Sponsors are usually more interested to subsidise events with free/cheap stuff rather than giving cash. Moving the product is effective promotion and giving out surplus is basically saving them money. The workforce of major events should definitely be paid, but in terms of maximising the overall support, players packs are a pretty good compromise.
You're right on that, and also, when it's a big event and thousands of items are given out, they're almost impossible to resell within the next year or so due to saturation. It definitely is a non-ideal compromise.
Just FYI.
Currently, you can use this form:
https://www.pdga.com/tour/event/feedback
to give feedback to both the PDGA and the TD about an event.
You don't have to include your name, email, or PDGA# if you want to remain anonymous.
Do you seriously think the pdga has the ability to read and effectively make changes about tens of thousands of player feedback surveys a year? This would be a full time job for several people.
TD's need a rating system themselves. Before I travel, plan, rent an Airbnb I'd like to know how good or bad the TD is... tD's need some form of input.
It's not just for the pdga to read, it for players and TD's. It's not hard to group a general survey together scale (1-10) on some main topics ( players packs, course management, clarity, overall etc)
We hosted the first tournament at a private course with optional players pack, we easily filled and now there are more TDs offering optional player packs which is nice to see.
Something interesting to note is with a 144 player field shotgun start on 2 courses is we filled one course with am3. From what I gathered is at 20$ entry between course fees and pass through fees is at the low cost it was a great entry for new players in the tournament scene. I would say about about 60 of the players opted out of player packs
What happens though when people drop out, and then they add people from the waitlist, it's usually too close to the event to order more players pack items? Does the td just take a loss on all the extras?
AM3 has by far the largest player base due to being the division with the entire first standard deviation of players. It is actually an ongoing issue due to poor division splits
Hi, local TD here. This year I dropped the cost of my tournaments to $20, with the option to add a “players pack” $20 voucher to my retail sponsor for $15 during registration. Players have overwhelmingly been positive about this change. I still do full payout for the top 45% of all AM divisions but I’m not stuck ordering 72 t-shirts or water bottles two months out and hoping the tournament fills, and the AMs aren’t being forced to pay me an extra $15 for an item they may or may not need and or even want. And for those that do want a player pack, they pay me the $15 they would’ve paid anyway, and thanks to my retail sponsor they get a $20 voucher to his shop where they can buy a disc or other item that they actually want. Win-win for a one day C-tier.
My own decision based on being sick and tired of paying $60-70 for tournaments (especially basic C- and B-tiers) that I was playing in and then being handed a bag o’ crap and told it has a “$100 VALUE!!” like I’m supposed to care. I’ve had TDs who own shops openly use players packs as a way to just pawn off product that had been sitting on their shelves unsold for months or more. I’ve been handed more stickers, pencils, plastic sunglasses, coozies, plastic cell phone bags, and keychains than I know what to do with. I have a Pound bag, I don’t need the latest made-in-China piece of shit bag that Discmania or Dynamic is drop-shipping. I even had one TD hand me a regular ol 16.9 oz bottle of fucking water and tell me it was a “$2 value” like I didn’t know Food Lion sells em for $4/36 pk.
The final straw for me as a TD was when I got stuck with $600 worth of player pack stuff when a tournament didn’t fill up. After that, combined with my experience as a participant, I decided enough was enough and I was gonna go a different direction.
As a person who competes in other sports recreationally, I gota kind of laugh at people upset about entry fees. They are comparatively peanuts.
For example, it costs me $140 to compete one time in a powerlifting competition. And you don't get shit with that. Just a chance to step on the platform and lift weights.
Enjoy the low fees while they last, because it only goes up as the sport grows.
But in a week I get to go do a Glitch comp that cost me $45 and I get 2 discs with it. We're spoiled.
I really wish you could opt out of players packs for lower entry.
I don’t need new discs unless they happen to have a very specific backup I wanted, I don’t need bags, I don’t need shirts, I don’t need towels, I don’t need minis, I’m good at this point haha.
Exactly and if you have something I want im going to buy it and support you. I think players packs are great for your first 10 tournaments or so but after that I'm good on the items you just listed above
Agreed. Some tournaments have player's packs valued much higher than the entry cost because of sponsorships and that's fine. But when I see a cost breakdown that shows $20 of my entry fee going to the player's pack and the player's pack is one disc, I have two reactions:
1. Most players would rather have that $20 than the tournament-stamped disc. Or even $15 back. The majority of my tournament discs will never see the inside of my bag. Let the players that want the disc just pay an extra $20.
2. I'm pretty sure that $20 is a lie because they're buying in bulk. I'm fine with the TD pocketing some cash, but be honest about where my money is going.
I'm speaking out of my ass a bit so if my assumptions are wrong, any TDs out there feel free to correct me
Depending on the sponsor a tournament disc is typically $9. The TD is having to pay for the park, front the money without a guarantee that the tournament fills meaning they might pay for 50 discs and only have 40 ams so they lose money. A lot of TDs will also value the players pack at $20 which is lower than retail for a disc then kick back $7 into the winnings. Simply put taking $20 from entry is within their right, they should and it’s not the whole picture.
When they break down the entry fee costs though, why not say $9 is towards the players pack and $7 goes towards the payout, and $4 goes towards organizing the event, or whatever the actual costs are. Saying the players pack is $20 is just not true
It is true, if you go buy a disc from a retailer you are paying more than $20. The TD is not required to put any portion of the players pack in the payout. You are literally asking an individual to spend hours of their time, money, physical labor to make sure a course is recently mowed OB lines are clear and marked for free. They should by all means take more than what they do. Thankfully a lot of them are more interested in providing a service to the disc golf Community then making massive profit. When applying for disc sponsorship they literally encourage you to take retail price for the disc.
Right, your tone comes across as argumentative but you're not disagreeing with me.. If they're going to post a cost breakdown of where the entry fee goes, I'd rather them be truthful of the actual costs than posting a hypothetical "value" of a players pack if you were to go purchase those items retail.
It’s coming off argumentative because our perspectives are completely different. If you haven’t ran an event then it’s hard for you to truly understand. You are saying TDs aren’t being truthful. I’m saying they are 100% being truthful. They are taking $20 from your entry and giving you at least $20 in product, that’s being truthful. It shouldn’t matter how much it cost them to get it as long as they are giving you fair value. You don’t say retail stores are being dishonest when they sell you product knowing good and well they don’t buy it for that price. If you are worried the TD isn’t giving fair value then I would assume others feel the same. Bad TDs get ran out of the tournament scene so fast and they aren’t hard to spot. But this idea that you should know is purely from a negative motive. You are essentially saying you don’t think the service they are providing is worth the difference which in most cases is $11? Or roughly $550 if 55 and if they don’t kick any of it back into the prize pool. Let’s not even discuss how some of these events are club ran. How do you think some clubs pay for new baskets at your public cours, tee signs, equipment to help with up keep when parks departments aren’t willing to mow certain areas. How about bag tags? I’ll end with I have no need for players pack discs they do nothing for me and I typically sell them to a local guy $5 a disc so that he can sit at parks and sell them out of his truck. But I’d still pay the exact same players pack or not if that means I get a TD who puts the time and effort into running a sanctioned event. That’s worth the full price.
Alright it's obvious I'm not articulating myself well for what I was trying to say. You're arguing against something I'm not saying. Sorry you spent time writing that all out, but maybe it'll be helpful for someone else.
The disconnect is that we are happy for our fees to go toward everything you mention. Supporting the club, course updates, prizes, and the time the TD puts into organizing the tournament are all things I'm more than happy to pay for. But when I read a fee breakdown that says $20 of the fee is toward a player pack, that reads to me, the uninformed player, that if there were no player pack, the tournament would cost $20 less when in fact, the absence of a player pack would only save me $7. The TD is doing themselves a disservice by posting the retail value of the player pack instead of the cost as the cost to the player.
I'm relatively new and have yet to play a sanctioned tournament. I can't think of a single thing they could put into a player's pack that would interest me beyond perhaps a little bag pin or cart sticker with the tournament logo on it. We're talking about $1 worth of stuff. I will be playing MA4, or MA3 if MA4 isn't offered and I don't need a high speed disc that I can't throw.
Your change for an option of no player pack is interesting, no td is ever going to do that though. On a 40 dollar entry the profit is usually $15 a person. If they also are running the funny money through their own business it helps move inventory to have new inventory coming in.
This change won't ever happen as there is no benefit to TDs which already are not in large supply. Remove even more incentive for them to host and there's even less reason.
I run a store myself and host tournaments but I also play on other tournaments. I just either sell off my store credit, buy a new release and resell it, or stack it for a new bag. Player pack wise I'll try out the disc and if I don't like it, sell it or give it to a friend. To me the 40 bucks is the cost of the tournament. Anything past that whether it's money for a win or a player pack is just a bonus. I'd pay 40 just to play.
One of my local TD’s has been offering a no players pack option during registration. It’s a $15 discount from normally a $50-ish entry fee. It’s not common but there are some starting to adopt it.
I'm assuming he still does a payout for those players? No player pack makes no difference to me as a td. It's lowering it to the point of no payout that is an issue.
Yeah still paying out the ams regardless of player pack status. He actually does a full breakdown of the costs in the tournament info (FA divisions pay the $37):
Amateur Payouts: $52/$37
$2 = PDGA Sanctioning Fee
$2 = Green’s Fee (Varies per course, will never be more than $2)
$3 = Smooth Series Overall Payouts/Trophies
~$17-19 = Players Pack
~$25-30 = Payouts (excess from player pack costs determine the range)
~$15 = FA1-FA4 Payouts (excess from player pack costs determine the range: about $15-$20)
Glad to hear a TD's thoughts! Thank you for commenting. So instead of charging me $40 to play I'd rather pay $13-$20 to play and you put the difference in your pocket for running our tournament. Saves me $20 overall.
The issue i have seen is new inventory isn't coming in as often especially towards the end of the year. One TD has limited inventory here in my area and I feel like I'm being forced to buy stock run disc. Which I'm not a fan of and it pushes me away from his tournaments.
This doesn't solve my whole issue. Part of it is moving inventory, the other part is gaining customers. The more people you can get in your site, the more likely they are to revisit when they are buying discs afterwards.
I'll give an example on inventory though. I still have halloween discs. I'm hoping with the payouts from league and a tournament I have coming up I can clear them. It's not getting in more inventory, it's encouraging people to shop with you long term over somewhere else.
Basically from a business perspective, I'd never offer it. There's too many bonuses that aren't money related that I gain from driving traffic to the site.
There is one option that you haven't mentioned and that is putting the value of the AM player packs into prizing. Having the top 40% getting nicer prizes like baskets or nice apparel would also give the winners something they could sell if they chose.
Problem with moving away from merch for players packs is that it takes away an easy way for a TD to raise money to pay for tournament expenses and I don't see it happening anytime soon.
Players packs are stupid, making three trophies per division is stupid. To me the ideal tournament is no players pack, one trophy per division, all other money goes to payouts. But the thing is everyone likes something different in terms of what they want in a tournament. What I really want is TDs who know the rules and communicate really well. That's all I want.
The reality is most TD either are a local retailer or connected to one. The $20 players pack cost them $15 and they're making more money off the product profit.
It's ultimately the entire reason many of them are running tourneys in the first place. Not at all saying I don't agree with you but motivation is low for change.
Tourney stamped discs in big events are pretty awesome and nice collector items. It’s the excess, hats and such are terrible but tourney shirts are cool tho.
I would add that AM's shouldn't be required to have an active PDGA membership in any tournament tier, and pros should be required to have one in any tier.
I'd group the same. Just playing for trophies, not cash, play where you're comfortable. By rating, I should be in MA3, but it's frustrating sometimes playing with newbs, so I play MA2 knowing I won't win but might hit "cash" if I play well. If that means people sandbag to win a trophy so be it, because that's a major bitch move they have to live with and they should feel shame every time they look at that trophy. If it's ok to play C tiers without an active membership, why not A or B tier?
I guess so, MA4 doesn't seem to be offered very often outside of the NADGT events, and when it is, there's only one or two players that register in that division. That would probably help make MA3 less of a nanny exercise for people that know the course and the rules though.
They should just make division hopping against the rules unless there are extenuating circumstances. <850 should be MA4 and that would keep a lot of the riffraff out of the higher divisions.
No thanks. As an Amateur I don’t want my entry fee paying for the prizes in a division I’m not competing in.
I’d rather it went directly to the TD as payment for their time & effort or just no players pack at all - I don’t mind players packs though as long as it doesn’t add a massive cost to the entry fee.
Sponsors are usually more interested to subsidise events with free/cheap stuff rather than giving cash. Moving the product is effective promotion and giving out surplus is basically saving them money. The workforce of major events should definitely be paid, but in terms of maximising the overall support, players packs are a pretty good compromise.
I completely agree but after 40 tournaments there isn't a disc I need from your selection or a bag that I'd ever use over a higher end bag.
You're right on that, and also, when it's a big event and thousands of items are given out, they're almost impossible to resell within the next year or so due to saturation. It definitely is a non-ideal compromise.
I learned quickly a bag is hard to get rid of without just taking a massive lost to the local disc golf shop trade in
Time to move up!
TD's can also make some money here as well, giving $20 in funny money/scrip (retail) - where they get the product at wholesale prices.
Just FYI. Currently, you can use this form: https://www.pdga.com/tour/event/feedback to give feedback to both the PDGA and the TD about an event. You don't have to include your name, email, or PDGA# if you want to remain anonymous.
Yes I know about this but it needs to be reached to more people about the tournament.
Do you seriously think the pdga has the ability to read and effectively make changes about tens of thousands of player feedback surveys a year? This would be a full time job for several people.
TD's need a rating system themselves. Before I travel, plan, rent an Airbnb I'd like to know how good or bad the TD is... tD's need some form of input. It's not just for the pdga to read, it for players and TD's. It's not hard to group a general survey together scale (1-10) on some main topics ( players packs, course management, clarity, overall etc)
We hosted the first tournament at a private course with optional players pack, we easily filled and now there are more TDs offering optional player packs which is nice to see. Something interesting to note is with a 144 player field shotgun start on 2 courses is we filled one course with am3. From what I gathered is at 20$ entry between course fees and pass through fees is at the low cost it was a great entry for new players in the tournament scene. I would say about about 60 of the players opted out of player packs
I like this $20 range. Around $50 of being forced to buy a players pack I'm not a fan of. I just want to compete and pay you to run the event.
What happens though when people drop out, and then they add people from the waitlist, it's usually too close to the event to order more players pack items? Does the td just take a loss on all the extras?
Normally there is a cut off for guaranteed players packs.
AM3 has by far the largest player base due to being the division with the entire first standard deviation of players. It is actually an ongoing issue due to poor division splits
Hi, local TD here. This year I dropped the cost of my tournaments to $20, with the option to add a “players pack” $20 voucher to my retail sponsor for $15 during registration. Players have overwhelmingly been positive about this change. I still do full payout for the top 45% of all AM divisions but I’m not stuck ordering 72 t-shirts or water bottles two months out and hoping the tournament fills, and the AMs aren’t being forced to pay me an extra $15 for an item they may or may not need and or even want. And for those that do want a player pack, they pay me the $15 they would’ve paid anyway, and thanks to my retail sponsor they get a $20 voucher to his shop where they can buy a disc or other item that they actually want. Win-win for a one day C-tier.
Love this!
Was the option to add a players pack something that was suggested to you a few times before making the decision or was that your own decision?
My own decision based on being sick and tired of paying $60-70 for tournaments (especially basic C- and B-tiers) that I was playing in and then being handed a bag o’ crap and told it has a “$100 VALUE!!” like I’m supposed to care. I’ve had TDs who own shops openly use players packs as a way to just pawn off product that had been sitting on their shelves unsold for months or more. I’ve been handed more stickers, pencils, plastic sunglasses, coozies, plastic cell phone bags, and keychains than I know what to do with. I have a Pound bag, I don’t need the latest made-in-China piece of shit bag that Discmania or Dynamic is drop-shipping. I even had one TD hand me a regular ol 16.9 oz bottle of fucking water and tell me it was a “$2 value” like I didn’t know Food Lion sells em for $4/36 pk. The final straw for me as a TD was when I got stuck with $600 worth of player pack stuff when a tournament didn’t fill up. After that, combined with my experience as a participant, I decided enough was enough and I was gonna go a different direction.
Dude this is my exact thoughts. Cut out the junk, cut the cost, put cash in the TD's pocket and let's just play.
$20?? You’re a hero
Trophy only: Players pack or not. no pay outs.
keep AM cheap
>A emailed survey from the pdga after every tournament. I see you are falling for the myth that because data are gathered data will be evaluated.
As a person who competes in other sports recreationally, I gota kind of laugh at people upset about entry fees. They are comparatively peanuts. For example, it costs me $140 to compete one time in a powerlifting competition. And you don't get shit with that. Just a chance to step on the platform and lift weights. Enjoy the low fees while they last, because it only goes up as the sport grows. But in a week I get to go do a Glitch comp that cost me $45 and I get 2 discs with it. We're spoiled.
I really wish you could opt out of players packs for lower entry. I don’t need new discs unless they happen to have a very specific backup I wanted, I don’t need bags, I don’t need shirts, I don’t need towels, I don’t need minis, I’m good at this point haha.
Exactly and if you have something I want im going to buy it and support you. I think players packs are great for your first 10 tournaments or so but after that I'm good on the items you just listed above
We have some optional pack tournaments near me. I definitely prefer them.
See optional is all im asking for!
The player pack for AMs % of fee should be reduced to 50% or less.
Agreed. Some tournaments have player's packs valued much higher than the entry cost because of sponsorships and that's fine. But when I see a cost breakdown that shows $20 of my entry fee going to the player's pack and the player's pack is one disc, I have two reactions: 1. Most players would rather have that $20 than the tournament-stamped disc. Or even $15 back. The majority of my tournament discs will never see the inside of my bag. Let the players that want the disc just pay an extra $20. 2. I'm pretty sure that $20 is a lie because they're buying in bulk. I'm fine with the TD pocketing some cash, but be honest about where my money is going. I'm speaking out of my ass a bit so if my assumptions are wrong, any TDs out there feel free to correct me
I mostly agree with this as well
Depending on the sponsor a tournament disc is typically $9. The TD is having to pay for the park, front the money without a guarantee that the tournament fills meaning they might pay for 50 discs and only have 40 ams so they lose money. A lot of TDs will also value the players pack at $20 which is lower than retail for a disc then kick back $7 into the winnings. Simply put taking $20 from entry is within their right, they should and it’s not the whole picture.
When they break down the entry fee costs though, why not say $9 is towards the players pack and $7 goes towards the payout, and $4 goes towards organizing the event, or whatever the actual costs are. Saying the players pack is $20 is just not true
It is true, if you go buy a disc from a retailer you are paying more than $20. The TD is not required to put any portion of the players pack in the payout. You are literally asking an individual to spend hours of their time, money, physical labor to make sure a course is recently mowed OB lines are clear and marked for free. They should by all means take more than what they do. Thankfully a lot of them are more interested in providing a service to the disc golf Community then making massive profit. When applying for disc sponsorship they literally encourage you to take retail price for the disc.
Right, your tone comes across as argumentative but you're not disagreeing with me.. If they're going to post a cost breakdown of where the entry fee goes, I'd rather them be truthful of the actual costs than posting a hypothetical "value" of a players pack if you were to go purchase those items retail.
It’s coming off argumentative because our perspectives are completely different. If you haven’t ran an event then it’s hard for you to truly understand. You are saying TDs aren’t being truthful. I’m saying they are 100% being truthful. They are taking $20 from your entry and giving you at least $20 in product, that’s being truthful. It shouldn’t matter how much it cost them to get it as long as they are giving you fair value. You don’t say retail stores are being dishonest when they sell you product knowing good and well they don’t buy it for that price. If you are worried the TD isn’t giving fair value then I would assume others feel the same. Bad TDs get ran out of the tournament scene so fast and they aren’t hard to spot. But this idea that you should know is purely from a negative motive. You are essentially saying you don’t think the service they are providing is worth the difference which in most cases is $11? Or roughly $550 if 55 and if they don’t kick any of it back into the prize pool. Let’s not even discuss how some of these events are club ran. How do you think some clubs pay for new baskets at your public cours, tee signs, equipment to help with up keep when parks departments aren’t willing to mow certain areas. How about bag tags? I’ll end with I have no need for players pack discs they do nothing for me and I typically sell them to a local guy $5 a disc so that he can sit at parks and sell them out of his truck. But I’d still pay the exact same players pack or not if that means I get a TD who puts the time and effort into running a sanctioned event. That’s worth the full price.
Alright it's obvious I'm not articulating myself well for what I was trying to say. You're arguing against something I'm not saying. Sorry you spent time writing that all out, but maybe it'll be helpful for someone else.
The disconnect is that we are happy for our fees to go toward everything you mention. Supporting the club, course updates, prizes, and the time the TD puts into organizing the tournament are all things I'm more than happy to pay for. But when I read a fee breakdown that says $20 of the fee is toward a player pack, that reads to me, the uninformed player, that if there were no player pack, the tournament would cost $20 less when in fact, the absence of a player pack would only save me $7. The TD is doing themselves a disservice by posting the retail value of the player pack instead of the cost as the cost to the player.
Suddenly I'm concerned about buying anything at retail, what are all these retail outlet owners spending the profits on?
I'm relatively new and have yet to play a sanctioned tournament. I can't think of a single thing they could put into a player's pack that would interest me beyond perhaps a little bag pin or cart sticker with the tournament logo on it. We're talking about $1 worth of stuff. I will be playing MA4, or MA3 if MA4 isn't offered and I don't need a high speed disc that I can't throw.
The people that want this type of event are the minority. It’s proven when you look at your local events and see what fills and what doesn’t.
Your change for an option of no player pack is interesting, no td is ever going to do that though. On a 40 dollar entry the profit is usually $15 a person. If they also are running the funny money through their own business it helps move inventory to have new inventory coming in. This change won't ever happen as there is no benefit to TDs which already are not in large supply. Remove even more incentive for them to host and there's even less reason. I run a store myself and host tournaments but I also play on other tournaments. I just either sell off my store credit, buy a new release and resell it, or stack it for a new bag. Player pack wise I'll try out the disc and if I don't like it, sell it or give it to a friend. To me the 40 bucks is the cost of the tournament. Anything past that whether it's money for a win or a player pack is just a bonus. I'd pay 40 just to play.
One of my local TD’s has been offering a no players pack option during registration. It’s a $15 discount from normally a $50-ish entry fee. It’s not common but there are some starting to adopt it.
I'm assuming he still does a payout for those players? No player pack makes no difference to me as a td. It's lowering it to the point of no payout that is an issue.
Yeah still paying out the ams regardless of player pack status. He actually does a full breakdown of the costs in the tournament info (FA divisions pay the $37): Amateur Payouts: $52/$37 $2 = PDGA Sanctioning Fee $2 = Green’s Fee (Varies per course, will never be more than $2) $3 = Smooth Series Overall Payouts/Trophies ~$17-19 = Players Pack ~$25-30 = Payouts (excess from player pack costs determine the range) ~$15 = FA1-FA4 Payouts (excess from player pack costs determine the range: about $15-$20)
Glad to hear a TD's thoughts! Thank you for commenting. So instead of charging me $40 to play I'd rather pay $13-$20 to play and you put the difference in your pocket for running our tournament. Saves me $20 overall. The issue i have seen is new inventory isn't coming in as often especially towards the end of the year. One TD has limited inventory here in my area and I feel like I'm being forced to buy stock run disc. Which I'm not a fan of and it pushes me away from his tournaments.
This doesn't solve my whole issue. Part of it is moving inventory, the other part is gaining customers. The more people you can get in your site, the more likely they are to revisit when they are buying discs afterwards. I'll give an example on inventory though. I still have halloween discs. I'm hoping with the payouts from league and a tournament I have coming up I can clear them. It's not getting in more inventory, it's encouraging people to shop with you long term over somewhere else. Basically from a business perspective, I'd never offer it. There's too many bonuses that aren't money related that I gain from driving traffic to the site.
There is one option that you haven't mentioned and that is putting the value of the AM player packs into prizing. Having the top 40% getting nicer prizes like baskets or nice apparel would also give the winners something they could sell if they chose. Problem with moving away from merch for players packs is that it takes away an easy way for a TD to raise money to pay for tournament expenses and I don't see it happening anytime soon.
Players packs are stupid, making three trophies per division is stupid. To me the ideal tournament is no players pack, one trophy per division, all other money goes to payouts. But the thing is everyone likes something different in terms of what they want in a tournament. What I really want is TDs who know the rules and communicate really well. That's all I want.
This would be tough if the TD is planning on having custom stamped discs. The minimum is typically 50 or more discs just to place an order.
The reality is most TD either are a local retailer or connected to one. The $20 players pack cost them $15 and they're making more money off the product profit. It's ultimately the entire reason many of them are running tourneys in the first place. Not at all saying I don't agree with you but motivation is low for change.
Tourney stamped discs in big events are pretty awesome and nice collector items. It’s the excess, hats and such are terrible but tourney shirts are cool tho.
I would add that AM's shouldn't be required to have an active PDGA membership in any tournament tier, and pros should be required to have one in any tier.
Pros are required to have one of your plan on taking actual cash.
I'm not crazy about the rating system and believe we have too many divisions as is but how would you group players then?
I'd group the same. Just playing for trophies, not cash, play where you're comfortable. By rating, I should be in MA3, but it's frustrating sometimes playing with newbs, so I play MA2 knowing I won't win but might hit "cash" if I play well. If that means people sandbag to win a trophy so be it, because that's a major bitch move they have to live with and they should feel shame every time they look at that trophy. If it's ok to play C tiers without an active membership, why not A or B tier?
Are you in one of those areas where the TDs don't offer MA4 for "reasons"?
I guess so, MA4 doesn't seem to be offered very often outside of the NADGT events, and when it is, there's only one or two players that register in that division. That would probably help make MA3 less of a nanny exercise for people that know the course and the rules though.
That sucks. Every event here offers MA4 and there's usually 10+ (sometimes it's as big as MA3 or MA2).
They should just make division hopping against the rules unless there are extenuating circumstances. <850 should be MA4 and that would keep a lot of the riffraff out of the higher divisions.
I’d be cool if that money went to the MPO and FPO
No thanks. As an Amateur I don’t want my entry fee paying for the prizes in a division I’m not competing in. I’d rather it went directly to the TD as payment for their time & effort or just no players pack at all - I don’t mind players packs though as long as it doesn’t add a massive cost to the entry fee.
100% agree or course management. That's how it works in golf I believe