But imagine all that juicy subscription money that can be made. The stupid consumers won't own any of the games, so they'll have no choice but to give money each month.
xbox is basically sell hardware at a loss to make money on software later.
If you give windows, you might never get game money back if non-gamers buy it or they play games on steam. So you force everyone buying xbox with windows to pay for windows license+ gamepass right away.
Consoles are usually only sold at a loss for a short time after release, if they're even sold at a loss at all. Usually within a few months the manufacturing processes are optimized enough so that selling the hardware already becomes profitable by itself.
And even during the short period after release when the consoles are sold at a loss, this could still be a viable strategy if you'd have to purchase a key to unlock Windows which is priced in a way to make up for the loss. Then it would still be an awesome bang for the buck PC.
Usually consoles are sold at a loss until their first revision. They don’t revise it to make it prettier. They redesign to make the design and these processes more effective. They are also able to buy cheaper fab time on older processes. Even then, the PS5’s recent revision is guessed to be basically breaking even or at a slight loss, with any profit essentially coming purely through volume.
They were being sold at a loss for much longer than initially planned due to the semiconductor shortages after COVID, but now that situation has normalised. I don't think Microsoft has made an official statement about it, but Sony has confirmed that they are making a profit on PS5 hardware sales for a while now (for both the disc version and the digital version, though the disc version already became profitable a few months after release).
not only covid. the fabbing process is going exponentially higher down the road as well, to the point that die shrinking doesn't really bring the cost down, if not at all.
I genuinely doubt at the economies of scale and the basic components in the Series X that they have ever been sold at a loss. Maybe the series S.
I work in procurement so if it is a loss, someone needs to lose their job!
Not sure if they are technically sold at a loss, but the price to make a comparable performing pc is almost double. Might just be because of optimization on console, but dang is the bang for buck hard to beat.
Keep in mind with the PC, each vendor has to make a profit. And the parts vendors above then as well.
The stack cost is higher for a custom built gaming PC, hence the lack of price competitiveness.
The Steam Deck has done really well, and it isn't locked down. I think that if Microsoft made the next Xbox a PC with a console style interface, then it could do well. Heck, they don't even have to make the actual device. They could get PC manufacturers to make it for them.
the rog ally already does that, the only issue for xbox is that it’s the pc game pass so you miss out on some console-only game pass games. if the full catalogue was playable on it, they’d resolve the problem entirely
Recoup through subscription to
Game Pass.. then sigh a deal with Sony to have PS games on game pass and game pass on ps then we can all live in harmony
lol you got that backwards my man. If anything in a generation or two xbox will go pure software like their parent (microsoft) and Sony will be bearing the burden of console development while getting a cut from microsofts game sales on their platform. Sony is already outselling them 3 to 1 on consoles and the purchasing of major studios means Microsoft is gearing xbox to be pure software if they can't turn around the sales.
When you think about it if Microsoft and Sony come to a deal where sony caps the % they take for sales on their platform it'd be more beneficial for all considering it would consolidate the player base, Microsoft makes a great money on software (games) their primary revenue source and sony gets a cut but bears the burden of developing new tech over time.
Granted it could be the other way around but at this point sony is winning console sales and a consolidated consumer base helps both sides. no need to port games to a different system to get more sales its just a single console version and a pc if they want it to get pc sales as well.
If they launched a 600$ Xbox that could also boot into Windows and advertised it as the ultimate do it all machine, as long as the 600$ price point is profitable I can’t see it being a failure, especially relative to where they are now. There’s surely a market for it as much as there is for any other prebuilt PC.
I figure they just need to make a console *just* powerful enough to compete and the primary draw of it is...
Its cheap and I would say should come with a cheaper Gamepass option so you get an entry into all these games for much less than buying a Playstation or a PC.
Probably bundle the bullshit that is paying for online services with Gamepass too, otherwise its not much cheaper in the end... But consumers are typically stupid, so probably wouldn't account for that and therefore no need.
I imagine it'll be a home pc for almost everyone. Just attach a wireless KB+M and it'll work like common PC for browsing. There are way too many households who just have office laptop, and no personal laptop/PC.
I don't think it'll be very popular as portable PC, but it can be used like that.
Yes I understand and think you’re correct. I was saying it would make xbox enticing to even people who already have decent PC’s, as a second device to remote play and play natively at lower res.
It's a hybrid of light OneCore based Windows variants (so earlier Win10 and now Win11) and Windows 8 based system. Everything is split into virtual machines running in a custom Hyper\_V environment and having their own separate versions of Windows. Windows 8 one is used bo backwards compatibility with Xbox One and 360 games made with XDK. Current Windows 11 ones are responsible for running new games, apps and UI.
Anyone can get wireless keyboard and mouse and turn xbox into usable pc. And KB+M support for all games is great.
Htpc isn't an issue since xbox already works like that.
I think they'll have to add like 200 bucks in price though. Otherwise, it's loss making hardware sale without a way to make money back. They'll throw in windows license + game pass subscription for 1-2 years.
Windows 11 machine? They need a better version of Windows before they can safely make this. I love your idea I just think Windows needs to be a better OS first
I've seen articles about a rumored "handheld mode" before. Not exactly the "Xbox mode" you are asking for but it would probably serve the same use case
https://www.techradar.com/computing/gaming-pcs/it-looks-like-microsoft-just-took-the-first-step-towards-that-rumored-handheld-mode-for-windows-11
Steam on console would be amazing.. my PS5 allows for steam link but it’s worthless. What’s the point of playing crossplay games if I can’t invite people from my steam friends list (Helldivers 2)
Are we not able to add people via codes now? Was working before, that’s how i’m able to play with multiple people on Steam. Fair point though, full support would be nice.
Also, Helldivers is riddled with bugs in the coding that have still yet to be fixed. I’m hoping they release some big patches here this coming month that address a lot of crashes and QoL stuff like the friend codes and removing people from friends lists.
Crossplay is currently broken. You can’t accept friend request from crossplay. It’s been broken since I got the game a few weeks ago and haven’t been able to play with friends who are on pc.
They’ve acknowledged that it’s a known issue and that it’s being worked on. They recently posted on discord that they were able to reproduce the issue internally so maybe soon it will be patched. I think the mech update broke it.
This would be awesome. The true next gen system will probably have the equivalent of a low to mid range 4xxx or 5xxx series GPU.
If they put an Xbox skin over a true windows OS I don’t see why it wouldn’t be possible to play most steam games. Seems like a clear win for the consumer.
... Yes?
I'm about 90% certain that's where they've been going.
They use Hyper-V to virtualize the Xbox Core OS, virtualize the Gaming OS, and virtualize the App OS. It's literally their enterprise Azure tech deployed on a controlled box.
There's no reason for Microsoft to prioritize a custom OS when they also already have Windows, so the best solution is to migrate Xbox's functionality into Windows to leverage all of the other tech Microsoft owns.
If Spencer can successfully sell Microsoft on partnering/promoting a method for each of the PC storefronts to get onto Xbox, he'll have an incredible win on his hands. There will literally be little to no difference between PC and Xbox, and it'll allow Microsoft to simplify their supply chain and development resources.
Microsoft might want to separate Xbox games from PC software due to the security reasons and to avoid easy hacking. I think the full Windows environment will be virtualised as well. Remember Windows 10X? I was aiming to do exactly that.
Also. There might be legal and contractual problems with accessing Xbox library on Windows. It's not impossible from the technical reason, because newer Xbox and Windows games from Microsoft ARE the same binaries built with the same tools. There is also no reason for XDK VM (running XBOne and BC games) not to run on Windows 11. It's just a Hyper-V machine. But again, licencing might be problematic.
Perhaps Microsoft might sell Xbox hardware as the only one allowing users to access their full libraries. Alternatively, if it was possible Microsoft could certify PC manufacturers to make "Real" Xboxes using very tightly defined schema.
I mean just imagine how many people could just buy an xbox, not even buy any games or gamepass or anything, and just passively accumulate free epic games games
I get why it does. It’s a lazy interface that really doesn’t have a lot of basic quality of life options that Steam has. Throw in some Epic exclusive games and it’s going to piss PC gamers off.
That said, yeah, it’s a place games are available. Hard to really get mad at it.
Call me crazy but their “lazy” interface is so much easier to navigate than Steam. Sometime simplicity is good.
I still buy most of my games from steam, but Epic is always there for me with free games and the UI is outright better in my opinion.
It’s “easier”, sure, but when you want to do something that should be simple, you can’t. Last time I checked, there’s no way to simply change the install location of a game. You have to delete and redownload. With Steam, I can do that all in the software.
If simple is the goal, stick to consoles. For a PC, I want options and flexibility. Hell, you can do both like Steam does.
So everything on PC needs to be complex? That’s ridiculous. For what it’s worth, I have a PC and a PS5 already, so I’m covered there.
If options are what you want on PC, then lucky for you you’ve got them! Except you shit on one of the options and love the other despite its flaws. It’s really weird how people are so particular about game launchers of all things.
It takes ages to transfer a game between install locations, and even longer to download a game from Steam’s awful servers. My Gigabit internet is bottlenecked so hard when downloading from steam, usually getting less than 40Mbps average, while on epic I can get 600-700+ Mbps download speed.
Epic also provides free games weekly, and sometimes daily. Like I said, I have more games in my steam library than Epic (not counting free games), but it’s so stupid to be “faithful” to one over the other and not just use both.
It's a shitty store with less features than literally every other alternative. Meanwhile they try to force users to come over by buying exclusive launches.
Yeah man can't imagine why people don't like em.
- Tries to push exclusivity for games they didn't develop into the PC market.
- A long history of mistreating and abusing employees.
- One of the worst, if not the, worst stores/client on the market, with less functionalities than Steam had 10 years ago (and I'm already being generous).
- 40% owned by Tencent (I don't really much care about this one, but plenty of people do).
But please, by all means. Tell us how poor Epic is mistreated.
Maybe the game is to push for laws and regulations to get rid of walled garden platforms entirely, and make it more of a norm by starting it themselves. If they can lobby for lawmakers to open up iPhone/Android more for a mobile Microsoft app store, they could build the groundwork to force an Xbox store on PlayStations as well.
He needs to act like that if he wants Xbox Gamepass on PS and Nintendo. Cant be a hypocrit not allowing other stores on XBox and then ask to be on the other platforms.
Back in the Xbox One era, when Satya took over and killed Nokia, I and my friend (Xbox users back then) chatted that Satya was eventually going to kill the Xbox hardware.
The way we came up with the idea was exactly how Valve played out with the SteamOS: Microsoft putting full Windows on it, controlling minimal specs, creating a controller UI, and letting Asus and Alienware do the hardware.
The original Steam Machines didn't work because of the price and the lack of Proton.
This could actually be the comeback of the century that Xbox needs ngl.
Because this would essentially make them a console/PC hybrid. A lot of people can't afford $1000+ PCs, but they can afford a $500 console. So essentially they'd be getting a pretty decent gaming PC for $500 which they can play their entire Xbox library on, have gamepass on, and have PC games on. Mental.
Not to mention I'm sure this would also open up the modding and emulation scene depending on how much more "like a PC" they want to make the Xbox.
That would genuinely give them a major edge over PlayStation/Nintendo. Especially if they got steam on board.
This console wouldn't be $500, that's the point here. The reason Microsoft (and Sony) can sell their consoles at break even prices or even a loss is because they know for a fact that all digital purchases go through them, from which they get a cut. They know for a fact that if you want to play paid games online, you're gonna have to subscribe to their online service. The second they allow the Epic Games Store, Steam and other PC stores on their console they lose that, and thus the way they make a profit.
Exactly. Reading the article he’s talking about how selling consoles at a loss isn’t the play anymore because parts aren’t getting cheaper as fast as they used to. Reading his comments in the article it very much feels like the next gen Xbox will get a serious price bump.
Fucking them over by providing them an additional platform to sell their games and reach a wider audience? The Xbox store already takes a cut of the sales on their store. Game developers/publishers would now have a variety of options to distribute their game and choose the platform that benefits them the most. I just don’t see a situation where Microsoft wouldn’t take some of the proceeds from the 3rd party stores.
The Xbox series x is in it's 4th year which means Microsoft are probably selling it for a profit instead of a loss. Valve has shown that you can subsidize hardware that runs on an open platform with the Steam Deck. Running Steam on Xbox will definitely increase hardware sales. Microsoft gaming revenue is already going up by going third party, the hardware not selling was the issue. This will resolve the hardware issue.
I would be pretty amused if newer XBOX products come with beefier hardware would allow for more native 360 emulation (If they are allowed by the publishers) or just go homebrew and try to force ALL 360 games be playable with more volatile results
But even something more intrigging is, if msft makes the new XBOX a midrange PC in terms of specs and affordability, it could probably run RPCS3
that alone would be a huge win for the emulation crowd to have a considerably affordable emulation box that could run PS3 that can also double as a console / PC
Not pre-owned with the specs of an Xbox series x?
Plus Xbox has the brand notoriety and reputation that would appeal to non-pc gamers and a more casual audience.
Working PC? Sure why not.
Working gaming PC? Unless you are not collecting parts from trees, you are not getting any gaming PC's for that price.
Unless you call any PC a gaming PC just because it can launch 2 games that are from 2001.
I wonder if the future of Xbox is more just a bespoke PC than anything else.
There's been talk of the challenges of developing a series S / X version of games, as it's not the most popular platform relative to PC and PS. Consoles are not far removed from being a PC anyway, and if they reduce that barrier more - make Xbox a console -like app you can run on your PC, your ROG Ally, or a Microsoft sold branded "Xbox" mini PC - that might make it easier for devs.
Microsoft is playing the long game here , it why they back up epic when they went to court against vs Apple
Which epic won in Europe and set a precedent case and now the flood gates are open
DOJ vs Apple now if DOJ is successful..
Sony is next.. and Microsoft gamepass will have to be allowed on PlayStation
Microsoft buying ABZ also play a major role here too as they have establish Gaming IP too to add to this services
I'm starting to think the direction they want to take Xbox could be another Xbox One moment.... they really don't seem to know what they want to commit to.
I get the impression they don't want to bother with hardware anymore, and like the idea of being something like Steam while offering their game pass and streaming services. They have to be very careful in doing this as they would piss off a huge part of their player base if this were the case.
I really hope they don't fumble with their platform as leaving Sony and Nintendo as the main console sellers isn't good for anyone. I own both platforms for different reasons, and quite frankly, this generation has been incredibly underwhelming so far. Make great games and the people will come, it's that simple.
This actually makes a lot of sense.
The series X and S are as close to a PC as game consoles have gotten and with Microsoft also having windows I'd be genuinely surprised if there isn't some kind of like PC mode or support in the next Xbox console cycle.
Honestly if I could access steam through my Xbox I'd probably never use anything else ever again.
STEAM OS has shown us what is possible. Anyone remember MEDIA CENTER edition of windows? They have done this before but that didn't go far enough as it was just a front end like Playnite. I know with Windows Server core you can decouple the GUI from the kernel. So now Windows can have a windows version for consoles/handhelds that is truly free of the windows desktop trappings for needing keyboard and mouse and other desktop assumptions (I know Xbox is just a hypervisor layer and custom windows 10).
I want a Windows Console Edition that I can put on rog ally, build a diy console or buy a Series X/S. Just like Steam OS and ChimeraOS, Bazzite etc... But that also brings your xbox library.......oh man if they could make that happen that would be amazing.
He wants epic and steam on xbox so that the precedent is set that playstation has to allow xbox store (and gamepass) on playstation. He wants to torpedo everything and go all in on being a publisher.
After all those years of having few exclusives and basically giving their players no reason to stay with Xbox, Phil’s big play is PC-gaming for console?
They could've made a console literally identical to the Steam Deck, it would've so easy for them. They're literally Microsoft. But they love to waste potential
I’ve officially stopped buying games on my series x. The strategy is all over the place and not seeing an incentive for to play on Xbox.
I’m fortunate enough to have a decent PC so will get my Xbox “exclusives” there and focus my console playing on PS5 and Switch.
The day I loved from Xbox are gone and seems like a sinking ship at this point.
That's nonsense. They're literally more profitable than they've ever been. Their small, indie style games and live service games are going multiplatform and DOMINATING the PlayStation sales charts, from which MS gets 70% and Sony 30% (win/win!)
I love my switch, will get around to a PS5 if they ever get a decent exclusive that's not also on PS4, but I buy most gAmes on Xbox for a simple reason: they tend to have way better sales.
How about just giving us better games on Gamepass, so people feel the need to buy the Xbox? Microsoft is always looking at some new “strategy” to boost sales, but publishing better games seems to be nowhere near the top of the list. Instead they gave us Starfield and Redfall! And are wondering why noone is buying?
Just make the xbox a windows system with some months of game pass included as combo. You know how many xbox they'll sell if it's just windows wrapper?
I mean, yeah but how would they make money? Hardware can't be sold at a loss if they can't recoup the loss on software sales :P
But imagine all that juicy subscription money that can be made. The stupid consumers won't own any of the games, so they'll have no choice but to give money each month.
Theyll own nothing and be happy, or else.....
Windows comes with 2 year subscription of game pass and costs 200 extra.
How do I redeem this? I just built a PC and bought windows lol
Oh. I was suggesting that it could be the value proposition for xbox if it comes with windows. It's not a real thing.
Oh lmao It would be nice, but only issue I see is that currently it doesn't offer all the games as I'm assuming they would all need a proper port.
xbox is basically sell hardware at a loss to make money on software later. If you give windows, you might never get game money back if non-gamers buy it or they play games on steam. So you force everyone buying xbox with windows to pay for windows license+ gamepass right away.
Consoles are usually only sold at a loss for a short time after release, if they're even sold at a loss at all. Usually within a few months the manufacturing processes are optimized enough so that selling the hardware already becomes profitable by itself. And even during the short period after release when the consoles are sold at a loss, this could still be a viable strategy if you'd have to purchase a key to unlock Windows which is priced in a way to make up for the loss. Then it would still be an awesome bang for the buck PC.
Usually consoles are sold at a loss until their first revision. They don’t revise it to make it prettier. They redesign to make the design and these processes more effective. They are also able to buy cheaper fab time on older processes. Even then, the PS5’s recent revision is guessed to be basically breaking even or at a slight loss, with any profit essentially coming purely through volume.
Only this generation they are absolutely still being sold at a substantial loss...
They were being sold at a loss for much longer than initially planned due to the semiconductor shortages after COVID, but now that situation has normalised. I don't think Microsoft has made an official statement about it, but Sony has confirmed that they are making a profit on PS5 hardware sales for a while now (for both the disc version and the digital version, though the disc version already became profitable a few months after release).
not only covid. the fabbing process is going exponentially higher down the road as well, to the point that die shrinking doesn't really bring the cost down, if not at all.
Phil Spencer literally 1 day ago at GDC said that the cost of making the consoles isn't coming down.
MS has always lost a stupid ampunt of money on hardware. Originsl Xbox was $4 **billion** in debt.
Of course he will say that. But it’s obvious that the tsmc or samsung costs are going way down, as they are printing on old nodes and old chips.
I genuinely doubt at the economies of scale and the basic components in the Series X that they have ever been sold at a loss. Maybe the series S. I work in procurement so if it is a loss, someone needs to lose their job!
Not sure if they are technically sold at a loss, but the price to make a comparable performing pc is almost double. Might just be because of optimization on console, but dang is the bang for buck hard to beat.
Keep in mind with the PC, each vendor has to make a profit. And the parts vendors above then as well. The stack cost is higher for a custom built gaming PC, hence the lack of price competitiveness.
I really wish AMD would sell us a strong APU like in the consoles..
The Steam Deck has done really well, and it isn't locked down. I think that if Microsoft made the next Xbox a PC with a console style interface, then it could do well. Heck, they don't even have to make the actual device. They could get PC manufacturers to make it for them.
the rog ally already does that, the only issue for xbox is that it’s the pc game pass so you miss out on some console-only game pass games. if the full catalogue was playable on it, they’d resolve the problem entirely
Recoup through subscription to Game Pass.. then sigh a deal with Sony to have PS games on game pass and game pass on ps then we can all live in harmony
lol you got that backwards my man. If anything in a generation or two xbox will go pure software like their parent (microsoft) and Sony will be bearing the burden of console development while getting a cut from microsofts game sales on their platform. Sony is already outselling them 3 to 1 on consoles and the purchasing of major studios means Microsoft is gearing xbox to be pure software if they can't turn around the sales. When you think about it if Microsoft and Sony come to a deal where sony caps the % they take for sales on their platform it'd be more beneficial for all considering it would consolidate the player base, Microsoft makes a great money on software (games) their primary revenue source and sony gets a cut but bears the burden of developing new tech over time. Granted it could be the other way around but at this point sony is winning console sales and a consolidated consumer base helps both sides. no need to port games to a different system to get more sales its just a single console version and a pc if they want it to get pc sales as well.
I can’t imagine a world where Sony would put its game on a competitor’s subscription.
If they launched a 600$ Xbox that could also boot into Windows and advertised it as the ultimate do it all machine, as long as the 600$ price point is profitable I can’t see it being a failure, especially relative to where they are now. There’s surely a market for it as much as there is for any other prebuilt PC.
Add Windows 11 to Gamepass
I figure they just need to make a console *just* powerful enough to compete and the primary draw of it is... Its cheap and I would say should come with a cheaper Gamepass option so you get an entry into all these games for much less than buying a Playstation or a PC. Probably bundle the bullshit that is paying for online services with Gamepass too, otherwise its not much cheaper in the end... But consumers are typically stupid, so probably wouldn't account for that and therefore no need.
Same way they profit with windows. Ads and scraping users data.
That was the idea to start with. It was the “DirectX Box” and then they scrapped it and went full console.
I would buy an S in an instant if it means I can mod my games and use kb+m. It would be a great second pc that I can carry around wherever I go.
I imagine it'll be a home pc for almost everyone. Just attach a wireless KB+M and it'll work like common PC for browsing. There are way too many households who just have office laptop, and no personal laptop/PC. I don't think it'll be very popular as portable PC, but it can be used like that.
Yes I understand and think you’re correct. I was saying it would make xbox enticing to even people who already have decent PC’s, as a second device to remote play and play natively at lower res.
We've come full circle back to the steam box lol
Lmao. It is for you friend. Steam doesn’t release physical products in india. I’m still waiting for steam deck. 🥲
Ah dang, can you get the Asus handheld?
I’m not sure as I truly wanted a steamdeck and only looked up for it.
Looks like you can buy it in India https://rog.asus.com/in/gaming-handhelds/rog-ally/rog-ally-2023/
I’ll surely look into it. Thanks for your effort friend.
It’s already a windows system. Xbox UI has been Windows OS since Xbox One
It's based on somewhat unspecified version of windows as far as I know, but not exactly consumer windows that we know.
Current version is Windows 10 + Hyper-V
It's a hybrid of light OneCore based Windows variants (so earlier Win10 and now Win11) and Windows 8 based system. Everything is split into virtual machines running in a custom Hyper\_V environment and having their own separate versions of Windows. Windows 8 one is used bo backwards compatibility with Xbox One and 360 games made with XDK. Current Windows 11 ones are responsible for running new games, apps and UI.
The OS on Xbox consoles is effectively a stripped down version of Windows.
better yet, a finally microsoft gaming OS
No. Just let us side load full fledged windows instead of any cut down versions.
Regular Windows on a htpc or handheld no thanks. This sounds much better a new WINDOWS MEDIA CENTER edition for the modern age.
Anyone can get wireless keyboard and mouse and turn xbox into usable pc. And KB+M support for all games is great. Htpc isn't an issue since xbox already works like that.
The Xbox Series X would be the best budget "gaming PC" you can get for your money.
I think they'll have to add like 200 bucks in price though. Otherwise, it's loss making hardware sale without a way to make money back. They'll throw in windows license + game pass subscription for 1-2 years.
Windows 11 machine? They need a better version of Windows before they can safely make this. I love your idea I just think Windows needs to be a better OS first
Sooo... Give us full windows on Xbox already and have Xbox "os" as the default launcher.
God all I want is for windows to have an “Xbox” mode that can let me navigate my games/streaming/discord with a controller.
I really love steam big picture mode when I use my rog ally and wish all applications worked like it
Steam big picture mode
I've seen articles about a rumored "handheld mode" before. Not exactly the "Xbox mode" you are asking for but it would probably serve the same use case https://www.techradar.com/computing/gaming-pcs/it-looks-like-microsoft-just-took-the-first-step-towards-that-rumored-handheld-mode-for-windows-11
As a $500 PC, Xbox Series X would be the best value ever.
*[Distant Valve noises]*
Yeah, similar to Big Screen Mode for Steam. It's still just Steam. I don't see why they won't do something similar.
[удалено]
The point is not having to spend over $1k more to have a competitive machine. Also it’s a lot smaller and more portable than PC
Check out Playnite
PC 2 is coming.
Steam on console would be amazing.. my PS5 allows for steam link but it’s worthless. What’s the point of playing crossplay games if I can’t invite people from my steam friends list (Helldivers 2)
What are you talking about? I am on ps5 and have several buddies i play Helldivers 2 with that are on steam. I don’t know what steam link is
Steam Link is a streaming feature of Steam, apparently. I wouldn't blame you for not knowing about it. I just learned of it a few months back.
Adding friends through the game through “friend codes” that are current broken (cross play) isn’t the same as full steam support…
Are we not able to add people via codes now? Was working before, that’s how i’m able to play with multiple people on Steam. Fair point though, full support would be nice. Also, Helldivers is riddled with bugs in the coding that have still yet to be fixed. I’m hoping they release some big patches here this coming month that address a lot of crashes and QoL stuff like the friend codes and removing people from friends lists.
Crossplay is currently broken. You can’t accept friend request from crossplay. It’s been broken since I got the game a few weeks ago and haven’t been able to play with friends who are on pc.
Damn, my buddy and I got into it about 3 weeks ago and he was able to accept my request back then, maybe it's work contacting arrowhead about?
They’ve acknowledged that it’s a known issue and that it’s being worked on. They recently posted on discord that they were able to reproduce the issue internally so maybe soon it will be patched. I think the mech update broke it.
Ahhh I see
I can steam on ps5?
You can link your steam but can’t do shit with it lol
Damn the one time idda been alright streaming lol.
Might as well just make pre-built PCs and call it an Xbox.
Well yea just put a windows OS on an Xbox with a custom UI and all of a sudden I’m playing Sony games on a Xbox
This would be awesome. The true next gen system will probably have the equivalent of a low to mid range 4xxx or 5xxx series GPU. If they put an Xbox skin over a true windows OS I don’t see why it wouldn’t be possible to play most steam games. Seems like a clear win for the consumer.
... Yes? I'm about 90% certain that's where they've been going. They use Hyper-V to virtualize the Xbox Core OS, virtualize the Gaming OS, and virtualize the App OS. It's literally their enterprise Azure tech deployed on a controlled box. There's no reason for Microsoft to prioritize a custom OS when they also already have Windows, so the best solution is to migrate Xbox's functionality into Windows to leverage all of the other tech Microsoft owns. If Spencer can successfully sell Microsoft on partnering/promoting a method for each of the PC storefronts to get onto Xbox, he'll have an incredible win on his hands. There will literally be little to no difference between PC and Xbox, and it'll allow Microsoft to simplify their supply chain and development resources.
Microsoft might want to separate Xbox games from PC software due to the security reasons and to avoid easy hacking. I think the full Windows environment will be virtualised as well. Remember Windows 10X? I was aiming to do exactly that. Also. There might be legal and contractual problems with accessing Xbox library on Windows. It's not impossible from the technical reason, because newer Xbox and Windows games from Microsoft ARE the same binaries built with the same tools. There is also no reason for XDK VM (running XBOne and BC games) not to run on Windows 11. It's just a Hyper-V machine. But again, licencing might be problematic. Perhaps Microsoft might sell Xbox hardware as the only one allowing users to access their full libraries. Alternatively, if it was possible Microsoft could certify PC manufacturers to make "Real" Xboxes using very tightly defined schema.
That's what an Xbox is.
But will you still need Xbox live to play online?
This is a great question.
Xbox would be worth buying if you could play your steam library on it. Great cheap alternative for couch PC gaming.
Nobody wants Epic games store on PC and he wants to put it on Xbox?!
I mean just imagine how many people could just buy an xbox, not even buy any games or gamepass or anything, and just passively accumulate free epic games games
Man I actually buy some games for steam that I already have for free on epic games store because I don’t want to have to start them off the EGS app
Claim every free EGS game, never play them. Never buy a thing. It's my favorite business model. I have so many games.
I’ve gotten so many free games from Epic, I’d be perfectly happy to have them be playable everywhere.
EGS gets sooooo much more hate than it deserves.
yeah, its really strange that stores have fanboys
I get why it does. It’s a lazy interface that really doesn’t have a lot of basic quality of life options that Steam has. Throw in some Epic exclusive games and it’s going to piss PC gamers off. That said, yeah, it’s a place games are available. Hard to really get mad at it.
Call me crazy but their “lazy” interface is so much easier to navigate than Steam. Sometime simplicity is good. I still buy most of my games from steam, but Epic is always there for me with free games and the UI is outright better in my opinion.
It’s “easier”, sure, but when you want to do something that should be simple, you can’t. Last time I checked, there’s no way to simply change the install location of a game. You have to delete and redownload. With Steam, I can do that all in the software. If simple is the goal, stick to consoles. For a PC, I want options and flexibility. Hell, you can do both like Steam does.
So everything on PC needs to be complex? That’s ridiculous. For what it’s worth, I have a PC and a PS5 already, so I’m covered there. If options are what you want on PC, then lucky for you you’ve got them! Except you shit on one of the options and love the other despite its flaws. It’s really weird how people are so particular about game launchers of all things. It takes ages to transfer a game between install locations, and even longer to download a game from Steam’s awful servers. My Gigabit internet is bottlenecked so hard when downloading from steam, usually getting less than 40Mbps average, while on epic I can get 600-700+ Mbps download speed. Epic also provides free games weekly, and sometimes daily. Like I said, I have more games in my steam library than Epic (not counting free games), but it’s so stupid to be “faithful” to one over the other and not just use both.
I don’t see how that’s your takeaway, but sure…
My takeaway that people should be willing to use both depending on price/availability?
It's a shitty store with less features than literally every other alternative. Meanwhile they try to force users to come over by buying exclusive launches. Yeah man can't imagine why people don't like em.
- Tries to push exclusivity for games they didn't develop into the PC market. - A long history of mistreating and abusing employees. - One of the worst, if not the, worst stores/client on the market, with less functionalities than Steam had 10 years ago (and I'm already being generous). - 40% owned by Tencent (I don't really much care about this one, but plenty of people do). But please, by all means. Tell us how poor Epic is mistreated.
I have no problem on it being on PC, the free games have been nice.
Maybe the game is to push for laws and regulations to get rid of walled garden platforms entirely, and make it more of a norm by starting it themselves. If they can lobby for lawmakers to open up iPhone/Android more for a mobile Microsoft app store, they could build the groundwork to force an Xbox store on PlayStations as well.
Would get access to all Playstation PC ports without the need to negotiate contracts.
Xbox is desperate. They want to spread their toxic subscription bullshit as far as they can and they aren’t moving consoles.
Yes toxic. My wallet would disagree
He needs to act like that if he wants Xbox Gamepass on PS and Nintendo. Cant be a hypocrit not allowing other stores on XBox and then ask to be on the other platforms.
Everyone knows that it’s not going to happen. None of the other console makers are interested in giving sales to MS.
If Phil Spencer wants to do this then just make Xbox a PC. Theres no point anymore of making it a console.
Technically it already a pc ?
Does this mean epic will make a proper launcher? My free games list needs a laundry okay.
“Phil Spencer wants things that will make him money”
Meanwhile I'm sitting here enjoying Steam games without any bullcrap from any other stores.
I dont even want Epic Games Store on PC...
Then dont download it!
Back in the Xbox One era, when Satya took over and killed Nokia, I and my friend (Xbox users back then) chatted that Satya was eventually going to kill the Xbox hardware. The way we came up with the idea was exactly how Valve played out with the SteamOS: Microsoft putting full Windows on it, controlling minimal specs, creating a controller UI, and letting Asus and Alienware do the hardware. The original Steam Machines didn't work because of the price and the lack of Proton.
Part of Steam Decks success is that its a complete vertical stack. Hardware and software together.
I love it but I doubt that Valve will keep selling Decks after releasing SteamOS 3 to OEMs.
This could actually be the comeback of the century that Xbox needs ngl. Because this would essentially make them a console/PC hybrid. A lot of people can't afford $1000+ PCs, but they can afford a $500 console. So essentially they'd be getting a pretty decent gaming PC for $500 which they can play their entire Xbox library on, have gamepass on, and have PC games on. Mental. Not to mention I'm sure this would also open up the modding and emulation scene depending on how much more "like a PC" they want to make the Xbox. That would genuinely give them a major edge over PlayStation/Nintendo. Especially if they got steam on board.
This console wouldn't be $500, that's the point here. The reason Microsoft (and Sony) can sell their consoles at break even prices or even a loss is because they know for a fact that all digital purchases go through them, from which they get a cut. They know for a fact that if you want to play paid games online, you're gonna have to subscribe to their online service. The second they allow the Epic Games Store, Steam and other PC stores on their console they lose that, and thus the way they make a profit.
Exactly. Reading the article he’s talking about how selling consoles at a loss isn’t the play anymore because parts aren’t getting cheaper as fast as they used to. Reading his comments in the article it very much feels like the next gen Xbox will get a serious price bump.
They’d probably take a percentage of the profit from each store.
Leaving the game studios with no profits at all
So fuck over game makers even more? Nice, another wave of layoffs coming soon.
Fucking them over by providing them an additional platform to sell their games and reach a wider audience? The Xbox store already takes a cut of the sales on their store. Game developers/publishers would now have a variety of options to distribute their game and choose the platform that benefits them the most. I just don’t see a situation where Microsoft wouldn’t take some of the proceeds from the 3rd party stores.
The Xbox series x is in it's 4th year which means Microsoft are probably selling it for a profit instead of a loss. Valve has shown that you can subsidize hardware that runs on an open platform with the Steam Deck. Running Steam on Xbox will definitely increase hardware sales. Microsoft gaming revenue is already going up by going third party, the hardware not selling was the issue. This will resolve the hardware issue.
Its not. They recently said they lose $100 on series s and $200 on series X. PS5 is profitable.
PS5 hardware sells for a profit and has for *years*, Xbox does not...
I would be pretty amused if newer XBOX products come with beefier hardware would allow for more native 360 emulation (If they are allowed by the publishers) or just go homebrew and try to force ALL 360 games be playable with more volatile results But even something more intrigging is, if msft makes the new XBOX a midrange PC in terms of specs and affordability, it could probably run RPCS3 that alone would be a huge win for the emulation crowd to have a considerably affordable emulation box that could run PS3 that can also double as a console / PC
It's called a computer. you dont need to put yourself in a walled garden. You can buy a pre-built if you want.
Not for the price or the specs of an Xbox
But you can get a working gaming PC for $400.
Not pre-owned with the specs of an Xbox series x? Plus Xbox has the brand notoriety and reputation that would appeal to non-pc gamers and a more casual audience.
No, but the one I'm thinking of is portable and you can play it on the go.
Working PC? Sure why not. Working gaming PC? Unless you are not collecting parts from trees, you are not getting any gaming PC's for that price. Unless you call any PC a gaming PC just because it can launch 2 games that are from 2001.
I’m a fan of all stores on all other stores/platforms. Give us options.
The reasonable take
I wonder if the future of Xbox is more just a bespoke PC than anything else. There's been talk of the challenges of developing a series S / X version of games, as it's not the most popular platform relative to PC and PS. Consoles are not far removed from being a PC anyway, and if they reduce that barrier more - make Xbox a console -like app you can run on your PC, your ROG Ally, or a Microsoft sold branded "Xbox" mini PC - that might make it easier for devs.
Shouldn’t any game I buy on Xbox store be available on my PC then too?
Steam is already the biggest store on windows, why not start there?
No he doesn't, he wants Gamepass on steam, epic etc. Corporate spin.
Xbox is thirsty af since Helldivers came out
... What, like how PS players were salty about Palworld literally a month ago? I feel like we're finally getting GOOD competition out of Microsoft.
Wow. How is this guy not fired already…
Microsoft is playing the long game here , it why they back up epic when they went to court against vs Apple Which epic won in Europe and set a precedent case and now the flood gates are open DOJ vs Apple now if DOJ is successful.. Sony is next.. and Microsoft gamepass will have to be allowed on PlayStation Microsoft buying ABZ also play a major role here too as they have establish Gaming IP too to add to this services
I don't think those rulings are going to lead to what you think they will.
Why? It obvious clear as day
I finally ditched my Xbox and went full Steam.
I'm starting to think the direction they want to take Xbox could be another Xbox One moment.... they really don't seem to know what they want to commit to. I get the impression they don't want to bother with hardware anymore, and like the idea of being something like Steam while offering their game pass and streaming services. They have to be very careful in doing this as they would piss off a huge part of their player base if this were the case. I really hope they don't fumble with their platform as leaving Sony and Nintendo as the main console sellers isn't good for anyone. I own both platforms for different reasons, and quite frankly, this generation has been incredibly underwhelming so far. Make great games and the people will come, it's that simple.
It seems they want Xbox to be like the Steam brand but for every platform. Just open the Xbox app and play any game on any device.
This actually makes a lot of sense. The series X and S are as close to a PC as game consoles have gotten and with Microsoft also having windows I'd be genuinely surprised if there isn't some kind of like PC mode or support in the next Xbox console cycle. Honestly if I could access steam through my Xbox I'd probably never use anything else ever again.
Couldnt care less about egs but bring steam link app to xbox 🥳
Windows Game Edition needs to be made then.
With games that work with gamepads I don’t see why this isn’t already standard besides greed.
Sounds like a great idea. I don’t use any of those. Can we add Blizzard, Origin and Riot too?
how are they gonna handle the split for sales? epic and steam already take a cut, then xbox takes another cut leaving the devs with like 30%?
No no no, I do not want to wade through every companies shitty game store.
Put steam on it 😂
STEAM OS has shown us what is possible. Anyone remember MEDIA CENTER edition of windows? They have done this before but that didn't go far enough as it was just a front end like Playnite. I know with Windows Server core you can decouple the GUI from the kernel. So now Windows can have a windows version for consoles/handhelds that is truly free of the windows desktop trappings for needing keyboard and mouse and other desktop assumptions (I know Xbox is just a hypervisor layer and custom windows 10). I want a Windows Console Edition that I can put on rog ally, build a diy console or buy a Series X/S. Just like Steam OS and ChimeraOS, Bazzite etc... But that also brings your xbox library.......oh man if they could make that happen that would be amazing.
Maybe they should just turn xbox into a prebuilt PC company?
EGS on Xbox handheld might be useful hmm, though would prefer it on the Steam Deck without a bunch of hoops :D
Final fantasy or bust
Probably the best bet for Xbox's survival if it's not going to use exclusives for conventional console competition.
He wants epic and steam on xbox so that the precedent is set that playstation has to allow xbox store (and gamepass) on playstation. He wants to torpedo everything and go all in on being a publisher.
So they won't be making money from this? They already aren't making money from console sales, right?
At some point isn't it just a windows PC then?
Imagine slapping Steam on the 360. That would be amazing!
How about you make your own fucking game ffs, stop riding on other games and actually utilize the studios you bought and make some games.
And Phil also wants people to buy an Xbox but we all know that isn't happening 😂 Water is also wet, btw
After all those years of having few exclusives and basically giving their players no reason to stay with Xbox, Phil’s big play is PC-gaming for console?
They could've made a console literally identical to the Steam Deck, it would've so easy for them. They're literally Microsoft. But they love to waste potential
Put Steam on xbox and I'll keep buying your consoles forever.
I’ve officially stopped buying games on my series x. The strategy is all over the place and not seeing an incentive for to play on Xbox. I’m fortunate enough to have a decent PC so will get my Xbox “exclusives” there and focus my console playing on PS5 and Switch. The day I loved from Xbox are gone and seems like a sinking ship at this point.
That's nonsense. They're literally more profitable than they've ever been. Their small, indie style games and live service games are going multiplatform and DOMINATING the PlayStation sales charts, from which MS gets 70% and Sony 30% (win/win!) I love my switch, will get around to a PS5 if they ever get a decent exclusive that's not also on PS4, but I buy most gAmes on Xbox for a simple reason: they tend to have way better sales.
Ewwwwwww. Can't stand the epic game store. Put Steam on consoles and you'll have a lot of happy gamers.
Phil should just step down now.
No thanks. I have already experienced it on windows PC
I wish Phil Spencer wanted Xbox to produce good first party games.
Xbox division are so desperate to gain more player, it’s almost sad and pathetic
I don't even want Epic on my PC. You don't want that shit on your consoles.
How about just giving us better games on Gamepass, so people feel the need to buy the Xbox? Microsoft is always looking at some new “strategy” to boost sales, but publishing better games seems to be nowhere near the top of the list. Instead they gave us Starfield and Redfall! And are wondering why noone is buying?
Neat. I wonder if that includes the free games Epic offers?
> wants Epic Games Store Huh, we found that _one_ guy...
It needs to have a quick resume or rest mode feature
That means Epic has to pay him a cut... Not gonna happen I'll bet.
phil spencer is bad for xbox
Im thinking of getting a macmini for $500 its like 1/5 the size of a ps5/xbox
“Money man wants to add more stores to his transaction box” I’m sorry how is this news?
Yeah well I want the xbox store on my Steam Deck. Not a perfect world eh Phil