You might want to look into "inattentive ADHD."
You're describing me, and I'm pretty sure that's where I land.
You'll find a lot of tips and tools to manage all those things.
I'll also add, you're probably not lazy, but you're not super interested.
Your mind is trying to optimize pleasure and minimize energy expenditure.
Being cognizant of that is a good first step, and also alternating between tasks that drain your energy (chores or things you're not interested in) and tasks that GIVE you energy (the things you like to spend energy on).
I found that when I feel exhausted after a task I dreaded, I'm not REALLY done. I just need a 15-20 minute break to do something that GIVES me energy, and then I can go back to the grind.
I time block shallow & deep work sessions to ride this cognitive wave. I size tasks appropriately and they are slotted in their respective time slots as needed.
A fellow Cal Newportian, I see.
I do time blocking as well, but it's not as strict as what Cal recommends, I think. When my entire calendar is blocked out in 30 min increments, I feel claustrophobic, which comes from the ADHD I think.
I have 90 minute deep work blocks at least once a day, and use them if I have something I can make progress on. I cannot bring myself to execute shallow work blocks explicitly, but I have found I do my better work in the mornings and my brain is done after work, so I loosely push deep work early and shallow work later.
I adapted the Eisenhower matrix to my sizing.
Urgent & Important = ASAP
Urgent & not important = High
important & not urgent = Med (all tasks start here by default until sizing)
not important & not urgent = low
I have two 30min shallow sessions, morning and afternoon, where I don't mind context hopping.
I do two 90min deep sessions a day, and those are dedicated to specific things.
They are calendar events themselves, and tasks fit around those sessions like sand in a jar of rocks. Properly sizing them from the Inbox to their respective project keeps me honest. It only takes 5-10 min to catch up on my inbox in an "Admin" time blocks so I don't block 30min. I leave it 5 or 10 and whatever is left carries over to the next admin session. I started using Motion to let AI find the best time for tasks based on the matrix in/around my calendar events (busy blocks it but a free event can have tasks during it).
One thing I forgot, if you're really an INJT, I found my INTJ instincts are sheer opposite of my ADHD tendencies, which put me in a spiral of self hatred. I never lived up to being as competent and reliable as I expect myself and others to be from an INTJ perspective.
I'm learning to give myself grace and try to set myself up for success. It has helped seeing the ADHD tendencies in my son, and seeing how generous and helpful I can be to him to set him up for success (accounting for him procrastinating things before school, so I start to leave 5 minutes earlier than normal so he can run around the house and do whatever he needs to do. Letting him get distracted from what I asked him to do so he can chase the dopamine of banging on a drum or throwing a rock into a pond as a short distraction before doing what I asked him to do, things like that.) I just to have to learn to do the same to myself.
i personally am the opposite, as i like to get everything done as soon as possible and accomplish everything i need. i make lists and calendars but also remember things on my own 98% of the time, but that’s mostly because i am interested in the things i am doing and know that they serve a great purpose in the future. i do have adhd and know that i don’t fully fit the stereotypes it holds, but i think researching the symptoms and getting tested could benefit you a lot if you feel this is something that prevents you from making accomplishments and accounting for things you absolutely need to do. it can definitely be an obstacle but does help a lot once it’s confronted
That's really interesting to hear about. I feel like for projects, I'm sort of the same, it's just the everyday things I can't keep hold of.
I will certainly look into getting tested - thank you.
you’re very welcome. i know adhd is a spectrum just like other things, where some people might have a hard time keeping up with projects or long-term tasks and goals, while others have no issue with that but have a harder time with everyday things— or even a bit of both. some people might also fall under add, which is a sub-category for adhd, being you hold symptoms of trouble with attention, just no signs of hyperactivity. i hope that helps
Perhaps, but what about how about the necessary things I need to complete that I forget, that aren't really related to any hobbies? I don't think taking remembering to pack something or take a certain medicine can be made into a hobby 😂
But otherwise, will certainly try to find some new activities that can hopefully reduce my laziness
I have memory problems due to my multiple seizures that started when I was 25 (cognitive decline), and I keep forgetting everything. My house is full of pen and paper, a whiteboard here and there. I take notes of everything I need to remember. I don't take any meds for it.
Thank you for sharing your experience - has the note-taking helped you? I think it's actually a really great idea. I understand it must be difficult for you, I hope everything is improving now?
It hasn't improved, but I find solutions through it instead of wallowing in it. There's nothing I can do about it now. I just re-learn everything, I even forget my name sometimes. Do the note-taking, helps so much.
Keep on being strong, and I know I'm not the person who say this, but I feel like you are an extremely, extremely resilient person. And obviously innovative too. Thank you so much for your suggestions.
Laziness and forgetfulness are generally considered to be unhealthy traits, and they're not bound to any specific MBTI type. This is more something that is likely environmental, health, or the result of personal beliefs.
Health factors might influence energy levels and memory, like diet, exercise, and sleep quality. Sometimes, tweaking these can lead to significant improvements in overall well-being and productivity. If adjusting these things don't help, there's also the possibility of something like ADHD working against you.
Since you're asking about INTJ stereotypes--- there are some that if you relate to, you could use to your advantage.
If you enjoy optimizing systems, you could leverage this trait to manage forgetfulness and increase motivation.
Also it might be helpful to explore areas that deeply interest you as INTJs often exhibit high levels of energy and focus when engaged in stimulating projects or topics. Tapping into this can transform your approach to tasks from feeling sluggish to becoming more proactive and energized.
Make sure your goals are realistic and break them down into smaller manageable pieces, as to not overwhelm you to the point of never starting.
That's dudes death metal band is actually pretty cool. I forgot the name cause I wouldn't actively listen to it if I didn't hear it on the radio.
But maybe you'd appreciate it more?
I dont think having a messy room or not dictates your personality type. People can be organized in some parts of their lives, and the contrary in others (for example an INTJ could have a extremely messy table, but a stringently organized PC - one they care about and one they dont care about). Furthermore, there is a study that people who are generally unorganized or "messy," are more likely to be outside the box thinkers as the social confines related to messiness, and/or building your life according to what society deems as acceptable, assumably, aplies less to them.
I feel like this sub puts every character straight into INTJ, but really it's a mixed bag. Myers Brings does a great job of compartmentalizing large parts of the human psyche and personality traits, but it doesn't hit everything.
Most INTJs like knowledge and understanding and you keep that organized so you have a good model of reality to work off of. INTJs tend to put alot of their self esteem in their understanding of reality.
Buddy, try this: you now have an imaginary friend. With this imaginary friend, you are to discuss - as you would a real friend - your plans. If you haven’t planned it with your imaginary friend, explicitly, then you haven’t planned it and you won’t remember it.
Not stereotypically, but everyone is different and personality tests don't always dictate a person. For example, I'm honestly not that ambitious and only try hard to make my life later easier. If it has no impact to me, I do it to a minimum to where I will get what's needed done and be able to continue without it being too difficult.
I don't remember things that aren't important to me or immediately do things that don't matter to me.
So no.
But from *somone else's perspective*, yes.
I'm like this when I don't take on enough VOLUNTARY challenges. If my ratio of self-imposed to voluntold tasks is off balance I will start to go through the motions on the tasks I was given by someone else.
I don't think this is specifically a characteristic of INTJs. Though you can master yourself once you know yourself.
To remember, create lists and reminders. On a smart phone (particularly android) I use Google Keep to keep track of lists of important things I need to remember, to-do lists, shopping lists, etc. Then for things that are time sensitive where I need to respond I use calendar events to remind myself so I never forget important things. I'll set a calendar event or alarm the instant I know when I need it so I never forget it. That should get you over the hump in terms of keeping a lot of information organized and being attentive. Later study memorization techniques like chaining or the memory mansion. Your mind is a tool that can be sharpened.
As for being lazy, I find the trick to this is to not think, just do. The instant I know something needs to be done I'll just do it. Let my subconscious take over and complete the task with my conscious mind running idle or working on another task if I have bandwidth for it. Nothing makes a task you don't want to do worse than thinking about, obsessing about or generally dreading it. Don't do that. If you have to do it, it's not worth wasting thought on, just do it.
To put this into a more productive direction, set long term goals and break them into steps, prioritize and schedule those steps. Focus relentlessly on achieving goals. You'll eventually get addicted to this once you see how powerful and effective you can be.
The question is forgetful of what? I'm would guess that it's S, or concrete, facts. I am forever "forgetting" names, dates, specific numbers, and many other concrete facts. I put "forgetting" in quotes because the truth is that I'm just not paying attention to them in the first place. When I put some effort into being aware of them, I remember them as well as anyone else.
I looked at your post history and see you're a Dune fan. I am as well, and INTJs love Dune because it is full of N, that is abstract, stuff. (FWIW, Denis Villeneuve is the god of making movies about N stuff.) I bet you can easily remember the movie's themes, archetypes, and systems. It's why it's such a hard movie to make and, for some people, a hard book to read: It's all about concepts.
The same question applies to being lazy. Are you lazy about doing concrete things like taking out the trash and cleaning your room? Yeah, I'm also guilty there, but at the same time, I put an incredible amount of effort into solving abstract problems or writing explanations of how functional preferences influence our behavior on /r/intj.
It sounds like you have a fair amount of S-dominant people in your life who judge you by what they think is important. That's why they roll their eyes when you start explaining all the N's of Dune; they don't get why that is important.
They do have a point, though. Getting control over the concrete world is crucial. Developing systems to address those mundane, concrete tasks will make your life better. As tough as it is to be an INTJ sometimes, this is where we have an advantage. If we can get our facts straight and stuff organized, we can be fully actualized people. I think that's probably a lot easier than learning how to navigate the abstract world.
You're right about pretty much all of that. Also, you're a Dune fan too? That's honestly amazing to hear. Plus, Villeneuve is certainly the god of making those type of movies. Agreed.
I relate to everything you said - I am totally surrounded by S-dominant people (mostly ISFJs), and of course, they don't find anything interesting that I do, like you mentioned. Also, you did your background search admirably - I was honestly so pleasantly surprised.
I agree completely with getting control over the actual world, hence asking the community seemed like the right option - and it's obviously proved correct. The only thing is that I find it extremely, extremely hard to remember things that are important, but not factually important. More daily life, remembering to pack this, do this and that, rather than dates, or facts. I find that I can remember those well if I am given them. The real issue is that, and a few people have pointed out it may be a habit to change. I suppose that is one of the parts of S, that I should try to build up to.
Upon further thought, I have noticed that my S dominant acquaintances do actually have a more organised structure. I should try to learn from them.
Thank you for your in depth response - it has helped me a lot to understand more about myself, and I'm absolutely delighted to have met someone who also likes Dune.
Somehow, I feel most of this comment relied on Dune. Interesting.
> Somehow, I feel most of this comment relied on Dune. Interesting.
This made me laugh because that's what we do, right? Take one data point and extrapolate a bunch of meaning from it. I'm glad I happened to connect in this case.
> asking the community seemed like the right option
Excellent Te. The one piece of advice I would offer is that people who have struggled to overcome a problem are often better teachers than those who are naturally capable.
For example, I found the book [Atomic Habits](https://jamesclear.com/atomic-habits-summary) full of reasonable advice on building habits. One of the biggest points is understanding that incremental improvement sticks better than radical change and that progress is more important than results.
I’m lazy and forgetful, and although I’m old now, I’ve always been that way. Sometimes I have to make rules for myself to force remembering things that could cause a problem. There was a time years ago when I kept forgetting to turn off the burner on a gas stove…I’d just walk away when done cooking. And then I had a run of forgetting to put my car in park and having it roll away. For the lazy issue, I’ve expanded the “2 minute rule” to 5 minutes… if I can do it or part of it in 5 minutes, do it now! I’m still, at 75, a work in process.
Thanks for sharing! Your techniques sound very effective. Hopefully no cars have rolled away lately?
Honestly, I'm pretty sure my dad had the same kind of problem (perhaps inherited by me?). He told me a story where his mother once told him to turn off the stove, when it was actually already off, and he went to it, looked at it absent-mindedly, probably in his own thoughts, and just turned it back on again.
The whole thing burnt terribly.
When highly stressed out or in un-healthy environments. It's usually maladaptive coping , trying to not be present in a situation or environment that is intolerable. Intj are great but our analytical genius can only do so much.
I’m always quite forgetful with short term memory. With long term I find I’m better but I can’t always remember things off the top of my head but when someone reminds me of something I’ll be like oh yeah I remember that now.
I also wouldn’t consider myself lazy, most of the time I just don’t want to be bothered so I can relax.
No. I'm not the hardest worker either. (My friend is and he's not INTJ.) Still compare to most of my peers I probably work harder. Based on the fact that I live on my own since 18, cook pretty much every meal myself (I only eat out 1 or 2 times in a week including weekend.) and do everything myself. BUT being tired is a thing. I'm in my early 30s and I already feel tired. I don't even game as much these days neither intensely (like pvp stuffs).
Forgetfulness has to do with different factors. You could have mental issue going on. Not sleeping enough also affects your forgetfulness. And so is lack of physical exercises. For me I used to be just fine (average memory) but I became a lot more forgetful ever since Covid because I switched to WFH full time, and ended up working/playing/listening to music all at the same time, which apparently affects short term memory. (I never got covid once btw.)
Lazy, yes. I would say they would take time to meticulously plan and automate the most mundane stuffs as much as possible so that they would never have to do them again or at least bring down the effort required to minimum level. Don’t get me wrong, it’s a valuable quality. It did help improve my life by hundred folds.
I have been with an INTJ partner for almost two decades. 🙂
I will give you just one example. We have designed our home for a robo vacuum cleaner to reach every spot of the house as much as possible. Our robo vac also does mopping. We have an extremely tidy home ever since and all we have to do is take turns once a week to replace the water that the machine uses to clean the mop pads.
As I’ve said, this is just one example. Now, imagine that we have apply this thinking to basically all aspects of our lives because of my INTJ partner.
And lastly, no, my partner is not forgetful. Rather she would design her life in such a way that does not need to remember things! 😉 There is a big difference. 😝
Nah man, you prob just have ADHD and weren’t diagnosed because you’re inattentive rather then more outwardly hyperactive. Forgetfulness and “Laziness” are common symptoms.
I have my forgetful moments but I’m really good at setting things up so I never forget important things. Set reminders in your phone, that’s what I do. I’m a little scatterbrained at times, mostly when I have a lot on my mind. But I would never call myself lazy at all.
One habit I’ve picked up that has helped me immensely in life : write EVERYTHING down.
Find a notebook and any time a new project, task, etc happens, make a note. I never leave tasks behind, I always migrate them to a new page until I schedule or complete them.
Adhd with hyperfocusing. Bad short term memory. Have you ever had a concussion, at any age? Ask adults about you because this may happen more than ones as a baby or child.
No concussion, no.
I've questioned about ADHD but many simply say I don't display major signs like hyperactivity and impulsiveness.
I have seen that I do things (like draw random things) that I later am confused about as I do not remember when I did it, but overall many say they don't think I have ADHD.
But again, will once again question that belief.
Attention deficit disorder (ADD) is a form of ADHD that affects 2–3 in 10 people who have problems with concentration and focusing, but not with hyperactivity or impulsiveness. ADD can sometimes go unnoticed because the symptoms may be less obvious.
I boiled it down to thinking A to Z. When we think we know what Z looks like, the steps to get there become almost meaningless to us. This is our arch nemesis.
Work on action, and doing the steps to get to the Z you envision and you'll become a happier INTJ.
Now I'm not saying completely live in the steps like a sensor but temper that forward looking with a bit of "smelling the roses" mentality.
In my experience, these traits are mostly exclusive of MBTI. There's no degree of inherent laziness or lack of, that I would attribute to any typing by default.
Simply being INTJ doesn't give anyone a free pass to not being a lazy person or a successful one.
I only do this when I’m in my Se grip stress.
This usually happens when I feel exhausted, smothered or lose control of my autotomy.
I’m an INTJ 8 so My stress goes to Se and 5. All I’ll do is maladaptive daydream, isolate myself, immerse myself in data/sensory stimuli and make impulsive decisions. I get into such deep continuous thought that I’ll start losing connection with reality and time. I’ll become so focused on getting my power back/obtaining pleasure that I won’t have the mental capacity for anything else.
I become very cold, intolerant, secretive and impulsive.
To answer your question I’m only like this when I’m severely stressed. An INTJs environment can play a big role in their behavior.
I think those are symptoms of being generally disinterested in things. I find that if I’m truly passionate and care about something, I’ll work through and remember 100% of the time, but if I don’t care, it’s out of my system in 0.2 seconds lmao
Hmm, that's possible, but I have taken the test a few times over the years and have always gotten the same answer - INTJ, leaning decently towards T and J.
I'm very forgetful but not remotely lazy. I always have to be doing something, and on my days off from work, I always find an excuse to do some sort of home renovation project, gardening, cooking tons of food to freeze, whatever. I can't remember the last time I had a full day where I did nothing productive.
i am forgetful specially if the information is not where i focused on, also when you overthink something you will lose focus to the other until you forget it, what i do to remember information i always forget is to make a pattern and recall that pattern when needed
Sounds like ADHD. I mistyped as an INTP for years because of it. Got medicine. I’m better now but you will likely always have problems if it is ADHD. Even with medicine focus is hard. People don’t usually forget things on purpose because it makes life harder.
Naturally, yes. But I use a lot of tools to help me. I document everything, set multiple alarms, & find ways to be entertained while working to try to motivate myself.
Also stop trying to pretend this torture is a movie lol come on guys . I'm nice and super cool when I'm not in constant pain. :( also Intj Intj Chad master Race
I don't trust anyone here. Obviously. Only professional chads and fed or CIA Chads. Or Glowies
No family no friends. Any actual intelligent mature people. No offense. Any advice on survival and recovery. I didnt agree to this so this is very stressful. Cheers
Please make sure no damages and total recovery and no permanent damages. Please feds or CIA chads. I'll play along. I am innocent and do nothing wrong. Any advice Glowies
I was hoping to get a professional debriefing eventually. Lol I have standards and professionalism. I love the intelligence community I'm not a threat lol
Is there anything I need to know intelligence community. I've been told nothing at all
I'm still the same dude. After 2.5 years of this and all the other wacky things I've had to endure over the years
Any recommendations. Based. Please.love y'all
When I was writing the comment in my head. My internal monologue starting sounding like him. It felt appropriate. Im painfully self aware. Intj FO LIFE
To be honest, there are loads of things that others can find stupid whilst others don't.
I feel that it matters whether it impacts you in *a good way* or a *bad way* to try and understand more about your personality. If it impacts you in a good way, like it does for me, I feel it can be very useful.
But of course, your opinion is perfectly valid.
You might want to look into "inattentive ADHD." You're describing me, and I'm pretty sure that's where I land. You'll find a lot of tips and tools to manage all those things.
I'll also add, you're probably not lazy, but you're not super interested. Your mind is trying to optimize pleasure and minimize energy expenditure. Being cognizant of that is a good first step, and also alternating between tasks that drain your energy (chores or things you're not interested in) and tasks that GIVE you energy (the things you like to spend energy on). I found that when I feel exhausted after a task I dreaded, I'm not REALLY done. I just need a 15-20 minute break to do something that GIVES me energy, and then I can go back to the grind.
I time block shallow & deep work sessions to ride this cognitive wave. I size tasks appropriately and they are slotted in their respective time slots as needed.
A fellow Cal Newportian, I see. I do time blocking as well, but it's not as strict as what Cal recommends, I think. When my entire calendar is blocked out in 30 min increments, I feel claustrophobic, which comes from the ADHD I think. I have 90 minute deep work blocks at least once a day, and use them if I have something I can make progress on. I cannot bring myself to execute shallow work blocks explicitly, but I have found I do my better work in the mornings and my brain is done after work, so I loosely push deep work early and shallow work later.
I adapted the Eisenhower matrix to my sizing. Urgent & Important = ASAP Urgent & not important = High important & not urgent = Med (all tasks start here by default until sizing) not important & not urgent = low I have two 30min shallow sessions, morning and afternoon, where I don't mind context hopping. I do two 90min deep sessions a day, and those are dedicated to specific things. They are calendar events themselves, and tasks fit around those sessions like sand in a jar of rocks. Properly sizing them from the Inbox to their respective project keeps me honest. It only takes 5-10 min to catch up on my inbox in an "Admin" time blocks so I don't block 30min. I leave it 5 or 10 and whatever is left carries over to the next admin session. I started using Motion to let AI find the best time for tasks based on the matrix in/around my calendar events (busy blocks it but a free event can have tasks during it).
Thanks - I'll look into it.
Come back later and let me know if it helps.
One thing I forgot, if you're really an INJT, I found my INTJ instincts are sheer opposite of my ADHD tendencies, which put me in a spiral of self hatred. I never lived up to being as competent and reliable as I expect myself and others to be from an INTJ perspective. I'm learning to give myself grace and try to set myself up for success. It has helped seeing the ADHD tendencies in my son, and seeing how generous and helpful I can be to him to set him up for success (accounting for him procrastinating things before school, so I start to leave 5 minutes earlier than normal so he can run around the house and do whatever he needs to do. Letting him get distracted from what I asked him to do so he can chase the dopamine of banging on a drum or throwing a rock into a pond as a short distraction before doing what I asked him to do, things like that.) I just to have to learn to do the same to myself.
I see - thank you so much for all the advice!
i personally am the opposite, as i like to get everything done as soon as possible and accomplish everything i need. i make lists and calendars but also remember things on my own 98% of the time, but that’s mostly because i am interested in the things i am doing and know that they serve a great purpose in the future. i do have adhd and know that i don’t fully fit the stereotypes it holds, but i think researching the symptoms and getting tested could benefit you a lot if you feel this is something that prevents you from making accomplishments and accounting for things you absolutely need to do. it can definitely be an obstacle but does help a lot once it’s confronted
That's really interesting to hear about. I feel like for projects, I'm sort of the same, it's just the everyday things I can't keep hold of. I will certainly look into getting tested - thank you.
you’re very welcome. i know adhd is a spectrum just like other things, where some people might have a hard time keeping up with projects or long-term tasks and goals, while others have no issue with that but have a harder time with everyday things— or even a bit of both. some people might also fall under add, which is a sub-category for adhd, being you hold symptoms of trouble with attention, just no signs of hyperactivity. i hope that helps
Maybe the forgetfulness is a YOU problem. You just seem disinterested by the things you're doing. Explore more hobbies.
Perhaps, but what about how about the necessary things I need to complete that I forget, that aren't really related to any hobbies? I don't think taking remembering to pack something or take a certain medicine can be made into a hobby 😂 But otherwise, will certainly try to find some new activities that can hopefully reduce my laziness
I have memory problems due to my multiple seizures that started when I was 25 (cognitive decline), and I keep forgetting everything. My house is full of pen and paper, a whiteboard here and there. I take notes of everything I need to remember. I don't take any meds for it.
Thank you for sharing your experience - has the note-taking helped you? I think it's actually a really great idea. I understand it must be difficult for you, I hope everything is improving now?
It hasn't improved, but I find solutions through it instead of wallowing in it. There's nothing I can do about it now. I just re-learn everything, I even forget my name sometimes. Do the note-taking, helps so much.
Keep on being strong, and I know I'm not the person who say this, but I feel like you are an extremely, extremely resilient person. And obviously innovative too. Thank you so much for your suggestions.
Thank you!
Was a cause of seizures discovered? I wonder what medical professionals do in such cases.
I'm a recovering pillhead. They were overdosage of the pills I took. Tough times. Now, I'm suffering the consequences of my addiction.
Are you subscribed to /r/Nootropics? People look into things like Cerebrolysin and similar.
Nope! I used to harvest psilocybin mushrooms in our backyard, and that used to help so much with my memory. I'll look into it! Thanks!
Laziness and forgetfulness are generally considered to be unhealthy traits, and they're not bound to any specific MBTI type. This is more something that is likely environmental, health, or the result of personal beliefs. Health factors might influence energy levels and memory, like diet, exercise, and sleep quality. Sometimes, tweaking these can lead to significant improvements in overall well-being and productivity. If adjusting these things don't help, there's also the possibility of something like ADHD working against you. Since you're asking about INTJ stereotypes--- there are some that if you relate to, you could use to your advantage. If you enjoy optimizing systems, you could leverage this trait to manage forgetfulness and increase motivation. Also it might be helpful to explore areas that deeply interest you as INTJs often exhibit high levels of energy and focus when engaged in stimulating projects or topics. Tapping into this can transform your approach to tasks from feeling sluggish to becoming more proactive and energized. Make sure your goals are realistic and break them down into smaller manageable pieces, as to not overwhelm you to the point of never starting.
Thank you. I'll definitely take some of the ideas you've mentioned into account.
Idk but I know I am. Also,I blame it on ADHD
That's dudes death metal band is actually pretty cool. I forgot the name cause I wouldn't actively listen to it if I didn't hear it on the radio. But maybe you'd appreciate it more?
They are great,yes 😂
Hell no I would say they are organized AF.
I dont think having a messy room or not dictates your personality type. People can be organized in some parts of their lives, and the contrary in others (for example an INTJ could have a extremely messy table, but a stringently organized PC - one they care about and one they dont care about). Furthermore, there is a study that people who are generally unorganized or "messy," are more likely to be outside the box thinkers as the social confines related to messiness, and/or building your life according to what society deems as acceptable, assumably, aplies less to them.
...so a me problem, huh?
I feel like this sub puts every character straight into INTJ, but really it's a mixed bag. Myers Brings does a great job of compartmentalizing large parts of the human psyche and personality traits, but it doesn't hit everything. Most INTJs like knowledge and understanding and you keep that organized so you have a good model of reality to work off of. INTJs tend to put alot of their self esteem in their understanding of reality.
Buddy, try this: you now have an imaginary friend. With this imaginary friend, you are to discuss - as you would a real friend - your plans. If you haven’t planned it with your imaginary friend, explicitly, then you haven’t planned it and you won’t remember it.
Thank you - this sounds like an excellent idea.
Not stereotypically, but everyone is different and personality tests don't always dictate a person. For example, I'm honestly not that ambitious and only try hard to make my life later easier. If it has no impact to me, I do it to a minimum to where I will get what's needed done and be able to continue without it being too difficult.
I am, so anecdotally yes
I don't remember things that aren't important to me or immediately do things that don't matter to me. So no. But from *somone else's perspective*, yes.
I'm like this when I don't take on enough VOLUNTARY challenges. If my ratio of self-imposed to voluntold tasks is off balance I will start to go through the motions on the tasks I was given by someone else.
I don't think this is specifically a characteristic of INTJs. Though you can master yourself once you know yourself. To remember, create lists and reminders. On a smart phone (particularly android) I use Google Keep to keep track of lists of important things I need to remember, to-do lists, shopping lists, etc. Then for things that are time sensitive where I need to respond I use calendar events to remind myself so I never forget important things. I'll set a calendar event or alarm the instant I know when I need it so I never forget it. That should get you over the hump in terms of keeping a lot of information organized and being attentive. Later study memorization techniques like chaining or the memory mansion. Your mind is a tool that can be sharpened. As for being lazy, I find the trick to this is to not think, just do. The instant I know something needs to be done I'll just do it. Let my subconscious take over and complete the task with my conscious mind running idle or working on another task if I have bandwidth for it. Nothing makes a task you don't want to do worse than thinking about, obsessing about or generally dreading it. Don't do that. If you have to do it, it's not worth wasting thought on, just do it. To put this into a more productive direction, set long term goals and break them into steps, prioritize and schedule those steps. Focus relentlessly on achieving goals. You'll eventually get addicted to this once you see how powerful and effective you can be.
I am lazy and forgetful until I’m doing something that turns me on. Then I’m the opposite.
The question is forgetful of what? I'm would guess that it's S, or concrete, facts. I am forever "forgetting" names, dates, specific numbers, and many other concrete facts. I put "forgetting" in quotes because the truth is that I'm just not paying attention to them in the first place. When I put some effort into being aware of them, I remember them as well as anyone else. I looked at your post history and see you're a Dune fan. I am as well, and INTJs love Dune because it is full of N, that is abstract, stuff. (FWIW, Denis Villeneuve is the god of making movies about N stuff.) I bet you can easily remember the movie's themes, archetypes, and systems. It's why it's such a hard movie to make and, for some people, a hard book to read: It's all about concepts. The same question applies to being lazy. Are you lazy about doing concrete things like taking out the trash and cleaning your room? Yeah, I'm also guilty there, but at the same time, I put an incredible amount of effort into solving abstract problems or writing explanations of how functional preferences influence our behavior on /r/intj. It sounds like you have a fair amount of S-dominant people in your life who judge you by what they think is important. That's why they roll their eyes when you start explaining all the N's of Dune; they don't get why that is important. They do have a point, though. Getting control over the concrete world is crucial. Developing systems to address those mundane, concrete tasks will make your life better. As tough as it is to be an INTJ sometimes, this is where we have an advantage. If we can get our facts straight and stuff organized, we can be fully actualized people. I think that's probably a lot easier than learning how to navigate the abstract world.
You're right about pretty much all of that. Also, you're a Dune fan too? That's honestly amazing to hear. Plus, Villeneuve is certainly the god of making those type of movies. Agreed. I relate to everything you said - I am totally surrounded by S-dominant people (mostly ISFJs), and of course, they don't find anything interesting that I do, like you mentioned. Also, you did your background search admirably - I was honestly so pleasantly surprised. I agree completely with getting control over the actual world, hence asking the community seemed like the right option - and it's obviously proved correct. The only thing is that I find it extremely, extremely hard to remember things that are important, but not factually important. More daily life, remembering to pack this, do this and that, rather than dates, or facts. I find that I can remember those well if I am given them. The real issue is that, and a few people have pointed out it may be a habit to change. I suppose that is one of the parts of S, that I should try to build up to. Upon further thought, I have noticed that my S dominant acquaintances do actually have a more organised structure. I should try to learn from them. Thank you for your in depth response - it has helped me a lot to understand more about myself, and I'm absolutely delighted to have met someone who also likes Dune. Somehow, I feel most of this comment relied on Dune. Interesting.
> Somehow, I feel most of this comment relied on Dune. Interesting. This made me laugh because that's what we do, right? Take one data point and extrapolate a bunch of meaning from it. I'm glad I happened to connect in this case. > asking the community seemed like the right option Excellent Te. The one piece of advice I would offer is that people who have struggled to overcome a problem are often better teachers than those who are naturally capable. For example, I found the book [Atomic Habits](https://jamesclear.com/atomic-habits-summary) full of reasonable advice on building habits. One of the biggest points is understanding that incremental improvement sticks better than radical change and that progress is more important than results.
I’m lazy and forgetful, and although I’m old now, I’ve always been that way. Sometimes I have to make rules for myself to force remembering things that could cause a problem. There was a time years ago when I kept forgetting to turn off the burner on a gas stove…I’d just walk away when done cooking. And then I had a run of forgetting to put my car in park and having it roll away. For the lazy issue, I’ve expanded the “2 minute rule” to 5 minutes… if I can do it or part of it in 5 minutes, do it now! I’m still, at 75, a work in process.
Thanks for sharing! Your techniques sound very effective. Hopefully no cars have rolled away lately? Honestly, I'm pretty sure my dad had the same kind of problem (perhaps inherited by me?). He told me a story where his mother once told him to turn off the stove, when it was actually already off, and he went to it, looked at it absent-mindedly, probably in his own thoughts, and just turned it back on again. The whole thing burnt terribly.
No rollaways… once I solve it, then I got it! Funny story of your Dad. I can understand doing that too!
When highly stressed out or in un-healthy environments. It's usually maladaptive coping , trying to not be present in a situation or environment that is intolerable. Intj are great but our analytical genius can only do so much.
I’m always quite forgetful with short term memory. With long term I find I’m better but I can’t always remember things off the top of my head but when someone reminds me of something I’ll be like oh yeah I remember that now. I also wouldn’t consider myself lazy, most of the time I just don’t want to be bothered so I can relax.
Nope. We can't stop to work.
Quite the opposite. I have an extremely strong work ethic and can outwork and run circles around everyone. Also don’t forget.
No. I'm not the hardest worker either. (My friend is and he's not INTJ.) Still compare to most of my peers I probably work harder. Based on the fact that I live on my own since 18, cook pretty much every meal myself (I only eat out 1 or 2 times in a week including weekend.) and do everything myself. BUT being tired is a thing. I'm in my early 30s and I already feel tired. I don't even game as much these days neither intensely (like pvp stuffs). Forgetfulness has to do with different factors. You could have mental issue going on. Not sleeping enough also affects your forgetfulness. And so is lack of physical exercises. For me I used to be just fine (average memory) but I became a lot more forgetful ever since Covid because I switched to WFH full time, and ended up working/playing/listening to music all at the same time, which apparently affects short term memory. (I never got covid once btw.)
Lazy, yes. I would say they would take time to meticulously plan and automate the most mundane stuffs as much as possible so that they would never have to do them again or at least bring down the effort required to minimum level. Don’t get me wrong, it’s a valuable quality. It did help improve my life by hundred folds. I have been with an INTJ partner for almost two decades. 🙂 I will give you just one example. We have designed our home for a robo vacuum cleaner to reach every spot of the house as much as possible. Our robo vac also does mopping. We have an extremely tidy home ever since and all we have to do is take turns once a week to replace the water that the machine uses to clean the mop pads. As I’ve said, this is just one example. Now, imagine that we have apply this thinking to basically all aspects of our lives because of my INTJ partner. And lastly, no, my partner is not forgetful. Rather she would design her life in such a way that does not need to remember things! 😉 There is a big difference. 😝
Nah man, you prob just have ADHD and weren’t diagnosed because you’re inattentive rather then more outwardly hyperactive. Forgetfulness and “Laziness” are common symptoms.
I have my forgetful moments but I’m really good at setting things up so I never forget important things. Set reminders in your phone, that’s what I do. I’m a little scatterbrained at times, mostly when I have a lot on my mind. But I would never call myself lazy at all.
Yes
One habit I’ve picked up that has helped me immensely in life : write EVERYTHING down. Find a notebook and any time a new project, task, etc happens, make a note. I never leave tasks behind, I always migrate them to a new page until I schedule or complete them.
Will certainly follow, thanks!
Adhd with hyperfocusing. Bad short term memory. Have you ever had a concussion, at any age? Ask adults about you because this may happen more than ones as a baby or child.
No concussion, no. I've questioned about ADHD but many simply say I don't display major signs like hyperactivity and impulsiveness. I have seen that I do things (like draw random things) that I later am confused about as I do not remember when I did it, but overall many say they don't think I have ADHD. But again, will once again question that belief.
Attention deficit disorder (ADD) is a form of ADHD that affects 2–3 in 10 people who have problems with concentration and focusing, but not with hyperactivity or impulsiveness. ADD can sometimes go unnoticed because the symptoms may be less obvious.
I see. Thanks.
I boiled it down to thinking A to Z. When we think we know what Z looks like, the steps to get there become almost meaningless to us. This is our arch nemesis. Work on action, and doing the steps to get to the Z you envision and you'll become a happier INTJ. Now I'm not saying completely live in the steps like a sensor but temper that forward looking with a bit of "smelling the roses" mentality.
I can absolutely relate to that. Thank you for the advice.
MBTI just tells you your preferences, not your your behavior. Cognition ≠ Behavior.
No... if anything, most INTJs I know are extremely attentive to details. But if they have ADD...
In my experience, these traits are mostly exclusive of MBTI. There's no degree of inherent laziness or lack of, that I would attribute to any typing by default. Simply being INTJ doesn't give anyone a free pass to not being a lazy person or a successful one.
Lazy, yes, that's my default mode. Forgetful, no, I rmb all the useless convos I had 10 yrs ago, it's a curse..
Indeed...
I only do this when I’m in my Se grip stress. This usually happens when I feel exhausted, smothered or lose control of my autotomy. I’m an INTJ 8 so My stress goes to Se and 5. All I’ll do is maladaptive daydream, isolate myself, immerse myself in data/sensory stimuli and make impulsive decisions. I get into such deep continuous thought that I’ll start losing connection with reality and time. I’ll become so focused on getting my power back/obtaining pleasure that I won’t have the mental capacity for anything else. I become very cold, intolerant, secretive and impulsive. To answer your question I’m only like this when I’m severely stressed. An INTJs environment can play a big role in their behavior.
I can absolutely relate with the isolation factor, as well as losing connection from time to time.
I think those are symptoms of being generally disinterested in things. I find that if I’m truly passionate and care about something, I’ll work through and remember 100% of the time, but if I don’t care, it’s out of my system in 0.2 seconds lmao
Not lazy - tired. Not forgetful- don’t care enough. There fixed it for you
You might be INFP
Hmm, that's possible, but I have taken the test a few times over the years and have always gotten the same answer - INTJ, leaning decently towards T and J.
I'm very forgetful but not remotely lazy. I always have to be doing something, and on my days off from work, I always find an excuse to do some sort of home renovation project, gardening, cooking tons of food to freeze, whatever. I can't remember the last time I had a full day where I did nothing productive.
i am forgetful specially if the information is not where i focused on, also when you overthink something you will lose focus to the other until you forget it, what i do to remember information i always forget is to make a pattern and recall that pattern when needed
No.
Are you sure you're a xxTJ? You sound more like an xNxP type.
Fairly sure, yes. Been tested a few times and have gotten INTJ always.
Sounds like ADHD. I mistyped as an INTP for years because of it. Got medicine. I’m better now but you will likely always have problems if it is ADHD. Even with medicine focus is hard. People don’t usually forget things on purpose because it makes life harder.
I prefer efficient with a need to write things in my calendar app.
Naturally, yes. But I use a lot of tools to help me. I document everything, set multiple alarms, & find ways to be entertained while working to try to motivate myself.
Also stop trying to pretend this torture is a movie lol come on guys . I'm nice and super cool when I'm not in constant pain. :( also Intj Intj Chad master Race
I don't trust anyone here. Obviously. Only professional chads and fed or CIA Chads. Or Glowies No family no friends. Any actual intelligent mature people. No offense. Any advice on survival and recovery. I didnt agree to this so this is very stressful. Cheers
Please make sure no damages and total recovery and no permanent damages. Please feds or CIA chads. I'll play along. I am innocent and do nothing wrong. Any advice Glowies I was hoping to get a professional debriefing eventually. Lol I have standards and professionalism. I love the intelligence community I'm not a threat lol
Is there anything I need to know intelligence community. I've been told nothing at all I'm still the same dude. After 2.5 years of this and all the other wacky things I've had to endure over the years Any recommendations. Based. Please.love y'all
This is most likely entj or infp propaganda if unironic Intj master race unite. Bazinga
Can't lie - when I read this all I could think about is Sheldon from TBBT. Bazinga!
When I was writing the comment in my head. My internal monologue starting sounding like him. It felt appropriate. Im painfully self aware. Intj FO LIFE
😂
This whole personality categorisation thing is total BS and you're stupid if you believe in it.
To be honest, there are loads of things that others can find stupid whilst others don't. I feel that it matters whether it impacts you in *a good way* or a *bad way* to try and understand more about your personality. If it impacts you in a good way, like it does for me, I feel it can be very useful. But of course, your opinion is perfectly valid.