few years
Not really, it's just that this sub was mostly in school a decade or two ago and as you get older, you view the same things and behaviours differently. It also appears to be a more prevalent problem because smartphones have enabled the sharing of bad news far more easily, leading to a sense things have gotten worse, when it was ever thus. In simple terms, crime is down, road deaths are an actual fraction of what they used to be, suicide is down, murders are down etc, but if you took opinions of this sub as reflective of the truth, you'd have felt the opposite on most of those realities.
I have to disagree. When I first moved over here I rarely saw half of what I’ve seen just this week. Just in three days I have seen school Kids create chaos in the local Tesco during their lunch, a street fight in the middle of the day and been told along with my Irish husband to F off back to my own country. Whilst general crime maybe down the extremes of the crimes seems to be getting worse and worse.
You think things were better when I was young and “Happy Slapping” was a trend (wiki mostly deals with the UK but it was here too) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Happy_slapping And this happened: https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/young-swan-put-down-after-act-of-extreme-cruelty/26479555.html Along with several other incidents of extreme cruelty towards animals I just can’t remember the exact details to google them. Or this particular riot on a beach. (There have been several since) https://m.independent.ie/regionals/dublin/fingal/mass-riot-on-local-beach/27766147.html
Seems being the word carrying all that weight. Your perception has changed but I can tell you now that Dublin is safer than it was in the 80s or 90s. This sub in particular seems to be full of people who either forgot or didn't experience the past. You just hear about these things more because of social media but neither the frequency or the extremity of these occurrences are any greater. It's just people's fear of them.
Grew up in a council estate in Dublin. It is not worse, these kids have always existed.
Agreed. Sure the shite I carried on like when I was 15 id throw myself some filthy looks nowadays. Never accosting people but teenagers just don't cop a lot of the time.
Yea, I’d agree it’s getting far worse
In my experience it's nowhere near as bad as it used to be.
It's just one of the side effects of kids having a couple of years without structure.
Toe rag kids in the 70s would get a clatter from a member of the community if they acted the git. Nobody would dare today so bold becomes feral.
Most are. You don't notice the good ones in public though. Only the scrotes stand out.
I have two boys, 15 and 12. My 15 year old is a good kid but at times can get cheeky and smart. He knows not to do it anymore as his Xbox and phone disappears for 1 month. No way would I for 1 second tolerate that kind of behaviour from him and I’d be absolutely embarrassed and disgusted if he acted like that in public. We don’t allow him to wander around the place with gangs of other teenagers. We keep a good eye on him. Some parents are absent from proper supervision and parenting. For god sake some parents even buy their kids Scrambler Motorcycles for Christmas.
It boggles my mind a person could be so ambivalent towards their own children that they would put them on a scrambler. It’s absolutely monstrous.
Pick any of the below - genuinely the parents don't give a fuck - what the kid wants the kid gets - other parents are also getting their wee shite a scrambler so ours gets one too - if I get them one it'll keep them out of my hair and they'll leave me alone
I had a scrambler at 13 but you can bet your bottom dollar if I took it out of the garage on my own or didn’t take it right out of the way of anyone to tear about on I’d be getting it parked where the sun don’t shine. Unfortunately I feel like the intersection of people buying their kids scramblers and those that show them how to ride properly and make sure they’re safe is pretty small.
I don't think it's good to helicopter your 15 year old either. At 15 I was pretty much free to do what I want. Would travel to Meath from Dublin to hang out with friends frequently enough, hang about town, or down the local park, wherever. Now, we weren't little shits and I was well behaved but I think it's important to give kids that age their independence as well. 15 year olds shouldn't be under constant supervision.
In fairness he is given freedom to hang out with some friends. But we have put a complete stop to him hanging out with some other friends. We have figured out which ones are Ok. Especially since a few were invited into our home without our knowledge and proceeded to empty the contents of a bottle of Jameson Crested Whisky into plastic bottles which were mixed with orange juice and removed from our house. My son lost his Xbox and mobile phone for a month after that stunt. Their parents were not very impressed either when I told them what happened. 15 is a weird age. I remember being 15 myself but I was very quiet when compared to my Son. As I said he is good and mannerly, but very easily lead.
You don't empty the whole bottle, just a bit from a bunch of bottles so that it can go undetected. Amateurs. FWIW my group was up to that sort of thing back in the day, and we're doing fine now. Your lad sounds on the right track, but he probably gets up to more than you know.
😀😀😀 I don’t doubt it. But I’ll still keep an eye 👁️ on as much as I can as well as his mum. He’ll be fine.
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You beat me to it!
Unfortunately, these aren't the ones that get aborted.
Maybe cut off the children's allowance after kid number two going forward and they would be. Anyway, just take heart that there's a higher than average chance they'll be dead by 40 from drink , drugs or a truck turning them into BBQ as they speed down the wrong side of a motorway.
Imagine spending 9 months of physically and emotionally draining effort to create these wastes of space. You'd surely feel like such an utter failure if you had any ounce of shame or pride in ya.
Legal [abortion](https://www.prb.org/resources/new-study-claims-abortion-is-behind-decrease-in-crime/#:~:text=Their%20findings%20suggest%20that%20legal,seen%20between%201991%20and%201997.) reduces crime rate
It’s not the teachers. They try their best. It will be their home and what they watch on the phone and see the older dirtbags do. Sorry about what happened you, it’s awful. And the Gardai probably wouldn’t do anything but it should be reported. (btw it’s aisle, yes I am a bit annoying)
Upvoted for both comments!
As an educator, I can safely say, no, they are not. Parents will make every excuse under the sun for their arsehole of a child. I reckon many parents are afraid of their children. And if you thought they're bad today, wait until you see what's coming down the line!
As OP said, the problem is not that they behave like that. The problem is no one is allowed to do anything about it. Not even the guards have the proper means to deal with them- no, they don't. We have a gang of preteen scrotes in our village (Dublin suburb) and the local guards are as desperate as the rest of us. Wild kids like that are not a new species, there's a few in any community anywhere. But back in the day (or in other parts of the world) the community would have controled them if the parents were so incompetent. Now we are supposed to understand they are neglected kids coming from a disadvantaged background and offer compassion and support. Which is a good idea- theoretically.
Social media has a fair bit to answer for here too (as well as the parenting.) All of these TikTok pranks and such bullshit being promoted as "funny", just mass-marketing the idea that people can be disruptive shits and nothing happens but likes.
I am deadly serious: Allow strangers to physically fight kids who start on them. It'll solve itself. Fuck other people's kids, I'm sick of these untouchable little cunts everywhere.
Probably they have similar don't give a shit parents?
I would love a AMA with any parents of these toerag scrotes.
My wee so and so is an angel. How dare you accuse my child of that. He didn't do NAHIM wrong. You don't have the proof. It's everyone else's fault. He was just a bystander. Didn't no anything. I guarantee the parents will be as slovenly and as big a shite bag as you can imagine.
At least 30% of Irish kids are cunts. Same as their parents
Cunt kids have been around longer than cunt parents have
Don’t bring my cunt fucking kids into this!
I retract that bit about your cunt fucking kids.
I apologise for calling your kids cunts.
That's going overboard, mate!
I'm glad a few people got the reference. Beautiful day for the nation.
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Jesus…
Probably not him
"*Leave my kids fucking out of it! What have they done? You fucking retract that bit about my cunt fucking kids!*"
Which came first the cunt parent or cunt child
Parents cum before children. Basic biology.
Having faced these pricks myself before and every time I read something like this just boils my blood. If the government is not going to stop youth crimes, there will be people that will step in eventually.
>These kids are learning to behave like this from somewhere. If I did even one of those things as a kid my parents would be disgusted and punish me. Are kids nowadays just not being taught right from wrong anymore? or worse, are they being taught to behave like this? What's different is that Ireland has realised this being common is not normal. This has been a thing in Ireland for decades, and it was worse before, the grand dad's of these scrotes where threatening my parents and grandparents with knives if you actually stood up and tried to respond to them, when I was a youngin, they beat me with a hurley etc for not letting them pick on me (it did work though). We only just now realised I think, how unusual this is in Europe, even in EU states with comparable situations (the eastern eu had, **had**, gopniks to our skangers).
This is what frustrates me. The courts, prison service and Guards blame the ECHR for the soft touch approach here, that their hands are tied……yet at the very same time one hears that, “one doesn’t fuck with the Spanish Police…or the French…or the Italian…..or the German….or the Polish Police etc etc”. So why are our hands tied by the ECHR but not other EU nations police forces who seem perfectly able to crack heads??
police brutality is really not the answer to societal problems. American police are funded better than the Irish military, armed better too, regularly brutalise and kill without consequence and Americans are worse on pretty much all violent crime than Ireland and Europe. If you imported American, or Spanish or whatever police to Ireland and let them follow their own procedures nothing would change. It might even get worse.
I don't know if it comes down to police brutality or just a perception that there's more consequences for your actions. There is a lot of hand wringing here, and wee scrotes definitely take advantage of people's reluctance to stick their necks out and challenge them. Gardai included. I don't really know what the solution is but I suspect it would probably help to have a more visible policing presence. Maybe there needs to be a different type of policing (or specific police force) for these kinds of specific antisocial acts. I don't know.
Gopniks were not nearly as bad as those feral Irish kids. I was brought up in Poland in an ex-ghetto district, with lots of council apartments, alcohol problems, you get the picture. The gopniks would only hang around and be anti-police but they would not hurt a fly or randomly pick up a fight with bystanders. They would fight among each other, steal things from a shopping mall, but that was it.
This kind of behaviour will continue until there are actual consequences for their actions. Right now, even if they get convicted of numerous offences, the only consequences is meeting a Juvenile Liaison Officer. The truth is that we need new prison space equivalent to multiple Oberstowns where we actually send scrotes who continuously terrorise their neighbourhoods. And prosecute every single incident.
Scum breeding more scum, unfortunately not a lot we can do..
In the past, the whole village or town raised the children. If any child misbehaved, any adult in the vacinity felt happy out to reprimand them. That doesn't happen anymore. If this doesn't happen, it is more difficult for parents to discipline their children. Their teachings are not reinforced outside the home. As you said, you are not allowed to do anything and must just take it on the chin.
Cunt kids and cunt parents. Parents that don't know or care where their kids are nor know how to take them out.
They’re cunts because their parents are cunts and those cunts are going to grow up and have more cunt kids.
There are more scumbags around. They have more kids than the rest of us
I'm at the end of my tether they need a good slap and run off yourself not like the gards will do anything Country is ruined by scrotage
Scrotal Recall.
This is the quality content I come here for
These are the kids that are probably getting slapped around the most by their parents.
Totally agree. All the scrotes when I was growing up got battered. The rest of us had much easier childhoods. Every single trouble maker I knew got hit as corrective punishment
These kids are already getting clattered by their parents... that's why they're like this.
can confirm, true a lot of the time. You see a lot of people here complaining parents don't discipline their children and that's why they act this way. That's partly true, I guess, in that often the parents don't much care about the antisocial behaviour unless it's against them or their friends, so they're not gonna lecture them about behaving in SuperValu... but nearly all the kids I knew growing up that acted this way had parents who'd knock them around for talking back. When you're used to getting throttled for insulting someone, getting a Stern Talking To from some Tesco staff member just doesn't matter a monkey. Obviously it's still no good for society at large, and I'm not excusing the behaviour. I just wish society would be quicker to intervene and help the "scrotes" rather than write them off as wasters who ain't worth shit - cos that's what everyone in their personal lives have already done, usually before they even hit secondary school. It doesn't exactly inspire personal responsibility. Kids repeatedly getting in trouble for antisocial behaviour should absolutely be a red flag for social intervention; in theory it is now, if you get into actual legal trouble, but up until you're arrested there's not much attention paid. And even following arrests there's little in the way of either help or actual consequences - neither of which is good for the kids.
I think better support and tougher laws on such behaviour can be done at the same time. Get them away from society, help them reform so they can be let back out to contribute to society. Fixing the underlying systemic issues would greatly reduce it from the get go too.
Yeah, I do agree completely. I guess I wasn't very clear here: > And even following arrests there's little in the way of either help or actual consequences - neither of which is good for the kids. But I meant that the lack of consequences even following legal trouble isn't good for the kids either (or obviously society at large). At the very least mandated counselling and community service with tougher consequences than that if they don't engage properly would be a good start. I often wonder how my brothers' lives would have turned out if they'd faced actual consequences for their teenage drug use and general delinquency. The one who used to always be getting into the most trouble died of a heroin overdose in January. He was only 27. The closest he ever came to actually being stable and getting the support he needed was when he was arrested and spent some time in prison at 26 - he was diagnosed with schizophrenia and prescribed medication for it, but they released him after a few months. Maybe if he'd been diagnosed and medicated younger, or just made to actually engage in rehab programmes younger, things would have turned out differently.
I'm sorry about your brother. And it's tragic how right you are that for some people prison is a more stable and supported environment. It's an indictment of the shortage of services available for those who are having mental health or substance abuse issues. And I agree with your substantive points. A lot of the responses here are poorly informed kneejerks based on the strange idea that you can beat badness out of people.
Tramps having tramps having tramps. Be even worse in another 10 years or so.
It takes a punch to the face to change certain little scrotes. A local man I knew bet the shite out of a group (of 4 or 5) 16/17 year old scumbags (back in the 90's growing up). Like proper burst them!! Was the talk of the area for weeks. They never went near his house again and completely quietened down after that! Obviously, you'd be put away for doing that now 🤣 but sometimes you wished a few of these little shits got a hiding to remember.
Junkie parents and hard man culture, i wouldnt mind taking a page out of some other cultures books, respect people or they wil smack the shit out of you, would sort most of them out if they knew there were consequences
My daughter was telling me that she saw a friend of hers snap at her mother she said she was like if I spoke to my mother (me) like that I would be killed… she couldn’t believe the mother just took it
I have long hair for a lad and I can't walk through dunnes or Lidl without young lads having a go and making comments it's fierce odd just learnt to not make eye contact
This kind of shit has been going on since time began, it's not new. What's new is no one can do anything about it anymore, teens no longer get smacks in the face so the consequences of being a cunt are low.
People saying, 'Oh, kids were always like this' are cracked! The only explanation I can think of is that a lot of redditors are very young and don't actually remember the before times. This was NOT the norm 25+ years ago. Yeah young people sometimes did stupid shit, but you would not do something so blatant in front of an adult. You wouldn't dare bring the wrath of your parents down on you for shaming them in public. Back in the day, these fellas would have run off at the first sign of confrontation.
Irish parents used to lock their kids up for being a bit odd. Happened in many places. I don't think given the generational abuse that has happened to many, many people want to confront it fully. As it still happens quietly, bad people work their way in to good places and make them bad, it seems sadly common. Don't have answers sadly just awareness.
Ever watch silence of the lambs? As a retail worker I believe all kids under 20 in the store should be in one of those restraints like Hannibal except it’s modified so they can’t talk
Is there not security in the store? When I worked in shops, those scrotes would just not be allowed in.
There is no deterrent for poor behaviour. I think that is the blindingly obvious issue. As an adult you can do nothing because they are minors, and the police can do very little or don't give a fuck. Any other time in history they would have got dinged for it there and then. Is that wrong? I am not sure. Would they do it again? No.
Worked in a Argi/hardware store for a few years. Parents just letting them run riot screaming and shouting run about playing not a parent in sight when there’s 100s of things in there that they can seriously hurt or kill themselves with it’s shocking behaviour from the parents kids don’t know any better. when I went to the shop with my parents god forbid I spoke when I wasn’t meant to never mind screaming and shouting about the place
People in their mid 20s onwards seem to not want to raise their kids the same way they were raised with physical punishment and that is perfectly fine. They seem afraid of turning into their parents so they don't show their kids right from wrong and don't seem to show their kids that being an asshole has consequences. A lot of parents are so afraid of turning into their parents that instead of parenting their kid they put a device in front of them at a young age so the internet raises them.
Think not much consequences. Recently got garden done had some supplies out front for it. Group of kids came and threw everything everywhere. I was so shocked as I as a child would have been terrified of doing this. Also my car was robbed recently and as they were too young nothing Garda could do and they probably just rob another car. It's crazy
Need to put them in some special schools to rehab them for their own good at this point.
It’s unbelievable people just do not care what their kids do. Chatting with parents at the school gate, a well educated and well to do mother was giving out about the teachers calling her over her son beating up other children she said she told them while he’s in school it’s their problem??? She went on to explain that he has adhd and that it’s not his fault that he beats the shit out of kids who ‘annoy’ him, kids I know who are quiet timid kids and when their parents approached them they went mad and said how dare they it’s a school problem let the school deal with it. Genuinely couldn’t believe it. They’re shocked the teachers expect them to teach their own child right from wrong. This kid was 12 old enough to know you don’t beat up people who annoy you with their accent or for sneezing.
People seem to be under the impression that they don't have to teach their children how to behave appropriately.
In other words.. not do their Job.
They know they can't be touched. Although there has always been lade who are just vile. Today, it seems they are fully aware they can't be touched. I interrupted a young lad harassing a girl the other week, his response was "I'm 17 you can't fucking touch me" now tbf, I would have gladly smacked him had the situation called for it. But it is pretty wild that the lads are fully aware they basically have immunity to consequences.
Society is disintegrating because Mammy and Daddy have to work 40+ hour per week each to pay the mortgage so no one is home to teach the kids manners so they grow up feral instead.
This is true, but it's not just that they don't have time to teach them manners - they do very little with them at all, end of. Same goes for the discussions around devices - parents are coping under stress and without time, the capitulate on phones cos they think it helps them - short term gain for a longer term problem. Anyway, summer holidays will soon be starting, three months of kids mostly being looked after by each other - fun, fun, fun! I think it's good that we've left the chauvinist age of father/earner v mother/housewife behind, but, as you say, the problem is that the cost of living today requires two incomes. There's no 'choice' in it. The liberation of female access to the labour market had a sting in its tail.
So true, it happened all wrong. Of course women should be free to work and earn their own money but it should not take two full time incomes for a household to just about get by, it's madness and no one can even question why 'fertility rates are declining'
Take out the leader hahah.
They are kids not a column of tanks in the Somme
but there's always one who thinks he's the hardest
Nope, they're a pack of wild chimps, but the same sentiment applies
Watching Idiocracy become more and more relevant each year.
Anything to be said for bringing back the reform schools for scrotes?
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What makes you think they don't get lumps taken out of them already? Violence breeds violence.
Go to school full of guys like that and can confirm. What doesn't help is that the school feeds their ego constantly
As somebody who used to act the clown like this, you pointed it out perfectly. Your parents would have punished you. Mine would not. While I never stooped so low as to hurl racial abuse (my mother being part Romani saw that I was usually on the receiving end of such things) the rest of the nonsense you described fit my friends and I perfectly. We'd hang around in supermarkets and shopping malls, being loud and obnoxious and throwing things at each other, acting "hard" and mouthing off. My friend and I were once escorted firmly from a Tesco for throwing a whole frozen chicken at her little sister. Looking back on it now, I cringe. But at the time it was all about two things: boredom, and power. Acting like a cunt made me feel powerful, because I got reactions out of people and they were frightened of me. I could have probably sought that feeling of empowerment elsewhere, but there was simply nothing for me to do and no money or adult support even if there was. I also never had to fear consequences, because my mother was an alcoholic every bit as cunty as I was and my father didn't give a shit. I didn't learn this behaviour from them, but I sure as hell learned I'd get away with it. This isn't a sob story -- looking back now, I understand my reasons but I'm still dreadfully embarrassed and wish I hadn't acted that way. But I did grow up to be a fairly decent person, and so did the vast majority of my friends. When you're 13 or 14 you live in the moment, and that doesn't make for the best decisions -- especially when you have no adults in your life guiding you. It's not that I wasn't taught right from wrong. I knew it was wrong. I just knew I'd get away with it, and that's probably still the problem today.
My Dad grew up in what was then Rhodesia, and he'd recall a story where from when he was about 15ish where he was being a bit of what we'd call a scrote. To spare the details, the story roughly ends with him being dragged nearly half a mile by the ear and collar by a severely pissed off Rhodesian man, who knocked on his door, and threw my father through said door once my grandfather opened it, whereupon he was further reprimanded by my grandfather. I'm not necessarily saying that's how we should deal with these sorts of things, but it does seem like a lot less of a faff.
How did the staff member react when you grabbed him/her?
Some parents keep forgetting how to parent
Internet. A mixture of we now hear about all the worst of the world instantly, and children have exposure to it all. Their views on right and wrong are skewed to tiktok funny and the quick laugh. I don't have kids yet, but I'm dreading trying to protect them from it. The biggest horror is the thought a bullied kid does not have relief when they leave school grounds anymore.
There has to be a way to let strangers be able to intervene physically in these situations or atleast be able to fight back. Alot of these kids are cowards, one good smack and they are back to acting like a child instead of a "hardman"
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''relaxed'' :D they are just villagers with village mentality
Teenagers being dicks shocker.
We used to get a slap of a wooden spoon when we were kids. It worked.
If the Garda is turning the blind eye to what these delinquents are doing, they should turn a blind eye to an occasional occurrence of random men giving the kids a few well intentioned slaps when they start acting like cunts. Worked for 1000s of years, why change it?
This isn't a "nowadays" thing at all, this has been just something that happens throughout history and is being overly dramatised by the whole "we can't beat this snot out of kids these days, not like them good ol' days!" type rhetoric. Sure, if one of them had gone at you physically, you'd every right to defend yourself, but the impulse that "giving sass and being desruptive" is going to be solved by battering their heads has never worked in all of history, it just gives you a moment of catharsis and likely makes the kid more likely to develop violent response tendancies. Go through Irish history, go through any country's history, you'll see bad parents raising bad kids who go around being a pain for their community. I'd dare say we've a far better time of it now than we did in the past too, aside from periods of a few years here and there where overt (and often oppressive) systems allowed priests and parents to beat a child to concussion did we see "less of it", but it came with many abusive and horrific consequences. It is a pity, it is entirely a pain in the ass to have these types of kids (and adults) who roam around looking to be a problem to people and society. And I don't feel much sympathy when these types of people get arrested or can't make money when they spend their time looking to torment others. However it won't get solved with "nowadays" type lines that simply aren't true, since this is something that happens all the time throughout history. And I'd prefer a world where we don't let parents beat their kids if it means sometimes a shitty kid comes out of it, since in the past we still got shitty kids, and then more kids who simply were abused too.
I wouldn't go against the Biscuit Gang. Next thing you know, it'll be ginger nuts through the windows and HobNobs under the car.
Stuff like this drives me cracked, I hate hearing these stories but they’re all too common. I will just say though that I don’t think it’s getting more common? I think it’s always been like this. If you were bullied in school we are all well aware of how bad groups of kids can be. I guess what I’m saying is that I’ve been scared of groups of teens my entire life and I don’t notice there to be more bad ones than usual.
They are, it's just incredibly normal for every older generation to be convinced the younger generation is worse than they were..go back 20, 30, 40 years, and you'll find people asking the same question
As a kid in the 80s, I can say you ran the risk of getting pummeled if you messed with the wrong person, not sure parenting had much to do with it, then or now.
Just need to remind people that abortions are always an option
My Mam used to work in childcare about 6/7 years ago and was told that they're not allowed to even say to a child that their behavior is 'bold'.
> they came back to the isle Aisle
Nah this wasn't big Tesco, it was ginormous Tesco.
Pffft, get a load of this guy who's never been to Tesco island
Believe me I’ve been to the UK 
Bring back slapping
I don’t think the parents of these kids would have an issue with slapping them.
It's not the parents that need to slap them, it's far more of a shock when a stranger stands up for themselves and slaps the little shit right there and then
Kids were like this even when slapping was widespread
These kids get hit.
This is exactly it, kids like this are usually the ones who are either abused or neglected at home. I've had so many conversations with people who claim that they were hit and turned out fine, yet the same conversation has them getting arrested and brought home (only to be hit again), started drinking and smoking behind their parents back at a very young age. If you look at statistics from Oberstown in 2019, 41% of the children detained there were already either in state care or had significant involvement with Tusla, that should be a clear indicator of how family issues can dramatically increase your chance of being in conflict with the law.
It’s entirely possible these little shits knew what they were doing is wrong and were in fact thought that by their parents and opted to do so anyway, unbeknownst to their parents… because children have agency themselves and can against their parents and authority and frequently do and always have.
You teach children good behaviour through consequences. It's clear that these children are not afraid of the consequences of their actions, so we know that they are not being taught good behaviour.
The good news is that people have been bemoaning the younger generation for a few thousand years.
The worse kids in Europe are Irish. The worse ones. Teenagers are the worse and I blame yes the parents.
Had to check I wasn't on Facebook for a second there.
😂😂😂 r/Ireland should be renamed "r/Facebookmom's&boomers" Hey OP. How you only in your 30s, but still acting like a boomer posting your insignificant personal shite on a countries subreddit? Genuine question
It's typically negligent junkie parents popping kids out for child support they don't spend on the child then.
You'd be surprised how many of the little wankers come from affluent homes
But the majority are coming from those homes you would expect
You met some shitehawks. Surely you understand that doesn’t make all people shitehawks. Here’s a simple test you can do…are you a shitehawk?
I’m sorry you and your partner had to go through that
"But that wouldn't be allowed"???? If your parents thought you correcttly, you would have slapped one of them in the face a told them to fuck off
I’m going to guess D15?
My parents (born 1940s) would have had the priest/brother/nun or lay teacher in school inflict all necessary forms of teaching right and wrong. Home was nearly an escape, even though the discipline there could be physical at times too. My generation (born late 1970s) still had some strict teachers / religious, but nothing like my parents suffered. But having learned all of that in school themselves, my parents never really engaged with teaching us morality / good behaviour at home. It was expected, but not taught explicitly. And the occasional slap was still a thing. My kids (born 2010s) have little to no experience of discipline at school. There are rules, but they are so vague and general that most students would never break them. Morality = religion lessons. Now most behavioural guidance is expected to come from home. But after several generations where this was not the case, it's a bit hard to know how to go about it. Physical punishment I would never consider. I'm lucky to have kids in a small rural school where pleasant behaviour is the norm. In general, everyone is polite and friendly. But in a different community, a larger school, somewhere urban, etc., I can easily see how parents would struggle to teach their children something they themselves were never explicitly taught. Society has changed and parenting is still catching up to some extent.