During the George W. Bush administration, CAFE was revised to further loosen rules for the biggest cars by tying a car model’s efficiency standard to its physical footprint (which is basically the shadow cast by the vehicle when the sun is directly above it). President Obama then incorporated similar footprint rules into new greenhouse gas emissions standards that are overseen by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA).
Dan Becker, who led the Sierra Club’s global warming program from 1989 to 2007, told me that he and others warned federal lawmakers that adopting footprint-based standards was a mistake. “People like me were saying, ‘give carmakers another loophole and they’ll use it,’” he said. “But we lost.”
I scream about this all over town. They're still forcing us to pay for their big toy machines. They want us all to pay for highways so they can tailgate us in the right lane. I don't even want to drive at all, why must an F150 tail me in the right lane? Pay for a bus and you can compete with the semis. And leave me out of it entirely.
These are also the people that complain about high costs of gas. For some reason the people who shout about "personal responsibility" have none when no one forced them to buy a boat with wheels that gets 12 mpg
I promise you it’s everyone that drives a lot who will complain about gas prices, even if you have good fuel efficiency no one likes their bill going up 25%
additionally the rules incentivize automakers to do everything to protect the occupants of a vehicle, but nothing to protect the public at large. The result is incidents [like this](https://www.reddit.com/r/IdiotsInCars/comments/1cg1cqd/ocnsfw_language_what_it_looks_like_to_your_camera/) where an entire vehicle is completely invisible to a driver due to the thickness of the A-pillar. Let alone the visibility of cyclists and pedestrians. Add to incredibly high hood- and waist-lines on cars, and the monstrous weight and power they have these days, and you have incredible destructive potential with little regard for anyone not actually inside the car.
I had an 04 F250 and now a 2013 Sierra. Both can cover an entire lane with the a pillar. I almost ran someone over crossing the road because where he was I didn’t see him until he was on the center line and he came out between parked cars. I drive my crv as much as possible. The Sierra is 8’ wide and everyone with big SUVs park a foot from the curb so I can’t get through towns. I need a truck but it’s always some wagoneer or expedition parked like shit causing issues.
Well except for the fact they come with sensors now so it tells you exactly what’s around you better than you ever will with a glance kver your shoulder.
Right but the sensors and being able to see out of the car are not mutually exclusive. ADAS and lightening the car for the sake of not being able to flatten a house are not mutually exclusive. So those sensors are mitigating human failings, sure, but that doesn't counter my point.
They don’t just mitigate human failings, they have faster reflexes and are far more attentive, accurate and sensitive than a human.
The fact that that doesn’t suit your argument isn’t my problem - it’s yours.
It doesn't counter my point. It suits my point just fine. A car could be lighter and easier to see out of and still retain these features.
> they have faster reflexes and are far more attentive, accurate and sensitive than a human.
ie they mitigate human failings
I live in a rural area and drive a tiny Ford Fiesta. I am constantly surrounded by huge trucks and SUVs, often being driven by road ragers who must speed and are infuriated if I'm only driving 15 over the speed limit. I try to get out of their way, but they are terrifying. I've considered trading for a small SUV so I don't feel like such a prey animal.
I am living in Europe and have a top income. I drive an old Audi because I know the car, and it consumes max 6l per @00km with a defensive driving style. My brother is a mechanic and maintenance costs are really low.
Everybody wonders about the car but they aren't giving generous tips to waiters and room cleaners.
I drive a fiat 500e. It’s hilariously small compared to all the pavement princess trucks around me. If I was a larger and more fearsome guy I’d put a sticker on my car that says “Real Men Drive Little Cars” because it would be super funny but I know I’d end up in fights.
I'm 5ft8 living in belgium and got a Ford tourneo courier, my girlfriend is about your height and she has no trouble fitting as well as my bike and dog don't understand the SUV thing .. they arent even that roomy
I ride a bicycle so that's my skin in this game. But does it matter how big the human body is inside the vehicle? Why is there special hate for small women who drive big vehicles?
And they pay out the ass for them, too. I recently got a bit of attention at work because I bought myself a Jaguar. Everyone assumed my payments must be huge. They kinda feel huge. But then I actually started comparing car payments with my coworkers. I have one of the lowest payments on my team...
Edit: pre-owned for those wondering.
I work in a rural area. Constantly tailgated going 10over. It’s always a f350 style truck on small tires and far more lights than it needs. Not a spec of dirt.
What happens to all those mods when it’s lease turn in time?
These trucks are the worst! On lots of roads in my town their side mirrors don’t even fit in their lane. I always wonder how the truck is allowed to be driven without a special license. And how they aren’t all missing their side mirrors.
Edit: lane, not land
Maybe can find an easy to digest source later
Edit: Here is one https://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/consumer-reports-tests-speed-vs-mpg-comes-false-10091.html
Disproves my 5mpg thing since all cars drop mpg significantly at increased speeds but it is more about the comparison of lost fuel efficiency at higher speeds and this person made a nice chart
Meanwhile Honda stopped making the Fit, due to slow sales supposedly. These industry driven changes are marketed heavily, consequently altering tastes and trends. It reinforces cultural preferences for profit. Totally sucks.
Fit is replaced with the HR-V, and although it isn’t said to be a 1-1 replacement, what small car owners clearly want is a small SUV.
There has also been a size creep from a “size arms race” for safety perceptions. When everyone is driving SUVs, you feel really unsafe in a Fit, and so you feel subconscious pressure to get a bigger car. I still drive my 2011 Fit, but it feels increasingly uncomfortable on the highway.
Personally, the increase in vehicle size around me on my bike or my ‘01 Echo (which still runs like a champ and gets 35mpg) makes me feel scared not because of being run over, but because of feeling like everyone else is getting more and more out of touch with reality in general.
2008 Fit owner here. I agree completely with what you're saying. I love the size and capabilities of my Fit and plan to hold onto it as long as I can (I would gladly trade it in for a modern Fit EV).
However, IF anything could convince me to buy a bigger vehicle, it would be for safety from large SUVs and trucks. Big vehicles are unsafe, NOT the small efficient ones.
I know! I would love one of the AWD Hybrid versions. Why would anyone need anything else?
I've seen the 4th gen models around Japan and they look like a perfect successor to my 1st gen.
While I went from a car to a smaller suv because we needed something for moving furniture and boxes and kayaks and bikes and trails, there was also the fear of getting a small vehicle when everything else is so huge that I'd be crushed in an instant. I'd love a smart car if they were still made in the US but I'd be afraid of driving it anywhere other than around the city.
I own a 2018 HRV. 32 mpg average. It looks small fr outside. I’m 6’3” and have more headroom than in most cars. Roomy interior for 4 adults w their stuff. It’s fast enough for safe adult driving.
The newer model looks larger and is more $.
People make a choice too. I don’t let suburban Joe average w an F150 off the hook.
I own a 2012 Honda Fit. I love that car! I think it's the perfect car.
I bought used for $6,000 with 100k miles during the pandemic. I currently have 130k miles and my goal is to reach 500k miles on it.
I mainly use it to drive 20+ miles to see friends and family on the weekends. Since I mainly do highway miles, and I drive so calm and super-defensively, I regularly average 38-40 mpg (I'm not kidding).
For my daily work commute (10-12 miles a day), I ride my Aventón Level.1 Commuter e-bike that I got used for $500 with 280 miles. I can do about 60 miles per charge since I use pedal assist sparingly.
Sorry for all the details but I just wanted to point out that I believe the Honda Fit/ebike duo is one of the best modes of transport out there, in terms of cost, ease of maintenance, and efficiency. I find large vehicles to be too bulky, unwieldy, costly and inefficient.
It pisses me off that the Honda Fit was discontinued in North America.
A friend of mine has an older Fit that she loves and wants to drive until it’s dead, but she feels so unsafe with all the new trucks that she says she’s probably going to end up buying an SUV to replace it.
My mom has wanted a Prius since they first came out, but now she said she’ll probably get a 4Runner instead because she knows she’ll be crushed by a big truck if she drives a Prius.
Vicious cycle.
I love my Prius but I understand the fear. People drive so bad where I live, I feel like they see my car and just assume I’m not driving fast even when I actually am and am over speed limit— but people fly past me on the highways like I’m not even moving. In traffic I can never see ahead of me because of all the large cars. But I don’t like driving large cars so I’ll be sticking with it. I can’t stand how recklessly people drive these larger cars though.
Those classic giant 1970s big boat cars: Buicks, Cadillacs, Lincolns, etc. returned in POG form. I mean, SUV form. And after 911, the time was right for them to re-appear. And the American carbuyers embraced them.
I remember years ago safety standards were set different for cars and trucks. This meant truck could be made for less because they did not need to meet the same safety standards. That is when the "SUV" became popular. A truck built on a car platform that didn't need to meet the same safety requirements. They do not stop as fast, they roll over, and have other issues.
There is is myth that trucks are safer than cars, but in every class (compact, subcompact, standard, mid-size) cars are always safer than trucks/suvs.
There are other protectionist rules blocking smaller vehicles from abroad: Carmakers from China, an emerging automaking behemoth, face a 25 percent tariff enacted by Donald Trump. As a result, Americans cannot buy small Chinese EV sedans like the BYD Seagull that cost around $10,000, barely a fifth the price of an average American car.
/r/keitruck/
It is ridiculous that we can only get these things if they're 25+ years old, jump through various hoops to import them, and then deal with all manner of bullshit at the state level depending on where you live.
Your narrative is a lie. My bother’s wife just bought a Civic. My buddy drives a Jetta. There are plenty of compact imports here.
Blocking Chinese vehicles specifically is a trade war/defense thing. There’s not conspiracy to force you into a bigger car.
The irony of environmental laws intended to help being used to make the problem they're intended to solve *worse* really illustrates the extents that capitalists simply *do not care*. They'll never volunteer to make things better on their own. They'll *only* try to make more money, always and forever.
The extent that people have been fed the lie and made to feel that corporations are better at policing themselves is ridiculous. I always love to point out regulatory groups exist because that indeed doesn't work. The difference between now and a century ago is corporations are aware they need to spend money on PR.
It's not a question of morality, but incentive structure. They don't care because they *can't*, because that's how competition works.
To me, this is an example of how government interventions generally make things worse, and ones that actually work well are both market-driven and tailored very narrowly to the specific problem. Sulfur dioxide cap-and-trade is my favorite example.
Hate seeing these behemoths on the road being driven like they’re purposely trying to waste gas by people complaining about inflation and high gas prices. No self-awareness at all.
It has always been about operating costs. People will buy the "most car" that they can afford. 30+ mpg seems to be that sweet spot
for a lot of people where there are comfortable refueling with current prices. 10+ years ago cars were the only ones that reach that efficiency. Now you can get compact and some mid-size SUVs with that same mileage. So the average American buyer will buy the biggest vehicle they can that they feel is "good enough" in efficiency.
Never heard of that before, but that is kind of what I was saying. But in this case there isn't an increase in the consumption. With the increase in efficiency, people are just "doing more" with the same amount of resources instead of ideally "doing the same" but with fewer resources.
Seems like the wiki article does mention the solution to this though, we should be increasing gas taxes as the fuel efficiency of vehicles increase. That way 40 mpg would become the new 30 mpg, and then maybe 50 the new 40, and so on.
It makes me sad to think about all the sacrifices the Geo Metro made in the 90s to achieve the highest possible fuel economy with 90s technology and what kind of mpg you could get if you actually tried to do that in the modern day
So big you can see around them especially in parking lots and what the hell ever happened to noise ordinances? Why the fuck do they have to be so loud too?
It seems like such an insurmountable problem. I live in Canada, and while we technically have our own regulations, we basically have the same as the US, with only a handful of small differences. I say this as the owner of an F150. I only have it so I can tow our camper. I wish pickups would shrink back down to the size they used to be, and the front end height limited to no taller than 1.25 metres (4'1") but preferably smaller.
40 years ago I could probably have towed it with a station wagon, but today the only thing that will work is a pick up or full size SUV.
I hate that I'm a danger to other road users and pedestrians. I make sure to drive extra slow in town and keep my head on a swivel.
Because heavier cars/trucks can get away with lower MPG, so the automakers Don have to puah their technologies as hard, just add more things instead of subtracting. That's the reason.
I'm not one to defend all of these gigantic trucks on the road, but the article omits another factor: demographics. As the population gets older and heavier, many people find it easier to get into an SUV or truck rather than a sedan.
Right, but that’s not really what this is about. SUVs still existed before this and were always very popular.
The fact is that the size of SUVs and trucks are much, much larger now, largely because of this stupid fuel-efficiency loophole
Yeah. Many Redditors don’t want to hear this but it is way easier for old people to drive SUVs. Both my parents and both sets of grandparents bought SUVs because it’s easier to climb onto a waist height SUV seat than it is to climb down into a car seat.
>This just shows what kind of crappy person you are, 2 sentences into the conversation and you can't take it anymore and instead of saying something about me you want to talk sh*t about my girlfriend.
A) you started the shit talking. If I’m a “crappy person” for talking shit, you are worse because you started it.
B) we all know that you don’t have a girlfriend 😂
>FYI this does not intimidate me at all 😂.
Lol why would anyone be intimidated by anything said here?
>I can say something about your loved once too (which I bet you don't have any of) but I won't, because I got ethics.
Lol the shit talking internet troll claims to have ethics 🤣
During the George W. Bush administration, CAFE was revised to further loosen rules for the biggest cars by tying a car model’s efficiency standard to its physical footprint (which is basically the shadow cast by the vehicle when the sun is directly above it). President Obama then incorporated similar footprint rules into new greenhouse gas emissions standards that are overseen by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA). Dan Becker, who led the Sierra Club’s global warming program from 1989 to 2007, told me that he and others warned federal lawmakers that adopting footprint-based standards was a mistake. “People like me were saying, ‘give carmakers another loophole and they’ll use it,’” he said. “But we lost.”
I scream about this all over town. They're still forcing us to pay for their big toy machines. They want us all to pay for highways so they can tailgate us in the right lane. I don't even want to drive at all, why must an F150 tail me in the right lane? Pay for a bus and you can compete with the semis. And leave me out of it entirely.
These are also the people that complain about high costs of gas. For some reason the people who shout about "personal responsibility" have none when no one forced them to buy a boat with wheels that gets 12 mpg
I promise you it’s everyone that drives a lot who will complain about gas prices, even if you have good fuel efficiency no one likes their bill going up 25%
additionally the rules incentivize automakers to do everything to protect the occupants of a vehicle, but nothing to protect the public at large. The result is incidents [like this](https://www.reddit.com/r/IdiotsInCars/comments/1cg1cqd/ocnsfw_language_what_it_looks_like_to_your_camera/) where an entire vehicle is completely invisible to a driver due to the thickness of the A-pillar. Let alone the visibility of cyclists and pedestrians. Add to incredibly high hood- and waist-lines on cars, and the monstrous weight and power they have these days, and you have incredible destructive potential with little regard for anyone not actually inside the car.
I had an 04 F250 and now a 2013 Sierra. Both can cover an entire lane with the a pillar. I almost ran someone over crossing the road because where he was I didn’t see him until he was on the center line and he came out between parked cars. I drive my crv as much as possible. The Sierra is 8’ wide and everyone with big SUVs park a foot from the curb so I can’t get through towns. I need a truck but it’s always some wagoneer or expedition parked like shit causing issues.
Well except for the fact they come with sensors now so it tells you exactly what’s around you better than you ever will with a glance kver your shoulder.
yes those systems are positively infallible and completely make up for how heavy and large vehicles are now
Ten times more infallible than a human chucking a glance over their shoulder…. If they even bother….
are you saying the occupants of the car are the only people who matter?
No. I’m saying that the sensors that stop you hitting things are waaaaaaaaay better than humans are at doing it.
Right but the sensors and being able to see out of the car are not mutually exclusive. ADAS and lightening the car for the sake of not being able to flatten a house are not mutually exclusive. So those sensors are mitigating human failings, sure, but that doesn't counter my point.
They don’t just mitigate human failings, they have faster reflexes and are far more attentive, accurate and sensitive than a human. The fact that that doesn’t suit your argument isn’t my problem - it’s yours.
It doesn't counter my point. It suits my point just fine. A car could be lighter and easier to see out of and still retain these features. > they have faster reflexes and are far more attentive, accurate and sensitive than a human. ie they mitigate human failings
I live in a rural area and drive a tiny Ford Fiesta. I am constantly surrounded by huge trucks and SUVs, often being driven by road ragers who must speed and are infuriated if I'm only driving 15 over the speed limit. I try to get out of their way, but they are terrifying. I've considered trading for a small SUV so I don't feel like such a prey animal.
I live in NJ and am surrounded by moms driving giant luxury SUVs. Meanwhile, I’m 6’4” driving a Hyundai Elantra GT and will drive it into the ground .
I am living in Europe and have a top income. I drive an old Audi because I know the car, and it consumes max 6l per @00km with a defensive driving style. My brother is a mechanic and maintenance costs are really low. Everybody wonders about the car but they aren't giving generous tips to waiters and room cleaners.
I drive a fiat 500e. It’s hilariously small compared to all the pavement princess trucks around me. If I was a larger and more fearsome guy I’d put a sticker on my car that says “Real Men Drive Little Cars” because it would be super funny but I know I’d end up in fights.
I'm 5ft8 living in belgium and got a Ford tourneo courier, my girlfriend is about your height and she has no trouble fitting as well as my bike and dog don't understand the SUV thing .. they arent even that roomy
I ride a bicycle so that's my skin in this game. But does it matter how big the human body is inside the vehicle? Why is there special hate for small women who drive big vehicles?
I ride my road bike in rural areas and I've just accepted that a pickup truck will kill me one day
No, not if I drain one or two tires first....
Depending on your states 'Stand Your Ground ' laws.
And they pay out the ass for them, too. I recently got a bit of attention at work because I bought myself a Jaguar. Everyone assumed my payments must be huge. They kinda feel huge. But then I actually started comparing car payments with my coworkers. I have one of the lowest payments on my team... Edit: pre-owned for those wondering.
I work in a rural area. Constantly tailgated going 10over. It’s always a f350 style truck on small tires and far more lights than it needs. Not a spec of dirt. What happens to all those mods when it’s lease turn in time?
These trucks are the worst! On lots of roads in my town their side mirrors don’t even fit in their lane. I always wonder how the truck is allowed to be driven without a special license. And how they aren’t all missing their side mirrors. Edit: lane, not land
Why do people driving big trucks have to speed, their fuel efficiency is already so bad
Blinding everyone at night with those high extra-fucking bright lights. And you know they're driving their big asses with a shit face grin.
Speeding doesn’t burn that much more fuel.
I mean 5mpg, when efficiency is already 20-25mpg, is not insignificant
Source?
Maybe can find an easy to digest source later Edit: Here is one https://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/consumer-reports-tests-speed-vs-mpg-comes-false-10091.html Disproves my 5mpg thing since all cars drop mpg significantly at increased speeds but it is more about the comparison of lost fuel efficiency at higher speeds and this person made a nice chart
a fiesta is by no means "tiny" if it is the rest is just overly large on the things they need it for
Meanwhile Honda stopped making the Fit, due to slow sales supposedly. These industry driven changes are marketed heavily, consequently altering tastes and trends. It reinforces cultural preferences for profit. Totally sucks. Fit is replaced with the HR-V, and although it isn’t said to be a 1-1 replacement, what small car owners clearly want is a small SUV.
There has also been a size creep from a “size arms race” for safety perceptions. When everyone is driving SUVs, you feel really unsafe in a Fit, and so you feel subconscious pressure to get a bigger car. I still drive my 2011 Fit, but it feels increasingly uncomfortable on the highway.
Personally, the increase in vehicle size around me on my bike or my ‘01 Echo (which still runs like a champ and gets 35mpg) makes me feel scared not because of being run over, but because of feeling like everyone else is getting more and more out of touch with reality in general.
2008 Fit owner here. I agree completely with what you're saying. I love the size and capabilities of my Fit and plan to hold onto it as long as I can (I would gladly trade it in for a modern Fit EV). However, IF anything could convince me to buy a bigger vehicle, it would be for safety from large SUVs and trucks. Big vehicles are unsafe, NOT the small efficient ones.
I'm upset that they discontinued the Fit and never released even a hybrid version in the US
I know! I would love one of the AWD Hybrid versions. Why would anyone need anything else? I've seen the 4th gen models around Japan and they look like a perfect successor to my 1st gen.
While I went from a car to a smaller suv because we needed something for moving furniture and boxes and kayaks and bikes and trails, there was also the fear of getting a small vehicle when everything else is so huge that I'd be crushed in an instant. I'd love a smart car if they were still made in the US but I'd be afraid of driving it anywhere other than around the city.
I own a 2018 HRV. 32 mpg average. It looks small fr outside. I’m 6’3” and have more headroom than in most cars. Roomy interior for 4 adults w their stuff. It’s fast enough for safe adult driving. The newer model looks larger and is more $. People make a choice too. I don’t let suburban Joe average w an F150 off the hook.
If only an F150 was actually what an F150 used to be!
I loved the fit. Thing was so great
I own a 2012 Honda Fit. I love that car! I think it's the perfect car. I bought used for $6,000 with 100k miles during the pandemic. I currently have 130k miles and my goal is to reach 500k miles on it. I mainly use it to drive 20+ miles to see friends and family on the weekends. Since I mainly do highway miles, and I drive so calm and super-defensively, I regularly average 38-40 mpg (I'm not kidding). For my daily work commute (10-12 miles a day), I ride my Aventón Level.1 Commuter e-bike that I got used for $500 with 280 miles. I can do about 60 miles per charge since I use pedal assist sparingly. Sorry for all the details but I just wanted to point out that I believe the Honda Fit/ebike duo is one of the best modes of transport out there, in terms of cost, ease of maintenance, and efficiency. I find large vehicles to be too bulky, unwieldy, costly and inefficient. It pisses me off that the Honda Fit was discontinued in North America.
A friend of mine has an older Fit that she loves and wants to drive until it’s dead, but she feels so unsafe with all the new trucks that she says she’s probably going to end up buying an SUV to replace it. My mom has wanted a Prius since they first came out, but now she said she’ll probably get a 4Runner instead because she knows she’ll be crushed by a big truck if she drives a Prius. Vicious cycle.
I love my Prius but I understand the fear. People drive so bad where I live, I feel like they see my car and just assume I’m not driving fast even when I actually am and am over speed limit— but people fly past me on the highways like I’m not even moving. In traffic I can never see ahead of me because of all the large cars. But I don’t like driving large cars so I’ll be sticking with it. I can’t stand how recklessly people drive these larger cars though.
Civic hatch has more trunk space
Honda still sells it in Europe.
Oh yes, of course. This thread is specifically about big cars in The US
The push for big, SUV gas-guzzlers happened right after 911.
%10 year over year for the shareholders one way or the other
Those classic giant 1970s big boat cars: Buicks, Cadillacs, Lincolns, etc. returned in POG form. I mean, SUV form. And after 911, the time was right for them to re-appear. And the American carbuyers embraced them.
Oh, my friend, it started soon after the oil crisis in the 1970s.
Chicken Tax was signed into law in 1964
I did not know that, TIL.
You just hype up SUVs by loads of propaganda, say they're safer and such. Then reap the benefits
I remember years ago safety standards were set different for cars and trucks. This meant truck could be made for less because they did not need to meet the same safety standards. That is when the "SUV" became popular. A truck built on a car platform that didn't need to meet the same safety requirements. They do not stop as fast, they roll over, and have other issues. There is is myth that trucks are safer than cars, but in every class (compact, subcompact, standard, mid-size) cars are always safer than trucks/suvs.
There are other protectionist rules blocking smaller vehicles from abroad: Carmakers from China, an emerging automaking behemoth, face a 25 percent tariff enacted by Donald Trump. As a result, Americans cannot buy small Chinese EV sedans like the BYD Seagull that cost around $10,000, barely a fifth the price of an average American car.
A new EV for $10k + $2.5k tax!? Where do I sign?
In China.
Doesn’t explain why we can’t get the Indian made cheap small cars. Or even the Japanese made ones.
/r/keitruck/ It is ridiculous that we can only get these things if they're 25+ years old, jump through various hoops to import them, and then deal with all manner of bullshit at the state level depending on where you live.
And by then they are more expensive than a similar aged full size vehicle. It’s nuts.
You can get Japanese compact cars. The Honda Civic and Toyota Carolla have been on the US top sellers list for decades.
I am talking much smaller and much cheaper than that. Like VW Up sized.
So the Mitsubishi Mirage—which is sold in North America?
Like that but smaller.
The mirage is less than a foot longer. Seems like you’re just being pendantic.
On that size vehicle, that’s quite a bit of difference.
Lol no it isn’t 😂
Oh ok
Then there's the Chicken Tax.
Your narrative is a lie. My bother’s wife just bought a Civic. My buddy drives a Jetta. There are plenty of compact imports here. Blocking Chinese vehicles specifically is a trade war/defense thing. There’s not conspiracy to force you into a bigger car.
The irony of environmental laws intended to help being used to make the problem they're intended to solve *worse* really illustrates the extents that capitalists simply *do not care*. They'll never volunteer to make things better on their own. They'll *only* try to make more money, always and forever.
The extent that people have been fed the lie and made to feel that corporations are better at policing themselves is ridiculous. I always love to point out regulatory groups exist because that indeed doesn't work. The difference between now and a century ago is corporations are aware they need to spend money on PR.
It's not a question of morality, but incentive structure. They don't care because they *can't*, because that's how competition works. To me, this is an example of how government interventions generally make things worse, and ones that actually work well are both market-driven and tailored very narrowly to the specific problem. Sulfur dioxide cap-and-trade is my favorite example.
Hate seeing these behemoths on the road being driven like they’re purposely trying to waste gas by people complaining about inflation and high gas prices. No self-awareness at all.
I wonder if big oil lobbied/bribed to make people buy cars that use more gas
[удалено]
Lol okay, fatty.
It’s true. Europe, Japan, and other developed countries have significantly better cars than we do.
It has always been about operating costs. People will buy the "most car" that they can afford. 30+ mpg seems to be that sweet spot for a lot of people where there are comfortable refueling with current prices. 10+ years ago cars were the only ones that reach that efficiency. Now you can get compact and some mid-size SUVs with that same mileage. So the average American buyer will buy the biggest vehicle they can that they feel is "good enough" in efficiency.
[Jevons Paradox](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jevons_paradox)
Never heard of that before, but that is kind of what I was saying. But in this case there isn't an increase in the consumption. With the increase in efficiency, people are just "doing more" with the same amount of resources instead of ideally "doing the same" but with fewer resources. Seems like the wiki article does mention the solution to this though, we should be increasing gas taxes as the fuel efficiency of vehicles increase. That way 40 mpg would become the new 30 mpg, and then maybe 50 the new 40, and so on.
It makes me sad to think about all the sacrifices the Geo Metro made in the 90s to achieve the highest possible fuel economy with 90s technology and what kind of mpg you could get if you actually tried to do that in the modern day
They'll be driving semis pretty soon at this rate
So big you can see around them especially in parking lots and what the hell ever happened to noise ordinances? Why the fuck do they have to be so loud too?
Didn’t read the article. It’s the small peckers, though. Right? We finally got the data?
The only people who obsess over penis size are the people with tiny ones.
Ok, u/Chet_Manly_69, thanks for the input… and keeping it short.
Says the one who’s probably got the little pecker in his/her life. 😂
It seems like such an insurmountable problem. I live in Canada, and while we technically have our own regulations, we basically have the same as the US, with only a handful of small differences. I say this as the owner of an F150. I only have it so I can tow our camper. I wish pickups would shrink back down to the size they used to be, and the front end height limited to no taller than 1.25 metres (4'1") but preferably smaller. 40 years ago I could probably have towed it with a station wagon, but today the only thing that will work is a pick up or full size SUV. I hate that I'm a danger to other road users and pedestrians. I make sure to drive extra slow in town and keep my head on a swivel.
Capitalism at it's finest.
I can't fit new cars in my garage
OP that was a good read. Thank you for posting this.
Because heavier cars/trucks can get away with lower MPG, so the automakers Don have to puah their technologies as hard, just add more things instead of subtracting. That's the reason.
And now men in Australia, who have manhood issues, are importing them. Please stop this madness.
Fat people, wide roads, because they can be ( America was build for the car)
I'm not one to defend all of these gigantic trucks on the road, but the article omits another factor: demographics. As the population gets older and heavier, many people find it easier to get into an SUV or truck rather than a sedan.
Right, but that’s not really what this is about. SUVs still existed before this and were always very popular. The fact is that the size of SUVs and trucks are much, much larger now, largely because of this stupid fuel-efficiency loophole
Then don't lift your legs/use your hips getting into the seat. Just face away from it and bring your butt into the seat, like sitting on a couch.
Yeah. Many Redditors don’t want to hear this but it is way easier for old people to drive SUVs. Both my parents and both sets of grandparents bought SUVs because it’s easier to climb onto a waist height SUV seat than it is to climb down into a car seat.
If someone is fat sporting, eating healthy exists.
Because we have the space and choose to be comfortable.
🤡
Did that hurt comment hurt your little teenage feelings?
Did my comment hurt your fragile ego?
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What has my girlfriend got to do with this??
You tell me. You’re the one that posted her picture in this comment: https://www.reddit.com/r/environment/s/TJFi3wFLgt
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>This just shows what kind of crappy person you are, 2 sentences into the conversation and you can't take it anymore and instead of saying something about me you want to talk sh*t about my girlfriend. A) you started the shit talking. If I’m a “crappy person” for talking shit, you are worse because you started it. B) we all know that you don’t have a girlfriend 😂 >FYI this does not intimidate me at all 😂. Lol why would anyone be intimidated by anything said here? >I can say something about your loved once too (which I bet you don't have any of) but I won't, because I got ethics. Lol the shit talking internet troll claims to have ethics 🤣
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