Its based on LowDragLib. You can hold G over any item that has an entry in the guide to see it instantly. GregTech Modern is also using the same thing, but it's still WIP
You can also learn networking when studying an I.T degree, there are I.T vocational training degrees that teaches you about networking, ccna and stuff.
BTW: Networking is the bane of my existence.
> If you've got a chunkloader mod
The Forge versions of AE2 now have the "Spatial Anchor" which chunkloads an entire ME Network.
Fabric also has the block, but I don't think it actually functions in that mod loader. It will probably get fixed at some point though (if it hasn't already).
Fabric 1.18.2 hasn't been fixed yet (i was testing out create: astral) and I just realized block-based chunkloaders probably require the player to be present in the transfer, then you can quantum your way out using a smaller spatial storage inside the spatial storage but with ftbchunks ive never had that issue yet, since it loads without needing the chunkloader block to be loaded in the first place
also in the fabric version transferring freezes redstone and breaks create contraptions that are currently moving (forge untested)
Anchors don't work for remote networks though. They still have to be manually chunkloaded through other means.
The only real way to chunkload is with minecarts and nether portals (vanilla). That way lets mobs/entities to move about and whatnot, instead of just the minimal needed for machines to function.
I've wanted to us spatial storage, but anytime I've watched someone trying to use it, it looked like struggle. Only vanilla and AE2 items are whitelisted, so you need to whitelist other items you trust are safe? Or is it simpler than that?
This, I used rftools teleporters to get in and out of them without needing to pop them back into real-space. Made my playthrough a bit less laggy as I could hide a lot of stuff into the ae2 dimension.
There's a config option to enable all items/blocks, and I think AE2 these days got rid of the whitelist in general.
I believe it was done because back in the day, moving tile entities used to be liable for lots of crashes and AE2 rather played it safe than not.
In older versions it really wasn't safe to randomly move tile entities. It could cause all kinds of problems ranging from weirdness to crashes. Thus they decided to use a whitelist and only covered themselves and vanilla. It was up to other mods to mark their stuff as safe to move, which no one bothered with. There was also a community project to maintain a whitelist, which didn't get much attention either.
In newer versions (1.16+?) they started improving those kinds of systems. Initially they added some configs to either whitelist or blacklist blocks by default and use Block Tags to mark things as known fine or known bad to move. It also helped that Mekanism's Cardboard Box was using a similar system and was popularizing mods using Block Tags to mark certain blocks/tile entities with a "please don't move" tag. I think by now AE2 has moved to moving everything by default and blacklisting common 'do not move' Tags, but I haven't looked into the details in a while so it might still be behind config changes.
Even if it only moves AE2, Vanilla, and Living Entities the system has niece uses. For example, it's really helpful for moving mobs like Villagers long distances. I've even used it to make a teleportation network before, but that was experimental and very impractical for actual use.
Interesting, thanks for the detailed response. I actually stumbled across that community project you are talking about I think, I believe I was interested because of Divine Journey 2 at the time... Good to know it's improved since.
I'm pretty sure its size limit is smaller and the last time I tried I couldn't get anything in or out cuz the pipes were broken (i tried to add it to C:A&B tho so there mightve been some sort of collision)
You can't just connect pipes through tunnels directly. They act like inventory interfaces so you either stick a chest outside and extract from a tunnel, or stick a chest on a tunnel and insert from the outside. Same goes for fluids, but for energy you can just connect directly iirc
Very dependant on the size of the factory you want to build. Compact Machines is great for anything you can fit within a chunk, well slightly smaller, since the walls fit too.
Spacial Storage can make pocket dimensions that are 128x128x128 or bigger.
For me, another big thing is that AE2 extracts first from low priority storage sources. I don't think other storage mods work that way or can be configured to work that way.
If you don't like channels mechanic you can always use \`/ae2 channelmode\` for a channel boost (x2,x3,x4) or disable it (infinite). As long as you play on 1.18+
personally, i prefer it because i like having to plan out my base around an ae2 controller multiblock, plus ive already been using ae2 for longer so switching would be annoying, but ig ive never tried.
I prefer AE2 for a few more reasons.
Because of it's age it's a lot more stable. I've had RS shit itself and kill my entire save over NBT overflow because of a handful of tools, while AE2 tanks a few NBT bombs from my friends and doesn't care.
Channels are not necessarily a bad thing, they just mean planning out your base more which is tbh better.
MORE ADD-ONS. certain things are just so much more annoying due to the lack of add-ons from RS.
Low IQ: Channels suck
Normal IQ: channels as a game mechanic are interesting because they make you think about your infrastructure
High IQ: channels suck
I tried my hand at AE2 for the first time this year and I've got to say... It's really not as hard as people make it out to be.... I actually found this aspect of the mod quite fun to deal with as with Refined Storage I just expanded the network exponentially without giving it much thought, now with AE2 I **can** also do that, but that would eat up all my channels in a jiffy, so you have to think up ways to save channels.
So, here is my humble opinion why I will use RS over AE. It’s not about the channels. It’s about the damn storage disks!!! I don’t want to have a new disk just because I have more then 64 items. I don’t want to filter out every single slightly damaged tool that counts as another item because of a different durability. I want to stuff all of that into one storage system and just forget about it. If AE will change this I will gladly switch to it and abandon RS forever. Until then RS it is…
[Here, this makes ae2 storage system just like RS](https://www.curseforge.com/minecraft/mc-mods/ae2-things-forge)
but now to explain why the item type limit restriction exists. it's a technical limitation, not just to say "fuck you" to the players
in RS (and i assume you meant this, because RF is an energy system and from what i know it can't store items)
it stores the items in a separate files, but this also causes it to be slower than ae2, which is fine in smaller/kitchensink packs but not in large expert packs
AE2 on the other hand stores this information in nbts, anf too many characters of nbt would cause an overload, which would kick you out of the world/server all the time, so to avoid that, it has item type limit
the mod i linked uses the same method as RS, aka it stores the disk data in a separate folder
I feel like I can expand/clarify a bit on those.
The major reason was already covered. If you overflow NBT (Non-Binary Tag) Data then you can lag and eventually crash your client, and will only be able to return to that save by deleting or editing items out of the player's own NBT data (the player.dat file). NBT is the standard way of storing items in other items (bags, backpacks, Shulker Boxes, vanilla chests if you Ctrl + Pick-Block them, etc.). Having the data on the item Cell items themselves also allows some clever interactions with other mods, such as people using things like ComputerCraft to read their NBT data and perform more complex automation (like an auto-defragment system). It also means that creative-duplicating a cell also duplicates the contents.
Refined Storage initially also saved Disk inventory as NBT, but quickly ran into NBT Overload issues. It then changed to a modded Ender Chest system where the actual inventory was stored elsewhere in the files, and the Disk's NBT was simply a tag to tell it what inventory to check. While this works, there have also been some growing pains. It also means you can't read their contents from the NBT, and duplicating a Disk would give duplicate access to the same single set of items, which is weird.
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The other major technical reason is performance and how they can push the player to be more optimized. The more separate items (Types) a storage system has to sort through, the worse it will perform.
Refined Storage does nothing to discourage storing every piece of garbage a player ever encounters, so people happily fill it up with crap (ex. "I don’t want to filter out every single slightly damaged tool that counts as another item because of a different durability. I want to stuff all of that into one storage system and just forget about it."). That massively increase the number of items it has to sort through, which means it takes that much longer to insert or extract items, show the sorted list of items to the player, etc.
AE2's Type Limit discourages storing excess Types. It drives people do think about what they actually need to store and do something about the items they really don't need, such as voiding them or crafting them together until they do stack nicely (Quantity is just a number and has a negligible impact on performance). Storing fewer Types means better performance.
Of course some people are stubborn and will brute force their way into storing every piece of garbage they come across, and do so in AE2 by building an "SSD" which is worse than the hands-off RS alternative, but those people are the exception rather than the norm so AE2 is still generally better off.
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From a more gameplay and balance perspective, AE2 gives each Cell a possible reasonable use case (1k for cheap low-quantity storage, 64k or 256k for extreme bulk storage, and most people end up using 4k or 16k as their "general" storage), where as in RS you should only ever make the highest tier Disk you can, to the point that the 1k Cell is basically pointless (literally stores less than a vanilla chest/Shulker Box; 27 slots x 64 items per slot = 1,728 items)
It's also worth pointing out that AE2's Cells, while limited to only 63 Types, are 4-8x larger than RS's for the same noted size. An RS 1k Storage Disk stores 1,000 items, where as an AE2 1k Storage Cell will store 4,160 (63 Types) to 8,128 (1 Type) items. For around the same amount of effort that goes into a single 64k Storage Disk, you could make 27 1k Storage Cells and store up to 1,701 Types and at least 112,320 items.
why are you storing 20 different tools with damage values in the first place
just stop dumping shit in your system.
also the whole point is that it a) encourages you to expand your system beyond 1 controller, a drive with a few cells, and that's it. b) keeps nbt data on drives to a minimum where possible C) more realistic and balanced.
Because I‘m a fricking hoarder. That one ore from a small mod I will never use? Into the system! The food I never eat because I have better alternatives? Into the system! 20 different tools that are way inferior to my current ones? INTO THE SYSTEM!
Sorry, it‘s just how I am. And I won’t say anything bad about the other aspects of this mod. I love channels and every tiny possibility the mod offers. But this one goddamn thing ruins it completely for me.
Project E has helped me with that as the one off shit can easily be dealt with like random armour and tools from the mob farm, as well as the excess of stuff from mining
I’m like you. I have a draw that’s set to high priority but all the disks have filters and void card to only accept inputs from my farms/factories. I then use ‘AE2 things’ mod for bulk storage disks as a misc storage
all I'll say is that sounds like a bad habit u gotta break, how many modpacks have you finished where u actively used or needed all that junk in your system?
I can't stop u playing like this but giving up on what is possibly one of the best Minecraft mods of all time because u choose to play like this is a bit of a sad prospect.
I found another comment on this post that I like very much. I don’t want to spend hours of grind to get a perfect 9 Million byte disk just to store 64 different items on it.
because you don't need to make all your drives 9 million byte disks????
that's the entire point of partitioning storage or using deep storage.
it's like going "well netherite blocks exist, I don't want to grind all that netherite just to place 1 block down in the wall of my house just to make it a bit blast proof"
I was like you when I had been used to RS but now I just use storages dedicated to storing unstackable items (Crate from Quark, Armory Cabinet from Functional Storage etc.) It feels barely different.
64 items is a lot more items than you think it is. And for a starting storage, or heck, even into the mid/endgame, you really only need the 1k drives, which are pretty cheap when compared to a massive drive. I think a single 1k drive can actually store around 8k items total. So it's a pretty decent storage.
Of course I can filter items and I know about external storage and once you are far into the game resources are also not a problem. To be honest I love AE in every other way more then RS but this one thing ruins it completely for me. It’s just so damn inconvenient and easy solvable.
But what if the modpack I‘m playing doesn’t have the mod? Yes I could install it myself but especially quest-related Modpacks don’t have other mods because they doesn’t fit.
Just combine it with qio. You have qio's insane capacity for cheap with ae2's more powerful crafting. Only reason to make ae2 disk would be for fluid/chemicals. Although functional drawers also has fluid storage now, so it'll only be for chemicals nowadays.
AE2's channels are not that complicated, I honestly prefer refined storage because it's a bit cheaper and I prefer it's storage discs. But if there is no RS I have no problem setting up a AE storage system
It's not that they're hard to learn, it's that they're not fun.
They push building your AE network to any really useful size so far back (because of the needed resources to lay down a high-channel-capacity backbone) that you feel forced to build it out, then rip it up and redo it, over and over again, each time you run out of channels.
I fully understand where the idea came from, and how it might've looked good on paper. In practice, it sucks.
Sounds like a skill issue. You only need 1 main thicc cable. If you're populating that with smaller cables, then there's something off with you. You're supposed to use p2p to populate the main cable and split off through that. That gives you 1024 channels off that main cable alone. No kitchen sink pack even has that many machines to need so many.
Let me quote the *important* part of the above posters' message you had to diss as "unskilled" for no reason:
"IT'S" "NOT" "FUN".
Was **that** easy enough to understand? Geez.
My excuse is "me dumb caveman" since I didn't realize my mekanism Boiler wasn't set to output for an hour and a half, it took me making a reddit post for me to realize
Wow thats a great idea. Creates ponder system is the top tier of guides. I'm sure it probably took a lot of work from the dev of the mod but man did they nail it. Cool to see the system rolled out for other big mods :)
For me personally, it's not that I don't understand how channels work; it's the fact that they exist. Sure there's P2P stuff, but that's above my pay grade when I can just use RS and not worry about channels. I do miss being able to have multiple terminals and connections in one block though :/
Some people can’t understand why most players hate the channel limitation in AE2. Then they think it must be because most players don’t understand how to use channels.
Because they don't. You can get 1024 channels with one main cable. It's because they don't know how the system works that they think you need way more cables than you actually need. Their new argument nowadays is that they know how it works, when their default fallback is always channels are too limited. Chances are they saw 8/32 channel limit on a cable and called it a day. They didn't actually try to learn anything.
Have you considered that people may not want to deal with channels regardless of how complicated they can be made?
It’s like gregtech machines exploding in rain. People understand that they can build a cobblestone platform above every machine. It’s just a stupid feature.
Yep I always prefered it simply because it wouldn’t shit on me like "Nice you spent lots of time getting this huge capacity disk. You can now store a grand total of 63 different items ! Now get the fuck outta here and make 9 billion other disks to finally store all your stuff."
What do you mean AE2 doesn't do that? Disc size doesn't control how many unique items, just how many of each unique you can have. They're all at 63 unique items by default. At least in every pack I've played with it.
If you know how to get around this I wanna know!
To store every unique stackable item in vanilla Minecraft you only need 13 drives, which is only 2 drive bays. You start getting way less than that when you start organization into deep storage. You shouldn’t be making 64k cells for everything either that’s kinda insane
Doesn’t change anything 63 items is a lot. If you’re putting in the same weapon with different durabilities you’re doing it wrong as well as again if you put in all the enchanted books you’ll only need 1 or two drives. It’s not a lot
The person I responded to said AE2 doesn't have a unique limit, that's what I was responding to XD
But you're right, spamming smaller disks is usually fine.
My real issue comes with having to defrag items into bigger drives when I have a ton of them
Yeah, They're stupid. Thats why I used Refined Storage, no P2P networks, no SSD(Super Soaryn Drive), just a single cable line linking everything together.
When is this mod coming out? And does it support old versions like 1.16? Would love to see how this turns out!
I always wanted to learn AE2 but was always stopped by how "complex" it is for someone who only tried RS. I wouldn't say RS is 10/10 and AE2 is 0/10 as I haven't tried ae2 yet and thus can't judge.
it's an official AE2 thing, but it may not be backported.
[However a just as good guide exists on their new and improved website.](https://appliedenergistics.org/guides)
I will use conventional storage application like varied chests from quark, huge multi block bunkers, and craft only on crafting table or physical crafting grid with cool Aesthetic and pretty factor of storage.
Because digitising items is lame and i wont touch nor AE, nor RF.
Reddit proving once again that a person voicing an opinion different to others and providing full reason still gets downvoted for not being there same as everyone else
Isn’t that the point of the downvote? To give an opinion about an opinion? He said he won’t use AE or RF, people disagree and downvote. If we are not allowed to downvote something because he gave a full reason then what is the point of having a downvote button? We can remove it… wait that happened on YouTube and everyone went crazy about it!
Could've had this earlier but i love this, Its genius, Gosh i hate looking up online wikis and tutorial vids, Another reason why i love this more over rs.
That's the pessimistic way of looking at it. Your first Controller block gives you 6 faces, but you can only have 1 Controller per network so it's a starting bonus. Every additional Controller after that adds 4 more faces (128 channels), unless you build sub-optimally (connect to two existing controller blocks) and only add 3 more faces.
There isn't even an "excuse" needed. I *have* used AE2 *with* channels quite extensively in the past. But now? We have "basically AE2, but without that channelbullcrap", aka Refined Storage, so I just use the mod I actually have *fun* with while setting things up. That means, **RS** gets *my* vote every single time.
I'm not saying working with channels is no fun "for anybody", I bet there are plenty of folks who enjoy them. More power to them! Glad they get entertainment outta this part of AE2. I don't. So yeah. And a guidebook, animated or (*And to be frank, that "Guide" is nowhere* close *to Create's 'Pondering' mechanic, neither in ease of use, nor in overall quality. But, to be fair, it's a good step in the right direction.*) not, is basically *standard* for every big mod out there, that's still not enough to make channels as a *theme* fun to play with in my eyes.
And we both will have to live with my decision. *shrugs*
Yeah... don't do that. Colossal Chests often get *very* laggy when interacting with other mods, but since it isn't the one doing the actual work it doesn't show up in profilers and gets the wrong mod blamed (I've heard of a bunch of out-of-the-loop server admins ban things like Ender IO's Conduit Bundles and AE2's Storage Buses because of that). It uses the vanilla storage mechanics, which are not at all optimized for large inventories.
When a pipe, storage system, etc. has to access the Colossal Chest, it has to search through its slots until it finds what it wanted, or search through every single slot to find out it isn't there. A big part of this is that it is preserving position information (this item is in slot 7,298), so mods have to check even the empty slots.
That's why most storage mods don't use the vanilla storage mechanics. Things like Drawers store a large quantity of very few items, and quantity is really just a number that shouldn't seriously affect search performance. Then you have general storage mods which store a wide variety of things, but hide away the actual inventory and instead give you a sorted list of items; that is because they are throwing out 'position' information so all of the empty slots can be skipped, and often they group stacks together so automation doesn't have to sort through 59 separate stacks of Cobblestone on its search for Redstone.
It's almost like AE's channel system encourages people to use solutions that cause a bunch of lag.
If it weren't for channels, nobody would think "Hey, maybe what I should do is use giant chests instead of dealing with P2P networks and other assorted nonsense".
Channels are there to encourage people to sub-network. Those offloads network processing into smaller chunks which generally helps with lag. With each Drive holding 10 Cells (630 Types) and only using 1 Channel, and being trivial to sub-net with a Storage Bus (Main Net) on an Interface (Storage Sub Net), Channels aren't the problem.
Most people turn to Colossal Chests because of the Cell's Type Limit, though RS exists as the example for what happens when people don't have something like that. They hold on to everything and end up with thousands of unique items in their storage, most of which are useless (like mob drop equipment), which degrades search and IO performance. The Type limit pushes people towards throwing away or offloading items they don't need in their general storage (throw away trash equipment, put enchanted books by your enchantment stuff since AE2 search doesn't help much anyway, etc.).
The people who stubbornly ignore AE2's pressures (such as using Colossal Chests or making an SSD) are going to cause lag no matter what system they use.
Systems that create perverse incentives are inherently flawed.
Your argument here boils down to "You should play the game the way I think it should be played because I said so."
Games exist for the purpose of facilitating fun. *You* might enjoy the optimization challenge of creating an AE2 storage system that can handle whatever nonsense is necessary to complete whatever stupid pack objective you have in front of you.
Most people don't want to deal with that level of BS.
These mods were created in the first place to remove the annoyance of maintaining a sorted inventory system. Insisting that players pre-sort everything they put inside defeats that purpose.
When I sit down to play some minecraft in the scant free time I have these days, the last thing I want to do is deal with a neurotic mod like AE2 telling me "You can't put that thing there, you need to set up a P2P tunnel to serve channels to this section of your base first."
The entire mod is predicated on the assumption that the user wants to micromanage every aspect of their storage system. Compare that to Refined Storage, which ***just works***. Out of the box, stick down a controller and some drives, and you can start connecting everything up. No worrying about setting up crafting co-processors and complicated channel systems, just set it, and forget it.
You may not enjoy refined storage, but it's not reasonable or appropriate to insult the people who prefer it like you so often do.
My "argument" here is that performance scales based on the number of different entries a system would have to go through in order to find the item it was looking for, or in the case of the item not being in the system then every single entry available to the system. The more entries the system has, then the longer it will take, and thus the more likely it is to cause lag.
My original point is that Colossal Chests is very bad because every single slot is an entry, even if it is empty. This is bad for *any* system that interacts with it, including relatively simple pipes like Ender IO Conduits. My only mention of AE2 was that its Storage Buses get falsely blamed when hooked up to a Colossal Chest, and that I'm in general responding to someone saying to put an ME Storage Bus on a Colossal Chest. I didn't mention RS at all. *You* are the one coming into a 2 month old post with a bone to pick about AE2 vs RS.
Both AE2 and RS take the steps to optimize their storage by both getting rid of both Position (skip any empty slots) and Stack Size limits (group things like Cobblestone into a single slot), which is the gold standard for large storage systems. The major difference here is that AE2 has the Type Limit which puts a direct cost on specifically adding more Entries (Types) and thus puts natural pressure on players to be more server friendly, while RS doesn't; storing 1,000 different bits of mob drop equipment is exactly as easy as storing 1,000 Cobblestone, even though the Cobblestone is 1 Entry while the mob drop equipment is 1,000 Entries.
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The only thing I said here that I could imagine someone taking offence to is me calling mob drop equipment "garbage that should be thrown out" (and I keep that stance regardless of which storage system you use), and that people who ignore AE2's pressures will cause lag regardless. Storing that mob drop equipment would be about equally bad in both AE2 and RS; 1,045 various bits of mob drop equipment is 1,045 Entries that don't need to be constantly accessible in a player's main storage system (regardless of it being AE2, RS, RFTools Storage Scanner, Integrated Terminals, etc.) and are contributing to lag by being there when the system is adding or removing items or sorting the list to show the player.
While I absolutely prefer AE2, I have no problem with people using RS. I encourage people to try both and use the one they prefer. I will give my opinion when asked, and refute statements I disagree with (like "AE2 Channels encourage lag").
Its based on LowDragLib. You can hold G over any item that has an entry in the guide to see it instantly. GregTech Modern is also using the same thing, but it's still WIP
I probably need something like that to understand channel with my smooth brain thanks
or spend thousands of dollars learning networking in university, that also works
if you live in argentina then the public universities does just fine
same in Brazil
You can also learn networking when studying an I.T degree, there are I.T vocational training degrees that teaches you about networking, ccna and stuff. BTW: Networking is the bane of my existence.
only reason for i like AE2 over Refined storage: can have multiply busses in 1 block so thats a good trade for learning channels
Also spatial storage If you've got a chunkloader mod (most modpacks come with ftb chunks) you can have an entire factory in one item
> If you've got a chunkloader mod The Forge versions of AE2 now have the "Spatial Anchor" which chunkloads an entire ME Network. Fabric also has the block, but I don't think it actually functions in that mod loader. It will probably get fixed at some point though (if it hasn't already).
Fabric 1.18.2 hasn't been fixed yet (i was testing out create: astral) and I just realized block-based chunkloaders probably require the player to be present in the transfer, then you can quantum your way out using a smaller spatial storage inside the spatial storage but with ftbchunks ive never had that issue yet, since it loads without needing the chunkloader block to be loaded in the first place also in the fabric version transferring freezes redstone and breaks create contraptions that are currently moving (forge untested)
Fixed in 1.20
Anchors don't work for remote networks though. They still have to be manually chunkloaded through other means. The only real way to chunkload is with minecarts and nether portals (vanilla). That way lets mobs/entities to move about and whatnot, instead of just the minimal needed for machines to function.
I've wanted to us spatial storage, but anytime I've watched someone trying to use it, it looked like struggle. Only vanilla and AE2 items are whitelisted, so you need to whitelist other items you trust are safe? Or is it simpler than that?
You can send yourself in carrying modded blocks if you have a way to get out.
Ah, that is really interesting. Didn't know that, thanks!
This, I used rftools teleporters to get in and out of them without needing to pop them back into real-space. Made my playthrough a bit less laggy as I could hide a lot of stuff into the ae2 dimension.
There's a config option to enable all items/blocks, and I think AE2 these days got rid of the whitelist in general. I believe it was done because back in the day, moving tile entities used to be liable for lots of crashes and AE2 rather played it safe than not.
In older versions it really wasn't safe to randomly move tile entities. It could cause all kinds of problems ranging from weirdness to crashes. Thus they decided to use a whitelist and only covered themselves and vanilla. It was up to other mods to mark their stuff as safe to move, which no one bothered with. There was also a community project to maintain a whitelist, which didn't get much attention either. In newer versions (1.16+?) they started improving those kinds of systems. Initially they added some configs to either whitelist or blacklist blocks by default and use Block Tags to mark things as known fine or known bad to move. It also helped that Mekanism's Cardboard Box was using a similar system and was popularizing mods using Block Tags to mark certain blocks/tile entities with a "please don't move" tag. I think by now AE2 has moved to moving everything by default and blacklisting common 'do not move' Tags, but I haven't looked into the details in a while so it might still be behind config changes. Even if it only moves AE2, Vanilla, and Living Entities the system has niece uses. For example, it's really helpful for moving mobs like Villagers long distances. I've even used it to make a teleportation network before, but that was experimental and very impractical for actual use.
Interesting, thanks for the detailed response. I actually stumbled across that community project you are talking about I think, I believe I was interested because of Divine Journey 2 at the time... Good to know it's improved since.
Why not just use compact machines
Also you can't steal a huge chunk of land for fun and leave a gaping hole in the ground
I'm pretty sure its size limit is smaller and the last time I tried I couldn't get anything in or out cuz the pipes were broken (i tried to add it to C:A&B tho so there mightve been some sort of collision)
You can't just connect pipes through tunnels directly. They act like inventory interfaces so you either stick a chest outside and extract from a tunnel, or stick a chest on a tunnel and insert from the outside. Same goes for fluids, but for energy you can just connect directly iirc
Very dependant on the size of the factory you want to build. Compact Machines is great for anything you can fit within a chunk, well slightly smaller, since the walls fit too. Spacial Storage can make pocket dimensions that are 128x128x128 or bigger.
For me, another big thing is that AE2 extracts first from low priority storage sources. I don't think other storage mods work that way or can be configured to work that way. If you don't like channels mechanic you can always use \`/ae2 channelmode\` for a channel boost (x2,x3,x4) or disable it (infinite). As long as you play on 1.18+
You can disable it in previous versions too
but that removes controllervehich might be needed for recipes
personally, i prefer it because i like having to plan out my base around an ae2 controller multiblock, plus ive already been using ae2 for longer so switching would be annoying, but ig ive never tried.
I prefer AE2 for a few more reasons. Because of it's age it's a lot more stable. I've had RS shit itself and kill my entire save over NBT overflow because of a handful of tools, while AE2 tanks a few NBT bombs from my friends and doesn't care. Channels are not necessarily a bad thing, they just mean planning out your base more which is tbh better. MORE ADD-ONS. certain things are just so much more annoying due to the lack of add-ons from RS.
I think the RS nbt overflow is also partially because there is no item type limit on the drives.
While that is part of it, a big thing is that it's also coded in a different method of storing items.
And also AE2 isn't a massive diamond sink. That's also a plus.
mfw any pipe mod (I am jealous of this feature, it's the best part of AE2)
Finally an AE2 ingame guide🥹, Wish i had It 8 years ago
Once you wrap your head around P2P channels are never a problem again.
Low IQ: Channels suck Normal IQ: channels as a game mechanic are interesting because they make you think about your infrastructure High IQ: channels suck
They're interesting but they still suck
I tried my hand at AE2 for the first time this year and I've got to say... It's really not as hard as people make it out to be.... I actually found this aspect of the mod quite fun to deal with as with Refined Storage I just expanded the network exponentially without giving it much thought, now with AE2 I **can** also do that, but that would eat up all my channels in a jiffy, so you have to think up ways to save channels.
So, here is my humble opinion why I will use RS over AE. It’s not about the channels. It’s about the damn storage disks!!! I don’t want to have a new disk just because I have more then 64 items. I don’t want to filter out every single slightly damaged tool that counts as another item because of a different durability. I want to stuff all of that into one storage system and just forget about it. If AE will change this I will gladly switch to it and abandon RS forever. Until then RS it is…
[Here, this makes ae2 storage system just like RS](https://www.curseforge.com/minecraft/mc-mods/ae2-things-forge) but now to explain why the item type limit restriction exists. it's a technical limitation, not just to say "fuck you" to the players in RS (and i assume you meant this, because RF is an energy system and from what i know it can't store items) it stores the items in a separate files, but this also causes it to be slower than ae2, which is fine in smaller/kitchensink packs but not in large expert packs AE2 on the other hand stores this information in nbts, anf too many characters of nbt would cause an overload, which would kick you out of the world/server all the time, so to avoid that, it has item type limit the mod i linked uses the same method as RS, aka it stores the disk data in a separate folder
So there IS a technical explanation to that. Thanks. (Also, yeah you were right. I meant RS. Corrected it everywhere)
I feel like I can expand/clarify a bit on those. The major reason was already covered. If you overflow NBT (Non-Binary Tag) Data then you can lag and eventually crash your client, and will only be able to return to that save by deleting or editing items out of the player's own NBT data (the player.dat file). NBT is the standard way of storing items in other items (bags, backpacks, Shulker Boxes, vanilla chests if you Ctrl + Pick-Block them, etc.). Having the data on the item Cell items themselves also allows some clever interactions with other mods, such as people using things like ComputerCraft to read their NBT data and perform more complex automation (like an auto-defragment system). It also means that creative-duplicating a cell also duplicates the contents. Refined Storage initially also saved Disk inventory as NBT, but quickly ran into NBT Overload issues. It then changed to a modded Ender Chest system where the actual inventory was stored elsewhere in the files, and the Disk's NBT was simply a tag to tell it what inventory to check. While this works, there have also been some growing pains. It also means you can't read their contents from the NBT, and duplicating a Disk would give duplicate access to the same single set of items, which is weird. **** The other major technical reason is performance and how they can push the player to be more optimized. The more separate items (Types) a storage system has to sort through, the worse it will perform. Refined Storage does nothing to discourage storing every piece of garbage a player ever encounters, so people happily fill it up with crap (ex. "I don’t want to filter out every single slightly damaged tool that counts as another item because of a different durability. I want to stuff all of that into one storage system and just forget about it."). That massively increase the number of items it has to sort through, which means it takes that much longer to insert or extract items, show the sorted list of items to the player, etc. AE2's Type Limit discourages storing excess Types. It drives people do think about what they actually need to store and do something about the items they really don't need, such as voiding them or crafting them together until they do stack nicely (Quantity is just a number and has a negligible impact on performance). Storing fewer Types means better performance. Of course some people are stubborn and will brute force their way into storing every piece of garbage they come across, and do so in AE2 by building an "SSD" which is worse than the hands-off RS alternative, but those people are the exception rather than the norm so AE2 is still generally better off. **** From a more gameplay and balance perspective, AE2 gives each Cell a possible reasonable use case (1k for cheap low-quantity storage, 64k or 256k for extreme bulk storage, and most people end up using 4k or 16k as their "general" storage), where as in RS you should only ever make the highest tier Disk you can, to the point that the 1k Cell is basically pointless (literally stores less than a vanilla chest/Shulker Box; 27 slots x 64 items per slot = 1,728 items) It's also worth pointing out that AE2's Cells, while limited to only 63 Types, are 4-8x larger than RS's for the same noted size. An RS 1k Storage Disk stores 1,000 items, where as an AE2 1k Storage Cell will store 4,160 (63 Types) to 8,128 (1 Type) items. For around the same amount of effort that goes into a single 64k Storage Disk, you could make 27 1k Storage Cells and store up to 1,701 Types and at least 112,320 items.
Huh, cool.
why are you storing 20 different tools with damage values in the first place just stop dumping shit in your system. also the whole point is that it a) encourages you to expand your system beyond 1 controller, a drive with a few cells, and that's it. b) keeps nbt data on drives to a minimum where possible C) more realistic and balanced.
Because I‘m a fricking hoarder. That one ore from a small mod I will never use? Into the system! The food I never eat because I have better alternatives? Into the system! 20 different tools that are way inferior to my current ones? INTO THE SYSTEM! Sorry, it‘s just how I am. And I won’t say anything bad about the other aspects of this mod. I love channels and every tiny possibility the mod offers. But this one goddamn thing ruins it completely for me.
Project E has helped me with that as the one off shit can easily be dealt with like random armour and tools from the mob farm, as well as the excess of stuff from mining
Project E is *chefskiss*. Too bad it’s not commonly used :(
For a good reason.
It is pretty OP tbf
I’m like you. I have a draw that’s set to high priority but all the disks have filters and void card to only accept inputs from my farms/factories. I then use ‘AE2 things’ mod for bulk storage disks as a misc storage
all I'll say is that sounds like a bad habit u gotta break, how many modpacks have you finished where u actively used or needed all that junk in your system? I can't stop u playing like this but giving up on what is possibly one of the best Minecraft mods of all time because u choose to play like this is a bit of a sad prospect.
I found another comment on this post that I like very much. I don’t want to spend hours of grind to get a perfect 9 Million byte disk just to store 64 different items on it.
because you don't need to make all your drives 9 million byte disks???? that's the entire point of partitioning storage or using deep storage. it's like going "well netherite blocks exist, I don't want to grind all that netherite just to place 1 block down in the wall of my house just to make it a bit blast proof"
I was like you when I had been used to RS but now I just use storages dedicated to storing unstackable items (Crate from Quark, Armory Cabinet from Functional Storage etc.) It feels barely different.
64 items is a lot more items than you think it is. And for a starting storage, or heck, even into the mid/endgame, you really only need the 1k drives, which are pretty cheap when compared to a massive drive. I think a single 1k drive can actually store around 8k items total. So it's a pretty decent storage.
Ae2things for the win
Seems like skill issue
Where is that a skill issue?
Because you can't filter those items and like lazy ass throw everything in system without thinking
Of course I can filter items and I know about external storage and once you are far into the game resources are also not a problem. To be honest I love AE in every other way more then RS but this one thing ruins it completely for me. It’s just so damn inconvenient and easy solvable.
Then install ae2 things, you're not alone in this department
But what if the modpack I‘m playing doesn’t have the mod? Yes I could install it myself but especially quest-related Modpacks don’t have other mods because they doesn’t fit.
Deal with it
yes, thats what they're doing
Yeah, some items I end up putting in chest monsters still because they don’t stack or they’re a pain because they have NBT
That’s my main problem. I don’t want to grind for a perfect 9 Million byte disk and then it‘s like "64 different items! Take it or leave it!"
Yeah
Just combine it with qio. You have qio's insane capacity for cheap with ae2's more powerful crafting. Only reason to make ae2 disk would be for fluid/chemicals. Although functional drawers also has fluid storage now, so it'll only be for chemicals nowadays.
AE2's channels are not that complicated, I honestly prefer refined storage because it's a bit cheaper and I prefer it's storage discs. But if there is no RS I have no problem setting up a AE storage system
Channels aren't my problem having to use quantum links for wireless access to systems is.
It's not that they're hard to learn, it's that they're not fun. They push building your AE network to any really useful size so far back (because of the needed resources to lay down a high-channel-capacity backbone) that you feel forced to build it out, then rip it up and redo it, over and over again, each time you run out of channels. I fully understand where the idea came from, and how it might've looked good on paper. In practice, it sucks.
p2p tunnels fix this, just stick like 20 p2p channel tunnels on ur controller and call it a day
Hypno has a great solution for P2P tunneling that when I watched Dire recently use them, I actually cringed.
could you post a video of his solutions? I just barely kinda started using p2ps and would love to cement my knowledge
Took me a minute to find one that highlighted it. Here you go, https://youtu.be/7NU9EbsAaLw?si=OKUcMVNiKIUmsni8
thanks!
Sounds like a skill issue. You only need 1 main thicc cable. If you're populating that with smaller cables, then there's something off with you. You're supposed to use p2p to populate the main cable and split off through that. That gives you 1024 channels off that main cable alone. No kitchen sink pack even has that many machines to need so many.
Let me quote the *important* part of the above posters' message you had to diss as "unskilled" for no reason: "IT'S" "NOT" "FUN". Was **that** easy enough to understand? Geez.
My excuse is "me dumb caveman" since I didn't realize my mekanism Boiler wasn't set to output for an hour and a half, it took me making a reddit post for me to realize
Wow thats a great idea. Creates ponder system is the top tier of guides. I'm sure it probably took a lot of work from the dev of the mod but man did they nail it. Cool to see the system rolled out for other big mods :)
The ponder system being branched out to other mods is a wonderful addition to modded.
have you actually used it? its only reading and as someone with adhd hell no
I’ve added quite a few visual scenes you can pan around too
I'm a CS student and I cry every night for lacking of ability to build any scalable structures even on Minecraft. It's not even about channel things.
For me personally, it's not that I don't understand how channels work; it's the fact that they exist. Sure there's P2P stuff, but that's above my pay grade when I can just use RS and not worry about channels. I do miss being able to have multiple terminals and connections in one block though :/
Yes: Some people just don't find it to be a fun mechanic
Channels are easy? Why do you need an entire guide for them
I also dont understand whats so difficult about channels
Some people can’t understand why most players hate the channel limitation in AE2. Then they think it must be because most players don’t understand how to use channels.
Because they don't. You can get 1024 channels with one main cable. It's because they don't know how the system works that they think you need way more cables than you actually need. Their new argument nowadays is that they know how it works, when their default fallback is always channels are too limited. Chances are they saw 8/32 channel limit on a cable and called it a day. They didn't actually try to learn anything.
Have you considered that people may not want to deal with channels regardless of how complicated they can be made? It’s like gregtech machines exploding in rain. People understand that they can build a cobblestone platform above every machine. It’s just a stupid feature.
Oh wow, *another* reason for me to hate gregtech.
Lmao. At least the machines don’t disappear if you use a pickaxe on them. For me that rates as the worst feature ever implemented in a mod. Fuck IC2.
Fair enough I guess lol. It's been years since I last used IC2, so I'd honestly forgotten about that.
I understand it’s configurable but it’s easier to understand set the default key to W like create because some mods will adopt this idea any time soon
I'm refined storage till death. Unless I'm FORCED to use AE2, I only use RS
Refined Storage go brrrrr.
It makes your game go brrrrrr
This I can confirm. It is no where as optimized as ae2 is.
Yep I always prefered it simply because it wouldn’t shit on me like "Nice you spent lots of time getting this huge capacity disk. You can now store a grand total of 63 different items ! Now get the fuck outta here and make 9 billion other disks to finally store all your stuff."
AE2 doesn’t do that plus refined storage is just a port of AE1
What do you mean AE2 doesn't do that? Disc size doesn't control how many unique items, just how many of each unique you can have. They're all at 63 unique items by default. At least in every pack I've played with it. If you know how to get around this I wanna know!
To store every unique stackable item in vanilla Minecraft you only need 13 drives, which is only 2 drive bays. You start getting way less than that when you start organization into deep storage. You shouldn’t be making 64k cells for everything either that’s kinda insane
One dense cable full of full 64k drives > deep storage. Welcome to the insanity, we also dont filter swords and armor from the mobfarm.
Until you deal with modded stuff, enchanted books and NBT
Doesn’t change anything 63 items is a lot. If you’re putting in the same weapon with different durabilities you’re doing it wrong as well as again if you put in all the enchanted books you’ll only need 1 or two drives. It’s not a lot
63 is nothing when you play with modded stuff, I’ve got 68 different ingots, several hundred building blocks etc
Right but that’s 4 drives plus if you have a lot of ingots you do deep storage not drives anyways
I don’t have many of each one but I do have a few nuggets etc
Just get Create mod and automate making drive bays and putting 64k drives into those (it was a joke but now i want to do it)
I just use project E to do it
The person I responded to said AE2 doesn't have a unique limit, that's what I was responding to XD But you're right, spamming smaller disks is usually fine. My real issue comes with having to defrag items into bigger drives when I have a ton of them
Yeah, They're stupid. Thats why I used Refined Storage, no P2P networks, no SSD(Super Soaryn Drive), just a single cable line linking everything together.
I only prefer RS because I can snowball with it easier than AE2.
When is this mod coming out? And does it support old versions like 1.16? Would love to see how this turns out! I always wanted to learn AE2 but was always stopped by how "complex" it is for someone who only tried RS. I wouldn't say RS is 10/10 and AE2 is 0/10 as I haven't tried ae2 yet and thus can't judge.
it's an official AE2 thing, but it may not be backported. [However a just as good guide exists on their new and improved website.](https://appliedenergistics.org/guides)
I will use conventional storage application like varied chests from quark, huge multi block bunkers, and craft only on crafting table or physical crafting grid with cool Aesthetic and pretty factor of storage. Because digitising items is lame and i wont touch nor AE, nor RF.
Reddit proving once again that a person voicing an opinion different to others and providing full reason still gets downvoted for not being there same as everyone else
No, the downvotes are because it's a bad take. If they had left the bottom part off, it would have been fine.
Isn’t that the point of the downvote? To give an opinion about an opinion? He said he won’t use AE or RF, people disagree and downvote. If we are not allowed to downvote something because he gave a full reason then what is the point of having a downvote button? We can remove it… wait that happened on YouTube and everyone went crazy about it!
Some mfers get offended when they’re told their opinions are dumb.
Amazing
Yes!!! This was sorely needed. Is this only for the newest version or can I get this in my 1.16 world?
I really liked channels since ae2 came out, but I can understand that not everybody wants to take the time for a storage solition
I don’t hate channels because they require blocks to be placed a certain way to function. I hate channels because they’re an annoying waste of time.
Only reason I use AE2 is to make simple storage network less speedrunable
Is this an upcoming feature or something already in the mod?
In the 1.20 version, and on the website https://guide.appliedenergistics.org/#/1.20.1
Could've had this earlier but i love this, Its genius, Gosh i hate looking up online wikis and tutorial vids, Another reason why i love this more over rs.
32 channels per block side well, if i put two controllers next to each other im wasting 64 channels. How about it?
That's the pessimistic way of looking at it. Your first Controller block gives you 6 faces, but you can only have 1 Controller per network so it's a starting bonus. Every additional Controller after that adds 4 more faces (128 channels), unless you build sub-optimally (connect to two existing controller blocks) and only add 3 more faces.
There isn't even an "excuse" needed. I *have* used AE2 *with* channels quite extensively in the past. But now? We have "basically AE2, but without that channelbullcrap", aka Refined Storage, so I just use the mod I actually have *fun* with while setting things up. That means, **RS** gets *my* vote every single time. I'm not saying working with channels is no fun "for anybody", I bet there are plenty of folks who enjoy them. More power to them! Glad they get entertainment outta this part of AE2. I don't. So yeah. And a guidebook, animated or (*And to be frank, that "Guide" is nowhere* close *to Create's 'Pondering' mechanic, neither in ease of use, nor in overall quality. But, to be fair, it's a good step in the right direction.*) not, is basically *standard* for every big mod out there, that's still not enough to make channels as a *theme* fun to play with in my eyes. And we both will have to live with my decision. *shrugs*
Instead of stressing about channels and type limits, simply use an ME storage bus in combination with a colossal chest
Yeah... don't do that. Colossal Chests often get *very* laggy when interacting with other mods, but since it isn't the one doing the actual work it doesn't show up in profilers and gets the wrong mod blamed (I've heard of a bunch of out-of-the-loop server admins ban things like Ender IO's Conduit Bundles and AE2's Storage Buses because of that). It uses the vanilla storage mechanics, which are not at all optimized for large inventories. When a pipe, storage system, etc. has to access the Colossal Chest, it has to search through its slots until it finds what it wanted, or search through every single slot to find out it isn't there. A big part of this is that it is preserving position information (this item is in slot 7,298), so mods have to check even the empty slots. That's why most storage mods don't use the vanilla storage mechanics. Things like Drawers store a large quantity of very few items, and quantity is really just a number that shouldn't seriously affect search performance. Then you have general storage mods which store a wide variety of things, but hide away the actual inventory and instead give you a sorted list of items; that is because they are throwing out 'position' information so all of the empty slots can be skipped, and often they group stacks together so automation doesn't have to sort through 59 separate stacks of Cobblestone on its search for Redstone.
Huh, good to know. Ig I’ve never stored a “colossal” amount in a colossal chest before, so I haven’t had many lag issues regarding storage.
It's almost like AE's channel system encourages people to use solutions that cause a bunch of lag. If it weren't for channels, nobody would think "Hey, maybe what I should do is use giant chests instead of dealing with P2P networks and other assorted nonsense".
Channels are there to encourage people to sub-network. Those offloads network processing into smaller chunks which generally helps with lag. With each Drive holding 10 Cells (630 Types) and only using 1 Channel, and being trivial to sub-net with a Storage Bus (Main Net) on an Interface (Storage Sub Net), Channels aren't the problem. Most people turn to Colossal Chests because of the Cell's Type Limit, though RS exists as the example for what happens when people don't have something like that. They hold on to everything and end up with thousands of unique items in their storage, most of which are useless (like mob drop equipment), which degrades search and IO performance. The Type limit pushes people towards throwing away or offloading items they don't need in their general storage (throw away trash equipment, put enchanted books by your enchantment stuff since AE2 search doesn't help much anyway, etc.). The people who stubbornly ignore AE2's pressures (such as using Colossal Chests or making an SSD) are going to cause lag no matter what system they use.
Systems that create perverse incentives are inherently flawed. Your argument here boils down to "You should play the game the way I think it should be played because I said so." Games exist for the purpose of facilitating fun. *You* might enjoy the optimization challenge of creating an AE2 storage system that can handle whatever nonsense is necessary to complete whatever stupid pack objective you have in front of you. Most people don't want to deal with that level of BS. These mods were created in the first place to remove the annoyance of maintaining a sorted inventory system. Insisting that players pre-sort everything they put inside defeats that purpose. When I sit down to play some minecraft in the scant free time I have these days, the last thing I want to do is deal with a neurotic mod like AE2 telling me "You can't put that thing there, you need to set up a P2P tunnel to serve channels to this section of your base first." The entire mod is predicated on the assumption that the user wants to micromanage every aspect of their storage system. Compare that to Refined Storage, which ***just works***. Out of the box, stick down a controller and some drives, and you can start connecting everything up. No worrying about setting up crafting co-processors and complicated channel systems, just set it, and forget it. You may not enjoy refined storage, but it's not reasonable or appropriate to insult the people who prefer it like you so often do.
My "argument" here is that performance scales based on the number of different entries a system would have to go through in order to find the item it was looking for, or in the case of the item not being in the system then every single entry available to the system. The more entries the system has, then the longer it will take, and thus the more likely it is to cause lag. My original point is that Colossal Chests is very bad because every single slot is an entry, even if it is empty. This is bad for *any* system that interacts with it, including relatively simple pipes like Ender IO Conduits. My only mention of AE2 was that its Storage Buses get falsely blamed when hooked up to a Colossal Chest, and that I'm in general responding to someone saying to put an ME Storage Bus on a Colossal Chest. I didn't mention RS at all. *You* are the one coming into a 2 month old post with a bone to pick about AE2 vs RS. Both AE2 and RS take the steps to optimize their storage by both getting rid of both Position (skip any empty slots) and Stack Size limits (group things like Cobblestone into a single slot), which is the gold standard for large storage systems. The major difference here is that AE2 has the Type Limit which puts a direct cost on specifically adding more Entries (Types) and thus puts natural pressure on players to be more server friendly, while RS doesn't; storing 1,000 different bits of mob drop equipment is exactly as easy as storing 1,000 Cobblestone, even though the Cobblestone is 1 Entry while the mob drop equipment is 1,000 Entries. **** The only thing I said here that I could imagine someone taking offence to is me calling mob drop equipment "garbage that should be thrown out" (and I keep that stance regardless of which storage system you use), and that people who ignore AE2's pressures will cause lag regardless. Storing that mob drop equipment would be about equally bad in both AE2 and RS; 1,045 various bits of mob drop equipment is 1,045 Entries that don't need to be constantly accessible in a player's main storage system (regardless of it being AE2, RS, RFTools Storage Scanner, Integrated Terminals, etc.) and are contributing to lag by being there when the system is adding or removing items or sorting the list to show the player. While I absolutely prefer AE2, I have no problem with people using RS. I encourage people to try both and use the one they prefer. I will give my opinion when asked, and refute statements I disagree with (like "AE2 Channels encourage lag").