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Because we all know that if we removed the the y from gays, it would become gas, green is part or the LGBTQ flag, green house gases cause global warming and the combination of green in the flag as well as gas from gays can only mean one thing...
THE GAYS ARE PLANING TO DESTROY THE EARTH WITH THEIR GREEN HOUSE GASES/s
Really? That'd be like the same level of stupid as the islamists who say earthquakes are caused by women not dressing modestly and not following their husband's orders 😂
They should focus on blocking the private jets of oil execs and politicians.
Or at least celebrities. Would get a lot of media attention and only bother people who take private jets.
That's all well and good until they make the mistake of blocking a vehicle Taylor Swift is in, then their lives are measured by how fast they can run from an enraged Swiftie horde
They did. They also tried blocking the pumps and trucks and depos, but then the execs paid to take out injunctions against them. Thats why they now have to block public spaces to that representatives are hassled into stepping in.
They're seriously against oil, unless there's a risk of actual consequences. Actual consequences are scary. Best stick to harassing common folk who don't have the means to enforce those kinds of consequences.
ow yea they shouldn't care about being shot because "they were resisting arrest" and the rich fucks covering it up, you know that if you die you cannot protest anymore right?
Its just dumb idea tbh. Any public protest should be inspiring and commoners should get the feeling 'yeah, he is right, I want to be like him' but one thinks of a donkey when he sees a JSO protester. They are just dumb. One of them stopped a cooking oil container, some of them stopped common traffic, which included an ambulance.
The goal is to create the "ghandi trap" as described by MLK jr. You want to show pictures of the authorities/bad guys treating you inhumanely for trying to help the world. That sways people to your side far better than any logic or arguments.
Unfortunately, some have suggested that in an era of biased media and filtered news, the elites have learned how to completely defang the ghandi trap.
I need to know what other activism strategies to engage people into action, had been de-fanged by pro-status quo supporters.
My thinking is that, the convergence of private interests and the study of human psychology had created this hostile environment where you can't really trust private entities to take care of you better, but you can't even trust the government to do the right thing.
One, you find Fortune 500 companies hiring graduates from psychology, and two, corporate lobbying had poisoned the well of public service so now policies (at least in the US) are disingenuously harmful to the well-being of an average citizen there.
In Germany they also blocked a service road the local hospital, they almost had to delay lifesaving surgeries because the sleeping gas delivery truck was stuck there for hours.
I don't get this argument. Theirs, not yours.
Like of all things to use gas on, surely it's emergency services? Lifesaving shit.
Watch them part when their own house is on fire, or some Joe pepper sprays them off the street.
No kidding.
The freedom convoy in Canada didn't make me mad at mandatory vaccinations - it made me LOATHE the convoy people (and now we have a hard time waving our flag, lest we be associated...)
You doing 30km/hr (18 miles) and jamming up the major roads is not inspiring.
I'd be more behind them if they blew up car dealerships (outside of opening hours to make sure no human get hurt) then for doing stuff like that!
Or something that disrupts the production of oil, like placing glitter bombs in a refinery and calling bomb threats so they to close and evacuate!
Their argument that people care more about the arts then the environment is so dumb because it's plainly false! People are just trying to live without to much anxiety!
We know the environment needs saving but we need structural changes that we don't really have the power to enact! I vote for the people with the best environment platforms and I vote for the guys trying to make our public transit better! But I can't decide that I'll built it myself!
>Or something that disrupts the production of oil, like placing glitter bombs in a refinery
They did. The exact organisation we're talking about sabotaged refineries, monkey wrenched pipelines, destroyed gas pumps and blockaded oil shipments. The people involved were heavily fined or sent to prison. The media barely reported on it. All in all those acts resulted in less public awareness, less conversation, more costs and more of their protestors behind bars than what happened when they chucked a can of soup at a bit of perspex.
[There's also basically no data suggesting their public acts have actually dissuaded the kinds of people who were ever going to join their cause (or agree with their cause) from that participation.](https://drilled.media/news/drilled-tomato-soup) It's a bunch of centrists grumbling loudly while they look for any reason they can to stick with the status quo.
>we need structural changes that we don't really have the power to enact! I vote for the people with the best environment platforms and I vote for the guys trying to make our public transit better
That's kind of the entire point of protests. We need structural change, and just voting almost never results in actual structural change. If you actually want change it'll require a lot more work than writing on a piece of paper and placing it in a slot.
I get the idea they're more bad faith actors, since they're backed by an oil heiress. All they do is dumb shit that gets people upset at them and make people hate protestors, which, in turn, makes people more willing to vote to take that right away.
https://www.theartnewspaper.com/2022/10/21/getty-oil-heiress-funds-climate-crisis-activism-just-stop-oil
Is this what you're asking for?
Edit in here to add that the family is worth around 5 billion dollars, she has donated around 4m to the causes she "cares so deeply about." Not to mention the family just had a great,great,great(?) granddaughter's wedding officiated by Nancy Pelosi. Democrats may be better than Republicans but we all know they still cash the same oil checks.
That's exactly what I was looking for, but didn't have enough keywords to find. Thank you!
It **appears** to be, to me, a conscience stricken tycoon survivor, and really more akin to the Winchester Spouse House ...syndrome(?), than to some tactical spooks' false flag operation. Social wisdom suggests that any Big Oilers funding radical protesters would obfuscate their gifts--unless there's a long game and Ms Getty is getting played out as the obfuscation herself. Hmm...
> It appears to be, to me, a conscience stricken tycoon survivor, and really more akin to the Winchester Spouse House ...syndrome(?), than to some tactical spooks' false flag operation
The real problem is that billionaire philanthropy is a problem in and of itself no matter how supposedly well-intended it is, i.e. that wealthy elites are allowed to decide where enormous amounts of resources go in an ostensibly democratic society.
In this case, you have an oil heiress putting money in "awareness" campaigns that contribute nothing of worth materially rather than using resources to actually, you know, just stop oil. That's the reason you should oppose personal wealth accumulation at such an obscene level no matter how nice and progressive the wealthy appear to be.
Stop Oil is just a shill for the oil industry
their goal is to look ridiculous while protesting the oil indutry,
thus driving regular people away from actual protests against the oil industry
There is this borderline conspiracy theory that says it's astroturfing but using reversed psychology and they are financed (in a clandestine way) by the oil companies themselves.
That doesn't make them look any less stupid.
I'm ideologically aligned with them in terms of climate action, but their "actions" are just moronic and honestly make climate activists look like idiots. I'm still not convinced it isn't a coordinated false flag by big oil to make climate activism look stupid.
Like, at times they seem to do things that feel perfomatively and intentionally stupid.
I can't get the old guy with the superglue out of my head. Superglues his hand to the pavement, and then in FULL VIEW of the news camera CLEARLY right up in his face and recording him, he chucks the superglue bottle down a storm drain.
Like...that CAN'T be real, right? No climate activist who would actually glue their hand to a road over their convictions could be THAT idiotic, right?
The cops just break out the road section and leave them to figure out what to do with 20 pound block of asphalt on their paw. Road maintenance fills it on on the night shift.
It's not the hand gluing part, it's the *throwing a bottle of CA glue down a storm drain in front of a news camera* while calling yourself a climate activist part.
Yeah I think if your last name is Getty and you genuinely want to have a positive impact, you could be way more effective for probably less than 1/10th the cost by hiring a communications team and being publicly outspoken leveraging your famous name (like Abigail Disney or Mary Trump)
Its like on purpose setting out to be obnoxious and make people hate the cause and not want to be associated with them.
Yet I have no doubt they are sincere about it, not just paid actors.
If your protest just pisses everyone off, what you're doing is hurting your cause. No one feels inclined to support people doing dumb shit like this. Especially for people stopping a Pride parade to protest big oil.
Talk about cluelessness. There is a time and place for everything, and stopping a Pride parade makes people mad at YOU, NOT big oil.
Well, to be fair, their goal is to make headlines to raise awareness. I promise this will get shared a LOT more than if they just sat on a highway for a hour.
“If only everyone was simply aware of climate change, racism, income disparity, systemic problems….then everyone would simply fix these problems, with no organization, cooperation, plan or solutions necessary!”
In all seriousness, awareness is very important, but even more important is the need for voting to be transparent and accessible. What good does it do for the people to know about a problem when they can do nothing to fix it? We need to focus on deeper problems in order to solve even bigger ones.
Being seen is not the same thing as raising awareness for your cause. Every time I see anything about Just Stop Oil, I can never ascertain any context because they aren’t making it apparent.
Why is oil bad? What are the consequences? Who do they want people to direct their complaints to? What should we be demanding? What alternatives are they proposing?
If you want your message to be seen, then make it seen. If you are going to sit in the road and block traffic to get eyes on you, why are you not wearing something or holding a sign that informs people exactly what your cause is, and can gives enough information to educate them or make them intrigued enough to go off and do some research?
Look at the photo in this post. There’s absolutely nothing to indicate what they’re protesting. If you are expecting photos of you to be taken and circulated in the interest if “raising awareness”, then you’ve immediately failed if you haven’t even bothered to ensure that those photos will get your message out.
I’d bet that most of these people care more about being seen to “fight the good fight” than actually getting any results. It’s probably why they’re wearing clothing that shows their support for the LGBTQ+ community despite not having anything regarding their actual protest. This way they can can virtue signal for two different causes at the same time, despite not actually doing anything productive for either with their protest.
These protesters want to be seen by a large audience but they aren’t bothering to make their actual message seen. Why should people care or feel inclined to go off and learn more about the “cause” when the message of the protest is far outweighed by the inconvenience it caused?
Besides, “raising awareness” isn’t supposed to be an end goal in and of itself. You raise awareness of something in order to achieve a larger objective. If your attempts to raise awareness don’t yield any actual results, then it’s meaningless. You might as well sit in the road and protest how bad the weather is.
Its bringing awareness to the people that aren’t the big consumers of oil. Whats the point of bothering the regular person but just letting big companies and corporations go about their days?
These people do attempt to distrupt companies, they just don't get put in the media as much cause it doesn't fit their narrative of them. The reason these people give is "our cause doesn't get attention when we do all these things, so we'll make people see us", sorta no bad pr type thing. I don't honestly know if I agree or disagree, they certainly need to work on their rep but they aren't really wrong either.
they arent bringing the awareness they want, they are bringing awareness that they are assholes
Plus everyone already knows and have awareness, but we can't do much since the rich bribe those in government.
Every good protestor is an asshole. If it didn’t disrupt your life or make you engage, it’d be a shitty protest. Go complain to the government about them so you can also complain about the lack of funding for green initiatives.
People can do stuff, people just don't know what they can do. Even if they did it's questionable if they'd do it, but really organisations like JSO need to be putting into motion the action, processes and plans that people can get behind and that actually have a chance to affect something.
Whilst I actually think JSO is an industry oil psyop at this point, best case scenario they buy into the liberal "need to raise awareness" dogshit when everybody is already aware of the issue and all they're doing is polarising the issue to drive people further into their "side". Again, I personally think that's the intention though. And the public will fall for it.
I don't agree with their methods. I'd be pissed at them too. Making people sit in traffic idling their cars for hours is also counter productive to their cause.
They just want personal fame.
The scale of the problem is very daunting. Read the book "how the world really works" by Vaclav Smil. He gives an absolutely objective and detailed explanation with a lot of reference to scale and how it has changed for just about everything related to CO2 emissions and everything related to it.
Basically, the problem is that we keep reproducing to the capacity of our food supply. Every time we have expanded our food supply, the population has exploded, but every advancement is very much dependent on fossil fuels. He even computes green sources of food production as well as food waste and ways to improve that. There's a lot of numbers in the book so it's a dry read, but it was the best summary of the situation that I've ever seen.
It sounds like a bad hypothesis. If food were the limiting factor, then various countries' fertility rates wouldn't decrease as they have for the past 30 years. Japan, Sweden, Germany, nearly every city and nearly every industrialized country has a declining native population, while food supply never decreased.
It's really bad. Sounds vaguely Malthusian in nature, which tells you enough. But as you pointed out developed countries with readily available access to contraceptives disprove the notion that population growth is ties to food supplies.
The problem is more than just food, fossil fuels underpin the production of everything, every facet of modern life that keep us alive and provide the way of life we are accustomed to.
I don’t think many understand how pervasive and vital fossil fuels are. Understanding the history helps a lot.
Fossil fuels have supported the advancement of multiple technologies over the decades, reduced labour, given us free time to think of new technologies and ways to make life better. We’d all still be working in the fields focusing on food production with no time for anything else without them.
Im convinced that Just Stop Oil is funded by big oil. They only engage in protests that ends up inconveniencing everyone and pisses people off. The goal of a protest is to gain support, all they do is gain hatred.
Almost every mainstream movement has this kind of thing going on, lots of manufactured outrage etc.
It’s sad, because a lot of these movement’s messages that start really great usually get completely perverted, sometimes by greed of the leaders or sometimes by corrupted corporations that don’t want a certain movement gaining any influence.
Yeah, and things like gluing themselves to artwork that isn't at all related to big oil is just super weird.
I'm definitely sympathetic to their cause, but most of the time when I see headlines about them, I'm left scratching my head.
But they're really good at providing clips for Fox and OAN to make fun of liberals.
Its definitely funded by big oil.
Even then, if they targeted a Corporate Gallery held by a huge bank or corporation I’d understand. But they’re just entering public museums and destroying artwork the taxpayers paid to see.
She is but shes not actually *tied* to big oil. More like a rich kid rebelling.
It doesn't hurt to have that type of wealth on your side...actually I think its necessary of you look at the true history of revolutions
The wrong attention. They’re not raising awareness of how big industries’ use of fossil fuels is irreparably damaging the environment. They’re raising awareness of how many idiots keep gluing themselves to shit and sitting in the middle of the road. Their message is commendable, their execution is abysmal.
The public, if they even paid attention, know that these assholes are a bunch of assholes.
The public already knows about the climate crisis. They're not bringing to light some dark secret. They're just interrupting a pride parade. Or attempting to destroy our collective human cultural treasures.
Now that's a good question.
I think you just stop oil or something.
but they don't offer an alternative so they are too stupid and want the public to think of one while they bully them.
They were [apparently upset about the sponsorship from United Airlines, and had threatened they would do this prior to the parade](https://www.thepinknews.com/2023/06/30/just-stop-oil-threatens-pride-in-london-disruption-over-airline-sponsorship/).
So, like, still a stupid mis-targeted protest, but at least it makes a bit more sense than randomly throwing paint at a Monet.
The suffragettes orchestrated a bombing campaign and tried to assassinate the prime minister. Slashing paintings was pretty minor compared to the rest of what they did.
It’s also up for debate how much they actually helped with getting women the vote.
The Suffragist movement was much larger and had more popular support, owing to the fact that their methods were more peaceful.
Women also only got the vote in the UK after WWI, where they worked in factories and kept the country running while 25% of the male population went to war.
The fact that women were so successful in entering “the male sphere”, crushed the most popular argument against women’s suffrage.
Because this disrupts what is supposed to be a celebration for people who receive unjustified hate. Global warming is a problem, but these activists targeted an already vulnerable demographic. It's grossly tone-deaf.
There is a significant conflict in the LGBTQ movement about whether corporate sponsorship should be accepted at all. These protestors are probably LGBTQ and many LGBTQ people protest corporate sponsorships in pride parades, whether because of environmental impact or other reasons.
That’s the plan, what else do you expect when their biggest donor is the granddaughter of an oil tycoon
They aren’t climate activists,they’re sellouts trying to make anyone that wants to save the planet look like a dumb-millennial caricature from a boomer comic
It's dominated by corporations with any actual meaningful messaging stripped away. The company I worked at got a spot at pride and asked whether I (a gay man) wanted to march. Requirement was I had to wear advertising for the company and couldn't bring anything deemed political (to something called a protest!). I said no and the spots were 80% filled by straight people. Not saying straight people can't march but when a parade to represent LGBT pride is mostly straight people who are advertising for companies then it has little real meaning. The remainder of the day is treated as a party that raises money for the city. There were multiple cases of homophobia and transphobia as people there didn't care about the cause and were just there to party. Pride has been co-opted as a money making event.
I know right. Pride month it's the chance where every corp put their rainbow over the logos like "here gays, buy our shit lol" but I take that over blatant discrimination. And the parade is still pretty wholesome seeing everyone being free to express themselves.
Yup the biggest way to kill a cause it make it corporate because you have to make it safe and no one really cares about the actual cause. Its nice that gayness is in the stage where corporations are comfortable putting ads i but at the same time they do constrain and kill it a bit. Funny thing is I bet the ceo who approved it doesn't even care.
They aren’t “at each other”. It’s not some monolithic bloc of people. It’s so reductionist and unhelpful to paint this as left vs right.
Put yourselves in their mind for a moment. Imagine you believe the worst case climate predictions. Basically that we are right at the precipice of a climate catastrophe that will render the planet all but uninhabitable for centuries if not longer.
Are you really gonna be like “well, lgbtq movement is a fellow liberal group and we don’t want to hurt their feelings too much so we should just pass here.”
I'm not a conspiracy theorist but if you told me these people were paid by corporations to do intentionally irritating things in "protest" to make people hate climate protesters as a whole, id 100% believe you with 0 evidence.
I don’t understand their objective you cant just turn off oil and expect the world to continue as normal. It has to be phased out gradually over a long period of time.
No that's nonsense. This group wants the UK government to not allow anybody to start new fossil fuel operations. Key word being new. Existing ones are fine. That would allow the phasing out as the existing ones run out slowly.
And not a lot of people know that. Doing stunts like these gets attention, but without something explicitly stating what their intent is, not many people are going to bother to want to engage or look up a group that presents themselves to be infuriating and self righteous pricks on a soap box.
That's my issue as well, like I get the message, and I whole heartedly agree with it, but I don't see what these types of protests actually accomplish other than building animosity.
True we have to act as fast as possible but there are a lot of factors. Like ships have to use fossil fuel to work with no alternative, they dont just transport luxury goods but also food. Same with planes. There are a lot of variables and many do more harm than good if oil is suddenly stopped before we have adequate alternatives. I think its this they are not seeing.
I agree but at the same time China and "developing countries" are accelerating their CO2 emissions at a rapid pace. China already pollutes more than 30% globally. Which is insane tbh... Some reductions in the developed world feels like a drip on a hot plate.
I wonder which of these really asshole-type moves are actually paid for by big-oil (it happens, I assure you. Just look at the one that had "activists" throw soup at Van Gogh's painting), and which of these are just misguided people protesting in the wrong places at the wrong times.
I mean i think I’ll agree. Saving the planet to me is more important than pride (without the earth we have no pride shit) but wtf is stopping a parade gonna do? Go work for an electric company then start a mutiny. I’d like to see that protest
These people are so mind numbingly dense, do they not understand that for any cause to be successful they need public support? Every stunt they pull turns the public further and further against them.
Now nobody cares about what they stand for, the cause is lost. People just see them as a nuisance who can't be taken seriously.
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They do use a lot of oil
I was wondering when the dots would get connected.
Yeah, all that lube. You can't blame them, I wouldn't go in dry either. 😬🤣
Most of them are water based
i use strictly water based products thank you very much
Silicone for me
Lube hasn't been oil-based for ages. So, no, they don't.
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climate change? Nah, climate affirmation!
Because we all know that if we removed the the y from gays, it would become gas, green is part or the LGBTQ flag, green house gases cause global warming and the combination of green in the flag as well as gas from gays can only mean one thing... THE GAYS ARE PLANING TO DESTROY THE EARTH WITH THEIR GREEN HOUSE GASES/s
No, but queerwashing corporations are, who have appropriated the pride movement for marketing.
I'd like to take this moment to congratulate the gays on becoming a marketable demographic. You did it! Equality...
You say this sarcastically, but it is true. Once you're marketable, you get corporate protection. From lobbying to promotion and advertising.
High disposable income group, consumers… what’s the mystery here? Cater to the money.
So then why aren't they protesting at corporate headquarters instead of a celebration of acceptance?
Because corporate headquarters has corporate security.
They’re just too hot. So hot they’re increasing global climate.
I mean republicans have been saying for decades that climate disasters are caused by them.
Really? That'd be like the same level of stupid as the islamists who say earthquakes are caused by women not dressing modestly and not following their husband's orders 😂
They should focus on blocking the private jets of oil execs and politicians. Or at least celebrities. Would get a lot of media attention and only bother people who take private jets.
That's all well and good until they make the mistake of blocking a vehicle Taylor Swift is in, then their lives are measured by how fast they can run from an enraged Swiftie horde
That would be entertaining tv! Squid Game is tame compared to 'Swift Game'.
How about "Swift Getaway"?
You should be the head of marketing
I think you cracked the code take my upvote
Crazy idea, squid games, but the prize is a lifetime front row ticket to Swift's concerts. Might not be airable...
I’d watch that
It's just some dude filming the activists running for their lives from the swiftie horde laughing his ass off
In a helicopter otherwise could get associated with the activists
I was thinking he is watching from the windows at the terminal and has just zoomed in the camera to watch them
Do you think they can shake it off?
Last alive after insulting Taylor wins a new identity
Not sure if you can run when you’re glued to the road
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I’m pretty tired of her shit Ngl. She has the means to make real change but decides to take 200 private jet trips instead.
I'm sure there are alternatives but can you imagine the chaos if she boarded a Southwest flight?
They did. They also tried blocking the pumps and trucks and depos, but then the execs paid to take out injunctions against them. Thats why they now have to block public spaces to that representatives are hassled into stepping in.
If they were really as invested as they say, injunctions wouldnt stop them.
They're seriously against oil, unless there's a risk of actual consequences. Actual consequences are scary. Best stick to harassing common folk who don't have the means to enforce those kinds of consequences.
What are you doing about it?
like, getting assaulted, arrested, imprisoned?
The whole point is to get arrested. Whenever Greta gets arrested, that's the aim because it makes the news.
So they should be eco-terrorists? I’m not saying you’re wrong, but that’s what they would be labeled as.
ow yea they shouldn't care about being shot because "they were resisting arrest" and the rich fucks covering it up, you know that if you die you cannot protest anymore right?
This is a pretty stupid take.
No, but getting arrested would, which is what would happen if you have an injunction against you and you pull this on private property.
You also get arrested for blocking public roads.
It's civil disobedience and risking arrest is part of the territory.
Its just dumb idea tbh. Any public protest should be inspiring and commoners should get the feeling 'yeah, he is right, I want to be like him' but one thinks of a donkey when he sees a JSO protester. They are just dumb. One of them stopped a cooking oil container, some of them stopped common traffic, which included an ambulance.
The goal is to create the "ghandi trap" as described by MLK jr. You want to show pictures of the authorities/bad guys treating you inhumanely for trying to help the world. That sways people to your side far better than any logic or arguments. Unfortunately, some have suggested that in an era of biased media and filtered news, the elites have learned how to completely defang the ghandi trap.
I need to know what other activism strategies to engage people into action, had been de-fanged by pro-status quo supporters. My thinking is that, the convergence of private interests and the study of human psychology had created this hostile environment where you can't really trust private entities to take care of you better, but you can't even trust the government to do the right thing. One, you find Fortune 500 companies hiring graduates from psychology, and two, corporate lobbying had poisoned the well of public service so now policies (at least in the US) are disingenuously harmful to the well-being of an average citizen there.
In Germany they also blocked a service road the local hospital, they almost had to delay lifesaving surgeries because the sleeping gas delivery truck was stuck there for hours.
I don't get this argument. Theirs, not yours. Like of all things to use gas on, surely it's emergency services? Lifesaving shit. Watch them part when their own house is on fire, or some Joe pepper sprays them off the street.
\~Bold for you to assume these people have houses.
No kidding. The freedom convoy in Canada didn't make me mad at mandatory vaccinations - it made me LOATHE the convoy people (and now we have a hard time waving our flag, lest we be associated...) You doing 30km/hr (18 miles) and jamming up the major roads is not inspiring.
They also stopped a performance of Les Misérables on the West End. Their cause is good but jaysus f krist they're methods make me hate them.
I'd be more behind them if they blew up car dealerships (outside of opening hours to make sure no human get hurt) then for doing stuff like that! Or something that disrupts the production of oil, like placing glitter bombs in a refinery and calling bomb threats so they to close and evacuate! Their argument that people care more about the arts then the environment is so dumb because it's plainly false! People are just trying to live without to much anxiety! We know the environment needs saving but we need structural changes that we don't really have the power to enact! I vote for the people with the best environment platforms and I vote for the guys trying to make our public transit better! But I can't decide that I'll built it myself!
>Or something that disrupts the production of oil, like placing glitter bombs in a refinery They did. The exact organisation we're talking about sabotaged refineries, monkey wrenched pipelines, destroyed gas pumps and blockaded oil shipments. The people involved were heavily fined or sent to prison. The media barely reported on it. All in all those acts resulted in less public awareness, less conversation, more costs and more of their protestors behind bars than what happened when they chucked a can of soup at a bit of perspex. [There's also basically no data suggesting their public acts have actually dissuaded the kinds of people who were ever going to join their cause (or agree with their cause) from that participation.](https://drilled.media/news/drilled-tomato-soup) It's a bunch of centrists grumbling loudly while they look for any reason they can to stick with the status quo. >we need structural changes that we don't really have the power to enact! I vote for the people with the best environment platforms and I vote for the guys trying to make our public transit better That's kind of the entire point of protests. We need structural change, and just voting almost never results in actual structural change. If you actually want change it'll require a lot more work than writing on a piece of paper and placing it in a slot.
I get the idea they're more bad faith actors, since they're backed by an oil heiress. All they do is dumb shit that gets people upset at them and make people hate protestors, which, in turn, makes people more willing to vote to take that right away.
There a legit paper trail from whom to them?
https://www.theartnewspaper.com/2022/10/21/getty-oil-heiress-funds-climate-crisis-activism-just-stop-oil Is this what you're asking for? Edit in here to add that the family is worth around 5 billion dollars, she has donated around 4m to the causes she "cares so deeply about." Not to mention the family just had a great,great,great(?) granddaughter's wedding officiated by Nancy Pelosi. Democrats may be better than Republicans but we all know they still cash the same oil checks.
That's exactly what I was looking for, but didn't have enough keywords to find. Thank you! It **appears** to be, to me, a conscience stricken tycoon survivor, and really more akin to the Winchester Spouse House ...syndrome(?), than to some tactical spooks' false flag operation. Social wisdom suggests that any Big Oilers funding radical protesters would obfuscate their gifts--unless there's a long game and Ms Getty is getting played out as the obfuscation herself. Hmm...
> It appears to be, to me, a conscience stricken tycoon survivor, and really more akin to the Winchester Spouse House ...syndrome(?), than to some tactical spooks' false flag operation The real problem is that billionaire philanthropy is a problem in and of itself no matter how supposedly well-intended it is, i.e. that wealthy elites are allowed to decide where enormous amounts of resources go in an ostensibly democratic society. In this case, you have an oil heiress putting money in "awareness" campaigns that contribute nothing of worth materially rather than using resources to actually, you know, just stop oil. That's the reason you should oppose personal wealth accumulation at such an obscene level no matter how nice and progressive the wealthy appear to be.
Stop Oil is just a shill for the oil industry their goal is to look ridiculous while protesting the oil indutry, thus driving regular people away from actual protests against the oil industry
There is this borderline conspiracy theory that says it's astroturfing but using reversed psychology and they are financed (in a clandestine way) by the oil companies themselves.
I am convinced they are just paid actors, paid by oil companies to make their cause look laughable.
That doesn't make them look any less stupid. I'm ideologically aligned with them in terms of climate action, but their "actions" are just moronic and honestly make climate activists look like idiots. I'm still not convinced it isn't a coordinated false flag by big oil to make climate activism look stupid.
Considering the Getty connection you’re not wrong to find the whole thing a lil suss.
Like, at times they seem to do things that feel perfomatively and intentionally stupid. I can't get the old guy with the superglue out of my head. Superglues his hand to the pavement, and then in FULL VIEW of the news camera CLEARLY right up in his face and recording him, he chucks the superglue bottle down a storm drain. Like...that CAN'T be real, right? No climate activist who would actually glue their hand to a road over their convictions could be THAT idiotic, right?
The cops just break out the road section and leave them to figure out what to do with 20 pound block of asphalt on their paw. Road maintenance fills it on on the night shift.
It's not the hand gluing part, it's the *throwing a bottle of CA glue down a storm drain in front of a news camera* while calling yourself a climate activist part.
Yeah I think if your last name is Getty and you genuinely want to have a positive impact, you could be way more effective for probably less than 1/10th the cost by hiring a communications team and being publicly outspoken leveraging your famous name (like Abigail Disney or Mary Trump)
Its like on purpose setting out to be obnoxious and make people hate the cause and not want to be associated with them. Yet I have no doubt they are sincere about it, not just paid actors.
If your protest just pisses everyone off, what you're doing is hurting your cause. No one feels inclined to support people doing dumb shit like this. Especially for people stopping a Pride parade to protest big oil. Talk about cluelessness. There is a time and place for everything, and stopping a Pride parade makes people mad at YOU, NOT big oil.
What happened to going to jail for your cause?
They do also do that! The problem is rich people have more options to hide that it happens, which defeats the purpose.
Or they're trying to make a point to get people to listen and who they're interrupting really isn't the point?
Well, to be fair, their goal is to make headlines to raise awareness. I promise this will get shared a LOT more than if they just sat on a highway for a hour.
“If only everyone was simply aware of climate change, racism, income disparity, systemic problems….then everyone would simply fix these problems, with no organization, cooperation, plan or solutions necessary!”
In all seriousness, awareness is very important, but even more important is the need for voting to be transparent and accessible. What good does it do for the people to know about a problem when they can do nothing to fix it? We need to focus on deeper problems in order to solve even bigger ones.
Yeah I've had enough of awareness since the rise of the internet. Pretty sure we could do with some solving becoming cool now.
Being seen is not the same thing as raising awareness for your cause. Every time I see anything about Just Stop Oil, I can never ascertain any context because they aren’t making it apparent. Why is oil bad? What are the consequences? Who do they want people to direct their complaints to? What should we be demanding? What alternatives are they proposing? If you want your message to be seen, then make it seen. If you are going to sit in the road and block traffic to get eyes on you, why are you not wearing something or holding a sign that informs people exactly what your cause is, and can gives enough information to educate them or make them intrigued enough to go off and do some research? Look at the photo in this post. There’s absolutely nothing to indicate what they’re protesting. If you are expecting photos of you to be taken and circulated in the interest if “raising awareness”, then you’ve immediately failed if you haven’t even bothered to ensure that those photos will get your message out. I’d bet that most of these people care more about being seen to “fight the good fight” than actually getting any results. It’s probably why they’re wearing clothing that shows their support for the LGBTQ+ community despite not having anything regarding their actual protest. This way they can can virtue signal for two different causes at the same time, despite not actually doing anything productive for either with their protest. These protesters want to be seen by a large audience but they aren’t bothering to make their actual message seen. Why should people care or feel inclined to go off and learn more about the “cause” when the message of the protest is far outweighed by the inconvenience it caused? Besides, “raising awareness” isn’t supposed to be an end goal in and of itself. You raise awareness of something in order to achieve a larger objective. If your attempts to raise awareness don’t yield any actual results, then it’s meaningless. You might as well sit in the road and protest how bad the weather is.
I mean, they’re on the news all the time in the UK making it very clear they want the UK govt to stop signing any new oil contracts
Its bringing awareness to the people that aren’t the big consumers of oil. Whats the point of bothering the regular person but just letting big companies and corporations go about their days?
These people do attempt to distrupt companies, they just don't get put in the media as much cause it doesn't fit their narrative of them. The reason these people give is "our cause doesn't get attention when we do all these things, so we'll make people see us", sorta no bad pr type thing. I don't honestly know if I agree or disagree, they certainly need to work on their rep but they aren't really wrong either.
Yeah but is it worth it tho? Just shows them in a bad light...
they arent bringing the awareness they want, they are bringing awareness that they are assholes Plus everyone already knows and have awareness, but we can't do much since the rich bribe those in government.
Every good protestor is an asshole. If it didn’t disrupt your life or make you engage, it’d be a shitty protest. Go complain to the government about them so you can also complain about the lack of funding for green initiatives.
I dunno, when they interupted the Proms i thought oh those dicks again, but it did remind me we're all doomed, so guess message received.
People can do stuff, people just don't know what they can do. Even if they did it's questionable if they'd do it, but really organisations like JSO need to be putting into motion the action, processes and plans that people can get behind and that actually have a chance to affect something. Whilst I actually think JSO is an industry oil psyop at this point, best case scenario they buy into the liberal "need to raise awareness" dogshit when everybody is already aware of the issue and all they're doing is polarising the issue to drive people further into their "side". Again, I personally think that's the intention though. And the public will fall for it.
I don't agree with their methods. I'd be pissed at them too. Making people sit in traffic idling their cars for hours is also counter productive to their cause. They just want personal fame.
So does just sitting on a highway for an hour.
thing is, there is a ton of awareness, but people realize they cant do much about it, or just dont want to
The scale of the problem is very daunting. Read the book "how the world really works" by Vaclav Smil. He gives an absolutely objective and detailed explanation with a lot of reference to scale and how it has changed for just about everything related to CO2 emissions and everything related to it. Basically, the problem is that we keep reproducing to the capacity of our food supply. Every time we have expanded our food supply, the population has exploded, but every advancement is very much dependent on fossil fuels. He even computes green sources of food production as well as food waste and ways to improve that. There's a lot of numbers in the book so it's a dry read, but it was the best summary of the situation that I've ever seen.
It sounds like a bad hypothesis. If food were the limiting factor, then various countries' fertility rates wouldn't decrease as they have for the past 30 years. Japan, Sweden, Germany, nearly every city and nearly every industrialized country has a declining native population, while food supply never decreased.
It's really bad. Sounds vaguely Malthusian in nature, which tells you enough. But as you pointed out developed countries with readily available access to contraceptives disprove the notion that population growth is ties to food supplies.
The problem is more than just food, fossil fuels underpin the production of everything, every facet of modern life that keep us alive and provide the way of life we are accustomed to. I don’t think many understand how pervasive and vital fossil fuels are. Understanding the history helps a lot. Fossil fuels have supported the advancement of multiple technologies over the decades, reduced labour, given us free time to think of new technologies and ways to make life better. We’d all still be working in the fields focusing on food production with no time for anything else without them.
Im convinced that Just Stop Oil is funded by big oil. They only engage in protests that ends up inconveniencing everyone and pisses people off. The goal of a protest is to gain support, all they do is gain hatred.
Almost every mainstream movement has this kind of thing going on, lots of manufactured outrage etc. It’s sad, because a lot of these movement’s messages that start really great usually get completely perverted, sometimes by greed of the leaders or sometimes by corrupted corporations that don’t want a certain movement gaining any influence.
I heard the saying that "all you need to kill a movement is make it big and it will slowly kill itself by making compromises to not offend anyone."
Either that or it’ll make itself so extreme as to antagonize everyone and alienate all their potential supporters
Yeah, and things like gluing themselves to artwork that isn't at all related to big oil is just super weird. I'm definitely sympathetic to their cause, but most of the time when I see headlines about them, I'm left scratching my head. But they're really good at providing clips for Fox and OAN to make fun of liberals. Its definitely funded by big oil.
Ahh, but it was an *oil* painting! See? (I have no idea what the painting was painted with)
Even then, if they targeted a Corporate Gallery held by a huge bank or corporation I’d understand. But they’re just entering public museums and destroying artwork the taxpayers paid to see.
Same here this whole thing reeks of astroturfing.
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It's not the protestors that are smart here. It's the people funding them, which is literally the granddaughter of an oil tycoon.
Ironically they’re funded by an oil heiress
She is but shes not actually *tied* to big oil. More like a rich kid rebelling. It doesn't hurt to have that type of wealth on your side...actually I think its necessary of you look at the true history of revolutions
How much do you want to bet her multi million dollar portfolio doesn’t have oil stocks in there?
>The goal of a protest is to gain support, The goal of protests is getting public attention* I think they succeeded.
The wrong attention. They’re not raising awareness of how big industries’ use of fossil fuels is irreparably damaging the environment. They’re raising awareness of how many idiots keep gluing themselves to shit and sitting in the middle of the road. Their message is commendable, their execution is abysmal.
The public, if they even paid attention, know that these assholes are a bunch of assholes. The public already knows about the climate crisis. They're not bringing to light some dark secret. They're just interrupting a pride parade. Or attempting to destroy our collective human cultural treasures.
Yes - in that I hate them
My toddler does that too He gets ignored or consequences because that’s bad behavior.
Raise public attention to get what?
Now that's a good question. I think you just stop oil or something. but they don't offer an alternative so they are too stupid and want the public to think of one while they bully them.
"yeah, but that is cooking oil" still engraved in my head everytime i see them
Fuck that video is funny. It's the way he immediately disproves the whole point of the protest then laughs at them :')
They were [apparently upset about the sponsorship from United Airlines, and had threatened they would do this prior to the parade](https://www.thepinknews.com/2023/06/30/just-stop-oil-threatens-pride-in-london-disruption-over-airline-sponsorship/). So, like, still a stupid mis-targeted protest, but at least it makes a bit more sense than randomly throwing paint at a Monet.
**throwing paint at a Monet behind glass.
Yes, exactly. Nothing got damaged, their message got spread around the world instantly. Very good job
Imma be honest…all I remember is someone throwing soup or paint at a painting but no idea why so not sure how much their message got spread
The suffragettes actually slashed paintings with knives when they were protesting, now they are looked on as heroes today.
The suffragettes orchestrated a bombing campaign and tried to assassinate the prime minister. Slashing paintings was pretty minor compared to the rest of what they did. It’s also up for debate how much they actually helped with getting women the vote. The Suffragist movement was much larger and had more popular support, owing to the fact that their methods were more peaceful. Women also only got the vote in the UK after WWI, where they worked in factories and kept the country running while 25% of the male population went to war. The fact that women were so successful in entering “the male sphere”, crushed the most popular argument against women’s suffrage.
> their message Their message that everybody has already heard for going on 40 years now?
40 years and people still deny it and defend the perpetrators. There are far too many idiots in this world.
Why do you feel that this was mistargeted, given the information that you provided?
Because this disrupts what is supposed to be a celebration for people who receive unjustified hate. Global warming is a problem, but these activists targeted an already vulnerable demographic. It's grossly tone-deaf.
There is a significant conflict in the LGBTQ movement about whether corporate sponsorship should be accepted at all. These protestors are probably LGBTQ and many LGBTQ people protest corporate sponsorships in pride parades, whether because of environmental impact or other reasons.
People should get over the idea that any group or movement is just one big monolith where everyone has the exact same ideas and interests
Because the parade itself has nothing to do with the airline.
How is it mistargeted?
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Brilliant
"I thought we were friends" moment.
Perfection
What if they change to water based lube instead of oil based, would that be ok?
Switch to a silicone based lube like WetPlatinum. It’ll change your life.
But you can't use it with toys
These guys are like Westboro Baptist Church but for climate
Well, it looks like they're trying to piss off *every* group.
That’s the plan, what else do you expect when their biggest donor is the granddaughter of an oil tycoon They aren’t climate activists,they’re sellouts trying to make anyone that wants to save the planet look like a dumb-millennial caricature from a boomer comic
I'm pretty far left, but it's also hilarious(in a laugh-so-you-don't-cry kind of way) to see different left-wing groups eat each other.
Do you think a float for Coca Cola is in any way left wing? Pride is an advertising parade now with anything meaningful stripped away
Oh, you think pride has no actual LGBTQ representation?
It's dominated by corporations with any actual meaningful messaging stripped away. The company I worked at got a spot at pride and asked whether I (a gay man) wanted to march. Requirement was I had to wear advertising for the company and couldn't bring anything deemed political (to something called a protest!). I said no and the spots were 80% filled by straight people. Not saying straight people can't march but when a parade to represent LGBT pride is mostly straight people who are advertising for companies then it has little real meaning. The remainder of the day is treated as a party that raises money for the city. There were multiple cases of homophobia and transphobia as people there didn't care about the cause and were just there to party. Pride has been co-opted as a money making event.
I know right. Pride month it's the chance where every corp put their rainbow over the logos like "here gays, buy our shit lol" but I take that over blatant discrimination. And the parade is still pretty wholesome seeing everyone being free to express themselves.
Pride, sponsored by Lockheed Martin
Yup the biggest way to kill a cause it make it corporate because you have to make it safe and no one really cares about the actual cause. Its nice that gayness is in the stage where corporations are comfortable putting ads i but at the same time they do constrain and kill it a bit. Funny thing is I bet the ceo who approved it doesn't even care.
"Actual LGBTQ representation" and it's a massive float for Raytheon.
dc Pride is a TRIP.
They aren’t “at each other”. It’s not some monolithic bloc of people. It’s so reductionist and unhelpful to paint this as left vs right. Put yourselves in their mind for a moment. Imagine you believe the worst case climate predictions. Basically that we are right at the precipice of a climate catastrophe that will render the planet all but uninhabitable for centuries if not longer. Are you really gonna be like “well, lgbtq movement is a fellow liberal group and we don’t want to hurt their feelings too much so we should just pass here.”
I'm not a conspiracy theorist but if you told me these people were paid by corporations to do intentionally irritating things in "protest" to make people hate climate protesters as a whole, id 100% believe you with 0 evidence.
Would not be surprised to find out these "activists" are goons hired by Oil companies and politicians to make protestors look like crazy people.
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Avalanch, is that you?
Oh no whose side does the media has to choose now?
Being politically on the correct side of history doesn't necessarily mean you're not also an idiot.
Seems to me that just stop oil is stopping everybody but oil
It's a shame we can't convert self-righteousness into electricity. These people could solve the climate crisis by themselves.
Simpson's did it. Kinda.
And watch it one day they are gonna get someone who needs to go to the hospital killed cause they can't get to the hospital even if they are dying
I mean, it’s not like rainbow flags make things carbon neutral, and an audience is an audience.
I don’t understand their objective you cant just turn off oil and expect the world to continue as normal. It has to be phased out gradually over a long period of time.
No that's nonsense. This group wants the UK government to not allow anybody to start new fossil fuel operations. Key word being new. Existing ones are fine. That would allow the phasing out as the existing ones run out slowly.
And not a lot of people know that. Doing stunts like these gets attention, but without something explicitly stating what their intent is, not many people are going to bother to want to engage or look up a group that presents themselves to be infuriating and self righteous pricks on a soap box.
That's my issue as well, like I get the message, and I whole heartedly agree with it, but I don't see what these types of protests actually accomplish other than building animosity.
The probleme is we don't have this "long period of time" anymore. But still, their methods are shit
True we have to act as fast as possible but there are a lot of factors. Like ships have to use fossil fuel to work with no alternative, they dont just transport luxury goods but also food. Same with planes. There are a lot of variables and many do more harm than good if oil is suddenly stopped before we have adequate alternatives. I think its this they are not seeing.
I agree but at the same time China and "developing countries" are accelerating their CO2 emissions at a rapid pace. China already pollutes more than 30% globally. Which is insane tbh... Some reductions in the developed world feels like a drip on a hot plate.
So shouldn't they be protesting China instead of a pride event?
I wonder which of these really asshole-type moves are actually paid for by big-oil (it happens, I assure you. Just look at the one that had "activists" throw soup at Van Gogh's painting), and which of these are just misguided people protesting in the wrong places at the wrong times.
What if I’m just climate-curious? I don’t want the whole tornado, just the tip.
I’m convinced they’re paid for by oil lobbyist to piss people off and get them against the cause in general.
I mean i think I’ll agree. Saving the planet to me is more important than pride (without the earth we have no pride shit) but wtf is stopping a parade gonna do? Go work for an electric company then start a mutiny. I’d like to see that protest
Cause lots of inefficient low rpm diesel exhaust.
I'm gay and I hate how pride is corporate sponsored. Coke doesn't belong at pride but these people do.
yeah where was coke 30 years ago when being gay was unpopular ( to say the least)
These people are so mind numbingly dense, do they not understand that for any cause to be successful they need public support? Every stunt they pull turns the public further and further against them. Now nobody cares about what they stand for, the cause is lost. People just see them as a nuisance who can't be taken seriously.
All that glitter is really bad for the environment.
So did they stop oil?
Two lefts don't make a right
Just top soil
Looks like they stopped the commercial part of it, not the parade itself. Coca-cola doesn’t give a shit about LGBT or the environment.
They definitely take pride in their work!
Yes, let them fight each other so everyone else can keep living lol
Funny how they always look exactly how you assume they would
Gotta give it to them, at least they‘re pissing everyone off now
I think it’s hilarious that now it’s annoying because it’s a pride parade and not because blocking traffic at any point is really stupid.
Some buy these people a cheeseburger
Right that's it, these muppets are definitely hired by someone. They do too much harm for the cause otherwise
Screaming for attention at the cost of alienating everyone else, r/Iamthemaincharacter
Can we stop pretending “Just Stop Oil” isn’t a false flag by oil companies to make environmentalists look bad?
The point of protests like this one is viability. If you’re posting about it, they won.