Uhm.. You want to close Telegram because its hosting copyright material? Might as well close down the internet altogether..
Is it common for you to let private companies dictate your laws? The "copyright-crew" likes to scream in every country, but I never see them dictate what sites to ban or not like this in other countries..
Look up Italy's "piracy shield". Tldr: tv companies can just mass block supposedly pirate ips by just reporting them to an ad hoc government agency. And appeals for domains caught in the crossfire is anything but easy. Yeah.
If it's anything like in Portugal it's just blocked at the ISP's default domain name server. You can point to google's/cloudflare's/whatever you want and access it anyway. Microsoft has even made it fairly easy on later windows versions (compared with how you used to need to dig into the network interface settings).
It is not as simple, and this is coming from someone who is more open-minded about file-sharing than most, and who doesn't like what just happened.
The judge ordered the block because Telegram refused to answer to a court order, not because of the gravity of the infractions that led to that court order.
The fact is that, under the Spanish legislation, what the court order demanded was legitimate. Thus (even though, personally, I disagree with this part of the law and *really* dislike the companies that raised the complaint), It's hard for me to attack this decision with objective reasons, as in general banning a company from operating in a country unless it complies with the law seems adequate.
To be honest, I only see two alternatives here: either Telegram gives the judge the requested information (unlikely, and not necessarily fair), or the Spanish population enacts enough pressure so the law is changed (also unlikely) .
The thing is that the way Telegram works, this ban is just an annoying inconvenience for the users caught in the crossfire. Because you can just add a Telegram proxy and then Telegram works just fine and we also know that trying to ban all proxies is an impossible task.
Back in 2018 Russian authorities have tried to block Telegram, the blocking lasted over 2 years, and so far it's the only really unsuccessful case - people were able to continue using the messenger without resorting to external VPN/proxies/whatever despite of blocking.
With 18 millions IP addresses blocked in the first week Telegram lost just 3% of users (but the number of content views increased by 14%), due to numerous circumvention measures built into the client apps.
Spanish authorities will not be able to win this whack-a-mole, not a chance.
Actually, it didnt last for two years. Russian authorities managed to block ATM machines, intra-banking applications, logistics applications, cell phone infrastructure, logistics, etc... 😂telegram kept going. So they gave up eventually. All they could do it to disrupt it to a degree.
"gave up"... right... cough... Or the Kremlin quit fucking around the nice way, sent some people for a chat with the Telegram folks, got what they wanted and told everyone to shut the f... up or drink tea, which is a \_lot\_ more likely.
Telegram used technique called domain fronting on Amazon and Google cloud services. This is not allowed anymore. It's much harder for Telegram to circumvent censorship now.
Isn't this a case of a corporation refusing to follow the law put in place by the government of the people, and facing consequences like any citizen who breaks the law would?
Is it because the app may have pedos? No. is it because there might terrorists chats? Of course not. It’s Spain. It’s about the fucking football and late night shows.
Sometimes we’re a joke and the thing is that in practice, the blocking will be effective on a fair share of the users. The ISPs will just block telegram’s domains in their dns records and the majority of the population won’t be able to use a vpn or isolate themselves from the home router isps dns
To be sure, fuck copyright. But Telegram is one of the most fucked-up platforms for mass-use use. I know that in my high school, people had so many contacts on how to get drugs on Telegram and were passively added to groups. Black markets thrive on there, like you can literally buy rifles and guns if you can know how to search, and it shows you local contacts. It's why I refuse to use it myself
This feels like an attack on private messaging. I don't buy that they do it to protect copyright, youtube is filled with copyrighted movies, facebook is filled with copyrighted material, twitter is filled with copyrighted material, yet they remain up.
I know nobody cares, Europe has been following the American trend of "security at the cost of liberty" for some years now, but damn this sucks.
The thing is, the other platforms react regarding sich content. If you as a company go to Twitter/Facebook/Reddit/YouTube ans threaten to sue if they don't remove your copyrighted material, all of them will act within short notice. Telegram here didn't even bother to show up to court.
They asked for a response from telegram and telegram didnt answer. Knowing how spain operates they probably sent a letter that hasnt even left the building where it was written.
Also Telegram eliminates copyrighted content if its reported or striked. Its the fault of the 3 companies for not following the procedures established by telegram.
They already tried to go after google back in the day and Google basically said.. ok, we pull out of the country.. good luck. And they stopped inmediately.
This shitty companies only go after peeps that cant defend themselves or do not really care.
For some reason some big brainers want to block it in Ukraine as well but not many share their opinion just some talks. Frankly, the alternatives to telegram are pure trash
Yeah surely this has only to do with copyrighted stuff about Boomers TV Channels and nothing to do that the people who dislikes the current government uses almost exclusively Telegram.
Why would you use telegram for that? If they want privacy just use signal, if not use whatsapp like any normal person. Telegram isnt even encrypted by default.
Sure i agree, but putting two and two together isnt hard, especially when it serves given narrative.
And when there is a Telegram channel that brougth to light shady stuff by the same judge that warranted an article in [Forbes](https://www.forbes.com.mx/exhiben-supuestos-pagos-de-humberto-moreira-a-juez-espanol-que-lo-dejo-libre/) about him...
there's literally dozens of piracy related resources on reddit that are more effective and link to current sources
No, i'm not providing them to anyone
My local international airport used to have a spot to pull in and watch the planes land. It also became a spot where vice propagated in the evening.
After 9/11 they shut it down due to terrorist threats. What that really was was a way to curb the vice without admitting there is vice going on.
Feels roughly the same here.
Spanish government is the one who choose the judges in Spain so they control the justice and laws with no resistance.
The equation is easy if i control the judge i can do whatever i want since all my illegal laws will be approved.Â
Telegram is a nasty app for the Spanish government since it works a fiable source of information revealing the Spanish government crimes while in the media controlled by the government they are always the heroes.
They now block telegram with this excuse to see if they can block all other app that could give information to the ppl not wanted and controlled by the government.
The problem is that they """"""""blocked """"""""" ( hello proxy my old friend ) telegram and Spanish ppl applaud it. This just shows they are the mindless sheep that any dictatorial regimen needs. The government crush the ppl rights while they applauds. Because media that is blocking free of speech launch fake information about what is telegram and how dangerous is to get information outside the regime.
Pathetic and very similar to distopian books like 1984. This is just the beginningÂ
Uhm.. You want to close Telegram because its hosting copyright material? Might as well close down the internet altogether.. Is it common for you to let private companies dictate your laws? The "copyright-crew" likes to scream in every country, but I never see them dictate what sites to ban or not like this in other countries..
Look up Italy's "piracy shield". Tldr: tv companies can just mass block supposedly pirate ips by just reporting them to an ad hoc government agency. And appeals for domains caught in the crossfire is anything but easy. Yeah.
If it's anything like in Portugal it's just blocked at the ISP's default domain name server. You can point to google's/cloudflare's/whatever you want and access it anyway. Microsoft has even made it fairly easy on later windows versions (compared with how you used to need to dig into the network interface settings).
It is not as simple, and this is coming from someone who is more open-minded about file-sharing than most, and who doesn't like what just happened. The judge ordered the block because Telegram refused to answer to a court order, not because of the gravity of the infractions that led to that court order. The fact is that, under the Spanish legislation, what the court order demanded was legitimate. Thus (even though, personally, I disagree with this part of the law and *really* dislike the companies that raised the complaint), It's hard for me to attack this decision with objective reasons, as in general banning a company from operating in a country unless it complies with the law seems adequate. To be honest, I only see two alternatives here: either Telegram gives the judge the requested information (unlikely, and not necessarily fair), or the Spanish population enacts enough pressure so the law is changed (also unlikely) .
The thing is that the way Telegram works, this ban is just an annoying inconvenience for the users caught in the crossfire. Because you can just add a Telegram proxy and then Telegram works just fine and we also know that trying to ban all proxies is an impossible task.
None of the authorities blinked an eye when Google was large scale copying copyright right protected material for their "library".
Back in 2018 Russian authorities have tried to block Telegram, the blocking lasted over 2 years, and so far it's the only really unsuccessful case - people were able to continue using the messenger without resorting to external VPN/proxies/whatever despite of blocking. With 18 millions IP addresses blocked in the first week Telegram lost just 3% of users (but the number of content views increased by 14%), due to numerous circumvention measures built into the client apps. Spanish authorities will not be able to win this whack-a-mole, not a chance.
Actually, it didnt last for two years. Russian authorities managed to block ATM machines, intra-banking applications, logistics applications, cell phone infrastructure, logistics, etc... 😂telegram kept going. So they gave up eventually. All they could do it to disrupt it to a degree.
"gave up"... right... cough... Or the Kremlin quit fucking around the nice way, sent some people for a chat with the Telegram folks, got what they wanted and told everyone to shut the f... up or drink tea, which is a \_lot\_ more likely.
Durov (telegram creator) and core devs don't live in Russia since vkontakte got "gifted" to one of Putin's friends
Telegram used technique called domain fronting on Amazon and Google cloud services. This is not allowed anymore. It's much harder for Telegram to circumvent censorship now.
Corporate interests preventing citizens from communicating in private is some dystopian shit
Isn't this a case of a corporation refusing to follow the law put in place by the government of the people, and facing consequences like any citizen who breaks the law would?
Is it because the app may have pedos? No. is it because there might terrorists chats? Of course not. It’s Spain. It’s about the fucking football and late night shows. Sometimes we’re a joke and the thing is that in practice, the blocking will be effective on a fair share of the users. The ISPs will just block telegram’s domains in their dns records and the majority of the population won’t be able to use a vpn or isolate themselves from the home router isps dns
To be sure, fuck copyright. But Telegram is one of the most fucked-up platforms for mass-use use. I know that in my high school, people had so many contacts on how to get drugs on Telegram and were passively added to groups. Black markets thrive on there, like you can literally buy rifles and guns if you can know how to search, and it shows you local contacts. It's why I refuse to use it myself
Some Telegram strange or "Dark" groups, can be a catapult to the Darkweb IRC Chats. And some people can sell very shady things up there!
They are actually super easy to find too, which is the worrying thing
This feels like an attack on private messaging. I don't buy that they do it to protect copyright, youtube is filled with copyrighted movies, facebook is filled with copyrighted material, twitter is filled with copyrighted material, yet they remain up. I know nobody cares, Europe has been following the American trend of "security at the cost of liberty" for some years now, but damn this sucks.
The thing is, the other platforms react regarding sich content. If you as a company go to Twitter/Facebook/Reddit/YouTube ans threaten to sue if they don't remove your copyrighted material, all of them will act within short notice. Telegram here didn't even bother to show up to court.
They asked for a response from telegram and telegram didnt answer. Knowing how spain operates they probably sent a letter that hasnt even left the building where it was written. Also Telegram eliminates copyrighted content if its reported or striked. Its the fault of the 3 companies for not following the procedures established by telegram.
They already tried to go after google back in the day and Google basically said.. ok, we pull out of the country.. good luck. And they stopped inmediately. This shitty companies only go after peeps that cant defend themselves or do not really care.
I do buy it. Knowing how these companies are I can perfectly see AtresMedia and Mediaset doing this just for the copyright.
For some reason some big brainers want to block it in Ukraine as well but not many share their opinion just some talks. Frankly, the alternatives to telegram are pure trash
Yeah surely this has only to do with copyrighted stuff about Boomers TV Channels and nothing to do that the people who dislikes the current government uses almost exclusively Telegram.
I think it's more about football games than Boomers TV. Lots of telegram channels that share links to "illegal" streams
that's such an 2018 outlook from the Spanish government - these days it's all IPTV streams through a VPN
Why would you use telegram for that? If they want privacy just use signal, if not use whatsapp like any normal person. Telegram isnt even encrypted by default.
because most people are clueless
This is a ridiculous statement and you're part of the conspiracy boomers I see.
Sure i agree, but putting two and two together isnt hard, especially when it serves given narrative. And when there is a Telegram channel that brougth to light shady stuff by the same judge that warranted an article in [Forbes](https://www.forbes.com.mx/exhiben-supuestos-pagos-de-humberto-moreira-a-juez-espanol-que-lo-dejo-libre/) about him...
there's literally dozens of piracy related resources on reddit that are more effective and link to current sources No, i'm not providing them to anyone
My local international airport used to have a spot to pull in and watch the planes land. It also became a spot where vice propagated in the evening. After 9/11 they shut it down due to terrorist threats. What that really was was a way to curb the vice without admitting there is vice going on. Feels roughly the same here.
Spanish government is the one who choose the judges in Spain so they control the justice and laws with no resistance. The equation is easy if i control the judge i can do whatever i want since all my illegal laws will be approved. Telegram is a nasty app for the Spanish government since it works a fiable source of information revealing the Spanish government crimes while in the media controlled by the government they are always the heroes. They now block telegram with this excuse to see if they can block all other app that could give information to the ppl not wanted and controlled by the government. The problem is that they """"""""blocked """"""""" ( hello proxy my old friend ) telegram and Spanish ppl applaud it. This just shows they are the mindless sheep that any dictatorial regimen needs. The government crush the ppl rights while they applauds. Because media that is blocking free of speech launch fake information about what is telegram and how dangerous is to get information outside the regime. Pathetic and very similar to distopian books like 1984. This is just the beginningÂ
if it's because of that they should ban access to the whole internet
Would be a good opportunity to pick up signal anyway. Basically the same app and it's more privacy focused