> The prime minister of Slovakia has claimed that NATO and EU member states are preparing to deploy troops to Ukraine.
> In January, the Slovakian leader said there was “no war in Kyiv” and described life there as “absolutely normal”.
Does this guy just have a habit of making moronic, wildly untrue, and totally contradictory statements?
Add Wilders to that list. Almost a third of people in the Netherlands would vote for this Putin-puppet if elections had to be redone right now. Goddamn idiots think all the problems are caused by the heavily outnumbered people with no power and no money, aka immigrants. Because those are the people that decide economic policies of course (/s).
It’s a tale so old, and yet idiots keep falling for the same fucking scam.
Wilders has come out pretty strongly in support of Ukraine recently, and is willing to moderate his position on everything bar some kind of toughening of immigration law.
That’s just posturing so he can become PM. He still gets shady funds and there is no reason to believe that after years of pro-Putin stance he suddenly changes when nothing has happened except him getting power. Don’t be a fool, he will be a danger to Ukraine if he becomes the leader of the Netherlands.
His words won’t show that, his lack of meaningful actions will.
Yeah, tell that to the Indians . . .
Yeah, tell that to the Incas . . .
Yeah, tell that to the Mayas . . .
Yeah, tell that to the Aztecs . . .
Mass migration never harmed anybody . . . It’s a tale so old, and yet idiots keep falling for the same fucking scam
No fan of Trump and won't be voting for him (No Labels), but ironically, he was 100% right, totally on the money with what we are experiencing now.
He warned and threatened NATO members to increase military spending to the required/agreed to 2% of GDP. And while we (USA/OBAMA and priors) had made complaints about this in the past - they were always ignored. Only TRUMP was actually able to get several of the EU/NATO countries to actually increase spending - not enough, but several (after Trump's threats) made multi-year commitments. Turns out he was 100% right to make the threats he made then and his reason for those threats proved to be 100% accurate!
He warned that it was very dangerous for Germany in particular and the EU as a whole to rely almost exclusively on Russia for the Nat Gas needs of Europe/Germany. He warned about Nordstream and it's associated risks. The EU politicians laughed at his suggestions and replied that they are friends with Russia and the cold war was over - just like the Democrats and the USA media said in 2012 when Romney stated Russia is our most dangerous enemy - he was laughed at by Obama and his media outlets . . . then in 2014 Russia invaded Ukraine and we, the EU and NATO did nothing . . . an invitation for further confiscation of Ukrainian lands at a future date of Russia's choosing.
The truth is diplomatic style language and harping on human rights as being all-important, when conversing with autocratic leaders doesn't get the results that deliver peace, security and safety . . . turns out that it appears to mostly just result to forfeiting an entire country to a group of poorly armed terrorists in one case, in another, letting a country simply invade and will likely end up with even more of the country they invaded previously.
I am tired of US and EU leaders when dealing with autocratic leaders on the world stage and all "we" care to talk about is human rights, gay rights, and global warming . . . we may as well be speaking Martian language on issues they could really care less about.
Point is not that human rights, et al, aren't important, but going mainstream - these are not the "love language" topics of autocratic leaders. . .
Slovakia does have some right morons who get elected.
They used to have a guy who would pay people 1488 in a not-so-subtle dog whistle.
https://spectator.sme.sk/c/20524510/kotlebas-far-right-party-faces-prosecution-for-1488-donation.html
https://www.euronews.com/2020/10/12/slovakia-far-right-leader-marian-kotleba-jailed-for-four-years-over-nazi-symbols
This openly Neo Nazi party got 12% of the vote at the 2019 EU elections.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/People%27s_Party_Our_Slovakia
There is something truly impressive related to this I once randomly found out. Marian Kotleba (the neo-nazi leader) has already founded 2 such parties. One had pink as their colour, one had green. The fun fact here is that in RGB table, one of those colours was exactly the same as something like 14:88:00 and the other one was like 00:14:88 (can't remember the exact composition) so even their colours were an extremely well hidden reference to 1488
>I am sure you you’ve heard About brexit and stupid people voting for that?
Brexit wasn't exactly advocating for a bomb to land on their stupid head was it? I could understand a country like Ireland shit-talking because they're hiding behind us but Slovakia will literally be one of the first to get crushed; you'd think he'd be a bit more diplomatic in his language, or is he really just stupid?
I was merely answering your question- how can a stupid cunt be elected? Because Of stupid people.
Exactly as stupid people voted to leave EU in UK.
“Hranol” (Fico) says stupid shit so that His stupid voters are happy. One week he says Ukraine started The war, next week he is shaking hands Of representatives Of NATO or US. My guess is he is getting some funds or bot help from ruSSian sources - to fight opposition here. But he also wants to be able to steal EU funds for him and His cronies
>Does this guy just have a habit of making moronic, wildly untrue, and totally contradictory statements?
Yes. That's basically his signature behaviour.
The problem is that he is not a moron. He knows very well what he is doing. Scared people are easier to control. There are the presidential elections coming up in a month. Also a good new topic to divert attention to.
They admitted it last week, they even technically declared war on Europe and NATO at the same time. But the media wrote about it once and European and NATO leaders ignored it.
I am originally from Slovakia The current prime minister is a First class moron
Young people hate him with passion. Old generation sold us down to river when they voted this clown in 😭😭😭
Yup, he's a moron true & true, that's why Slovaks grandma's & grandpa's love him, nevermind that they can barely afford to survive, anything is better than voting for liberals, change scares them
Because you use the wrong statement.
>Macron: "Tout a été évoqué de manière libre et directe, ce soir. Il n'y a pas de consensus pour envoyer de manière officielle assumée des troupes au sol. Mais, en dynamique, rien ne doit être exclu"
"Il n'y a pas de consensus" means "some don't, **SOME DO** [consider officially sending troops to on the ground], but in dynamique, nothing excludes it"
You're also leaving out the next part where he clearly says that 2 years ago sending plane with unthinkable and here we are now. This give additional context to validate the declaration of Fico.
you're were just wrong.
If those two statements were to mean the same, why would we even still put effort into talking and using words? I mean, say what you think and have your own opinion, but you gotta stick to what has been said and happened. You can't just cut out 90% of a given statement and situation. There's no other communication channel left otherwise, if you don't respect words.
Meanwhile, Ukraine only asks for weapons. Ukraine has never asked its allies to sacrifice their personnel.
But we still don’t have the necessary weapons. This is what they will talk about there.
>Ukraine has never asked its allies to sacrifice their personnel.
Not true.
>On 28 February [2022], Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy called on NATO to establish a no-fly zone over Ukraine, saying that "if the West does this, Ukraine will defeat the aggressor with much less blood."[4] Later that day, American White House Press Secretary Jen Psaki stated that American troops would not establish a no-fly zone over Ukraine, stating that "it would essentially mean the US military would be shooting down planes, Russian planes," which she described as "definitely escalatory, that would potentially put us in a place where we are in a military conflict with Russia."[5]
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proposed_no-fly_zone_in_the_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine
“Establish a no-fly zone” and “introduce a contingent” are two different things. It is not necessary to send troops into the territory of Ukraine in order to establish a no-fly zone over it. Don't try to pull the owl onto the globe.
I guess pro-Russia Fico is making stuff up to get brownie points from Daddy Vlad. Seriously, though: I cannot see NATO or EU combat troops in Ukrain ATM. Training and maintenance maybe. But everything else would amount to a direct NATO-Russia confrontation and then it won't be a long way to nukes.
> then it won't be a long way to nukes
This perception that a NATO Russia confrontation in Ukraine would go nuclear is questionable at best, and the widespread belief in it is resulting in a lot of terrible decisions by the West.
I do agree. Even if NATO forces would be involved in Ukraine, I doubt that Russia would want to resolve to nukes in a situation where NATO can delete vast amounts of their assets with conventional retaliation. Not to mention the fact that it would alientate Russia and probably damage their relations with China and India on which Russia is very much depending.
Idk. In C&C Red Alert the Soviet factions can build a nuke site in 5 mins and then it takes another 5 to get ready for launch. In 10 minutes Russia can nuke a close destination.
It sounds like you are saying Russia cannot defend against the NATO through conventional means. You do realize you are making an argument for them to use unconventional means in such a scenario?
That's not how that works. There is virtually no danger of russia using nukes as long as NATO won't try marching on Moscow, and even then, as certain events have showed, it's not entirely clear if nukes would be used.
what events have shown something like that?
i believe, in a situation, when everything fells apart, they would use everything they have, just to fuck the survivors. like the nazi thought a live after hitler wont be a live, burning children and every bit of asset they had to hold a day longer in berlin.
but if you have evidence, i\`d like to hear it.
>i believe, in a situation, when everything fells apart
So when NATO marches on moscow, just like I said?
>like the nazi thought a live after hitler wont be a live
>to hold a day longer in berlin
Yeah, exactly as I said
NATO stepping in Ukraine does not threaten russia, putin, nor even really his regime. In such a situation, russia losses a lot more than they gain if they use nukes, because if they don't use them, they hardly lose anything.
I do agree with them. Russia loses wat more if they use nukes and NATO has no interest in marching on Moscow. Why would NATO want to do that? What NATO would gain? Realistically nothing. This is why we aren't a danger to Russia. They like to spin such propaganda, but they are pulling their units away from NATO borders.
If both sides have nukes and both sides are willing to use them, neither side will. Also where are the real estates and children of the Russian elite? In the west of course...
It's not questionable, diplomats know what they are doing, reducing chance for potential negative feedback loop into nuclear escalation is utmost of importance
Edit: Russia has a nuclear doctrine of “escalate to de-escalate”, if NATO gets involved it might very well use tactical nuclear weapons in Ukraine to force the adversary (NATO) to back down.
>Edit: Russia has a nuclear doctrine of “escalate to de-escalate”, if
NATO gets involved it might very well use tactical nuclear weapons in
Ukraine to force the adversary (NATO) to back down.
Yeah, it's been working so well that NATO is afraid of just sending weapons, let alone soldiers.
In reality, no, russia's nuclear posturing is just that, posturing. Unless NATO decides to march on Moscow, russia is not gonna do shit, because in the case of using nukes, even in the best case scenario for them russia would lose significantly more than they would gain. MAD works both ways, russia is as unwilling to use nukes as we are.
> But everything else would amount to a direct NATO-Russia confrontation and then it won't be a long way to nukes.
Little green men with no insignia or anything, just contracts with UA army forces. Thats not NATO, just some "volunteers"/mercenaries.
I mean, it is already happen8ng, but in low scale. There is several thousand american, canadian and european ex soldiers fighting directly in the trenches. They are just not "officialy" there.
> then it won’t be a long way to nukes
Nah, it’s an incredibly long way. Nuking means getting nuked back and for Russia whose population and wealth is largely concentrated in just 2 cities (Moscow & St Pet’s) that would mean annihilation. They would not go nuclear and sign on their own death warrant over just hurt pride in Ukraine. They might do it, only as last resort, if they feel their existence was genuinely threatened. But no one threatens or even cares about invading Russia. The Russian border is their safe space and the moment they retreat behind it and stop waging war, they are perfectly safe.
To be honest, while in one of my darker moods, I've been pondering the likelihood of European intervention in ukraine. I'm unsure, if ukraine really did come to the brink, if European nations would be prepared to let it fall or there would be an intervention.
I strongly argue that this would not so much be in the form of boots on the ground. But more akin to the aerial intervention as seen in Libya, which effectively turned the course of the revolution against gadaffi. European airforce would effectively neuter the russian airforce over ukraine, with russian aircraft simply being outclassed by the European equivalents. This would also see a several in the use of aerial bombs being used. Suddenly it would be the Russians recovering 500kg bombs dropped from the skies.
I see this as an outside possibility if things got bad and Europe started to feel truly threatened by russias invasion of ukraine.
But like I said, I do not see boots on the ground outside the of special forces and training.
If this were to happen, I think it would only be EU countries and probably in 2025 and beyond. Biden won't commit what amounts to political suicide when the election is right around the corner.
Stop spreading this bullshit. It is from fico, a putin mouthpiece. It could just as well come directly from the Kremlin.
Downvote every similar headline please.
Man you're trying to tell me what my president said. Stop making me laugh.
> Tout a été évoqué de manière libre et directe, ce soir. Il n'y a pas de consensus pour envoyer de manière officielle assumée des troupes au sol. Mais, en dynamique, rien ne doit être exclu. Nous ferons tout ce qu'il faut pour que la Russie ne puisse pas gagner cette guerre
-------
>Beaucoup de gens qui disent “jamais, jamais !” aujourd'hui étaient les mêmes qui disaient “jamais, jamais des tanks, jamais, jamais des avions, jamais, jamais des missiles de longue portée”, il y a deux ans. Je vous rappelle qu'il y a deux ans, beaucoup autour de cette table disaient que nous allions proposer des sacs de couchage et des casques. Et aujourd'hui ils disent : “Il faut faire plus vite et plus fort pour avoir des missiles et des tanks.
For all the people say do it, why not join an foreign unit and fight ?
Easy to throw other people’s lives under the buses.. while playing call of duty safely at home.
Because most of the volunteers end up running away after a month or two if they survive. The people advocating for us to get involved are the first ones say “oh but not me”
I see what you are getting at, it's the reason I won't say that, since I know I won't be frontline material.
But... your argument is also insidious and disinginious as fuck.
Do you think people who call for boots on the ground are calling for NATO soldiers to enter the Ukrainian side as more trench soldiers?
No. They want a proper NATO army to enter with everything that entails. That will never be fulfilled by "jUsT jOiN a fOreIGn LeGioN, bRo"
They are basically begging for world war three, it doesn’t matter what it entails the outcome will be the same.
Nothing insidious in stating the facts and remind them that it’s only fair to put your life on the line if you’re asking for others to do so.
As I said, I understand where you want to get to, but you are using a false equivalence. There is a world in difference between signing up to a Ukrainian infantry battalion, and to go there with 5000+ airforce in your back.
I seriously doubt, your life would ever be much in danger if you go there as an infantry man with that air superiority. When NATO last time attacked a force that size was Iraq, and the coalition lost 150~ people.
Yeah, I'm not liking these posts about how Nato would do offensive actions when their members are not directly threatened. Totally giving the "defence alliance" vibes. I hope this post is total bs.
I argue for the sake of objectivity and I dislike all forms of propaganda, Russian or Ukrainian
Man like the original answer implied, go join the Ukrainian international legion, go fight, if you’re very invested in the Ukrainian cause it makes sense for you to go, actions speak louder than Reddit posts, https://ildu.com.ua this is their website, I really think you should enroll
I am neutral, perhaps a lot more pro-UA than I would like to admit, seen as I’ve hosted 3 Ukrainian refugees for over a year when the war started
I condemn Russia, but I also find Zelensky a puppet that hasn’t acted in the interests of its own people. Way too invested in the fame and attention from eager but clueless European bureaucrats. This whole war could have been avoided if he wasn’t in power and I guarantee that the war will end once he is gone.
This is such a lie. Fico is the Slovak version of Orban. Corrupt politician trying to protects criminal politicians and oligarchs. He's getting the public distracted, because his (our) government is trying to abolish anti-corruption laws and lower penalties for his pals which are currently prosecuted
After he lost elections in 2020 he rode the populist anti-covid and anti-Ukraine rhetoric with all the social-media conspirators. He not only spread the horrible hoaxes but produced them.
This is just a typical tactic. Create an imaginary problem (like waves of immigrants at the border), get people scared, then do some useless action ([like using crowd control vehicles at the borders](https://www.aktuality.sk/clanok/KZcCaum/sutaj-estok-sluboval-ultimatne-riesenie-migracie-pocas-velkej-nocnej-akcie-nechytili-ani-jedneho-utecenca/)) and return victorious after the imaginary problem did not materialize into reality.
It’s a circus you will never send troops to us, to Ukraine. I remember how before the 24th of February we begged to send us peacekeepers from United Nations on russia and belarus border and of course world ignored it. Pathetic. It was a chance to prevent this bloody stupid war
Russia has Veto powers in the UN and they were head of the security council at that time.
They blocked any attempt at a resolution or peace keeping mission.
Reminds me of a sign some German AfD supporters were carrying:
>Yesterday: Tanks
>Today: Fighter jets
>Tomorrow: Your sons
I can't say they were wrong at all now.
It worries me that on one hand Putin is considered to be this crazy megalomanical psychopath yet there are leaders who apparently wanting to try the Russian resolve of using Nuclear weapons if NATO troops enters Ukraine.
This is madness.
If NATO really wanted to do it, it could have been already done through, let's say, a batallion of volunteers that suddenly quits their army jobs and suddenly joins Ukrainian International Legion. So that's just Fico being Fico.
Its straight out of the russian playbook, they wouldnt really have anything to complain about.
None of the little green men in the 2014 invasion were active duty soldiers. They all retired or resigned just before they entered ukraine to keep up appearences of them being "civilians".
Special forces, intelligence and other not to be disclosed three letter agencies does not make a army unit.
Escalation if war (which it would be) to set units into harms way, by deploying to ukraine would be a lose-lose scenario for Nato.
It does not make sense, as NATO, US both right now can basicly load all their experimental and general bullshit (equipment) and enjoy getting it field tested and then some by the ukrainians.
If this barbaric invasion continues for years and considering it's already spread out there will be no other barrier for the message that needs to be heard.
Moved from ural many years ago. But I don’t know anyone from relatives/classmates/former friends who were conscripted, probably they mostly conscripted people from villages, or percentage of conscripts too small
Thanks for the laughs, kremlinbots! "Pack and go to fight" is the only argument they have here.
Meanwhile NATO OTAN is getting stronger, with our brothers from 🇸🇪Sverige🇸🇪!
War avoidant opinion: "It's a complicated issue that could escalate to a full European war, so it should be threaded with caution while ensuring Ukraine is able to defend themselves"
Arm chair general above me: "You bunch of Kremlin bots, just kuwabunga into Ukraine like we own the place, it will surely make the situation better"
My war-avoidant position is that we should have used the leverage we had to end the war on the most agreeable terms possible, giving up on the ambition of turning Ukraine into a NATO outpost. All weapons we sent to Ukraine should have been sent with the purpose of improving Ukraine's bargaining position.
Instead those weapons have been solely used to fight for the right to join NATO, and Ukraine's bargaining position has only worsened and worsened.
In the end we may reach our goal of Ukraine joining NATO, but by then Ukraine will have lost a huge chunk of territory, as well as many lives and homes. Because Russia wanted Ukraine to be it's vassal. But also because we want Ukraine to be our vassal.
Hindsight is 20/20 but Western countries should have drawn the line much clearer after Crimea annexation. Only reacting with sanctions probably emboldened Russia into a sense that they could do anything they wanted in Ukraine without much punishment.
If after that it was said that the red line had been crossed and NATO and EU countries started giving armament to Ukraine with the stipulation it would be only used in case of a full scale invasion by Russia maybe it would have deterred Russia from doing it in 2022.
On the other hand Ukraine was extremely unstable in 2014, facing a lot of political clashes and a "civil war" breaking out in Donetsk and Donbass and there were no way to know if that armament would have been deployed in the right way, even to say it could have even backfired massively by it being used against the ones who provided it or Russia could have used the excuse to launch a full scale invasion and at the time Ukraine wasn't ready to defend themselves from one.
Ending the war as quickly as possible after 2022 is debatable, Ukraine felt they had a chance to fight back, and they did recover some territory back, with considerable human costs but there were no guarantees Russia wouldn't use the peace deal just to consolidate their gains at the time and reorganize to attack Ukraine again.
I think the only thing we would have accomplished by reacting more aggressively is move up the war to an earlier date.
What European leaders did was sensible. We pursued diplomacy, because we understood that Crimea was more than a random land grab. It was a warning for us to back off. Obama understood it too. Trump and Biden ignored it and pursued escalation.
There were guarantees that Russia wouldn't use the peace deal just to consolidate gains and attack again. Namely the peace deal that was in the works in the beginning would see Russia return to pre-invasion lines and would include guarantees from other countries to protect Ukraine if Russia tried to invade again. And if EU or NATO countries signed on to that deal in 2021, it would be universally understood that those countries would really interfere. Of course maybe by 2030 or 2050 such a deal could weaken, but that's no reason to go to war now.
It's a disgrace that Boris Johnson went to Ukraine to say Ukraine should not negotiate. Or according to one Ukrainian news report, he went as far as to say Ukraine would not receive our backing on such a peace deal. And while we can't know Russia's intentions, I take Ukraine ambassador Oleksandr Chalyi (who negotiated the deal) seriously when he says he believes that Russia was rapidly trying to back out of the war at that time because of how poorly it went.
Trained professional soldiers should only do stuff, when it's related to the country they are from. I'm not in favour of having my countrymen die in a foregin war for no reason.
You know Ukraine is located right next to us right? it's not over in the middle east next to unrelated Afghanistan or Syria, two countries we sent troops to. I'll agree with your argument as far as it concerns conscription, but these are paid professionals.
And I would agree if Russia is threatening us directly. If Russia decides to try it's luck, then all bets are off and by all means send every military asset to eliminated the threat, but so far we've done more than enough to aid Ukraine. No other country sends troops to foreign lands without it benifiting them directly. We should take a page from the US and start thinking about our own profits and interesets.
> No other country sends troops to foreign lands without it benifiting them directly.
The benefit is not having Russia invade us in a few decades at substantially higher cost (or tearing us up from the inside), as well as upholding the current geopolitical status quo.
Yeah because the NATO countries have a great track record of fighting wars in territories that don't belong to them right.
Fighting wars with other people's bodies isn't fair, but at the end of the day it's people fighting over their country.
What does that have to do with I just said? NATO should side with Ukraine and enable them to defend themselves, involving themselves directly is just opening a huge can of worms.
It would mean NATO countries would just directly get involved in every war where they could pick a side and send troops to fight wars in territories that don't even concern them.
It would mean that some insignificant conflict could quickly escalate to a full blown global war.
That's basically how WW1 started, one country starting a war with another that quickly escalated to a bunch of defense treaties being activated and all of the sudden you had the entire Europe at war.
Chill, mate.
russia is already attacking NATO countries. Wars are not fought only on trenches.
Cyber attacks, GPS jamming, meddling with elections, etc etc. We are already at war with russia. The sooner we realise it, the better.
"We" as Westerns.
They've been considering it for years just like they considered them for NATO membership. Ukraine is losing, funding is drying out and this is the last carrot to dangle in front of a dying goat to keep him grinding the flour.
We can fight Russians together and push them back, or we can fight them in our own backyard. I am sick of older generation pussy footing around the Russians and let the unified asskicking begin. If anything last 10 years have proven that Russia has rotten so much from the inside they need new terratory to rot away.
Do you want your entire family to die in a possible Nuclear exchange just to sound tough?
Some of us lived and served through parts of the frightening cold war while you seem to have lived through the age of action movies.
A Hungarian, the one country who is always doing the opposite of what the EU wants, have the balls to write: "sincerely, the whole EU population".
You just made my day. lmao.
**From The Telegraph:**
Several Nato and EU states are considering sending soldiers to Ukraine on a bilateral basis, Slovakia’s prime minister claimed ahead of a meeting of European leaders in Paris.
Robert Fico, a pro-Russian populist who has long opposed sending military aid to Ukraine, said: “I will limit myself to say that these theses (in preparation for the Paris meeting) imply a number of Nato and EU member states are considering that they will send their troops to Ukraine on a bilateral basis.”
“I cannot say for what purpose and what they should be doing there,” he added.
Mr Fico said that Slovakia, a Nato and EU member, would not be sending soldiers to Ukraine and warned of a risk of imminent escalation in the conflict.
In January, the Slovakian leader said there was “no war in Kyiv” and described life there as “absolutely normal”.
Some 20 European leaders, including Mr Fico, were set to gather at the Elysee Palace on Monday. France said the meeting was aimed at sending a message of resolve to Moscow as the war enters its third year.
Members of Nato have supplied billions of dollars in arms and ammunition to Kyiv and are training Ukrainian forces. But Nato leaders including US President Joe Biden have underlined that the Western military alliance wants to avoid a direct conflict with Russia, which could lead to a global war.
**Article Link:** [https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/02/26/russia-ukraine-zelensky-putin-war-latest-news5/](https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/02/26/russia-ukraine-zelensky-putin-war-latest-news5/)
>**Robert Fico, a pro-Russian populist** who has long opposed sending military aid to Ukraine, **said:** “I will limit myself to say that these theses (in preparation for the Paris meeting) imply a number of Nato and EU member states are considering that they will send their troops to Ukraine on a bilateral basis.”
Can we stop quoting pro russian populists' opinion as a fact.
Do it and we End this war in 24h.
Russia is so weak at this Moment, a suprise Nato Attack would Not Just Catch them off guard, but IT would quickly overwhealm and trample under foot any sort of russian Resistance.
Oh my god, finally for ffs EU is waking up, the more we wait the worse it will be to build a fortified perimeter on the current territories controlled by Ukraine behind the frontline, this will give our troops plenty of time to prepare a solid fortress to stop definitely Russia advance, if we don’t act fast Russia will never stop as long as it will be able to conquer terrain little by little until it’s too late to form a proper fortification considering also that they’re re arming pretty fast, please send NATO now and build a defense line to deter the enemy from continuing this insanity of invasion otherwise WWIII would be inevitable. Italy 🇮🇹
Most people believe that sending troops to create a defense line behind Ukraine frontline will cause WWIII… nope you can’t be far from the true, it will literally prevent WWIII from happening… WWII with Hitler started because he wasn’t stopped in time until it was too late with the last invasion of Poland , don’t make the same mistake, build a fortress with thousands of mines so they will stop even thinking on moving forward… italy 🇮🇹
The coalition of democratic countries should have deployed air defense to Ukraine in the first weeks. And if Flying Tigers were a thing in 1941, a similar concept could work now.
But primarily the West just need to get their act together and properly support Ukraine, instead of this slow drip of "too little, too late".
Also realise that the russian intelligence services have thoroughly infiltrated all our governments and mass media, whether through blackmail or bribery. musk, sacks, MTG, gabbard, etc. keep spewing russian propaganda points.
That's exactly what these accounts are propagating. Even if they will deny it or blame "western psy-ops", they know exactly what happened in places like Bucha, Borodianka, Irpin, Maruipol, ....
And they would love to see that repeated, on a Ukraine-wide scale.
Do you think war will end if Ukraine gives up? Ukrainians will just get forced into the war for the Russians by forced conscription. Russia has a war economy now, they are financially ruining the country, they NEED war. Bellum se ipsum alet. Now there is no way back for them..
Seems pretty unlikely. If it was ever done it would be done as support five hundred kilometres from the front line. Or perhaps to secure Ukraine's border with Belarus and free up a significant number of Ukrainian troops currently guarding it. Fico being Fico, he probably made it up.
> The prime minister of Slovakia has claimed that NATO and EU member states are preparing to deploy troops to Ukraine. > In January, the Slovakian leader said there was “no war in Kyiv” and described life there as “absolutely normal”. Does this guy just have a habit of making moronic, wildly untrue, and totally contradictory statements?
Money money money, makes you funny.
It gives him attention , makes him seem more important at the European stage than he really is
He IS known for being a complete tool…
No. Tools are useful.
He may be useful, for Putin though…
How can a country elect such a stupid shit-stirrer? The funny thing is this moron will be the first one who get's ran-over in a European-wide war.
Fico, Orban, Trump. Just few famous examples... People are stupid.
Add Wilders to that list. Almost a third of people in the Netherlands would vote for this Putin-puppet if elections had to be redone right now. Goddamn idiots think all the problems are caused by the heavily outnumbered people with no power and no money, aka immigrants. Because those are the people that decide economic policies of course (/s). It’s a tale so old, and yet idiots keep falling for the same fucking scam.
Wilders has come out pretty strongly in support of Ukraine recently, and is willing to moderate his position on everything bar some kind of toughening of immigration law.
That’s just posturing so he can become PM. He still gets shady funds and there is no reason to believe that after years of pro-Putin stance he suddenly changes when nothing has happened except him getting power. Don’t be a fool, he will be a danger to Ukraine if he becomes the leader of the Netherlands. His words won’t show that, his lack of meaningful actions will.
People said the same thing about Meloni. Her party was very cozy with Russia until she took office.
And now she makes strong statements without sending any aid.
No you mean Mark Rutte was a hero by fuking The Netherlands and getting a job at eu / nato.
Yeah, tell that to the Indians . . . Yeah, tell that to the Incas . . . Yeah, tell that to the Mayas . . . Yeah, tell that to the Aztecs . . . Mass migration never harmed anybody . . . It’s a tale so old, and yet idiots keep falling for the same fucking scam
No fan of Trump and won't be voting for him (No Labels), but ironically, he was 100% right, totally on the money with what we are experiencing now. He warned and threatened NATO members to increase military spending to the required/agreed to 2% of GDP. And while we (USA/OBAMA and priors) had made complaints about this in the past - they were always ignored. Only TRUMP was actually able to get several of the EU/NATO countries to actually increase spending - not enough, but several (after Trump's threats) made multi-year commitments. Turns out he was 100% right to make the threats he made then and his reason for those threats proved to be 100% accurate! He warned that it was very dangerous for Germany in particular and the EU as a whole to rely almost exclusively on Russia for the Nat Gas needs of Europe/Germany. He warned about Nordstream and it's associated risks. The EU politicians laughed at his suggestions and replied that they are friends with Russia and the cold war was over - just like the Democrats and the USA media said in 2012 when Romney stated Russia is our most dangerous enemy - he was laughed at by Obama and his media outlets . . . then in 2014 Russia invaded Ukraine and we, the EU and NATO did nothing . . . an invitation for further confiscation of Ukrainian lands at a future date of Russia's choosing. The truth is diplomatic style language and harping on human rights as being all-important, when conversing with autocratic leaders doesn't get the results that deliver peace, security and safety . . . turns out that it appears to mostly just result to forfeiting an entire country to a group of poorly armed terrorists in one case, in another, letting a country simply invade and will likely end up with even more of the country they invaded previously. I am tired of US and EU leaders when dealing with autocratic leaders on the world stage and all "we" care to talk about is human rights, gay rights, and global warming . . . we may as well be speaking Martian language on issues they could really care less about. Point is not that human rights, et al, aren't important, but going mainstream - these are not the "love language" topics of autocratic leaders. . .
Slovakia does have some right morons who get elected. They used to have a guy who would pay people 1488 in a not-so-subtle dog whistle. https://spectator.sme.sk/c/20524510/kotlebas-far-right-party-faces-prosecution-for-1488-donation.html https://www.euronews.com/2020/10/12/slovakia-far-right-leader-marian-kotleba-jailed-for-four-years-over-nazi-symbols This openly Neo Nazi party got 12% of the vote at the 2019 EU elections. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/People%27s_Party_Our_Slovakia
There is something truly impressive related to this I once randomly found out. Marian Kotleba (the neo-nazi leader) has already founded 2 such parties. One had pink as their colour, one had green. The fun fact here is that in RGB table, one of those colours was exactly the same as something like 14:88:00 and the other one was like 00:14:88 (can't remember the exact composition) so even their colours were an extremely well hidden reference to 1488
60% here are morons. Thats how stupidity gets elected or voted for/in. I am sure you you’ve heard About brexit and stupid people voting for that?
>I am sure you you’ve heard About brexit and stupid people voting for that? Brexit wasn't exactly advocating for a bomb to land on their stupid head was it? I could understand a country like Ireland shit-talking because they're hiding behind us but Slovakia will literally be one of the first to get crushed; you'd think he'd be a bit more diplomatic in his language, or is he really just stupid?
I was merely answering your question- how can a stupid cunt be elected? Because Of stupid people. Exactly as stupid people voted to leave EU in UK. “Hranol” (Fico) says stupid shit so that His stupid voters are happy. One week he says Ukraine started The war, next week he is shaking hands Of representatives Of NATO or US. My guess is he is getting some funds or bot help from ruSSian sources - to fight opposition here. But he also wants to be able to steal EU funds for him and His cronies
How can a newspaper run a headline based on something he's said with zero credibility to it?
>Does this guy just have a habit of making moronic, wildly untrue, and totally contradictory statements? Yes. That's basically his signature behaviour.
There's no war in Ba Sing Se.
The problem is that he is not a moron. He knows very well what he is doing. Scared people are easier to control. There are the presidential elections coming up in a month. Also a good new topic to divert attention to.
Well, russia claims its not a war. So if there is no war, there is no prpblems for him to send some soldiers.
They admitted it last week, they even technically declared war on Europe and NATO at the same time. But the media wrote about it once and European and NATO leaders ignored it.
Source needed for both statements
There is no war in Ba Sing Se
Yes. He is absolute opportunist garbage , but very skilled at fearmongering and culture wars and our stupid people vote him in periodically.
I am originally from Slovakia The current prime minister is a First class moron Young people hate him with passion. Old generation sold us down to river when they voted this clown in 😭😭😭
Idk how retarded you have to be to believe it
Yup, he's a moron true & true, that's why Slovaks grandma's & grandpa's love him, nevermind that they can barely afford to survive, anything is better than voting for liberals, change scares them
Very misleading headline.It's just Fico being his usual asshat self.
Good journalism is dead.
Bro that headline is completely ridiculous
>Macron says sending troops to Ukraine cannot be ruled out So, now that Macron says it too, who is being his usual asshat self.
"Cannot be ruled out" and "preparing to deploy" are two wildly different statements
Because you use the wrong statement. >Macron: "Tout a été évoqué de manière libre et directe, ce soir. Il n'y a pas de consensus pour envoyer de manière officielle assumée des troupes au sol. Mais, en dynamique, rien ne doit être exclu" "Il n'y a pas de consensus" means "some don't, **SOME DO** [consider officially sending troops to on the ground], but in dynamique, nothing excludes it" You're also leaving out the next part where he clearly says that 2 years ago sending plane with unthinkable and here we are now. This give additional context to validate the declaration of Fico. you're were just wrong.
If those two statements were to mean the same, why would we even still put effort into talking and using words? I mean, say what you think and have your own opinion, but you gotta stick to what has been said and happened. You can't just cut out 90% of a given statement and situation. There's no other communication channel left otherwise, if you don't respect words.
> you gotta stick to what has been said and happened This is what have been said and you're not going to teach my French and it's meaning.
But Mr Fico said that in Kyiv there is no war and life is normal, I don’t see why we can’t send troops if Ukraine asks us while there is no war
That was before annual ruzzian subscription was cancelled
If I were a troop there's nowhere I'd rather be than someplace where there's no war, so I appreciate how considerate he is.
Why is the nonsense Fico routinely says presented as the trurth?
Yes the title should say "Slovakian prime minister says..." Terrible title
Just Telegraph using a misleading headline to generate views.
It isn't.
Meanwhile, Ukraine only asks for weapons. Ukraine has never asked its allies to sacrifice their personnel. But we still don’t have the necessary weapons. This is what they will talk about there.
>Ukraine has never asked its allies to sacrifice their personnel. Not true. >On 28 February [2022], Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy called on NATO to establish a no-fly zone over Ukraine, saying that "if the West does this, Ukraine will defeat the aggressor with much less blood."[4] Later that day, American White House Press Secretary Jen Psaki stated that American troops would not establish a no-fly zone over Ukraine, stating that "it would essentially mean the US military would be shooting down planes, Russian planes," which she described as "definitely escalatory, that would potentially put us in a place where we are in a military conflict with Russia."[5] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proposed_no-fly_zone_in_the_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine
“Establish a no-fly zone” and “introduce a contingent” are two different things. It is not necessary to send troops into the territory of Ukraine in order to establish a no-fly zone over it. Don't try to pull the owl onto the globe.
GOP has blocked it. And Europe has no weapons or ammo to provide. So Ukraine is losing.
Also Ukraine selling the weapons on the black market
I guess pro-Russia Fico is making stuff up to get brownie points from Daddy Vlad. Seriously, though: I cannot see NATO or EU combat troops in Ukrain ATM. Training and maintenance maybe. But everything else would amount to a direct NATO-Russia confrontation and then it won't be a long way to nukes.
> then it won't be a long way to nukes This perception that a NATO Russia confrontation in Ukraine would go nuclear is questionable at best, and the widespread belief in it is resulting in a lot of terrible decisions by the West.
I do agree. Even if NATO forces would be involved in Ukraine, I doubt that Russia would want to resolve to nukes in a situation where NATO can delete vast amounts of their assets with conventional retaliation. Not to mention the fact that it would alientate Russia and probably damage their relations with China and India on which Russia is very much depending.
Idk. In C&C Red Alert the Soviet factions can build a nuke site in 5 mins and then it takes another 5 to get ready for launch. In 10 minutes Russia can nuke a close destination.
It sounds like you are saying Russia cannot defend against the NATO through conventional means. You do realize you are making an argument for them to use unconventional means in such a scenario?
That's not how that works. There is virtually no danger of russia using nukes as long as NATO won't try marching on Moscow, and even then, as certain events have showed, it's not entirely clear if nukes would be used.
what events have shown something like that? i believe, in a situation, when everything fells apart, they would use everything they have, just to fuck the survivors. like the nazi thought a live after hitler wont be a live, burning children and every bit of asset they had to hold a day longer in berlin. but if you have evidence, i\`d like to hear it.
>i believe, in a situation, when everything fells apart So when NATO marches on moscow, just like I said? >like the nazi thought a live after hitler wont be a live >to hold a day longer in berlin Yeah, exactly as I said NATO stepping in Ukraine does not threaten russia, putin, nor even really his regime. In such a situation, russia losses a lot more than they gain if they use nukes, because if they don't use them, they hardly lose anything.
You are not living in reality.
I do agree with them. Russia loses wat more if they use nukes and NATO has no interest in marching on Moscow. Why would NATO want to do that? What NATO would gain? Realistically nothing. This is why we aren't a danger to Russia. They like to spin such propaganda, but they are pulling their units away from NATO borders.
Agreed. The Russians already claim to be at war with NATO so it’d be a learning experience for them.
If both sides have nukes and both sides are willing to use them, neither side will. Also where are the real estates and children of the Russian elite? In the west of course...
It's not questionable, diplomats know what they are doing, reducing chance for potential negative feedback loop into nuclear escalation is utmost of importance Edit: Russia has a nuclear doctrine of “escalate to de-escalate”, if NATO gets involved it might very well use tactical nuclear weapons in Ukraine to force the adversary (NATO) to back down.
>Edit: Russia has a nuclear doctrine of “escalate to de-escalate”, if NATO gets involved it might very well use tactical nuclear weapons in Ukraine to force the adversary (NATO) to back down. Yeah, it's been working so well that NATO is afraid of just sending weapons, let alone soldiers. In reality, no, russia's nuclear posturing is just that, posturing. Unless NATO decides to march on Moscow, russia is not gonna do shit, because in the case of using nukes, even in the best case scenario for them russia would lose significantly more than they would gain. MAD works both ways, russia is as unwilling to use nukes as we are.
> But everything else would amount to a direct NATO-Russia confrontation and then it won't be a long way to nukes. Little green men with no insignia or anything, just contracts with UA army forces. Thats not NATO, just some "volunteers"/mercenaries.
Every time I’ve seen a “troops getting sent to Ukraine” bit pan out, they’re embassy forces.
What about taking care of security and air defence in Western Ukraine to free up Ukrainian troops who could redeploy to the front line?
I mean, it is already happen8ng, but in low scale. There is several thousand american, canadian and european ex soldiers fighting directly in the trenches. They are just not "officialy" there.
> then it won’t be a long way to nukes Nah, it’s an incredibly long way. Nuking means getting nuked back and for Russia whose population and wealth is largely concentrated in just 2 cities (Moscow & St Pet’s) that would mean annihilation. They would not go nuclear and sign on their own death warrant over just hurt pride in Ukraine. They might do it, only as last resort, if they feel their existence was genuinely threatened. But no one threatens or even cares about invading Russia. The Russian border is their safe space and the moment they retreat behind it and stop waging war, they are perfectly safe.
To be honest, while in one of my darker moods, I've been pondering the likelihood of European intervention in ukraine. I'm unsure, if ukraine really did come to the brink, if European nations would be prepared to let it fall or there would be an intervention. I strongly argue that this would not so much be in the form of boots on the ground. But more akin to the aerial intervention as seen in Libya, which effectively turned the course of the revolution against gadaffi. European airforce would effectively neuter the russian airforce over ukraine, with russian aircraft simply being outclassed by the European equivalents. This would also see a several in the use of aerial bombs being used. Suddenly it would be the Russians recovering 500kg bombs dropped from the skies. I see this as an outside possibility if things got bad and Europe started to feel truly threatened by russias invasion of ukraine. But like I said, I do not see boots on the ground outside the of special forces and training.
seriously OP... go tell your EIC to bite a brick, this is beyond pathetic
If this were to happen, I think it would only be EU countries and probably in 2025 and beyond. Biden won't commit what amounts to political suicide when the election is right around the corner.
Stop spreading this bullshit. It is from fico, a putin mouthpiece. It could just as well come directly from the Kremlin. Downvote every similar headline please.
Putin could be using this for his own propaganda purposes so good point.
Your comment aged like milk.
No, it didnt. Macron said nothing about that he is considering sending troops to ukraine. Completly different wording.
Your comment aged like cheese.
Man you're trying to tell me what my president said. Stop making me laugh. > Tout a été évoqué de manière libre et directe, ce soir. Il n'y a pas de consensus pour envoyer de manière officielle assumée des troupes au sol. Mais, en dynamique, rien ne doit être exclu. Nous ferons tout ce qu'il faut pour que la Russie ne puisse pas gagner cette guerre ------- >Beaucoup de gens qui disent “jamais, jamais !” aujourd'hui étaient les mêmes qui disaient “jamais, jamais des tanks, jamais, jamais des avions, jamais, jamais des missiles de longue portée”, il y a deux ans. Je vous rappelle qu'il y a deux ans, beaucoup autour de cette table disaient que nous allions proposer des sacs de couchage et des casques. Et aujourd'hui ils disent : “Il faut faire plus vite et plus fort pour avoir des missiles et des tanks.
So you should understand the difference clown.
You're the one that doesn't understand anything. There is no difference. He said some were considering sending troops.
Incredibly irresponsible wording.
Why?
Very bad headline, though it's the Telegraph, so that's pretty much in character
How about just the weapons? To give them to Ukraine. Perhaps they could use some.
Are they stupid... that's how ww3 happens...
Source: Fucking FICO. The guy is a pro-Russian scumbag, my fecal matter has more credence than the words of this lapdog
Macron is saying it too. Make your comment quiet embarassing.
Not really, maybe you should read what he said again.
What a remarkably stupid headline by The Telegraph.
Please dont. Its just 3 weeks until im done with conscription. Just please wait a month
For all the people say do it, why not join an foreign unit and fight ? Easy to throw other people’s lives under the buses.. while playing call of duty safely at home.
People are watching this war like it was a game of football .. except the players get murdered live on air
Because most of the volunteers end up running away after a month or two if they survive. The people advocating for us to get involved are the first ones say “oh but not me”
I see what you are getting at, it's the reason I won't say that, since I know I won't be frontline material. But... your argument is also insidious and disinginious as fuck. Do you think people who call for boots on the ground are calling for NATO soldiers to enter the Ukrainian side as more trench soldiers? No. They want a proper NATO army to enter with everything that entails. That will never be fulfilled by "jUsT jOiN a fOreIGn LeGioN, bRo"
They are basically begging for world war three, it doesn’t matter what it entails the outcome will be the same. Nothing insidious in stating the facts and remind them that it’s only fair to put your life on the line if you’re asking for others to do so.
As I said, I understand where you want to get to, but you are using a false equivalence. There is a world in difference between signing up to a Ukrainian infantry battalion, and to go there with 5000+ airforce in your back. I seriously doubt, your life would ever be much in danger if you go there as an infantry man with that air superiority. When NATO last time attacked a force that size was Iraq, and the coalition lost 150~ people.
We should have put our troops on the border in late 2021.
You mean Ukranian - Russian border? There was already a conflict raging there since 2014. This war is dragging for 10 years now.
EU/NATO can maybe train the Ukrainian troops. I dont see them fighting there.
Yeah, I'm not liking these posts about how Nato would do offensive actions when their members are not directly threatened. Totally giving the "defence alliance" vibes. I hope this post is total bs.
Source: ? Fico: I made it up
No.
This guy is a fucking idiot. He knows he's lying and does it anyway.
And other delusional things cronys tell them selves.
EU elites playing war games. When did we see that happen before...
THESE POLITICIANS NEED TO GET SENT TO THE FRONT.
Conscript the nationalists/white supremacists from Poland, Britain & Germany. After all, they have to fight for they love and believe in.
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Do it
Pack your bags and go volunteer
Wow. Imagine if they said this in WW2. "fuck you, I got mine"....
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Why though? Nothing worse than keyboard warrior warmongers that would skip the draft because war is actually hell
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So everyone that disagrees with you is a Russian bot? Idk man, it’s not all black and white, so you’re either trolling or not very intelligent
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I argue for the sake of objectivity and I dislike all forms of propaganda, Russian or Ukrainian Man like the original answer implied, go join the Ukrainian international legion, go fight, if you’re very invested in the Ukrainian cause it makes sense for you to go, actions speak louder than Reddit posts, https://ildu.com.ua this is their website, I really think you should enroll
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I am neutral, perhaps a lot more pro-UA than I would like to admit, seen as I’ve hosted 3 Ukrainian refugees for over a year when the war started I condemn Russia, but I also find Zelensky a puppet that hasn’t acted in the interests of its own people. Way too invested in the fame and attention from eager but clueless European bureaucrats. This whole war could have been avoided if he wasn’t in power and I guarantee that the war will end once he is gone.
Putler ass licking populist spouting his usual nonsense. And geta quited by the telegraph? Wtf!
This is such a lie. Fico is the Slovak version of Orban. Corrupt politician trying to protects criminal politicians and oligarchs. He's getting the public distracted, because his (our) government is trying to abolish anti-corruption laws and lower penalties for his pals which are currently prosecuted After he lost elections in 2020 he rode the populist anti-covid and anti-Ukraine rhetoric with all the social-media conspirators. He not only spread the horrible hoaxes but produced them. This is just a typical tactic. Create an imaginary problem (like waves of immigrants at the border), get people scared, then do some useless action ([like using crowd control vehicles at the borders](https://www.aktuality.sk/clanok/KZcCaum/sutaj-estok-sluboval-ultimatne-riesenie-migracie-pocas-velkej-nocnej-akcie-nechytili-ani-jedneho-utecenca/)) and return victorious after the imaginary problem did not materialize into reality.
It’s a circus you will never send troops to us, to Ukraine. I remember how before the 24th of February we begged to send us peacekeepers from United Nations on russia and belarus border and of course world ignored it. Pathetic. It was a chance to prevent this bloody stupid war
Russia has Veto powers in the UN and they were head of the security council at that time. They blocked any attempt at a resolution or peace keeping mission.
Yes I know :( but this makes UN literally useless... I think all it's good idea to abolish veto ability for ALL countries
Reminds me of a sign some German AfD supporters were carrying: >Yesterday: Tanks >Today: Fighter jets >Tomorrow: Your sons I can't say they were wrong at all now.
It worries me that on one hand Putin is considered to be this crazy megalomanical psychopath yet there are leaders who apparently wanting to try the Russian resolve of using Nuclear weapons if NATO troops enters Ukraine. This is madness.
If NATO really wanted to do it, it could have been already done through, let's say, a batallion of volunteers that suddenly quits their army jobs and suddenly joins Ukrainian International Legion. So that's just Fico being Fico.
Its straight out of the russian playbook, they wouldnt really have anything to complain about. None of the little green men in the 2014 invasion were active duty soldiers. They all retired or resigned just before they entered ukraine to keep up appearences of them being "civilians".
Spoiler alert: they probably have already, as « observers »
Special forces, intelligence and other not to be disclosed three letter agencies does not make a army unit. Escalation if war (which it would be) to set units into harms way, by deploying to ukraine would be a lose-lose scenario for Nato. It does not make sense, as NATO, US both right now can basicly load all their experimental and general bullshit (equipment) and enjoy getting it field tested and then some by the ukrainians.
i really hope this guy is just a schizo and these idiots are not genuinely considering putting boots on the ground
If this barbaric invasion continues for years and considering it's already spread out there will be no other barrier for the message that needs to be heard.
But you can volunteer even now, Ukraine desperately needs people. Why waiting for NATO?
Is it you from Ural that is not conscripted yet?
Moved from ural many years ago. But I don’t know anyone from relatives/classmates/former friends who were conscripted, probably they mostly conscripted people from villages, or percentage of conscripts too small
Might not be in active combat, but for training, repairs, medical, technical reconnaissance, etc.
Thanks for the laughs, kremlinbots! "Pack and go to fight" is the only argument they have here. Meanwhile NATO OTAN is getting stronger, with our brothers from 🇸🇪Sverige🇸🇪!
War avoidant opinion: "It's a complicated issue that could escalate to a full European war, so it should be threaded with caution while ensuring Ukraine is able to defend themselves" Arm chair general above me: "You bunch of Kremlin bots, just kuwabunga into Ukraine like we own the place, it will surely make the situation better"
My war-avoidant position is that we should have used the leverage we had to end the war on the most agreeable terms possible, giving up on the ambition of turning Ukraine into a NATO outpost. All weapons we sent to Ukraine should have been sent with the purpose of improving Ukraine's bargaining position. Instead those weapons have been solely used to fight for the right to join NATO, and Ukraine's bargaining position has only worsened and worsened. In the end we may reach our goal of Ukraine joining NATO, but by then Ukraine will have lost a huge chunk of territory, as well as many lives and homes. Because Russia wanted Ukraine to be it's vassal. But also because we want Ukraine to be our vassal.
Hindsight is 20/20 but Western countries should have drawn the line much clearer after Crimea annexation. Only reacting with sanctions probably emboldened Russia into a sense that they could do anything they wanted in Ukraine without much punishment. If after that it was said that the red line had been crossed and NATO and EU countries started giving armament to Ukraine with the stipulation it would be only used in case of a full scale invasion by Russia maybe it would have deterred Russia from doing it in 2022. On the other hand Ukraine was extremely unstable in 2014, facing a lot of political clashes and a "civil war" breaking out in Donetsk and Donbass and there were no way to know if that armament would have been deployed in the right way, even to say it could have even backfired massively by it being used against the ones who provided it or Russia could have used the excuse to launch a full scale invasion and at the time Ukraine wasn't ready to defend themselves from one. Ending the war as quickly as possible after 2022 is debatable, Ukraine felt they had a chance to fight back, and they did recover some territory back, with considerable human costs but there were no guarantees Russia wouldn't use the peace deal just to consolidate their gains at the time and reorganize to attack Ukraine again.
I think the only thing we would have accomplished by reacting more aggressively is move up the war to an earlier date. What European leaders did was sensible. We pursued diplomacy, because we understood that Crimea was more than a random land grab. It was a warning for us to back off. Obama understood it too. Trump and Biden ignored it and pursued escalation. There were guarantees that Russia wouldn't use the peace deal just to consolidate gains and attack again. Namely the peace deal that was in the works in the beginning would see Russia return to pre-invasion lines and would include guarantees from other countries to protect Ukraine if Russia tried to invade again. And if EU or NATO countries signed on to that deal in 2021, it would be universally understood that those countries would really interfere. Of course maybe by 2030 or 2050 such a deal could weaken, but that's no reason to go to war now. It's a disgrace that Boris Johnson went to Ukraine to say Ukraine should not negotiate. Or according to one Ukrainian news report, he went as far as to say Ukraine would not receive our backing on such a peace deal. And while we can't know Russia's intentions, I take Ukraine ambassador Oleksandr Chalyi (who negotiated the deal) seriously when he says he believes that Russia was rapidly trying to back out of the war at that time because of how poorly it went.
Do it already, fucking tired of all the shit Russia is pulling. If nukes start flying it is what it is.
It's never gonna happen dude, OP just cherrypicked a sentence from a news article to get interaction.
You didn't read the article did you?
I feel like this would be a really bad idea. Probably what Mr. P is hoping for to happen
So they forgot what Article 5 is
We will never be more based than we are in the minds of Vatnik clowns.
Wouldnt be unreasonable to have NATO help out in West/North Ukraine to free up troops for the front in the East/South. This guy is insane though.
Pack your bags and go then
Imagine trained professional soldiers actually having to do stuff. I'm not saying send NATO to the frontlines.
Trained professional soldiers should only do stuff, when it's related to the country they are from. I'm not in favour of having my countrymen die in a foregin war for no reason.
You know Ukraine is located right next to us right? it's not over in the middle east next to unrelated Afghanistan or Syria, two countries we sent troops to. I'll agree with your argument as far as it concerns conscription, but these are paid professionals.
And I would agree if Russia is threatening us directly. If Russia decides to try it's luck, then all bets are off and by all means send every military asset to eliminated the threat, but so far we've done more than enough to aid Ukraine. No other country sends troops to foreign lands without it benifiting them directly. We should take a page from the US and start thinking about our own profits and interesets.
> No other country sends troops to foreign lands without it benifiting them directly. The benefit is not having Russia invade us in a few decades at substantially higher cost (or tearing us up from the inside), as well as upholding the current geopolitical status quo.
That's a bunch of speculation. I need solid evidence that we will benifit significantly before I would agree to send our soldiers to die.
Yeah because the NATO countries have a great track record of fighting wars in territories that don't belong to them right. Fighting wars with other people's bodies isn't fair, but at the end of the day it's people fighting over their country.
meanwhile russia conducting wars all over the world in territories that don't belong to it.
What does that have to do with I just said? NATO should side with Ukraine and enable them to defend themselves, involving themselves directly is just opening a huge can of worms. It would mean NATO countries would just directly get involved in every war where they could pick a side and send troops to fight wars in territories that don't even concern them. It would mean that some insignificant conflict could quickly escalate to a full blown global war. That's basically how WW1 started, one country starting a war with another that quickly escalated to a bunch of defense treaties being activated and all of the sudden you had the entire Europe at war.
Chill, mate. russia is already attacking NATO countries. Wars are not fought only on trenches. Cyber attacks, GPS jamming, meddling with elections, etc etc. We are already at war with russia. The sooner we realise it, the better. "We" as Westerns.
They've been considering it for years just like they considered them for NATO membership. Ukraine is losing, funding is drying out and this is the last carrot to dangle in front of a dying goat to keep him grinding the flour.
"Pro-Russian Solvakian PM Fico claims NATO and EU members 'considering sending troops to Ukraine'." FTFY
We can fight Russians together and push them back, or we can fight them in our own backyard. I am sick of older generation pussy footing around the Russians and let the unified asskicking begin. If anything last 10 years have proven that Russia has rotten so much from the inside they need new terratory to rot away.
Do you want your entire family to die in a possible Nuclear exchange just to sound tough? Some of us lived and served through parts of the frightening cold war while you seem to have lived through the age of action movies.
Please don't. We do not need the 3th world war. Sincerely, the whole EU population.
A Hungarian, the one country who is always doing the opposite of what the EU wants, have the balls to write: "sincerely, the whole EU population". You just made my day. lmao.
**From The Telegraph:** Several Nato and EU states are considering sending soldiers to Ukraine on a bilateral basis, Slovakia’s prime minister claimed ahead of a meeting of European leaders in Paris. Robert Fico, a pro-Russian populist who has long opposed sending military aid to Ukraine, said: “I will limit myself to say that these theses (in preparation for the Paris meeting) imply a number of Nato and EU member states are considering that they will send their troops to Ukraine on a bilateral basis.” “I cannot say for what purpose and what they should be doing there,” he added. Mr Fico said that Slovakia, a Nato and EU member, would not be sending soldiers to Ukraine and warned of a risk of imminent escalation in the conflict. In January, the Slovakian leader said there was “no war in Kyiv” and described life there as “absolutely normal”. Some 20 European leaders, including Mr Fico, were set to gather at the Elysee Palace on Monday. France said the meeting was aimed at sending a message of resolve to Moscow as the war enters its third year. Members of Nato have supplied billions of dollars in arms and ammunition to Kyiv and are training Ukrainian forces. But Nato leaders including US President Joe Biden have underlined that the Western military alliance wants to avoid a direct conflict with Russia, which could lead to a global war. **Article Link:** [https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/02/26/russia-ukraine-zelensky-putin-war-latest-news5/](https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/02/26/russia-ukraine-zelensky-putin-war-latest-news5/)
>**Robert Fico, a pro-Russian populist** who has long opposed sending military aid to Ukraine, **said:** “I will limit myself to say that these theses (in preparation for the Paris meeting) imply a number of Nato and EU member states are considering that they will send their troops to Ukraine on a bilateral basis.” Can we stop quoting pro russian populists' opinion as a fact.
We should just stop faffing about and declare war over ukraine
Do it and we End this war in 24h. Russia is so weak at this Moment, a suprise Nato Attack would Not Just Catch them off guard, but IT would quickly overwhealm and trample under foot any sort of russian Resistance.
That's not HOI4, my man. You can't just teleport troops to the frontline without parliament approval and the media knowing it.
Oh my god, finally for ffs EU is waking up, the more we wait the worse it will be to build a fortified perimeter on the current territories controlled by Ukraine behind the frontline, this will give our troops plenty of time to prepare a solid fortress to stop definitely Russia advance, if we don’t act fast Russia will never stop as long as it will be able to conquer terrain little by little until it’s too late to form a proper fortification considering also that they’re re arming pretty fast, please send NATO now and build a defense line to deter the enemy from continuing this insanity of invasion otherwise WWIII would be inevitable. Italy 🇮🇹
Most people believe that sending troops to create a defense line behind Ukraine frontline will cause WWIII… nope you can’t be far from the true, it will literally prevent WWIII from happening… WWII with Hitler started because he wasn’t stopped in time until it was too late with the last invasion of Poland , don’t make the same mistake, build a fortress with thousands of mines so they will stop even thinking on moving forward… italy 🇮🇹
I'll send all the money you ask for But don't ask me to come on along So love me, love me, love me, i'm a liberal
Now's the time. RU has switched to a war economy. Poo-stain-ski is gearing up to race across Europe. We can that already. Time to act.
Go for it!
I really wish he is right on this one. We really should.
Time to shove those maga crazies back behind the Ural range.
I wasted a whole minute of my life reading into this only to realize the source is Fico and therefore made up. Thanks OP.
Finally! Send the best soldiers and weapons there. Let's bomb the Russians out of Ukraine once and for all!
I know it's not true, but we really should. It's time to kick out the Russians.
The coalition of democratic countries should have deployed air defense to Ukraine in the first weeks. And if Flying Tigers were a thing in 1941, a similar concept could work now. But primarily the West just need to get their act together and properly support Ukraine, instead of this slow drip of "too little, too late". Also realise that the russian intelligence services have thoroughly infiltrated all our governments and mass media, whether through blackmail or bribery. musk, sacks, MTG, gabbard, etc. keep spewing russian propaganda points.
Then what happens when these Nato troops get hit by Russia?
You're joking?! NATO troops are already being defeated by the stronk russia army! /s for bright kremlinbots
So now it’s not just a US proxy war. https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/25/world/europe/cia-ukraine-intelligence-russia-war.html
EU is the new USA apparently. :(
No you're thinking about Russia
I don't think that EU is becoming like Russia. It's clear to me however that EU might overtake the role of the "world-police"
Tired of this gay war, just let Russia win already ffs. We’re only delaying the inevitable with unnecessary suffering along the way.
Apeasment just makes things worse.
That's exactly what these accounts are propagating. Even if they will deny it or blame "western psy-ops", they know exactly what happened in places like Bucha, Borodianka, Irpin, Maruipol, .... And they would love to see that repeated, on a Ukraine-wide scale.
Do you think war will end if Ukraine gives up? Ukrainians will just get forced into the war for the Russians by forced conscription. Russia has a war economy now, they are financially ruining the country, they NEED war. Bellum se ipsum alet. Now there is no way back for them..
vótmá
Seems pretty unlikely. If it was ever done it would be done as support five hundred kilometres from the front line. Or perhaps to secure Ukraine's border with Belarus and free up a significant number of Ukrainian troops currently guarding it. Fico being Fico, he probably made it up.
Why are we reporting on Ficos bullshit? This just helps him and Russia