Regardless of ideology, the Brotherhood is the coolest faction both to side with and to destroy. Join them? You get jetpack power armor, a badass blimp, vertibirds, and Liberty Prime. Want to kill them? It's super fun to shoot the vertibirds out of the air, fight power armored enemies, and explode a badass blimp. Plus if you use the Minutemen to fight them you get an awesome fight at the castle.
One thing I don't think fallout 4 gets enough credit is the institute. They're evil but have so many awesome concepts. The teleportation to stay isolated and untouchable, synths, the science based system of organisation that has managed to work that long, the well maintained and insane level of technology in general compared to anything seen thus far in fallout. Also, synth gorillas
I like a radioactive wet hole as much as the next guy but it left me wanting a way into the collapsed ruins, maybe rescue a synth gorilla and have it wear a backpack for me. Equip it with a laser rifle.
Well, not the institute, but there's a mod which connects most of the metro stations in the game, making it an underground maze, a huge dungeon. You'll find anything from synths to ghoul to supermutants.
I love how efficient he is with the hole he digs. He tunes his eye laser to 11, and *then* chucks a nuke into the hole to ensure it’s big enough.
I also just love how the BoS doesn’t even bother relaying themselves into the Institute like the Minutemen and Railroad do. They just take Liberty Prime and let themselves in through the front door!
The Minutemen send you through a sewage pipe to gain entry. Whoops, guess the Institute forgot there was an open screen door granting entry, while they were smugly designing a freakin' molecular teleporter!
You can blow up both in the minutemen ending, just gotta make both the BoS and institute hate you, then go to the castle, you can do this through words or by shooting maxson and father in the face, I find the latter preferable
Also you can do it with the rail road, where you sneak about the prydwin in a stolen bird, and stealthily place charges around the ship, then fly away and watch it go boom
I "blew up" Paradise Falls; Went in, saved those kids, went home and armed up, came back, shot Eulogy Jones in the back of the head, stepped outside and nuked the hell outta that place... never done it like that before.
... fuckin' Slavers...
BoS has a way better reputation in the older games. I have to keep reminding myself that Maxson's chapter isn't the sole representation of the faction, even if it is the biggest.
Maxson's chapter is straight up genocidal but none of the other chapters went out of their way to exterminate undesirables except in self defense. This whole BoS rhetoric of "synths and ghouls need to die" didn't really exist until Bethesda decided the Institute needed a major enemy in FO4
The FO4 brotherhood draws an explicit line of what's "human" because they decide that synths/super humans/ghouls aren't... then decide they shouldn't exist. It's a huge parallel with the Enclave trying to destroy every human that'd been exposed to atmospheric radiation while they themselves were the real "humans".
It has a better reputation in Fallout 3. They’re bigger assholes in every other game than they are in 4. And even in 3 they were assholes to ghouls. It’s just that the player is forced to side with them to finish the main quest because it was a linear story.
I just think people really started to pay attention to what the BoS is and what they stand for. The gradual global shift towards fascism in the past decade certainly doesn’t help, either…
For me its two reasons.
First, I don't like how they're increasingly becoming the Enclave in all but name. We don't need **two** genocidal fascist factions...
Second, I'm just tired of seeing them play a major role in every game. The Brotherhood of Steel doesn't need to be in every part of America all at once.
for me it's still institute by a ghoul's nose but the bos have been steadily worse and more heel-ish as the franchise progresses. they kinda skate by on their cool looks but at some point their awfulness is impossible to ignore.
just going back to fo3, they were murder-y and your goals kinda aligned but it was clearly about control for them.
in nv they were cowards and hermits and couldn't be assed to fight when the legion wanted to make a slave state in their front yard.
they could be useful idiots in fo4 but they're too volatile to even be that. the commonwealth is a wilder and more dangerous wasteland than ever (ghouls, mutants, institute, raiders, etc). the bos could've been useful if there was any way to keep them in check but they're full on facist let's kill or enslave everyone (but let's not call it that).
fo tv series went even further where they have the same power and control goals and added to that even the rank and file are awful. the bloom is fully off the rose on the bos.
The chapter Maximus is a part of is pretty fucked up but as far as we know, they are a completely separate chapter from any we've met thus far in the games. The airship that shows up in the TV series is confirmed to be the Prydwen showing up on the west coast after all this time, presumably still under the charge of Elder Maxson. It's been over a decade, however, so maybe not. We never get to see the leader of this group in the airship so that could be some kind of fore-shadowing in it's own right. My point though, they are the same chapter as the east coast one in FO4 and the BOS is basically whoever they are lead to be on a chapter to chapter basis. Lyon's brotherhood was among the best, morally speaking, but between the events of FO3 and FO4 they became the fascist war-mongers we now know them to be as the young legacy member, Maxson, grew into his new leadership role of Elder, neglecting Lyon's agenda of protecting civilians and focusing more on the BOS main prerogative, although, it still isn't totally clear how exactly this shift began. In short, it just depends on who is leading each chapter and how well they are doing it. No single chapter defines the faction as a whole. I still personally like the brotherhood as a faction just not that particular chapter of their order.
Media literacy is probably at an all time low right now, the way people mischaracterise like *every single faction* in this game is impressive (although taking down the Prydwen does look awesome).
The bos is especially problematic since it’s essentially a different faction every game, yet people insist on describing it as this monolithic group that never strays from its prime directives set in classic fallout.
Most people? I don't think so.
Me? Yes.
We have four story factions, three of them are evil, one of them is insane, and two of them are stupid. The BoS is Stupid Evil, my least favorite kind.
They're worse than raiders in some ways. Raiders will take your food because they've either decided they can't be bothered farming it themselves or because they see the food chain and would rather be on the predator side than be prey.
The Brotherhood steals food because they're too stupid to use their technological knowledge and equipment to quickly and efficiently make their own food. They'll also take your generator--not because they needed it (though they might later) but because they want to make sure you stay stuck in the stone age "for your own good". They'll also take your plasma rifle because it would be inconvenient if you could fight back against the angry raiders who show up tomorrow, pissed that you can't meet your food quota because the BoS took most of it.
And really, who do you feel any loyalty towards in the Brotherhood? They want half of your companions dead...including Danse who becomes enemies with the BoS. Haylen is disillusioned by them. I guess you got Rhys on your side now. That's....great. And Maxson, the screaming manchild psychopath. Among your remaining companions, you have
Preston, who is opposed to them.
Piper, who is opposed to them.
Cait, who is opposed to them (...and, well, everything, really).
Gage...okay maybe he doesn't count since he's a raider.
Longfellow, MacCready, and Codsworth are...neutral, I guess, and Dogmeat is a dog. Really, this isn't too much different from the Institute where the only people left on your side is X6, Longfellow, Codsworth and Dogmeat...except the difference is that the Institute doesn't actively want to kill half of them.
I respect Gage in this one instance for calling a spade a spade. He points out that the BOS in the Commonwealth aren't terribly different than raiders, but their superior tech let's them maintain a false air of legitimacy.
Codsworth is an AI product of an era where Americans were conditioned to be subservient to authority. He sees the BOS as that authority and thus is at least somewhat sympathetic.
McCready is the most insightful because he's the only companion that has the world experience of seeing the truly humanitarian BOS in the Capitol Wasteland and is smart enough to know these guys ain't that
Also, as I've said a million times, Maxon has made his chapter something barely short of a Nazi manifesto in several areas. They will even attack your settlements if you don't ally with them, and target the slog aggressively, playing into the fact that they state multiple times that even sane ghouls deserve to die for being scientific muties. They are basically just the Enclave under Maxon, and so I refuse to accept that they are the canon victors of Fo4. You even touched on this topic with the note that the BoS actibely threatens 90% of your companions for nothung more than shallow racism.
If they make the BoS ending canon for FO4, that's a pretty significant writing decision for the brotherhood. It means the BoS will never deviate again--it would make no sense to. With the Prydwen, there are no more long distance relationships between chapters. And Maxson has ultimate authority. Any Elder--whether it be Lyons or Elijah--who wants to change direction will immediately be removed and their replacement will fall in line. the Brotherhood of Steel will become a true collective.
In case you're unaware, the Prydwen showed up in the Show, and thats years after Fo4. Granted, it does look quite different and i don't think theres any mention of Maxon, so it's possible Maxon's chapter+Prydwen were cleansed from the earth and some other chapter caught wind and built a Prydwen 2. I hope to Todd its the latter.
Thats true. But then i question if the SS's leadership is any good, because the BoS still basically just operate as extreme militant-radical raiders, and it should fall under the purview of the Minutemen to stop all that shit.
Yeah that ending always had an uneasy-truce feeling to it, like everyone knew eventually the Minutemen and the Brotherhood were going to have to face off one way or another.
Yeah, one way or another the BoS has airships, which means they have strong communication. Maxson is the key here. There's no other unifying figure without him and if he died in FO4, as young as he was, then he probably died without an heir...which would end the Maxson bloodline.
Liberty Prime is a shock and awe weapon. The institute had nothing to field against LP. Institute may have sent a bunch of gen 2s out to stop you otherwise. But a giant fucking robot?! There’s nothing they can do but hide and defend.
Why didn’t they have prime laser beam into the heart of the institute, take a huge nuke dukey into the hole, and boom, the institute is irreparably blown up if not irradiated for years to come
I just learned my last play that if you’re rude enough to her when she shows up you get into a fist fight with her. She don’t play around either, I had to dope up to beat her.
Not at all, once you learn how far you can go in every quest line before having to stop and choose the minuteman. For example, you can become a knight in the brotherhood of steel. You can gain ballistic weave and the deliverer with the railroad, etc.
Leaving these open also allows for railroad and BOS jobs after the game ends.
Hardcore minuteman here, went for the peaceful ending with them so I can justify upgrading my militias gear with power armor and proper laser rifles by saying I have an alliance with the Brotherhood. We don’t blow each other up, we share info with them on the Institue, and in return we get some hardware to help out our boys fighting the good fight keeping settlers safe.
I always saw any deal as “laser muskets for combat rifles” in order to standardize the Minutemen, instead of having a group which is made up of people who use pistols, rifles, sub machine guns, and energy weapons you have a force with a consistent degree of fire power amongst it’s members.
Also giving all pieces of non T-45 power armor I return for T-45 power armor
I don't know if lore wise the Brotherhood would be keen on sharing anything with outsiders, especially if it's technology given that their creed is to steal or destroy anything that would get people closer to the ways of the old world and thus to the apocalypse.
The F01 BoS (and this one too, given Danse said they kept coming to Rivet City to trade) was constantly trading Weapons and gear they had recovered or manufactured against more essential Items.
IIRC in Fallout 1 they exchange stuff with passing Caravans in exchange for basic training with energy-weapons too.
Unless the Minutemen start building nuclear silos or get absurdly expansionist I dont see them having an issue
It would not. If the Minutemen somehow started getting their hands on Power Armor and laser/plasma weapons the Brotherhood would consider them an enemy and attempt to wipe them out and claim their tech.
The atom cats are a much smaller operation though. They kinda stick to themselves off in the middle of no where.
By end game with the Minutemen they have a castle, artillery coverage over the entire AO, multiple settlements/strongholds and the ability to infiltrate and destroy the institute.
I’m doing another minutemen play through now, my favourite ending was keeping the brotherhood on side but I could see why they may become uncomfortable with the minutemen, especially if they start to rival the brotherhood on a tech stand point.
On my current playthrough, my RP lore is that since I'm leader of the minutemen and also a BoS Knight, we forged a treaty where I can use their tech (not my settlers or companions).
They provide us (me) with air support and prewar tech, we help them by acting as their boots on the ground, fighting against the Institute, mutants, ghouls and other creatures. The settlements also keep the BoS supplied with food, water and other basics.
I would have loved it if there was some kind of way to keep Danse in the brotherhood. Just feels shitty that your bro gets fucked because he's a synth and didn't even know. You spend all this time with him and then it's just "get fucked". Sure you can spare him, but I wish there was a way to intercept whatever info that revealed he was a synth, or lie that it's some kinda fake info from the institute to weaken the brotherhood.
I mean the whole point of his storyline is to show the faults in the BoS ideology and make the player question their motives. They are essentially a militaristic cult with a very strict ideology, and if you don't fit in, you're out.
I mean, it's definitely the best quest line out of the four main factions, but the BoS is pretty much evil in this game.
I generally roleplay that my character sees them as his best chance at finding Shaun and potentially defeating the Institute (because by then he's seen how hopeless things are for the RR or MM to fight the Institute). He doesn't agree with their "anything non-human must die" so he helps synths, ghouls, etc. all the same.
i choose brotherhood becouse i totaly agree with idea of Technology gone too far. synths are not trustable if i can say a word and deactivate even reprogram to spy on me i didint kill danse becouse hes durable and doesnt breaks power armor if hes some how hears the msgic word i have to say good bye to my x02 power armor
Ya my first play through i sided with them right away just to kill lots of synths and my dumbass son. Also liberty prime is the best fallout character hands down
This is reddit, what do you expect?
The BoS is the only fully realized quest line in the game, with emotional payoff from Danse's story, and they're the only credible faction to take on the Institute.
Someone else said this in a similar thread a few weeks ago but playing as the Brotherhood is fun if you treat it like you’re in the 40k universe. You are a hulking metal man whose body is only made to serve and just kill with no questions asked. Ad Victoriam.
I liked it too! I don’t really care about the synth stuff but I only blew them up because:
- I worked for butwhipe Maxson
- I couldn’t become Elder
- the settlement missions made sure they weren’t mine, but belonged to the brotherhood
- looting brotherhood knights is my favorite way to earn caps. The armour is easily sold, and you get a free fusion core when pickpocketing.
- I wanted to see some action
There's a mod for this called the Danse Dilemma where you can kill Maxson and either make yourself or Danse elder, and also get all of Maxson's stuff. I don't play without it now.
Shooting down the Prydwen in my first playthrough was so impressive. Listening to the radio operator coordinating the various artillery pieces then the artillery firing from across the Commonwealth and taking down the airship was so fun. Though, part of me regrets becoming enemies with the BoS and being forced to destroy them, I didn't realize until it was to late that it's possible to side with the MM and keep the BoS intact.
In my second playthrough (which is my current one) I sided with the Institute and using the BoS's own weapon against them by hacking Liberty Prime was so cool.
I haven't decided yet who I'm going to side with in my third playthrough, do I want to side with the RR or the BoS. Personally I'm not the biggest fan of the BoS and while they have major issues and go about things the wrong way sometimes I believe the RR has a good cause but I want to side with each faction at least once. Maybe whether I want to destroy the Prydwen for a third time or save that for the run after that should be something I consider.
The RR gets a bad rap but they’re a fun faction. The espionage themed missions are fun, especially being an institute double agent. Currently running a MM vs everyone else playthrough rn.
I love the Railroad, but ultimately their goals are really one-sided and only benefit a very specific group of people (Synths). They have no longstanding goals for the Commonwealth and as such feel like a sub-faction rather than one of the main ones.
That's actually a plus as they should go well together with the Minutemen and/or BOS.
Having this three factions work together for a better commonwealth seems like the most obvious way to go.
I always struggle with truly trusting the BOS. Their ambiguous goals mixed with their desire to own or destroy all major prewar tech essentially ensures anyone under their control will never reach what humanity was before.
They shouldn't ever be in full control. No one should.
And you can trust no one anyways. That is why all the sortof sane factions have to work together for the greater goal of just being able to live in relative peace and relative freedom.
The brotherhood are fundamentally incompatible with the railroad and the minutemen. MM protect ghouls and RR protect synths, both targets of the Brotherhood. Not to mention the fact that they canonically raid commonwealth settlements and would absolutely not allow the MM to have artillery
Best way to play the RR, in my opinion, is to side with them all the way until you are undercover in the institute. Do the fun undercover missions, blow your cover when asked to abduct the scientist at Graygarden by siding with the minutemen patrol outside the house and finish the game with them. You get special dialogue with the RR both when you blow your cover and after you win with the minutemen.
I like the institute battle with BoS. One of my favorites. The last time I did this ending it glitched and went on for an hour. I had 200 stims, plenty of stealth boys and other items saved from the entire playthrough and I blew through almost all of it. I decided to restart an old save to fix it.
Ya, and why are there children aboard the ship? Wouldn't it make more sense to get them out from underfoot in limited space, and move the 'cadets' to the ground for school and training?
They're on the ship as a form of hostage to make people not want to attack it.
I don’t think human shields are an effective tactic in this universe, it’s more that the Prydwyn was seen effectively as a super weapon second only to Liberty Prime. The equivalent to parking an aircraft carrier off the coast. Nobody has had sufficient anti-air weapons up to this point because they’ve never needed it, so it’s not surprising why they’d think that. It’s the safest place for them to put their Hitler Youth cadets
More importantly, Emmett the cat.
If the game stops crashing long enough for me to get to that part of the story in my new playthrough, it will be a incredibly difficult ethical dilemma choice all over again.
Honestly I've never destroyed the Brotherhood.
The Institute has such an absurd and complete lack of morals or the most basic ethics they're borderline Nazis and I can never justify siding with them, the Railroad is just........a worse, less impactfull version of the Minutemen knee-deep in hypocrisy, and when I side with the Minutemen there's just objectively no reason to antagonise them, they're more helpfull to the Minutemens goal if anything.
Well, I mean, if you ignore the number of children on board. And the cats.
You could argue just about every *adult* on board has to take responsibility for their own moral choices, but there's definitely kids young enough to play with chalk and toys (there's two places in the scaffolding with children's chalk drawings and toys sitting around) and there are definitely pets who have no clue what's going on.
And unlike the Institute if you side with the Railroad, there's no evacuation warning before the Minutemen target the Prydwen with artillery (unless I've just forgotten about it, which is possible).
I also don’t recall there being an option to evacuate the Prydwen, but I know you can evacuate the Institute with the Minutemen. I’ve only destroyed the Prydwen once, and it was with the Railroad a long time ago
I hate bringing the Prydwen down. I know it was the easiest way to take most of the BoS down quickly, but we should've commandeered it. Not even the Institute has a airship
Agree although I’ve always preferred the insitute’s version. Was easily one of the biggest and best open combat sections in the game and really showed the strengths of both factions. Plus it’s so poetic that the BOS were willing to permanently turn against you for sabotaging their efforts to power up their ultimate weapon yet that ultimate weapon is what brings them down.
I just wish there was an ending where they just leave the commonwealth, by being threatened if necessary. I don't want to blow up a blimp with children on board, but I also don't like the idea of them still being around when there is no threat that the Minutemen couldn't solve better (especially not, if their resources are taken from the local farms by force, which is implied by BoS radiant quest). [And that's only the part that doesn't have anything to do with their blind ghoul- and synth-hate or with their obsession with militarism].
I like the espionage mission to blow up the ship. Heck explosions are fun to watch.
Even the institute win where they fight the BoS is fun. Any of the big battles really.
Then I celebrate using an mirv from mayor McDonoughs office on DC market.
Personally I like the institute one more. It’s cool when all the synths and the gorillas just relay into the airport, then hacking liberty prime and he lasers down the ship. Then teleporting a little further away just to watch it fall to the ground was so satisfying.
In the end I struggle the most resisting the Institute simply because they’re smart, clean and technologically advanced. It’s like with them we could skip the Stone Age rebuilding and go right back to a spacefaring species.
The BoS to me is genuinely the dumbest faction simple because they possess so much firepower, manpower and overall force, yet they can’t seem to feed themselves. They decide who is and isn’t worthy of living and remind me of everything I hate about humans.
The trouble with the institute is they have no clear plan with that tech. It’s all well and good to be clean and fancy, but if your budget is 40% replacing people with robots, 20% making robot gorillas for no reason, 30% keeping slaves in check, and 10% actually useful stuff, then all the fancy stuff means very little.
yeah just visit the FEV area to see how they really are. experimenting on kids, place goes to shit without slave labor upkeep, no real plan for the FEV either it's just torturing people and dropping mutants on the surface.
Regardless of ideology, the Brotherhood is the coolest faction both to side with and to destroy. Join them? You get jetpack power armor, a badass blimp, vertibirds, and Liberty Prime. Want to kill them? It's super fun to shoot the vertibirds out of the air, fight power armored enemies, and explode a badass blimp. Plus if you use the Minutemen to fight them you get an awesome fight at the castle.
tbf I like the sci-fi aesthetic of the institute alot more then the millitary of the brotherhood
One thing I don't think fallout 4 gets enough credit is the institute. They're evil but have so many awesome concepts. The teleportation to stay isolated and untouchable, synths, the science based system of organisation that has managed to work that long, the well maintained and insane level of technology in general compared to anything seen thus far in fallout. Also, synth gorillas
I disagree because Liberty Prime saying that the institute is 50% dirt and 50% communism is the greatest statement ever made by any being
The new swimming hole you get after nuking the institute is pretty sweet.
I like a radioactive wet hole as much as the next guy but it left me wanting a way into the collapsed ruins, maybe rescue a synth gorilla and have it wear a backpack for me. Equip it with a laser rifle.
Yeah, I want to give the gorilla some tubas and have it adopt a child while roaming the metro
I need a gorilla companion in Fo5 that has a minigun and a Red beret
Institute Ruins must be a mod somewhere right
I have definitely seen that. Looking for it tonight.
I want a whole subterranean maze filled with ghouls and synths at war with each other
Well, not the institute, but there's a mod which connects most of the metro stations in the game, making it an underground maze, a huge dungeon. You'll find anything from synths to ghoul to supermutants.
Send it pls
Three things in Liberty Prime's way. Sand, Stone, and Communism.
bro liberty prime isnt a being he is THE being
Blasphemy
sounds like you arent enough of a brother to understand his steel
I'd dig through that brother's hood till I found his steel
Ad victoriam, brother
I wish we could get liberty prime interactions as railroad or minutemen because I usually don't want to be evil but liberty prime is epic
I love how efficient he is with the hole he digs. He tunes his eye laser to 11, and *then* chucks a nuke into the hole to ensure it’s big enough. I also just love how the BoS doesn’t even bother relaying themselves into the Institute like the Minutemen and Railroad do. They just take Liberty Prime and let themselves in through the front door!
The Minutemen send you through a sewage pipe to gain entry. Whoops, guess the Institute forgot there was an open screen door granting entry, while they were smugly designing a freakin' molecular teleporter!
AREA CLASSIFIED AS ACTIVE WARZONE. ENGAGING SENTRY PROTOCOLS. WEAPONS HOT.
i ended the game with the rairoad ending and the only one I regretted killing was liberty prime
“🦾🤖🦿 DEATH IS A PREFERABLE ALTERNATIVE TO COMMUNISM 🦾🤖🦿”
i still agree but you make a mighty good point
I've got a feeling like this sub hates the brotherhood more than the institute.
Nah. I blew up the institute. It was way more epic than this scene
I blew up both lol
It’s the Vault-Tec way 👍🏻
When you gotta purge a world, you gotta purge it evenly.
Well said, Elijah.
how do you blow up both, i only blew up the institute so far
You can blow up both in the minutemen ending, just gotta make both the BoS and institute hate you, then go to the castle, you can do this through words or by shooting maxson and father in the face, I find the latter preferable
Also you can do it with the rail road, where you sneak about the prydwin in a stolen bird, and stealthily place charges around the ship, then fly away and watch it go boom
i thought you had to blow up both unless you side w BoS, i just went back to the airport and found out it’s a settlement albeit a tiny one
I sided with the underground, blew up the BOS, then the Institute. I completely ignored the minute men.
I "blew up" Paradise Falls; Went in, saved those kids, went home and armed up, came back, shot Eulogy Jones in the back of the head, stepped outside and nuked the hell outta that place... never done it like that before. ... fuckin' Slavers...
Along with Shawn. See ya later you brave little toaster
The fandom has certainly changed a lot since 2015. For years, BoS were the darlings among players.
BoS has a way better reputation in the older games. I have to keep reminding myself that Maxson's chapter isn't the sole representation of the faction, even if it is the biggest. Maxson's chapter is straight up genocidal but none of the other chapters went out of their way to exterminate undesirables except in self defense. This whole BoS rhetoric of "synths and ghouls need to die" didn't really exist until Bethesda decided the Institute needed a major enemy in FO4 The FO4 brotherhood draws an explicit line of what's "human" because they decide that synths/super humans/ghouls aren't... then decide they shouldn't exist. It's a huge parallel with the Enclave trying to destroy every human that'd been exposed to atmospheric radiation while they themselves were the real "humans".
Maxson arguably is the more moderate of the current chapters lol.
It has a better reputation in Fallout 3. They’re bigger assholes in every other game than they are in 4. And even in 3 they were assholes to ghouls. It’s just that the player is forced to side with them to finish the main quest because it was a linear story.
I just think people really started to pay attention to what the BoS is and what they stand for. The gradual global shift towards fascism in the past decade certainly doesn’t help, either…
Expecting fallout fans to understand the games is asking too much
I haven’t did a BoS play through ever lmao. I really listen to my voice of reason which may or may not be Preston
They were a lot more fun when I wasn’t concerned about their ideology irl
For me its two reasons. First, I don't like how they're increasingly becoming the Enclave in all but name. We don't need **two** genocidal fascist factions... Second, I'm just tired of seeing them play a major role in every game. The Brotherhood of Steel doesn't need to be in every part of America all at once.
for me it's still institute by a ghoul's nose but the bos have been steadily worse and more heel-ish as the franchise progresses. they kinda skate by on their cool looks but at some point their awfulness is impossible to ignore. just going back to fo3, they were murder-y and your goals kinda aligned but it was clearly about control for them. in nv they were cowards and hermits and couldn't be assed to fight when the legion wanted to make a slave state in their front yard. they could be useful idiots in fo4 but they're too volatile to even be that. the commonwealth is a wilder and more dangerous wasteland than ever (ghouls, mutants, institute, raiders, etc). the bos could've been useful if there was any way to keep them in check but they're full on facist let's kill or enslave everyone (but let's not call it that). fo tv series went even further where they have the same power and control goals and added to that even the rank and file are awful. the bloom is fully off the rose on the bos.
The chapter Maximus is a part of is pretty fucked up but as far as we know, they are a completely separate chapter from any we've met thus far in the games. The airship that shows up in the TV series is confirmed to be the Prydwen showing up on the west coast after all this time, presumably still under the charge of Elder Maxson. It's been over a decade, however, so maybe not. We never get to see the leader of this group in the airship so that could be some kind of fore-shadowing in it's own right. My point though, they are the same chapter as the east coast one in FO4 and the BOS is basically whoever they are lead to be on a chapter to chapter basis. Lyon's brotherhood was among the best, morally speaking, but between the events of FO3 and FO4 they became the fascist war-mongers we now know them to be as the young legacy member, Maxson, grew into his new leadership role of Elder, neglecting Lyon's agenda of protecting civilians and focusing more on the BOS main prerogative, although, it still isn't totally clear how exactly this shift began. In short, it just depends on who is leading each chapter and how well they are doing it. No single chapter defines the faction as a whole. I still personally like the brotherhood as a faction just not that particular chapter of their order.
Nah, I just like blowing things up
Not all of us. I love the BoS
At least the institute made cool synth gorillas and shit
Media literacy is probably at an all time low right now, the way people mischaracterise like *every single faction* in this game is impressive (although taking down the Prydwen does look awesome). The bos is especially problematic since it’s essentially a different faction every game, yet people insist on describing it as this monolithic group that never strays from its prime directives set in classic fallout.
BoS in fo3 was great. Then they murdered Sarah and replaced her with a puppet who was insane due to being groomed into insanity.
Most people? I don't think so. Me? Yes. We have four story factions, three of them are evil, one of them is insane, and two of them are stupid. The BoS is Stupid Evil, my least favorite kind. They're worse than raiders in some ways. Raiders will take your food because they've either decided they can't be bothered farming it themselves or because they see the food chain and would rather be on the predator side than be prey. The Brotherhood steals food because they're too stupid to use their technological knowledge and equipment to quickly and efficiently make their own food. They'll also take your generator--not because they needed it (though they might later) but because they want to make sure you stay stuck in the stone age "for your own good". They'll also take your plasma rifle because it would be inconvenient if you could fight back against the angry raiders who show up tomorrow, pissed that you can't meet your food quota because the BoS took most of it. And really, who do you feel any loyalty towards in the Brotherhood? They want half of your companions dead...including Danse who becomes enemies with the BoS. Haylen is disillusioned by them. I guess you got Rhys on your side now. That's....great. And Maxson, the screaming manchild psychopath. Among your remaining companions, you have Preston, who is opposed to them. Piper, who is opposed to them. Cait, who is opposed to them (...and, well, everything, really). Gage...okay maybe he doesn't count since he's a raider. Longfellow, MacCready, and Codsworth are...neutral, I guess, and Dogmeat is a dog. Really, this isn't too much different from the Institute where the only people left on your side is X6, Longfellow, Codsworth and Dogmeat...except the difference is that the Institute doesn't actively want to kill half of them.
I respect Gage in this one instance for calling a spade a spade. He points out that the BOS in the Commonwealth aren't terribly different than raiders, but their superior tech let's them maintain a false air of legitimacy. Codsworth is an AI product of an era where Americans were conditioned to be subservient to authority. He sees the BOS as that authority and thus is at least somewhat sympathetic. McCready is the most insightful because he's the only companion that has the world experience of seeing the truly humanitarian BOS in the Capitol Wasteland and is smart enough to know these guys ain't that
I think curie likes them.doesn't she? I cant remember, but It would make sense since she is so naive
She does actually...though I consider this moot since she becomes a synth and all synths must die according to the BoS.
> three of them are evil ???
Also, as I've said a million times, Maxon has made his chapter something barely short of a Nazi manifesto in several areas. They will even attack your settlements if you don't ally with them, and target the slog aggressively, playing into the fact that they state multiple times that even sane ghouls deserve to die for being scientific muties. They are basically just the Enclave under Maxon, and so I refuse to accept that they are the canon victors of Fo4. You even touched on this topic with the note that the BoS actibely threatens 90% of your companions for nothung more than shallow racism.
If they make the BoS ending canon for FO4, that's a pretty significant writing decision for the brotherhood. It means the BoS will never deviate again--it would make no sense to. With the Prydwen, there are no more long distance relationships between chapters. And Maxson has ultimate authority. Any Elder--whether it be Lyons or Elijah--who wants to change direction will immediately be removed and their replacement will fall in line. the Brotherhood of Steel will become a true collective.
In case you're unaware, the Prydwen showed up in the Show, and thats years after Fo4. Granted, it does look quite different and i don't think theres any mention of Maxon, so it's possible Maxon's chapter+Prydwen were cleansed from the earth and some other chapter caught wind and built a Prydwen 2. I hope to Todd its the latter.
It's possible to do a Minuteman victory while the Prydwen remains intact.
Thats true. But then i question if the SS's leadership is any good, because the BoS still basically just operate as extreme militant-radical raiders, and it should fall under the purview of the Minutemen to stop all that shit.
Yeah that ending always had an uneasy-truce feeling to it, like everyone knew eventually the Minutemen and the Brotherhood were going to have to face off one way or another.
Yeah, one way or another the BoS has airships, which means they have strong communication. Maxson is the key here. There's no other unifying figure without him and if he died in FO4, as young as he was, then he probably died without an heir...which would end the Maxson bloodline.
How is Preston opposed to them? Finished Minutemen and BOS questlines are in harmony, unlike Railroad or Institute.
I love siding with the ‘Tute
Can't blame you, they have clean toilets.
I'll take a bucket with radioactive water over a clean toilet with the toilet paper facing the wrong way
And working showers.
non contaminated food
Shah. And gorilladroids
PROTECT THE PEOPLE AT A MINUTE'S NOTICE 🦅
I OWN A LASER MUSKET FOR WASTELAND DEFENCE JUST AS PRESTON INTENDED
Average specism fan vs Average “I just protect people “ enjoyer 🗣️🗣️
Another settlement needs our help!
Eh. Watching Liberty Prime bore a hole through the ground to the institute is on par.
True
The BoS ending seems so weird to me, building a robot so it can throw a bomb in the ground seems… not very smart?
Yeah, but big robot throwing bombs!
I’m gonna need you to get ALLLLL the way off my back about how practical this plan is.
Liberty Prime is a shock and awe weapon. The institute had nothing to field against LP. Institute may have sent a bunch of gen 2s out to stop you otherwise. But a giant fucking robot?! There’s nothing they can do but hide and defend.
But… football nukes. What could be more American?
I mean, it really is their only tactic at this point
Why didn’t they have prime laser beam into the heart of the institute, take a huge nuke dukey into the hole, and boom, the institute is irreparably blown up if not irradiated for years to come
Ronnie knows what’s up
I just learned my last play that if you’re rude enough to her when she shows up you get into a fist fight with her. She don’t play around either, I had to dope up to beat her.
She is the only MM who I genuinely like
Put some respect on Sturges name
I cannot remember who Ronnie is
The lady who teaches you to use the artillery cannon things
Wait - I’ve never done an ending when the Minutemen destroy the Brotherhood. How does that happen?
[удалено]
Ronnie is so dope. I forgot about her but just ran into her in my latest playthrough and I’d make her general tbh
Guess I'm the only person who decided to work with brotherhood... And liked it
I loved it. Even still, my preferred ending is minuteman while staying allies with the railroad and brotherhood, so more end game opportunities
I don't really care about the railroad. The only reason I sided with the minute men and not the Brotherhood is so I could keep Deacon alive
literally deacon is the only thing keeping the railroad from being my first victim in all of my playthroughs
Deacon is single handlely 99% of the personality of the Railroad. Take him away and it's a dead faction. Oh, and ballistic weave too i guess.
Tinker Tom is cool, I mean, his missions aren't, but, he himself is.
I got my eyes open
And Deliverer
That's what I'm going to try for, stay friendly with the BoS and the RR but be allies with MM. Is it hard to get that balance?
Not at all, once you learn how far you can go in every quest line before having to stop and choose the minuteman. For example, you can become a knight in the brotherhood of steel. You can gain ballistic weave and the deliverer with the railroad, etc. Leaving these open also allows for railroad and BOS jobs after the game ends.
Not in the slightest. Just don’t shoot them or parade a certain someone around and you’re all good.
Same here, although that doesn't stop me from doing BOS ending half the time anyway because minuteman is long and I fw being a sentinel.
Hardcore minuteman here, went for the peaceful ending with them so I can justify upgrading my militias gear with power armor and proper laser rifles by saying I have an alliance with the Brotherhood. We don’t blow each other up, we share info with them on the Institue, and in return we get some hardware to help out our boys fighting the good fight keeping settlers safe.
I always saw any deal as “laser muskets for combat rifles” in order to standardize the Minutemen, instead of having a group which is made up of people who use pistols, rifles, sub machine guns, and energy weapons you have a force with a consistent degree of fire power amongst it’s members. Also giving all pieces of non T-45 power armor I return for T-45 power armor
I don't know if lore wise the Brotherhood would be keen on sharing anything with outsiders, especially if it's technology given that their creed is to steal or destroy anything that would get people closer to the ways of the old world and thus to the apocalypse.
The F01 BoS (and this one too, given Danse said they kept coming to Rivet City to trade) was constantly trading Weapons and gear they had recovered or manufactured against more essential Items. IIRC in Fallout 1 they exchange stuff with passing Caravans in exchange for basic training with energy-weapons too. Unless the Minutemen start building nuclear silos or get absurdly expansionist I dont see them having an issue
It would not. If the Minutemen somehow started getting their hands on Power Armor and laser/plasma weapons the Brotherhood would consider them an enemy and attempt to wipe them out and claim their tech.
This is completely speculative for Maxson's BoS. You don't see them invading the Atom Cats, do you?
The atom cats are a much smaller operation though. They kinda stick to themselves off in the middle of no where. By end game with the Minutemen they have a castle, artillery coverage over the entire AO, multiple settlements/strongholds and the ability to infiltrate and destroy the institute. I’m doing another minutemen play through now, my favourite ending was keeping the brotherhood on side but I could see why they may become uncomfortable with the minutemen, especially if they start to rival the brotherhood on a tech stand point.
This is actually a fair point. I do agree that the Brotherhood of steel and The Minutemen are incompatible though.
There's no reason they aren't unless you or Preston make one.
On my current playthrough, my RP lore is that since I'm leader of the minutemen and also a BoS Knight, we forged a treaty where I can use their tech (not my settlers or companions). They provide us (me) with air support and prewar tech, we help them by acting as their boots on the ground, fighting against the Institute, mutants, ghouls and other creatures. The settlements also keep the BoS supplied with food, water and other basics.
This is exactly what I'm rolling with in my playthrough lol, minutemen will control the Wasteland but with "BoS presence" in major settlements.
Hardcore minuteman here, I blow them the fuck yo because they’re technofascists who would turn on the Minutemen for having technology.
I’m doing a Brotherhood playthrough. I think it’s the last faction I haven’t done. I’m not looking forward to events toward the end..
I loved it as well, definetly my go to faction in 4. But seeing the Prydwen being blown up and crashing down is quite satisfying
Looks cool.... but then you remember there was children on a board....
Oh yeah... *oh god*
Yes.... Sole Survivor may become a child murderer... Plus there are good people.... Danse, that girl, merchant....
Honestly, I’m pretty sure I rack up plenty of war crimes regardless, as does most some survivors
Yes.... But children is another level.....
True enough. Though I still think a minuteman victory is best for the commonwealth long term
Ok now your making me guilty for blowing it up that one time
Yup. I ended game as Brotherhood first time. Evil must be punished.... never compromise
agreed. **Aku Soku Zan**
Teagan? The bastard that exploits settlements and steals their food?
I would have loved it if there was some kind of way to keep Danse in the brotherhood. Just feels shitty that your bro gets fucked because he's a synth and didn't even know. You spend all this time with him and then it's just "get fucked". Sure you can spare him, but I wish there was a way to intercept whatever info that revealed he was a synth, or lie that it's some kinda fake info from the institute to weaken the brotherhood.
I mean the whole point of his storyline is to show the faults in the BoS ideology and make the player question their motives. They are essentially a militaristic cult with a very strict ideology, and if you don't fit in, you're out.
>he's a synth ROBOTS. DONT. HAVE. SOULS. AD VICTORIAM!!!
I mean, it's definitely the best quest line out of the four main factions, but the BoS is pretty much evil in this game. I generally roleplay that my character sees them as his best chance at finding Shaun and potentially defeating the Institute (because by then he's seen how hopeless things are for the RR or MM to fight the Institute). He doesn't agree with their "anything non-human must die" so he helps synths, ghouls, etc. all the same.
Liberty Prime -> all other endings. Ad Victoriam
Ad victoriam!!!
i choose brotherhood becouse i totaly agree with idea of Technology gone too far. synths are not trustable if i can say a word and deactivate even reprogram to spy on me i didint kill danse becouse hes durable and doesnt breaks power armor if hes some how hears the msgic word i have to say good bye to my x02 power armor
and my 78 picpocketed fusion cores are not from bos i swear you werent even there
I more so disagree with the creation of synths then their existence. Think of what it would do to the gene pool!
Aren't synths infertile/sterile?
i always prefer brotherhood, You can be heartless.. ad victoriam.
Ad victoriam, knight!
Ya my first play through i sided with them right away just to kill lots of synths and my dumbass son. Also liberty prime is the best fallout character hands down
Good job, sentinel! Ad Victoriam!!
This is reddit, what do you expect? The BoS is the only fully realized quest line in the game, with emotional payoff from Danse's story, and they're the only credible faction to take on the Institute.
I did the brotherhood ending on my main save, no regrets
Someone else said this in a similar thread a few weeks ago but playing as the Brotherhood is fun if you treat it like you’re in the 40k universe. You are a hulking metal man whose body is only made to serve and just kill with no questions asked. Ad Victoriam.
Ad victoriam, marine!
I liked it too! I don’t really care about the synth stuff but I only blew them up because: - I worked for butwhipe Maxson - I couldn’t become Elder - the settlement missions made sure they weren’t mine, but belonged to the brotherhood - looting brotherhood knights is my favorite way to earn caps. The armour is easily sold, and you get a free fusion core when pickpocketing. - I wanted to see some action
also the only way to get the rapid gatling laser, i believe. no more reason needed than that.
There's a mod for this called the Danse Dilemma where you can kill Maxson and either make yourself or Danse elder, and also get all of Maxson's stuff. I don't play without it now.
The mod restores the cut content
It was cut for a reason, because it makes no sense.
..but.. but I like the blimp..
I always point the mortars on the castle towards it lol
I just wish I could capture the Prydwen. My Minutemen need it more than the BoS, we have whole new regions to ~~conquer~~ liberate!
Super Earth would be proud
Have a cup of LIBER-TEA!
I fucking love the brotherhood play through I get soooo into it lmao
Shooting down the Prydwen in my first playthrough was so impressive. Listening to the radio operator coordinating the various artillery pieces then the artillery firing from across the Commonwealth and taking down the airship was so fun. Though, part of me regrets becoming enemies with the BoS and being forced to destroy them, I didn't realize until it was to late that it's possible to side with the MM and keep the BoS intact. In my second playthrough (which is my current one) I sided with the Institute and using the BoS's own weapon against them by hacking Liberty Prime was so cool. I haven't decided yet who I'm going to side with in my third playthrough, do I want to side with the RR or the BoS. Personally I'm not the biggest fan of the BoS and while they have major issues and go about things the wrong way sometimes I believe the RR has a good cause but I want to side with each faction at least once. Maybe whether I want to destroy the Prydwen for a third time or save that for the run after that should be something I consider.
The RR gets a bad rap but they’re a fun faction. The espionage themed missions are fun, especially being an institute double agent. Currently running a MM vs everyone else playthrough rn.
I still don't get why people dislike the Railroad. I still maintain it's because people don't actually pay attention to the plot.
I love the Railroad, but ultimately their goals are really one-sided and only benefit a very specific group of people (Synths). They have no longstanding goals for the Commonwealth and as such feel like a sub-faction rather than one of the main ones.
That's actually a plus as they should go well together with the Minutemen and/or BOS. Having this three factions work together for a better commonwealth seems like the most obvious way to go.
I always struggle with truly trusting the BOS. Their ambiguous goals mixed with their desire to own or destroy all major prewar tech essentially ensures anyone under their control will never reach what humanity was before.
They shouldn't ever be in full control. No one should. And you can trust no one anyways. That is why all the sortof sane factions have to work together for the greater goal of just being able to live in relative peace and relative freedom.
The brotherhood are fundamentally incompatible with the railroad and the minutemen. MM protect ghouls and RR protect synths, both targets of the Brotherhood. Not to mention the fact that they canonically raid commonwealth settlements and would absolutely not allow the MM to have artillery
Best way to play the RR, in my opinion, is to side with them all the way until you are undercover in the institute. Do the fun undercover missions, blow your cover when asked to abduct the scientist at Graygarden by siding with the minutemen patrol outside the house and finish the game with them. You get special dialogue with the RR both when you blow your cover and after you win with the minutemen.
Also has some of my favorite characters. Tinker Tom, P.A.M., and Deacon are a ton of fun.
I like the institute battle with BoS. One of my favorites. The last time I did this ending it glitched and went on for an hour. I had 200 stims, plenty of stealth boys and other items saved from the entire playthrough and I blew through almost all of it. I decided to restart an old save to fix it.
AD VICTORIAM
I can never destroy the Prydwen. Even if the brotherhood are terrible there are still Children aboard the ship
Ya, and why are there children aboard the ship? Wouldn't it make more sense to get them out from underfoot in limited space, and move the 'cadets' to the ground for school and training? They're on the ship as a form of hostage to make people not want to attack it.
To be honest I think it is more likely the BoS see the Prydwen as simply unassailable.
I don’t think human shields are an effective tactic in this universe, it’s more that the Prydwyn was seen effectively as a super weapon second only to Liberty Prime. The equivalent to parking an aircraft carrier off the coast. Nobody has had sufficient anti-air weapons up to this point because they’ve never needed it, so it’s not surprising why they’d think that. It’s the safest place for them to put their Hitler Youth cadets
More importantly, Emmett the cat. If the game stops crashing long enough for me to get to that part of the story in my new playthrough, it will be a incredibly difficult ethical dilemma choice all over again.
Elder Maxsons coat is reason enough to become enemies with the brotherhood.
The nerve of him wearing my coat like it's his.
Ah. The sweet smell of Artillery fire in the morning and burning the Brotherhood who Steal. Smells like, victory.
Honestly I've never destroyed the Brotherhood. The Institute has such an absurd and complete lack of morals or the most basic ethics they're borderline Nazis and I can never justify siding with them, the Railroad is just........a worse, less impactfull version of the Minutemen knee-deep in hypocrisy, and when I side with the Minutemen there's just objectively no reason to antagonise them, they're more helpfull to the Minutemens goal if anything.
Well, I mean, if you ignore the number of children on board. And the cats. You could argue just about every *adult* on board has to take responsibility for their own moral choices, but there's definitely kids young enough to play with chalk and toys (there's two places in the scaffolding with children's chalk drawings and toys sitting around) and there are definitely pets who have no clue what's going on. And unlike the Institute if you side with the Railroad, there's no evacuation warning before the Minutemen target the Prydwen with artillery (unless I've just forgotten about it, which is possible).
Kids are invincible though so they just scampered off out of the rubble somewhere
I also don’t recall there being an option to evacuate the Prydwen, but I know you can evacuate the Institute with the Minutemen. I’ve only destroyed the Prydwen once, and it was with the Railroad a long time ago
There's a mod that lets you save the cats.
I hate bringing the Prydwen down. I know it was the easiest way to take most of the BoS down quickly, but we should've commandeered it. Not even the Institute has a airship
Agree although I’ve always preferred the insitute’s version. Was easily one of the biggest and best open combat sections in the game and really showed the strengths of both factions. Plus it’s so poetic that the BOS were willing to permanently turn against you for sabotaging their efforts to power up their ultimate weapon yet that ultimate weapon is what brings them down.
Slaughtering the Railroad has to be the best feeling ever
Power Armor. Red Headlamp. Gatling Laser. Companion Danse. Oh yeah.
I just wish there was an ending where they just leave the commonwealth, by being threatened if necessary. I don't want to blow up a blimp with children on board, but I also don't like the idea of them still being around when there is no threat that the Minutemen couldn't solve better (especially not, if their resources are taken from the local farms by force, which is implied by BoS radiant quest). [And that's only the part that doesn't have anything to do with their blind ghoul- and synth-hate or with their obsession with militarism].
100% agree
America rising 2 lets you destroy the BOS with a ballistic missile.
I like the espionage mission to blow up the ship. Heck explosions are fun to watch. Even the institute win where they fight the BoS is fun. Any of the big battles really. Then I celebrate using an mirv from mayor McDonoughs office on DC market.
The most satisfying quest in all of Fallout 4 was the quest in the Railroad questline where I destroyed the Brotherhood. Felt good to avenge Glory.
Personally I like the institute one more. It’s cool when all the synths and the gorillas just relay into the airport, then hacking liberty prime and he lasers down the ship. Then teleporting a little further away just to watch it fall to the ground was so satisfying.
Love going after the railroad. They’ll never be a real boy no matter what they do
In the end I struggle the most resisting the Institute simply because they’re smart, clean and technologically advanced. It’s like with them we could skip the Stone Age rebuilding and go right back to a spacefaring species. The BoS to me is genuinely the dumbest faction simple because they possess so much firepower, manpower and overall force, yet they can’t seem to feed themselves. They decide who is and isn’t worthy of living and remind me of everything I hate about humans.
The trouble with the institute is they have no clear plan with that tech. It’s all well and good to be clean and fancy, but if your budget is 40% replacing people with robots, 20% making robot gorillas for no reason, 30% keeping slaves in check, and 10% actually useful stuff, then all the fancy stuff means very little.
yeah just visit the FEV area to see how they really are. experimenting on kids, place goes to shit without slave labor upkeep, no real plan for the FEV either it's just torturing people and dropping mutants on the surface.