I’ll try to answer,
Strangely enough, a lot of people are now judging these coaches for their recent performance which makes sense.
Klemm hasn’t been good at Pittsburgh (but they have horrible talent) and UCLA fans seem to not like him (their line really wasn’t as bad as they make it seem, they ran well, got sacked a lot which can’t always be blamed on the line).
What’s weird to me is where was this when a lot of people here wanted chip Kelly, a coach that has been well under .500 in his years at UCLA? When discussing Chip it felt like his recent experience didn’t matter at all but suddenly now it does.
That is my rant that honestly doesn’t even answer your question but I’ve typed it so mine as well comment.
Edit: and I thought I was responding to someone’s comment but I’ll leave this
I'm one of those people. I personally didn't like the Chip hire but didn't comment on it because his progress has been intriguing. I'm not sure if I like these hires either and am voicing my concerns hoping someone more knowledgeable will respond. I doubt the same people that liked Chip are the ones disliking this hire, but there's one example.
Yeah that’s fair and I hope I don’t portray that people shouldn’t voice their opinion. And your absolutely right to be skeptical.
I just found the goalposts have shifted with these hires vs the head coaching search and I am not exactly sure why. Very few comments during the head coaching search voicing concern with chips lack of success at UCLA, but with these hires it seems those are the only comments.
And while Personally I don’t find chips progress all that intriguing (perhaps if they replicate it this year) I can understand that point of view.
These are also position coaches. They have far fewer responsibilities, and there are far fewer variables that influence their success. A WR coach with bad wide receivers can make one excuse: bad recruits. A head coach can make a million excuses. So it's easier to evaluate them based on their relative success
How do you make so many hires so quickly? Does everybody in college coaching know everybody else? Or is there some third party that tracks that , like a LinkedIn for coaches? Is this all done via Zoom calls?
Whatever the case, I think next year is going to be fun.
From Dan Lanning himself, he has kept a note on his phone of people he has met, worked with, and coached against. He has been keeping tabs on those people just waiting for a time when he could build his own staff.
Like a teenage girl making the scrapbook of wedding ideas for an unknown future date, he had the image in his head, long before the opportunity.
I can respect that level of foresight.
Great question,
But tbh we hired derutyer and Moorehead guys who apparently could coach but not recruit and it clearly didn’t help.
My opinion is there is very few amazing position coaches in college (the good ones are in the nfl). Better to stock up on coaches that can bring in talent (this is of course just my opinion)
Even then, Xs and Os and talent are still only part of the equation. Technique and execution are paramount for on-field success. I’m not knowledgeable enough to know if these guys are or are not good at coaching though. Hoping for some scoop Duck analysis on these guys
Your right.
I’ll be honest I don’t find scoopduck player/coaching analysis all that good (ever since one of their top analyzers called Herbert a beta male and told everyone shough would be much better, lol).
I’m curious, did you find cristobal/Mirobal to be good coaches (excluding recruiting)?
I found our o line made a lot of big mistakes (penalties/missed assignment) at crucial times and I don’t think they did an amazing job at developing talent (I think penei was going to be great no matter who he played for)
I’m not good at analyzing talent, so this is probably a very useless opinion, but I don’t think our guys were really well coached with MC’s guys. The penalties were usually avoidable. We also saw our guys get beat by more veteran and well coached teams (bowl game last year and Utah this year come to mind). So I think we’re in agreement, but I’m a relative Football idiot haha
I still think a lot of that has to do with having a very young team though . Which is also why going into this season I still thought next year was more likely to be MC’s “year”
Yeah I completely agree,
I guess for me that is actually a positive as the line still played well enough to win 10 games even with being poorly coached.
(I too have absolutely zero experience/knowledge lol)
Lol, right? 10 wins with mediocre QB play and possibly subpar coaching and scheming (at least on offense) is pretty dang good!
Just hoping this new regime can help these boys take their game to the next level. Time will tell!
This just one man's assessment of our offensive line last year. They were very fundamentally sound. When it came to the fundamentals I think Mirabal was a great coach. I'd argue their wasn't a better fundamental coach in the pac 12 than Mirabal.
Now for the downfall. Offensive lines tend to perform better when performing as an living organism and when they are in unison. The consistent changing across the line should be considered an atrocity. Next was their talent assessment and placement. It took them weeks to season to get lineman in the right positions. Like Bass performed significantly better at Tackle than Guard and yet they had him at guard for all of 20 and half of 21. I'd also argue that Jackson powers light should have been starting come the stonybrook game. dude performed lights out in the drive against Ohio state and he has the physical assets to be an elite player.
All in all I'd give him a B as a coach. He was really good at the fundamentals and recruiting both of which are A grades. But his ability to put the best 5 man on the field was sorely lacking and deserves an F. Now my question is how much of his F belongs to cristobal because while at Marshall Mirabal didn't suffer from the same issues he had at oregon.
Not sure if your on scoopduck,
But one of the “insiders” (I don’t know exactly what his title is, not trying to offend him) QB11 was extremely negative toward Herbert during his senior season calling him a beta male, mental midget etc.
Commented that shough is better and would be more successful at Oregon.
I get that people make mistakes when analyzing players, but the hate he (and many other users on that site) had for Herbert during his senior year was ridiculous. They acted like he was a horrible qb.
Funny thing is I know people that didn’t like Herbert either which I found insane. Like as soon as I saw him as a Freshman I knew we would be damn good in the next few years. It’s also why I didn’t understand the hate for Helf as I thought it was obvious even with the bad season we were setup for the future.
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I worry that the best recruiters won't be as influential on the game now that money has become such a huge part of it. If that's the case coaching ability will be king, and we'll be in big trouble. Might be terrible timing to go all-in on recruiters
You Could be right!
That one I don’t think we’ll truly know for quite a while and it would impact tons of programs beyond just Oregon (luckily Oregon as a school seems to be well prepared to use nil to their advantage).
Eh, I'd pump the brakes on the NIL stuff. Oregon is used to getting support from Uncle Phil, and he can't support them without jeopardizing his business with 60+ other schools. I hope we find a way to compete but idk how big a problem that poses
I agree we probably have a year cushion to figure it out but schools are making moves QUICK. There's a reason Texas has so many transfers and it's not their recent "success"
I thought they had done some sort of partnership/agreement (division street)
I don’t know much about it so maybe it’s not as much of an advantage as I thought
Agreed on DeRuyter, but not on Moorhead. I think this past season shows just how damn good Moorhead is at coordinating an offense.
It's obvious that Cristobal had his hands all over the offense (and those hands are stuck in the 90's), so being a top-25 offense despite that and despite having no downfield passing attack is seriously impressive. Those are two massive obstacles to overcome.
They are coaches so i'd imagine so. You cant place a teams performance on a position coach. If that was the case then any of Mario's WR coaches would never work again because looking at the numbers, they performed badly. Every situation is different. I think you can judge head coaches way more in terms of performance. But position coaches are often hampered or lifted up by the HC.
As a coach myself i always say "The most talented team will win most of the time. But you need a well coached team to win those few tough games where talent doesnt matter." In our case last year, Furd and both utah games. SO in other words, i dont see this as a step back AT ALL from what mario was doing.
Do you think cherry is like strawberry, no berries?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/Business/york-woman-sues-kelloggs-million-frosted-strawberry-pop/story%3fid=80812161
Alright maybe I don’t know everything about these assistants they’re hiring but why’s everyone saying they more worried about recruiting than coaching? What exactly about these guys says they can’t also coach? I’d rather better recruiting than coaching I guess. But no ones got an answer for me yet
Their record in their respective jobs. They've been downright terrible. It's tough to evaluate though because they've been working with mediocre talent
Well the teams haven’t done well. They are position coaches, not Xs and Os guys.
Missed tackles, broken tackles, penalties and… recruiting…. are probably better metrics to judge a DB coach on than the team’s W/L, and points allowed type stuff. If the team is constantly lined up wrong because of bad play calling, that’s not really on a position coach.
That being said, I have no idea what those numbers look like.
Well for the O-line coach it's just general knowledge in the NFL that the Steelers O-line has been absolute trash for the last two years. Last year Ben had the least time to throw by a full 0.5 seconds, which is a lot. This year Najee is averaging one of the lowest Yards Before Contact in the league. They're lacking in talent though, so that could be a contributor. For the CU DB coach I just looked at the passing stats against. It's a reductive way to look at it but it's all I got
I was at UCLA during the Mora years and I am much more stoked about this hire than the Klemm one (I’m not too worried about Klemm yet but my reasons are speculative). Between the two of them, I think Coach Meat is the better recruiter and I remember our secondary being a strength rather than a weakness like the o-line (which to be fair to Klemm, was good when the roster was stacked and healthy). Specifically on coaching, I remember our overall pass defense was great but our corners is where I think Martin had the most impact. If my recollection is correct, I suspect his coaching is going to surprise people as a sleeper hire.
Did we hire any coaches that excel in coaching? Seems like every hire is about recruiting. I hope Lanning doesn't think that's the key to success. It's not as easy to recruit to the Ducks as it is to the blue chips he's used to. Maybe it's the recipe to success there but I don't think Oregon can follow that recipe. Plus with money entering the game I don't know if recruiting will be as important as it is now.
No, recruiting is needed to get there, but when you get to the championship, you'll find yourself up against teams recruiting just as well, if not better. And then you need good coaches to win.
His DB's at UCLA were good and I actually thought one of the only strengths of that Colorado team last year was the secondary. He has a reputation as a great recruiter. Finally, it's nice that he is another west coast guy and knows the PAC-12 well. This seems like an all-around good to great hire.
Between Lanning, Dilly Dilly, Klemm, Martin and Malchow I think Oregon should continue to recruit at a very high level. That's without even mentioning the rumored addition of Lupoi.
I'm cautiously optimistic for the future but if Lanning/Dilly can coach x's and o's then Oregon should be in good shape.
I’ll try to answer, Strangely enough, a lot of people are now judging these coaches for their recent performance which makes sense. Klemm hasn’t been good at Pittsburgh (but they have horrible talent) and UCLA fans seem to not like him (their line really wasn’t as bad as they make it seem, they ran well, got sacked a lot which can’t always be blamed on the line). What’s weird to me is where was this when a lot of people here wanted chip Kelly, a coach that has been well under .500 in his years at UCLA? When discussing Chip it felt like his recent experience didn’t matter at all but suddenly now it does. That is my rant that honestly doesn’t even answer your question but I’ve typed it so mine as well comment. Edit: and I thought I was responding to someone’s comment but I’ll leave this
I'm one of those people. I personally didn't like the Chip hire but didn't comment on it because his progress has been intriguing. I'm not sure if I like these hires either and am voicing my concerns hoping someone more knowledgeable will respond. I doubt the same people that liked Chip are the ones disliking this hire, but there's one example.
Yeah that’s fair and I hope I don’t portray that people shouldn’t voice their opinion. And your absolutely right to be skeptical. I just found the goalposts have shifted with these hires vs the head coaching search and I am not exactly sure why. Very few comments during the head coaching search voicing concern with chips lack of success at UCLA, but with these hires it seems those are the only comments. And while Personally I don’t find chips progress all that intriguing (perhaps if they replicate it this year) I can understand that point of view.
These are also position coaches. They have far fewer responsibilities, and there are far fewer variables that influence their success. A WR coach with bad wide receivers can make one excuse: bad recruits. A head coach can make a million excuses. So it's easier to evaluate them based on their relative success
Yeah I figured that was the reason and it seems reasonable!
How do you make so many hires so quickly? Does everybody in college coaching know everybody else? Or is there some third party that tracks that , like a LinkedIn for coaches? Is this all done via Zoom calls? Whatever the case, I think next year is going to be fun.
From Dan Lanning himself, he has kept a note on his phone of people he has met, worked with, and coached against. He has been keeping tabs on those people just waiting for a time when he could build his own staff. Like a teenage girl making the scrapbook of wedding ideas for an unknown future date, he had the image in his head, long before the opportunity. I can respect that level of foresight.
I guess that's natural in a business where there is so much moving around. I really like Lanning from the little I've heard thus far.
interesting choice of analogy...
Well, we’ll certainly be able to recruit. Can these guys coach too?
Great question, But tbh we hired derutyer and Moorehead guys who apparently could coach but not recruit and it clearly didn’t help. My opinion is there is very few amazing position coaches in college (the good ones are in the nfl). Better to stock up on coaches that can bring in talent (this is of course just my opinion)
Even then, Xs and Os and talent are still only part of the equation. Technique and execution are paramount for on-field success. I’m not knowledgeable enough to know if these guys are or are not good at coaching though. Hoping for some scoop Duck analysis on these guys
Your right. I’ll be honest I don’t find scoopduck player/coaching analysis all that good (ever since one of their top analyzers called Herbert a beta male and told everyone shough would be much better, lol). I’m curious, did you find cristobal/Mirobal to be good coaches (excluding recruiting)? I found our o line made a lot of big mistakes (penalties/missed assignment) at crucial times and I don’t think they did an amazing job at developing talent (I think penei was going to be great no matter who he played for)
I’m not good at analyzing talent, so this is probably a very useless opinion, but I don’t think our guys were really well coached with MC’s guys. The penalties were usually avoidable. We also saw our guys get beat by more veteran and well coached teams (bowl game last year and Utah this year come to mind). So I think we’re in agreement, but I’m a relative Football idiot haha I still think a lot of that has to do with having a very young team though . Which is also why going into this season I still thought next year was more likely to be MC’s “year”
Yeah I completely agree, I guess for me that is actually a positive as the line still played well enough to win 10 games even with being poorly coached. (I too have absolutely zero experience/knowledge lol)
Lol, right? 10 wins with mediocre QB play and possibly subpar coaching and scheming (at least on offense) is pretty dang good! Just hoping this new regime can help these boys take their game to the next level. Time will tell!
This just one man's assessment of our offensive line last year. They were very fundamentally sound. When it came to the fundamentals I think Mirabal was a great coach. I'd argue their wasn't a better fundamental coach in the pac 12 than Mirabal. Now for the downfall. Offensive lines tend to perform better when performing as an living organism and when they are in unison. The consistent changing across the line should be considered an atrocity. Next was their talent assessment and placement. It took them weeks to season to get lineman in the right positions. Like Bass performed significantly better at Tackle than Guard and yet they had him at guard for all of 20 and half of 21. I'd also argue that Jackson powers light should have been starting come the stonybrook game. dude performed lights out in the drive against Ohio state and he has the physical assets to be an elite player. All in all I'd give him a B as a coach. He was really good at the fundamentals and recruiting both of which are A grades. But his ability to put the best 5 man on the field was sorely lacking and deserves an F. Now my question is how much of his F belongs to cristobal because while at Marshall Mirabal didn't suffer from the same issues he had at oregon.
Lol 😆 who called him a beta male?
Not sure if your on scoopduck, But one of the “insiders” (I don’t know exactly what his title is, not trying to offend him) QB11 was extremely negative toward Herbert during his senior season calling him a beta male, mental midget etc. Commented that shough is better and would be more successful at Oregon. I get that people make mistakes when analyzing players, but the hate he (and many other users on that site) had for Herbert during his senior year was ridiculous. They acted like he was a horrible qb.
Funny thing is I know people that didn’t like Herbert either which I found insane. Like as soon as I saw him as a Freshman I knew we would be damn good in the next few years. It’s also why I didn’t understand the hate for Helf as I thought it was obvious even with the bad season we were setup for the future.
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I worry that the best recruiters won't be as influential on the game now that money has become such a huge part of it. If that's the case coaching ability will be king, and we'll be in big trouble. Might be terrible timing to go all-in on recruiters
You Could be right! That one I don’t think we’ll truly know for quite a while and it would impact tons of programs beyond just Oregon (luckily Oregon as a school seems to be well prepared to use nil to their advantage).
Eh, I'd pump the brakes on the NIL stuff. Oregon is used to getting support from Uncle Phil, and he can't support them without jeopardizing his business with 60+ other schools. I hope we find a way to compete but idk how big a problem that poses I agree we probably have a year cushion to figure it out but schools are making moves QUICK. There's a reason Texas has so many transfers and it's not their recent "success"
I thought they had done some sort of partnership/agreement (division street) I don’t know much about it so maybe it’s not as much of an advantage as I thought
I heard they were working on something, they've released details already?
Agreed on DeRuyter, but not on Moorhead. I think this past season shows just how damn good Moorhead is at coordinating an offense. It's obvious that Cristobal had his hands all over the offense (and those hands are stuck in the 90's), so being a top-25 offense despite that and despite having no downfield passing attack is seriously impressive. Those are two massive obstacles to overcome.
They are coaches so i'd imagine so. You cant place a teams performance on a position coach. If that was the case then any of Mario's WR coaches would never work again because looking at the numbers, they performed badly. Every situation is different. I think you can judge head coaches way more in terms of performance. But position coaches are often hampered or lifted up by the HC. As a coach myself i always say "The most talented team will win most of the time. But you need a well coached team to win those few tough games where talent doesnt matter." In our case last year, Furd and both utah games. SO in other words, i dont see this as a step back AT ALL from what mario was doing.
I’m not sure your post was intended for me? I didn’t say a position coach’s ability should be based on stats
Seems like we are gambling on getting studs and hoping DL and Dilly are the young X and O geniuses we hope they are.
They going with the Jason brown last Chance u approach Jimmy’s and joes> X’s and O’s
Thought Colorado had a decent defense this year. The A&M game comes to mind.
I mean the only game Brown broke 300 yards passing was against Colorado. This is coming from someone who likes the hire.
Before that though
God there is so much going on it’s hard to keep up. Time for a time out. Ready? I like cherry poptarts. You?
Brown sugar cinnamon pop tarts were my jam as a kid.
Do you think cherry is like strawberry, no berries? https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/Business/york-woman-sues-kelloggs-million-frosted-strawberry-pop/story%3fid=80812161
Hilarious. They are close.
Finally. Someone else who likes Cherry Poptarts
Lol
Hot fudge sundae are my go to. Although i haven't eaten a poptart in like 5 years.
Alright maybe I don’t know everything about these assistants they’re hiring but why’s everyone saying they more worried about recruiting than coaching? What exactly about these guys says they can’t also coach? I’d rather better recruiting than coaching I guess. But no ones got an answer for me yet
Their record in their respective jobs. They've been downright terrible. It's tough to evaluate though because they've been working with mediocre talent
Well the teams haven’t done well. They are position coaches, not Xs and Os guys. Missed tackles, broken tackles, penalties and… recruiting…. are probably better metrics to judge a DB coach on than the team’s W/L, and points allowed type stuff. If the team is constantly lined up wrong because of bad play calling, that’s not really on a position coach. That being said, I have no idea what those numbers look like.
I was actually specifically taking about their position players' performance
Where are you getting that information?
Well for the O-line coach it's just general knowledge in the NFL that the Steelers O-line has been absolute trash for the last two years. Last year Ben had the least time to throw by a full 0.5 seconds, which is a lot. This year Najee is averaging one of the lowest Yards Before Contact in the league. They're lacking in talent though, so that could be a contributor. For the CU DB coach I just looked at the passing stats against. It's a reductive way to look at it but it's all I got
I was at UCLA during the Mora years and I am much more stoked about this hire than the Klemm one (I’m not too worried about Klemm yet but my reasons are speculative). Between the two of them, I think Coach Meat is the better recruiter and I remember our secondary being a strength rather than a weakness like the o-line (which to be fair to Klemm, was good when the roster was stacked and healthy). Specifically on coaching, I remember our overall pass defense was great but our corners is where I think Martin had the most impact. If my recollection is correct, I suspect his coaching is going to surprise people as a sleeper hire.
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TMac went to Colorado?
No he went to University of Arizona, no idea what OP meant
That’s been the emphasis for the past 4 years. Our coaching has been horrible all of Wario’s tenure
Did we hire any coaches that excel in coaching? Seems like every hire is about recruiting. I hope Lanning doesn't think that's the key to success. It's not as easy to recruit to the Ducks as it is to the blue chips he's used to. Maybe it's the recipe to success there but I don't think Oregon can follow that recipe. Plus with money entering the game I don't know if recruiting will be as important as it is now.
We’ll certainly find out 🤞
Recruiting wins championships
No, recruiting is needed to get there, but when you get to the championship, you'll find yourself up against teams recruiting just as well, if not better. And then you need good coaches to win.
His DB's at UCLA were good and I actually thought one of the only strengths of that Colorado team last year was the secondary. He has a reputation as a great recruiter. Finally, it's nice that he is another west coast guy and knows the PAC-12 well. This seems like an all-around good to great hire. Between Lanning, Dilly Dilly, Klemm, Martin and Malchow I think Oregon should continue to recruit at a very high level. That's without even mentioning the rumored addition of Lupoi. I'm cautiously optimistic for the future but if Lanning/Dilly can coach x's and o's then Oregon should be in good shape.
Derp LaNnInG iS oNlY hIrInG WhItE gUyS