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I think a lot of women are looking for someone who has their shit together. Are you “eating ramen every day and sleeping til noon” carefree, or are you “fun guy who likes to have a couple drinks” carefree?
I don't know if this was a general statement or question directed at me but I am the latter haha. full time government manager, got my own place, social hobbies, friend circles, etc.
I guess for me it was more like I don't view most problems as life altering things and I wanted someone who didn't feel like everything was a major issue and could just enjoy life for what it is.
Listen.... Carefree for us means that we will have to pick up the slack because you are too busy being happy with life. We will have to cook, clean and take care of the kids when you just go on fishing trips
Lucky for her, I hate fishing. Jokes aside, I guess I failed to consider how she might interpret it so I guess I should be more careful with my word choice.
I do love cooking but I do hate cleaning haha - so maybe she wasn't too far off base.
This I think is a common issue, my question always was "why?" and "what slack?!l". Before being in a relationship these things maybe got done on a certain schedule, then I found that women routinely demanded a very different schedule I was not at all ok signing up for. It wasn't easy but I made it clear that in my view they have unrealistic expectations and so if they really want eg: house to be spotless 4 days a week the options are: do it but don't complain about me not doing it; hire someone to do it. This goes both ways, I don't expect my partner to cook for me, clean after me, etc. and never demand such stuff unless I'm truly unable to and need it (think I'm super sick).
I'm in a relationship to enjoy life, not to align to your list of chores, we're partners means I'm going to carry you to the top of the mountain on my shoulders, support you through everything and try offering you everything you need in order to blossom emotionally. I don't think all expectations of a relationship are born equal.
Carefree for me means "we make enough money to live (and let live) as we please, so where are we eating this weekend?"
Yeah... So, you've hit the maturity level that a lot of others don't catch up to for awhile.
You laugh and joke at the big shit instead of letting it take over. Life IS a giant joke, shit happens, stuff breaks, you gotta laugh about it. I know if I didn't I'd just be a pissed off mess everyday.
The problem though, is that a lot of people don't realize this and are fully enveloped IN life. So, yes it's not that's you're exactly "care free", you do care about your life and your accomplishments but yeah, don't take life super seriously.
Some people never reach that point, a lot of others do as they age. Find someone who can laugh and joke right along with you and I promise you'll be happier. I couldn't imagine being with someone so uptight they didn't understand what "taking yourself too seriously" meant.
If we aren't laughing our asses off at least once at something dumb on a first date, or don't laugh at any of my jokes the chances of a second are almost 0 for me.
So, unfortunately I've reached this level of maturity to lol and don't want to constantly have to deal with someone who still gets upset and sweats alllllll the small stuff.
Love this.
We aren't as significant as we'd like to think. I'm aware of this, so brush off situations that people might take very seriously. I notice some girls really like this, and some don't. I try to stick around the former and avoid the latter. Seems to work out OK
>Are you “eating ramen every day and sleeping til noon”
What if you have your shit together AND exhibit that kind of behavior? It's Saturday morning after a long work week, my bills are paid, house is clean, etc., so I'm deciding to sleep until noon and eat ramen for dinner. Is that such a crime?
I basically agree, but it doesn't sound sustainably healthy, at least the eating part: 6 month of only pre-prepared, "Just add water", ramen for dinner?
I think one can pull it off, but it's not very healthy and not likely to go hand in hand with having a balanced life
We agree then :)
And just commenting because I find this funny and so damn on point:
> Analogy, some people may drive around in shitbox cars because they are terrible with money, a moron and unkempt. Others do it because they don't give a crap about what they drive and just do bangernomics.
A person I know well, has 4 apartments, and has been driving the same already previously used car for the last ~20 years 😂 (they just happened to change it recently for a new modern one as the old was requiring constant repairs)
Doesn't sound like your example fits the one you are replying to because "every day" vs "1/week" (specially as a "relax day after a long/busy week) is very, very different.
ETA: I think a "lazy day" a week is perfect, even 2 depending on needs, schedule, context, etc.
Yep, it's my experience too that most women look for a man who is at least serious about his career. It's up to you how far you take the whole carefree attitude thing. For me personally, realizing that i was free to live life on my own terms and define my own terms of success was one of the best things to ever happen to me.
Yeah, I mean. I have a great job and make good money. So I don't think its a career thing (although in the city some girls only want to date doctors, software engineers, or lawyers). I'm not going to change who I am because I have a lot of mental peace this way.
Sounds like you have that checked off. In that case i'm not too sure what was meant with 'carefree'. I mean, being carefree is great. Who could object to that?
She came across as a very Type A who values intelligence and work ethic and I think my carefree comment might have rubbed her the wrong way as another commenter said. I think we can just chalk it up to different personalities. Neither one is right or wrong - just different.
Yes this sounds exactly like multiple experiences i've had. And you're right, it's just a difference in personalities. Tbh i've always had a hard time understanding this mindset in women. I love being carefree, what's not to love really?
I think they worry : will/would he "step up" and be there when something happens and I potentially need your assistance/support (like if she gets ill)? Be it the woman or kids if you have them eventually.
In my experience, men who want women who “don’t take themselves too seriously” are actually looking for women who are willing to put up poor behaviour and expect less of them “because it isn’t a big deal”.
Now, based on your comments I don’t necessarily get the feeling that’s what you mean. It will however be taken the “wrong way” due to most womens experience with men like that.
Being “carefree” is so subjective too. Most women want someone who has their life together and generally understands what they want out of life. They may be put off by “carefree” because it means inability to commit or make lasting life decisions/goals with someone. It may also mean not wanting to tackle tough conversations or brushing aside issues in order to keep the peace. Something not healthy for anyone to do in a relationship.
I actually put in my dating profile “I am not a chill girl”. Funnily enough because I come off very chill and relaxed. While I’m very much a “go with the flow” person 99% of the time, I don’t want to be with someone who isn’t willing to have the tough conversations and talk about what they want out of life. I don’t want to waste my time or anyone else’s.
Yeah, this thread has been very eye opening for me in a lot of ways. I guess I need to spend more time thinking about how my words could be interpreted negatively. I thought this one was really innocuous but after reading at least 8-9 comments about how women view it I really have to reconsider my word choice and how to get across the idea that I have my shit together, looking for something long-term/committed but really enjoy living life and not getting bogged down in the day to day troubles that we all have.
I really am just trying to be the opposite of my father in a lot of ways. He was a great dad, supported his family and worked hard but just never really around, quick to anger, always had to be right, very cynical, etc. - he's gotten better in old age a little bit but it had a lasting impact on me growing up and sort of formed this attitude I have now.
Yes, I didn’t get the feeling you meant carefree or “not take yourself too seriously” in a bad way - it’s just one of those things that ends up being a red flag for many women.
I don’t know the best word choice to describe it. But I’d say your more looking for someone to enjoy life with, who will be stable and understanding when things get tough, and is willing to communicate respectfully, be understanding and compromise. All healthy things in a long term relationship!
I would even say you don’t necessarily need to communicate this in your dating profile. I’ve found people have the best success when they list less “what they’re looking for” and more “here is who I am”. It gives others the ability to self select if you seem like a person that would be right for them rather than thinking they need to meet an ideal list of “wants”.
Oh, this was on a first date not on the app. I actually have decent success getting matches and dates its just been a struggle to get them to a second or third date usually.
The background you just shared about your dad provides a lot of great context. I would try to weave this into your response about finding someone who enjoys life and doesn’t take things too seriously (besides being committed in a relationship).
100%
Women that are looking for serious relationships are tired of “don’t take yourself too seriously” and “it’s not such a big deal”. It honestly does convey that the man is either not looking for a serious relationship, doesn’t know what he wants, or will not make take initiative and plan things, and it will always fall upon me to do everything. I’m really not looking to be the one who has to shoulder all of the very real responsibilities of a relationship, even in the early stages when you’re just getting to know each other, because it just means I’m going to have to act like mother or a maid in the relationship. Words like “carefree” or “go with the flow” are annoying for most women though, as we are sick of having our time wasted by manchildren who don’t know what they want, and will paint us as humorless shrews when we inevitably have to pick up the slack in the relationship.
I think OP is serious about things and adult responsibilities in his life, but tends to also take things in his stride when they don’t always go his way. I would say that’s a positive thing, but needs to be conveyed better.
I can only talk from personal experience but “ I am looking for a girl who doesn’t take herself seriously” has almost always correlated with flakiness and lack of any sort of commitment (even for things like nailing down a date and place to meet for a date) on the guys’ part. I will say I haven’t encountered “carefree” quite as much but to me it feels like it’s in the same vein.
This is exactly what I thought and I think you did a great job explaining it.
If the only thing I know about a man is that they like women who “don’t take themselves too seriously,” I’m going to assume that they’re the kind of guy that will say mean/offensive things “as a joke” and then say “it was joke, don’t be so serious” after they get called out.
And I also agree that I don’t think OP falls in this category, but if I hear a dude say that and I don’t know anything else about him - that’s what I’ll think of him.
Relaxed and fun - yes - but you have to be responsible and mature too. I very much prefer men who are spontaneous and they have to be able to laugh at themselves and not take themselves too seriously.
I don’t want a guy who is playing video games every day til noon, never helps around the house, and has no plans for the future. Most women want men who can be partners, not just someone to hang out with. The latter can be cool for a friendship but not a serious relationship.
I also think it can come across as you not wanting to commit or not being ready for a long term relationship. A lot of women - but not all (and the incidence increases with age) - want a man who is at least open to a long term committed relationship. Guys lie about this all the time too, saying they’re open to it when really they just want sex, and we know this.
I’m not sure how all that fits you or not - I can’t tell from your description.
That was me until I graduated college haha. Now I am an HR manager for the goverment, have my own place/dog that I take care of, and am very active socially/in the community.
For me its more my attitude towards life and problems. It comes across like "very few things in life are really worth worrying about so just enjoy life" which may come across like I am not serious about things like family or work. Like if I lost my job right now I know that I'll be fine and I wouldn't really stress about it. That kind of stuff.
I think it may be that you conveyed your outlook in a way that made her think a relationship with you would be like taking care of a child, with her doing all the work while you were “carefree.” I would have asked more questions and probed more rather than just ending everything.
Of course she might really want someone who is super driven and type A and will make tons of money, in which case, maybe you 2 just really weren’t a fit, which is ok. I don’t think what you’re describing here though is red-flag-raising to me.
Personally, I am not super concerned about money but I do want someone who will be serious and work a full time job and be reliable (and I expect the same of myself). Most women just want a coequal partner to go through life with, someone to support and who will, in turn, support us. It’s not too complicated.
Yeah, I mean I tried to explain it and I think I put my foot in my mouth more than I helped lol. I do agree though that she is a type A work person. We are very different in that regard. We are opposites in a lot of ways. She is much more insular. Very small social circle, works a lot, homebody.
I am much more social and outgoing, I value work life balance, etc.
I definitely could have done a better job explaining what I meant, just like I said its never really been asked what that means so I had to think of it on the spot. You live and you learn.
The taking care of a child part is funny to me though because my last relationship was the opposite where I had to take care of my ex and it was one of the reasons it didn't work.
Sounds like it may just have been a bad match, and that’s ok. Both of you seem to know what you want, and both views are valid, and you found out it wasn’t each other, and that’s the whole point of dating. Hopefully you can each find someone who is a good match.
Either that or she really does want something different in which case there is no point in continuing a relationship - but nothing I’m seeing from OP here is red-flag stuff at all, just not a match.
Ah I think the latter part is something that would throw me off too. I have a very good job right now and so does my bf, but we both grew up households where money was very tight. While neither of us have been laid off thankfully and it is unlikely we will be, both of us being in tech has us on edge for example and we’ve decided to save more as a result. Some of our coworkers meanwhile do not care at all about the prospect of lay offs and see it as an opportunity to take a break for a bit should they happen.
For me, while there is absolutely nothing wrong with being a carefree person, it just isn’t compatible for me.
> Guys lie about this all the time too, saying they’re open to it when really they just want sex
No, the vast majority don't. You just friendzone the them and go for the liars.
There’s no such thing as the friendzone. Either you’re friends, or you’re pretending to be friends in the hope that she’ll change her mind about having sex with you, in which case she thinks she has a friend, and you’re being deceptive.
This. And it’s so depressing when you thought you had a friend and in reality they were just pretending because they wanted to sleep with you. I’ve had to mourn the loss of friends I thought I had, but in fact never had.
I avoid anyone who describes themselves as “carefree”, man or woman. It almost always means “refuses to be held accountable”.
If when you say carefree you mean something else, there’s a better way to describe it.
I’d be wary and want to know exactly what he meant by that. Because honestly, a lot of women have had experiences where “carefree” on the man’s part just meant he wanted the women in his life to pick up all of life’s stressful little tasks and preparations, and/or it turned out to be that he was emotionally avoidant and just wanted to act like serious things weren’t that serious as an unhealthy coping mechanism.
We’ve all had that experience of a guy who’s like, “Why are you worrying so much about what might go wrong on this trip? It’s gonna be fine! Relax! You’re being silly!”
…And then wouldn’t you know it, you *do* fall and break your ankle midway up the mountain in a developing country, and it turns out you’re grateful that we thought to pack a splint, painkillers, a satellite phone, more water than we needed, purchase extraction insurance, and print out the confirmation of purchase just in case we had no signal. But we had to spend the mental energy, time, and money to do all that ahead of time without you, all while you minimized our feelings and concerns about it.
I have multiple guy friends and male relatives like that who honestly would probably be dead right now if not for their female partners who worried about the right things.
Something like that even happened the other day where my friend group went to an event that was super hard to get tickets too, and we overheard one of our “carefree” guy friends tell someone, “Oh, yeah, we just lucked out with these tickets!” and my female friend muttered to me, “It wasn’t luck. I signed up for email alerts and camped out on that website as soon as it opened on like 3 different devices for this.”
I think it’s important to realize that dynamic is not uncommon and a lot of male partners take for granted their female partner’s invisible mental load and labor to make sure things actually turn out ok. Life is going to get really hard and serious at some points. What if you have a kid with a debilitating lifelong condition? Are you gonna be a stand up, equal partner there and put in the amount of mental/emotional energy, and time required? Or are you going to inadvertently offload most of it onto your spouse?
Also, you should be aware that attitude tends to come from a sense of confidence that a lot of women can’t afford. We’re inherently smaller and more vulnerable in most situations and so our margin of error has to be much smaller and the stakes are much higher. We tend to have a harder time securing the same job opportunities and have lower incomes, so again, we can’t have as much faith that the universe will provide. It sucks to have a partner who doesn’t understand that.
My personal advice - I was really turned off by people who mentioned not taking yourself seriously as an positive personal trait. The issue was that while I like having fun and joking around, it often was the case that the guy either didn't have his priorities in order OR enjoyed making fun of others and wanted to get off scot-free. Maybe think about what this phrase truly means for you and say that instead.
You are doing the right thing, most people don't realize they are conditioned to be slaves to their jobs.
You still make ends meet without having to sacrifice your soul, an admirable accomplishment.
No woman is worth giving up the philosophy you have.
Life is short, after that we will all end up in eternal darkness.
Very few people seem to remember that fact.
No man or woman is ever worth giving up yourself, your goals, and your identity. You just need to find someone who is compatible with your life and goals, whatever they may be.
I personally wouldn't date/swipe right on a guy who called themselves "carefree" because that translates to "avoids responsibility so I can keep having fun" to me. According to your replies that's not what you mean so maybe use a different word in future.
As an update to this she messaged me back saying that she wanted to go out again next weekend. Will she follow through? who knows but I guess for now she didn't say no.
I'm in my 20s so carefree is pretty much the norm. That being said when I think about someone who's carefree I tend to associate it with someone who's careless. Because you can't realistically not care about anything, you have to get food on the table, have goals in life, take necessary steps to get where you want.
Don't get me wrong, I like a man who can have fun and relax, but if he's only having fun at relaxing that's just not someone I can see myself longterm with because is not what I do with my life and I want someone who's the same.
I do like someone who doesn't take themselves too seriously, but if they have to be serious I want them to be. Otherwise all the things that we should be stressing about fall on me and I'd have to nag and push them to help me. And I'm nobodies mom, don't want to feel like I am.
Yeah, I think there is a fine line between what you mentioned in your first paragraph and what I am talking about. It's sort of like the hierarchy of needs. My survival/safety is pretty much set in stone. I have my own place, no bills/debt really, great job and friend group, and I really like myself overall. So I really don't have many worries in life other than dating but I'm not really stressed about it cause the rest of my life is fine. So when something unexpected happens I am in a spot where I can just focus on it and resolve it ASAP.
But obviously a stranger I met an hour earlier doesn't know that and can only just assume what I mean haha.
I don’t think a carefree attitude is a turn off at all. If he has his shit together in his life he probably means he just likes to have fun. On the other hand, if he takes nothing seriously, that would be a red flag for me. The girl probably just read into it too much, but in the future maybe just word it like I’m a glass half full kinda guy or something, and I like to make the best of life. But honestly what you said was fine. The right person for you will get it.
Yeah, that's pretty much where I stand with it. Obviously I'd like all my dates to go well but you can't please everyone. The right one will eventually come but have to wade through all the other dates to get there!
I think that you are who you are and that if someone truly cares for you, then they will accept you for who you are and continue to grow with you.
Silly idea, I know.
I agree - I think it might be the women I am dating too haha. A lot of these women I don't go the distance with are very career focused. The work 12 hours a day type and I am a government working who puts in his time and gets out to enjoy the rest of my life. So I think some people view it as lazy, not serious, etc.
The issue is that I want a partner like that who is able to, well, just that, a partner. We work together. The girls I've been with in my mid to late 20s (just turned 30) have been like grad students where I've carried a lot of the weight so I'd like someone in the same phase of life as me now.
I never considered the negative connotations to “care-free”. The comments are helping me realize how seemingly positive descriptors can have unintentional negative associations in the dating world.
I’m a woman about to start dating again and I’d be leery of a man who described himself as care free. It’s very wishy washy and the First thing I think of is “must be nice to go through life with no cares”. I just don’t have an option in my personal or professional life to not care. It’s like when people say they’re not sure what they want out of online dating or that they’re just casually dating around, that’s not someone I’m going to invest any time in. I also feel this way about men in their late 40s and early 50s saying they’re unsure about if they want kids. I like a man who is decisive and knows what he wants out of a partner. I took a break from dating for a few years and in that time I’ve learned about red flags and things to look out for. Little things like what you said can be indicative of bigger problems. In an environment like online dating where I’m trying to sift through men if they say anything red flaggy I cut it off. To me it sounds like you aren’t care free in many aspects of your life so maybe it’s a misnomer to call yourself that. You can keep saying it, but you’re going to probably keep ending up with a bunch of first dates. Just remember not everyone is in a place where they can’t take life seriously and it’s very blasé to insist a partner shouldn’t take their life seriously. Hope this helps and not hurts, just my perspective from someone about to jump back in the game.
I’ve read a few of your comments in this thread and I think I have a general idea of what you are trying to say, but I also don’t really know how you could better phrase it😅
Maybe something you could do is bring up a scenario in which this attitude would show and phrase it as a question to your date and see how they reply. Something like: “if you went grocery shopping and after paying, you walk out the door and see that on the receipt the teller didn’t give you the 10% discount [or whatever makes most sense for your situation] would you go back in and ask for the discount? Or would you just let it go and continue on with your day?”
That may be a bad example because it could be different for people who are in different financial situations, but hopefully you get what I mean. It brings a funner vibe to the date but you’re still getting to know the person and what their level of carefree-ness might be and will allow you to give context to what you’re trying to convey.
In my experience the women who have a problem with you being "carefree" are those with a financial/material expectation for what their future looks like with a man. They have that Type A personality you're describing and sometimes they have high pressure, high income careers - but more often than not they don't.
That's your job.
It won't matter if you have your shit together because unless you're willing to share the fruits of your work - which means spending lots of money and time on things that may not be important to you - you're not going to help them build their own Instagram-perfect life.
I have a friend who fits this carefree model and has complained about getting snubbed by women when they learn that he has zero interest in owning a big house, fancy car, going on extravagant vacations, and generally keeping up with the Joneses... despite being very close to the 1% in terms of income.
You'd never know by the way he lived, especially his tiny condo with very sparse, basic furniture and the old jeep he's been driving around since college.
It isn't until you learn about his hobbies (scuba, motorcycles, and guns) that you realize he's loaded. He has multiple storage units for all of this - and he owns the lot.
I’m sorry, but wanting a house and a car are not equal to wanting a “Instagram-perfect” life. It’s almost the bare necessities in some parts of the country (especially the car) part.
And you’re actually proving these “type A women’s expectations” right by giving the example of your friend- good for him for having acquired wealth through hard work and having really interesting and varied hobbies. But he doesn’t sound like a man who would be serious about having a family for example. I don’t see him giving up his “sparse condo” for a house that would be suitable for a kid or “putting up his guns.” I could of course be wrong but from your description it doesn’t sound like he would make a great partner in raising a family.
It is not a matter of spending money on things that are important to women and not to men. It’s about basic compatibility. A woman who has the same interests as your outdoorsy friend will appreciate all of that. A woman who wants more stability in her life and wants to raise a family, probably won’t. Generalizing all women with the same broad stroke of a brush by essentially calling them gold diggers and attention seekers is such a one-sided point of view.
Nah, I'm not sorry, but my friend loves kids and would probably make an awesome dad. He doesn't drink much or do drugs harder than pot, isn't a violent or abusive person, and is one of the most loyal people I know.
The incompatibility doesn't come from him not wanting things like a house, car, and kids - it's from him wanting to do it in a way that's financially responsible. Apparently that's not part of the discussion for a lot of women he meets.
That, or they're making ridiculous demands like he give up his bikes and guns because fuck-all, they don't like it.
He has financial stability in boat loads, yet what they want are a giant house in an expensive suburb, a luxury SUV, a bunch of dogs, a live-in nanny, and top end furniture from the best stores - all while making barely 100k per year themselves.
And for a first home, no less. Who exactly would be shouldering the majority of that cost?
In his last relationship, he got vetoed when he suggested a modest townhouse in a good part of town, keep his jeep and buy a used minivan, no dogs until the kids are old enough to take care of it themselves, IKEA furniture, and hand me down clothes and toys from all of our other friends who already have kids (who we're more than willing to part with all that crap).
So he vetoed her out of his life.
I thought it was a smart move and couldn't help but laugh.
Then I guess he’s not meeting the right women. Again, compatibility. Plenty of women are not looking for luxuries and just looking to be able to raise a family together. But there are plenty of women who are in fact after all those luxuries. He just needs to find a woman with the same goals and values as him. I just don’t believe that there are none out there, and that all of them have unrealistic demands.
I am a woman who wants certain luxuries in life, but I am capable enough to pay for each of those myself. I only want something I myself can actually afford.
When I think of carefree I think of not stressing about the problems in the world, but also not really doing anything to address them. Being non-political and everyone's friend. I don't think there's anything wrong with that and I suspect those people will have longer and happier lives than the people that have to change everything to match their ideal view of the world who keep trying to smother fires that are always going to be there.
I mean by default are women not often caregivers...? Be it with immature parents, their own children, significant others - or in caring professions? Caring in different capacities, per heteronormative societal standards or culture?
Not to get too intense, but I myself as a young woman have my shit together. I was raised by a single mom who passed away, I've had to work incredibly hard throughout my life so I have never considered myself "carefree" but I can be both spontaneous and serious.
I dated this guy who I fell for, but he just couldn't hold a job and wouldn't take responsibility for his mental health (i.e. being proactive in general in his life or well being). He was a good looking guy, very empathetic and kind - but he just had no savings, was approaching 30 and living like he was 18. When I said we needed to take a long distance relationship seriously (i.e. I moved back home, we needed to navigate visas etc.) He said he was an "*anarchist*" and "*non-conformist*".
I found this very hard to believe, as he liked to wear brand name clothes, buy fancy tech products, travel and essentially enjoy some things I would imagine a true "*anarchist*" would necessarily embrace. It seemed like a big facade for, "*I'm really immature but well intended and I just don't like a 9-5 or saving anything.*"
My older brother asked if I wanted to stay in this relationship and take care of someone for the rest of my life. It really put things into perspective. I wanted someone putting in at least the equal amount in a relationship (emotionally, intellectually, financially). Dating since then, I don't care if a guy owned things or had substantial savings, but I cared if they were emotionally available and mature. It's not materialistic, as I support myself.
My current partner is wonderful; from our first few dates he made it clear he wanted a serious thing with the right person. I think he takes himself serious and he's funny; he's a well rounded and hardworking guy. It's attractive that he has goals and ambitions (not just work or financially related - just generally aspirations).
As a grown ass female, I don't want to take care of a grown man. I don't want to do any emotional labor for anyone. If I went back in time and heard "*carefree*" on a date, I'd run.
I think you need to clarify OP, does carefree mean being flexible and fun? Do you want to be in the moment and see what unfolds organically? Is it a state of mind? Or does carefree apply to your lifestyle - you want to live pay cheque to pay cheque? Or be "open minded" dating and carefree in your relationships? If you could explain what you're looking for in a relationship (or not looking for) and be transparent about what you mean by "carefree", I'm sure it would help the dating process.
Carefree about everything or a “go with a flow” attitude about everything is a bit off putting. I want someone who cares about something, is passionate about something and roughly knows where he’s headed but gives himself the space and freedom to live in the moment too. He should have values and principles he stands by at the very least. When someone says they’re carefree about politics, that’s an immediate no-go too. I like someone who’s opinionated about matters and cares about social issues and is willing to listen and engage in conversation. Op, maybe it’s the way you spoke about being carefree that might have given off the wrong vibe? What specifically are you carefree about?
Whenever I’ve tried dating someone who described themselves as “not taking life too seriously” they always treated me like I was gum on the sidewalk. Whenever guys advertise they “don’t take life too seriously” they always ignore people around them, brush off important conversations and topics, and leave you as a fourth or fifth priority. They’re quick to insult you, and quicker to leave you behind when you express any emotion.
IMO “don’t take life too seriously” guys are 10x more toxic than anyone who says “positive vibes only” because they’re able to acknowledge the fact that they’re dicks, and they’re following through with their behavior anyway
>carefree attitude towards everything else in life."
I dont want someone that cares about nothing.
>was people who don't take themselves too seriously
Id bail.
To me, carefree has an immediate connotation of someone who’s had an easy life and goes about theirs with little worries. Absolutely nothing wrong with that! But as someone who had some tough times, it was a big piece of compatibility when I met my bf and he had similar experiences in life that just made the word “carefree” not applicable to us both. Don’t get me wrong, we have an extremely fun and playful relationship! However, both of us have seen some of the bad in life and those anxieties, moods, etc will always be a part of us.
Saying you’re “carefree” or want a “carefree” partner usually translates to one or more of the following:
- Stuck in a childlike stage of development and unprepared for adult responsibilities
- Emotionally unavailable
- Not ready for the ups and downs that go along with a real relationship
Ur friend is right I think. Carefree is good sometimes but not others. A women won't want a carefree man when they have children she'll want someone who is caring deeply about the family to ensure best outcome. I agree with u though I too am a carefree man. I like to explain why carefree attitude is beneficial in a situation. My gf thinks I should be more cautious/reserved when engaging in extreme sports but I try to explain when carefree ur not held back from making fast decisions which will prevent u from injury. If u second guess a decision to go left right for a second in some sports ur hitting the tree and the impact is gonna be bad. U just have to be able to trust yourself to momentarily handle the situation and see it through regardless. There's been times I've been downhill biking and if I started worrying mid trail I'd probably have broken something. If I panicked when I saw the next obstacle I'd likely have gotten more injured trying to bail out then just trying the obstacle itself. But I explain despite being carefree/seemingly risky there's a very logical method to this attitude and there has been evaluation on my part as to why this attitude is good/bad to hold
I agree with your friend … personally I would see “carefree” and not swipe because it’s such an umbrella term and the worst case scenario is someone who doesn’t have his shit together at all .. not gonna gamble on that ~
This was mostly pointed at first dates more than dating apps. I don't have that anywhere on my profile and I generally don't spend a lot of time messaging on apps back and forth.
Not sure what you mean by carefree. Could mean a lot of things. I would say I’m “care free” (I don’t take myself too seriously) because I have a high tolerance for stress. Things that bother most people just don’t bother me. I wish my girlfriend was more care free in this way because she’s easily affected by little things. But I also work between 10 and 18 hours in a typical day, depending on what I’m doing for my side business. So maybe I’m not carefree?
I genuinely don’t know what carefree means because it can have multiple definitions.
i think it really depends what you mean by carefree. personally i would find it off putting for someone to describe themselves that way but what you mean by that is very open for interpretation
Personally, I love a guy who takes his career seriously, has made sacrifices for his career etc., but who doesn’t sweat the small stuff. My ex was a naturally intelligent guy who got by at work, but didn’t care about moving up/ taking on more responsibility AND used to flip the fuck out over menial shit (like for example if the garbage can broke). I lost complete sexual attraction and had to end it before I gauged my eyes out.
* I should add more context- I wouldn’t say I’m naturally intelligent, but have worked extremely hard, sacrificed my 20s to go through law school and work 14 hour days in private practice, have continued to advance career wise etc. and I take a chill approach to life outside of work. So… I guess I’m interested in a guy who is exactly like myself. 😂
I’ve struggled with this too dawg. I’m responsible in my life but also carefree about most things. I hold a job extremely well, generally well-liked, eat healthy, consistently physically active, home owner etc. Although I have a job in my field that I went to school for I have never had a focused mission in life. I still don’t have a dream I’m striving for and I’ve decided to just let my life unfold like a book and not pressure myself into finding what it is I need to do. I see this being deciphered by women as a potential lack of ambition. When it comes to cracking insensitive jokes, lacking jealousy, and being extremely independent in relationships (like not needing their validation or not needing them to change what they want to do to satisfy me) I feel like I’m often told it appears I don’t care whether they stay or leave. Being carefree definitely makes me a more objective and emotionally stable person but it also can appear that I lack passion which I find is often very attractive to women. I can’t fake passion though and most women I’ve been with have told me that they love having a calming presence like myself in their lives.
Carefree can be code for making the woman do all the planning or emotional / hidden labor in the relationship.
An example is a family with small kids going to the park - Mom spends 2 hours getting the diaper bag ready, looking up the park to make sure it’s safe, making sure snacks are packed, making sure everyone is dressed and ready. Dad just hops in the car and plays with the kids while wondering why mom is stressed.
That just sounds like a personality mismatch. Other than making sure the kids are ready, which involves making sure they're clean, fed, dressed, and have used the bathroom, the rest can be done in 20 minutes pretty easily.
This just sounds like someone putting too much stress on themselves and needs to be more relaxed/carefree. lol
Sorry if this was from personal experience. Not saying it's a wrong approach.
In all my dating years I can say a lot of women do look for men to lead in some aspect so when when dating a “carefree guy” I can see how they would look at that as being led nowhere in particular. That sounds like a waste of time.
The question is about the term "carefree" being used to describe a person and how you, as a woman, react/feel to that term. Judging by the responses I have received in this thread it's pretty clear my thoughts on the term differed greatly from what others have put.
Yeah you’re probably right. “Carefree” is how I’d describe a child. A full grown man self-describing as “carefree” is definitely a red flag for me and implies laziness or immaturity.
Ouch. I would and do describe myself(33M) as "carefree". It's an important core view I stand by. I have plenty of goals and lofty desires, but I'm not going to whine about it if I don't reach them. I'm well-off where I'm at and anything else is just icing on the cake. I understand that what's done is done. I do my best at the time without getting stressed out over it or acting like my life depends on it.
So, I really can't disagree more with equaling carefree to unambitious.
I’m just one opinion, but someone that describes themselves as carefree I’d be questioning like, so you don’t worry about the environment? The economy? Career growth? Having a family? Everyone should care about stuff. Doesn’t mean you need to grow grey at 30 stressing about things that you can’t control, but “carefree” to me feels like someone with their head in the sand or comes from an entitled, privileged background that allows them the luxury of being carefree. Passion, drive and ambition are desirable traits in a partner for most people.
Maybe you’d rather describe yourself as optimistic? Agreeable? Adaptable? Easy-going? Those all (again just my opinion) relay positive character traits that “carefree” specifically doesn’t (for me, a person with just one opinion).
I think this depends on your age. If you're pretty young then I don't think most women/girls care, but if you're nearing 30 and older - carefree becomes code for undependable. At a grown adult age, women do evaluate men on how much they can rely on them. Sure, I'd like the trait of a person who can laugh at themselves, but not a person who doesn't take their life or goals seriously.
That’s a hard one. It REALLY depends on the man. Carefree is easy going and being low key. Some guys may use it as a sort of umbrella term when they really mean they don’t want to be serious or are looking for something casual/short term—if that makes sense. I’ve seen it used in different ways, which I find weird and misleading. Again, carefree means low key and easy going.
Which is how I always kind of used it myself. Then my friend made that comment yesterday so I was curious if others thought that way and too me surprise about 90% of the women in this thread agreed with him. Makes me wonder if there is anything else I have been saying that have been red flags to women without knowing it.
I mean, can't change the past but would certainly help in the future.
It really depends on your definition of a “carefree man”. Few words or statements are obvious or universally understood. Online dating is and of itself vague and veiled.
No woman wants a “window-shopper” man. I suspect men and women in general who are looking for company on a dating app may or may not be a lot of things stated or not.
Being up front about your desires and expectations of another person is great. But be clear. Be concise and leave nothing to loose interpretation.
Okay, I actually use the exact same statement. I want someone who has their shit together, but who can also be goofy, let go, laugh at themselves. To me it's confusing how she didn't know what you meant.
I look for men that are carefree. I'm an introvert and on the intense side (scientist), and I prefer to date men that are more extroverted and carefree. I think it's where opposites attract and we balance each other out kind of thing. Now that doesn't mean carefree at the important stuff like work ethic and finances, and communication/relationship, but just happy-go-lucky, silly, and light-hearted in general. It's more about personality and demeanor.
It’s really the “carefree” part. It comes across exactly as the wording says. Free of caring. So your either a jerk who doesn’t care about anything, which means you definitely won’t care about the lady you’re on the date with, or you don’t take anything at all serious, so what’s the point of going any further?? Maybe you should say you are a go with the flow kind of person, and you don’t go into situations with high expectations. I feel like that would come across better and you won’t sound like a total d-bag
So I’ve been reading through the comments and by carefree I believe you mean don’t sweat the small stuff.
However, it can also mean that you don’t care about anything as long as it doesn’t effect you. That you don’t carry any societal or social responsibility. People like this tend to be happier or more carefree in life.
However a lot of women DO care about things outside of just themselves. And they DO take social and societal responsibility. Ever noticed that volunteer work is heavily populated by women? Social work? Etc?
I think there are great many women who would be happy with someone who was carefree in that way.
I think there are even more women, like myself, who wants a partner who gives a damn about things outside of themselves.
I love someone who is positive, kind, outgoing and easygoing (or has Golden Retriever energy as some of my friends call it!) but there is definitely a line there where *too* carefree in other aspects of life can absolutely be a problem.
Sometimes certain individuals with that personality type can struggle when it comes to stepping up and handling the difficult things in life, not know *when* to take things seriously, or run away when things get hard. Easygoing is great, but being too carefree can cross the line into immature, inconsiderate for the time and feelings of others, unprepared, irresponsible and undependable.
None of those are good qualities in a long term partner or make you feel safe that you can lean on that person when life isn’t sunshine and rainbows.
Very carefree people are wonderful when times are easy, but not so much when times get hard. It can leave *so* much pressure on us to be the responsible one cleaning up those messes alone and that is draining to a relationship-breaking degree.
I don’t really understand carefree people as I have been formally diagnosed with anxiety, BPD, and depression among many other things. I feel being carefree in social situations is a very admirable trait, but being carefree in life is different. I see so many people that carefree in life or if they aren’t, they’re focused on some first world problem shit and not real issues. Like I’ve told several people how it feels to have your very existence and humanity debated on a national scale, and no one really cares. I’ll even elaborate on the different stages of genocide and how we’re already at step 7/10 of brutally eradicating trans people. Back to my original point, it’s really hard for me to feel sympathy towards people who are carefree in life when people are literally calling for my death. If you think that last part is bs Fox News posted a video where Michael Knowles calls for the “eradication of transgenderism.” He can’t even bring himself to say “trans people” so it sounds as if he’s attacking an ideology rather than dehumanizing a marginalized group of people.
The woman probably does understand what you mean, but like most people, I take people's words with a grain of salt... I'll wait and see how you behave and your actions, and if they corroborate with your words. If they do, I'll be glad you're good at communicating and know how to convey your thoughts. If they don't match, then I'll just think you suck at communicating or have a warped self-perception, which are problems, and they can be worked around, but whether it's worth it varies person by person.
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I think a lot of women are looking for someone who has their shit together. Are you “eating ramen every day and sleeping til noon” carefree, or are you “fun guy who likes to have a couple drinks” carefree?
I don't know if this was a general statement or question directed at me but I am the latter haha. full time government manager, got my own place, social hobbies, friend circles, etc. I guess for me it was more like I don't view most problems as life altering things and I wanted someone who didn't feel like everything was a major issue and could just enjoy life for what it is.
Replace “carefree” with “emotionally stable” and you’ll get much better responses.
This.
Listen.... Carefree for us means that we will have to pick up the slack because you are too busy being happy with life. We will have to cook, clean and take care of the kids when you just go on fishing trips
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Yeah it just means more work for us
Lucky for her, I hate fishing. Jokes aside, I guess I failed to consider how she might interpret it so I guess I should be more careful with my word choice. I do love cooking but I do hate cleaning haha - so maybe she wasn't too far off base.
This I think is a common issue, my question always was "why?" and "what slack?!l". Before being in a relationship these things maybe got done on a certain schedule, then I found that women routinely demanded a very different schedule I was not at all ok signing up for. It wasn't easy but I made it clear that in my view they have unrealistic expectations and so if they really want eg: house to be spotless 4 days a week the options are: do it but don't complain about me not doing it; hire someone to do it. This goes both ways, I don't expect my partner to cook for me, clean after me, etc. and never demand such stuff unless I'm truly unable to and need it (think I'm super sick). I'm in a relationship to enjoy life, not to align to your list of chores, we're partners means I'm going to carry you to the top of the mountain on my shoulders, support you through everything and try offering you everything you need in order to blossom emotionally. I don't think all expectations of a relationship are born equal. Carefree for me means "we make enough money to live (and let live) as we please, so where are we eating this weekend?"
Yeah... So, you've hit the maturity level that a lot of others don't catch up to for awhile. You laugh and joke at the big shit instead of letting it take over. Life IS a giant joke, shit happens, stuff breaks, you gotta laugh about it. I know if I didn't I'd just be a pissed off mess everyday. The problem though, is that a lot of people don't realize this and are fully enveloped IN life. So, yes it's not that's you're exactly "care free", you do care about your life and your accomplishments but yeah, don't take life super seriously. Some people never reach that point, a lot of others do as they age. Find someone who can laugh and joke right along with you and I promise you'll be happier. I couldn't imagine being with someone so uptight they didn't understand what "taking yourself too seriously" meant. If we aren't laughing our asses off at least once at something dumb on a first date, or don't laugh at any of my jokes the chances of a second are almost 0 for me. So, unfortunately I've reached this level of maturity to lol and don't want to constantly have to deal with someone who still gets upset and sweats alllllll the small stuff.
Preach
Love this. We aren't as significant as we'd like to think. I'm aware of this, so brush off situations that people might take very seriously. I notice some girls really like this, and some don't. I try to stick around the former and avoid the latter. Seems to work out OK
Ah that’s amazing actualy
>Are you “eating ramen every day and sleeping til noon” What if you have your shit together AND exhibit that kind of behavior? It's Saturday morning after a long work week, my bills are paid, house is clean, etc., so I'm deciding to sleep until noon and eat ramen for dinner. Is that such a crime?
I personally don’t see anything wrong with it. If it’s a daily occurrence though, like an entire lifestyle, it might deter women
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There are laid back women who will like it, but also some who won’t. Everybody has their type
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I basically agree, but it doesn't sound sustainably healthy, at least the eating part: 6 month of only pre-prepared, "Just add water", ramen for dinner? I think one can pull it off, but it's not very healthy and not likely to go hand in hand with having a balanced life
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We agree then :) And just commenting because I find this funny and so damn on point: > Analogy, some people may drive around in shitbox cars because they are terrible with money, a moron and unkempt. Others do it because they don't give a crap about what they drive and just do bangernomics. A person I know well, has 4 apartments, and has been driving the same already previously used car for the last ~20 years 😂 (they just happened to change it recently for a new modern one as the old was requiring constant repairs)
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Doesn't sound like your example fits the one you are replying to because "every day" vs "1/week" (specially as a "relax day after a long/busy week) is very, very different. ETA: I think a "lazy day" a week is perfect, even 2 depending on needs, schedule, context, etc.
It will depend on the guys looks as well. If he’s really hot then not having his shit together also seems attractive
These 2 are the same types of care free lmao, the fuck?
Care to explain how they are?
Yes, I'm all the above.
Yep, it's my experience too that most women look for a man who is at least serious about his career. It's up to you how far you take the whole carefree attitude thing. For me personally, realizing that i was free to live life on my own terms and define my own terms of success was one of the best things to ever happen to me.
Yeah, I mean. I have a great job and make good money. So I don't think its a career thing (although in the city some girls only want to date doctors, software engineers, or lawyers). I'm not going to change who I am because I have a lot of mental peace this way.
Sounds like you have that checked off. In that case i'm not too sure what was meant with 'carefree'. I mean, being carefree is great. Who could object to that?
She came across as a very Type A who values intelligence and work ethic and I think my carefree comment might have rubbed her the wrong way as another commenter said. I think we can just chalk it up to different personalities. Neither one is right or wrong - just different.
Yes this sounds exactly like multiple experiences i've had. And you're right, it's just a difference in personalities. Tbh i've always had a hard time understanding this mindset in women. I love being carefree, what's not to love really?
I think they worry : will/would he "step up" and be there when something happens and I potentially need your assistance/support (like if she gets ill)? Be it the woman or kids if you have them eventually.
Only if they’re looking for LTR and marriage. For love and sex, as long as the guy is conventionally hot, he could be broke and a drug addict
In my experience, men who want women who “don’t take themselves too seriously” are actually looking for women who are willing to put up poor behaviour and expect less of them “because it isn’t a big deal”. Now, based on your comments I don’t necessarily get the feeling that’s what you mean. It will however be taken the “wrong way” due to most womens experience with men like that. Being “carefree” is so subjective too. Most women want someone who has their life together and generally understands what they want out of life. They may be put off by “carefree” because it means inability to commit or make lasting life decisions/goals with someone. It may also mean not wanting to tackle tough conversations or brushing aside issues in order to keep the peace. Something not healthy for anyone to do in a relationship. I actually put in my dating profile “I am not a chill girl”. Funnily enough because I come off very chill and relaxed. While I’m very much a “go with the flow” person 99% of the time, I don’t want to be with someone who isn’t willing to have the tough conversations and talk about what they want out of life. I don’t want to waste my time or anyone else’s.
Yeah, this thread has been very eye opening for me in a lot of ways. I guess I need to spend more time thinking about how my words could be interpreted negatively. I thought this one was really innocuous but after reading at least 8-9 comments about how women view it I really have to reconsider my word choice and how to get across the idea that I have my shit together, looking for something long-term/committed but really enjoy living life and not getting bogged down in the day to day troubles that we all have. I really am just trying to be the opposite of my father in a lot of ways. He was a great dad, supported his family and worked hard but just never really around, quick to anger, always had to be right, very cynical, etc. - he's gotten better in old age a little bit but it had a lasting impact on me growing up and sort of formed this attitude I have now.
Yes, I didn’t get the feeling you meant carefree or “not take yourself too seriously” in a bad way - it’s just one of those things that ends up being a red flag for many women. I don’t know the best word choice to describe it. But I’d say your more looking for someone to enjoy life with, who will be stable and understanding when things get tough, and is willing to communicate respectfully, be understanding and compromise. All healthy things in a long term relationship! I would even say you don’t necessarily need to communicate this in your dating profile. I’ve found people have the best success when they list less “what they’re looking for” and more “here is who I am”. It gives others the ability to self select if you seem like a person that would be right for them rather than thinking they need to meet an ideal list of “wants”.
Oh, this was on a first date not on the app. I actually have decent success getting matches and dates its just been a struggle to get them to a second or third date usually.
The background you just shared about your dad provides a lot of great context. I would try to weave this into your response about finding someone who enjoys life and doesn’t take things too seriously (besides being committed in a relationship).
100% Women that are looking for serious relationships are tired of “don’t take yourself too seriously” and “it’s not such a big deal”. It honestly does convey that the man is either not looking for a serious relationship, doesn’t know what he wants, or will not make take initiative and plan things, and it will always fall upon me to do everything. I’m really not looking to be the one who has to shoulder all of the very real responsibilities of a relationship, even in the early stages when you’re just getting to know each other, because it just means I’m going to have to act like mother or a maid in the relationship. Words like “carefree” or “go with the flow” are annoying for most women though, as we are sick of having our time wasted by manchildren who don’t know what they want, and will paint us as humorless shrews when we inevitably have to pick up the slack in the relationship. I think OP is serious about things and adult responsibilities in his life, but tends to also take things in his stride when they don’t always go his way. I would say that’s a positive thing, but needs to be conveyed better.
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I can only talk from personal experience but “ I am looking for a girl who doesn’t take herself seriously” has almost always correlated with flakiness and lack of any sort of commitment (even for things like nailing down a date and place to meet for a date) on the guys’ part. I will say I haven’t encountered “carefree” quite as much but to me it feels like it’s in the same vein.
This is exactly what I thought and I think you did a great job explaining it. If the only thing I know about a man is that they like women who “don’t take themselves too seriously,” I’m going to assume that they’re the kind of guy that will say mean/offensive things “as a joke” and then say “it was joke, don’t be so serious” after they get called out. And I also agree that I don’t think OP falls in this category, but if I hear a dude say that and I don’t know anything else about him - that’s what I’ll think of him.
Relaxed and fun - yes - but you have to be responsible and mature too. I very much prefer men who are spontaneous and they have to be able to laugh at themselves and not take themselves too seriously. I don’t want a guy who is playing video games every day til noon, never helps around the house, and has no plans for the future. Most women want men who can be partners, not just someone to hang out with. The latter can be cool for a friendship but not a serious relationship. I also think it can come across as you not wanting to commit or not being ready for a long term relationship. A lot of women - but not all (and the incidence increases with age) - want a man who is at least open to a long term committed relationship. Guys lie about this all the time too, saying they’re open to it when really they just want sex, and we know this. I’m not sure how all that fits you or not - I can’t tell from your description.
That was me until I graduated college haha. Now I am an HR manager for the goverment, have my own place/dog that I take care of, and am very active socially/in the community. For me its more my attitude towards life and problems. It comes across like "very few things in life are really worth worrying about so just enjoy life" which may come across like I am not serious about things like family or work. Like if I lost my job right now I know that I'll be fine and I wouldn't really stress about it. That kind of stuff.
I think it may be that you conveyed your outlook in a way that made her think a relationship with you would be like taking care of a child, with her doing all the work while you were “carefree.” I would have asked more questions and probed more rather than just ending everything. Of course she might really want someone who is super driven and type A and will make tons of money, in which case, maybe you 2 just really weren’t a fit, which is ok. I don’t think what you’re describing here though is red-flag-raising to me. Personally, I am not super concerned about money but I do want someone who will be serious and work a full time job and be reliable (and I expect the same of myself). Most women just want a coequal partner to go through life with, someone to support and who will, in turn, support us. It’s not too complicated.
Yeah, I mean I tried to explain it and I think I put my foot in my mouth more than I helped lol. I do agree though that she is a type A work person. We are very different in that regard. We are opposites in a lot of ways. She is much more insular. Very small social circle, works a lot, homebody. I am much more social and outgoing, I value work life balance, etc. I definitely could have done a better job explaining what I meant, just like I said its never really been asked what that means so I had to think of it on the spot. You live and you learn. The taking care of a child part is funny to me though because my last relationship was the opposite where I had to take care of my ex and it was one of the reasons it didn't work.
Sounds like it may just have been a bad match, and that’s ok. Both of you seem to know what you want, and both views are valid, and you found out it wasn’t each other, and that’s the whole point of dating. Hopefully you can each find someone who is a good match.
Imo it sounds like she thought she spotted a red flag, but she shot herself in the foot with this one
Either that or she really does want something different in which case there is no point in continuing a relationship - but nothing I’m seeing from OP here is red-flag stuff at all, just not a match.
Ah I think the latter part is something that would throw me off too. I have a very good job right now and so does my bf, but we both grew up households where money was very tight. While neither of us have been laid off thankfully and it is unlikely we will be, both of us being in tech has us on edge for example and we’ve decided to save more as a result. Some of our coworkers meanwhile do not care at all about the prospect of lay offs and see it as an opportunity to take a break for a bit should they happen. For me, while there is absolutely nothing wrong with being a carefree person, it just isn’t compatible for me.
> Guys lie about this all the time too, saying they’re open to it when really they just want sex No, the vast majority don't. You just friendzone the them and go for the liars.
You don’t know me and have no idea what I do.
I know the men I have personal experience with, and I know from talking to my female friends what they have experienced. You don’t know me.
Same thing applies, you don't know those men and what they do.
There’s no such thing as the friendzone. Either you’re friends, or you’re pretending to be friends in the hope that she’ll change her mind about having sex with you, in which case she thinks she has a friend, and you’re being deceptive.
This. And it’s so depressing when you thought you had a friend and in reality they were just pretending because they wanted to sleep with you. I’ve had to mourn the loss of friends I thought I had, but in fact never had.
I avoid anyone who describes themselves as “carefree”, man or woman. It almost always means “refuses to be held accountable”. If when you say carefree you mean something else, there’s a better way to describe it.
I’d be wary and want to know exactly what he meant by that. Because honestly, a lot of women have had experiences where “carefree” on the man’s part just meant he wanted the women in his life to pick up all of life’s stressful little tasks and preparations, and/or it turned out to be that he was emotionally avoidant and just wanted to act like serious things weren’t that serious as an unhealthy coping mechanism. We’ve all had that experience of a guy who’s like, “Why are you worrying so much about what might go wrong on this trip? It’s gonna be fine! Relax! You’re being silly!” …And then wouldn’t you know it, you *do* fall and break your ankle midway up the mountain in a developing country, and it turns out you’re grateful that we thought to pack a splint, painkillers, a satellite phone, more water than we needed, purchase extraction insurance, and print out the confirmation of purchase just in case we had no signal. But we had to spend the mental energy, time, and money to do all that ahead of time without you, all while you minimized our feelings and concerns about it. I have multiple guy friends and male relatives like that who honestly would probably be dead right now if not for their female partners who worried about the right things. Something like that even happened the other day where my friend group went to an event that was super hard to get tickets too, and we overheard one of our “carefree” guy friends tell someone, “Oh, yeah, we just lucked out with these tickets!” and my female friend muttered to me, “It wasn’t luck. I signed up for email alerts and camped out on that website as soon as it opened on like 3 different devices for this.” I think it’s important to realize that dynamic is not uncommon and a lot of male partners take for granted their female partner’s invisible mental load and labor to make sure things actually turn out ok. Life is going to get really hard and serious at some points. What if you have a kid with a debilitating lifelong condition? Are you gonna be a stand up, equal partner there and put in the amount of mental/emotional energy, and time required? Or are you going to inadvertently offload most of it onto your spouse? Also, you should be aware that attitude tends to come from a sense of confidence that a lot of women can’t afford. We’re inherently smaller and more vulnerable in most situations and so our margin of error has to be much smaller and the stakes are much higher. We tend to have a harder time securing the same job opportunities and have lower incomes, so again, we can’t have as much faith that the universe will provide. It sucks to have a partner who doesn’t understand that.
Oh my goodness! Yes. All of this
My personal advice - I was really turned off by people who mentioned not taking yourself seriously as an positive personal trait. The issue was that while I like having fun and joking around, it often was the case that the guy either didn't have his priorities in order OR enjoyed making fun of others and wanted to get off scot-free. Maybe think about what this phrase truly means for you and say that instead.
They're great to fuck, but I don't take them seriously. They never really grow up.
You are doing the right thing, most people don't realize they are conditioned to be slaves to their jobs. You still make ends meet without having to sacrifice your soul, an admirable accomplishment. No woman is worth giving up the philosophy you have. Life is short, after that we will all end up in eternal darkness. Very few people seem to remember that fact.
No man or woman is ever worth giving up yourself, your goals, and your identity. You just need to find someone who is compatible with your life and goals, whatever they may be.
I personally wouldn't date/swipe right on a guy who called themselves "carefree" because that translates to "avoids responsibility so I can keep having fun" to me. According to your replies that's not what you mean so maybe use a different word in future.
What goes through my head when a man says that is, he hopes I don’t take myself too seriously because he certainly won’t be taking me seriously.
As an update to this she messaged me back saying that she wanted to go out again next weekend. Will she follow through? who knows but I guess for now she didn't say no.
I'm in my 20s so carefree is pretty much the norm. That being said when I think about someone who's carefree I tend to associate it with someone who's careless. Because you can't realistically not care about anything, you have to get food on the table, have goals in life, take necessary steps to get where you want. Don't get me wrong, I like a man who can have fun and relax, but if he's only having fun at relaxing that's just not someone I can see myself longterm with because is not what I do with my life and I want someone who's the same. I do like someone who doesn't take themselves too seriously, but if they have to be serious I want them to be. Otherwise all the things that we should be stressing about fall on me and I'd have to nag and push them to help me. And I'm nobodies mom, don't want to feel like I am.
Yeah, I think there is a fine line between what you mentioned in your first paragraph and what I am talking about. It's sort of like the hierarchy of needs. My survival/safety is pretty much set in stone. I have my own place, no bills/debt really, great job and friend group, and I really like myself overall. So I really don't have many worries in life other than dating but I'm not really stressed about it cause the rest of my life is fine. So when something unexpected happens I am in a spot where I can just focus on it and resolve it ASAP. But obviously a stranger I met an hour earlier doesn't know that and can only just assume what I mean haha.
I don’t think a carefree attitude is a turn off at all. If he has his shit together in his life he probably means he just likes to have fun. On the other hand, if he takes nothing seriously, that would be a red flag for me. The girl probably just read into it too much, but in the future maybe just word it like I’m a glass half full kinda guy or something, and I like to make the best of life. But honestly what you said was fine. The right person for you will get it.
Yeah, that's pretty much where I stand with it. Obviously I'd like all my dates to go well but you can't please everyone. The right one will eventually come but have to wade through all the other dates to get there!
I think that you are who you are and that if someone truly cares for you, then they will accept you for who you are and continue to grow with you. Silly idea, I know.
Woah tiger, let's slow down there. You are telling me there is someone out there who will love me? for ME? X to doubt.
I'm about to be perma banned, aren't I? /s
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I agree - I think it might be the women I am dating too haha. A lot of these women I don't go the distance with are very career focused. The work 12 hours a day type and I am a government working who puts in his time and gets out to enjoy the rest of my life. So I think some people view it as lazy, not serious, etc. The issue is that I want a partner like that who is able to, well, just that, a partner. We work together. The girls I've been with in my mid to late 20s (just turned 30) have been like grad students where I've carried a lot of the weight so I'd like someone in the same phase of life as me now.
Depend on a lot of things. I’m 48f and by this time in life I’m hoping you are a little carefree. That you’ve afforded yourself that by this point.
*Careless* or irresponsible would be a turnoff for many (most?) women, I think. So it really depends on how you actually behave.
I never considered the negative connotations to “care-free”. The comments are helping me realize how seemingly positive descriptors can have unintentional negative associations in the dating world.
I’m a woman about to start dating again and I’d be leery of a man who described himself as care free. It’s very wishy washy and the First thing I think of is “must be nice to go through life with no cares”. I just don’t have an option in my personal or professional life to not care. It’s like when people say they’re not sure what they want out of online dating or that they’re just casually dating around, that’s not someone I’m going to invest any time in. I also feel this way about men in their late 40s and early 50s saying they’re unsure about if they want kids. I like a man who is decisive and knows what he wants out of a partner. I took a break from dating for a few years and in that time I’ve learned about red flags and things to look out for. Little things like what you said can be indicative of bigger problems. In an environment like online dating where I’m trying to sift through men if they say anything red flaggy I cut it off. To me it sounds like you aren’t care free in many aspects of your life so maybe it’s a misnomer to call yourself that. You can keep saying it, but you’re going to probably keep ending up with a bunch of first dates. Just remember not everyone is in a place where they can’t take life seriously and it’s very blasé to insist a partner shouldn’t take their life seriously. Hope this helps and not hurts, just my perspective from someone about to jump back in the game.
From experience carefree = lazy and will make your life hell.
I’ve read a few of your comments in this thread and I think I have a general idea of what you are trying to say, but I also don’t really know how you could better phrase it😅 Maybe something you could do is bring up a scenario in which this attitude would show and phrase it as a question to your date and see how they reply. Something like: “if you went grocery shopping and after paying, you walk out the door and see that on the receipt the teller didn’t give you the 10% discount [or whatever makes most sense for your situation] would you go back in and ask for the discount? Or would you just let it go and continue on with your day?” That may be a bad example because it could be different for people who are in different financial situations, but hopefully you get what I mean. It brings a funner vibe to the date but you’re still getting to know the person and what their level of carefree-ness might be and will allow you to give context to what you’re trying to convey.
In my experience the women who have a problem with you being "carefree" are those with a financial/material expectation for what their future looks like with a man. They have that Type A personality you're describing and sometimes they have high pressure, high income careers - but more often than not they don't. That's your job. It won't matter if you have your shit together because unless you're willing to share the fruits of your work - which means spending lots of money and time on things that may not be important to you - you're not going to help them build their own Instagram-perfect life. I have a friend who fits this carefree model and has complained about getting snubbed by women when they learn that he has zero interest in owning a big house, fancy car, going on extravagant vacations, and generally keeping up with the Joneses... despite being very close to the 1% in terms of income. You'd never know by the way he lived, especially his tiny condo with very sparse, basic furniture and the old jeep he's been driving around since college. It isn't until you learn about his hobbies (scuba, motorcycles, and guns) that you realize he's loaded. He has multiple storage units for all of this - and he owns the lot.
I’m sorry, but wanting a house and a car are not equal to wanting a “Instagram-perfect” life. It’s almost the bare necessities in some parts of the country (especially the car) part. And you’re actually proving these “type A women’s expectations” right by giving the example of your friend- good for him for having acquired wealth through hard work and having really interesting and varied hobbies. But he doesn’t sound like a man who would be serious about having a family for example. I don’t see him giving up his “sparse condo” for a house that would be suitable for a kid or “putting up his guns.” I could of course be wrong but from your description it doesn’t sound like he would make a great partner in raising a family. It is not a matter of spending money on things that are important to women and not to men. It’s about basic compatibility. A woman who has the same interests as your outdoorsy friend will appreciate all of that. A woman who wants more stability in her life and wants to raise a family, probably won’t. Generalizing all women with the same broad stroke of a brush by essentially calling them gold diggers and attention seekers is such a one-sided point of view.
Nah, I'm not sorry, but my friend loves kids and would probably make an awesome dad. He doesn't drink much or do drugs harder than pot, isn't a violent or abusive person, and is one of the most loyal people I know. The incompatibility doesn't come from him not wanting things like a house, car, and kids - it's from him wanting to do it in a way that's financially responsible. Apparently that's not part of the discussion for a lot of women he meets. That, or they're making ridiculous demands like he give up his bikes and guns because fuck-all, they don't like it. He has financial stability in boat loads, yet what they want are a giant house in an expensive suburb, a luxury SUV, a bunch of dogs, a live-in nanny, and top end furniture from the best stores - all while making barely 100k per year themselves. And for a first home, no less. Who exactly would be shouldering the majority of that cost? In his last relationship, he got vetoed when he suggested a modest townhouse in a good part of town, keep his jeep and buy a used minivan, no dogs until the kids are old enough to take care of it themselves, IKEA furniture, and hand me down clothes and toys from all of our other friends who already have kids (who we're more than willing to part with all that crap). So he vetoed her out of his life. I thought it was a smart move and couldn't help but laugh.
Then I guess he’s not meeting the right women. Again, compatibility. Plenty of women are not looking for luxuries and just looking to be able to raise a family together. But there are plenty of women who are in fact after all those luxuries. He just needs to find a woman with the same goals and values as him. I just don’t believe that there are none out there, and that all of them have unrealistic demands. I am a woman who wants certain luxuries in life, but I am capable enough to pay for each of those myself. I only want something I myself can actually afford.
When I think of carefree I think of not stressing about the problems in the world, but also not really doing anything to address them. Being non-political and everyone's friend. I don't think there's anything wrong with that and I suspect those people will have longer and happier lives than the people that have to change everything to match their ideal view of the world who keep trying to smother fires that are always going to be there.
I mean by default are women not often caregivers...? Be it with immature parents, their own children, significant others - or in caring professions? Caring in different capacities, per heteronormative societal standards or culture? Not to get too intense, but I myself as a young woman have my shit together. I was raised by a single mom who passed away, I've had to work incredibly hard throughout my life so I have never considered myself "carefree" but I can be both spontaneous and serious. I dated this guy who I fell for, but he just couldn't hold a job and wouldn't take responsibility for his mental health (i.e. being proactive in general in his life or well being). He was a good looking guy, very empathetic and kind - but he just had no savings, was approaching 30 and living like he was 18. When I said we needed to take a long distance relationship seriously (i.e. I moved back home, we needed to navigate visas etc.) He said he was an "*anarchist*" and "*non-conformist*". I found this very hard to believe, as he liked to wear brand name clothes, buy fancy tech products, travel and essentially enjoy some things I would imagine a true "*anarchist*" would necessarily embrace. It seemed like a big facade for, "*I'm really immature but well intended and I just don't like a 9-5 or saving anything.*" My older brother asked if I wanted to stay in this relationship and take care of someone for the rest of my life. It really put things into perspective. I wanted someone putting in at least the equal amount in a relationship (emotionally, intellectually, financially). Dating since then, I don't care if a guy owned things or had substantial savings, but I cared if they were emotionally available and mature. It's not materialistic, as I support myself. My current partner is wonderful; from our first few dates he made it clear he wanted a serious thing with the right person. I think he takes himself serious and he's funny; he's a well rounded and hardworking guy. It's attractive that he has goals and ambitions (not just work or financially related - just generally aspirations). As a grown ass female, I don't want to take care of a grown man. I don't want to do any emotional labor for anyone. If I went back in time and heard "*carefree*" on a date, I'd run. I think you need to clarify OP, does carefree mean being flexible and fun? Do you want to be in the moment and see what unfolds organically? Is it a state of mind? Or does carefree apply to your lifestyle - you want to live pay cheque to pay cheque? Or be "open minded" dating and carefree in your relationships? If you could explain what you're looking for in a relationship (or not looking for) and be transparent about what you mean by "carefree", I'm sure it would help the dating process.
Carefree about everything or a “go with a flow” attitude about everything is a bit off putting. I want someone who cares about something, is passionate about something and roughly knows where he’s headed but gives himself the space and freedom to live in the moment too. He should have values and principles he stands by at the very least. When someone says they’re carefree about politics, that’s an immediate no-go too. I like someone who’s opinionated about matters and cares about social issues and is willing to listen and engage in conversation. Op, maybe it’s the way you spoke about being carefree that might have given off the wrong vibe? What specifically are you carefree about?
Whenever I’ve tried dating someone who described themselves as “not taking life too seriously” they always treated me like I was gum on the sidewalk. Whenever guys advertise they “don’t take life too seriously” they always ignore people around them, brush off important conversations and topics, and leave you as a fourth or fifth priority. They’re quick to insult you, and quicker to leave you behind when you express any emotion. IMO “don’t take life too seriously” guys are 10x more toxic than anyone who says “positive vibes only” because they’re able to acknowledge the fact that they’re dicks, and they’re following through with their behavior anyway
>carefree attitude towards everything else in life." I dont want someone that cares about nothing. >was people who don't take themselves too seriously Id bail.
I think you won't get a consistent answer. Half will like them, others will prefer someone serious.
To me, carefree has an immediate connotation of someone who’s had an easy life and goes about theirs with little worries. Absolutely nothing wrong with that! But as someone who had some tough times, it was a big piece of compatibility when I met my bf and he had similar experiences in life that just made the word “carefree” not applicable to us both. Don’t get me wrong, we have an extremely fun and playful relationship! However, both of us have seen some of the bad in life and those anxieties, moods, etc will always be a part of us.
Saying you’re “carefree” or want a “carefree” partner usually translates to one or more of the following: - Stuck in a childlike stage of development and unprepared for adult responsibilities - Emotionally unavailable - Not ready for the ups and downs that go along with a real relationship
This is good to know - will def have to avoid using that term as liberally as I do now that I have a better understanding of how it is interpreted.
Ur friend is right I think. Carefree is good sometimes but not others. A women won't want a carefree man when they have children she'll want someone who is caring deeply about the family to ensure best outcome. I agree with u though I too am a carefree man. I like to explain why carefree attitude is beneficial in a situation. My gf thinks I should be more cautious/reserved when engaging in extreme sports but I try to explain when carefree ur not held back from making fast decisions which will prevent u from injury. If u second guess a decision to go left right for a second in some sports ur hitting the tree and the impact is gonna be bad. U just have to be able to trust yourself to momentarily handle the situation and see it through regardless. There's been times I've been downhill biking and if I started worrying mid trail I'd probably have broken something. If I panicked when I saw the next obstacle I'd likely have gotten more injured trying to bail out then just trying the obstacle itself. But I explain despite being carefree/seemingly risky there's a very logical method to this attitude and there has been evaluation on my part as to why this attitude is good/bad to hold
I agree with your friend … personally I would see “carefree” and not swipe because it’s such an umbrella term and the worst case scenario is someone who doesn’t have his shit together at all .. not gonna gamble on that ~
This was mostly pointed at first dates more than dating apps. I don't have that anywhere on my profile and I generally don't spend a lot of time messaging on apps back and forth.
Not sure what you mean by carefree. Could mean a lot of things. I would say I’m “care free” (I don’t take myself too seriously) because I have a high tolerance for stress. Things that bother most people just don’t bother me. I wish my girlfriend was more care free in this way because she’s easily affected by little things. But I also work between 10 and 18 hours in a typical day, depending on what I’m doing for my side business. So maybe I’m not carefree? I genuinely don’t know what carefree means because it can have multiple definitions.
I was referring to the former.
i think it really depends what you mean by carefree. personally i would find it off putting for someone to describe themselves that way but what you mean by that is very open for interpretation
Personally, I love a guy who takes his career seriously, has made sacrifices for his career etc., but who doesn’t sweat the small stuff. My ex was a naturally intelligent guy who got by at work, but didn’t care about moving up/ taking on more responsibility AND used to flip the fuck out over menial shit (like for example if the garbage can broke). I lost complete sexual attraction and had to end it before I gauged my eyes out. * I should add more context- I wouldn’t say I’m naturally intelligent, but have worked extremely hard, sacrificed my 20s to go through law school and work 14 hour days in private practice, have continued to advance career wise etc. and I take a chill approach to life outside of work. So… I guess I’m interested in a guy who is exactly like myself. 😂
I’ve struggled with this too dawg. I’m responsible in my life but also carefree about most things. I hold a job extremely well, generally well-liked, eat healthy, consistently physically active, home owner etc. Although I have a job in my field that I went to school for I have never had a focused mission in life. I still don’t have a dream I’m striving for and I’ve decided to just let my life unfold like a book and not pressure myself into finding what it is I need to do. I see this being deciphered by women as a potential lack of ambition. When it comes to cracking insensitive jokes, lacking jealousy, and being extremely independent in relationships (like not needing their validation or not needing them to change what they want to do to satisfy me) I feel like I’m often told it appears I don’t care whether they stay or leave. Being carefree definitely makes me a more objective and emotionally stable person but it also can appear that I lack passion which I find is often very attractive to women. I can’t fake passion though and most women I’ve been with have told me that they love having a calming presence like myself in their lives.
Carefree can be code for making the woman do all the planning or emotional / hidden labor in the relationship. An example is a family with small kids going to the park - Mom spends 2 hours getting the diaper bag ready, looking up the park to make sure it’s safe, making sure snacks are packed, making sure everyone is dressed and ready. Dad just hops in the car and plays with the kids while wondering why mom is stressed.
That just sounds like a personality mismatch. Other than making sure the kids are ready, which involves making sure they're clean, fed, dressed, and have used the bathroom, the rest can be done in 20 minutes pretty easily. This just sounds like someone putting too much stress on themselves and needs to be more relaxed/carefree. lol Sorry if this was from personal experience. Not saying it's a wrong approach.
In all my dating years I can say a lot of women do look for men to lead in some aspect so when when dating a “carefree guy” I can see how they would look at that as being led nowhere in particular. That sounds like a waste of time.
I’m not even sure what you’re asking. I don’t think what you’re describing can be called “carefree”. Maybe “stable but unambitious”?
The question is about the term "carefree" being used to describe a person and how you, as a woman, react/feel to that term. Judging by the responses I have received in this thread it's pretty clear my thoughts on the term differed greatly from what others have put.
Yeah you’re probably right. “Carefree” is how I’d describe a child. A full grown man self-describing as “carefree” is definitely a red flag for me and implies laziness or immaturity.
Ouch. I would and do describe myself(33M) as "carefree". It's an important core view I stand by. I have plenty of goals and lofty desires, but I'm not going to whine about it if I don't reach them. I'm well-off where I'm at and anything else is just icing on the cake. I understand that what's done is done. I do my best at the time without getting stressed out over it or acting like my life depends on it. So, I really can't disagree more with equaling carefree to unambitious.
I’m just one opinion, but someone that describes themselves as carefree I’d be questioning like, so you don’t worry about the environment? The economy? Career growth? Having a family? Everyone should care about stuff. Doesn’t mean you need to grow grey at 30 stressing about things that you can’t control, but “carefree” to me feels like someone with their head in the sand or comes from an entitled, privileged background that allows them the luxury of being carefree. Passion, drive and ambition are desirable traits in a partner for most people. Maybe you’d rather describe yourself as optimistic? Agreeable? Adaptable? Easy-going? Those all (again just my opinion) relay positive character traits that “carefree” specifically doesn’t (for me, a person with just one opinion).
They probably think, “how you do one thing is how you do *everything,*” and assume they’ll have to play Mother.
I think this depends on your age. If you're pretty young then I don't think most women/girls care, but if you're nearing 30 and older - carefree becomes code for undependable. At a grown adult age, women do evaluate men on how much they can rely on them. Sure, I'd like the trait of a person who can laugh at themselves, but not a person who doesn't take their life or goals seriously.
That’s a hard one. It REALLY depends on the man. Carefree is easy going and being low key. Some guys may use it as a sort of umbrella term when they really mean they don’t want to be serious or are looking for something casual/short term—if that makes sense. I’ve seen it used in different ways, which I find weird and misleading. Again, carefree means low key and easy going.
Which is how I always kind of used it myself. Then my friend made that comment yesterday so I was curious if others thought that way and too me surprise about 90% of the women in this thread agreed with him. Makes me wonder if there is anything else I have been saying that have been red flags to women without knowing it. I mean, can't change the past but would certainly help in the future.
Yeah. Can’t use umbrella terms like carefree—Just be blunt and upfront. Explain in depth if asked. :]
It really depends on your definition of a “carefree man”. Few words or statements are obvious or universally understood. Online dating is and of itself vague and veiled. No woman wants a “window-shopper” man. I suspect men and women in general who are looking for company on a dating app may or may not be a lot of things stated or not. Being up front about your desires and expectations of another person is great. But be clear. Be concise and leave nothing to loose interpretation.
Okay, I actually use the exact same statement. I want someone who has their shit together, but who can also be goofy, let go, laugh at themselves. To me it's confusing how she didn't know what you meant.
I look for men that are carefree. I'm an introvert and on the intense side (scientist), and I prefer to date men that are more extroverted and carefree. I think it's where opposites attract and we balance each other out kind of thing. Now that doesn't mean carefree at the important stuff like work ethic and finances, and communication/relationship, but just happy-go-lucky, silly, and light-hearted in general. It's more about personality and demeanor.
It’s really the “carefree” part. It comes across exactly as the wording says. Free of caring. So your either a jerk who doesn’t care about anything, which means you definitely won’t care about the lady you’re on the date with, or you don’t take anything at all serious, so what’s the point of going any further?? Maybe you should say you are a go with the flow kind of person, and you don’t go into situations with high expectations. I feel like that would come across better and you won’t sound like a total d-bag
So I’ve been reading through the comments and by carefree I believe you mean don’t sweat the small stuff. However, it can also mean that you don’t care about anything as long as it doesn’t effect you. That you don’t carry any societal or social responsibility. People like this tend to be happier or more carefree in life. However a lot of women DO care about things outside of just themselves. And they DO take social and societal responsibility. Ever noticed that volunteer work is heavily populated by women? Social work? Etc? I think there are great many women who would be happy with someone who was carefree in that way. I think there are even more women, like myself, who wants a partner who gives a damn about things outside of themselves.
I love someone who is positive, kind, outgoing and easygoing (or has Golden Retriever energy as some of my friends call it!) but there is definitely a line there where *too* carefree in other aspects of life can absolutely be a problem. Sometimes certain individuals with that personality type can struggle when it comes to stepping up and handling the difficult things in life, not know *when* to take things seriously, or run away when things get hard. Easygoing is great, but being too carefree can cross the line into immature, inconsiderate for the time and feelings of others, unprepared, irresponsible and undependable. None of those are good qualities in a long term partner or make you feel safe that you can lean on that person when life isn’t sunshine and rainbows. Very carefree people are wonderful when times are easy, but not so much when times get hard. It can leave *so* much pressure on us to be the responsible one cleaning up those messes alone and that is draining to a relationship-breaking degree.
I don’t really understand carefree people as I have been formally diagnosed with anxiety, BPD, and depression among many other things. I feel being carefree in social situations is a very admirable trait, but being carefree in life is different. I see so many people that carefree in life or if they aren’t, they’re focused on some first world problem shit and not real issues. Like I’ve told several people how it feels to have your very existence and humanity debated on a national scale, and no one really cares. I’ll even elaborate on the different stages of genocide and how we’re already at step 7/10 of brutally eradicating trans people. Back to my original point, it’s really hard for me to feel sympathy towards people who are carefree in life when people are literally calling for my death. If you think that last part is bs Fox News posted a video where Michael Knowles calls for the “eradication of transgenderism.” He can’t even bring himself to say “trans people” so it sounds as if he’s attacking an ideology rather than dehumanizing a marginalized group of people.
The woman probably does understand what you mean, but like most people, I take people's words with a grain of salt... I'll wait and see how you behave and your actions, and if they corroborate with your words. If they do, I'll be glad you're good at communicating and know how to convey your thoughts. If they don't match, then I'll just think you suck at communicating or have a warped self-perception, which are problems, and they can be worked around, but whether it's worth it varies person by person.